By | November 12, 2011 11 Comments

Get out of jail, commit murder

It seems that every time Raymond Harris of Carpentersville, Illinois, gets out of jail, he tries to kill a woman. He allegedly succeeded last month, and then took the elderly woman’s engagement ring to propose to his girlfriend.

Read Raymond Harris stole murdered nurse’s wedding ring to propose to his girlfriend, prosecutors say, on

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Ox Drover

Spending a considerable amount of both money and time in figuring out ways to keep my psychopathic son Patrick (In prison for premeditated murder since January 1992) in prison and to keep him FROM being released on parole. I shake my head in lack of understanding on why parole is granted to people who have shown a tendency for VIOLENCE toward others, and especially to people who have REPEATEDLY shown VIOLENCE.

There Are many people in prison who have done bad things that did NOT involve violence toward people.

I do know that the general statistics about completion of parole before being “busted again” is pretty grim….about 60% of people don’t complete their parole.

In Arkansas where I live, the state does NOT bust a parolee on a “technical” violation, like he doesn’t show up for a parole date, or he violates curfew, etc. but ONLY rearrests him if he COMMITS ANOTHER FELONY. So, to me, that sort of like telling a kid repeatedly “if you do that again, I will not even spank you if you don’t mind me, I won’t even put you in the corner, I’m, not even going to threaten you. I’m going to ignore you ignoring me and what I tell you to do.”

Well, I guess you can imagine what an “uppity 5 year old would do with those instructions.” Well the convicts are as smart as five year olds.

In addition, a ten year sentence for a crime will result in about 18 months in jail and/or prison and then “parole” for the rest of the sentence (and we just learned what “parole” is—NOTHING.)

The Federal Justice system “did AWAY with Parole”—-know how they did that? They CHANGED THE NAME from “Parole” to “supervised release.” LOL

Right this minute in the US there are about 2 MILLION people in jail or Prison, and Dr. Robert Hare says that 25% of them are full fledged psychopaths, and Dr. Kent A. Kiehl, another researcher of psychopaths, says that the AVERAGE PCL-R score of ALL inmates is 22 (and the average score for everyone is only 4-5) so there are a BUNCH of bad dudes in prison…..none of us would want to marry a person who scored 22 on the PCL-R, but half of them do score less than 22 so maybe there are some folks in prison who are NOT HIGH in P-traits.

Now, there are an additional 5 million folks on parole or probation. I don’t know what THEIR PCL-R average score is but since they are or have been in trouble with the law and/or been in prison, I would say that it is (just a guess now) “above the average of the general population for everyone).

It looks like to me that the PAROLE BOARDS are the ones “practicing mental evaluations without a license” when they decide WHO is released back into the public.

Actually crime statistics for just about every class of crime is going DOWN—as our criminal population of INMATES GOES UP, so keeping more people off the street seems to be having a POSITIVE EFFECT—-AS LONG AS WE DO KEEP THEM OFF THE STREET.

Our parole boards and our judges and our courts need to realize that these people will NOT CHANGE, REFORM OR GET BETTER. My son is a perfect example and would score 38 out of a possible score of 40 on the PCL-R, he CAN be kept in prison for his natural life. Every time he has been let out on parole or conditional release he has done a new and higher level crime. He has NEVER completed even a short parole without a new felony. The last felony was MURDER.


@Ox Drover
I really appreciate your experience with all these justice system and psychopathic criminals issues! I don’t know very much about your story, it must be so painful for you to have a psychopathic son. I have three sons…I honestly can’t even imagine how painful that would be! God bless you in your efforts to keep people safe from him. It must be so frustrating working with a justice system that just doesn’t get it.

This article above regarding Raymond Harris is so disturbing! What a monster this guy is!! I am glad he is in jail and I hope he stays there!!

Ox Drover

Hoanna, I’m trying to keep myself safe from him as well, he had one of his buddies come to infiltrate our family like a Trojan Horse, and the purpose was to kill me….so my son could inherit….and probably the rest of the family too. God was good and I found out before it was too late that the man who rented a house from me was a former cell mate of my son’s as well as a 3X convicted child sex abuser. He ended up going to prison again, as well as my oldest son’s wife who was having an affair with him…sounds like a soap opera, but in the meantime, my elderly mother is financing my P-son and sending him money in prison, hiring an attorney to get him out on parole when he comes up for parole again, and I am hiring an attorney to FIGHT his parole, and am NC with her. She lives on the same farm as I do, just across the pasture from my house where my adopted son and I live. Like I said, sounds like a soap opera, but I’ve finally learned that the SHAME ain’t mine!


