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By | November 30, 2009 150 Comments

I, Psychopath: Watch the documentary online

Three years ago, on November 30, 2006, I received an e-mail from Sam Vaknin, Ph.D.

Perhaps you’ve seen Vaknin’s name on the Internet. He wrote and self-published a book called Malignant Self-Love—Narcissism Revisited. He promotes the book heavily online, so if you Google “narcissism,” his website on narcissistic personality disorder comes up on the first page of search results.

Here’s what Vaknin said in his e-mail:

You haven’t responded to my last two e-mails to you. Have I done anything to offend you?

(puzzled)

Take care.

Sam Vaknin

Now, I didn’t remember seeing any e-mails from Sam Vaknin. So I wrote:

Sam,

What emails? I haven’t received anything.

Donna

His reply:

Dear Donna,

I much appreciate your response, thank you.

My e-mail messages to you are probably relegated by your e-mail program to your spam or trash folders.

I wrote to offer to collaborate with you in any way you deem fit. For instance, I can respond to questions about narcissism, or write a short monthly column about the intersection between narcissism and psychopathy.

Here is a list of links which you, the visitors to your Website, and the readers of your (great!) newsletter may find of interest.

His e-mail included 17 links for articles on his website, articles he’s written on other websites, and articles in which he was quoted. The guy seemed to know what he was talking about, so I invited him to send me an article to explain the difference between narcissists and psychopaths. He immediately sent another link to another one of his pages. I read the information and determined that it was poorly written and explained nothing.

So I looked into his background. Right on his homepage was a link to his disclaimer:

The author is NOT A MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONAL. The author is certified in Psychological Counseling Techniques by Brainbench.

Brainbench was an organization that offers online business training and assessments. And his Ph.D., according to his own website, was in philosophy. Delving further into his website, I read his page about Narcissists and Women. Here’s what Vaknin wrote about himself:

I am atrabilious, infinitely pessimistic, bad-tempered, paranoid and sadistic in an absent-minded and indifferent manner. My daily routine is a rigmarole of threats, complaints, hurts, eruptions, moodiness and rage. I rail against slights true and imagined. I alienate people. I humiliate them because this is my only weapon against the humiliation of their indifference to me.

Sam Vaknin, it turned out, readily admitted that he was a narcissist. I decided not to publish any of his articles.

Sam, the movie

Now, Sam Vaknin is star of a documentary called I, Psychopath. The documentary followed Sam Vaknin and his wife, Lidija, as Vaknin was examined and tested by experts to determine if he is, indeed, a psychopath.

It is a world first. As we all know, psychopaths don’t think anything is wrong with them and so are unlikely to seek evaluation or treatment. The only ones who are examined are in prison. But Vaknin voluntarily submitted to the process, and it was captured on film.

We see Vaknin take a personality test and be interviewed for the PCL-R (SV) diagnostic tool. Then we see other experts examine his brain in an MRI machine.

Along the way, Vaknin offered some chilling insights. “Most psychopaths are more like poison than a knife,” he said. “And they are more like slow-working poison than cyanide.”

He also explained proper bullying technique—verbally attack, then back off. Attack, then back off. Eventually, he explained, the victim is done in by his or her own stress reactions.

The documentary also addresses Vaknin’s academic “credentials,” which are, not surprisingly, highly exaggerated. (For Vaknin’s response to questions about his qualifications, see his rant about “malicious gossip.”)

Attacking the filmmaker

The film was written and directed by Ian Walker of the Magic Real Picture Company in Australia. Walker offered a first-person narrative through much of the film, describing his observations of Vaknin’s behavior. “Making a movie with a psychopath,” Walker stated, “Is a little like poking a snake with a stick.”

Slowly, Vaknin turned his verbal abuse on Walker. According to the I, Psychopath web page, “By the end, Walker almost calls it quits on his own film rather than spend another day with its main subject.”

I can understand that. Looking back at my e-mail correspondence with Vaknin, I suspect that he never sent two initial e-mails that he claimed I failed to answer. The “have I done anything to offend you?” language was probably contrived to put me on the defensive right away. Classic psychopathic strategy.

If you want a good look at the behavior of a psychopath, and at research about the disorder, watch this documentary.

I, Psychopath on Top Documentary Films.

Thanks to a Lovefraud reader for sending the link for online viewing.


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LKamienski

This film is very important. Survivors please know that it will likely trigger you.

I am troubled by the number of people who want to discount the importance of what we can learn from studying Vaknin based on his flimsy credentials. Ironically this argument against him was first given to me by my ex-sociopath. He discounted the possibility that narcissists even exist based on Vaknin’s lack of accredited degrees. It just doesn’t matter if he even has a degree or not.

