I write this column (using “he” throughout, for simplicity purposes) to suggest some useful ideas for vetting a prospective provider who does not come recommended through a reliable source (or through Donna Anderson’s growing new LoveFraud referral base).
How can you begin to assess a relatively unknown provider for his competence to address your experiences with a suspected sociopath specifically, exploiter in general, or otherwise personality-disturbed individual?
Let me start by suggesting that a provider who claims to be educated about sociopathy really isn’t if he lacks an equally fluent understanding of narcissistic and borderline personality disorder.
The reason I say this is that, under certain circumstances, all three disorders can look very much alike; but more importantly, if you are involved with someone who has any one of these disorders, you are at heightened risk of being personally violated and abused.
So, while they are distinct from each other (although common elements of narcissism and sociopathy remain intriguing), I’m suggesting that all three disorders greatly increase the probable, if not certain, occurrence of interpersonal violation.
In the course of this discussion, I’m going to assume that you may be involved with someone (or have been involved with someone) whom you suspect (or know) to be, for instance, sociopathic and/or abusive? Otherwise you wouldn’t be seeking assurances that a particular provider has knowledge and/or expertise of the disorder(s) in question.
I also make the assumption that LoveFraud members or visitors wanting to find a knowledgeable resource on sociopathy (who do not find assistance through Donna’s new referral resource) come with a nice advantage—by virtue of their involvement with LoveFraud, they are already extra knowledgeable on the subject. This equips them to be astute evaluators of a prospective resource.
So let’s get down to business.
You will need, no surprise, to ask questions; questions that can gauge the provider’s competency to appreciate the gravity of a situation in which a sociopathic (or some other exploitative dynamic) is, or has been, present.
And you will want good, expressive answers to your questions, not dismissive ones.
The first, vital task is to assess the provider’s receptivity to your interest in his clinical experience. This point needs emphasis: You are entitled to evaluate the provider’s clinical experience and expertise as it pertains to your circumstances.
I stress: You are completely, utterly entitled to assess the provider’s professional experience, skills, and interest on matters relevant to your personal circumstances and self-interest.
Remember, this is not about protecting the provider; it’s about protecting yourself.
As such, this speaks to a bigger issue: You are setting yourself up if you do not protect yourself, and so you protect yourself by owning your right to a completely respectful, receptive invitation to evaluate the provider’s scope of interest and competence with a given client population, or in a particular clinical area. Anything less than a genuine, undefensive invitation from the provider to proceed with your questions should immediately disqualify him from consideration.
So for instance, you might begin with something like, “You know, it’s very important to me, given my circumstances, to be working with someone I can feel confident has a really good knowledge of _________. Would you mind if I asked you several questions along those lines, for my own personal comfort?” (There are many ways to break the ice, this is just one example.)
Remember: A provider who fails, at this point, to invite you to proceed, undefensively, has disqualified himself. Thus, if he responds impatiently, arrogantly, angrily, curtly, condescendingly, as if offended or put-off, or in any other way inadequately, he is wrong for you. You must move on, because you deserve better.
Assuming you’ve gotten the proper encouragement to proceed, I offer below a list of questions (hardly comprehensive) which, depending on your circumstances, can elicit meaningful information. The idea (quite obviously) isn’t to ask all of these questions, but to pursue several that are most applicable to your situation.
This list is by no means complete; rather, it’s at best a starting point, if only to get your own wheels rolling to come up with even better questions! Note that some of the questions probe for knowledge, others for personal views and biases, and others for experience. The asterisked questions can sometimes elicit responses that will enable you to quickly eliminate potential resources.
· How familiar are you with sociopathy?
· How familiar are you with psychopathy?
· Do you distinguish sociopathy and psychopathy, or are we using these terms to mean the same thing?
· Do you distinguish antisocial personality disorder from sociopathy or psychopathy?
· How many cases have you worked involving sociopathy?
· Can I ask how you came to work with these individuals?
· What is your treatment philosophy regarding sociopathically disturbed individuals?
· I’m curious how you view sociopathy? I know that many people have different ideas about sociopaths. Can you tell me your view of what characterizes the sociopath?