@Ox Drover
That is the stuff of nightmares!!
When I read your note I got a little red flag…
because a former cellie of my ex started writing me from prison and I have been writing him, he said he had a falling out with my ex and they are no longer friends…hmmmm…I have met this guy before and I feel sorry for him. He has been in and out of prison his whole life due to the fact he was sexually abused as a child and given drugs as a child. The reason I met him was because my ex was involved with a prison ministry and he used to be my ex’s cellie. I am no longer involved with the prison ministry, but I did meet this guy the last time he was out, now he is back in. There is nothing more between us that friendship and I have made it very clear that I am not looking for anything but friendship, and I don’t send him any money…nothing more than letters and cards. After reading your note I will proceed with extreme caution with that guy just because he was a friend of my ex.

My experiences with prison ministry were not very good, that is one of the reasons that I was so interested in what you were saying. I am much too naive and trusting to work well in ministry with criminals. After my disaster of a relationship with a criminal psychopath, I will never do prison ministry again. I can’t wrap my brain around their motives and thinking and choices, too dark and evil to comprehend.

I am sorry to read that your mom is still drinking the Kool-Aid! That makes it even more difficult! Wow…what a mess these people make! And you are right, the shame isn’t yours!


Dear Hosanna,
Something you said, about the cell mate of your X husband sounds like my OLD THINKING, which was so often wrong.
You said . . .
“He has been in and out of prison his whole life due to the fact he was sexually abused as a child and given drugs as a child.”
Many psychopaths use abuse (which is often not even true) or drugs (most drug addicts don’t kill) as an excuse . . . and WE buy it. We wind up excusing THEIR EVIL acts.
They act EVIL, because they “ARE” EVIL. Most abused people and drug addicts are NOT EVIL & DON’T KILL etc. Most likely, If the cell mate does EVIL acts, it is because he IS EVIL!

Ox Drover

Dear Hosanna,

There is a 25% chance this man is a psychopath, and a VERY GOOD chance he is VERY HIGH in P-traits if he isn’t a complete psychopath. I STRONGLY RECOMMEND that you do NOT WRITE THIS MAN ANY MORE, and do not have any contact with him at all.


QUIT feeling “sorry for him!”

Unfortunately, too many times the “ministries” that go into prison are all in to “forgiveness” = pretend it didn’t happen.

The truth is that IT DID HAPPEN. There are CONSEQUENCES to behaviors and “getting the bitterness about something out of our heart” is my idea of “forgiveness” but i t doesn’t mean PRETEND IT DIDN’T HAPPEN….or RESTORE 100% trust over and over and over when it is betrayed over and over and over.

LOVE is a verb, it is an ACTION verb, it means to ACT KINDLY, it is not a “squishy feeling” When people act BADLY they are NOT acting lovingly. ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS.

This man is dangerous, get him out of your life is my advice. Keep him and ANYONE who is an ex convict, an addict, a pity-me whiner, or who does not take responsibility for their own actions and keep themselves substance clean and crime free.

Save your compassion for abused children and cancer victims.

Ox Drover


From reading both those articles I see the “manipulation” for sure. One of the things that just about every inmate learns inside is how to “manipulate” the social workers and the ministry volunteers with stories of their psychological grief and remorse, and how to “play crazy” when it gets them something.

In my son Patrick’s medical records which he had sent to me a few years ago because he needed surgery on a shoulder and the Prison system wasn’t interested in doing it, so he wanted me to put pressure on his doctor (which I did and he got the surgery.)

In the records which I CAREFULLY read when I was preparing to fight his parole release last year I found where he had lied to and manipulated the social worker/counselor/therapist by pretending to be “grief stricken” by the death of his “nephew.” He wanted a housing change and he got it.

The “nephew” he was so grief stricken over the death of was my son C’s 21 year old step son that Patrick had never met, never seen, and did not know at all, so I sincerely doubt that there was a BIG ATTACHMENT….but there WAS a “grain of truth” in his lie. His brother’s step son had died, and by marriage that would make the kid his “nephew.”