What is even more interesting about this film is the glimpse we get into the life of Vaknin’s wife. I highly recommend reading “Women Who Love Psychopaths” by Sandra Brown in conjunction with this film.

Ox Drover

For all the self-aggrandizing this man does, none-the-less, I know people whose first introduction to Narcissism has been by finding and reading on his site(s) or reading his book.

While I have the idea that Sam, probably unique among most Ns/Ps, has recognized somehow what is different about him than “normal people” and has uniquely decided to capitalize on it for making a living.

I think he enjoys his manipulations and seems to have more insight into the disorders than the average disordered person, but it doesn’t mean he has any more connection or empathy than the next N or P—he’s just found a new way, an unfilled niche if you will, to fill and make a buck from it…as well as present himself as this “guru” and in spite of all this aggrandizement of himself, he actually has done some educating of people and made them aware of some things about NPD and PPD. So, bottom line, I think “it is an ill-wind that blows no one good.”

Maryjane

I have read his books, etc. He does offer insights.. you don’t need to be degreed to have awareness and insights… there are many that are degreed that are very ill..

I met a famous .. actually infamous psychiatrist that told me that most in the mental health profession get into it to heal themselves.. and there are more suicides in this profession than others because they find out that they can’t. This man visited my house when I was a teenager.. he was one of the fathers of the prefrontal lobotomy. He literally messed with peoples brains and he was way off center himself.. so a degress don’t mean all that.. Vakin offers insight.. I look at him as his own lab rat.

neveragain

I have to admit that his writing helped me. In particular, his piece about how true love can feel to a narcissist like you are trying to control them and brings out their rage. That made everything really click for me. So I thanked him, and said whatever his intentions, he did help me. He wrote back, but I never answered. Some of his writing is STRANGE and he has served prison time, and I don’t read anything of his now.

Maryjane

Also, I have a sister that is a psychologist and she is off the charts bizarre in her behavior.. now, she appears, great.. but behind that great for those that know.. she is a mess.. she is the most messed up in our family and she as this facade that she hides behind and dictates from..and her kids, her oldest one especially is a mess.. so just because someone has a degree in this field.. doesn’t mean everything..

Ox Drover

Style, Vaknin,’s “degrees” are from an internet “by a degree” program I believe. He has NO real credentials for what he proposes to be, he sets himself up as an educated expert, and he is NOT at all. He is out to make a buck and get NOTICED which is what a narcissistic person does and what they enjoy. He likes to be noticed! Making money out of it is only a side benefit.

I can’t wait to watch that movie, but my air card won’t do it so will have to find another way to watch it. I have seen a clip or two off it, but i want to watch the whole thing.

Matt

That idiot, Dr Phil, is what — a botanist? Now we’ve got Sam Vankin with his IUDs (internet university degrees, not the birth control device). Is it any wonder people are at times skeptical about the psychiatric profession?

breckgirl

I saw part of this awhile ago but never the whole thing until just now.

I think the scariest part of this video comes at the end where the doctor does a test and has people walk down a hallway – and just from looking at them walking people who are high in psychopathic tendencies can pick out which one
makes a good victim. For someone who has been on the receiving end that is very very freaky to know.

It seriously makes me afraid of my own ability to assess what is safe for me and I want to crawl into a hole and hide and only let a few people in.

It has made responding to anyone that pays me attention really
hard to deal with.

Is this safe? Is this gonna hurt me? Is he playing
with my head? What does this person want with me?

The part of the video where the cat is playing with the mouse – made me want to throw up.

Maryjane

I posted a photo of myself on an internet site yesterday and I have had 200 responses.. and out of that, maybe one that I might have an interest in…in just talking to on the phone..
And when I look through all these men… it makes me sick to my stomach.. as from what they wrote and who they are, they never even read what I wrote.. I stated NO SMOKING, I AM PHYSICALLY FIT EXPECT THE SAME, and no children in the home.. and this one man with three young kids has sent me 8 emails.. then think of the sociopaths.. it is a disgusting state of humanity..
Not to sound like a narcissist or that I have delusions of grandeur.. but my sister with the degree is a joke..
I have more of a handle on how to live than she does.. and have a more successul, morally life..
she almost lost her license for having an affair with her married client while she was counseling them for marriage…
So what VAkin does is like a social service,.. I say learn from him…
there is no one that has all the answers and a degree doesn’t do it.. I have dated and married men with degress from Harvard, Yale, Stanford and so what?

