By | October 7, 2010 307 Comments

Living the Lie: the Truth Revisited

By The Front Porch Talker

“Who in the rainbow can draw the line where the violet tint ends and the orange tint begins? Distinctly we see the difference of the colors, but where exactly does the one first blendingly enter into the other? So with sanity and insanity”¦the soul would have no rainbow had the eyes no tears.” From Billy Budd (Herman Melville).

We all live the lie sometimes: everybody lies. Lying is part of the American social contract; a matter of civility and manners, in some circles. Culturally, we even eschew the truth sometimes, equating it with rudeness. Who wants to hear that they are looking old or that their appearance is less-than-stellar? While our American cultural values appear friendly—albeit naïve—to the world, we are fiercely private and “independent” about our deeper feelings. Nobody wants to seem powerless or out of control.

We all know why we lie: because it is convenient; or, maybe it is easier just to keep the peace—so we believe. Sometimes we lie by saying that everything is just fine when it really isn’t. We tell our friends that we are just fine to signify that our real feelings are private. I do feel a little better now, just saying I’m fine. In turn, they tell us the same lie—it’s quid pro quo social management. Sometimes we lie to protect others from our reality; or, to protect ourselves from our own reality. We tell ourselves that we should be fine and that by saying it aloud we will be fine.

The truth is: not all lies are equal. Some people lie because they can and because it serves them in some way. They don’t live by social rules—or any rules, except as it harms us and benefits them. They are not part of the social contract of civility or convenience. They are “people of the lie,” as Scott Peck calls them in his book of the same name. They are the narcissists and sociopaths who live among us, undetected, and wholly without a conscience. They imitate our emotions to fill the vacancy of their own. They pretend to care, to have feelings of remorse even, if it will serve their own ends.

Sociopaths run the gamut of the danger zone—from the trusted partner or friend who steals your identity and every dime you have, to the person who commits violent acts against innocent people who “trusted the wrong person.” They are the “people of the lie.” They will take everything you ever had, including your dignity, then move on to the next person, leaving us to wonder: what could we have done differently? But even that is part of the manipulation. The truth is: there was nothing you could have done, or that anybody can do, especially if they are well adept at evading the law, which most of them are.

They hurt everybody, and because we would like to believe that they are “just like us—”you know, with morals and a conscience, they continue to offend. I have known more than my share of sociopaths and others who have no discernable conscience. I’ve spent half of my life blaming myself for “letting them” harm me and people I’ve known. I always wondered why sociopaths do what they do—it’s because they can.

I am thinking now of the anniversary of the month that my college student was murdered, back in 1993. Lisa had been moving from one apartment to another, and had solicited the help of a stranger. It had been a violent death: and, it is still unsolved. She was only twenty-two years old at the time.

At a memorial service for Lisa I read the following quote, which I’d written as part of a eulogy for her.

“Who in the rainbow can draw the line where the violet tint ends and the orange tint begins? Distinctly we see the difference of the colors, but where exactly does the one first blendingly enter into the other? So with sanity and insanity”¦the soul would have no rainbow had the eyes no tears.” From, Billy Budd (Herman Melville).

The truth is: we don’t know exactly where one color in the rainbow ends and the next begins. It seems that I’ve learned a lot about the colors, which I’d like to share with you. From Lisa’s death, I learned that fear is a good thing, unless you run with it. Many of us see a person whom we fear, for whatever reason, and we bypass our intuition to let them in.

For all the violent events that I have witnessed in my life, I will name a color. Yellow is for all the charming sociopaths who made their way into our apartments, and ultimately into our lives, then betrayed us—or worse.

Red is for the raging friend in high school, Barbara, who beat-up another girl, Aileen, in my presence and in the presence of the whole school. Aileen later died of a concussion. Barbara was never charged.

Green is for Tucson, Arizona where I witnessed a murder and a near-murder. For the man who lived next door to me while I was in graduate school—a gun lover. I heard the gun go off, then saw the man dragging a woman across the bare parking lot. I reported this to the police and even showed them a puddle of blood in the parking lot, but nothing was ever done.

The Green near-murder would involve me. While living alone in Tucson in a big house on Speedway Avenue, near the center of town, I was interrupted from my writing one day. My dog never barked. Something just told me to walk through my fenced back yard and look over the gate to the narrow space in the side-yard. A man was attempting to hoist himself up and into my kitchen window. The press had called him “The Prime-Time Rapist.” As my dog and I stood there staring, in shock, he jumped down and stared back. He was maybe twenty feet away. The moment we locked eyes was the pivotal moment. We both ran, in opposite directions. That night, he was gunned-down by the police.

Purple is for the female sociopath who stole my identity and everything I had in my life, then changed her name and found somebody else to steal from. I had been a “trusted friend” for over ten years. I had helped her through her years of disability. I knew her children and her grandchild. But nothing in the world prepared me for what she would do to me. I lost my job, my retirement account, my house, and all the money and credit I had worked so hard to earn, all because I had trusted a sociopath with a very long history of scamming people.

The most difficult part for me is the trail of tears we leave behind with all of this unfinished business and grieving—for what never was. Sociopaths steal our innocence, and perhaps our naiveté too, for no particular reason and with no particular meaning. They leave us unfinished too, at least privately.

Unfinished, but not defeated. We look to some higher power to finish what we cannot. We know that pain is inevitable in life—for all of us. But suffering—that is optional. We love who we love, because we are human and we have a conscience. We love people imperfectly, then when we’ve held too long to the outcome drawn somewhere in our imaginations, we detach with love and let go to a power that some call God. Fly high and free!

In the end, I tell myself this: there are plenty more colors in a rainbow, if you look closely. Some are nuanced or muted; some appear tinted at different angles, with more or less light than when you first had seen it. Some colors form hazy borders about exactly where the colors become “blendingly into the next,” just as “sanity and insanity does.”

Truths are blendingly complex too—a sign of intimacy. Whatever we reveal to others we are also revealing to ourselves, simultaneously. The pain is tacit and unspoken. But paradoxically, we are freed of suffering and that need to control or soften things with our lies. The only truth that we can know for sure borders on solipsism: that we know that our own mind exists; all else is speculation, at best. We can only know our own private and ineffable experiences of what is or isn’t the truth. The rest is beyond us to know for sure.

And, I will repeat the words I began with: we can never really know what is in the hearts of others. We can hope against hope, but never know for sure.

I will never be the same trusting person I once was. Thank God. The muted pinks and blues and greens are becoming clearer, with more defined lines now. I know that it’s time to finish my novel, and get on with the business of living, and to honor those who, for whatever reason, weren’t as lucky as me and didn’t survive.

We may not ever really know what is in another person’s heart, but now—now that we’ve seen that vacant look; and, now that we’ve heard the superficial stories and lies that never did quite add-up, because they didn’t. Now that we are older, and probably wiser, we can cut through the artifice, the faker, the liar and cheat, the approximation of humanity—like butter, and spread it over so many slices of proverbial bread.

