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Classic psychopath convicted in the UK

A Lovefraud reader forwarded a link to a newspaper article about a con artist convicted yesterday in the United Kingdom. The guy was known as “King Con,” and for good reason.

Bounder with a barrister’s wig preyed on women from lonely hearts page ads

The guy did everything from masquerading as a prominent barrister (lawyer) to stiffing cab drivers to swindling women he met through personal ads. The guy was actually diagnosed as having an “untreatable psychopathic condition.” I hope it means he’ll be sentenced to spend the rest of his life in jail.


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Great article Donna, and you are right he is a CLASSIC psychopath—what amazed me though is he has already been CONVICTED of 155 crimes, and “considered” for 350 more! When are they going to shut this guy down?

Sounds to me like he has obviously been doing this for 30 years or so—-and trying to OPERATE on a patient in a complex operation! MY Goodness! WOW! What gall and guts!

I hope to heck he does get sent away forever, but sounds to me like the court system over there doesn’t “get it either!”

Donna

I’m alarmed at the air of comedy in the article, the journalist clearly enjoys listing all the things he did in a can you believe this guy folks! what a con man, what a guy!! I’m feeling serious today about it, I find very little of what he did funny and its a thin line between comedy and tragedy.

Watching Dr Phil yesterday. It was all about the child who was sexually abused and murdered allegedly by Melissa Huckaby who is shown in the dock crying. she is also linked to a prior missing child case (the child was found 4 hours later under the influence of a controlled substance, having been with Huckaby last) An investigation is being carried out.

Dr Phil asks the question ‘what kind of dysfunction would cause someone to do this to a child’
FBI profiler Candice stallone (?) answers usually there is a less that 4 per cent chance of a child being sexually abused and murdered by a woman- she talks about about an arousal factor, fantasies driven by sexual proclivities(?) and there is a casual mention about the woman being a Psychopath…and the explanation that she is crying in the Dock not because of any remorse but because she had been caught.
They outlined a troubled past, but nothing that would stand out as a sign of what she was capable of doing.
Someone must have known. Her family must have known. Defence says she didn’t do it, yet there are no other suspects …the next plea is guilty by reason of insanity…is that the usual sentence for a psychopath murderer? they are insane right? they wear a mask of sanity but are clearly insane.

Ox Drover
I would see his acts as gutless and without gall…and how laws don’t work half the time, he just manages to get through the holes in the law time and time again…it’s a wake up call

Dear Staying sane,

You are RIGHT! There is an air of “comedy” about the article. I FELT it but didn’t realize what it was, thank you for pointing it out!

Of course we know that “Dr.” Phil doesn’t get it…so on that case, what is new? I have little respect for the man except as a SUCCESSFUL entertainer using the dysfunctions and pain of other people as his script.

As for your comment of “someone must have known” I am not sure I am in agreement with that, for two reasons.

1. The people close to her would, even if they saw some RED FLAGS, probably “discount them” with an “oh, she couldn’t do THAT, I must be mistaken.”

2. The psychopath who is doing this sort of thing is quite good at covering up CERTAIN things that they know might get them in trouble with the law.

What I was calling “gall” is a “southernism” for ARROGANCE in pulling off a con or scam….sorry for the regionalism in my choice of words and my lack of clarity! I do think it takes a lot of ARROGANCE (“guts and gall”) to try to pull off such a con.

Thanks for your take on that article! ((((hugs))))

okay, good….so Dr Phil does not get it….It was worrying because he looked so puzzled and lost with this case…even I get it more than Dr Phil! Because he is high profile supposedly cares about people it’s particularly worrying that he is not on the ball.,,even the FBI woman to be honest just seemed to be reading out of a book…
ARROGANCE isn’t gutsy, it comes from deep insecurity and a need to blow ourselves up to BIG so we do not dare feel any ‘puny weak vulnerable’ feelings which is taboo for psychopath…they hate those feelings within themselves and sever them off (treat with contempt)
ah I’m just being serious today…sorry I know what you mean and ignore me I just want to vent my heart out because I’m so angry that a psychopath causing untold harm and hurt out there might be entertainment to lucky people who haven’t a clue what they are laughing at…yep I’m a grumpy woman today, with good reason. Sorry. You are great, and have helped me tons, that’s why i’m turning into a little know it all who just wants to express….something!! aaaaargh get the psychopaths !!!!

Dear Stayingsane,

You grump all you want to sweetie! I get so frustrated too that these “entertainers” put themselves out as KNOWLEDGABLE when they don’t know jack! They could do a lot of good if they were less “entertaining” but because they do what SELLS—I think most of the good they COULD do is undone. But, then, if the TRUTH sold, I think they would tell that! I think too many people are actually treatened by the facts of the matter and that is that psychopaths are ANYONE not just “Charlie Manson” and no one is really safe in this world.

This PC crap that “there is good in everyone” and anyone who is “bad” is bad because they were abused, or poor, or made fun of etc. and if we just threw more money at it, they could be rehabilitated with enough “love” and “kindness” PUKE!!!!!

But “Dr.” Phil isn’t alone, lots of real professionals in the mental health business do not get it either! We can only educate folks 1 person at a time! I think Donna andersen has done more with this site than any 10 professionals added together. Of course there are some GREAT professionals who post here too and that’s a good thing too!

It bothers me that the article is written with comical lightness, as you’ve pointed out. Before I encountered the n/p who upended my life, I remember reading about a Canadian man who, during WWII, had pretended to be a doctor and done surgery while on duty at sea. I felt puzzled, but couldn’t understand why someone so talented wouldn’t have had the dedication to qualify, but I was interested in what I thought of then as his audacity. As I recall, a movie was made of his life in which his “antics” were treated as special and even cool. Now I know better, with a vengence!