Ox Drover

Dear Breck girl,

It is a scary thing to realize finally that the WORLD is full of PREDATORS, and the ones “out to get us” are disguised as HUMAN.

Sort of like that series “V” huh? Or 100 other old movies where you can’t tell the REAL humans from the demons or aliens out to get you.

Fortunately, we are born with “-dar” detectors and what we have to do is to train and hone those skills of discernment.

In reading the Bible where Jesus was tempted by Satan, I often wondered why Jesus would desire those things and actually be TEMPTED, but I see too that Jesus was as we would have been SCARED of what he faced, knowing what was coming, and ANYthing that might have prevented that oncoming torture would have been tempting.

I remember when I was about to go into labor for the SECOND time, believe me I DID NOT LOOK FORWARD to it. I would have done about anything to have been able to just “go to sleep” and have that baby come out without pain to me.

I imagine Jesus felt the same way. I think what the Ps do is to hold out a CARROT to us (theya re good at figuring out what our personal carrot is) and the “stick” is already there….such as (stick) FEAR OF on’t want to spend the rest of my life alone without a person to be my partner and love me. CARROT, I will take care of you and love you and you no longer have to be afraid of being alone and unloved.

Man o man, that is a POWERFUL CARROT, to overcome a POWERFUL FEAR. The P offers to keep us safe and to love us. Who wouldn’t go for that CARROT rather than face a life time alone.

So we JUMP at that carrot before we see it is PLASTIC, and then we are hung because they keep that carrot JUST OUT OF REACH and make us dance and lunge but NEVER QUITE get our hads on it. OMG, IT IS SOOO CLOSE WE CAN ALMOST FEEL IT, but what we put up with trying to get to it, but we just know if we jump a little harder next time it will be in our reach.

The studies done with training dogs to salivate when hearing a bell by ringing a bell then feeding them, the dogs would salivate no matter how many times you rang the bell but did not feed them. They were CONDITIONEd to it. They could’;t help it. that is the exact way I train animals is INTERMITTENT REWARD, and they do not get the reward every time they perform the trick, because if you gave them a reward every time after you stopped they might do the trick once or twice more but they would then say, “well this isn’t working any more” and quit the trick. But if the rewards have been intermittetnt, so intermittent in fact that the reward eventually quits all together, they still continue the behavior because they are CONDITIONED THAT EVENTUALLY THEY WILL GET REWARDED….that’s how a SLOT MACHINE WORKS, you get a few coins every once in a while so you keep on feeding it coins because you are conditioned and expect that NEXT TIME FOR SURE you will get the big reward.

Humans can be condit8ioned with intermittent rewards just like other mammals.

Remember when you were potty training your kid, it was a big deal and s/he got a reward for doing it like a big kid, do you still do that? of course not, you were eventually able to quit rewarding your child for “doing it in the pot” and the behavior continued.

The Ps reward us with “love” ONCE IN A WHILE, but the rest of the time they can beat the crap out of us and we are still wawiting for that reward we just KNOW WILL EVENTUALLY COME IF WE TRY HARD ENOUGH.

I’m here to tell you folks, intermittent “love” and “respect” is NOT ENOUGH FOR ME. i WANT CONSISTENT BEHAVIOR FROM THOSE IN MY LIFE, so I am not going to “dish out” TRUST like it is candy to everyone I meet, TRUST is going to be earned or not gotten at all.

Maryjane

I watched a portion of it.. I found him to be arrogant, unattractive, he has hemispheric varitions.. one side of his face is greatly different from the other.. which according to one brain and kinisolgy .. he is conflicted.. duh! He is cold, arrogant and a bully.. nothing about this man is attractive to me…

but he teaches lots.. false modesty to disarm… love is disposable just things to be used…on and on…
he is an empty vessle.. learn from him…

But many artists are perfectists.. and demand perfection and work until they get it right.. and have traits of narcissism but aren’t..
I mean we all have traits.. and were we not a bit narcisisst, we would be total doormats…
but the true ones… on see their reflection in others or what they can do for them… so they are disposalbe when their use is up.. like a kleenex…. blow and toss….

one/joy_step_at_a_time

dear oxdrover: powerful post.

it strongly brought to mind some dharma teachings for me.
this ‘fear’ would be described as a fear of death in buddhism – not of life ‘unfulfilled’.

one of the first things i found when i started researching love fraud was a quote that said a scam was a balance of oppostional forces of what one was getting now and being offered in the future.
I’ll post it when i find it.

all for now,
one step

Twice Betrayed

The second book I read on this subject was Sam’s. I ordered the book online-I own it.. I will have to say I learned from this book. I did discard some of it.=did not accept it. To me a lot of it was jumbled ranting kinda like trying to nail jello to the wall or conversing with Bob Dylan. 😉 But, also, some of it I did understand and saw in my x’s. It helped give me a foothold into understanding my x’s were nuts just by Sam’s writing, if nothing else. I also had a short interesting email exchange with Sam regarding Christianity…
*I did not find answers, empathy or validation until I found the book Women Who Love Psychopaths. I carried that book in my purse for two solid years and read it many times daily. It helped pull me thru my days. For me this book was my life line- I literally cried from relief when I first read it.