· How do you distinguish, if at all, the sociopath from the narcissistic personality?
· What’s been your experience working with borderline personality disturbance?
· In your experience, what are similarities and differences between borderline, narcissistic and sociopathically disordered individuals?
· How much experience have you had working with abusive individuals?
· Can you tell me a little about the history of your interest, and experience working, with abusive personalities?
· *How effective and appropriate, in your experience, are anger management referrals for abusive personalities?
· How much interest, and experience, have you had working with victims of abuse?
· What is your view of what constitutes abuse in a relationship?
· What are your goals in working with someone who is in, or has been damaged by, an abusive relationship?
· *Are there circumstances where someone might be driven, legitimately, to abuse someone else?
· Do you mind if I ask you whose work or writings on abusive relationships and abusive personalities has most influenced your views?
· Do you mind if I ask you whose work on the subject of psychopathy (or sociopathy) has most influenced your ideas?
· *Are you familiar with Robert Hare’s work?
· *Have you successfully treated sociopaths?
· My partner, if you meet him, will tell you that I’m a sociopath”¦how will you know which of us, if either, is the sociopath?
· Are you familiar with any psychological instruments that assess for psychopathy, and if so, do you use them?
· *Under what conditions, if any, would you be hesitant to do couples therapy?
· What goals do you have, generally, when working with a borderline personality?
· What goals do you have, generally, when working with a narcissistic personality?
· What is your understanding of the central feature(s) of sociopathy?
· What is your understanding of the central feature(s) of the narcissist?
· Would you be willing to read something I’d give you if I felt it could help you understand the precidament/situation/personality I’m dealing with?
· When you believe you are dealing clinically with a sociopathic individual, what is your clinical goal?
The answers to your questions
As I’ve strongly suggested, the provider’s responses, first of all, should convey interest in, and respect for, your questions. Your first assessment, then, is less of the provider’s expertise and knowledge, than his or her attitude to your questions.
As a matter of fact, a primary purpose of your questions is to assess the attitude of the provider. In other words, if the provider isn’t temperamentally suited to appreciate the complexity of your concerns, he or she can have all the knowledge in the world and be pretty much worthless.
You’ll want honest answers. Genuine answers. Not pretenses to expertise where there isn’t any. You’ll want a provider who is willing to say, “That’s an interesting question. I might even need to think about that a bit more.”
I offer randomly some rough examples (from countless possibilities) of what might be deemed encouraging responses to some of these questions:
“To be honest, no”¦I haven’t worked with what I’d call a high volume of ________; but I do feel comfortable with my understanding of this clinical issue, and I’d like to be of help to you.”
“I consider myself to be clinically literate on this subject, but I’m happy to become even more enlightened and would welcome anything you have to share with me to get me up to speed.”
“I wouldn’t say that I have a particular interest working with _______, but I do like working with and helping those who have been victimized by ________(s).”
“I suppose I’d regard ______as a very central feature of _______. Also ______.”
“I don’t really make a distinction between antisocial personality and the sociopath? As a matter of fact, I wasn’t even aware of such a distinction? But I’m curious about that? Am I missing something?”
“I’ve worked a great deal with victims of abuse and enjoy working with this client population.”
“I’m not familiar with that issue, to be honest” (depending on the circumstances, this doesn’t necessarily have to be a disqualification).
“I can’t say that I’ve had great success working with narcissistic personalities”¦but I’ll work with anyone who voluntarily seeks my help genuinely.”
“I’m not sure if I satisfied you with my response?”
These hypothetical replies have in common a thoughtful, humble, curious quality. The confident provider will feel relaxed, undefensive, and unpressured to produce brilliant, comprehensive answers beyond his or her scope of expertise.
At the same time, you are looking for evidence of expertise that will leave you feeling comfortable that this is someone who can effectively, sensitively advocate for your interests.
Some responses, as noted, can quickly reveal a provider’s serious limitations.
For instance, the response to the question, Have you successfully treated any sociopaths?, “Yes”¦I’ve worked with many sociopaths and treated several very successfully,” is a great time-saver. You just say, “Thanks very much, I’ve really appreciated your time,” and then have a good laugh on your way out.
