This week the Connecticut Medical Examining Board restored me to the full practice of medicine. Due to the fact that my ex-husband Barry Lichtenthal impersonated a physician and examined female patients in a clinic that I directed, my license was restricted. I am not going to retell the full story today but I am going to comment on some things I have kept silent about. For more details of the story you can read Barry Lichtenthal: Sexual predator ruins the career of Dr. Liane Leedom. Donna Andersen is an excellent journalist and did her own investigation in order to report the story. She uncovered details even I was unaware of.
I want to address the question of whether or not I was Barry’s “accomplice” and the question of what I was aware of in terms of the goings on. The precise answer to the question is that I was an unwitting accomplice. I knew that he told people he was a retired doctor and that he called himself “Dr. Taylor.”
This behavior on his part began shortly after the clinic opened. The first I was aware of it was when I was negotiating a contract with an insurance company. He got on the other line and started schmoozing with the executive. I do not remember exactly what he said but he told the man he was a retired doctor and proceeded to tell funny and entertaining stories. Although I laughed, I was disgusted at this because it seemed infantile on his part and a waste of time. I did not understand this was his “foot in the door” with me and these stories.
I correctly recognized these stories as being pathological lies (pseudologica fantastica). However, I did not understand that all people who are pathological liars are predators. I am now sure that this is the case, though if you read the Mask of Sanity by Dr. Hervey Cleckley, he says that not all pathological liars are psychopaths.
I thought Barry told these stories because he has an ego problem and was threatened by his wife’s status. Again that interpretation was correct, but again I missed the significance of it. I let it go because I thought his pathological lies were harmless entertaining stories that no one really believed any way. Several patients indicated to me they were aware that the stories were entertaining fabrications.
I never told anyone Barry was a doctor. In fact I told every patient I was the only physician at the practice. I realize now this must have been very upsetting and confusing for some people who were being told one thing by me and another thing by Barry. Since he is a professional con artist who do you think was believed?
Because of this terrible judgment on my part, I deserved all the punishment that I received. Since I was part of other people’s victimization, I sought to do everything I could to make amends. The victims were compensated by my malpractice insurance carrier after I provided hours of truthful testimony regarding what happened. The officials of the insurance company believed my explanation that I never intended any fraudulent or criminal activity. I made the wrong decision regarding coping with my husband’s story telling.
Shortly after Barry’s arrest, I had the good fortune to speak with Annie Mcguire from fraudaid.com. It was she who made me aware of Donna Andersen. She and I also had a discussion of the unwitting accomplices of psychopaths. She said this is very common and pointed out that psychopaths could not do what they do without witting and unwitting accomplices. She has written step by step instructions for what to do if you are the unwitting accomplice to financial fraud.
I am speaking out about the fact that I was an unwitting accomplice to fraud to help to bring attention to this phenomenon. Psychopaths con and manipulate people into helping them do their dirty work and sometimes also into doing their dirty work for them. If we can raise public awareness of psychopathy and stop non-psychopaths from helping psychopaths we will be able to do a great deal of prevention. Do not ever help a psychopath in any way or you will be tricked into becoming an accomplice.
Now that gets me to telling the rest of the story. You might be wondering, “What ever happened to Barry Lichtenthal?” It is no surprise that he went to Connecticut State prison where he continued to tell his pathological lies. Prison staff members became his unwitting accomplices when they too did not prevent him from calling himself “doctor” or “doc.”
A law enforcement official told me that it was not illegal for Barry to call himself “doctor” in prison. He said this after I verbally reprimanded him for allowing this to go on. I told him I believe prisoners like Barry need to have a special designation “psychologically dangerous” so that prison staff will not be psychologically harmed by them. It seems odd that if a prisoner is more physically dangerous than average, staff members are warned, but there is no appreciation of the concept of psychological dangerousness.
Now enter another set of accomplices, family members. Even after they knew that Barry is what he is because I told them while also fully explaining the concept of psychopathy; and even after they witnessed his destruction of my life, members of his family participated in his seduction of his next woman. They sent her flowers on his behalf while he was incarcerated. They also did nothing to warn her even though I begged them to.