Maryjane

The carrot is what is so true.. someday.. when this or that happens then…

that is what mine did…

someday never comes…

Elizabeth Conley

I started boycotting Vaknin about the time I realized what he was. As he coyly admitted, his kind are more like poison than any other means of assault.

I suspected that any dose of Vaknin, no matter how small, was likely to be harmful. Better safe than sorry.

As much as I admire Donna, I still won’t watch this film.

Life without cluster Bs is good -> so good!

Twice Betrayed

* the most helpful section I found from Sam’s book that answered a lot of questions I had was :
Notes to the Table on page 555

RE: documentary: interesting….some hard to follow, awful music and could do w/o the sensational tone of voice…my take was: paranoia abounds either real or faked…on several levels….and left me with the feeling I had just watched a con con a con-all bad acting and what could everyone hope to benefit from this….

Twice Betrayed

We must all admit a true P knows how to market themselves…..and Sam knows how to spin it….

slimone

As with many of you I also got my initial information about Nism from Mr. V. I downloaded the large e-book, and many selected readings that he offered. I learned alot!

It was clear to me after reading the book that N/P’s ‘doing good’ in the world in no way balances, or otherwise makes ‘treatable’, or less toxic, their condition. It is painfully true there are countless numbers of these people contributing their particular insights/talents in the world, while they slowly and simultaneously attempt to poison their environment. I hung out with one such ‘do gooder’ and he was as much a LIE as any murderous spathole.

Sam is no exception. So well put by Oxy that “he’s just found a new way, an unfilled niche if you will, to fill and make a buck from it”as well as present himself as this “guru”.” And the ‘it’ that he makes a buck off of is his deep, dark, devastating emotional/ethical void, and his ability to, at least at first glance, ‘humanize’ himself by sharing and helping.

But just like all people who are so afflicted, their imagery, in this case ‘helpfulness’ is a lie. Just another con for the end-goal of feeding their addiction to winning the game.

Elizabeth Conley

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2010389064_webclemency01m.html

Which part of “They don’t change.” is so hard for parole boards to comprehend?

Twice Betrayed

Elizabeth: sadly this is some of what the judicial system is feeling in backlash. This guy was only 17 and our then gov took that in consideration apparently as one of the deciding factors on releasing him later. We also just had the convicted killer of beautiful news reporter Anne Pressly spared the death penalty because of sympathy and legal work done.

breckgirl

Oxy thank you for your wonderful response.

The word discernment is such a fine one to use in this context. I am asking for guidance from God – for good clear direction to be given to me.

I have asked for my eyes to be opened – I think I need to also ask for the willingness to believe what I see/hear/feel and the power to take the correct action as a result of the knowledge I receive from any potential P’s or S’s or N’s….

And Elizabeth I started avoiding Sam Vaknin and his information as well. Reading him I started to feel that much of what he wrote for the women and partners of Narcissists was written in a way to make them (us / me) feel like we were intellectually inferior or somehow weak for being capable of love.

This guy is seeking to make a buck (capitalize as Oxy said) by his own admission of being pathologically personality disordered. How vile and sick is that? And pathetic?

He seems to thrive on attention, the focus exclusively on him at all times. Doesn’t matter even if it is a repulsed, disgusted focus as long as he is the topic of discussion. As this thread demonstrates.

But Donna offers it as another tool in our arsenal, more indepth revelation for our own education and self-preservation.

Psychopaths are not fascinating. Or interesting. We all have realized how predictably boring they are. Dullsville personified once you saturate your brain with their nasty, mean behavior/personality characteristics.

Sam V. is no exception. He is the antithesis to the sort of person I consider worthy, wonderful and valuable.

Ox Drover

Dear TB–Yea, but if you look at the HORROR of the crimes this guy committed at age 17, our then bleeding heart gov doesn’t “get it either”—letting this creep out, and then him committing so MANY OTHER CRIMES including child rape, gosh, killing 4 cops is “nothing” for him! I only hope this kind of thing will make BIG news so those cops will not have died for nothing.

