By | November 18, 2011 47 Comments

6-year-old boy charged with sex assault

Three little kids were playing doctor. That led to a boy being charged with sexual assault and his parents filing a civil rights lawsuit.

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Reading this article has made me so angry. Playing doctor as a child is “normal”. Children do this. No one had been hurt… Now so many are being hurt. This poor little boy and his well as the little girl who will most likely grow up feeling shame as a result… Told by her parents she was abused. With so much child abuse and dangers that children have to face that are real.. I think this is outrageous! A civil lawsuit? Are the parents trying to get money? Horrible!!

the sisterhood

This article is interesting to me because it reminds me a lot of the child I had to report. The child I reported actually told my friend’s little girl she couldn’t get on a trampoline unless she showed him her vagina. The little girl refused so the boy went over to her and ripped of her underware as she struggled to keep them on. He then threw her underware in the woods and laughed the whole time. He was 5 and she was 4.

The mother of the boy downplayed everthing and said that he has ADHD and was only copying what his sister had done to his little brother. (Hmmm…so that makes it alright?)

The people on this article’s comment section seem to be very sypathetic to the little boy involved. That has me concerned only because we do not have all of the facts. Yes they are young children who were only playing “doctor”. But, did the little boy in the article have a hisotry of doing this type of thing? Does he have other red flag issues? Not sure I can decide either way unless I have all of the information.

This leads me to the people in the community who support the family that I reported. They don’t have all of the facts and are willing to believe the watered down version of events. They don’t know that this boy has also touched other little girl’s vaginas in the past and that he has other serious issues going on.

I knew of all of these facts and therefore felt it necessary to report it to CPS. Yes, he was only five. But, maybe that makes what he did even more concerning.

I’m not sure why people seem to brush off events like this as just “child’s play”. I don’t know, maybe to a certain point it is, but where is the line and how do we know when a child has crossed it?


It’s true not all the facts were revealed in the article.. However little kids do this in a “normal” way. Your points were very valid with respect to history, ect.. However where do you distinguish normal? The case you mentioned did not seem normal. More like this child was “learning” from abusive figures.
I just think it’s very sad and disturbing that this little boy and his well as this little girl are now dealing with this. They will be forever affected.

the sisterhood

Trying to figure out what was “normal” child behavior was very difficult for me in my case. But my gut, and the 5 different school psychologists and guidance counselors that I spoke with-all agreeing that I should report it, made it very clear to me what I needed to do. Mine was not a knee jerk reaction. I took two weeks to really think about what I needed to do and I sought professional advice.

If the boy in the article was truly only being naturally curious and “innocently” playing doctor, then I do feel really sorry for both children and the parents of the boy.

I do know that I tell my children constantly that they are never, ever to touch anyone in their private area and NO ONE (except the doctor and mommy if she’s cleaning you) is ever allowed to touch you. I’ve been drilling that concept into their heads since the time they were born.

That being said, my son did wind up playing “family” with two other children at his pre-school. The little girl he was playing with wanted to pretend she was having a baby so she pulled down her pants slightly. She told my son to catch the baby…He touched the very top of her butt. (the third child was pretending to be the family dog) Needless to say, the girl’s parents and I were very upset at the lack of adult supervision at the school. Apparently, it all happened very fast.

I had a VERY LONG conversation with my son that evening. He has never repeated that experience. Thank God!

So, I can see how innocent things can become very disturbing and vice versa. All depending on context and our personal experiences.

Ox Drover

The daughter of a friend of mine was sexually molested by her mother’s BF and we thought at the time (and still do) that the mother participated in the abuse which was full-on sexual intercourse when the girl was 5. Unfortunately, there was never any prosecution.

By the time the girl was 9-10 she was acting out sexually and attempting to have sex with her younger brother.

The “you show me yours, and I’ll show you mine” kind of playing doctor or family is in my opinion “normal” behavior, and for children who have been molested very young, acting out sexually is EXPECTED type behavior (I dont’ call it normal). Each case must be evaluated on its own merits, at ANY AGE for a very young child. It may signal that the child him/her self has been abused, or that they have observed abuse, or it may be simple curiosity on the part of the child.

That this particular very young child was “heavily” prosecuted and that the father of the girl was “politically connected” and the relative of the girl was a social worker makes the prosecution seem suspicious to me. The article also said the boy had no “priors” so that is in his favor.

