Question: Why do people engage in aggressive behaviour (some, as we know, rather more than others)?
Answer: Because they enjoy it.
There’s a bit of a flutter on the internet (see here and here) about research coming out of Vanderbilt University. Studying mice, Maria Couppis and Craig Kennedy have found that aggression can be as emotionally rewarding as food or sex.
The neurotransmitter dopamine has been implicated in nearly every experience we consider rewarding, such as love, drugs, eating, and sex. Indeed, the mesolimbic dopamine pathway is referred to as the reward system of the brain. Dopamine is necessary for reinforcement, e.g. the ex-smoker’s craving brought about by the whiff of cigarette smoke.
Now a direct connection has been drawn between dopamine and aggression. In the experiement the male home mouse continually pushed a button to let in an intruder mouse which it then aggressed. When treated with a dopamine antagonist (blocking the activity of the dopamine) the home mouse decreased its button-pushing. (For a discussion of the experiment see here.)
(Incidentally, it is important not to conflate aggression and violence. Aggression is dominating behaviour. For the mice aggressive behavior included tail rattle, an aggressive sideways stance, boxing and biting – two non-violent and two non-violent behaviours.)
“We learned from these experiments that an individual will intentionally seek out an aggressive encounter solely because they experience a rewarding sensation from it,” Kennedy said. “This shows for the first time that aggression, on its own, is motivating, and that the well-known positive reinforcer dopamine plays a critical role.”
Not that surprising?
I suspect that lovefraud/blog readers who have been on the receiving end of aggression won’t be surprised by these findings. Says Dr. Bliss at Maggies’ farm, “I cannot speak about mice, but every psychiatrist – and every person – knows that this is a fact for human beings.”
Any comments?
A query I have is runs something like this. Many commentators on this blog speak of increased assertiveness, anger, determination, etc. which has enabled them to get through relationships with psychopaths, to gain self-respect, and to make new lives. Would you say that you have learned to better access aggression? And if so, is there pleasure in it?
sarah
“I’ve been trying to come up with some verbiage (rather than/narcissistic/psychopathic/Anti-social Personality/Sociopath) that describes these POWEER ADDICTED people. Usually victims will say “I’m not sure if he’s a narcissist/psychopath/ASPD/Sociopath” because he hasn’t been professionally diagnosed, or he’s not old enough, or I’m not a psychologist. But the victims are SURE that these demented individuals are always putting them down, falsely blaming them, raging uncontrollably, lying a lot, exploitative, gaslighting, abusive (physically and/or verbally), don’t take responsibility, are controlling, predatory, and have no conscience, and are sometimes very charming etc. With all that, victims are still often reluctant to LABEL them . . I read it again and again . . . It’s remarkable to me!!!!!! It seems that victims are so frightened to make a diagnostic mistake. And of course, in many instances the psychologist, who is not scared to make a mistake, only sees the charming side and hears the lies & excuses, and erroneously, again blames the victim (or as I was told ”“ “It takes 2”³.) Yes, In a murder it also takes 2, a victim and a murderer. But no one would dare say . . “It takes 2”³. My point is that we need to give this addiction a name that victims won’t be scared to use (without trampling on professionals toes). I suggested POWER ADDICTS or POWER-HOLICS/CONTROL ADDICTS or CONTROLAHOLICS. I think we need to place the blame precisely where it belongs, and not be scared to do so, just because we are not “the professionals”. Sometimes (when so many professionals “just don’t get it” . . You’ve got to take it into your own hands. We lived it . . . they didn’t!!!! With apologies to those few professionals that DO GET IT!
This is the MOST profound post I’ve read on this site so far.
I’m going to copy, paste and put it up on my bathroom mirror.
It’s about the ONLY good sense I’ve seen here thus far in trying to make sense of a nonsense situation.
Thank you!!!
LL
tobe,
I cannot avoid your inflaming, triggering posts.
So I need to leave the site.
That’s too bad. But what you’re saying is so steeped in denial I am triggered beyond belief.
Take good care everyone!
HUGS!
LL
LL please dont feel you have to leave us. We need you. A chain is only as strong as its weakest link . You are a link we need. Cant you just disregard the posts that trouble you?
If you have to go, I hope and pray youll be back soon.
Love,
Mama gemXX
LL,
In regards to your comments about change. I agree with your therapist. Just because someone does not change/will not change does not mean they can not change. Changing something as complex as who you are can be very difficult.
