UPDATED FOR 2024. Editor’s note: Lovefraud received the following e-mail from a woman who we’ll call, “Cybil.” She was married to a sociopath, and is now raising two toddlers, paying 75% or more of their support, and being run into the courts, stalked, threatened and harassed.
Today I was thinking about this comment I get a lot from the supposed “resources” I have. What I have found is that there really is not much in the way for resources out there for abused women. Even my family, who have been helpful and are starting to “get it” little by little, can be a little backhanded in their support.
The comment goes like this: “Well, you chose this guy. You chose to have kids with this guy.” It is always said after they are frustrated at your upset or stress, or after they have gotten stressed, or when they realize they really can’t help you. I guess it’s a kind of guilt deflector. A way of saying, ultimately it’s your own damn fault so take the drama somewhere else. Even if the drama is externally created and you’re trying your best to have the boring, drama-free life that is SO attractive now. I would love boring.
I did not choose this guy
The thing is, I didn’t “choose” this guy. He chose me. I chose a different guy, the one he was pretending to be. Yes, maybe I got involved too quickly. They are good at moving things along. So yes, I made a bad decision. It’s true. I would undo it if I could. Some people make hasty relationship decisions and have it all work out fine, like my parents did.
But is that one bad decision I made as bad as all the things he has done: the emotional and physical abuse, the con, the isolation, the crazymaking, the fact that I had to give up a great career, my life savings, my car, the fact that I am being run into court on an almost monthly basis, the fact that my good reputation is now sullied with the lies he tells.
No, I didn’t choose this. I was smart, successful, maybe a little vulnerable, but not stupid. And I was nice. That’s why he chose me. That’s what people don’t get. I am not this psycho-bitch he keeps telling people I am. If I was, he would have moved on to an easier mark. The reality is that I was a semi-Pollyanna, who believed in helping people, giving the benefit of the doubt, being NICE.
Only a little bit my fault
So, no this is not my fault. This incredible nightmare that has become my life since I met this man, is not entirely my fault. It is a little bit my fault. I am more cautious now. But his behavior is not my responsibility, as awful as it is. And nothing I did was so bad that I deserve what has happened and is happening.
No, I didn’t choose this. Even though my mother said it today. Even though the cop that was supposedly on my side (after I received a death threat) said this after they brought him in for questioning, and then reduced the whole thing to a “domestic matter.”
I didn’t choose this guy and this nightmare. It chose me. I was just a little too naive to tell. I am not anymore.
Learn more: Sociopathic seduction—how you got hooked and why you stayed
Lovefraud originally posted this story on Nov. 16, 2010.
Dancing as treatment for depression
Thank-you! I know you are right. I have moved on somewhat but I do believe that It will always hurt somewhat to as I have always made my family my life and will always feel the empty spots which I do pray gets filled one day again.
Dear Grandmother,
I thought I also would feel “empty” spots because my P-son is in prison for murder and I soooo hoped he would get out and come home and live a good life….and I would do whatever possible to help him.
BOY was that a mistake! He had NO intention of living anything but his self serving self centered entitled to everything he wanted life style!
My other biological son, married a psychopath, and he too was alienated from us, isolated from us by HER….well, that was what I thought any way–what I wanted to believe anyway—and I kept hoping that he would come back to see what she was doing and come back to us emotionally. Well, THAT WAS A MISTAKE TOO….all of the isolation wasn’t just because of her, it was what HE WANTED AS WELL…I found out later. Long after she was gone for trying to kill him by buying a gun for her ex convict BF (she did 8-9 months in local jail for the attempted killing and is out on probation now.) Of course son C (her now X husband) after she was arrested said all the “I’m sorrys” and so on, and threw himself around my neck like the prodigal son returned home. “You were a prophet, Mom”
Well, as I got to know my son again as an adult, after he had been married to her for 7 years, I realized he has many admirable qualities, he is hard working, wouldn’t steal from his boss or anyone else for that matter, would stop to help strangers on the side of the road, but he will LIE when it suits him, even KNOWING that lying to me is the CUT OFF point in any relationship. Knowing that there is no excuse acceptable and that now I can never believe him about anything.