I was told by inside sources that the prison nurse who married Barry at one point believed he was a doctor. But I have not spoken with her myself to verify this. Donna and I have known about Barry’s new relationship because we both received letters from him while he was incarcerated, and the letters were not all stamped with the prison stamp. I received several letters addressed in a woman’s handwriting and postmarked “Hartford, CT.” Upon seeing the letters I knew that he had yet another person manipulated. I did my own investigation and found out he married a nurse who worked in the prison.
Donna and I did not write about our investigation of Barry and his marriage to the prison nurse because although I have all the documentation of the events that went on in the prison, we have no proof Barry and the nurse were actually married. Donna is a very good journalist and you can trust that she will not tell a story without possessing proof. For more information regarding Barry’s recent activities see Probation department wants access to sex offender’s computer
I pray every day that Barry, now in his 60s has mellowed and become less predatory. I believe that the best person to deal with him is an experienced prison nurse so I hope that situation is going well. I also pray there will be no more victims and no more accomplices.
Eden,
I like to because it helps bring new things to the surface to learn or more questions to ask.
I was just reading an article or two here of kathleen Hawks about anger. I think I’ve definitely hit that point in the process. I’m angry i didn’t see the signs, even the signs I saw in childhood…having said that you make perfect sense in saying that a psychopath would be difficult to detect because one has never experienced it, or difficult to see because one has. I think that’s pretty much right on. It leads me to believe that ANYONE can be caught up in their machinations, and one doesn’t have to come from such a dysfunctional background for it to happen. One thing I have noticed a lot though is that those who have NOT had background of abuse, tend to recover more quickly than those who have. While that’s discouraging, it sure does make sense.
I think part of my fascination in trying to understand how psychopaths function (how they manipulate/gaslight/etc) is because it IS my background. I want to understand it as much as I can to avoid it again in the future. What is somewhat encouraging is that there WERE things from my childhood, signals that told me even my spath family was off. The debates they had, and my observances of them were also significant in that even though there was horrible abuse and craziness around me, there was still yet apart of me that was able to SEE what was going on. I just wasn’t able to define it verbally or integrate it into my life as a non pattern of getting involved with spaths. It was simply too familiar. I’m recognizing how eerilly similar last spath is to my bio fam. Far more than ex P ever was.
It’s important to me now to hold onto that significance of those observances of spath bio fam from childhood. They are validating and i can take that into my future. I can learn to trust myself. There were many times in my life where I was told not to trust myself or that my thinking was wrong….when actually, when it came down to spaths, and their intentions, it was accurate. I carry a great deal of anger from being told to ignore what I was feeling and then eventually, I DID ignore ALL my gut instinct. It was a habit. It was how I survived. I don’t have to survive that way anymore. One of my biggest triggers and something that seems so disrespectful to me is when someone says, YOU”RE WRONG……….um…………it absolutely nails me every single time. Not that I don’t MIND being wrong and I’ll think on it and if I’m wrong, I”M WRONG, but I find this term particularly offensive as of late and it flat pisses me off! This is what spath and bio fam did to me on constant basis. You’re wrong, you assume, you do this and do that…….which is somewhat true because to some degree, everyone at one point or another, “assumes” or is “Wrong’ about something..but the way a spath says it means something entirely different.
I won’t be neglecting that part of myself again
Rambling…
Eden, you are very blessed to have this as your first encounter and not more than that. I can see your strength AND healthy responses to your situation. It’s neat to see you come out of this so quickly and what is even better is watching you OWN all of it, with each step in the process.
That’s encouraging to me.
Roses.
Roses,
I can see that you and I have that in common. We both really need to understand the spaths. It might be in part because we know that being raised with spaths, we will always gravitate toward them emotionally. So without the intellectual understanding and knowledge, we are more vulnerable than someone who wasn’t raised by spaths. Their instincts will protect them, while our instincts actually put us at risk.