The real truth to what these people often leave behind them is in the final paragraph: while posing as a doctor, the British n/p told the parents of a 16 year-old victim of a car crash that she’d be fine. She was dead in 6 hours. Because of his game playing, she never got real medical attention that might have saved her life — and her parents have to live the rest of their lives wiht that knowledge. What must that be like? That is a lot damage, and only one case out of hundreds of lives this guy messed with.

Hopefully, word will continue to get out. Many thanks to Donna for this site!

Ox Drover

Thanks. I think Judge Judith Sheindlin has a good manner with liars and con men/women She gives them nothing in the way of limelight. She seldom smiles, and when she does it’s kind of through gritted teeth! She has no problem silencing any hysterical laughter in the ‘audience’ the laugh that says ha ha ha thank god that’s them and not us….

she reacts as though sickened and depressed…get the hell out of my sight kind of manner which I think is great. I feel like judge judy today.

Betty
heartbreaking what happened the 16 year old girl at the hands of a psychopath posing as a Doctor, (easily enough, who would question it) no pangs of conscience, no upset over the patient…it’s sad and depressing..moronic and dull

Donna
grateful for this site to turn to, it’s so hard to find people who I can just talk to about this stuff because unless coming from a real experience of it no one wants to talk about it where I come from…they would rather be entertained by it. They are totally convinced they would have spotted the signs….gee thanks folks

Hi everyone again

I will see if I can find out a bit more on this case, as its just up my street, as I worked in the legal system over there before I moved and got the S-experience.

Yes, even lawyers get taken in!

Id like to know what the untreatable condition is…..

one/joy_step_at_a_time

THE BETRAYAL BOND – tonight, I am working on the ‘abuse inventory’ in the Betrayal Bond.

I am doing it in two sections – 1 to 18, and 18 to the present.

I got to 18, and writing down something about a man i met when i was that age. I realize he was probably a sociopath – he was damn scary. I got curious and looked him up online. He is in his late sixties now – still a felon, and still being arrested.

He was involved in a murder case that got a lot of press, and is a known ‘enforcer’….he is one NASTY piece of work. I had to leave the city i was at that time for awhile to get away from him – and he was IN PRISON at the time.

The man who was charged with the murder is still in jail – whenever he got out of jail on a day pass (only a couple of times) he counseled people on conspiracy to commit murder – including the planned murder and abduction of his lawyer’s daughter. OY!

He was diagnosed as a narcissist and psychopath by prison psychiatrists.

here is what the judge said of him in sentencing him to more concurrent life sentences:

“Your evil knows no bounds. It never rests. It never ends … In my opinion, this man should never, ever, ever be released on parole. Whether or not you are inherently evil, I do not know, but you ooze evil out of every pore and contaminate everyone around you.”

It’s funny, I remember saying to the spath, that my friends didn’t know how much evil there was in the world and therefore couldn’t fathom the spath’s (ficitonal character’s) (fictonal) history. And I cited my encounter with enforcer dude as one of the ways i know there is evil in the world.

irony of ironies.

Does anyone know much about what would provoke a mother to molest her daughter and also her son that was dealing with cancer then died. My guy told me that his daughter revealed to her psycholgist that this occurred to her and to her brother after they were divorced. He told me that she french kissed her then three year old when they were dating and he told her that this was wrong and she stopped.. so he told me that he thought that this is all that there was to it.. he told me that they took her to court and that she plead no contest. And he took custody of the daughter. The son died of a brain tumor.
His daughter told me in the first 24 hours that her mother had molested her. And she went from telling her father that she thought I was great to turning on me when I said something that she didn’t like.. She was an emotional basket case, very controlling and acted like she had control over her father and immediately squared off with me.. she was nice only until she realized that she wasn’t going to be able to control me. And what I don’t understand is that if the mother claimed no contest.. why didn’t she go to jail?
I have never been around anything like this..
And what little I have read on this topic.. it is extremely rare for a mother to molest her young children sexually..
so they are saying that women who do this are sociopaths or psychopaths?

When I think back to that aspect of that man I was engaged to it makes me feel ill.. in that, he was married to a woman like that for 10 years and had two children with her. When this crossed my mind and the full realization of this made me have the feeling that I was entering into some real sickness in this family.. and it was only a part of it.. two children with cancer. That child of hers overdosed… another child of one of his ex’s had brain damage at birth… I mean what are the odds of this in one group of people connected by marriage?

And I know that this is true… the grandmother and photos confirm it.. And his last wife that he married in two monther died of an overdose of percription medicine… And three months after she dies.. this man comes after me like I was the most desirable woman on earth .. his true love, his soulmate.. and he holds himself out as some sort of guru.. in that he has been practicing yoga since he was a young man.. and he reads spiritual stuff all the time.. and plays religious music in the car to keep his mind on God.. and if he see road kill .. he will comment “I prayed to help that poor thing make it to God.”
It all freaks me out when I look back..

and at the same time, he is kind and attractive.. and he always was touching me like holding my hand or touching my shoulder… and he criticized me for not saying ‘you’re welcome’… it is

So, in reading the above.. the part about mother’s molesting stuck out.. and made me think back and feel sick to my stomach and freak out a bit inside.. It’s all too much.. how can someone have so much trauma in their life? It is tragic and I felt sorry for him.. but it is not my trauma.. I have never been around the likes of what he had in his life..

Help! I have this need to understand … but what is it that I am trying to understand?

one/joy_step_at_a_time

oh god. today has been a day, for sure.

style – i think the truths are burbling up tot he surface for you, but they may be a little different than you think they are at this time. it’s hard cause you are trying to make sense, not of a horrific life, but of untruths. they won’t come together as a whole. it’s not your head; it’s his lies. his past isn’t truamatice to him – cause it didn’t happen.

Odds of this much trauma in one family: REALLY REALLY SLIM.

Take a look at this idea as a way to frame his story about his past: if his mouth is moving he is lying.

