Lovefraud Professional Resources Guide: Bill Ronan

Bill Ronan is a licensed clinical social worker and a practitioner of medical hypnoanalysis based in Hopkins, Minnesota.

Q. What experience have you had dealing with sociopaths or other disordered personalities—personally, professionally, or both?

A. Sociopaths are a category I had given little attention to, as it is unlikely therapy will be of benefit to them. The style of therapy I do basically requires that I believe the patient. Carl Rogers, the originator of client-centered psychotherapy, was and is one of my therapeutic heroes. The goal was to always give positive regard. The analytical style I use is to find the truth that sets the patient free. This creates an honorable way out so that change is possible. Most people coming to me are honest and seek help.

However, after being widowed, I married a woman from another country. I did not know she only wanted to become a citizen, and had learned about our domestic violence laws. She knew she could accuse me of domestic violence and receive, as a result, instant citizenship.

She and members of certain agencies worked together, all bringing false allegations against me of a very serious nature. As a fluke, they eventually realized they would lose in court, or at least come close to losing, so they never showed up for any criminal trial. I learned from this that our legal system appears to be filled with sociopaths. (Here’s an article about similar cases.) Since then I have sought to help others in similar situations.

Q. How do you go about helping clients who have tangled with a sociopath?

A. I will help them to understand that they were taken in by a professional, or professionals, as the case might be. I will help them to re-center and re-connect with their own judgment skills, while maintaining the learning that sociopaths exist and are not so rare. Hopefully they re-learn to trust in those who are trustworthy.

Q. What, in your experience, is the biggest issue or problem that people who have been betrayed by a sociopath need to overcome?

A. The biggest obstacle I see is that of fear. Fear can be associated with attraction, the desire to do kind things, and to be helpful. Researchers have concluded that one of the most important signs of a sociopath is that they seek sympathy. Once that is secured, the victim is leaning in, offering to help, and therefore, off balance. Decent people seek to help those they perceive as in need. Both men and women have been victims in my practice.

Sometimes, the circular system of courts and agencies seems to be a graduate school for psychopaths. Much of this process has to do with government funding. Through false allegations, the police are used as one might use the Mafia, with the exception that the police come free and will virtually never be prosecuted. Those who bring the false allegations are rarely held accountable for their actions.

Q. What’s one tip you can suggest for helping Lovefraud readers recover from the betrayal of a sociopath?

A. Keep in mind that there are decent people out there. The sociopaths are few in numbers—one researcher says 1 in 25. They could not do what they do if there were more of them, because their targets would come to understand the game. Most people have not knowingly come into contact with sociopaths.

Also, sociopaths will manipulate others connected to you to convince them that you are the evil one. Look at the movies Rebecca by Alfred Hitchcock, Hush Hush Sweet Charlotte with Bette Davis, or Odd Girl Out to see how sociopaths play their games.

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Ox Drover

While I believe the WAVE article is somewhat biased, I do agree that there ARE legitimate instances of nurturing fathers and mothers being persecuted by using the court systems, or as you say:

“Sometimes, the circular system of courts and agencies seems to be a graduate school for psychopaths. Much of this process has to do with government funding. Through false allegations, the police are used as one might use the Mafia, with the exception that the police come free and will virtually never be prosecuted. Those who bring the false allegations are rarely held accountable for their actions.”

You also say, and I agree with:

Researchers have concluded that one of the most important signs of a sociopath is that they seek sympathy.

The problem is that LEGITIMATE VICTIMS also want validation and sympathy and empathy from the courts and from their friends and relatives and unfortunately it boils down in many cases to “He said/she said” so who are we to believe, at least at first until we see some EVIDENCE

I have found that unfortunately too many times in my experience the psychopath pretends to be a VICTIM (seeking sympathy) so it is difficult for outsiders to see who the REAL VICTIM is until the mask slips, which may take some time, or actually never happen for the “general public” to see the real person behind the mask.