That’s because true sociopathy, as the LoveFraud community well knows, is a refractory
condition, unamenable to meaningful modification.
Regarding the Hare question: in cases where a provider claims to be experienced with the subject of sociopathy, I might find it dubious (although not necessarily instantly disqualifying) that he or she would have no knowledge of Robert Hare, who is such a notable figure in psychopathy research.
Similarly, the response to the question, Under what conditions would you be hesitant to do couples therapy?, “Umm”¦.I can’t really think of any?,” would suggest a potentially serious defect in the provider’s clinical knowledge and/or judgement. That’s because couples therapy is ill-advised under several circumstances, among them when serious abuse is occuring in a relationship, or when one or both partners is sociopathically oriented. (And naturally, non-genuine motivation to work on the relationship would be another contraindication.)
Further, a provider who suggests that, yes, a referral for anger management is probably the best intervention you can offer an abusive personality betrays a likely ignorance of the dynamics of the abuser, who has much more than merely an anger problem.
And it’s self-evident that a provider who can find a basis to justify abuse under any circumstance is probably confusing abuse with, perhaps, self-defense—a failure of understanding that ought to send you running for the hills.
Bear in mind there is no one right way to answer many of these questions; in many cases, there are multiple good (and good-enough) answers which also allow for differences in clinical approaches and orientations.
I offer below additional examples (also random, hypothetical) of the kinds of responses that might reflect a reassuring level of clinical expertise:
“What do I see as the central feature of sociopathy? I see the sociopath as someone who is extremely, chronically manipulative and deceptive. Someone who lacks empathy in a very gross way for the victims of his or her exploitation.”
“I see what you mean”¦.you can have a borderline personality disorder doing something, say, really vengeful that might look very sociopathic, but the motive for the aggression would be different. The borderline personality might be motivated by rage, panic, or desperation over, say, abandonment issues, whereas the sociopath? He or she may be movitated by”¦the impulse?”¦pure greed”¦or even the fun of it?”
“If I have good reason to believe I’m dealing with a sociopath, my main goal becomes evaluating his or her risk to others”¦depending, of course, on the circumstances of the referral and case.”
“If I’m working with someone with borderline personality, I’m looking to help that individual, among other things, learn how to better regulate his or her emotions, which may be very dysregulated and for that reason a source of much distress.”
“If I’m working with a narcissistic personality disorder, I’m looking, over time, to help that individual, if possible, examine his demands and expectations of others—his inflated sense of entitlement—more thoughtfully; and also examine the ways that he routinely handles, or mishandles, his disappointment in others.”
“When I’m working with abusive individuals my goal is to confront their excuses and rationalizations for their violating behaviors.”
“When I’m working with victims of abuse I may have several goals, including safety concerns; also exploring how the client finds herself in an abusive relationship, and the factors that make it difficult for her (or him) to leave that relationship.”
“How will I know which of you is the sociopath? I think in any clinical situation, you rely on a number of factors in formulating possible diagnoses, including your instincts, your experience of the individuals, the client’s history (as furnished by the client and others), other relevant, available, supporting documentation; and any adjunctive testing and evaluations that can narrow down, if necessary, a suspected diagnosis more accurately? And so there’s no guarantee that I’ll get it right, but I’m pretty confident of my chances.”
In sum, you’ll want assurances that the provider, at a minimum, can recognize the central aspects of sociopathy (or the disorder in question); he or she should appreciate the futility of pursuing treatment with the sociopath, especially in a private practice setting; but most importantly, the provider should be able to convey a good clinical grasp of, and history of work with, abusive personalities and their victims.
You will know, intuitively, whether the provider’s responses indicate an adequate level of thoughtfulness and knowledge.
And remember, your initial assessment doesn’t end when you choose to begin a working relationship with a particular provider, anymore than you cease evaluating the individual with whom you enter a personal relationship. Your evaluation should be ongoing, and your continued investment in the relationship, whether with a professional resource, or intimate partner, should be based on a continuing evaluation of him or her as worthy of your time and trust.