About the only situation where being raised by spaths would be advantageous, is in a war zone, in which case your ability to trauma bond could save you. Also if you decide to become a spy, like in the movie “Salt” with Angelina Jolie, being able to lie could be helpful.
One person that I know who was raised by N’s and still has a protective coating, is my oldest sister. She wasn’t abused very much. They mostly left her alone. She was quiet and distant. She wanted to be a nun, then a doctor and finally became a teacher. Her thinking was influenced more by the nuns at school than by my parents. She knew nothing about sociopaths but has such strict standards and ethics that she won’t let anything slide and she NEVER puts up with crap from anyone. She seems to be an anomoly and I can’t quite figure out how she did it.
Roses,
I haven’t finished reading your post, above but wanted to reply before I lose my thought… In regard to the second paragraph within your post, you can use this as a way to know or to counter the thoughts about yourself you had been expressing and were concerned about, reharding having some evil within you. Look at the fact that even when you were young, you KNEW there was something not right about the way the conversations were going within your family. I believe this means that you do bot posses any evil at all, because you could identify the narcissism, or what-have-you, in their conversations. This is a good thing, Roses. Read what you wrote and absorb it fully!
I am going back now, to read the remainder of what you wrote.
E
Sky,
You have such CLARITY in your posts. I WISH i could achieve that level of clarity when I write. It’s like knowing what I want to say, however, not articulating it CLEARLY…just rambling thoughts, but you are RIGHT ON! It IS very important for me to understand it logically and intellectually. This was something that was already in place as a child but squelched with all that I saw before me. This is also important in helping me to identify my triggers. What the spaths did that triggers me now……..present triggers connected to old, such as you’re WRONG. When someone says that to me, I just come COMPLETELY unglued. It’s what last spath did to me constantly (denying my reality) and it’s what bio spaths did (again, denying my reality). It also causes me to SHUT DOWN. I get angry, then I shut down and spend the next several hours, days WEEKS. trying to figure out what I did that was so WRONG. Mind you emphasis here< WRONG. Well of course my observations were WRONG. They had to be. It was a no win situation. And there's another trigger. Winning/losing. EVERYTHING in spath bio fam was a competition. EVERYTHING a triangulation. I can't recall a dynamic that wasn't triangulation. I could SEE IT, I could OBSERVE it, I could be a VICTIM of it, even PERPETRATE IT, but I COULD NOT articulate it as the evil that it was. What a MESS!!!
I think the observances of those debates has such significance for me for a multitude of reasons, in watching how spaths operate. It's all about WINNING, not about LOVING. So winning means EMOTIONS go out the window (exception anger in the debate), but guess what else goes out the window with it? LOGIC….to win at all costs, even while it doesn't make any sense. This is where the cut off was for me. I absorbed all of that. With last spath, it was about WINNING. Because I loved him, I saw that i was WRONG. Does this make sense? If I see it as an observance of what happened, there was no logic, no emotion, it was about WINNING. I can't recall how many times he would say to me, "fine, you win, you always win"….WTF? COUNTLESS times…….
I NEVER understood that because I didn't say or do anything to WIN with him, I LOVED him. But for him, it was an endless competition. I was smart, and he knew it. So did my bio fam and what better way to try to destroy someone than to tell them they're constantly wrong in denying their reality or their perceptions so you (editorially) can WIN. WTF?
But that's really what it's all about with spaths. The need to win. The POWER of winning……it's always a one uppance. I see what it is now. Just what to do with it or how to deal with it without a TON of anger? I haven't figured that one out yet.
Eden, you are absolutely correct. And I am in process of doing just that too. THAT hits the nail right on the head!
Roses
Sky
I don’t know how your sister did it either, other than that she was basically left alone. Perhaps she was just an observer and decided that that was NOT for her. I believe there are those that are lucky enough not to be directly touched by abuse, even though they lived with it as a child and draw healthy conclusions from that. That is PRECISELY the boat I unfortunately was not on lol, even if I knew what was going on was more than strange.