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kim frederick

I love this, Donna. A really nice peice of writing.

I watched something on TV last night. Not sure if it was 20/20 or 48 hrs, but it was one of those.

A young woman, about 23, I think, was home with 2 small children when she was kidnapped. Both kids were fine, found by the husband when he returned from work. They were both in the same crib, crying…but she was gone. He called 911, right away. When it hit the news, a woman called in saying she had seen a green camero sitting in the victims driveway, earlier that day. No less than three people saw this car on the highway with a very distraut young woman in the back seat, beating on the window violently. One motorist saw that her wrists were cuffed, another saw the driver lean back over the seat to hold her down. Only one motorist…a woman, actually called it in. She told dispatch exactly where the car was…There were police within a couple of miles, already looking for the green camero, but for some reason dispatched dropped the ball, the message was never sent.

The kidnapper pulled into his cousins drive-way, and when his cousin came out of the house, he asked him for a can of gas and a shovel. The cousin saw the frantic woman, hand-cuffed, pleading, asking for help, and did nothing. He later claimed that he knew his cousin liked kinky relationships. One of the motorists who didn’t report, said he didn’t want to get involved, he thought it was a domestic issue….He had his cell phone in his hand and was debating with himself, but decided not to call.

The cousin called his 17 year old daughter to tell her what had happened, she called police.They found this woman dead, having been brutally raped, buried in a shallow grave on the side of the highway, not far from where the motorist reported seeing her.

So many people are afraid to get involved, or they doubt their own instincts, and don’t report.

On two seperate occasions, I have heard heated domestic disputes while in the presence of other people, (usually men)
who will say something like,”you’re being nosey,” when I called the cops.

Just a reminder to everybody, get involved if you see a problem.


It is fine writing. The credit goes to the Lovefraud reader who posts as The Front Porch Talker.

kim frederick

Oppps. Sorry. Thanks, Frontporch talker. And thanks to you Donna, for posting it.


wow Kim! that’s horrific. There are too many people who don’t feel anything for anyone in this world.

I truly believe that 25% of the people on earth are bad people. My friend has written a book on Trust and gives lectures all over the country. We discuss sociopathy because it is the reason people can’t trust and he asks me to help him understand it. A few weeks ago he gave a lecture and handed out pointers to the audience of college students who are considered the brightest and future leaders at the school. He explained that the pointers were expensive and requested that they return the pointers at the door. After an inspirational speach about increasing trust in our daily lives, how many of the 130 pointers did he get back? 88, if I recall. I knew it would be about 75% before he even told me. Because 25% is about the percentage of people who suck, in my experience. (actual number worked out to 33% so I guess I underestimated the spaths, AGAIN! lol)

I explained to my friend that 25% of people walk around seething with envy and memetic desire. They enjoy seeing others’s pain. They feel they’ve racked up points when they get something over on someone else.
My experience of this is my P- sister and her P-husband, the trojan horse, cop, homeland security agent.
When he was just a regular patrol cop, we three, went out to a billiard hall and we witnessed a man beating his wife. Both he and my sis carry guns but didn’t want to get involved, wouldn’t even call the cops. when I told them I was personally going to stop this man (all 5’5″ 110lbs of me and no gun, just a cell phone), my BIL, not wanting to look like a pansy, finally moved forward while calling the cops and instantly was surrounded by about 10 police cars to help him subdue one fat italian man. What a wuss. The point, neither would do anything to help a petite woman who was being beaten, BUT, the moment they see someone swerve or with expired tabs, they get on their phone and call the cops. If you’re parked over 72 hours on the street or break a zoning law THEY CALL THE AUTHORITIES. This kind of behavior is a RED FLAG OF EVIL.
I just never knew what it was. Never knew why and never put it all together into one big template for P’s. I called it sick behavior, I remember feeling the need to bathe after being in their presence (that’s called getting slimed). Now I know I was in the presence of those who enjoy suffering: SADISTS.

Very nicely said, FrontPorch Talker. In the end, we learn the RED FLAGS. They can’t hide them from us forever. The woman who hurt you was grooming you for 10 years, just as a pedophile does to his victims. She had you as a potential meal ticket, watching and waiting. Now that you know more about the P’s and their red flags, can you say what else you might have noticed, if you had known what to look for? I know she was very nice – they all are, but was there any incongruent behavior?

Ox Drover

Great Article FPT!!! Thanks!~

“Don’t get involved” is an interesting concept. A new series this summer called “what would you do?” where they have a candid camera and a set up script of someone in trouble and then film how people respond and then question the people afterward and ask, “Why did you go on by?” or “why did you stop to help?” It was an interesting little series, I guess a summer fill in.

Recently though an 8 year old girl was grabbed by a pervert who pulled her into his vehicle (while others watched) and drove off, an Amber alert was issued and a man saw the truck (unfortunately after she had been raped) and followed it until the vehicle stopped and the child jumped out and was saved from death at least, and the man eventually [email protected] This man is a hero and we need MORE HEROES LIKE THIS!!!

With the number of cell phones on the street now there is NO reason for ANY observed violence to go unreported.


Is it me, or a subtle change is taking place in our culture? More and more I find that Americans I know are becoming honest and truthful. NO offense is intended in saying this. Before it was veiled by politeness and distant fake and meaningless “Fine, thank you” , but I am now surrounded by bluntness, and directness, and I value those so highly. Don’t BS me. Tell me when I look like hell, tell me when I overstep my boundaries, tell me what you like and what is in my power to change. I will do the same.
More and more people try to not be fake – is it assertiveness or dire economic burden? I am seeing a change. Maybe, it’s not so embarrassing anymore to say that you feel awful because you got laid off, or that you fear because of all we see on the news, maybe, it’s finally ok to be real. Not with the Ps though, never with the Ps….

super chic

GettingIt, maybe people feel more comfortable saying they can’t find a job… because neither can anyone else! Many people are walking around in fear, maybe it pulls people together, we’re all in this together.


Dear GettingIt,

I must respectfully disagree with your notion that “Americans are becoming more honest and truthful.” In fact, my own experience leads me to believe the exact opposite. To be sure, your point about the virtues of forthrightness and openness is well taken. However, what I sense in today’s culture is rather a general breakdown of civility, than a shift towards greater honesty and authenticity.

One can witness this especially on the “comments” section of any discussion forum, as well as on things like Youtube. Indeed, it never ceases to amaze me how crass and vulgar we have become. For example, I bet if you looked up a video on Superstring Theory or The Sermon on the Mount on Youtube (or whatever other “elevated” topic one chooses), I can almost GUARANTEE you that within ten comments someone will be calling someone else a “Stupid retard” “Whore” “dumb ass bitch”, etc. etc. Even on this site we see the same sort of thing. (And don’t even get me started on those revolting Reality Shows where incivility is glorified to an extent that would have been unimaginable twenty years ago!)