I’d say a whole lot of what he told you about his traumatic past is bullsh*t.

if it doesn’t MAKE SENSE, if you can’t SQUARE IT in your mind, it is more than likely bull. he didn’t have all this trauma in his life. I can’t tell you the percentage, so let’s go with 95% not being true. I’ll BANK ON THIS INCEST STUFF BEING A LIE. SURE, SOMEONE HERE WILL GIVE US GOOD ODDS ON THAT.

The spath i tangled with was THE KINDEST, SWEETEST, HOLIEST MOTHERF**CKING LYING PIECE OF SH*T I have EVER met, with A STORY OF ABUSE AND TRAUMA THAT AFFECTED ALL OF HIS RELATIVES. (and i have met some hardcore GENUINE holy people) IT’S ALLLLLLLL A LIE!

And so is the touching and hand holding. I remember telling the spath about a meeting I was in – dealing with a rather disordered board member. I told him the story, and this sweet, guilless creature who ‘couldn’t lie to save his own life’, told me that the board member, who I thought had touched my arm in a conciliatory way, was PLAYING ME. Now, how would this kind creature know that? Exactly; they project ALL the time.

The game is: “how deeply can I traumatize this woman so that she is bonded to me”? They don’t only traumatize us through hurting us, THEY TRAUMATIZE US WITH THEIR UNHOLY STORY OF ABUSE AND TRAUMA. He is NOT kind, and touching just bonded you through exciting certain hormones and chemicals in your brain – he wasn’t kind, he was tying you to him.

I suspect the ‘ex’ never went to jail, BECAUSE IT DIDN’T HAPPEN. Given how the daughter acted I would say 1) she is traumatically bonded to him, 2) HE might have been the incestuous parent, and 3) she may be spathy herself. And none of these are mutually exclusive.

STYLE, THE STORY IS NOT UNDERSTANDABLE, CAUSE IT’S BULL. YOU ONLY NEED TO UNDERSTAND THAT YOU ARE LOOKING A THE FAKE MOVIE SCREEN HE ERECTED – in my case, the WEIRD of his life, hid the ODD of his being. I am SURE they use this ALL the time.

hugs,
one step

Hi Style, I agree with one step – that’s a typical pity ploy. My sociopath also claimed he had a story like that – the father this, the sister that…now I’m sure he was the abuser on all fronts. I’d say it’s not only a pity ploy, but also something they use as part of a defense mechanism when they turn into abusive partners to us: they blame it on the trauma they say they went through, come up with lines like “sorry I’m fucked up”, or “deep down I hate myself and I don’t believe I deserve you so I can’t help destroying the best thing that ever happened in my life”, and so on and so forth. And we find ourselves understanding them, forgiving them, helping them to “heal” when they are really abusing us.

I turned off the computer after I wrote that post.. so you all think that the girl was not molested by her mother? He told me that the girl came to live with him but that he continued paying child support to her mother to get her.. which again does not make sense. If they took it to court, and the woman pled no contest, they would have awarded the girl to the father and he would not have had to continue paying child support and if woman pleaded no contest to something that bad. Wouldn’t she be designated a child molester? She is remarried and was at the girl’s wedding.. I saw the DVD.. It is all so bizarre to me.. these are nice appearing people educated etc… He told me horrible things about this woman, the mother of these two.. that she came after him with a knife, that she was an alcholic .. that they had horrendous fights..
Then I punch him in the arm and he calls me violent.. when I have never been called that in my life…

But the girl told me herself that her mother molested her.. in the first 2 hours.. I thought what a thing to reveal when you first meet someone.. I didn’t even respond.. It was all too bizarre.. it was like a setting that we should be talking about shoes or something light and she says this…THen that night at dinner, I stated that I wasn’t interested in being involved with the boy that is the son of his other ex wife and another man … and this girl cause a scene in the restaraunt and yells at me that her father will listen to her..because she is his daughter! Everything felt so bizarre, off and I actually felt sick inside like I was ‘supposed’ to do what these people tell me..rather than express my wants.. and this is my life and I am grown.. and I never even met the other three boys and the year that he was living with me, he only saw them once..
Yet this girl accuses me of trying to break up her family.. it was insane.. I volunteer to assist children and would never do anything to harm one or to break up a family.. but I won’t be forced to be around people that are no kin to me because this girl demands it.. after that I should’ve broken up with him..
Two of my friends suggested that it was he that molested her.. that make me want to gag.. he doesn’t seem like the type..
Again.. it is confusing.. and as reflect back.. it seems so over the top. NOw, I know the two boys had brain tumors.. I have seen the photos.. of both and talked to one on the phone.. two different mothers and two boys with brain tumors.. Medical friends of mine told me that this is so rare that is it amazing..brain tumors are rare in young children and to have two in the same family but with different mothers.. and he told me that it was not genetic.. then what was it? Then all the death, illness and mentally issues around him.. his stepson dying of an overdose.. another stepson having some sort of brain damage..and he had one child stillborn and he still had half of her ashes that he kept with him and put in a container in a bookcase.. at first, I thought so much trauma and I felt sorry for him… but at the end.. I had a minor surgery.. and I got freaked that I was going to die.. ( his last wife had died) I told a girlfriend that.. to call me and check on me.. as it was last Thanksgiving over the holidays and he cared for me… he wasn’t mean or anything I just had this feeling .. like there was so much negativity around him that something would happen to me…
I never could get physically into him.. we made love twice in a year… now we were affectionate … but most times his touch creeped me out.. his hands felt like claws…. and I am very sensual and he was handsome..I found him physically attractive but I couldn’t stand his touch… Also, a friend told me that this was my intincts protecting me.. and I agree.. butI felt strange.. like I had lost my sexuality. I had had a very sexual relationship just proceeding him and I ended it before him…
I am just thinkng back…my family of course, has issues.. but I have never seen a man with so much trauma in his life.. and when he was a teenager, his mother was married to a man that was abusive to his mother and he protected her from him.. he even held a gun on them.. now, met he mother and she was a fine lady.. and I was with her when she died.. and she confirmed these things…
I just don’t know… I am glad to be out of the dysfunction.. I am processing it all in a different level.. this was the strangest experince of my life with a man.. as it was so confusing .. his neediness, his over attachment to his children… his obession with mediating and spiritual things..his obsession and over correction to saying things like ‘you’re welcome’.. while he is so rude that he cons his way into living with me and asks me to marry him in the first month.. then later when I confront him on it.. he states that I asked him to live with me and that I was the one that wanted to get married.. okay ‘gaslighting’…
And my friends confirmed.. I did not want to marry… I was shocked at how fast all of it was moving..
I think a piece of me still wants to believe that he was ‘good’…
Is this making sense to anyone? I am at another level of understanding, recogition or something….
But if that women did molest those children.. why wasn’t she put in jail and why was she at her daughter’s wedding.. he was so proud that the girl could forgive her mother.. but the girl went to a psycholgist and took mood controling medicine..