Fellow readers, I urge you to read this article. I urge you to click on the listed “here’s an aricle about similar cases” which is an article in WAVE – an organization that is AGAINST the VAWA (Violence Against Women’s Act)

It is an article witten by former Domestic Relations Magistrate, Kathy King from Franklin County, Ohio

In this article she lists 5 “ridiculous” instances where men were arrested for violating protection orders. Four out of the five she listed were legitimate violations of a protection order.

At the end of the article she talks about how the laws need to be changed to : “Respondents should be able to apologize via email, text, flowers delivered by a florist or other socially acceptable fashion without threat of a violation of a court order”

Now, for all of you that have been stalked by a sociopath, have fought to have the police and courts actually pay attention to protection orders and take stalking seriously, PLEASE BECOME OUTRAGED and voice it. I ask you, when considering “legal abuse syndrome” how would you have felt being in a court room ruled by this jurist, who apparently does not have a clue regarding sociopathic behavior.

For those of you who did not see remarks in last weeks posting of Bill Ronan’s article/advertisement please know he stated he had to find a bride from a foreign country because no American women were willing to take the “risk” of raising a child that was not their own. Being a mother of 3 adopted children, I took great offense to this statement and commented on that fact. At that point in time, the entire article/advertisment was deleted, taken down, GONE.

I have NO idea what Mr. Ronan is doing here as a Lovefraud Professional.

Please read the link and tell me if I am wrong here.


PLEASE – take the time to READ my above post, I believe it is important to all of us in our constant fight to be heard..

Ox Drover

Milo, I went to the web site for WAVE which is “women against VAWA (violence against women act) Excess” I really hadn’t paid much attention to what WAVE was, though I did notice that the article seemed very biased. After reading several articles and links on the WAVE website the entire site seems to me to be a pretty rabid political site.

While I agree that there are men who are the nurturing parent and women who are the abusers, and that our family courts are a complete mess, and I do think the bill might be termed more gender neutral, it seems to me that the WAVE group is pretty rabid.

And when I got to thinking about it, I agree with you that the article linked does condone the very things that a stalking psychopath does do, e mail apologizing etc. We should NEVER be kept from NC if that is what we desire. We should never be forced to have “social contact” with ANY one we don’t want to.


Oxy ~ I agree that this should not be a “women’s issue” only, but rather a victim’s issue.

The magistrate quoted in the linked article gives the example of a mother inviting a father to the child’s birthday party, then turning him in for violation of a protection order. Under these circumstances, the father became the victim.

This magistrate apparently didn’t read her local newspapers or hear local news reports from about a year ago when a mother had a protection order taken out on the father for abuse. The father begged to come to the child’s birthday party. She planned the party so it was at a local restaurant thinking he would not do anything in a crowd of people. She was wrong. He shot and killed her and his two children. Funny she didn’t bother to mention this “ridiculous” incident.

This former magistrate, now attorney in private practice went on to state, in this article linked by Bill, “Respondents should also be able to respectfully request that the petitioner and he enter into counseling without the fear of violating a court order”

How many times have we heard that one here on LF, forced counseling with your abuser. How does that usually turn out ?


Hi Bill,
I’m sorry for the loss of your wife. Can you please expound on this
“However, after being widowed, I married a woman from another country. I did not know she only wanted to become a citizen, and had learned about our domestic violence laws. She knew she could accuse me of domestic violence and receive, as a result, instant citizenship.”

Did you actively seek a foreigner to marry?

How does one receive instant citizenship from accusing someone of domestic V?
I had no idea this is what our country offered? WOW Crazy, I’d like to hear more about this situation!

Also, what agencies did your ex work with to ‘process’ a criminal trial against you that didn’t follow through? Were they private advocacy groups or law enforecment?

Do you have affiliations to the Wave organization linked in the article and what do you advise your clients to do in a DV situation. Do you ever recommend seeking an Ro?

Thanks Bill, and welcome to LF.

Ox Drover

Yea, Milo, I remember that murder at the birthday party. It was so terribly sad, and yea, they will do whatever it is that they want no matter who is watching.

