Editor’s note: This is the completion of Lovefraud’s e-mail from “robxsykobabe.” The beginning was posted yesterday: Part 1—Giving him the benefit of the doubt.
He contacted me April 13th, 2010. Three days before his son’s 11th birthday. I didn’t respond as he “dangled the carrot” with texting me simply, “I wish”¦” Yeah, it was a game. I didn’t contact him because I felt sick to my stomach and severe panic after receiving it. I waited”¦and he didn’t contact me again. And I responded”¦and so the story goes.
We met and I was LESS than pleased. This was NOT the reunion where we embraced each other and kissed long, sultry kisses. It was the kind of meeting you’d see in a movie and expect a knife to be jabbed through someone’s stomach. I had NOTHING but contempt, disgust, and anger for him. He took it all. And he apologized, acknowledged, accepted, asked for forgiveness.
He agreed to go to “counseling” if we were to get back together, as he BELIEVED he had things to sort out with me. He, of course, had been in therapy for three months prior to contacting me as he had “bottomed out” in January of 2010, and began seeing a therapist to “deal with my abandonment issues and take stock of how I had treated people in my life, particularly you.” We began seeing each other with the understanding that we were NOT “dating” for long, as I was WELL on my way to having a “normal, healthy life,” and was ready for marriage and a family. He agreed”¦he went to counseling”¦he was in love”¦he wanted this to work”¦he was “on the boat—¦
Moving in
November of 2010 rolled around, after my grandmother had had a stroke in August. He told me of money issues he was having and how he needed to “rectify” them. We had been talking about moving in together, as we were supposedly on the same page. I told him to get the money situation cleared up”¦no big deal. December rolled around and I asked him when he was planning on moving in, as the “agreement” was that we would “date” for about nine months and then make a move”¦we were on month seven. He told me of the money issues he still had and I was quite displeased. I asked him again if he thought he would be moving in”¦he told me of his expectations of me IF he moved in (I would have to “drive” him places he “wanted” to go at night with no questions asked. He had a restricted driving license and couldn’t drive many places other than work.) I argued with him over that and set some boundaries. I WOULD do for him if he NEEDED something, I would NOT do for him ALL THE TIME if he simply WANTED something. He didn’t know if he could “live” with that. He, nonetheless, agreed to move in”¦but not until the end of the month.
Christmas came and he told me I would get “the BEST present anyone could EVER ask for”¦you’ll NEVER have a better Christmas than this one.” I was stoked. I opened my front door to find”¦a puppy. He bought me a puppy for Christmas”¦a puppy who would FAR outweigh my condos weight limit in a very short time. A puppy who needs a yard to run around in as she is a breed with A LOT of energy. I live in a condo with NO yard. Did I mention I had said I did NOT want a dog UNTIL I bought a house?
Commitment
So, New Years Eve comes and he asks me, “Do you realize what me buying you the dog means? It means commitment.” REALLY? A dog? OK? I had inherited in my 900 square foot condo a puppy, his 11-year-old son and him. It was an adjustment to say the least.
I struggled with this adjustment quite a bit. It was very overwhelming and there seemed to be little regard for my struggle. January 3rd my grandmother died. This added to the difficulty, as my family is EXTREMELY close. Needless to say, he and I began fighting quite a bit. He began what seemed to be “picking on” me. I didn’t understand. I was struggling with some significant changes and he was picking on me?
An argument ensued in mid January over my expectation that his son find “independent tasks” to do”¦you know, BE A CHILD! My ex did not want his son to have to do things on his own. So, I wound up watching television on the floor while my ex lay on my couch and his son on my love seat. I went to my bedroom and went online. He followed me in and we began arguing over our opinions. He packed his stuff and left, with his son, prompting his son to “thank” me for “letting him come to your house this weekend.” REALLY? His son was at my house EVERY OTHER WEEKEND!