The bleeding heart gov of AR also released that rapist that had been castrated by some guys before he was convicted on “pity party” reasons, and the guy had only been out a MONTH when he raped and killed another woman!!!

When will they learn that “correction” of jail doesn’t do anything but give these Ps a Ph.D in crime!??????????

UHG!!!!! that sound is me grinding my teeth!

Yes, Sam sets my teeth on eduge too. I started out blogging on a “suvivor site” owned by him. Problem was, some of the “moderators” were TOXIC and if you even said the words “I am a Chrisitian, it helped me survive” you would be privately thretened with being blocked because it “might traumatize someone who had been religiously abused.”

Then the “coupe e la da gracie” was when Sam Published an article “proving” that Jesus Christ was a NARCISSIST JUST LIKE HIM.

The article was taken down after I commented on it (you can guess what my comments were!) LOL but the managers and moderators told me if I said ONE MORE word about christianity I would be banned. At the time I was still in the chaos of it all and still living in hiding, and also was (unbeknown to me) fighting the serious infection with the tick fever, so the threat of being banned from the ONLY support I had was devestating to me…but, guess what, the good Lord directed my search engine to LOVE FRAUD….and you know what else, DONNA AIN’T SAM VAKNIN! Can you believe that!? Wow, isn’t that a wonderful thing????Yea Donna!!!

I have felt welcomed here from the first day, and never went back to that other site.

So believe me there are abusive sites out there for “survivors” that PREY ON THEIR VULNERABILITY AND WEAKNESS, and I can name several of them. Sam’s is only one where the moderators will flame you, or allow flames from other posters who are just as disordered as the people they CLAIM to be victims of.

Many of you have seen these pseudo-victims come here and make trouble. for no other purpose than to get a fight started, sort of like Satan attending church, but Satan does have his OWN “churches” out there on the net with people just looking to suck a victiim in while they are down. Sam’s site(s) aren’t the only ones.

pollyannanomore

I watched it quite a while ago at google video – the whole thing is avail there for free for whoever was talking about an air card … Oxy?

I am quite distrustful of him and he just regurgitates things that other people have written. I find the VOLUME of information on his site overwhelming and arrogant. Similarly he is involved in several forums supposedly for survivors of psychos. There is a section called ask Dr Sam – readers send in an outline of their particular problem and question and all he does is spout out multiple lines of references to HIS OWN sites. I find it enormously arrogant – he doesn’t even address them normally at all – just puts the links.

I agree watching his wife is more interesting than watching him – she is truly tragic but I recognised myself in her. He is daring her to leave him but she doesn’t seem able. I personally think he is an a**hole who is out to glorify himself. He really doesn’t add to the body of knowledge and in fact confuses it by first proclaiming himself to be a narcissist and then having it found he is in fact a psychopath. Interestingly enough when I first encountered his material that very question ran through my mind
“How does he know what he is? He hasn’t been professionally screened. He sounds more like a psychopath to me.” I think it was the cold dispassionate way he writes and he also outlined his multiple betrayals of his own family in the past.

His writing is hardly lucid … most articles repeat themselves over and over again and what he says is not earth shattering – others have said it before. He just has spin on his side. Hope his wife wises up and ditches him before it’s too late!

Twice Betrayed

Oxy: I am upset over the laxness of the judicial system. You are so correct….they don’t get it regarding the p’s among us! I remember when I was 28 years old -a seasoned circuit judge told me….there are some people that are simply evil and they love/live to do evil. I was working on my degree in elementary ed [late- cause I had to get my kids school age=first p hub took a powder]and I was still buying into the environment is THE thing issue….so I was ‘more tolerant’….ugh. Having now graduated from the college of hard knocks…I know this judge was so correct. Tough to get a death sentence any more….the Anne Pressly trial proved that.

Donna, fascinating post….and I’m eager to check out that link/documentary. What a great introduction you provide.
Steve

teacher123

I have read some of his online writings as well. He does provide insight into the psyche of a narcissist since he is a self proclaimed one. Much like the documentary provides insight for what it is worth as well. I am taken aback by his grandiosity. Maybe it is because also the psycholgical world keeps telling him how smart he is by mentioning his IQ. There is a fine line between genius and insanity, and isn’t it funny how many of “smartest” among us who flash their Mensa cards are the criminal type? And ironic that many of us viewed as crazy are the truly smart ones? Disturbing too is how he views others as beneath him, and views victims as deserving. Donna mentions his tactic of bullying that he reveals, but that is just one of the many used by them. What may even be more sinister is when they mix- I love you, with I think you are pathetic; I love you, I want to kill you. Not as forthright as bullying then laying off, but equally effective.

hens

I have never read anything this man has written. I think I will pass on viewing this movie. Just reading the above post have set off some trigger’s already. If I want to watch a Narcissist in action I will go visit my mother.