Remember the kid in first grade who was suspended for sexually assaulting a girl in his class for kissing her that made the news a few years back? Commmmme on folks! give us a break, kids will be kids!


Prosecuting a 5 year old is beyond insane. The person has only been ALIVE for 5 years! In that time he has been busy learning to focus his eyeballs, walking, learning language and controlling his bowels.

He simply cannot be held responsible for violating ANY codes, much less the complex moral codes involved in sexuality for each culture. DUH!

If the prosecuting attorney was sent to an insane asylum for his behavior, he would think twice before committing such a crime as prosecuting a 5 year old.

What we lack today – is common sense. It’s just gone. It went to hell in a hand basket a long long time ago.

Ox Drover

Well said, Sky!

“He simply cannot be held responsible for violating ANY codes, much less the complex moral codes involved in sexuality for each culture.”


Sky ~ I’d like to second Oxy’s “Well said.” Absolutely. And right on with what we lack today – common sense. I see the lack of common sense on an every day basis at Grand’s school, and his is good compared to a lot of them.

There is no such thing as little boys getting into pushing or punching fights out on the playground – it is now called assault. I raised 3 boys before Grand came along. They were all great kids, not troublemakers, not bullies. They all, at one time or another in grade school, got into some sort of playground “brawls”. The teachers separated them, maybe I got a note informing me, maybe not. That was it. Now, they are suspended for assault. COMMON SENSE


Ox Drover

Milo, yea, but sometimes the school yard or after school fights can be a “signal” as well that there is something else going on. My youngest half sib that I think from what I hear/read is probably also a psychopath would come home from school every afternoon during the time I was around him (at age 8) with his clothes torn almost off, he had FOUGHT his way home from school every day. He was a straight A student and the teachers loved him, but after school he was a scrapper….also a quiet child, obedient and cooperative at home and the sperm donor’s “golden child” as well.

I’ve seen other kids at age 8-10 that were showing signs of glee at bad behavior and there was a PATTERN of bad behavior there, a demonstrating of GLEE at getting away with bad behavior even if they got punished for it….children that had no indication that they CARED what the adults in their life wanted, no desire to please, and no fear of punishment. Those kids can be scary indeed, but your average kid just getting into a school yard scrap is NOT ASSAULT, and playing doctor is NOT SEXUAL ASSAULT either. This “politically correct” carp of labeling little kids with criminal offenses is OVER THE TOP STUPID!


Oh, I agree, I’m talking about rolling around, rough housing that almost every boy does at one time or another. It is now assault and assault equals suspension, as early as 1st & 2nd grade.

In 1st grade Grand got into a altercation with another child on the bus. They were pulling at each other clothes and pushing, within the seat. The other kid’s book bag got ripped. Bus driver (large van type) told me about it when he dropped Grand off. I made Grand write an apology note and go to WalMart that evening and spend HIS OWN money on a book bag for the kid. I think they were equally to blame, but this is the way I handled it. The next morning we took the book bag out to the van and gave it to the kid along with the note. Next day school called and said Grand and other kid were being suspended for assault. The only way you can object to a suspension is to wait until the suspension is served then it goes to a board at the county level. Lot of good that does. I demanded it be an in-school suspension. That meant I had to pay $75/day for a substitute to come in a sit with him in a empty room. I did this on the condition that the other kid served in-school also, on my dime. Again, this was 1st. grade.

Yep, OVER THE TOP STUPID. And a 5 or 6 year old playing doctor is curiosity and play NOT SEXUAL ASSAULT.

Ox Drover

Dang, Milo! That is unreal!!!! LOL FIRST GRADE CRIMINALS! LOL I think your way of handling it is totally correct.

Throwing a kid OUT of school for bad behavior seems to me to be sort of counter to good sense really unless it is a VERY dangerous thing. We used to have to STAY AFTER SCHOOL if we were “bad” not get out of school. LOL Boy have things changed. There are so many people now who are home schooling their kids or sending them to private school rather than deal with the public schools.

The home school associations that join together for sports teams and other events where the kids can socialize and play together are really neat. We have hosted several groups out here for the day on a farm tour and son D does various science programs and nature things with them. The kids just eat it up and enjoy the time here. Our living history group does things for public schools and most of the time the kids in junior high up are monsters of disrespect and lack of interest, but the middle schoolers (5th graders) are wonderful.

Private school kids are usually very well behaved as they have reasonable rules and discipline for bad behavior and more parental involvement I would imagine too.


