We know only too well that by far the majority of psychopaths are men. Or at least we think we know that. Could it be that the criteria used to identify psychopaths are biased towards men? After all Hare began his work in male prison.
Think about it. While behaving and being the way the PCL-R without doubt earns one the label psychopath, this is simply a list of symptoms. It says nothing about the underlying dynamics. If psychopathy is life centered on the principle of power (as opposed to love) and if it is therefore characterised by what Liane Leedom nicely calls ‘warped empathy‘, then wouldn’t you expect there to be more or less the same number of woman as men psychopaths? And wouldn’t you expect them to come across differently?
I am beginning to wonder whether there may be two broad types of psychopathy – a ‘male’-type and a ‘female’-type. I place these in quotes because, when I think about it, men with might be thought of as ‘female’ psychopathy come to mind and we all know about women with ‘male’ psychopathy. And yet, at the risk of being un-PC, I want to maintain these descriptors for now so that the difference I think I see doesn’t disappear.
A ‘female’ psychopath would not necessarily commit crimianl/antisocial acts like her male counterpart, but she woud be as power-driven, as toxically narcissistic as a ‘male’ psychopath. The control, the manipulation, the dishonesty, the selfishness, the callousness – all these would be present, but we might not recognise them for what they are because of 1. media portrayal and 2. medical diagnosis of psychopaths. The difference would come in the gendered style of their behaviour.
In my clinical work I have come across this phenomenon. For example, a woman I now consider to be of the ‘female’-type of psychopath didn’t come close to committing a crime and yet the way she mothered her daughter, my patient, came close to destroying the child’s mind. This seems to me to be a perversion of motherhood eqivalent to the perversion of fatherhood we read about on this website.
Do readers have any comments? I’m particularly interested in any examples you might have of how ‘female’ psychopathy – if such a thing does exist – manifests itself?
Blueskies –
I read about your nieces continued crazy-making journey. Sounds like it hasnt been easy, but with your shared information and support/advice once the landlord moved in – your niece got it! And from what you wrote, I think she has moved out!!! Thats about as successful as it gets with these people. No joy, no real happiness felt on the part of family and friends and acquantainces — just relief and a sense of peace that the hellish experience has ended.
You may have to deal with residual texts, calls..but I just wanted to say what a strong, brave person you are for standing up for first standing up for yourself and secondly for standing your ground and letting her know you will not tolerate any connection with her until she gets help.
Im sorry for your experiences with your niece. Im glad you were able to get her to leave your house and the next victim she secured. Prayers and strength to you and her parents and all the families who are subjected to these types of toxic personalities. xo
I want to thank you all for helping me come to terms with this. I just got off the phone with another source target – we’d been planning a surprise birthday party for the P when all of this came apart. The other target (call her, “Ellen”) and I had been deliberately misinformed about one another to make certain that we would never spend time together as mutual friends of the P. Since the collapse of the house of cards, we’ve been in fairly regular contact to help one another through this.
The question that I have that was raised by Ellen was whether we should inform the P’s mother about how anxious the P is for her mother and step-father to die. These words have come straight out of the P’s own mouth, “She’s going to die soon,” and, “I can’t wait until she’s dead.” The background on this is that the P has claimed to any who will listen that she bailed her mother and step-father out of financial ruin with the understanding that HER name would be placed on the deed to the property that the mother and step-father own (it’s paid off long ago). The P and her victim husband live in the house and have been doing so for 4 years.
The mother, herself, has expressed the unwavering belief that, should her husband pass (he’s 77, she is 57) that she would become mysteriously ill. I asked her, “Do you believe that (the P) would actually poison you?” The answer was, “I certainly do.”
Ellen has expressed the desire to sit down with the mother and tell her everything. I’m on the fence about this, but I do think that someone should tell the mother, whom I’m very fond of. I would VERY much appreciate thoughts on this: should someone tell the P’s mother?
With regard to closure with these types of people, I don’t believe that there is what can be defined as “closure” or “justice.” What keeps me from acting on an impulse to confront this person is that somehow, someway, she’s going to reap what she’s sown.
Blueskies, your ordeal has been horrible, and I very much appreciate your endeavor to educate others through your own suffering. And, for all of those who have been “had” by these people, brightest blessings on your healing.
