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[freeatlast]

Any day now, Melania is going to post on here….. 🙂

[sept4]

Haha both my mom and sister think she will leave him soon but I actually don’t think so. He already has two divorces under his belt so he probably has an airtight prenup now with Melania. So she might not get much if she leaves him and I think she will just stay for the lifestyle.

It’s been very interesting to see his behavior over the past few months. My ex is EXACTLY like him. Not just his behavior but also mannerisms and even body type. They are exactly the same type both personality wise and physically.

[freeatlast]

Wow. You poor thing. I can’t imagine the horror. I’m glad he’s your EX.

It will be interesting to see how things unfold with Melania once they are out of the White House. My heart goes out to her. Anyone on this forum can see exactly what he is and no doubt she has suffered horrendous abuse at his hands of one kind or another.

[sept4]

Yes it’s very interesting to me because of all the parallels to my life.

I’m not sure what to make of her. Is she an innocent victim who was genuinely in love with him and thought he really loved her? Or is she a gold digger who never really loved him and just married him for the lifestyle? It’s hard to tell from just looking at her and she doesn’t say much.

If she is an unloving gold digger then they deserve each other. If she is an innocent victim then I feel deeply sorry for her, and I understand exactly her position because I was in the same position in my marriage. It is really hard to break free from someone powerful like that. And these guys get vindictive in divorce and their emotional abuse gets worse during divorce. So if she does go that route then I hope she ends up okay.

[freeatlast]

No, I’m not sure what to make of her, either. She strikes me as someone who is keeping her head down as much as possible, a very understandable thing to do in her shoes.

From my perspective, I have sympathy with her either way. Even if she’s a gold-digger, the abuse she’s suffering must be staggering. Her husband is an exaggerated extreme of a psychopath. No one deserves that. Maybe she’ll learn her lesson re gold-digging after this (if that’s what is going on) but either way, she has my heartfelt sympathy.

When I was still in a relationship with my ex I had a saying which I would say to myself in my head all the time which was “make it work for you.” Meaning, I was in an awful relationship, but we had kids etc and I felt the best way through it was just to keep my head down, not rock the boat, and get as peaceful a life as possible. It all went south when he (of course) lied and cheated on me and then left. But that instinctive reaction to keep your head down, say nothing, don’t rock the boat, is something I understand and see in Melania.

[Redwald]

Well, who knows what Melania will do? She’s smart; maybe she’s managing well enough. Hillary is still married to that lying, cheating, female-exploiting husband of hers, twenty years after HIS Presidency ended…

[sept4]

Freeatlast, yes I did the same with my ex after our breakup when I was still tied to him financially. I just tried to keep my head down, keep the peace, let things go, stay silent. Because I knew that if I stood up against him he would react with rage and retaliation. I was afraid and figured I had to keep the peace to stay as safe as possible.

I just don’t know if Melania feels the same way. I can’t judge whether she is a victim who is hurt and afraid, or an equally cold and calculating person. Either way it will be interesting to see how their marriage plays out after he leaves office.

[freeatlast]

Hi guys, yes, I am looking forward to watching what plays out between those two once they leave the White House. I’m still fairly fresh out of my relationship, so I have found it interesting to watch how things are between them because I am still in need of validation for what happened to me. It’s helpful to see it “out there” so I can recognise it for what it is, and relate it to my own experience – for example, the gaslighting was a huge thing I had to put up with. He screwed my head up and made me think I was losing it. Also the “word salad” which DT does a lot. My ex used to do that. He used to ramble on in an accusing way. He was very intelligent so it SOUNDED as if it made sense and I always ended up apologising, but I always left those conversations not really knowing what he said and what I was supposed to have done wrong and what I apologised for – and that was because it DIDN’T MAKE SENSE! It just sounded as if it did…. it was relentless. He actually scheduled in a weekly meeting in our calendar for these “discussions” which were basically, sit me down and character-assassinate me for an hour until I wept and apologised. Every week. Literally on the calendar. You can’t make this crap up.
And that is why my name on here is free at last!!

[sept4]

Freeatlast yes my ex also used the word salad strategy. Don’t blame yourself for falling for it because any normal trusting person without prior knowledge of manipulation strategies will fall for it.

To see through that you need either A) prior experience with personality disorders and manipulation strategies (learned the hard way) or B) prior training or education on those things or C) be extremely street smart. Normal trusting people will fall for it because their natural inclination is to give people the benefit of the doubt and assume they mean well and that there is logic behind it.

My ex even fooled our marriage counselor with the word salad strategy. Our first session he basically took over the entire conversation and filibustered until the hour ran out. It was nuts. And the counselor did not understand what was happening because he assumed my ex was a normal person with good intentions.

[freeatlast]

Hi Sept4 – oh my gosh – my ex did the same thing! In our first counselling session he managed to take over from the very outset and direct the conversation throughout the hour. This was despite the fact that the therapist KNEW we were coming because he had had an affair. I had assumed she would start by asking me how I was and the conversation would go from there. But no, he managed to direct the conversation from the outset. I had to plan a strategy for getting in on the conversation for our 2nd session. My therapist just didn’t see through him. She never did, even after he left me. They are just so smart and manipulative it is a thing to behold.