Roses,
your posts are what brought out my clarity!
Your post about winning is making me think about that too. My bf has had a couple of little pouting sessions because he says I “negate” him. Huh? Well, I did tell him he was wrong when I thought he was wrong. Does he want a “yes man” around him? Well that ain’t me! I tend toward bluntness, but sheesh! I think he’s too sensitive. He was also raised by an N/P mom, so that helps me understand it a bit better, thanks.
on the other hand, I made a suggestion for a way to publicize his new product and he said, “no, we will NOT be deceptive in anyway with this company.” And he had a small fit.
I didn’t suggest we should deceive, but I had posted in a forum under a different name and not my own. And I didn’t post any lies, I only posted, “Hey guys check out this new product my friend invented, here’s the website.” It worked. He got some traffic.
Then yesterday, his two friends suggested that they would post on forums and say, “I just bought x product from x website and it’s really cool, check it out, I love mine!” Now THAT would be a lie because they are not stating their REAL relationship to the manufacturer. But BF came running up to me and told me that this was a great idea that his two friends came up with blah, blah, blah…and he was going to let them do it.
I was flabbergasted. First of all, it wasn’t a new idea, secondly, when you lie like that you get busted. Anyone who frequents a forum, knows that the forum bloggers are immediately going to suspect a newbie whose very first post is, “hey! buy this! I did and I love it!” If you’re going to post, post the truth. and btw, no one cares what your real name is.
Anyway, I bitched him out. He seemed sorry. He certainly admitted he was wrong. But I asked him a question: are you stupid or are you doing this on purpose? I still don’t have an answer.
Skylar & Roses,
Roses,
It is interesting to read what you expressed that you see in me. Because of the experience I had with the P, I still feel vulnerable and not 100% sure footed, just yet. But I am working on it. And don’t forget, if you have been reading any of my other posts, I am still at times very enraged at what he has done and has taken from me. On another note, I understand what you are saying about being told you are wrong. I am a huge believer in the fact that everyone on this planet has a mind of their own (I am not including the P/S/N’s in my referrences here) and a right to think the way they do, even if it doesn’t match the thoughts of the N. Please do not think that I am calling my family perfect. Yes, I do know that my parents and my family in general are healthy minded, however my parents were and still are big supporters of using therapy to get through the things that we are unable to resolve on our own, or between us. My sisters and I were introduced to therapy before we were in our teens. I think I was 12 (wow come to think of it, maybe it was a puberty thing, lol). Anyway, my sisters and I just got lucky that we have smart parents, that had enough awareness and the desire to raise their children in a healthy way. But it wasn’t that everything was just perfectly perfect all of the time. And I did get a tast of other familie’s dynamics. I have lost my train of thought so now I am the one who is rambling. Sorry.
Skylar and Roses,
Don’t think that I haven’t been spending way to much time researching the “Devil”. Trust me I have. I have found it incredibly facsinating and most disturbing. In fact, in the beginning, when I was doing most of my learning and having such vivid realizations about what he had done and said, I developed so much anger and resentment. I am still somewhat obsessed with gaining knowledge, however, I am now more focused on ways to lighten my anger. I am so grateful that I found these particular homeopathics that I had made mention of, as they are doing wonders for me, and I fortunately got matched up with an incredible therapist at UCLA who has worked with people who have been victimized by Psychopaths.
Here is an example of what happens to me that gets me angry: One of the things that was brought on by this experience is loss of hair. Today, as I was brushing my hair and pulling it back into a ponytail, I saw the balding areas were getting worse, in front. I cried. I am angry. He had this power over me. I never had a health issue in my life. Since this occurance, I have had to start taking a bit of a thyroid pill, pills for my adrenals, pills for the bumps all over my scalp that come and go. Today, as I was sweeping my floors, I must have swept up enough hair to give to make a child size wig. I know it is because of him, because, I had my physical recently and my bloodwork showed that I am still nowhere close to being menopausal, and I was in great health other than the ailments brought on by trauma induced stress, I am told. My blood pressure has always been low, now it is borderlining on normal to high. My doctor says all of what is going on with me can eventually be regulated and I will be able to go off of the pills (most of which are natural remedies, but still…). Yes, I was in it for only 9 months, but this just shows how Psychopathic this devil was/is, as he wreaked such an abundance of havock in such a short amount of time, in comparison to most, that is.