I think about many child killings by mothers as well as fathers. We had one like “Susan Smith” here in Arkansas last year. A woman killed her two small sons because she was angry at her mother for saying she wasn’t being a good mother, then after she killed them she drove her car into a creek and tried to convince the police they drown.

And that girl in Texas who did something with her baby boy just to keep him away from his father. She is in prison now but no one knows what happened to the baby and she’s told so many stories no one knows what to believe and she wants the father to never have closure on what happened to his son. How is that for TWISTED.

So I agree that women can be the abusers, and bloggerT’s web site about women sexual abusers which is linked here on blog roll is a perfect example of research done that at least half of sexual abuse is done by women…and only 2-3% of the prosecutions are female for sexual abuse, although here recently there have been a bunch of female teachers prosecuted for sex with underage kids.


I’m baffled – I have never heard tell that any immigrant can accuse their U.S. Citizen spouse of domestic violence and, suddenly, recieve instant citizenship.

Even via legal marriage, the process of citizenship isn’t “instant,” and voluminous paperwork is required to help in the prevention of marriage-for-citizenship.

Just saying….

Several men have contacted me with stories just like Bill’s – they married women from other countries, and as soon as the women were legally in the U.S., they accused the men of domestic violence. The entire relationships were scams to get into the US.

On the other hand, there are immigrant women who legitimately need protection from abusive husbands.

That’s the problem with passing laws to try to solve these problems – so matter what the law is, sociopaths will twist it around and use it for their own advantage.

Ox Drover

Donna, I know several guys who married women from other countries, some from on line and some from being in the service and in all cases the women were only after a green card….and one was threatened if he didn’t move out but keep sending money he would be accused of abusing his daughter. He chose to move out rather than try to prove he did not abuse her.

So abuse iis NOT a male or female thing and laws to prevent ANYTHING don’t stop it, if iit did, we’d have a perfect world. Murder iis against the law but people still do it, robbery iis against the law but people still do that too. Laws do not STOP anything, they only make it possible to prosecute it after the fact.


I don’t think it’s about passing laws…’s about using common sense really.
There has become such a dominant ideal in our society today that laws are the only thing to rely on to keep us safe and others around us towing the line.

We have forgotten our common sense, rational and natural consequence roll.
We head out into life on a daily basis taking no responsibility for what happens to us.

We get in a car accident, we sue the other person.
We lose our jobs, we collect unemployment.
We slip at the grocery store, the store pays our medical.
We trip on a curb, we sue the city.
The stroller unhinges, and our kid get’s a blister on his toe, we sue the stroller manufacture AND the store who sold it.
We get burned by a cup of coffee, we sue mcdonals for it being too hot.

At some point, we ALL must realize, there is a natural responsibilty and LIABILITY for walking this earth.
Others should not hold our bags. And we shouldn’t have to rely on a law to cover everything.
By the mere fact we get outa bed in the am, we have a chance of falling down, crashing, losing jobs, children failing school, cars breaking……..we DO NOT LIVE IN A PERFECT WORLD.
Accept responsibiltiy!!!!

This is how/where we learn our lessons.
Learn from experience!

Not learn how to sue others from experience!

The laws we have in place today can’t possibly be enforeced.
WHY are we making more?

I remember (in the heat of things with spath) reading that California had just passed a law that went into effect…..
It was NOW ILLEGAL to have sex with a corpse.

O- M- G!!!

Ok….so is this a real problem…..people having sex with corpses?
Or one mortician who exploited a dead person and someone thought it should be a law and lobbied for it?

If we spent more time on educating OURSELVES (meaning society as a whole, each of us) as to the dangers around us, we’d sure be able to make better decisions to avoid this crap in the first place!
ANd NOT rely on the law!

Spaths will exploit any law any where……it doesn’t matter!
Laws are made for the law abiding to follow. And they do- because they are law abiding.