I use an example of change on various students/interns to show just how complex this can be. Here it is:
Most people (adults) can tie their shoes without even looking at them or thinking about it. In fact many can do so while carrying on a conversation, etc. They also tend to tie them the same way everytime.
Now this action has been done repeatedly over and over, thousands or even tens of thousands of times. It has become a part of us.
Now the challenge is to try and tie your shoes the opposite way you do now. So if you start of with left over right you would switch to right over left, etc.
Do that and see how long it takes you to be able to tie them without thinking about it. How many times did you backslide and revert to the old way? How stressful was it? Were you able to really change it?
The answers are different for different people of course. But what it does (hopefully) is to help people give themselves a break when they are trying to change some part of their lives and are struggling or have some slip ups. If something as unimportant and goofy as tying your shoes different can be so hard than we can (hopefully) understand why we do so on bigger things.
That also (hopefully) tones down the judgemental aspect when we see others trying to change and struggling/backsliding at times.
And again just because someone won’t/don’t change in no way equals they can’t change.
There are many examples of people that could meet the criteria for ASPD or psychopathy who later on did change. The flaw in the myth of untreatable is that it starts off with the (flawed) assumption that “untreatable/unchangeable” is fact rather than looking to see if that assumed fact is really true or not.
Just because many or even if most did not change it still does not equal to they can’t change or that all of them can’t.
Some may find this interesting from a researcher who studies psychopathy along with other things https://webfiles.uci.edu/skeem/Downloads_files/IAFMHS_2008.pdf
Blogger T.
I’m not opposed to your analogy, however, it is touted here on this site that pathology CANNOT be changed.
Be that as it may, and since you appear to agree with my therapist on this issue, to which I take argument, for the sake of those who have suffered at the hands of someone such as this………
What proof do you have to back up your assertions that this is indeed a changeable” aspect of one’s rigid and entrenched personality?
What factors are involved, if you in fact, have witnessed this, that says it is possible?
This is VERY contradictory as you well know here, however, I would appreciate learning more from you that supports some sort of hypothesis (other than the shoe tying analogy), that change is at all possible with a pathological, given the information that is gleened here. I believe this could very well be potentially harmful to a victim of the abuse that a psychopath liberally applies to his/her victim.
Please elaborate. I’m interested.
LL
Blogger t
BTW, I’m not giving up on this therapist. Not an inch. He is WILLING to debate this with me at length. Is open to my perspective as I am open to his.
THis actually has a healing effect upon me.
But could also be a detrimental one at the same time if not carefully orchestrated in the therapeutic environment with a victim ( I prefer survivor) who has suffered at the hands of a very abusive psychopath.
LL
LL
I found an aggression and an anger inside me that I have NEVER experienced before and that is what has kept me going over recent months.
When I told Spath to go he turned up at my sons place and gave him agro. The police were called.
Now I’m a mother and my son is 25 BUT I am a mother and by God I was like a lioness with her cub. I could have killed spath – it worries me that I felt such anger and aggression ( I have never hit anyone in my life) Call it the maternal instinct, call it what you will, but I would have put him 6 feet under had it not been for my family calming me down and telling me HE’S NOT WORTH IT.
And do you know what? He’s not worth it. None of them are worth it.
To change…..we must first recognize there is a problem.
The final end for me was being told by spaths psychologist that they DO NOT CHANGE…..when I asked him……
He then followed it with…..well…..he’s seen a ‘manipulative’ change, forced when a spath is old, alone and get’s sick…..after he’d run off all dupes and supply…….THEN he started the lonely ploy……….whoa is me and went back through his black book of supply……looking for pity and ‘help’.
He was afraid of dying lonely.
Fuck that…..that’s YOUR gift! Deal……
For me……the ex spath was 44…….there was NO WAY I was gonna wait around for THAT! I’d already donated 28 years hoping and trying for change……
I WAS DONE! The ‘hope’ no longer existed for me…..and I was done.
I could give a rats ass if he changes……It will not affect me either way!
Never poke a sleeping bear…….
If he ever comes around here to cause ANY harm….he better smile……cuz that’s the pose he’ll be layed in the ground with.
Candy….I don’t think it matters how old our kids get…..its’ instictual.
What fool would mess with a mamma?
Blogger t
As you can see, this subject of “change” for spaths. ruffles some feathers.
I’d appreciate it very much if you would elaborate as I’m interested in your perspective.
LL