You can say at any point along the way, This person is not right for me. Just because I sized this person/provider up initially (with necessarily incomplete information) as worth my initial investment, doesn’t mean I can’t modify my assessment of him or her at any time, thanks to my making good use of additional, more complete information!
I hope this offers some guidance for conceptualizing an approach to the evaluation of a relatively unknown prospective provider. I am glad to continue this discussion based on feedback.
(This article is copyrighted (c) 2009 by Steve Becker, LCSW.)
Thank God we’re here to validate each other. These vignettes are so revealing. It doesn’t matter the genders in our relationships, the S playbook was what was operating. Matt, you said it: “that sly, avaricious smirk.”
Now, remember, they are in the minority, so statistically we’ve got a better chance at finding someone who has a real heart, especially now that we have a better idea of what we want.
Rune:
I was talking to a young friend of mine who came into my life as things with S were rapidly going downhill. She settled in this country after marrying an American.
When her marriage hit an extremely bad patch, she packed up her things, bought a bus ticket and moved to this city. She didn’t know a soul, she didn’t have any money.
I asked her how she found the nerve to do it and she said “I decided I wanted the best for me. If I didn’t want it, I wasn’t going to get it.”
At the time she said those words I heard them, but I didn’t HEAR them in the sense that I didn’t feel the truth of them emotionally. It wasn’t until after I drove S out of my life that I knew what she was talking about.
You’re right — after this we have a better idea of what we want. And I think we want what my friend wanted — the best for ourselves. Because, if we don’t demand it for ourselves, we’re never going to get it.
So each of us is moving to a new country, in our own way.
Rune:
Ireland is snake-free. Hopefully our new countries are S-free.
Well, just my luck to have been on the wrong island before!
Y’know, though, I was musing earlier about something a fellow spiritual seeker told me many years ago. He said that the snake symbolizes transformation and — if you will — the rising of the kundalini. (That’s the eastern term for the development of yet another level of awareness, using our energy field, to state it in a clumsy fashion. Any of the rest of you who want to clarify, please step in!)
Anyway, he made the point that when a snake shows up in dreams, meditation, or in real life it is a sign that points to transformation. He also said that the cobra is the sacred symbol of the snake-like kundalini, and the rattlesnake is the “cobra” of our continent. Oh, and one more piece of advice: he said that if you see a snake, don’t pick it up or move it. I think we can go along with that!
When we’re ready to consider, though, that our physical experience is a reflection of our energy-bodies, we might gain a glimpse as to why these “snakes” came into our lives.
If Stargazer is around, I’ll bet she has a comment or two!
Matt, that was so beautifully put, your truth above about the interactions. Were we all “emotionally raped?” Did we all have a “betrayal bond”? Were we all “targets”? Did we all “love too much”? Are we all “co-dependents”? Are we just super empathetic and understanding? Are we all recreating a former relationship we had as a child? Or is it just simply we were with a P/S/N and did not yet know about them and how to spot them and get away?
I know almost all break ups hurt, but not like this. Not for this long. Not with this much confusion.
I just wish I could label it all once and for all and forget it all.
justabouthealed:
In my case I had two verbally and physically abusive Ns for parents. So, I know I have a “betrayal bond”. I was beautifully conditioned by them to take the abuse others down the line have handed out.
But, I think the concept of recreating the former relationship we had with our parents is too simplistic. In my case my relationship with S went a stage beyond my relationship with my parents.
I wasn’t looking for mommy and daddy’s love. I wanted an adult relationship.
I was desperate to feel desired. I was desperate to give all the pent-up love I had in my to someone. I was desperate for someone to love me.
And S sensed those yearnings and deliberately targeted me. And I responded by being so damned empathetic and understanding. I responded by loving too much.
Even growing up with N parents, I don’t think it gave me the tools to recognize a sociopath. Unlike my parents, by whom I had been conditioned since birth to not expect anything from them, S tapped into my needs perfectly. Up front he gave me what I was looking for. That’s why we didn’t recognize them and get away.