All the private schools around here are at least 45 minute to an hour away, so that isn’t an option, unless I send him to Amish school. If I were younger and had more patience, I would home school.

The reason I made them do the in-school suspension, even though the two days cost me $150, was because what kind of a message is that sending a 1st grader? Misbehave and get two days off, yea. They can’t really comprehend that as a punishment. Although, the two days locked in a classroom with only one other child and a substitute was a severe (too severe for the crime) it was better than days off.

He has a new principal and she is a gem, thank God. One day she called me and asked if Grand was wearing the same jeans he had on the evening before. I thought a minute and said “yes, why”. She said OK, I am not suppose to do this because I could get in BIG trouble, but Grand came into my office this morning and handed me a pocket knife. He said he discovered it in his pocket from the night before, he forgot and did not want to get in trouble. She said, I think that was so responsible of him and it was the right way to handle it. Come and pick up the knive and I will forget it ever happened. COMMON SENSE.

Ox Drover

Dear Milo,

It is a wonder he was not prosecuted as a terrorist and hauled off campus in hand cuffs! Thank goodness he is responsible! Kudos to you!!!! She does sound like a GEM!!!!

My own little darling took a GUN to campus, a stolen gun at that! He apparently showed it around (typical P, showing off!) fortunately some of the kids reported it to the campus cop, who came to my house and told me what he had heard, and I confiscated the gun, and that was when Patrick and my foster kid RAN, stole a motorcycle and got caught the next day. I sent the foster kid away and things went down hill with Patrick from that instant on….Thank God I was wise enough to turn him in as a run away to the police, or I would have been responsible for any damage he did to the MC, and it was obvious I had NO control over what he did.

I’m not sure by that time anything would have helped, but the social services and the police were neither one helpful to me at that point, the one “therapy” session we had after his first arrest, the therapist bought into how “mistreated and abused” my son was. LOL

the sisterhood

Sky and Oxy-
“He simply cannot be held responsible for violating ANY codes, much less the complex moral codes involved in sexuality for each culture.”

The child cannot be held responsible, but the parents sure can.

In the case where I reported the child, The parents were absentee and alcoholic. They never took responsibility for their children’s behavior. The mother would get drunk and pass out at little kids’ birthday parties, (there were a few this happened at). She would also get drunk and pass out at home while the children would run amok around the house. Her husband would come home from work and find her that way.

The boy was at a football tailgating party with his parents and he fell onto an open grill and burned his hand. The parents did absolutely nothing to help him. Everyone stood around in shock that they didn’t even comfort him. The parents were too busy partying to care. His hurting himself was an inconvenience to their fun.

My point is, in this article, we don’t know what the boy’s parents are like and what the girl’s parent’s experiences with these people have been like. We are only hearing the sensational headline. I do admit that the mother of the girl being involved with child services does seem to indicate that she may be using her position. But I’m still not so sure I can brush this off as innocent Doctor play. It just may very well be. And I do hope it gets cleared up.

And as for 5 and 6 year olds being so sweet and innocent-I am a teacher and I can tell you first hand that some 5 year olds are most certainly anti-social. They are violent, defiant, and just plain mean to the other children. Is it their fault, NO. But they certainly don’t belong in the public school system. They are negatively impacting the learning of the other children. But God forbid the parents face the truth about their child. Apples usually don’t fall far from the tree.

Milo- I am shocked that your S.D. made you pay for in-school suspension. That is the first place the children are placed when there is a physical altercation. We have a permanent in-school suspension aid. A student would have to do something pretty horrible to get out of school suspension. Sounds like something that needs to be addresses at school board meetings. Trust me, taxpayers do have the power. Admin is terrified of boisterous parents. Squeaky wheel gets the oil.


Knowing what I know, genetic wise, I have to walk a fine line. I want to be aware, but not over reactive. That is why it is so important to understand that kids are just kids sometimes.

I do know this kid has sincere empathy and is caring, I hope it stays that way. He turns 11 on Monday and I also know that seems to be the magic age for it all going down hill. The dog ran away from him the other night and he got very angry and started spanking the dog. I said Grand, you could hurt him, you don’t want to do that, do you? He started to cry and then hugged the dog, saying I’m sorry, over and over. I hope I’m reading good signs. Time will tell.