When he came home the following Monday, he brought boxes to pack his things up in. He never brought them in the house, he just kept them in his car, I guess, “just in case.” He told me he doesn’t “like it” that he “got a better night’s sleep this weekend at home than I’ve gotten since moving in with you.” Hmmmm”¦he said “things need to change.” I took that and ran with it.
Rejection
I began “coming on” to him, repeatedly, only he was not interested. Not interested? He’s ALWAYS interested. Four times in a row I came onto him and four times in a row I was “denied.” as he said, “I’m tired”¦let’s try again tomorrow.” So I did, and I got rejected. One day, after having my feelings hurt, I actually ASKED him if we could be intimate later. He said, “let’s do it now.” I took it thinking it was somehow progress. He lay naked on my couch with me fully clothed. I hadn’t been touched, kissed or even looked at for that matter. He was “ready,” turned, looked at me, and said, “Do you want to get on?” I could not believe my ears. Do I want to get on? I asked him if he noticed I was fully clothed still and hadn’t been touched one time. I asked him if he saw anything wrong with that. His response”¦ “no.”
At that point, I was on a mission to better myself, as I knew I had NOT been super pleasant to be around since the end of December. I had been adjusting to quite a bit. So, at the end of January, I made a CONSCIOUS decision to worry about getting myself under control and being better. I had to make concerted efforts on a daily basis to see the glass as half full and see the “good” in all the changes. I had decided to “handle my feelings.”
Valentines Day
For Valentines Day, I had some beautiful pictures taken of myself to give to my ex. I was SOOOO excited about this, as I believed HE would be SOOOOO excited when he got them. The pictures came and I showed him the proofs online. My excitement was obvious. As I showed him his gift, he responded with no feeling, saying, “You got pictures taken of yourself? For what?” I said, “For you, for Valentines Day. Aren’t they good! Do you like them?!!!” He responded, “Yeah, they’re nice. Why would you think I would want pictures of you? I mean, they’re nice, but you went and got these done?” I WAS CRUSHED!!! I repeated myself. “I thought you’d like them. Aren’t you excited? Don’t you like them? You don’t like them do you?” His response, “Yeah, you’re a pretty girl. What, this isn’t the response you were looking for, is it?” I was so confused. Response? Response? No! I just wanted him to be happy and like them. He continued, “You’re not gonna get the response from me that you want until you start acting better.”
ACTING BETTER? The words echoed in my mind over and over. Acting better? Better than what? What does he mean? Acting better? Doesn’t he know how turned upside down my world is right now? He stated, “I’ve noticed your attitude change in the past three weeks and it’s been better. It takes more than three weeks though.” I not only was crushed, I now was insulted. Who did he think he was?
Hurting
With no sincere apology, my feelings continued to get hurt. The following weekend we were supposed to go see his biological mother and aunt. He, of course, couldn’t drive, so I would be. We argued on the way to the gym before leaving for the trip. I became so enraged with his lack of consideration for me I couldn’t even look at him. We drove to Michigan and spoke none, although not for lack of trying on his part. You see, before we left my house, he tried being extra nice, stating, “I want to have a good weekend at my aunt’s.” That was IT! He didn’t care about MY feelings”¦he cared about how HE looked to his family. I couldn’t pretend”¦he did.
The weekend at his aunt’s was miserable for me as he put on a show of how lovely of a person he was. The more he pretended, the angrier I got”¦and it showed. We came home from the weekend and I wanted to talk.
I told him, through sobbing, of how badly I felt, how badly my feelings were hurt, how badly I wanted him to sooth me and comfort me. I cried and cried and sobbed and sobbed, on the verge of begging him to show me attention and affection. He did none of it. In fact, after about an hour and a half of me falling apart in front of him, he looked at me and said, “Are you done?” I couldn’t believe my ears. Again”¦am I done? He said his son was “probably” hungry and he needed to get him a sandwich. And that he did.