My plans never changed after the corpse law was enacted…….I never wanted to have sex with a corpse, and even today…’s not ever a thought!!!!

Ox Drover

EB I am SO relieved that you are not sexually attracted to a corpse NOW THAT A LAW HAS BEEN PASSED. LOL ROTFLMAO

Yea, taking responsibility for ourselves is not an “American” trait much any more it seems. LOL


I spent 28 years with a corpse…….damn glad they made THAT illegal!!!


This article appeared a couple weeks ago, in slightly different form but was deleted before I could call it out as BS. The writer in that version claimed he had no other choice but to buy a mail order bride because, he claimed, no American woman would “risk” dating a man with a child already. This is of course complete bull. Likely he could not find another wife for other reasons likely pertaining to his overall dateability, and sought a mail order bride. American men seek mail order brides because they want a woman who would be submissive.
There is no room for campaigns to make it even more difficult for women to get protection from violence. Sorry, but violence is still very gendered here in the U.S. It is also because of “father’s rights” organizations like this man’s that innocent children die by forced visitation with psychopath fathers.


Ericasoso ~

I’m glad I was not the only one who saw the first article. I did have the opportunity to call him out on his “BS”. Unfortunately my comments were deleted with the article. I believe Oxy also commented on his generalization of American women not willing to “risk” raising a child that was not born to them.

I do not doubt that this gentleman had legal difficulties with his “bride”. I do not doubt, Donna, that you have received emails from other men who have had similar experiences. But, that IS NOT the point.

The problem is this “Lovefraud Professional” cited three movies “to see how sociopath’s play their games” – In all three of these movies the sociopath was a woman.

The link he provided and suggested we read to see “similar cases”, similar to his I presume, contained propoganda against the Violence Against Women’s Act. It contained an article from a former Magistrate, who thinks Restraining Orders should be severly changed to allow such things as couple therapy, email, text and other contact. The very things that we have come to learn are very dangerous stalking signs, she wants to allow people with restraining orders against them to be able to do, without worry of arrest.

IMO, this is the very thing that so many posters and authors of articles here on LF have voiced frustration over and whose very lives have been placed in jeopardy because of this kind of misguided thinking.

That is the point !!!

Ox Drover

I did call BS on that comment about “American Women” and the generalization that we don’t want to “risk” raising the children we have not given birth to…I have had many foster children, and have an adopted son. Many millions of American women raise foster children, step children, and adopted children and I thought the statement was totally inaccurate. I notice that in this article, that comment has been removed.

I didn’t get to the article last time, and I gave it a quick scan this time, but later went back and re-read it and checked out the WAVE group which is, I think, a pretty rabid political group against the “Violence against women Act”–I agree that the act should be more gender neutral in scope, and I agree that there ARE women who falsely accuse their male partner of violence or even sexual assault in order to persecute them, but by the same token there are men who terrorize women with e mails, birthday cards, texts, phone calls, and following them–i.e. STALKING. I do also believe that we have the RIGHT as humans to refuse to associate with or receive unwanted messages from ANY one. If we have made known to ANY person that we don’t want any contact with them, then that wish should be respected, or the law should demand it if it is upsetting to us or makes us afraid, and especially if we have been abused by that person in the past.

With a “he said/she said” type of thing it is difficult to get a restraining or no contact type order, but usually if there is a RO above a TRO there is some “proof” that there has been violence used against the person getting the RO.

Bill has apparently either not read the comments here or has chosen not to respond to them. I would very much like to hear “his side” of the story in addition to the article he posted in Q & A form.

We all make poor choices from time to time based on poor information or thinking and if he sought out a foreign woman for a wife because he perceived that American women didn’t want to raise his child, he made what apparently was a poor choice based on a false belief. God knows I have based many of my poor choices on false beliefs, like “it takes two to fight” or “there is good in everyone.”

The first comment made about American Women not wanting to risk raising someone else’s child though, makes me wonder if he *still* holds that opinion about American women in spite of evidence to the contrary.