Ox Drover

Dear sisterhood,

Oh, yes, I agree with you that parents should be held accountable for a child that has a PATTERN of misbehavior, and they should address the FIRST episode of misbehavior as well…whatever that misbehavior is.

One of my favorite books has a line in it that I just love, a kid had done something REALLY STOOPID (not maliciious just stoooopid and unexpected) an old man was trying to talk to the kid’s grandfather about the event and make an explaination of why the kid did what he did. the old man said “He ain’t no bad boy, he minds good, if you tell him don’t do such and such, he won’t do it, it’s just that there is too many things to tell him NOT TO DO that I can’t think of them all.”

The “crime” was the kid had been out plowing a balky mule that was stopping regularly to fart, and he got tired of falling behind in his work, so he LIT THE MULE’S FART the next time she stopped. Of course she went ape and pulled the plow around in a big circle ruining an acre of his grandpa’s prime cotton! LOL

So not every thing a kid does is malicious or intended to hurt anything or any one, just something that they don’t realize the consequences of. LOL See you guys tomorrow!


Sisterhood ~ please don’t make statements like apples usually don’t fall far from the tree or that these kids don’t belong in a public school.

Children should never be labled anti social.

When my youngest was in 1st grade, the teacher reported that he was so mean and nasty that he unhooked another child’s lunch box so that when the child picked it up it all fell out. My youngest does not have a mean or nasty bone in his body NONE. I asked him why he unhooked the child’s lunch box. He said this little boy’s mom always packed him such a GOOD LUNCH, he wanted to see what it was and forgot to hook it back.

These kids deserve at least A CHANCE at this age.

the sisterhood

Milo-I’m sorry if my comments offended you.

The children I’m speaking of do much worse than opening a child’s lunch box. I am certainly not implying mischeif behavior as being anti-social. All I can say is that you would have to be in the school to witness what I have witnessed over the years. The children I am speaking about have a void of empathy and a look in their eyes that is very disturbing.

It is a shame that they are like this and I do not think for one second that it is their fault. I do think they can be helped at this age. But unfortunately, if the parents are in denial, the child will not be helped. After meeting some (not all) of the parents of these children, it is pretty clear why the child is the way they are. And some of the other parents I’ve met just don’t know what to do about it. They are at their wits end and are relying on the school for help. It is a complicated issue.

Listen, we are all just now learning about Sociopathy and personality disorders. There is a lot of controversy surrounding children who show signs and traits of these disorders. I am not professing to be an expert. I am just sharing my experinces with them. And trust me, my heart aches for them. The general public is just not educated enough about this to understand what they are dealing with.

Milo, you seem like a very caring and concerned mother. Not all parents care. And that is a shame.


My brother has been a sociopath since he was a small boy. He showed the classic spath traits: charm, charisma, intelligence. All the little girls had crushes on him, because he was so good looking. Little boys respected him. He was the class bully. He was admired and feared for his daring. He got into fights, he broke windows, he got the best grades in his class, he was constantly sent to the principal who used corporal punishment on him. It just made him more defiant. It didn’t make the kids admire him any less.

There was no vacant look in his eyes. He radiated magnetism. That’s what a spath looks like.

He still looks like that when he puts on his mask. But mostly now he doesn’t bother, he just lives in my parents’ basement watching porn and drinking beer.



Do your parents know he’s a sociopath? Do they care he’s “parked” in their basement?


my mother is a psychopath with a perfect mask: the saint.
my dad is a narcissist who just wants to control all the members of his family.

My understanding of the dynamics in my family is leaving me stunned. I’m getting it, more and more. It’s so sick. To explain the complexities of it would take several pages. Suffice it to say, nothing is what it seems to be in my family. everything is 180 degrees what it appears to be.




Sisterhood ~ You did not offend me and I do understand where you are coming from.

I am the custodial grandparent of a child who has been diagnosed with high functioning autism, ADHD, RAD and PTSD. His mother (my adopted daughter) is a P, also an alcoholic and drug user. His biological father spent 8 years in prison for armed robbery and kidnapping and was diagnosed with conduct disorder as a teen. My grandson suffered severe neglect and abuse as a baby and toddler. He is in special ed classes for behavior problems. He may very well be one of those children you were talking about. He has been in therapy since age 3. He has come a long way, but each day it is a struggle. He deserves a chance to be all that he can be. I have no idea what the future will be for him, but for now I give him love, attention, boundaries and a strong sense of right and wrong.