one step,

Your comment ” the weird in his life ‘reflected’ the odd in his being” I changed it a bit, but that stuck out…
In that, how can one person have so much trauma unless they attract it to them and in their own children.. illness, molestation, death of a stepchild, still birth…all surrounding one man.. and he came after me hook line and sinker.. I had one foot in and one out the whole time.. and he some big business deal was always on the verge of coming together but never did..he wanted to marry me yet had nothing to offer me .. and the trauma from his past was overwhelming.. why would anyone woman want to walk into that?

one/joy_step_at_a_time

style –

It is called cognitive dissonance when what we know or want to believe and what we are experiencing, either internally or externally, are in direct contradiction. there is a short description here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance

I know this desire/ hope that he is ‘good’. but i wonder if that in me is more about MY wanting to be good, right, compassionate, sane, not taken adavantage of, loved, etc. and my disordered willingness for it to be my problem.

And at the same time, I work everyday to know that I know the truth, as you do. this is your list of knowing form your post:

‘which again does not make sense’
I thought what a thing to reveal when you first meet someone
It is all so bizarre to me
Everything felt so bizarre
I actually felt sick inside
it was insane
that make me want to gag
like there was so much negativity around him that something would happen to me
it is confusing
t seems so over the top
I never could get physically into him
his hands felt like claws
I just don’t know.

KNOW that the DETAILS of the traumas are just a knit together smoke screen. pull back out of them and see the patterns and the wider picture.

(I have over 50 of my photos of my tragic traumatized spath and his WHOLE family, his ex, pets, his families’ pets, etc., and there are at least another 50 that I know of – and who they really are of I have no idea.

I talked to ‘him’ AND ‘his sister’ on the phone. NEITHER of them were real.)

best,
one step

one/joy_step_at_a_time

Style,

Your last question of why would a woman want to walk in to this – this is the work we need to do. We need to uncover THAT and heal THAT.

I am reading the BETRAYAL BOND and doing the exercises. It is a beginning.

one/joy_step_at_a_time

hmmm, I think the hypothesis – of what we create in ourselves we attract may work with NON DISORDERED folk. I don’t know how these folks work inside – but i am pretty sure that they work differently and that most of the trauma (most, not all – let’s go back to the over 90% figure) they project isn’t actually in their lives, but only in their minds; it is PART OF THE GAME, part of the stroy, ONLY.

Why are so many spaths attractive, even though they may not be ‘good looking’ – I have started to think that stress ages us, hangs heavy on our faces and bodies. I sure see this in my self in this past year. And i suspect that they look good cause they have a disordered conscience, they would have no stress response to the things we have stress response to.

one step, that list really helped me to see what I was feeling the whole time… it was all wrong and I felt it..

I didn’t want to walk into that.. that is what I was saying.. I was like suffacating.. yet he was showing me all this attention, and being there for me and talkimg love love love.. you are my soulmate.. . So ‘being a good person’ I wanted to be there for him… but his being there for me.. was fun stuff like shopping for my new place and hanging art.. I need to read the Betrayal Bond also… and I will read about the cognitive dissonance.
In my family of origin, my parents were functioning alcoholics.. this started when I was a teenager.. as a young child I was not around it and I had a pretty good upbringing.. and lots of nuturing.. but as a teenager I witnessed alcholic behavior and when I would call my Dad on what he did or said he would tell me that I was wrong.. this made me doubt myself.. and what I saw and knew to be true. I adored my Dad.. everything in my life ‘looked’ good… beautiful home, successful Dad, pretty people.. but there was alcholism and denial.. I learned to deny myself..and what I knew to be true.. I was the trouble maker that told the truth. THat did not drink.. That was a ballet dancer and took good care of myself. I get that I try to believe what people that I love tell me.. My Dad actually told this man that I always tell him the truth and that I am always right..
It blew my mind.. my Dad and I are very close on certain levels.. he doesn’t drink but a bit now.. and is dealing with health issues.. and he is grumpy and on some levels doesn’t show affection but on others does.. My parent were married for 55 years..I had a pretty stable family.. some weirdness but fairly stable.. I am the diligent want to be good, look pretty, do the right thing always be perfect child… never did drugs, drink little.. and wanted to be married and a ‘wife’… I am the caretaker, the one that people come to and the one that tries to understand and to fix… with this guy I had my boundaries as I watched and with his daughter I set boundaries.. I was not going to let this emotionally disturbed child that I had nothing to do with rearing define my life.. and this is where it began to be revealed…

I have the look.. I look 15 years younger than I am.. I trust in God.. and I have been pulled out of things just in the nick of time… I just don’t get why I get into them at all.. yet I just wrote why above…LOL

But this man just inflitrated my life like some badger.. that is what one of my girlfriends calls him.. then I become what is wrong in his life.. I was the one that blew it when it was ‘perfect’ for him.. becuase of what I siad to his daughter.. I see it.. but it is still wierd for me..