At any rate, I think that when we cease to ACT in a polite and courteous fashion, the moral nature is inevitably coarsened. Conversely, I often find that when we do act kindly and exhibit good manners, it actually makes us FEEL the corresponding emotions (of which courtesy is like the outward shell and body). When we smile at someone and tell them to “Have a good day”, we may not literally feel it at the moment when we say it; but I think ultimately that sort of good natured civility serves as the “glue” which binds us more closely to our fellow human beings. And for me, there is more “truth” in acting thus, then there is in the overly free expression of our subjective feelings and judgments (especially the negative ones). It’s like the old saying “It ain’t all about you” (by which I don’t mean “you”, my dear GettingIt, but people in general). Well, what is courtesy, after all, but the formal way of expressing “It ain’t all about me”?

Besides, it annoys the hell out of me when someone (usually under 25, I’m thirtysomething) walks past me in a hallway and doesn’t nod or say hello. Even if I’d just lost my entire family in a housfire, I can promise you, I’ll still say hello! But that’s exactly my point: courtesy is the outer discipline which molds and refines our selfish animal nature into something less unseemly. (I realize that there are exceptions to this rule, i.e., the people who use the outward forms to manipulate, etc. But even so, I think what I’m saying is still largely applicable to the rest of us.) And in light of current cultural trends, I think wisdom lies rather in embracing a greater restraint (in our behavior, interpersonal interactions, etc.) than less. And if you don’t see the wisdom in that, then you’re just a dumbass retard anyway, and besides, who gives a f**k what you think?! (ha ha)

At any rate, I laughed when I read Skylar’s comment about 25% of the population being “bad” – I would have said 19% myself! (though what’s a mere 6% between friends, eh?!) Ah well, it’s hard not to be a bit cynical when our entire civilization is pretty much collapsing before our eyes. And what is a cynic, after all, but an idealist who’s been mugged by Reality?


Point well taken. I should have not generalized. It was my immediate surroundings that I was commenting on, my professional world and even the neighbors. I dislike fake smiles and fake “how are you?s” Whenever asked, I turn and regardless of my mood, my state of mind and my ability to spend any time with that person, I respond: ” Do you really want to know”. Very rarely do I hear a YES. Usually it is some shocked muffled response. I will not tell you how I am doing unless you are genuinely interested. I won’t ask unless I am prepared to give you 10 minutes of my undivided attention. So, perhaps my views are subjectives: I am surrounding myself with honest “”real” people and not afraid to call their BS if they fall into that pattern.

Ox Drover

Dear Constantine and Gettingit,

Constantine, I totally agree with your well thought out and articulated article…and I had to BELLY laugh when “if I didn’t see the wisdom in that, then I’m a dumbass retard anyway, and besides who give s a fark what I think anyway?” LOL ROTFLMAO

“Good manners” is the oil that helps our stones of civilization slide together without creating sparks. I think it is the rare person who passes a stranger or almost stranger and they say ‘Hi, how are you?” that for one second thinks that comment is LITERAL. It isn’t in my opinion less than “honest” it is just not LITERAL, it is polite MANNERS.

Good Manners statements or questions are not meant to be taken LITERALLY. That doesn’t make them “dishonest” though because everyone knows they are NOT literal, they are superficial language that says in reality, “I acknowledge that we have passed each other and made eye contact.” It is the sound I make to acknowledge that. ON the surface the “meaning” of the words indicate that I care about your status as a human being, but in reality, I am only acknowledging your humanity. (Note, think about this, if the person you are passing by and make eye contact with looks HORRIBLE OR CRITICALLY ILL, you would not say these words, “How are you?” but might say “good day” or simply “Hi” because it was very OBVIOUS the person was NOT “okay.”

Getting it, I also see your point, with people closer to me, if you want to know how I am, ASK, and if you don’t, then don’t ask. Be UPFRONT with me and let the superficial questions and TRITE “good mannerisms” go.

Sometimes though, people we THINK might really want to know, don’t want to know. I think this is one of the commonalities of people who have been victimized by psychopaths and have a NEED to share this intimate grief with people they consider as CLOSE friends. Sometimes those people we CONSIDERED close are not really as close as we thought…they say they want to know, (manners) but in truth, they are simply being polite.

Instead of saying “Look, I really don’t care about all that emotional turmoil you are going through, I don’t want to be bothered, but I can’t say that or I will hurt your feelings and my mom told me to be polite to others.” So they will continue to be “polite” and “superficial” until we finally “get it” that they really either can’t get it, or actually don’t care deeply about us enough to be our sounding board. Sometimes THAT hurts as much as the damage done by the psychopath. It makes us ultimately realize who really cares among our friends and who is just a superficial acquaintence instead of a FRIEND!



Your writing style is very familiar to me. I am guessing UK? I don’t see any “favourites” or “behaviours” in your post (the British spelling usually gives it away).

Anywho, your post generated these thoughts in me- 0oh nooo, she says 🙂 :

Where I come from (I won’t divulge for privacy purposes) it is not unusual to display a “get the f outta my face” attitude as a matter of survival. We are good people and will jump to help one another but I believe “civility” is relative. To show the level of “civility” that some groups have come to expect only connotes weakness to other cultures/communities. We must be careful to avoid ethnocentric expectations.

In other words, what looks like a class act to a group of highbrows could be considered p###sies to others as in the case of where I hail from.

Same goes for talking to or acknowledging strangers. In my neck of the woods, asking someone “how are you”? randomly, might get an “why do you wanna know?” kind of response. I try to keep in mind that all is relative and one man’s cuppa tea is another man’s pint of beer.

I think that we are programmed to act “civil” by what we have been fed on as children (in the developmental years). As a boomer, what I saw in film, TV, etc was a very cleaned up media but behind the scenes people were just as crass (perhaps less so in public due to societal pressure much like the spaths we discuss on this site-decorum is learned behavior).

As kids we got a kick out of watching Andy, Opie and Barney ohhing and ahhing over Aunt Bea’s pie while sitting on the porch in idyllic Mayberrry. Then we went out to play on some mighty dirty, rough streets, kicking ass all along the avenue in order to survive in the real world. My main point being: I don’t allow what media generates to color my world. But I hear you. Reality TV is insulting to my intelligence. I lived it-don’t want to be entertained by it.

Doesn’t mean we were manner-less or without teaching in the home (my mother made sure we did not use the colloquialisms that were common on our streets within her hearing) but we are all products of our environments. After years of fighting as a youngster, in my adulthood I became a pacifist but that old fighting broad is still in me and like the saying goes “you can take the girl out of the ___________ but you can’t take the ______ out of the girl. You fill in the blank. My belief system keeps me kind most of the time! 🙂

What we are seeing now on TV, films is probably what has always lurked in the minds of humans but the masks are stripped away and we are seeing the real face of society as it has always been. Wasn’t it over 100 years ago that Jack the Ripper scared the shite out of everyone?