Ox Drover

TB–hey, what can I say? Charlie manson didn’t get a death sentence, and so many others as well. Huckaby was ‘conned” on a bunch of the cons he let out on the “recommendation’ of the parole board.

Hell the parole board was going to (had already approved) my TH-P’s pariole into a HALF WAY HOUSE which is in Arkansas ILLEGAL (Act 679) and his “parole officer” did not even KNOW HE WAS A 3X CONVICTED CHILD RAPIST with 3 separate convictions with 3 separate kids at 3 different times.

CRIM-IN -IN–EEEEEEEEE????? what does someone have to DO today to get locked up forever? Put to death?

I am so sick to death of the judical system that seems to think that having a “difficult childhood” means you can kill, rape, destroy, rob and brutalize and the governor or some parole board appointed by the governor will give you a pass because you are “whatever” (fill in the blank here fo ryour ticket to be forgiven by society) What about the VICTIMS.

Huckabee was on the news tonight and said “I wouldn’t have done it if I could have seen into the future” CRAP does he need a crystal ball to think that a man with 8 major felonies by age 17 including taking a gun to school on up, is going to “reform” because he spent 11 years hoeing cotton at Tucker max?

This man has been arrested and rearrested multiple times since his release by the gov, and a week or so ago they gave him BAIL on a child rape charge! It isn’t ONLY the gov (thank God he didn’t get elected president) that let this jerk free but also the Judge in Marianna (his home town) who sounded as dumb as a ROCK on the news tonight—“give the po’ boy a nutha chance!—” crap!

Can you guys tell I am grinding my teeth over this? LOL Bet ya can hear them clear to Australia Gem! OH, BTW Gem, I know you are not homicidal and it was a joke, but believe me on this, I wish I could pull the switch on this guy, I would volunteer to be the executioner—OOps, didn’t give him enough juice, just fried his nose, let’s try again! OOPs, just roasted his toes that time, oh, well, if at first you don’t succeed, try try again and again and again and again! LOL

Sometimes the injustice and the consequences of people not getting it though is so bad and so many people suffer and lose their lives because of a bunch of bleeding heart liberal “give the po boy anutha chance” crap and people DIE! It does make you want to do something drastic!

Thanks for letting me vent! (((hugs))))

Twice Betrayed

Oxy: Amen to that….and to top that off….they want to take our right to have firearms away from us! I’ve got a sticker that says: “We support the right of victims to shoot back.”

one/joy_step_at_a_time

why the hell is everyone always telling us to write a book?!!

I hear it every week. Mind you I heard it before we even knew what my spath was, cause the story just kept getting wilder and wilder.

I wanna go on Oprah. Then i’ll write a book. bad marketing plan – should be the other way around, but oh well.

My two cents on Sam V. is that, like others, in the early stages of discovering what I was up against, I read a lot of his site (the book on line basically) and got some insights, but his approach turned me off.

He repeatedly creates the impression that the condition that he calls “narcissism” can be modulated, controlled, tweaked, and used appropraitely by the N. When he talks about dealing with an N, he tries to teach how to “manage” them. He referes to his wife in the book, and makes it sound as if they have a “functioning” and stable relationship.

Bottom line, by saying I am an N and then teaching people how to deal with them, he is doing many people a great disservice.
He is normalizing the N, and saying basically if we are clever enough and can “get it” we can have a meaningful relationship with an N/P whatever.

Not the right information for someone involved with one of these creatures.

The film is creepy, he is creepy, and even though I stopped visiting his site long ago, I felt somehow violated that he poses on line as a source of “help”. It will be interesting to watch how his “career” plays itself out.

lostingrief

sam v.’s book was the first i read; about 10 years ago when i got in touch with an old flame (major narcissist!)who proceeded to devastate me. (strangely, that bastard was the one who prompted me to get back in touch with my old s/p/n lover, who told me ”come back to me. i’ll help you remember what love is all about.”) OMFG!
and ‘come back’ i did; and y’all know how THAT story ended. i was floored by sam’s temper tantrums … VERY much like the ex-spath. pouty, boyish, obnoxious.
but what really chilled me was sam’s wife saying, ”he’s the most amazing man i’ve ever known” (paraphrased), and sam’s assertion that ‘she’s completely fascinated with my lifestyle.’ OMFG-squared!
the ex-spath was the shiny disco ball of the world. i was INFINITELY fascinated with how he lived his life — never a doubt, swaggering self-confidence, a forthright way of getting whatEVER he wanted.
and we, ‘victims’ simply because of our great capacity for sharing, empathy and compassion. made me wonder if i WALK that way, too. now THAT was the creepy part!