Moving out
The next day he came home from work and told me we needed to talk. He said, “I love you”¦I’m just not in love with you and I just realized this on my way home from work. I’m not excited to see you or be here.” I was floored! He said he hadn’t felt connected to me since November and he moved in because he felt “obligated” to. He said he felt “pressured” as I put him on a time line. He also said he didn’t want to leave me with my grandmother having just passed. He wanted to be there for me. He asked me what I wanted to do about the bills and services we had. I told him I would take care of it all. I SPECIFICALLY said, “Leave them be, I will cancel or call and take care of them.”
I helped him pack his stuff, gladly at that point. As he proceeded to pack his things, I noticed he had left some items like his electric razor, coffee pot, mountain bike and some clothes. As I pulled the coffee pot from the counter he asked, “What are you doing with that?” I said, “I’m giving it back to you. It’s not mine.” He said, “Oh, you don’t want it?” I said, “I don’t drink coffee, why would I want your coffee pot?” He said, “I thought you might want some coffee tomorrow morning.”
We met in the kitchen and he proceeded to pick a fight with me over how I never liked his son and how I was just plain old mean to him. I, again, couldn’t believe my ears and responded with, “that’s a lie and you know it. I think your son is one of the nicest kids I’ve ever met and you know that too. I don’t agree with how clingy and dependent he is, but I’ve always liked him.” At that point, he dropped THE bomb”¦
He responded with, “I don’t want to hurt you. I’m not attracted to, interested in or feeling you. I don’t even know if I like you.” And, now, it was on!
I went into my bedroom, got my keys and dog and said “I’ll take my keys now.” He was quite surprised with this request as he responded with, “What? Are you serious?” I said, “You don’t live here so you don’t need my keys. I will take them back now.” He asked how he was going to get his things (I believe he was planning on coming back the next day for his stuff). I simply said “I’ll put it all in the hallway and you can prop the bottom door open with a bag. You can get your things from the hallway. I will take my keys back.” He responded “It’s not like Im going to steal anything.” I said “I’m not saying you are. You don’t need my keys because you aren’t living here anymore so I will take them back.” With a look of absolute disgust, he took them out of his pocket and shoved them at me saying “here!”
I left with my dog and he packed his car from my hallway.
Cable bill
The next day, I received 3 texts from him TELLING ME what I needed to do about the bills as HE had already contacted Comcast and USCellular to get the information. I ignored the texts and what they said. He instant messaged me from yahoo, again TELLING ME what I needed to do and then gave ultimatums”¦ “If you don’t switch Comcast to your name I will cancel it later. It’s been five days now and you haven’t done anything. Again, you have to do things your way. I tried working with you but it has to be on your terms. I wish you the best.” Again, I didn’t respond.
Three weeks after he left, I realized he DID, in fact, steal from me! He stole my bike rack that was in the hallway! I had wondered how he got his bike home, as his car is so small that with all his bags he couldn’t have fit the bike. I found my answer!
One month later, to the day, I get another text from him simply asking, “Have you contacted Comcast yet?” I didn’t respond. Mind you, the bill and account are in HIS name. I had contacted Comcast, about 10 times, to see what my responsibility was regarding the bill and switching the service out. They assured me multiple times, I was NOT responsible for any bill as the service was in HIS name. I also could NOT switch the service out, as again, the account was in HIS name. He needed to do this.
One month later, I received another text from him telling me I have mail and he would like for me to respond by the afternoon. The email basically was an attempt at guilting me into paying for the Comcast that he hadn’t shut off yet. The bill was $200. He proceeded to tell me how he never took me as untrustworthy or dishonest. He also didn’t know how I could think “using” the cable without paying the bill was an honest thing to do. He didn’t know how I could consider myself a “good person” because of this, and he was giving me “one more chance to do the right thing and pay half the bill as its only fair because (he) wasn’t there for the month I used the cable.” I didn’t respond.
Later that day I received a phone call from him, beginning with, “I don’t know why you’re choosing to not communicate with me over the cable” and basically reiterating all that was in the email, but with such a snide, condescending tone. He again told me how “dishonest” and “untrustworthy” I am and how he never “took” me as that kind of person. He told me to call him when I got the message OTHERWISE I leave him NO OTHER option than to turn the cable off! I COULD HAVE CARED LESS! I did not respond.