Dear Learning, I certainly could not have done it without support from people here:)xx …Yes I am certain before anyone chimes in:)x
I think there is definately something going on in My, well my mother’s (egg doner’s) side of the family that needs notice:( and care… I think MY daughter is okay…but I’m learning all the time:)x
I dont think i’ll have to deal with residual texts, she is young, and yet again sprung so she’ll be moving on…I cant see how i would be (thankfully) useful in her eyes anymore…and they operate on who’s useful…
buttons: I think it will be very hard to tell the mother.but mabey encourage her to trust her instincts! I think this is the best thing I have learned in the last two years…. still learning:)xx
I agree, blueskies. The mother has already acknowledged that something is wrong. She’s too deep into it and can’t bring herself to kick out her own daughter and son-in-law, both of whom she has become too dependent upon.
Oxdrover,
I wanted to tell you that I’ve told my SO that I am moving out at the end of the lease, 45 days. I don’t believe he is a path but he does have issues with ego, big time. It has been sheer hell since I told him. My conscience wouldn’t let me not tell him in time for him to find a place, it may have been a bad mistake. Just to make clear I don’t fear for my safety at all but I don’t have support system where I am now and it’s going to be very very difficult on me. 🙁
The final straw was when he and I had a spat and I dozed off in another room I was awakened to hear him on the phone at 3 am mind you talking to his ex, the socio. I knew then that they would never separate. Plus we discussed for a year about my move and how I would work at his office. It’s been nearly a year and I’ve been basically spending most of my time alone here during the day. I just feel very sad and misled.
I should add what I mean by ‘sheer hell’. Glaring at me, posturing, ugly remarks under his breath, he nearly fell yesterday (an automatic response) and I jumped up and he immediately said ‘get away from me’, ‘I don’t want to talk to you’ This is a small condo and now I have no place to sleep but a small sofa. I keep telling myself it’s only 45 days.
We’ve had some issues off and on, a lot of them surround the socio ex. We talked about counseling but arrangements were never made. I know zero about this area and asked him to follow-up and set an appointment, never happened. Sadly I do still love him 🙁
Dear Zen,
Good for you, I’m sorry that you felt compelled to give him advance warning, but that was your choice, and frankly they use advance warning to punish you. But, you are right, it is only 45 days.
While You are waiting, get your things together and your ducks in a row. I would start moving my things out into a storage if necessary so that at the last he doesn’t destroy them just to “get even.”
You say you still love him. What’s to love? Think about the nasty remarks, the broken promises, the calling his x and all the other REAL things he has done to you. It will help you heal to think on those things. I’m glad you are on your way out of this relationship. Good for you!!!!!! ((((hugs))))
OxDrover,
You’re right, he has said some very ugly things to me not just during this. Sometimes I wonder how he can say the things to me that he does, if he in fact loves me as he has said. I am not going to be able to take much with me, I can’t afford it. Much will be tossed and the large items will be sold on craigslist or be donated. I gave up everything for him, my family, my job (believing I would have one here), my friends, home to come across country to make a life with him. Ha! I am little more than a maid here, although to his credit he is generous with me in a lot of ways and he can be a good companion as long as it’s on his terms-his films, his music, his interests. It’s not all been negative by any means but bottom line he will never give up the socio ever. He’s lied to me too about her-things he said he told her but I have found out it was very much not the case. I guess I love the person I wanted him to be or the person he presented when he was trying to win me. But I did see some red flags about our relationship and communication but I ignored them all because I loved him, I thought we could work through them. Oh well.
Generous? Certainly, he is generous as long as you tow the line, Zen, and never let yourself forget that his “generosity” comes at a very high price, no less than your very soul.
What you loved, what I loved, and what countless others have loved was the fantasy that they portrayed. I believed the fantasy, and it was just smoke and mirrors.
The next 45 days will be an emotionally dangerous time for you, if not physically dangerous. I would encourage you to develop an exit strategy in the event that you feel that your safety is at risk. God bless you….
Buttons,
You’re right about towing the line, if I had an issue I wanted to discuss with him I’d have to suppress it for fear of addressing it because I knew it would be an argument with me ending up apologizing when I hadn’t done anything at least anything that should take hours and hours of lecturing or arguing. I would do anything to stop those arguments, said anything to end them. When I told him one reason I had to leave was that I could no longer afford to live here. He questioned me and I said well can you come up with a solution (hoping he’d abide by his promise of work) You know what he said? I am NOT handing you a solution. You do this and that.
When I think about the things he gave to me were nothing really tangible. He’d bring home cookies for me when he went shopping or ice cream, things like that not jewelry or personal gifts. For Valentines day he did buy me flowers and candy though.
Funny I had bought him some new undershirts and a new shirt. I saw where he had taken one of the shirts and threw it across the room in anger.