pollyannanomore

Lostingrief – hope you don;’t mind but I will be stealing that wonderful expression from you:
OMFG squared
LOL
That just sums it up don’t it?

swallow

Help from a self confessed Psychopath is about as genuine a paedophile offering to babysit!
I read a lot of Mr Vaknin’s articles on the MSN Psychopath website when I first needed help and before I truly understood the danger of these personalities. Now, I would advise anyone NOT to communicate on any level with him or anyone else you suspect. As he says, they are a slow way of poisoning yourself and very dangerous.
Swallow

blueskies

Although I was tempted to have a look I think I’m with henry on this one.

I am NC with my mother for a reason, I dont think reading or listening to her pontifications, even if they where some attempt at explaining what she is or why she behaves like she does (like she ever would, and if she did would it be for some kind of advantage/pity/no strings absolution…worthless noise) or studying her selfish and poisonous actions any further will help me heal or be happy, so…I think I will apply this to this Narc too… – tune out.

blueskies

Typo – will NOT.*

teacher123

Lostingrief,
I like the comment about how your ex was the shiny disco ball of the world. That explains how they want to be received just like Dr. Sam (Green Eggs and Ham), and Kim Jong Il, and any other flaming narcissist. Here is a couple of paragraphs that illustrates this principle from Merrill Markoe who is writing about the aforementioned ruler of the world.

For those of you who don’t obsessively read books on narcissism, as I do, a friend of mine once explained the credo of the narcissist as “I’m the piece of shit the world revolves around.” It is a psychological syndrome in which extreme insecurity finds cover and comfort in self obsession.
Therefore, every response you make to a petulant, irritable, childish, tantrum-inclined narcissist finds you walking on thin ice. This applies equally to agents, politicians, actors, officious little bureaucrats at Wal Mart and North Korean heads of state. It is the reason why, when one is dealing with a narcissist who is also wielding a nuclear bomb, a little tactical forethought is your best friend.

It’s important to understand that a narcissist operates out of only two constantly flip-flopping states of emotional being; grandiosity and humiliation. So, if you are not feeding the grandiosity of someone like Kim Jong Il, than you are humiliating him. Period. Those are your choices. That is the part of this equation you can’t change. Out of those two choices, only the grandiose narcissist is a happy narcissist. A humiliated narcissist is a rigid, non-compliant, revenge seeking nightmare.
I have long sought out the whys of the equation with my “friend”, but maybe this is the conclusion of the matter. They are not happy unless appeased and then if you comply too much then they are not happy with that either as you are too soft, too caring, too close to uncover their lies, or something like that. Sometimes people are like mystery novels that you can’t figure out.

Twice Betrayed

teacher: good post!

Well, I watched Sam’s video. I bet he just loves all of the attention he is getting.

What really was scary and mindblowing was the very end of the clip…the part where psychopaths can pickout a victim just by the way a person walks!! Holy SH..!! Perhaps we send off these signals subconsciously and attract them!

Ox Drover

From what I see, sam has done everything he has done, from his Ph.D. which is worth the paper it is printed on, and not a legitimate degree, to give himself the APPEARANCE of being a legitimate university graduate who has studied and truly earned that title, rather than “buying” one. PHONY

His pointifications and the new words he coins like “inverted narcissist” as well as Donna says, the poor writing quality of his book, and the redundency of it I think would only “impress” someone of lilttle knowledge about these things at all, however that said, if he publicises the concept and then people go on to look for other information (rather than just stop after reading his drivel, he is at least introducing the concepts of personality disorders to people who might not otherwise get the conceopt.

The blogs that are on the site(s) he owns though are so anti christian, flame ridden, and over all not very helpful compared to what we find here with good information and with a much calmer atmosphere and acceptence of people’s spiritual beliefs and thoughts.

This is why I have stayed here, because I don’t like dealing with the up tight atmosphere of the vaknin run sites. I know many other former bloggers from there that left for the same reasonsn I did.

It will be tomorrow before I can watch the show on my son’s faster and better aircard, but I am going to watch it. I’ve heard too much about it not to want to see it. He is creepy though, I’ve see a few short videos of him. SLIMY is the way I would describe him.