I think it is important that with any person we engage as our advocate or therapist that we examine their knowledge and beliefs as well as academic qualifications. Bill’s academic qualifications seem to be more than adequate, though I wasn’t impressed with the “certification” for “ADA advocate” which consisted simply of an 18 hour course with a PhD LLC and $500. Apparently there are no federally “mandated qualifications” for the position so this “qualifies” him to use that “certification.”

I would like to hear more from Bill, though, since the above article generates quite a few questions, though I want to make it perfectly clear that I do NOT doubt that he had a run in with a psychopathic “bride” who simply wanted a green card and would do what ever it took to get one.



raggedy ann

I just noticed what was going on here.

“Bill has apparently either not read the comments here or has chosen not to respond to them. I would very much like to hear “his side” of the story in addition to the article he posted in Q & A form.”

Perhaps Bill has been badly triggered by all this skepticism, recognized it as baited, deliberate trouble making, and left very rattled.

I certainly hope his accuser met with some skepticism if her accusation was a lie.

Ox Drover

Raggedy ann,

I quote myself above:

I want to make it perfectly clear that I do NOT doubt that he had a run in with a psychopathic “bride” who simply wanted a green card and would do what ever it took to get one.

I don’t think anyone else made reference to his story about his “wife” not being true or that she attacked him. The questions were in reference to comments made about American women not wanting to raise other’s children and about the article he linked to from WAVE.

When a person holds themselves out as a professional to help others, it is not unkind or trouble making IMO to want to know what their views and attitudes are as well as their knowledge of psychopaths.

raggedy ann

Oxy, I apologize – I failed at making a wry remark, and it definitely wasn’t about anything you said. I completely agree with you about everything (I think). I noted the claim about American women when it first appeared, and the link would imo reasonably prompt skepticism pending clarification or comment from Bill. There are lots of circumstances in which asking for more information is appropriate. And it has nothing to do with deliberately inflicting discomfort or provoking, it’s just appropriate or reasonable.

I didn’t mean to imply anything about Bill’s wife attacking him. I do hope she was met with skepticism when she made her accusations against him. If he shares it, I am very curious as to what happened with the predator who tried to exploit him and if he saw some deeper motivation than just the green card in hat she did. So often other things come up in discussion here as motivations: envy, shame, desire to control, sadism, etc.

I am also curious as to where she was from and how things have turned out with the stuff she tried to do.


Are you sitting on a sit n spin…….Your whirls are amazing!


Raggedy ann ~

I have “watched” or read you verbally attack almost every poster, on every post here on LF for the past few weeks.

Now your failed attempt at making a “wry remark” was directed at me.

“Perhaps Bill has been badly triggered by all this skepticism, recognized it as baited, deliberate, trouble making, and left very rattled.” YES, I am skeptical of Bill, very skeptical about certain issues he himself has brought up. Bill is here on LF, in part, to offer a service, a service you must pay for. I made it very plain that I did not doubt his unfortunate experience with sociopath, his wife and/or the court system. QUESTIONING his remarks about American women, QUESTIONING his link to an organization that speaks out AGAINST the Violence Against Women’s Act, QUESTIONING his linked letter from a former Magistrate whose ideas about orders of protection would jeopardize the well being of many, many women is IMO justified.


I have always gone out of my way to make sure that my posts are supportive and caring. I think about my words and make every attempt not to deliberately, unkindly, trigger anyone. I do not use “verbal vomit”, can you say the same Raggedy ann?

I have watched you go after many on here, I would greatly appreciate it if you didn’t try to insult me again. This isn’t my first time at a rodeo, sis.

Ox Drover

While there are more women at LF than men, we don’t try to come off as a “man bashing” group and we as a community openly WELCOME men and I try to make sure each man who posts here is WELCOMED by me personally and told that we value his input as a man.

We have several men and women who are openly gay and they are accepted very well.