As you say, any normal trusting person will allow them a certain amount of leeway, and as the saying goes, give them an inch and they take a mile. Yes, I have now learned the hard way how to spot someone who is doing this – who is not well-intentioned as the rest of us are.

My ex’s longstanding lament about me was that I was “not co-operative.” It was meant as an insult because he was a spiritual leader and I was supposed to be spiritual and open and all those other things, so it was a real dig at me. I now wear that term “uncooperative” as a badge of pride rather than shame, because it represents all the times when I actually stood up to him by refusing to let myself be blindsided by his gaslighting and word salad.

[sept4]

Freeatlast, yes you should be VERY proud of yourself for standing up to him!

I never had the chance to stand up to my ex and it is my biggest regret. And I think that is the reason why I am still not over the trauma.

Toward the end of our marriage I still had no idea what was going on or who he was. I still thought he was a normal person with good intentions who genuinely loved me. And I thought our struggles were normal in a long marriage and that we could work through them.

After he left me I did some investigation and discovered his double life (hookers, drugs, squandering money) and eventually realized he is not a good person at all and that he did not love me at all. But I was still not able to stand up to him because of trauma bonding and because we had a business together, so I was just trying to keep my head down and not trigger his rage and retaliation.

Eventually he forced me out of the business with threats and manipulation, and it is my greatest regret that I did not stand up to him and take him to court. But I was too afraid and too emotionally exhausted to fight him. And I knew that he would do anything to win. He has no regard for the law or the truth or morals and he would have tried to destroy me if I stood up to him.

So while I have been away from him and complete NC for many years, I still suffer from the trauma. Because I never had the healing satisfaction of standing up to him and saying NO.

[freeatlast]

Hi sept4, yes, I totally relate to the idea of thinking it was a normal marriage and that these struggles were somehow normal. They were not. You were subjected to horrible abuse over a lengthy period of time and you deserve inner peace. One thing that has helped me is what I learned from the book Becoming the narcissist’s nightmare. Something called Reverse Discourse. Basically you journal about something that happened with the narc – and you write it from your perspective and calling out what he has said and done – the things you wish you had said at the time. It is surprisingly helpful because it gives you the space to say the things you want to say to him but in a totally safe way and does give some relief. Hope this helps.

[sept4]

Thank you Free I will try that! Yes journaling has helped me a lot the past few years.

One thing I really struggle with is just how unfair it is that the victim of abuse has to work through many years of PTSD suffering after leaving the relationship. It’s a huge price to pay and that is AFTER you are already out of the relationship.

Abuse is so damaging because of the long lasting effects. I am many years out but still struggling. I really thought that by now I would be happy again and be fully healed but I’m not there yet.

[freeatlast]

I know, sept4. It is really, really unfair. I look back at all the years I wasted on him. The money I sank into our relationship. All that he took from me in terms of self-esteem. I am a shadow of my old self. I have almost no self-confidence at all. I feel inferior in almost every social or working situation I’m in. It’s going to take me a very long time until I recover. Probably the rest of my life. However, there is still fun to be had and in fact, I make sure to regularly remind myself “I couldn’t have done this a year ago” or “he wouldn’t have allowed me to say or think or do this.” That helps to remind me of how far I’ve come and to focus on enjoying the moment. My self-esteem is slowly increasing and I’m enjoying the fact that there are things that were previously forbidden that I can now just enjoy in peace – like a glass of wine, for example. Despite being a 50+ professional woman, there was hell to pay if I came home from work and poured myself a glass of wine – something I might add that is totally normal and indeed EXPECTED behaviour here in the UK! There isn’t a list of rules and things I am and am not allowed to do, say or think bearing down on me all day every day. I guess I would sum this up as saying that I am savouring the small freedoms and mini steps of progress. And that’s keeping me going for now. Hugs to you.

[sept4]

Free yes my self esteem was greatly affected too and even after many years NC it’s still very low.

But yes I do really value all the freedom I have now! My days are so lovely now doing EXACTLY what I want to do without any compromise. I go out to the restaurants I like, I’m always at the gym, I go to outings I enjoy whenever I want. It’s wonderful to be free to be myself and live my life the way I please.

It’s just that the emotional and financial abuse are still in my head. It’s like he is haunting me and the effects just linger on endlessly without relief. I got my life back after him but I want my mind back!

[freeatlast]

That’s a tough one. Have you tried the emotional freedom technique? Donna writes about it on this site. I haven’t tried it. One thing that has helped me is the book Self Compassion by Kristin Neff. That helped me a LOT. We beat ourselves up and denigrate ourselves through our own self-talk using the “voice” of our abuser. This book helps us learn how to treat ourselves with compassion – because that is how we deserve to be treated, no matter what our history is – and I found quite a bit of healing through following the steps in her book. I also found some loving kindness meditations on youtube, including one for abuse survivors. The other thing that helped was binaural beats – look up on youtube. Very therapeutic. These are just ways to directly access healing for yourself and learn to let go of the past. Even if just for a few minutes – in the recognition that YOU MATTER. And your peace of mind and heart matters.

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