That is why it is hard to hear some of the remarks. I hope you understand.


God bless you and your family, MiLo.

How does he react to the care you give him? Do you see him forming bonds now that he’s in a safer environment?


Purewaters ~ Thank you. We have had him since he was 3 years old and he will be 11 tomorrow. Because we were blessed with the most amazing psychologist when he was just 3, who recognized all his problems and understood not only the genetic aspect, but also the toxins he was exposed to before being born and the results of severe neglect, we were able to start all types of therapies that were very helpful.

One of the things that I believed saved him was the fact that since birth to age three we were in and out of his life, giving him just enough security to sustain him. Although it was a broken, interrupted bond until three, it was a bond just the same.

Yes, he has formed a very strong bond with his grandfather and I. He is very loving and has a great deal of empathy. However with the ADHD he is very impulsive and many times does things before he thinks. He also has a very bad temper. These are things we work on daily. He is now in Special Ed. as an intervention only, if he needs a safe place when he becomes overwhelmed. Other than that, he is in regular classroom and has been on the honor roll for the past three years, last year all A’s.

Again, thanks for thinking of me.


Dear Milo-
I hope you all were able to have a wonderful birthday! Thinking of you and hoping you are well.
I’ve been thinking allot about this article about young children these past couple of days it makes me sad.
I think someone out there should write an article about new moms, child rearing, and the sociopath. I think so much could be gained from such an article. Things to look for, proper care for the mother and child. I’ve read so many articles from so many women who are pregnant and new moms as well as from women who are older and dealing with/ or dealt with this stuff. They have learned… Perhaps a good article could inspire others and
allow lessons learned to be shared. Knowledge is power as ox says..
Maybe I’ll email Donna. I think it could be a useful and powerful resource.
Best wishes…

Ox Drover

Coping, Dr. Liane Leedom has written quite a bit about child rearing of children who are “at risk” kids—i.e. have at least one psychopathic parent, so there are some articles. Go back through the archives and read Dr. Leedom’s articles and her book, “Just like His Father”


Coping ~ It was a good birthday, thanks. We had to work extra hard to make up for what Mommy Dearest promised but didn’t come through on, but what else is new. I know Grand gets the picture and is learning how to deal. So sad that kids have to “deal”.

I have Dr. Leedom’s book, it is well worth the money, even if your child is not “at risk”, some really thoughtful advise.


Thank you ox-
I’ve read several but nothing that addresses my concerns. She has written allot.. Time to start reading! Like yesterday.
I’m scared… Jr is acting wierd. He did just have his surgery but there were complications.. Which no one can explain. He has started hitting himself on the head and pulling his hair. He just turned 1. I don’t think this is normal. I don’t know if it’s pain from the ears, or frustration.? Furthermore jr is becoming distant.. I’m teaching him to hold hands.. Which he hates and he now hates to be held.? He seems like he’s fighting for independence.. I thought this happened at 2 or 3???
They botched his surgery.. But he is full of strange energy. I don’t know if this is normal or what I should do.

Ox Drover

Dear Coping,

No, that is not normal behavior, but it could be caused from several things. PAIN in the ear is one of those things….I wouldn’t force him to hold hands if he doesn’t want to, in other words if he doesn’t Want to be held, forcing him to be held might only frustrate him and make him think that you don’t respect his boundaries….he may be fighting for independence as well.

I would also consult with a pedi specialist, there are SPECIAL pedi certified psychiatrists and I would find and consult with one. The head banging and hair pulling is a concern for me, but also consult with the ear specialist in case he is in pain. ((((hugs))))


We posted over each other..
I’m glad the bday was good in spite of the other issues..
I’m going to buy the book! I’m just afraid of thinking jr. Could have a genetic disposition… Screw it. I need to know. He is still my angel… Always!!


Ox- Ent dr. Says all is ok??? Despite the fact he was bleeding fresh blood through his ear and we spent 8 hours in er 3 days after surgery..Saw Ent today… Er doc said tube was crooked.. Ent said all was good and normal.. To be expected? Wtf?!!
Jr.. Is normally happy.. Does not cry.. Understands the word no.. Laughs, and is smart. According to books he is on schedule. His distance towards me and others is disturbing. The hair pulling and head hitting started around 4 days ago. The hand holding issue has been for around 2 weeks… But he just started walking and all he wants to do is move.. With mom semi close by. Other kids his age don’t want to leave mom. He is so attracted by other kids.. Is that nomal? The head hitting has me so afraid.