Twice Betrayed

No doubt they have very honed animalistic skills. I went to a Halloween party a few weeks back and this guy stuck on me—drunk as all get out, …started with the typical p stuff….but..he could read me [and everyone else there]like a book. I listened to him size up the whole crowd….and I would say he nailed them. I know in less than fifteen minutes he had me sized up correctly and my friend I was with. It was eerie…he was right on the money. As soon as the crowd cleared in front where I could get loose-I left. I thought about it later…how he could peg people like that. My X’s were both that way…paid close attention to body language.

notagain

I just posted a link to this movie on another page. Ive been studying them now. It has helped me to understand how they work, and now I see it coming quick!!! There have been a couple of guys that I got away from quick. I have the same traits as the wife in the movie..very empathetic…already a victim.

One thing that struck me in the movie, is the test they did with the women walking through the hallway. The psychopath picked out the one who had already been victimized in her life with no problem!!! This has made me look at my own vulnerabilities and decide on how I can change those vulnerable aspects with people I do not know that well.

1. I tend to disclose too much info. about my self.
2. I have trouble setting boundaries and sticking to them.
3. I get sucked in with empathy too quickly.
4. I tend to make excuses for other people.
5. I sometimes do not carry myself with enough confidence.
6. I am way too friendly sometimes, wanting to believe the best about people, and ignoring my own instincts which have always been right!!!
7. I tend to try and explain myself too much, which is what people like that want you to do. they love it I think. They are getting your attention, and they also know how to explain “you” away, with twisted logic. they size you up when you explain. I really need to learn how to be more of what they call a “B*tch.”

Those r things I need to work on about myself.

Cat

Like others on here, I am choosing not to watch this documentary at this point in time. I started to watch it and simply could not stand to look at this man. I have not read anything by him, either. I refuse to put a dime in his pocket. JMHO

notagain, you listed some really great things on your list. It’s a good checklist for a lot of us to consider when looking at oneself. I am particularly looking at #7. I spent more time than I care to think about explaining my actions to others when in reality, it’s no one’s business but mine. Thank you….:-)

hens

I agree with Cat. I used to be an open book when I met someone that paid me attention or seemed interested in becoming ny friend or what ever. Not anymore.
I met this guy about a year ago. He came over to visit and we watched a movie. He said ‘ Let me borrow this movie and I will bring it back in a few days’ I kinda hesitated and he said ‘You can trust me’ well weeks go by and not a call. So I emailed him and he replyed with a nasty email “sorry dude I lost it”.. Well I kicked myself in the head and blamed myself for being too nice. So not a word out of this guy until a week or so ago and i get an email ‘ I hope you not mad at me, I would like to see you again, sorry about that dvd. I replyd ‘ Did you see something else of mine you felt intitled to when you were here last? Something else you just want to take? I told him he was a jerk and an asshole and a narcissist…. I was so mad at myself for being so trusting back then,, I am becoming a bitch too….

ErinBrock

I watched it….but I fell asleep……
He is creepy looking/acting and his wife…..OMG…..was that ME a few years ago???? Holy crap…..

In the beginning, his info was mostly the ‘authority’ I came across…..I am a cross referencer, and what I read I found elsewhere……
I was grateful for the info, but it was flooded on the web…..
I do have to say…..this I found to be weird….the flooding…..

The provided info was a catalyst to where I am today……so I feel indifferent towards him……on that level. I guess reading what he says about himself an N…..and the writings and twists….that is what we should expect…..
I used it as a launch pad……some confused me, some enlightened me.

I’m learning that S’s are ruling the world…..there is always another group to network off of. ALWAYS!!!!!

Cat

Henry, so sorry that happened to you but I like your response to him! Still, I wouldn’t put it past him to try again. They are so persistent! Mine would repeat the same question 20 times, over and over, wearing me down to get the answer he wanted.
I learned that by giving out so much info about myself was also giving others a lot of power, MY power. Knowledge IS power and here I was giving it away freely just because someone was listening. Often, the very things I told others was used against me, with major twists, I might add. No more. I share more on here than with anyone else about my life now.
Erin, that’s a scary thought, S’s ruling the world, but they DO seem to know others and travel in packs, like wolves.

Rosa

I can’t believe Sam Vaknin had the same butler as Prince Charles!! What a coincidence!! 🙂

I also have an announcement to make! I am getting married!! 🙂 🙂

hens

Cat – Thats exactly what happened with my x S…that saying ” He stole my dreams” was so true, I told him everything, what I wanted, etc. well I was ignorant then. In the future someone has to take some effort to find out my dreams and desires.. And btw the dvd I let this other guy ‘borrow’ was BrokeBackMountain, it was very special too me.

hens

Congratulations Rosa~~!!!!

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