It is a shame that HE CHOSE to behave that way, but I cannot and will not tolerate those close to me lying to me. If someone lies to me, they are NO LONGER ALLOWED to be in my circle of trust. I don’t hate that son, I don’t wish him bad, but I just realize now that his isolation from us as a family and me as his mother was AS MUCH HIS CHOICE AS IT WAS HIS WIFE’S “FAULT.” If he really wanted to have been around us, he would have been…just like now. He is not “forced” to stay away from us by a wife who doesn’t like me or catch hell from her—his wife who hates me is long gone…he chose to LIE TO ME of his own free will, knowing the consequences of lying to me.
He’s not a psychopath, he has lots of good qualities…but respect for me enough that he will tell me the truth instead of lie, or gratitude to me for being there for him when he needed me. Nah, he has none of those things…but because of that he has forfited our relationship, but while my relationship with him meant a GREAT DEAL to ME, it obviously didn’t mean as much to himm. People do what they WANT to do in the end. People have choices.
While a trauma bond and Stockholm syndrome are REAL things, people also have choices, and my son of his own free will chose to distance himself from me by lying to me. In January of this year I was devastated by that knowledge, but I’m healing now. I have forgiven my son, but I will never trust him again. I only feel sadness now that he has thrown away what he had, a mother and a brother who loved him and trusted him, or wanted to, who would have done anything in the world for him–and now he has no one except some scumbag friends who couldn’t help him if they wanted to. They can’t help themselves, much less someone else.
To everyone “who did not choose this guy”.
Let’s face it, we were all swindled. It happened to me also. When I met my Stray Ray at a singles dance – he told me he owned his own home (a multi family) and was divorced for two years!! All lies which I did not find out until later. He has a best friend Joe who when we were alone let out tiny little snippets of info to me, to watch out for Ray, he is a player and “Ray is Ray”. Little did I realize this to be true. About a year into our relationship Ray, Joe and myself were out at Joe’s brothers’s house shooting targets and Joe looked at me and said “Ray cheats on you every chance he gets”. Ray glared at him and said he was crazy (Joe is bi-polar) and not to believe him. So life went on with Ray’s lies, one after another, lying to the US Goverment, lying about his creepy relationship with his ex-wife (who he cheated on and said to me he wants nothing to do with her) – another lie. She and he used to call each other up about books to read, soccer tickets that she would get and he would hand out, movies, etc. Please note, they had NO children together, just their marital house (see back to my original sentence – he did not own it alone). Anyway, I broke up with Ray many times because I caught him in lies and one time we were to go to Mexico to a couples resort for my birthday (I was paying – he HAD NO MONEY – read on) but I broke up with him before and I decided to go alone. Little did I know that he went to the same travel agency and decided to surprise me at the same resort at the same time we were to be there together. Well, the travel agency had a hit on their computer (since I cancelled his portion of the trip with me) and they called me that they felt this was a stalking issue and to notify me. I told them, thanks, let Ray go to Mexico (found out it cost him over 2k) and I went to Aruba. HE WAS PISSED when he went there, spent the money and was ALL ALONE (side note: a month before I met him he said he went to Vegas for a long weekend alone and I found out he went with his “mistress” the one that was the reason behind the divorce. I laughed in his face and said “now you can honestly say you have been on vacation alone”. But, it did not stop there. He would promise not to lie, stay away from the ex, no more internet pornography – blah, blah and I would break it off, but somehow that snake wiggled into my life – many times because his friend Joe would call me and say how much Ray missed me. So, as of today, I am Ray free and the unreal thing about all this – Joe who knows what a liar and cheat Ray is has hooked Ray up with the next door neighbor because according to Joe “she is older, a little on the heavy side and has a hard time meeting guys”. Can you explain WHY someone would do this? I know Joe is bi-polar but come on. Ray is on an internet dating site now looking for fresh victims and I would blame Joe if the neighbor (who is now crazy about Ray) comes down with some STD. I have been labeled the psycho bitch – but can someone out there please explain why someone would do this to a neighbor? I am at a loss for an understanding. But, maybe there is none. Thanks.