Ox Drover

Dear Copiing,

The head hitting starting 4 days ago tells me that there is SOMETHING wrong, and I am going to bet that he has PAIN in his ear….so don’t give up on finding out what is going on. I know it is a terrible time (Holidays) to get a physician’s attention, but SQUEEK! The squeeky wheel gets the grease!

I would not try to hold his hand if he doesn’t want it to be held, let him move and let him learn to walk (and fall) on his own, just keep him in a “padded room” if you can as much as you can so he won’t bang his head as he falls.

If you need to you can get him one of those things that is like a harness that you can let him walk along beside you and help support him with the harness but not hold on to his hand. Him pulling away may be the result of you trying to hold his hand when he doesn’t want you to.

The HEAD BANGING I think is a separate issue with the hand holding though, I would check about the pain in the ear. (((hugs)))


i had a sister( disowned family who are all sociopath) who was jumped on by brother. also around 4 or 5. he told her that the priest said this was ok. she is a fuck up person for alot of other issues to and became a abuser to my life. i cut them off . but i wondered why he said preist said it was ok. catholic school in paterson where some sexual molestations took place. so i wonder if a preist got to him or if he was copying father and mother. waht ever my sisters is a agressive asexual abusive mean spirit who never emotional got anywhere ,is married but used me as a skapegoat to her problems. theywould not give up unless they broke me and tried to mak me sick to. i escaped my fate but it seems someonw would not give up unless they took me to hell. which took place off of a person i met who also had similar pernoalit to the brother , an abuser and also from a twisted family.


Coping ~ sorry, I checked out early last night and didn’t see your posts.

I agree with Oxy, the hair pulling and head banging is related to an ear ache and pain. I would keep after the Dr. about this, especially if it continues.

Sometimes the not wanting to hold hands is him wanting independence or he is just too busy. When you say he hates to be held, is it when he wants to be moving around and you are trying to control him or is it he doesn’t want to be held during snuggle time? There is a big difference. Does he look at you, or turn away? This is probably a phase, but if it continues, I would have him evaluated, there are also pediatric behavioral specialists that can detect early signs of problems.

As all of us experienced mothers can tell you, kids do strange things for NO reason and that is probably the number one cause – NO reason. No matter what the books tell you, they will do things at their own rate, their own way. My 2nd son was not walking by the time he was almost 18 months old, not even along furniture. I took him to a specialist (ortho) for an evaluation. He said does he have older siblings that get him things? I said yes. He said that’s the problem, he doesn’t need to walk. That night, he got up and walked all the way around the room. Go Figure!!!

I would worry about the head banging and hair pulling because of his ears. The other, give him time and see what happens, and above all enjoy the little bugger.

Ox Drover

Great Post Milo, good points! My second son (the P) didn’t talk except for a word or two until he was nearly three….and we realized that the two boys had a “twin language” that they spoke, and the older one would “interpret” for the baby….he didn’t need to talk. Then one day my egg donor sat him at the bar on a stool and gave him 3 cookies while she was getting ready for church and he said ONE, TWO THREE. So she gave him some more cookies and he counted to 20, only missing one number, and we didn’t even know he could talk much less count. LOL

Later that year the two boys were separated when I went back to work (I had been a stay at home mom) and put them into different day care/pre schools and P son blossomed and became a chatty cathy because he had to talk to get what he wanted without his brother around to speak for him.


Oxy ~ they are just such little dickens – imagine he was listening, just didn’t have anything worthwhile to say LOL

I know I could have saved a great deal of money on the ortho guy had he walked the NIGHT BEFORE. That kid did stuff like that to us his entire childhood!!!!!! I had to take a saw and cut apart the rungs of an antique Windsor chair because somehow he managed to get his head wedged firmly between them.

Motherhood …… Coping – keep your sense of humor, you will need it.

Ox Drover

Milo, one of the funniest (now) things mine did was older son C was 17 months older than P son and when P son was an infant, I had tropical fish. Son C FED them a whole can of food so I had to clean out the aquarium and put the fish into bowls and pans while the new water adjusted….one jumped out on to the floor, a red sword, and son C came out of the kitchen with what looked like a red pepper in his hand, munching….it was a red sword that had jumped out and dried up when it landed on the floor! LOL Then about a week or so later, he DID IT AGAIN! LOL dumped in a whole box of food.