Just my opinion as a menopausal sociologist hahah. Could be worse. I could be a menopausal psychologist!

I enjoy reading your posts. I like the way you express yourself. It’s refreshing!


sorry to stray from the subject: of being victimized by spaths.

Sometimes it does help to know how we (the LF community members) were formed in order to better empathize in our attempts to offer our help.

jane smith

Dear Lovefraud Community,
Thank you for being here to read day after day.
I am not sure where to post this so i will try here.

After 2+ years of no contact, i sent a note to the SP. It was a happy birthday note. With basically just that wish, no questions no desire to see him expressed.

I had been thinking about him alot and this was the way i decided to rationalize culminating those thoughts – sending the note.

We had a tumultous off and on relationship for years with basically no violence, none directed at me personally.
A couple months after I last saw him, I forgave him in my mind and lost most of the anger – and realized my part.

Because i have very low self esteem and from a purely logical standpoint, I decided to take alot of the blame for not being done with him sooner and/or sorting out that he had this disorder. I am smart and should have thought to look into this. Since I consider myself smart i wish i had discovered the reality of what was happening sooner so I could have changed what I expected from him and turned this situation around.

For a long time i just called it alcoholism and at the end I became obsessed with the idea he should go to rehab.

If i was healthy this would never have gone this far. My story is very long but the gist is I considered him my soulmate even tho he treated me as anything but, and he had the known classic tendencies. No goals, parasytic behavior, manipulating and lying, cruelty and taking alot that i gave with only giving back to me just enough so i would wait for that next bone to be thrown.

The reason I am writing is my life is a shambles and I dont know where to turn. Certainly this traumatic situation and my knowing that I could have ended this sooner for good, or changed my reactions enough to not have felt it necessary to kick him out, has played a large part in my current situation, but not all completely. I lost my job for many months until recently and i had ALOT of time on my hands to reflect on how i have handled my life.

I am very aware this may sound very fucked up what i have written to members on this board. But i keep coming back to it and its the only logical analysis i can feel is right.
Since I went NC i became very healthy complete with ending bad habits, losing weight, volunteering extremely regulary for a well known non profit, and taking on a very time heavy exercise regime, and working at a job.

However all these huge changes in a way has only made me realize how unhappy i really am and how much unnecessary space i am taking up. I lost alot of friends and spend alot of time isolated. i feel so ashamed of this it permeates most of my day, and unless I am actually in the moment of exercise, i feel nasty and like a complete loser.

The Sp wrote back wishing me well, and saying he has no interest in being in touch again. And he is right. I wonder if he has changed – but since he actually recieved a sociopath/anti social diagnosis from a doctor, my brain says that is probably unlikely.

I did not expect him to write me back – I had just written because I felt compelled to do it for me somehow – to show him all is forgiven and what not. I know it was against everything this board teaches. But i cant stop loving him and I feel I will never be able to have a decent life and i am almost 40 yrs old.

Thank you in advance for letting me be candid, and reading what i know is pretty depressing.
thanks again for this board.

Ox Drover

Dear Jane smith,

(((((Jane)))))) I’m sorry you are hurting sweetie, but I am SOOO GLAD that you came back here.

Remember ErinB’s (I think it was her) with th e”fake it til you make it?” Well you seemed to have REALLY LEARNED to “fake it” but now you realize that JUST FAKING it, and NOT FEELING it isn’t very satisfactory so NEXT STEP—think about getting some professional counseling.

I can SURE relate to the FAKE it part (NOT like a psychopath fakes it, let me clarify that!) but the WHAT WOULD THE NEIGHBORS THINK? kind of faking it, keeping up an “all is well” front, a “we are normal” front, a “don’t let’em see you bleed” front—putting too much importance on the OUTSIDE—oh, yes, I was raised at my egg donor’s knee on that one. It was and IS still hard to overcome–a lifetime of training.

You’ve done the BIGGEST and hardest part, Janie, you have RECOGNIZED what is going on.

The FANTASY he presented to you, that’s what you “love” and even a “good reality” doesn’t measure up to that “fantasy” but I think you are BIGGER AND BETTER than that fantasy!!!! I think you are on the cusp of some NEW DISCOVERIES! SOME NEW WONDERS!!!! So hang in there and be prepared for some new and wonderful discoveries!!!! (((Hugs))) and God bless!

Ox Drover

Dear Adamsrib,

WHAT A MARVELOUS slant you put on the “polite society” and the “social” ways we respond. Thank you!!!!

I had seen the same thing, yet hadn’t “clicked” like you did on that point. Example. Years ago when I was in New Orleans (mid-60s) the “public” shows were pasties and G-strings and “titillating,” but not what I would call “nasty”–years later later, I went back and it was what I considered “Nasty”. (Sort of the differences between “EARLY Playboy” and “Later HUSTLER” magazines.) I knew it was different, and I knew I was uncomfortable but didn’t actually click on the WHYs.

Different cultures have evolved in different ways, for example Japanese culture is “super polite, and structured polite” because so many people living in such a tight space had to be in order to survive. NYC on the other hand has evolved differently. And there have been GREAT Changes in our overall US culture of politeness, or lack there of, and over what is publicly (or privately) allowable and what it not.

Premarital sex, openly living together before marriage or commitment, single parents, openly gay, gays adopting children, gay children adopting, gays in the military, casual sexual encounters, and I could go on. We know almost none of these things is “new” to the culture, but they have been kept “hidden” or in the background or openly denied, but are no longer being denied or hidden now.

Unfortunately, much of the “openness” of this allows the psychopaths I think to flourish more easily with less cultural condemnation or consequences.

Thanks for your keen eye and pointing out the (what should have been obvious) to me! I really do appreciate your great posts!!! You and Constantine together make a great pair!!!! BTW “how are you today?” LOL (((hugs)))))


“However all these huge changes in a way has only made me realize how unhappy i really am and how much unnecessary space i am taking up. I lost alot of friends and spend alot of time isolated. i feel so ashamed of this it permeates most of my day, and unless I am actually in the moment of exercise, i feel nasty and like a complete loser.”

Jane, your above comment basically sums up my life right now. I feel great when exercising or otherwise active; otherwise, I feel quite lonely and depressed, although not exactly a loser.

I view my relationship with a sociopath as a blessing in disguise, as it made me confront issues unrelated to him, the very issues which allowed me to chose beginning a relationship with him, despite all the red flags. Part of confronting those issues was the realization that many in my life had to go or be kept at a distance. In addition, a serious heath problem prevented me from participating in sports at a high level, thus furthing my isolation.

You statement is also your solution as well as mine: STOP ISOLATING AND MAKE NEW FRIENDS. START NEW HOBBIES.