He shut off the cable that night and sent me another email giving me directions on how I needed to return all the equipment (that was in his name). He told me if I chose not to return the equipment, he made sure Comcast “knew the situation” and they had now associated the account with MY address. If I did not return the equipment, he said it would be “very difficult for you to get other service at your house, as the account is now linked to your home.” It was a line of bull. I called Comcast about this and they told me “he’s telling you that because the equipment is in his name and if you don’t turn it in, he will be charged”¦like $600 for the missing equipment.” I knew it! Another game.
Almost 3 months later, I am still getting bills addressed to him from Comcast for the remainder of the bill, which, according to him, is MY responsibility. He has also gotten notices from two different collection agencies within the past week. I wonder if one of them is for the Comcast bill J
Dear Lovefraud writer, After reading your summary I was wondering if your spath & mine where one in the same person but that couldn’t be since my experience took place 30 years earlier. I too met my ex-husband spath through a dating agency & I too was told about his 2 kids he had no contact with. I was told about his son who he hadn’t seen in years.
As it turned out he was the son of the first wife I was never told about. And then I was told about his daughter who was never wanted and was conceived on a holiday binging weekend with an ex-girlfriend.
He told me that neither woman would allow him contact with either child. He told me how the mother of his daughter ran off with another man & deserted him taking the baby.
The TRUTH was that he had deserted mother & child for the woman that had preceded me. So the mother of his child moved on, found a husband who married her and adopted her child.
My ex-spath neither paid child support for either child since they had been adopted by both women’s new husbands.
He too convinced me that he had turned over a new leaf and was reformed having given up drugs & booze.
I too believed in giving someone the benefit of the doubt
and second chances. But now that I am older and wiser and more cautious I wouldn’t risk it again.
Aside from the fact I have been in a comfortable marriage for many years. But if single I would never take on the emotional baggage of a spath again. But now I know what red flags to listen to and what to watch for.
Joanie
You brought up a good thing to watch for with spaths. I have learned that whatever they tell you, it is usually the opposite. Like in your case he was saying these women would not let him see his children when in reality, he had deserted THEM. I found those type of lies with the spath’s that I dealt with also. They will always turn things around, but until you can talk to the other side, there’s no way of knowing at the time that what they are saying is not true.
Babe,
thanks for writing out your story.
I also had mine tell me: “we can’t get married because we fight too much. If you can go an entire year without fighting, then we could get married. ”
Well he stuck around for 25 years without marriage even though we fought too much for a wedding. It was a carrot dangle meant to make me acquiesce to his will. Too bad for him because when I left him, he got nothing and had no way of going after it. He threatened lawyers and legal action, but he had nothing since there were no papers to tie us together – by his OWN choice. The only thing he had done was convince me to make out my will leaving everything, including my house, to him.
LOL!
Skylar: It was a good thing you got out while the getting was good! Otherwise you may have disappeared from the face of the earth; AND HE MAY HAVE GOTTEN AWAY WITH IT!
My young daughter is currently being pursued by a wealthy older widower. Luckily she doesn’t like him and she’s listening to my advice to avoid him.
This guy’s wife died last month, UNDER MYSTERIOUS CIRCUMSTANCES!
As yet, no one has been charged but the wife just last year came into a major inheritance. So last month she blows her brains out. The gun is found on the night stand next to the bed. It was ruled a suicide. But things just don’t add up.
Such as why would a happily married woman who just inherited money kill herself?
Anyhow the guy is pursuing my unwed daughter and she’s scared. I told her to keep her distance and avoid him like the PLAGUE!
My daughter may be missing a good catch or she may not be.
In either event I don’t want my daughter being found dead down the road. So I told her to stay away. My daughter is in college and will be in a good career so I have faith she’ll find the right guy.