Style 1,
The best thing you might do for yourself now is to consider the “source”. All that disfunction and bizzare stuff in his past .
The S/P/N lives in a delusional world and they spin stories according to THEIR own distorted percetion.

I am pretty sure that for every story an S/P tells his new woman about the woman from his past….The woman from his past generally is described as being “crazy” (or fill in the blank) By the end of a relationship with these disordered individuals most of us feel pretty crazy! But the story you hear from them doesn’t give ANY truth about their accountability of being the HUGE DISFUNCTION in that relationship. (to make her do those crazy things)

It is like you punching him in the arm and now his distorted “take” on all that is that you are violent. That is his story.

I think it would be impossible to firgure out the absolute truth of all those bizzare things he told you.
But maybe you shouldn’t even try to spend one more minute on even trying to figure it out.

Its taking to much space in your head and that is not in YOUR best interest. Entertaining different thoughts of him in your head regardless if it is about his past before you or when he was with you is giving him MORE than he deserves right now.

This is the addictive part of what happens when these toxic people have been in our lives.
Try to go no contact with him in your thoughts as well. I think there is a good older article here at LF about this.
No contact begins in my head, or something similar.

witsend.. thanks, you are correct..I am in my head thinking back.. and part of that is me wanting to be and having been so perfect… when I don’t need to be perfect… I go over my behavior and disect it.. and this is how ‘they’ get me.. to doubt what I know is real and right.. they get me to doubt myself or at least to question myself on some level but not totally.. my gut tells me the truth…

My father demanded perfection and I complied as best that I could..

one step,

I read about cognitive dissonance and that was helpful.. I am processing all this.. to see more and more clearly…

Thanks all…

Hi Style1,
My sociopath’s ex-girlfriends were all “crazy” and “deluded”. Turned out they were not girlfriends – but girlfriends, including one wife-to-be. If you really want to know the truth – I’m not sure it’s a good idea, but for the sake of argument let’s say you want to find out – try other sources of information – anyone except him. Could his daughter be an accomplice instructed to validate his lies? My sociopath had a friend doing that for him whenever I got too suspicious.

Eileen,
I never really met any of his friends.. just his daughter, her husband and his mother… I think his daughter was just messed up from all the trauma..of the death of her brothers and whatever her mother did to her.. two brothers dying and one survived cancer.. then her father married four times and the last one dying and her grandmother just dying.. he was not from here but from Fla… and he talked on the phone alot to business people.. his mother confirmed alot of it.. I think that it all happened just not exactly like he recalls it with the women or the whys of things.. of course they were from his perspective..

This is what is weird.. I was doing so well and lately like I worked out today with a friend then went to Starbucks then drove around and it is a beautiful day and I am all alone.. We spent a lot of time together both last Christmas and the one before it.. and this was when his mother got ill two years ago.. there are lots of memories related to him and the recent holidays.. I find myself wondering or actually thinking is he somewhere having a great time.. and I am left here with all these memories.. in that, he may very well have attached to another woman or rather ‘soulmate’..and I am living amongest the memories of where that we went and what we did..it is quiet and peaceful and too much time to think.. the world seems still… and it is nice in ways and not in others… I am doing all the right things… but ir is weird how life changes from one year to the next.. we were always running here and there .. and this year was pretty much boring with terrible dating experinces and too much time to think.. it is like a void.. and I don’t want to avoid the void.. I want to experience it.. I have reached out to others.. I workout .. I go through my day.. I watch TV.. I go to movies.. I saw It’s Complicated and it made me sad.. I am like that woman in ways..I love to cook and have a great house.. was an interior designer..I know how to create a warm loving home.. and I do so for myself and others but I did for him… and other men in my life and it all ends up for naught…I am weary of it all…

What’s it for.. to learn .. to experience… I have experienced enough for three lifetimes where men are concerned…and I mean in an honorable way.. and what for.. to learn I am better off alone…
what was all that with his mother? THat I helped her… then I am turned on by his daughter.. and ultimiatly him..when I wasn’t exactly as he planned it..
I have never been one not to be independant..
I am just confused right now.. and I guess that is okay… it’s just what it is…

I can’t remember where I saw that article written by Donna on the site, she makes a distinction between 2 types of lies: the blatant, outrageous ones, that have no connection with reality; and the lies mixed with truth. I know my sociopath for instance tended to “borrow” stories about things that happened to other people, and made them his own. Alternatively, if he wanted to boast about his affairs, he’d claim he was talking about his friend’s affairs…Their webs of lies can be infinitely complex and you could spend ages trying to unravel them. With time, you’ll see more clearly though, and you’ll think in terms of “likely”/”unlikely” instead of “true”/”false”, and eventually you’ll reach a point when you don’t care anymore… don’t worry about him having a “great time”, he can’t , sociopaths are too shallow for that. How could he find a “soulmate” if he has no soul…

Thanks Eileen..I am cleaning out stuff tonight and I tripped across one of his early emails 4 months after we met..
Here it is…

“I am usually not at a loss for words, but this time I have to think carefully as to how to convey my sense of of wonder, thankfulness, and appreaciation for you and all that you bring to my life.
The difficulty lies not in realizing that it is happening but in taking in the full impact of it and feeling its repercussions and reverberations through the corridors of out time together, out emotions, feelings and the future of our conmingled life forces.
You and I have always known that we are not like other people. We have had to go through several experiences for our sake and the the sakes of others. Now all that is past. The certiamty of each other and out own individual identities, echoed back through the intuitions of several others around us, convery the celebration of our getting back together. I feel the whole Universe shares and rejoices in our love.