However, in the article(s) Bill has seemed to express or imply several somewhat misogynistic thinking patterns, for example the comment about American women not wanting to raise another’s children so he was FORCED to find a foreign woman. Then the WAVE article which I think is rabidly biased against women being able to go NC with men who stalk them. Just an aside, he mentioned 3 movies to watch showing psychopaths…in which all three were women.

I do not for one minute doubt he had a horrible confrontation or even false accusations of domestic violence from his foreign bride or that she was first and foremost after a green card or citizenship…I personally know of several such situations.

I DO question why Bill expressed a belief that American women won’t raise some one else’s child. I do question his connections and approval of the group WAVE (and we are all allowed our own political views, and if those are his, he is welcome to have them, they are just not mine but I’d like to know since HE is the one who linked to the group’s article.

Since he listed himself as a certified ADA advocate, I went to find out what the “qualifications” of such a certification were and frankly, I was NOT impressed, but there are apparently no federally mandated qualifications so anyone can give a course and “certify” that someone has completed it and it’s legal to do so. If there is more to the “certification” course than I could find out on the web site of the LLC that certifies them I’d like to hear from Bill about it.

If Bill came here as a regular blogger and made some of the misogynistic statements he has made in his article he would have been “questioned” about the validity of them. Since he puts himself out as a practitioner of therapy for victims of psychopaths and an advocate for them in court (at a FEE) I would want to know his qualifications and his ATTITUDES and I don’t see anything wrong with ASKING.

One of the other therapists who writes articles here uses “He” in his articles but makes sure to say that he is only using the “male” term rather than he/she and does not imply that all psychopaths are males.

In fact, I think the majority of the people who write articles for LF and who are professionals or “professional resources” here are above and beyond gender neutral in their outlook and in their writings or bloggings. Frankly, if I went to a therapist I would want to know if he or she “got it” about psychopaths, and if they didn’t I would find one who did, but if a therapist made such an apparently misogynistic comment about American women or referred me to an article by WAVE, I think I would CLARIFY with them their attitudes before I undertook to use them as a therapist. Is that wrong?

Are we to be unquestioning of the professionals we HIRE and pay money to? (Though I admit it is unlikely I personally would be in need of his services in court, but some love fraud reader might,) and don’t they have the right to know his attitudes and beliefs about women? (since HE brought it up in offering his services!)

raggedy ann

My first post was an inappropriately placed sarcastic remark. It’s probably the second time I have ever resorted to sarcasm here. I hope my response to Oxy helps make it clear that I did not see anything here as deliberate trouble making, and that skepticism was warranted. I was in no way even in my sarcasm referring to you specifically as the person questioning.
I have very strong disagreements with a few posters here. Largely because like you I objected to having been charaterized as deliberately baiting people when using cautioning language about someone making assumptions or drawing some absolute conclusions about something. Without any qualifying language like “perhaps”. Neither the conclusions, nor the statements about me. After my first post in a number of years, not even some pattern.
I am in 100% agreement with you on the “what it is not” here. (And whatever contentious posts of mine you refer to are likely to be consistent with this general idea in other contexts, so I hope that will
further assure you tha I was in no way disagreeing with you or singling you out.)

I am very used to bluntness and sarcasm because of a very different forum I have spent years on. And have mostly avoided it here. It’s not the best way to communicate, for tons of reasons. (In fact in that other forum sometimes people change their font color to indicate that they are being sarcastic precisely because it isn’t always obvious itself)
I’d say this is the closest I have gotten to any deliberate troublemaking, since you asked about me myself. I’m truly sorry I caused you this confusion and upset.


MiLo, Raggedy Ann likes to incite triggering and regurgitates “quotes” with a definite and deliberate “sit N spin” twist to appear astute, reasonable, insightful, and concerned. The original THREADS are obscured with the word-salad and subsequent attention. Peace, OUT.