I know this is easier said than done, but it is the solution. Humans are social animals not meant for isolation. It is a vicious cycle: depression causes isolation which furthers depression which furthers isolation…

Regarding your x-spath, in my isolation I often think of him. However, while I thought about contact several times, the last being right before open heart surgery, I never contacted him. I am intellectually glad, perhaps not emotionally. Sociopaths do not change. Besides, he has had nearly two years to contact me. What does that say?

Maybe you are better off that you did contact him, as his reply is clear — he is not interested. Now, stop isolating, take all that you have learned and move on with your life. This is what I am doing, finally.

I am sick and tired of being sick and tired.


Hi Jane,
glad you reached out to LF. This is normal for you to feel this way. You are doing great, exercising and preparing yourself.
Look at all you have accomplished, not on what you haven’t, because you are not God and you can’t judge where you should be and what you should have done. You know that He has his plan for you and you were meant to carry this cross for a little while and with our help here at LF. Turn your burden into the tuition you must pay to emerge better on the other side – the school of hard knocks is expensive but it’s the most complete education you’ll find.
I think I remember you had a baby. How is he?

jane smith

thanks very much for your responses.

ox drover, you are right i absolutely need counselling. In the past insurance never covered it and when i could manage to go for sliding scale, i dropped it because it was too painful and i thought it wasnt for me. however it could be the only solution. and i actually hadnt realized that what i was doing was Faking It. this is eye-opening, I hope i am on the cusp of not wasting anymore time and i appreciate you saying so.

blue eyes – i too am sick and tired of being sick and tired. very tired. i think my psyche is fighting between moving on (which i have not succeeded at) and giving up completely – so thank you for sharing that you are in a similar place and that you are able to move on.

skylar, thanks for your kind words. i actually have only posted here once or twice and do not have a baby.
i actually dont believe in god and the plan he may have, but i have often thought about the concept of burden and tuition thing. i feel i have went to this school for a long time and ‘earned’ something nicer now by this point time. however since that hasnt happened, that is why i am still feeling like death warmed over. i have tried very hard for a long time to mindful of karma and to practice non-attachment to the result of my actions, but its not working out well or at least yet.

thanks to you all for listening and helping



Trying to move on. It is not easy especially since I have too much time on my hands. But I keep trying.

I hope you feel better. Do anything to get out. More gym classes, a new hobby, volunteer… anything.


Jane, I guess I had you mixed up with another Jane on LF.
But Behind Blue Eyes said it very well, “I view my relationship with a sociopath as a blessing in disguise, as it made me confront issues unrelated to him, the very issues which allowed me to chose beginning a relationship with him, despite all the red flags. Part of confronting those issues was the realization that many in my life had to go or be kept at a distance.”
That is so true. The sociopath does force us out of our comfort zone thats for sure. It make us look at the lack of moral fibre in society and sometimes, in ourselves. Why do we (individually and as a society) make excuses for bad behavior? Why do we accept the crap the sociopaths dish out? Who and what does that make us?
Comments by Adamsrib and Constantine are really on the mark, though they seem contrary, they aren’t. Because what we say and do is not as relevant as the intent, compassion, and thought behind those words/actions.
I’m grateful to LF for providing a place where people can help eacho ther move forward towards a more adult and enlightened way of living. Without the sociopath I’d never have ended up here.

Ox Drover

Sky, That is why most dishes we eat are not just ONE item in the dish, but multiple items whose flavors compliment each other even though they are different. Or even opposite, like sweet and sour, or some other thing that sounds like a contradiction, but together it is so good.

Jane, glad that I didn’t offend you, it was just that your situation made me think of my own of “fake it til you make it” and it is the “what would the neighbors think” part that is more important than the REALITY of what is going on. External appearances are NOT what are important, I am learning so late in life, but it is never too late.

Lots of people I think who APPEAR to “have it all” are empty inside, and there was a poem I studied in English Lit in school that was about that—KIM WHERE ARE YOU??– (she’s a lit major) and how the man SEEMED so happy to his friends and neighbors and seemed to have everything, but “last night he killed himself” sort of thing.

Look at Mel Gibson, he APPEARS (or did) to have everything fame, money etc and he is MISERABLE (probably a P too) and all the other rich famous “stars” and they are so miserable and drug addicted in and out of rehab, jail etc.

The “spiritual” aspect of ourselves as humans Ii don’t think necessarily depends on a belief in a God or god, but on the “spirit” within us that makes us US. I think part of the difference between us and “them” is that our spirit is caring and theirs is selfish. Hang in there Jane! It is a journey not a destination to peace! Enjoy the ride, and yes, it will be somewhat painful at times, but still good! Keep coming back here! There are kindred spirits here to help support your journey!


Jane – I am going to ponder why you sent him a note. Not sure if I understand, not that it matter’s. But I want to give you a big HUG and Jane you never were or never will be a loser..You are one of the bright stars I see at night – the one I named my JaneSmith star. She helped me see the light a few years ago..sorry you feeling so low – but you shine brighter than you will ever know……..henry


Dear Jane –

i read your post carefully. i am not a medical professional, but girl your depression shines through. i know you are in deep pain – but the pain of your life will not be erased by mixing it up with an external pain.

i don’t think it’s the shame of being spathed that you are dealing with – i think it’s the lies that depression tells us about our selves. the beating going on inside your own head is chemical.

i got out of a bad illness caused depression at 41. It’s so very possible to do.

you are doing much to care for yourself, but girl, you need a hand. please talk to your doctor and find a counselor pronto. take this seriously – because 6 months for now your life could be SO much better.

we are rooting for you. even if you can’t feel the care others have for you – be it personal or impersonal. there is a battalion of battleaxes out here who fight every day to value ourselves and make the best lives we can – and we know what this shit is like.

take a piece of my hope; trust me, it is possible for this to change. you don’t even have to trust yourself or dharma yet – you need to touch the ground and there is only samsara in depression. you probably can’t meditate your way out of it. it will help and don’t stop – but you need to descend into ego before you can transcend it, and depression creates LIES within us, distorting our perceptions of ego and mind.

best wishes,
one step



I responded to you on Legal Abuse Syndrome because I have been having technical problems with my posts going poof. Emailed Donna so she is aware. I tried twice on this one???