You are very right that love is the Magic and what’s being mirrored back is love, But above all, we ourselves are the Mirrors on which that love is reflected and amplified through the intertwined wholeness of our consciousness the triumphant expression of Divine Love unfolding to express itself and find itself amidst the Creation. There’s nothing like it .. it enfolds me and sweeps me away. It’s a mystical experience in the First Magnitude.
It is that Realization that upholds me no that I am physically away from you. I can’t wait for us to start our lives together;to put our Rings on our fingers; to restate and reaffirm our eternal sacred trust in each other in the presence of God, the Universe, His and Angels and all those who have eyes to see.
I am so proud of you and what you have become and achieved in this life against great odds. You have face disintegrating ungratefulness and tearing evil and have remained unsullied and have not responded in like kind. I know the Mother is very proud of Her Daughter. I feel it in my soul. She tells me so. Our time is here now .. In Love with you forever.”

All this was in response to my thanking him for the roses and a wonderful Valentines weekend and telling him that I miss him. He made me a card, gave me chocolate and we went out all weekend..

Does his email creep anyone else out?
As a back story.. he thought that we had spent lives together somewhere in China and we were like a King and his Queen..
I didn’t feel it.. sorry to say….

witsend and Style 1 — My ex also described women from his past as being “crazy.” I recall telling him I bet he had something to do with it! He once replied that “they either become crazy or become saved (as in saints returning to church).”

one_step_at_a_time: I agree with your point that stress ages us, hangs heavy on faces and bodies, and the N/S/Ps still look good because they are oblivious/disordered conscience and have little to no stress response to — but they sure are good at causing stress for others.

Amazing.

All of mine were intimidate by his intelligence, were either violent, alcoholic or crazy or all of the above..

That email was written when he was like four months behind in his rent.. and by the next Valentines.. it was over…

I wonder if the Universe told him that…

I like the opening words “I am usually not at a loss for words”…I can well believe that! It’s quite revealing that he then writes “but this time”. Something didn’t work out according to plan the previous times? I don’t understand the second sentence at all – sounds quite vacuous to me – verbose, flowery language that makes no sense but impresses nonetheless. The mirror metaphor is adequate – a smooth, cold surface with nothing underneath. Then mystical stuff, except for the rings – that’s what he was getting at, then. And you haven’t responded to evil by evil, that’s interesting for a sociopath planning to do something evil to you…
Creepy enough indeed… All in all very vague, nothing concrete, no real promise nor plan, just words…

Eileen.. thanks and yep.. he wrote and talked like that alot.. like to run large words together and even say a french word in french while speaking English … he is an affected boor..
And I for some reason I am angry this evening.. like at myself for even having a freak that writes like that in my life.. and that I bought it ‘kinda’ for awhile.. it’s all jibberish..
He reads ‘spiritual’ things all the time.. and reguritates them..for his purposes..
thanks everyone for letting me vent..

French words, ha, mine preferred Latin! Except that sometimes he didn’t know what they meant!

I read on here somewhere that the language and accent deal was a part of their deal..

Mine was a word master in that if we went to a Chinese restaraunt he could read the words on the bakc of the fortune in the forture cookie.. to impress.. but like who cares! Everything was to impress with his intellect..

I have been around lots of learned and intelligent people and never had one act like this piece of work..

then when I would ask why he did that.. he would state that I was initimadated..when I was BORED!…

Oh the accent part……
HA!
Mine developed a accent from whereever he was at or whomever he was around…..
He sounded like such a dope!
If his friends were from NY with a hard accent…..he became mafia…..
If he visited Italy….it was ciao this and ciao that…..
France offered a stupid bonjour gig or ‘we-we’……everything was answered with we-we with a bowed head…..(can you picture that?)
and god forbid…..Hawaii…..he developes the pigeon tongue…..there is nothing (IMO) more repulsive than a mexican/white dude speaking pigeon as if he was raised in the islands….it’s a very ignorant sounding dialect.
YA-bruthuh……EH……
OMG…..this would come after 1 day on vacation…..

He so wanted to belong…..I thought he was an idiot and called him on it and would ‘tease’ him…..HE HATED IT!!!!

Good thing he wasn’t more ‘international’…..

YA BRUTHUH…..CIAO…….wewe
ADIOS!

Hi Style 1, if you haven’t already done so, check out the article “a psychopath’s bewildering way of talking” and the comments with it. Just found it on the site – it’s in “scientific research”, page 2. I had no idea there was so much on this site!! It is another tool for parsing sociopathtalk…it triggered a lot for me. Big words but spelt wrong or misused; unfinished sentences (that left me wondering if I was stupid because I thought there must be a joke there but I just didn’t get it!) etc. My sociopath wasn’t the genius nor the intellectual he claimed to be…definitely not!!

one/joy_step_at_a_time

ouuuu, spath speak! will go read it right now!

one/joy_step_at_a_time

eileen, are you sure it’s in scientific research?

Yes, go to scientific research, click on “next page” at the bottom, and you’ll see it, just before the picture of the woman with a gun!

Erin, that is hysterical.. yes, they want to belong and to appear so ‘with it’ and knowledgable.. like they are ‘above’ the average person, but they have nothing that actually sets them apart, but their airs.. I am watching LIFETIME and a movie is coming on. The true one about Sante and Kenny Kimes, a mother and son con team. When I first met this man and he told me about his mother ..I thought of this movie.. His mother asked me on our first meeting if my new townhouse had a downstairs bedroom. She couldn’t walk up stairs and was in the downstairs master bedroom in the house where they were renting. I thought that a wierd question and then when she got ill and was in the hospital and later in a nursing home and he told her that he was closing down their house and selling all of her things. She got really angry at her son. I suggested that he rent a two bedroom apt. and he never even looked. He was set on moving in with me and he worked it that way.. We got rid of all his things and he was planning on moving in with me. His mother was getting worse and worse. When I think back, they were looking for a place to move .. a woman with a house.. and it just worked out as it did.. as I don’t have a downstairs bedroom and even if I did I would not have his mother and dog move into my house. He didn’t have a good enough credit report to lease and apt.. he was getting ready to be evicted. And looking back when he wasn’t with a woman, he and his mother lived together.. I haven’t lived with anyone in my family since I left home and got married for the first time. I am thinking that she was in on the con.. in on knowing that they were sinking fast and needed a place to move.