I could write a book of the things that ADHD kid got into, but he wasn’t a “bad” kid, just one that kept me hopping! I really didn’t have any major problems with either kid until Patrick morphed into a psychopath at puberty. I actually ENJOYED watching them grow and do the things that they did…it was more fun than a box of kittens!


Oxy ~ that is hysterical ~ I wonder how many times a mom says “what is that in your mouth?” He had sushi ! He probably dumped the fish food again so he could have more fish. LOL

Friends were in Sears looking at new bathroom fixtures in one of the displays. Turned around to see their 4 year old little boy with his pants down sitting on a display toilet – AND USING IT. Mom pretended she didn’t know him and walked away, Dad had to claim the child from a store employee. They never went in Sears again.

Ox Drover

[email protected]!! ROTFLMAO SNORK, SNARF, CHOKE!!! That is tooooo funny. One time older son C went into the women’s bathroom with me and while I was in the stall he peeped under the stall door at some other woman and SHE WAS NOT AMUSED to look up and see these two beedy little kids eyes looking in at her. LOL

Yea, I can understand the parents never going into Sears again! LOL That is TOOOOO FUNNY! Thanks for my laugh for the day!

Yea, my kids pulled some things that at the TIME were NOT funny, but in retrospect are VERY funny, and I can even remember the things that Patrick(P-son) did as a little kid that were REALLY funny, and how much I enjoyed being a mommy to those little kids! My family hasn’t “turned out” like I wish it had, but I guess considering what I had to deal with genetically, I could have done worse! LOL

Ox Drover

I just wanted to post a link to a story about a 12 year old that was obviously “out of control.” I doubt that this kid murdered his parents as his FIRST act of defiance. This is a very sad story and fortunately not really common, but there are kids who are VERY young who are VERY dangerous.–siblings-boy-12-stabbed-killed-parents–talk-new-life.html


Coping ~ How is Jr. doing with his poor little ear aches? Better I hope. Thinking of you.


Dearest Milo and ox-
Thank you so much for your input. The posts gave me a good laugh. 🙂
Jr. Is doing so much better. Lol… Yep stopped the hair pulling and head banging.. It was pain. Poor guy! But he is doing good and so full of energy. 13 months today! Shit! It’s amazing we have both done ok inspire of it all. All in all I’m feeling pretty happy and positive.. I’m seeing a glimpse of the light at the end of the tunnel. We see Ent specialist again tomorrow to see about the crooked tube. I’ll see. But I do intend to be firm.. I think little old coping is slowly coming back.
On a sidenote I’m feeling good about the spath.. He seems to have gone mia thank god. Maybe… Just maybe it’s over. I don’t want to think about it to much… I’m enjoying the peaceful feeling. I don’t want to jinx things.
Maybe it was the car? Maybe it was the child support notices that caught up with him. Maybe he has another victim (I’m sad about that.. But thankful it’s not us) visitations are over. They did not close the case but they ended.. He lost his missing visit time. I don’t know what the future holds but praying he’s gone!!
I’m doing good also. I start servicing my first client tomorrow. It’s crap money but it’s money. It’s my Corp so when I can good job in my field I can still use this as supplemental income. Slowly but surely things seem to be coming together. I know it will take time.
However we are alive, healthy, and our needs our met. I am thankful in spite of it all!!!
God bless.


Humility and gratitude! They come hand in hand!
There is a light for all those in doubt!

Ox Drover

Dear Coping,

I am SOOOO glad to hear the good news and glad that Junior’s ear pain is under control. Bless his little heart!

Psychopaths seem to be like “bad pennies” and keep turning up, but keep the PROBLEM ON HIS HEAD…the child support, and so on, so that it COSTS HIM something to keep giving you a hard time. It must be COSTLY to him to hassle you, so push for support if he wants visitation, and they will put them in jail in some places for failure to pay, or take it out of his pay checks, or make life miserable for him. When he pushes, PUSH BACK!

Hopefully you will be able to move on to another area or he will and he will eventually let go of both you and Junior.

I’m glad you are starting to make money and meet your own needs! TOWANDA!!!!!


Coping ~ Great News, all the way around. So glad to hear Jr. is feeling better, hopefully that will be the end of the ear infections.

I would think the spath has royally screwed up regarding the missing visits. That SHOULD be the end of them granting him any more.

Keep up the good work and my thoughts are with you.

Ox Drover

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