That’s the hell of it — now that we’ve labelled it, we still can’t get away from it and forget about it.
Matt and JAH: We tend to go for what is familiar — it feels right to us. So when those of us who grew up with authoritarian or abusive families get around authoritarian (oh! I feel so SAFE! He’s TAKING CHARGE!) or abusive (I must have done something wrong . . . I’ll work harder and fix it. I’m lucky he still loves me.) people in intimate relationships, we just know how to play our parts, and the parts are familiar so they must be right. Right????
I’ve come to believe that we don’t quite know how to read the “vibration” underneath the words and even the actions. Our sensors have been tainted by those early experiences, so like the frog in the pot as the water approaches the boiling point . . . Hey, we’re used to hot water. In fact, we LIKE it! So, what’s the big deal? And we don’t notice as the S/P smiles at us in the pot, and instead of bringing a towel and perhaps a cold drink, comes over to us with the onions and salt, perhaps a pinch of . . . How do you season Frog Soup? We thought we were invited to dinner, and we find out that we’re the main course!
Matt, I’m still not sure that we can “love too much.” But we can certainly give our love to the wrong people. I wonder if we struggle with this because we don’t know how to turn off that “love light,” that brilliant lighthouse beacon of True Love that these pirates saw from their sinking rafts out at sea.
If we could just internalize all the wisdom from all the postings on this site!
Yes, Matt, there is nothing like that terrible moment of truth when you realise that not only are you not loved, but that you never were. That blinding moment when you realise that THEY ARE THE LIE. Talk about a dagger to the heart.
Isnt it wierd though, that they think they are actually getting something from you. But it is like dirty money. It hasnt really been earned, and they are not legitimately entitled to it.
I cannot ever imagine pretending to love someone whom I actually didnt. I just cannot imagine doing it, point blank. It has to be one of the sickest things that anyone can do. It is so digraceful. So pathetic, and so vile. And ultimately so poinltess.
Rune:
QUOTE: “If we could just internalize all the wisdom fro all the postings on this site.” AMEN!!!
The internalizing is the TRICK I think. Many of us here are professionals, educated in psychology and STILL we hadn’t internalized that knowledge and education or put it to USE in our own cases. I wonder if it was actually counter productive for us.
Matt, I think I never felt loved as a child by my mother, I know I did not feel loved by my P-biio-father who discarded me along with my mother, I did feel approved of and loved by my mom’s dad, and yet, because I was female, not a male grandchild, I felt “second rate” and I knew that men were esteemed more in the family than women. When I was more or less “gender neutral” before puberty I was treated one way, but after an early puberty, the approval decreased along with the rapid increase in the size of my breasts (by age 11 I was physically a woman) I was no longer allowed to accompany my grandfather to “all male” gatherings. Since I had no idea about sex or procreation I didn’t understand why and felt rejected, but not quite sure why.
When I was 13 I knew how animals procreated but actually thought that babies were “fertilized” by kissing. I can laugh now about how little sexual teachings I had by being told that a cow found a calf in the field, and I wanted a baby calf and roamed the fields trying to get one before the cow found it. I was always frustrated that there seemed to always be a cow there before I found it! I was 10 before I found out different when a cow happened to have one stuck that had to be pulled out and I saw it (much to the upsetting of my grandmother) My grandmother didn’t even say the word “Bull” or “Stallion” but would say a “male cow” or “male horse” if she had to refer to them.
When it became apparent that I had NO IDEA how women became “in the family way” (pregnant was a forbidden word) my total “education” was my grandmother asked me if I knew how cattle procreated and I said yes, then she said “well people do the same thing.” END OF DISCUSSION.
Of course I had to run to school the next day and tell my best friend, Glenna, whose mother had just had a baby (only the second child) how her mother got that baby in her belly, and my friend looked at me and SCREAMED “MY mother wouldn’t do THAT!” and from that day forward she never liked me again, because I had “soiled” her mother! LOL ROTFLMAO
I did determine from that experience though that I would be sexually open with my children and that they would not be kept in the dark as I had been. Sexuality would not be a forbidden topic in my home when I had children.