Eileen, thank you. I will read that article..
I got depressed yesterday.. just thinking back and feeling lonely. I also had dreams last night.. I recalled things.. like he was talking about these huge deals to ‘business partners’ yet every so often, he would need to wire like a hundred bucks to one of them.. I would ask why would this business man be in such dire need of 100 bucks and he would answer.. don’t ask? This former CIA guy and this big banking deal that they were working on and this guy would need 100 bucks overnighted.. inconguous… don’t you think?
Being still and thinking is revealing more and more in my memory..
Then one night I asked him if he was ever accused of being involved in his last wive’s’ death in some way.. and he got so angry .. shouted at me..
Instead of just talking to me about it..
I mean the woman died of a perscription drug overdose and he told me that she has called 911 and accused him of abuse… but he told me she was just crazy… I mean he told me that he couldn’t afford a divorce and that is why that she still lived there.. then she dies.. Did he have something to do with her death.. in one form or another? Geez, I am feeling sick…

one/joy_step_at_a_time

didn’t see the next page, so searched for it. wish i’d seen the gun first. 😉

one/joy_step_at_a_time

style, i was wondering about his wife’s death also. if it helps, you may be able to do some research on her death. but only if you think it will help – and not make it more difficult for you.

i know i am a mix of needing to know more, do more over time AND work at letting go.

i am not sure what i need to do about the spath in the long term. but i know i need to be patient, and take care of myself in the doing.

one step,

Yes, it freaks me about the death.. in that, he told me that the marriage went bad after the first few months and he married her really fast like in two weeks.. and moved her from Chicago to Texas.s Then what he says is that she has health issues that he didn’t know about from a car wreck and other health issues and that she took all this medicine and she lived in an upstairs bedroom and his ill mother in the downstairs.. it was a large house.. and he came in on the weekends and took care of them both. And when I met him the house was practically empty.. except for his mother’s wing.. He slept on an air mattress with children’s cartoon sheets and an altar in the room so that he could meditate….It was bizarre .. yet I continued to date this freak..you see, he was so charming..attentive and had been though so much and I was the love of his life..his soulmate.. the one that he had been looking for his whole life…
Yes, how convenient for him . that this woman died.. he turns my stomach just thinking about it… he is so manipulative.. he could’ve just mentally messed her over that she had no will to live.. according to him.. she became violent and he had no idea why.. just crazy…
When I was helping him move out of that place.. I found hidden notes from her to him.. and they read like she was broken hearted and confused… and she wrote things that I came to realize..
That he is never wrong about anything.. etc..

AND I CONTINUED to DATE him.. although I felt really off about it.. and I felt ill many times that I was around him.. like this vague anxiousness… and I had stomach upsets.. I thought I was tired from the stress of moving, from meeting him, from his mother’s illness.. but it was more…something I recognized and couldn’t quite put my finger on..

If a man I was married to overdoses, I would be truamatized. I would be upset.. I would not be looking for a new husband in three months as he was with me..
He was like on the hunt…
This ex that died of his didn’t work and she was living with another man wheh he met her … and he commented that she had good credit..
The more I recall and write.. the sicker that I am feeling..
This guy was worse than I even realize..
And, yes, I did call the police dept in the town where this occurred to see if I could find out anything.. but no one got back to me… I think it might upset me more to try and find out …
He wasn’t charged with anything so….

one/joy_step_at_a_time

style, seems he has a ‘story’ that he repeats and repeats – they don’t have to change the story, just keep dangling it until one of us bites.

but YOU lived, and now you also will heal. you ARE on your way.

It’s wierd… I miss him and feel lonely like yesterday… then I get depressed last night and I have dreams and this recall of little things that he said and did.. and things that I saw then but that are coming back to me now to look at again… for more awarness…

OH, I know that feeling, Style, and I know it’s so horrible. Sometimes I feel I’m still trapped in his web, feeling I’ve sold him out by turning back to the ways of my family and the legal system and just go back to him. (he has asked me to stop the order of protection I placed on him, for a Christmas present. I didn’t do it, but I’m scared he’ll be even more angry at me now, and REALLY come after me)

But in my gut, I know that if I go back to him, he’ll just use and abuse me more, and “punish” me, which he used to say he’d do if I wasn’t “good.” His punishment took the form of increasing unexpected sadism while making love.

Go back to that? Yikes!

I need to read this blog regularly, and write on it, to remind myself. . . .

Geez Louise.. STAY away from him….read on here.. and do not drop the protective order… just NO CONTACT…

Like I was feeling so low.. that I pondered for a moment contacting him over Christmas.. and now I am into the reality again..
I think that this is just the process to unwind from them..

Don’t put yourself back into their web of deciet .. it will only make you feel more crazy.. work it out here…

one/joy_step_at_a_time

it’s like a detox. there are healing crises in detoxing; when we detox we often get a rush of chemicals dumped in our systems that we then need to process. maybe this is the same.

i had a REALLY vivid experience, while I was dozing one night, a few weeks ago, of the spath in the loved boy manifestation coming at me full on – the energy jolted me. detox. let me know what affect she had had on me.