Joanie
Joanie:
Wow! First of all, if it was a suicide, how could the gun have been on the nightstand? Second…he is pursuing someone ONLY one month after his poor wife supposedly commits suicide?? Who does that other than someone who is NOT worthy? And if he did do it, he will most likely get away with it.
Joanie—I agree with eb92044, sounds fishy to me!!!!
Ox: I agree. I just don’t like the whole scenario. The guy maybe innocent. But I don’t want my daughter in a Drew Peterson scenario. Sometimes these guys escape justice and fool even law enforcement and then 2 or 3 wives latter they get found out. On the other hand the guy maybe totally innocent.
But in any event he sounds like an asshole and maybe he was just so dysfunctional he drove the wife to it. I believe that. That some people put out a negative aura and can drive you to drink or even suicide. In any event who goes wife looking so soon after a death? Any one with a brain would give themselves space to heal and go looking for a good quality mate.
Joanie,
I absolutely agree that going “wife hunting” a month after your wife kills herself is a “bit odd”—TO SAY THE LEAST (a little tongue in cheek here) LOL I don’t blame you at all for being suspicious of this guy and I hope that your daughter listens to you!@....... AMEN!!!!
I read this article before I read Part I, so I had somewhat of a different reaction after reading part I. Just from reading this part alone, what jumped out at me was a reminder of a 3-year relationship I was in many years ago that ended in him basically pulling away and cheating on me while we lived together. Or rather, he was having a long distance emotional affair and threw it in my face, for unknown reason. He had stopped caring, stopped respecting me, and stopped wanting me. Things had been going in that direction for a long time. I allowed it to happen and played the needy, begging woman. I begged for his attention, doing many of the things babe did. It drove him farther away. This guy was not a spath, though he certainly wasn’t the most compassionate man. I have often wondered if there is anything I could have done to redirect the relationship before it had gotten to this point, because we were once so much in love. In retrospect, I don’t know if he is really the kind of person I could have lived with forever. But it is VERY clear to me that I did not value myself in that relationship. So how could I expect him to value me?
After reading Part I, I see the added component to babe’s story – the prison record, lying about it, shady past, and so on. This guy was bad news from day 1. Babe systematically accepted these things as okay. So over time, it’s as if nothing the guy did was a deal breaker. I know I’ve been there a few times with men, and once you basically “accept” them for who they are, they could do whatever they want and you won’t see it as a red flag anymore, because you’ve already accepted their basic character. I see a combination of things happening. I see that this is a really really bad guy and probably very high on the sociopath scale. This sounds like a very dangerous person to be involved with, and babe, I hope you are in NC at this point. And the other thing I see is babe failing to value herself by watching him pull away, and instead of just pulling back and taking care of her own life, trying harder and harder to get his attention, continuing to focus more energy on him. Even with normal men, this tactic doesn’t seem to work – at least it has never worked for me.
Obviously, he is really bad news, and he has been from day one. On the other hand. in general, I can’t fault a guy for simply pulling away and losing interest. This is not necessarily a sociopathic discard, because many men do it if they sense the woman does not value herself or is leaning too far toward him to fill her needs.
All of this points to the need for us to value ourselves and put ourselves first in our own lives. I believe that doing so makes us able to have much clearer boundaries in our relationships. If we value ourselves highly, we will also attract men who will value us, rather then disrespect and discard us.
No, it’s called chasing and it NEVER works. It turns men off. They are the ones supposed to do the chasing (by nature), not us. They see that as no challenge whatsoever and become bored.
Also, I read something on here earlier in the evening. It was in one of the many articles. It rung true with me. It was talking about the con and how when we are being conned it’s because we feel like we can trust the person, but it also is because they make us feel like THEY trust US. Bingo for me. You can imagine with my X spath…he was five levels above me at the company we both worked. And he was telling me all kinds of confidential information. What better way to con me and make me feel that he must really care about me; must really trust me if he was confiding all these things in me. Ooooooh, he was good, let me tell you. Soooo cunning.