Your spath is not interested right now because he is probably very busy scamming a slew of others. Be very glad you are not in that revolving door. My bet is when his supply runs out he will come looking for you. I would run like the Devil himself is chasing me. Sometimes we get nostalgic and lonely and go back for more. That’s OK to feel that way. I have done that very thing and was sorry after wards. Don’t do it, dear. Hang tough!! (((hugs)))

super chic


jane smith

dear everyone – thanks so much again.

i think i thought awhile back i was totally done dealing with the SP. then i got the bad idea of sending the note, because like one step writes – the depression creates alot of lies. lies that i will say are lies right now – but sometimes i believe them.

skylar – you have echoed something my yoga teacher friend continually tells me – we are not our actions, we are the awareness behind them.

one step – that was a very inspirational post you wrote. i absolutely have depression, and used to take medication that made me put on weight so i stopped.
u wrote something so profound – one must descend into ego to transcend it. that makes so much sense that i wish there was a manual on how to do just that!

i am going to be more proactive to deal with depression which is clearly my main problem and what led me to years of disfunctionality with someone who was able to manipulate me.

i was able for about a year to think back only on the good times, so i need to get back to this place. even if i have to fake it for now.

jane smith

hens – thanks so much for the hugs – i do want to be bright again like i once was a long time ago.

super chic

erin1972, just wanted to say hi in case you stop by here.

Ox Drover

Dear Jane,

I can relate to the “gaining weight” on antidepressasnts, but the bottom line is that the medication does NOT make us eat too much, and if we EAT MORE THAN WE BURN WE GAIN WEIGHT! I’ve gained 10 pounds a year for the 6 years I have been on AD and I am having to take myself in hand and get my eating patterns adjusted, but there is NO WAY I would quit the medication.

Just as diabetes is a hormonal imbalance so is depression and just as diabetes requires a patient to SELF MANAGE food and exercise (and sometimes medication) so does depression.

There are SELF CARE things we need to do for depression, eat right, exercise and get therapy and sometimes medication. All the medication in the world for depression won’t help if we don’t do the other things too. Same with diabetes!

I spent a great deal of my working life in small rooms in clinics advising others how to SELF CARE for diabetes and/or depression so now it is TIME FOR ME TO TAKE MY OWN ADVICE. To eat right (and the right amount) and exercise and (the right amount) and Do the SELF CARE that is necessary for my HEALTH. Both physically and mentally. It is a full time job for some of us sometimes, but it is WORTH IT in the end, because otherwise we are not going to live a life worth living.

Just as diabetes can kill a person one leg and one organ system at a time, so can DEPRESSION! It ruins everything it touches but it is definitely a DO IT YOURSELF CARE PLAN. We may need the coaching of a medical professional and/or medication, but in the end, success for failure doesn’t depend on the medical professional but on us as PATIENTS!

That is one reason LF is so wonderful we have the ON LINE support of others to encourage us to do the self care we need! So hang in there, you’re on the right [email protected]!! (((Hugs))))


I think that Love Fraud party is long over due. I grieve for my friends like JaneSmith when we are down and in the dumps. It is such a struggle for us to learn to live again or live with some peace and happiness. So many of us have had life long struggles to feel something close to normal and happy. And then we meet these parisites that farck with our mind’s and emotion’s for their amusement and benifit. I guess trying to understand is impossible, it’s more about coping and hoping time will erase the memories. I think we learn so much about ourselves because of them, but they remain the reason for such a huge change in our life. The change isnt bad, but at such a cost.. Ok Janie get out your fairy dust, crank up the volume and let’s dance…fairy dust for everyone ~!


dude, i think i need to find my stash of fairy dust. damn spath.

can’t last long typing laying down. damn muscle spasms in my back.

i just watched inglorious basterds. whoa. I want a movie like that about spath revenge. yah, i know, best not to harbor resentments…snicker………

i’ll take a dusting dear hens ….in purple and green please.

super chic

Hens, I think this is a different jane smith, the other one is JaneSmith,
I was a bit confused at first.
Jeez, I so relate to everything you wrote!!!!!!!!
It freaks me out, I feel like you are reading my mind!
Sprinkle some fairy dust on my brain! Thanks!

Ox Drover

I’m not sure what I thought about that movie “inglorious bastards”–in a way it was a caricature and in a way it was “campy” but the subject was so serious and the violence so real….my son D liked it very much but I can’t make my mind up about whether I like it or not. Some days I think I do and other days I’m not sure.


Hello, nice to hear from you. You’re right. party on!
The lovefraud gang is growing everyday. And there are others like us. eventually it will be so big that the sheer numbers will outweight the Spaths. Yep, the parasite always ends up killing it’s host or being killed by it. Their strategy is flawed. We need to be prepared for the day when we finally say NO MORE! and it is coming.
Problem is, the only thing that gets people to join our group is the tragedy of a sociopathic encounter. Without that, you’d never even imagine what it’s like. So pain is part of it. What doesn’t kill us makes us stronger.


will the real JaneSmith please stand up? I am totallly confused – where is the Jane Smith that dance’s and sprinkles fairy dust? Sorry your back is out 1steprs, and I know what you mean by ‘out’…I sneezed a few days ago and was out of commission for three days…Shabby shab – lean in close too your monitor and I shall boink ya gently with fairy dust ~~~!!!


Hi Skylar I have been reading your post , good to see you back, I guess I will never go away..Ox I thot that movie your talkin about was violent, never was a fan of brad pitts anywho..two thumbs down for me..


oxy – i love tarrantino. his camp, his humor, his cartoon characters…but watching this i forgot it was tarrantino until the extreme close-up on the evening shoe.

it was the ‘no holds barred’ aspect of the movie that appealed to me. this would have been true before the spath too…but the idea of an elite killing squad speaks very directly to my desire for one to get rid of spaths. i know that you are not for the death penalty and understand the sound reasoning behind that, and that although you are tough, and a tough talker, you are also against vigilante justice.

but i am not joking when i often say, ‘spaths, can’t live with them, and can’t kill them with impunity.’

i know we are different in this way, and i respect your point of view – and i don’t mean that i respect our differences; my p.o.v. was similar to yours before the spath.

not now. i am different now, and i can understand the true feelings that would motivate real people to do what the characters did in inglorious basterds. because of the heinous nature of the genocide of the jews in nazi germany, people can easily accept the elite team in i.b. – and tarrantino manipulates that. whether that is right or wrong, you go for the ride with a film maker, or you don’t. he took me somewhere i wanted to go…to spath killing land, albeit in fantasy.


g’ night all…sleep tight, dream well.


Dear Oxy and Adamsrib,

Please forgive the delay in my posts – I don’t have Internet access at home and often go for days on end without a computer. (And when I get time to respond, the thread has often moved far beyond the topic that was under discussion.) Anyhow, thanks for your kind words about my post (I’m actually from the Eastern US, to answer adamsrib’s question!). I would add that I likewise find much humor and wisdom in the various things you (and several others) have written on this site. So it goes both ways.

GettingIt – your point is likewise well-taken. As an admirer of Holden Caulfield, I do appreciate people who (and adamsrib makes a similar point that you do) fight against “phoniness” and “superficial BS”. In fact, I would probably take an instant liking to someone who, if I said “Good Morning” to them, asked me “What the hell is so good about it?” But I think Oxy did an excellent job of fleshing out the meaning of my words – which I don’t think are opposed to your own in spirit.