What do you think people in Lovefraud have in common aside from the obvious that we were all conned and deceived? What qualities do we all possess AND qualities we lack that we all winded up here? When I read people’s stories here, I realize everyone is fair game – no matter the age, race (I’m Asian), education and stature in life…we all got duped. Many of us here say “I am wiser”… yet I have seen people’s stories here that seem to have fallen for the same type of people and that is a frightening thought. I just turned 41 y/o and from this experience with that man, I have conditioned myself to not want to be in a relationship again. I tell myself “yeah I’m alone…I get lonely but at least I am not allowing anyone to use me and betray me over and over again”. When I feel a twinge of wishing and wondering that maybe…just maybe there is one good man out there for me, I shoot that thought down just as quickly to protect myself from another possible mistake and to keep myself from wanting something that could hurt me again. I barely made it through the first time. I keep my guard up and do not allow people especially men getting close to me. But truth is it has kept me VERY lonely and keeping people at a distance is emotionally/mentally tiring for me too. Does anyone feel/think the same way too or is it just me?
Dear Deceived,
We have many things in common, including empathy (sometimes too much) and many times they pick us because we provide “supply” for them either emotionally, sexually, financially, etc. and we have been gullible. I was a widow and I know I was “needy” and he was looking for another respectable wife to cheat on and keep his harem at bay.
I think we all also LOST OUR TRUST IN OURSELVES to keep ourselves SAFE…I am regaining that trust. I’ve been duped by more than one psychopath, but not but one romantic relationship, the rest were family members and “friends.”
I was conditioned to be a “people pleaser” and to be “responsible” for others happiness….but none of us should be responsible for anyone’s happiness except our own! If someone did something bad, I was brought up not to raise a rucus with them but to pretend it didn’t happen. To worry more about what the neighbors thought than what the reality of the situation was/is.
I am learning to set boundaries and to say to people, “I will not allow you to treat me that way” and to get away from people who are liars, dishonest in any way, rude, crude or mean. Not to give hundreds of “second chances” and not to think that some people are not just EVIL.
If and when I meet someone who appears to be a good match (not likely at my age 63) I will be CAUTIOUS and at the first sign of dishonesty I will ditch the relationship. It doesn’t matter to me WHO the person is, if they are dishonest or lie I do not want them in my life. I am not going to lower my standards just in order to “not be alone.” Alone isn’t all that bad, and having a psychopath isn’t an improvement over “alone.”
Dear Czarinamom,
The “bi polar” friend is probably also high in P-traits is why he acts that way….and that’s why he does what he does. He did not warn you because he was morally responsible to warn you, he warned you just to make trouble for his “pal”–they have a hate/hate not a friend/friend relationship….The bi polar friend is a snake in the grass too. Frequently bi-polars have a dual diagnosis of PPD as well and vice versa.
Deceived, there is a good book called Women Who Love Psychopaths, which can be found on Amazon, and Donna Andersen’s book is available in the LF book store & amazon. I think many of us believed in the goodness of people, some were people pleasers, some did not have good boundaries, I had all 3 of these things!! Others were married for years and years to someone who turned out to be a complete lie… so many different stories and experiences. Everyone is different… but I feel as you do… kind of scared to trust anyone, keep my guard up, very lonely. I feel it’s a healing journey, one I will always be on, I hope I will someday be more trusting of my own judgement and of others.
Deceived,
I would rather not be single at this point in time, but I have been through a train wreck, so I’ll stay put, alone.
What Oxy and shabbychic said is right on – I use to believe that there was good in everyone, but that’s been tossed out the door. I am cautious around others, not so trusting, wanting to avoid being used and abused. I feel like I have had an education (crash course) in human behavior, finding out some shocking, unsettling realities (eg. there truly are wicked, evil people in this world – a truth, not a myth).
Ox Drover you are so right again and I know it will take a lot for me to ever trust my daughter again. Your story is very similar to mine with your bio son. My daughter was honest with me to my knowledge up until she met this anything but a man. I do not think she told me the truth since. Will she always be this way. Has he turned her into a sociopath. Is there anyway to save my grandchildren. What are they going to grow up to be with a Mom and anything but a man drinking doing drugs putting there needs and wants way before the children These were three very good loving happy boys who now are lying too just to protect them selves. How do we judge these boys when they grow up.What a vicious circle.
blue,
i agree with you on not wanting to be single right now…..but we have to let the smoke clear from the train wreck, pick up the pieces and put our train back together and get NEW pieces to replaced the ones we lost or didn’t have to begin with (that we thought we had). So my train station is closed until further notice! They need to keep going down the track.
Yes, you have found some shocking, unsettling realities.
Best to you in your healing.
soimnotthecrazee1!!!