His grief over the death of his grandfather was the same kind of manipulation. My step father had gone NC with Patrick when Patrick was 17. He knew what Patrick was, and didn’t want anything to do with him. The one letter Patrick wrote my step father shortly before his death in January 2005 “apologizing” for a theft from my step dad that Patrick had done years before but CONTINUED TO DENY in spite of the evidence to the contrary—I had asked Patrick to write daddy and “admit and apologize for the theft—EVEN IF YOU DIDN’T DO IT—at least let him go to his grave in peace about it.” How is that for Oxy MAKING PEACE???—let’s pretend none of it happened. LOL Well Patrick wrote a letter admitting that his BEST FRIEND had stolen from daddy, but he KNEW ABOUT IT so in a way it was HIM and he’s sorry. Daddy read the letter, made a SPITTING NOISE with his mouth and THREW the letter to the floor. I picked it up and read it and “wanted to die” because Patrick wouldn’t even do THAT for me…for “daddy’s peace.” I realize now, that I was deceptive, I was WRONG for wanting that, I should have listened to daddy–he was a very smart man. But even he was fooled by my egg donor.

The inmates know what is PC for them to say in terms of “remorse” and “finding Jesus” and the families who have been encouraged to be “supportive” of them when they get out, should I say GUILTED into being supportive of them when they get out, so the STATE won’t have to be responsible for housing them or watching them….also know what to say to appear able to help Junior or Bubba get out.

I don’t know what the percentage of people/families are like me and don’t want Junior or Bubba back….my attorney for the parole fight said he had never heard of a family hiring an attorney to fight Junior’s parole, that usually if they don’t want Junior or Bubba back they just DO NOT hire an attorney FOR helping them get out. My egg donor hired an attorney FOR him the first time, (she paid the money) and I did the leg work of getting people to testify that WE were a good family and he would have a great place to parole to with lots of PC support. He’d only been in at that time 15 years for a cold blooded pre meditated murder so they gave him 4 years (probably he would have gotten 5 without the attorney) but when he came up this last time, egg donor had an attorney FOR him getting out and I had one AGAINST and he got 3 years til he can ask again. Statistically 22-25 years is what “you get” for the kind of murder he did, so he is coming up on that amount of time…and I expect that no matter what I do, he will be out by 2017 (25 years inside) but I will continue to fight, and my sons after me. If he does get out and we can stay safe, he has ALWAYS gone back to prison in a matter of a few months and I can’t imagine him as a middle aged ex convict working at a mcDonald’s, sleeping in a flop house and being “satisfied”—he will “have to” get into something to make him feel “superior” and with his record of LACK OF SUCCESS in his crimes, he’ll be arrested again pretty quick me thinks. Just like this man was.


@ Ox Drover and Sarah999,

I think you are both correct! The more I think about this the more creepy it is! I have no idea what is true that this guy has told me. He is one of those guys that “finds Jesus” when he is in prison and then goes back into his criminal behavior when he gets out. I reread his letters and I see lots of flattery and lots of pity play…NOT a good sign on top of the obvious! Yep…why me, why would he choose me, he hardly knows me at all, he needs to find a different friend!


he picked you because it is apparent to him that you are a good person. Evil searches for good. Good people provide a cover and a mirror. Good people want to take responsibility, spaths love it when others become responsible for them. They love scapegoats and authorities. Both of these types are willing to be responsible for the spaths. They are children and do not want any responsibilty. They only want power and they want to take it from you, not work for it.

the phoenix

Wow, what timing. Just this morning as I was leaving my neighborhood, there was a small van with a trailer, a guard and two inmates working on the roadway clearing the drainage ditch area.

I found myself thinking, “Try not to be judgemental about the inmates. They are men. Maybe not so much ‘bad men’, but men that had done bad things. Maybe not even so much bad things, but bad enough that they got caught and now are being ‘punished’ for it.”

Then to read about a freak like this that has certainly done bad things, repeated the process a couple of times and definitely Should be in jail… yet the parole board had the nerve and convenience of seeing only what they chose to allowing him out to commit murder again? Maybe there should be some accountability on their part in this as well. That’s just messed up!

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