Jane Smith – Yes, it is amazing how a single birthday card can dredge up so many bad memories and negative emotions! However, you don’t need anyone to tell you that that was a bad idea, because you’ve clearly said as much yourself. Nevertheless, I often wonder how much mischief has been caused by the whole notion of “soulmates.” Perhaps we would do better if we just went back to the old fashioned arranged marriage thing!

In any case, it seems to me that what you “love” about this fellow has almost nothing to do with him, and everything to do with the falsely idealized image that you’ve projected on to him. In other words, all the good, poetic, and loveable stuff is coming from within you, and has little or nothing to do with your ex. (I can speak authoritatively about this as it’s something I’m terribly guilty of myself!)

The more you realize this, the more you will be liberated from his toxic spell. Unfortunately, the chameleon-like nature of the sociopath often makes him uniquely suited to serve as the object of our projections. And for the romantic dreamer types, it’s damned easy to to make the most soulless creatures imaginable into sublime and flawless Romeos and Juliets. But seeing how this works is the first step in ridding ourselves of the illusion. And it is most certainly an illusion.

It takes time, but the pain ALWAYS lessens. My God, you’re only 40 years old! Send this joker packing in your thoughts AND your actions, and realize you have your whole life in front of you. Don’t let him steal even more time and joy from you!


Guys forgive me for chiming in on a total unrelated subject but just needed to talk. This morning i feel like my stomach is in my throat and like Im about to throw up. cant eat cant sleep cant do anything.

I’ve been here for a good while just trying to recover from the sp that was in my life. i eventually ran into a guy on an internet dating site that caught my attention. I eventually realized that so many things about him were exactly like the sp. Bad boy mentality, etc. They even had the SAME birthday. It was totally weird.

I met this guy for the first time and had sex with him (even though that was totally out of my realm!) i felt like their was a connection but I believe it was only bc i wanted him to be the sp.

The new guy is no catch. Probably worse than the sp. conceited, self motivated, only cares about himself, but I’ve made a total jackass of myself. now this guy thinks Im some crazy person…..what the hell is wrong with me. Now, even though I know this new person is no catch I have the same feelings toward him that I did the sp. He told me that I would get addicted to him and I did in just 2 or 3 weeks. What is going on? I just don’t understand my obsession with these types.

I keep thinkin im on the right track but today i feel like it started all over again.

Someone – anyone……plese help!! how can i forget all this shit and live a normal life?

Ox Drover

Dear Sarasims,

It’s good to see you are back, but sad to say, needing to be back.

QUOTE QUESTION: What is going on? I just don’t understand my obsession with these types.

ANSWER: Okay, Sara, you asked. The problem is not HIM it is YOU trying to hang on to a DREAM of a PLAY that is not real, and you just lost one ACTOR so you replaced that ACTOR and the PLAY goes on. You play the female romantic lead and he plays the CHEATING ROMEO SEX STUD and the PLAY GOES ON.

You are setting yourself up for a life of DRAMA and PAIN…and until you CLOSE THIS PLAY it will keep on playing. It will never make Broadway but it will CONSUME YOUR LIFE AND RAP YOU IN MISERY FOR THE REST OF YOUR DAYS.

This is NOT something you have no control over….you are doing it to yourself darling. BUT at the same time it is like an addiction, GET PROFESSIONAL HELP.

None of what I’ve said may be what you want to hear, but it is sort of like someone with a hammer hitting themselves in the thumb repeatedly and then crying because their thumb hurts. STOP HITTING YOURSELF—throw away the hammer.

He may be causing the pain, but YOU are the one saying “Here, here! Psychopath, PICK ME!!!! I VOLUNTEER TO BE YOUR VICTIM!”

You are not a moth and he is not a flame, but he is DANGER! GET AWAY!! (sorry about mixing the metaphors so much!)

Sara, you are a smart woman, and you are well educated about psychopaths, please, sweetie, get some help and get AWAY from this man. ONLY YOU can save yourself from yourself! (((hugs))) and God bless.

Ox Drover

Dear Constantine,

Glad to know why your posts are sporadic. I really do enjoy them, wish you posted more! your writing is very spot on. Don’t let the fact that the thread has moved on stop you from commenting on a post…just go back and say something like, “to comment on your post of October 2 at 3:30 p.m……xyz”


Dear Oxy….I know your right. I know your right. I don’t know how to close that door. It is an addiction. And you can’t take a pill to make it go away. I just don’t know how to make it stop. I want it to. I want to live a good, happy and NORMAL life like i used to because all this craziness started. But I don’t know how to be me anymore.


Mornin’ Ox!! 🙂


How the H are ya? ( I know you won’t maddog me if I ask) 🙂

I want to comment on your statement on the “soulmate” phenomenon that we are bombarded with in our culture of Romantic Love, the boyfriend/girlfriend cult etc.

First, Oxy NAILS it here:

ANSWER: Okay, Sara, you asked. The problem is not HIM it is YOU trying to hang on to a DREAM of a PLAY that is not real, and you just lost one ACTOR so you replaced that ACTOR and the PLAY goes on. You play the female romantic lead and he plays the CHEATING ROMEO SEX STUD and the PLAY GOES ON.

You are setting yourself up for a life of DRAMA and PAIN”and until you CLOSE THIS PLAY it will keep on playing. It will never make Broadway but it will CONSUME YOUR LIFE AND RAP YOU IN MISERY FOR THE REST OF YOUR DAYS.

Bravo!! Take a bow Ox.. Amazing way of tellin it girl.

Anam Cara (pronounced hara) in Irish means “soul friend”. The late John O’ Donohue (he was a former Irish priest) writes on this subject quite beautifully. He says in his book “Anam Cara” the soulfriend could be one’s child, a teacher, a parent and yes a love partner, but not always.

Where we take the notion to the extreme (as we have a tendency to do with everything in this country IMHO) is we fuse the idea of the “soul friend” with the storybook mentality that we are fed as children. “Happy ever after” bullshit. “Some day my prince will come”.

Well, Lady Di’s Prince did come and she’s no longer with us. God rest her lovely soul. ((iiiiii)).

You say:

“But seeing how this works is the first step in ridding ourselves of the illusion. And it is most certainly an illusion.”

OMG Constantine this ties directly into what Oxy said about the play actors. You must have gotten her memo 🙂

Spot on, spot on!!


“In any case, it seems to me that what you “love” about this fellow has almost nothing to do with him, and everything to do with the falsely idealized image that you’ve projected on to him. In other words, all the good, poetic, and loveable stuff is coming from within you, and has little or nothing to do with your ex. (I can speak authoritatively about this as it’s something I’m terribly guilty of myself!)”

Don’t we all do this? Until we realize that we are spinning our wheels in a false script as Oxy points out so amazingly well as she always does. Just zeros right in on it!!

This is a VERY important theme in dealing with spath victims. The poetry and roses shite gets us every time: like Lucy pulling the football away from Charlie Brown only much more sinister in nature.