As for Bill Ronan, I don’t know enough about his experiences, but I’ll hazard a wild guess to say that there is no Law – no legislation – that enables any immigrant to obtain citizenship status as the result of a Domestic Violence complain, whether it’ bogus or not. Now, if I read his recollections entierly wrong, my apologies to Bill Ronan whom has not yet entered this discussion of his own Q&A’s.

raggedy ann

Truthspeak, you and I are in complete disagreement about your gift for identifying witches. You were dead wrong the first time you claimed to know my secret thoughts and agenda. What’s more, you immediately posted the opposite of something you were arguing with me after doing that – in a context tghat could also have been very triggering. Just moments ago you posted something to someone else clarifying a post that could only have been referring to me, stating that a poster was demanding evidence of her (false), but in you clarification you are pretending not to have done anything of the kind and stating that you meant articles aare triggering.


Raggedy, you are 100% spot-on with regard to my response to KatyDid. I avoided naming you, specifically, as someone who was attempting to incite triggering, which I should have done, from the outset. Shame on me.

I’ll “clarify:” I, personally, do not appreciate your convolution of words, intentions, meanings, or definitions and (IMHO) you are doing this for whatever purposes that you have in mind whether it’s hijacking this thread, or another one.

Ox Drover

Okay guys, PEACE!

Raggedy Ann, Sarcastic remarks here are usually very triggering and cause trouble as it is difficult to understand what is sarcastic or not from printed text, whereas in verbal conversation it is usually easily figured out from the tone of voice, so I would suggest kindly that you refrain from sarcastic remarks.

Fortunately, we are quite able to NOT respond to someone who we disagree with or find offensive. We also have the report abusive comment link so that Donna knows what is happening if the level of offense rises to an abusive level.

I would actually hate to see this thread deleted again because of the conversation turning ugly, and I WOULD like Bill to come on here and discuss his views about several questions.

raggedy ann

Ok oxy didn’t see you. Just deleted what was here. Sorry again, agree on the sarcasm.


PEACE it is Oxy ~

I’m going to put on my Peter, Paul and Mary vinyl of “Kumbaya”, search the VW bus for my love beads, I’m already wearing my tie dye shirt, so got that covered.

Then I think I will put on some water for tea, probably earl grey, sit down and enjoy a nice warm cup before I must check the boxer’s butt for a boil.

Why don’t you join me Truthy, it’s always good to chill with friends. xxx ooo

Ox Drover

Thank you Raggedy Ann.

Ox Drover

I hadn’t thawed any meat for supper so we had oat and whole wheat flour pancakes, uncle Luke’s pure maple syrup and made hash brown fried potatoes from some left over cooked potatoes I had. Got a wonderful carb load and feel really good.

Yes, I am improving in my attitude but still having trouble focusing, so just trying to work through things one step at a time. I really didn’t feel just how far I fell in to the abyss until I hit bottom so far down I couldn’t see a glimmer of light at the top so the climb has been pretty hard work.

You know the reason I am sharing this with you all is that I want you to know that no matter how “healed” you are if you relax doing the things you KNOW TO DO and a stressful situation hits you can have your socks knocked off and go back into the PITS.

It’s all about STAYING actively on the road to healing.


OxD….thank you for that strong reminder.

Brightest blessings

Tea Light

Oxy points out that ”he (Bill) mentioned 3 movies to watch showing psychopaths”in which all three were women.”

Bill, you need to show up and answer the very reasonable questions that have been put to you!

Many thanks to Milo for the information on WAVE, I will circulate to my UK anti violence againist women contacts.

Raggedy…good grief woman! Take Oxy’s advice and learn to tone it right down, please. Sarcasm just isn’t going to go over well on a site which exists to support survivors of traumatic relationships.

Peace and love all x

Ox Drover

I agree, Tea Light, that Bill should engage in a dialog about some of the questions we have asked, but I don’t think at this point that will happen.

Milo, we are both “crotchety old women” who are trouble makers because we call BS when we see it. LOL So I’m raising my glass of prune juice to you! LOL


MiLo & OxD, I’ll turn on some Doobie Brothers, and we can sit around discussing fiber and sociopathy. (guffaw, snort, wheeze, hack)

BRIGHTEST blessings

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