I know the difference bewteen ‘coming’ and ‘going’ with chemicals most often; when I am becoming more toxic or detoxing. They feel different, but the ONE thing they have in common, is that they can leave me feeling clouded and depressed as I process the toxins.

maybe it is the same here. we are chemical/ hormonal beings. this makes so much sense to me – that pyschological expereinces impact on our chemistry. and like me growing allerigc repsonse to mold and other things, we get more sensitive. BUT that also means we can use that to make ourselves safe.

all best style – keep going, keep learning, keep knowing that YOU KNOW. And what you are and want to be is more important that what he is.

LouiseG:
It’s the guilt we allow ourselves to ‘own’.
HE did the mean things.
HE was abusive.
HE crossed the line of the law.
HE-HE-HE!
(AND WE HOLD THE GUILT?????)

This is the whole crux of NO CONTACT!
With 2 plus years NC……I see how I reacted before….and I see how I react now/after.
I AM CONVINCED NC was the only way I was able to get out and stay out…..
For 28 years I bought into and ALWAYS looked for the ‘i love you’s’……the fake ‘i’m sorry’s’….the please help me’s….the i know i need helps…..the ‘you are the love of my life’s’, the ‘you are the only woman I want’…….the blah’s, blah’s, blah’s……..
They only had to be spoken for me to believe the words…..I was desperate.
I WANTED TO HEAR THOSE WORDS, SO I DIDN”T HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE “PAIN” of a breakup. Live another day being punished….bring my life back to the ‘honeymoon’ phase of cutesy-wootsy….temporary, yet sufficient for me….to offer me hope….he could change….prove to myself I WAS WRONG…..see EB, he really isn’t the monster I thought…..look, he cried as he said, I LOVE YOU!
HOLY SHIT EB….WTF?
This is the crap we allow our minds to play on us……AVOIDANCE through guilt!

Well……the pain of the breakup was NOTHING like living in hell and rollercoaster with a toxic person……the pain of the breakup is temporary and minimizes over time…….
Living in toxicity almost killed me! LITERALLY!!!!
It was a 28 year process of dying. And not one month after booting him……I had 2 strokes, dissected carotid artery and diagnosed with cancer!!!
HHHHEEEEELLLLLLLOOOOOOOOO~!

DO NOT OWN WHAT HE DID! You are protecting your rights as a HUMAN BEING!
The ‘guilt’ is simply your programming to do whatever he wants……and NOW YOUR NOT!!!!!

In reality, you know the outcome……keep reminding yourself of that.
Keep up NO CONTACT…..really, it offers space and time for your mind to heal and become strong and refamiliarize yourself with YOUR own values, morals and wishes!

I truely value my NO CONTACT!
This action and this alone has allowed me to gain EB back-strength to make my own decisions based on what EB wants……NOT HIM! It’s a snowball effect of self esteem…..all coming from NO CONTACT!!!!

It’s like having a strained foot……if you don’t stay off of it and give it a rest……it’ll never get better and you’ll always be walking with a limp. You need time to gain strength…..
(the difference here…..once the strain feels better….you can’t go back to doing the ‘old’ activities again…..)

Stay strong…..
And always remember…..YOUR BEST INTEREST!!!!!

I just read your post and really appreciate it…you see, today is my ex’s birthday and I am at home feeling guilty for cutting off contact with him almost 2 months ago…

His phone call to me when he realized I had cut off contact after a fight about stealing from my house revolved around how ‘insulted’, ‘offended’, and ‘hurt’ he was that I accused him of stealing and how could we be in a relationship if there was no trust…I know he has the STUPID book…its the point of stealing ANYTHING from me…

My point is this…I am having racing thoughts and Im obsessing…with guilt today even though all the lies and manipulations are playing out in my head as well…

Please Rbabe don’t fall for that. My ex-sociopath used the exact same strategy: he claimed he was ‘offended’, ‘hurt’ and also ‘angry’, all at the same time – everytime I suspected him – and everytime I was right.
Actually, correction: I was not entirely right – very far from the truth actually: I only suspected 5% of what he actually did – at the time I had no idea of the extent of his lying and cheating. And still, he was the one trying to make me feel guilty. Don’t let him do that to you.

His reaction would indicate that he stole a lot more than a book from you…

So it’s his birthday, ha? How many years of stupidity?

Eileen:
Interesting thoughts. I know a bunch of half stories…you know, the ones that he told me that left out the ‘catch’ to the situations but made him look semi-good still?

Much of my anger is towards me (guilt=anger turned inward) for allowign all the crap to continue, despite his efforts to really SHOW me who he is.

I appreciate you reiterating the fact about his over reaction to his perception of being ‘accused’. It is true…his reaction did and continues to indicate he stole that…not to mention what ever else he took that is unknown to me at this time…

He is 36 today and you are right again…36 years of stupidity. He lives at home with his parents still…does not drive…and has the NERVE to demand anything from me?

Thank you, eileen—you are much appreciated!

Robxsy, I’m glad if it helps! It helps me a great deal also – funny, it’s easier to deconstruct the very same sociopathic sentences when they come from someone else’s sociopath!

I also got the “if you’re demanding evidence that what I’m saying is true, it means there is no trust and this relationship can’t work” and you know what? When they say that, they are actually telling the truth. Relationships with them can only work if we trust them – if we trust them blindly. If we don’t believe or trust them anymore, they know there are losing the game. Either they try harder to convince us, or they see the danger coming and they dump us for a more gullible prey before we find them out.

I have no doubt now, that even though my sociopath claimed he loved me etc, if I had insisted to see the evidence I wanted when he came up with the trust thing, he would have walked away there and then!

As always I’m hesitant to give details here in case he checks this site and spots me (and then signs up! Argh!)

DEar Eilee,

Good words from you, you are so right, they DEMAND “trust” BLIND TRUST, trust should be EARNED not given to every tom, dick and harry that DEMANDS it, betrays it and then DEMANDS it again!

Oh, Baby, truuuuuuust me! Yea right! that is “P-speak” for SUCKERRRRRRR!!!!

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