I always enjoy hearing what you have to say!


Ox Drover

Dear Sara,

(((Hugs)))) Monday morning you get to a professional counselor, and you STOP seeing that man. If the only way you can stop is to get inpatient treatment, you do it. It is important you stop this NOW ASAP!

This isn’t just a “sexual addiction” (and there are groups for that) but it is very self destructive.

No there is no pill for stopping any kind of addiction, it takes work on your part, and acknowledging that you must have help as well. Keep on coming here. There is support here, but you also, I think, need real life support more than we can give you here. Keep on reading there today. Knowledge is power, but we must pllug in to that power! (((Hugs))) and my prayers for you.



A few years ago I was feeling down and lonely and I was on I met a guy and we had a nice date. The second date he invited me to his house and he cooked dinner and we ended up in the sack. Nothing came of it after that. It was a booty call for me AND him.

Although Shit Happens, if I had an UNDO button like my computer, I would change that scenario. It WAS NOT ALL THAT!! He coulda been a murderer or given me HIV. Damn, what was I thinking? I have ALWAYS regretted that because it was not in my make up either to do something like that.

Throwing caution to the wind, in the old days, seemed sophisticated and maturing. Today it is STOOPID!! And potentially deadly.

Did I learn?

Nope, Just a few weeks ago I got involved with a spath. Tho it took several months of “getting to know him”, I had unprotecetd sex with him after getting stoned on pot!!

I am a professional, educated woman. But I was STOOPID. Depression and loneliness does this to us. Throw in heartbreak and we are toast!

I found this site while researching the spaths tendencies. I knew he was not right but did not have a label for him.

Listen to Oxy. She is SO RIGHT ON!!

I am now determined to never let myself get hit with that STOOPID stick again. I am just hoping and praying I don’t have any STD’s. Condoms don’t always work either.

Commitment and monogamy is the only way. Hey I am a product of the late sixties, early seventies. I wish the free love thing still applies but it DOES NOT. And there is a reason for it.

I just need to listen to that still, small voice that tells me to LOVE MYSELF more than the CREEPS!!

Blessings to you Sara (((iiii))


Ox Drover

Top of the moring to you as well, Adam’s rib. I slept long and well so am in about as close to the top of the form as I’m due to get at this age! LOL

Having closed my theater-playhouse for the duration, life is quiet here on the farm, without either a great many highs or lows any more. Not boring by any means, as there are always interesting things going on, but not things that stress us out, or cause frequent adrenaline rushes.

Sometimes I miss the adrenaline rushes, but not the way I was getting them for sure. There are ways to get the rushes we may crave from less dangerous persuits, and less risky behavior.

Sort of Like the old deodorant commerical said, “takes the worry about of being close.”

Recognizing that there are some patterns in our behavior that aren’t working, and to let go of those familiar patterns not knowing what the replacement ones will be is scary.

Change brings on insecurity. Someone once said to me that the man on death row who knows exactly when and how he will die, and how every minute between now and then will take place, and what his last mean is, is the most SECURE man on earth because he KNOWS THE FUTURE. He doesn’t have to worry about WHAT WILL HAPPEN or WHEN.

We know nothing of the future, or how we will die or when, or what will transpire between now and then, so somehow we must make our path through those hours, days or years, and come to grips with the fact we are mortal and will die, that nothing on this earth is certain except CHANGE.

An animal lives in the NOW because they have no way to know about hor what it means, but they do experience and grieve loss. My Black-mouthed Curr dog who had spent her entire life with my Border Collie, grieved piteously for weeks after his sudden death this summer.

I try to live more in the NOW of TODAY, enjoying the sun and the wind, the simple joys of just being alive and being on the green side of the dirt!


We reach out to them because there is that small voice within is that STILL thinks that maybe, just maybe, maybe, they might say, “I’m so glad to hear from you. I’ve been thinking about you and feeling terrible about how I treated you. I think we should get together, as I realized that you were the only person I ever truly loved and who truly loved me. I’ve missed you”.

The truth is they have moved on to the next person who thinks they have found their “soulmate” and we are expendable. We are meaningless to them.

This is not Cinderella. We just have to battle the evil Step-Sisters and get the hell out of this house and move on. In the meantime, YES you are faking it. Just keep “whistling while you work”.

But remember that if all the work is external, “I’ll get a hobby, I’ll work out, I’ll volunteer and there is NO work done on the inner stuff, then the progress is REALLY slow. LETTING GO is the ONLY way out. You have to learn WHY you hold onto something that brings you SUCH sadness and pain. And it’s NOT just because you love them so much. But you have to find your own answer to that question.

I would love to hear what others have discovered. What others who are farther down the road to recovery, have learned about WHY they have SO much trouble letting go???? Even for those of us that are very accepting of our shortfalls, somehow the failure of this particular relationship is difficult to accept. For me, the holding was is in part about the idea that if I keep holding on, then the relationship hasn’t really failed yet. Somehow it was still in it’s evolution and I could still think that any second he’d come riding through the door on his white F’n horse.

That was part of it. The other was accepting the rejection. For those of us with difficult childhood (most on this site, I should think), it’s VERY difficult for a child to understand having a parent who doesn’t really love them….in a healthy way….. As children we make excuses…..that’s why so many try to be perfect….”If I can just be good enough, thin enough, funny enough, pretty enough, smart enough, successful enough, they will love me”……And so when we hook up with these people in our life that we can’t let go of, we are once again not accepting that THEY JUST DON’T LOVE US. It’s the part where we have to accept that a) this has NOTHING to do with us, our worth…..and b) NOTHING we can do will change it and we have to stop blaming ourselves. But it creates a tremendous sense of lack of power within ourselves and we think that we have to hold onto that idea that WE CAN make a difference and that WE HAVE the power to change things. But it’s an illusion. You have to disconnect from the idea that your inner power doesn’t exist unless it can be used to make someone love us, who doesn’t. These are just SOME of the things I’m learning, but it’s one LONG frickin’ process.

Letting go, is salvation.


Adamsrib….you sound just like me. B-day late 60s. And I have those EXACT same feelings. It all sounds so romantic and fun but then you get hooked to some creep that uses you as a booty call. CRAP! It’s just not fair. They have no heart and unfortunately we get wrapped up in it! There is no such thing as unattached sex. For women, it always means something. I had unprotected sex with this man and still dont even know his last name. How stupid is that!

Ox Drover

Dear Callista,

Your above post is FILLED WITH MANY IMPORTANT POINTS. Too many to digest or go over at one time. It is like a 20 course meal there is so much there. I iam going to print it out and go over it point by point. There is a great deal of things in it that resonate with me about why we have trouble letting go of the dreams. (doesn’t matter what the relationship is, lover, child, parent, friend…) why do we hang on?

Thanks for this very thought provoking post. You are right. Letting go is SALVATION.

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