Thank you for the venting session, and for listening/reading. Wow, I think I needed to release all of that.
XXOO,
Eden
(((Eden)))
I’m so sorry about your hair. They certainly affect our health. I think maybe it’s the sensation of not being safe, that messes with our immune system. The adrenals get overworked in fight/flight response and the thyroid goes into low mode. My thyroid is also low.
Are your homeopathics still working? I haven’t begun mine because I’d have to drive to my cabin and I hate going there since he has left a gaggle of sociopaths in my neighborhood and I don’t like going up there for that reason. He planted them there as part of his plan to drive me to suicide. But he failed because he is STUPID.
Seriously, this man had every advantage. He was completely covert. I suspected NOTHING. I couldn’t even IMAGINE such a thing. I was loyal like a dog. He recruited people to do his dirty work, so it was me against at least a dozen people all of whom knew what I didn’t know. He kept me in constant fear and poverty. It was psychological warfare for 25 years.
So why was I able to get the upper hand every once in a while and why was I able to escape in the end? Well, I have to first of all give credit to God, but also because he was STUPID! Thank you, I needed to vent too! Just thinking about all the crap I was subjected to requires some deep breathing exercises! Argh!
Anyway…you were saying about your health and your anger…
I learned from Kathleen Hawk that anger is a mechanism for identifying when there is danger. It helps us to draw boundaries between what is good for us and what isn’t. So perhaps we are angry until we can intellectualize it and then we don’t need anger anymore. We can protect ourselves with wisdom instead of anger.
Mostly, I’m not angry at my STUPID spath. I get angry when I think of the spaths that he left in my life: my spath neighbors, the cops in town and the trojan horse spath that married my sister. I want them GONE. They do make me angry. How do I get rid of them? I don’t want to be driven off, I was there first. I’m thinking about blackmailing spath. Not for money, but to force him to remove the spath slime he left in my life. That I would love to do.
Thank you, Skylar,
It isn’t my hair I care about, although you probably got that already. It is the reminder of the fact that he had an affect on me. Yes the Homeopathics are still working. Each day, since I started taking them, I feel less and less overcome. I know it is because of them, as yesterday, I had forgotten to take them after my first dose in the morning, by 5:00, I thought hmm, feeling it creeping back, them realized, I had not taken them since about 8:00 AM. Today, despite the reminder, by my hair loss issue, I am feeling even better. I am still doing other things as well. I write a lot, go Paddle Surfing as much as possible and started jogging on the beach again, which I had stopped doing a few weeks into the relationship. Exercise, especially exercising in nature is extremely helpful, but I swear it is the Homeopathic pills that have made most of the recent difference, I believe.
My Psychopath was also somewhat stupid. Probably more than I noticed, on the surface. Blackmail sounds good. Be careful though after all that you have stated about him. I would not want to see anything negative happen to you!
E
((((((((((((( Eden! ))))))))))))))))))
Firstly, I’m so terribly sorry about your hair issue. I so understand this it is unbelievable. My thyroid has been affected by what I believe is stress, for years now. Since I was about twenty two. It’s gotten WORSE and far more so over the last two years. I’ve been monitored regularly for the last two years, but went six months without a blood check. This was within the last year with spath. I was becoming so incredibly ill and I knew NOT what was wrong,but began to think that it was something other than premenopausal symptoms. I was also very high in blood pressure, which continued to rise each month that I was checked at the doctor (yes I go regularly once a month), and my hair was coming out and my scalp was so itchy I thought I had head lice lol! I had my daughter checking my head constantly. I would have no idea where the head lice would have come from, but it wasn’t. My skin was enormously dry, but not just my scalp, I just noticed it more as my hair was also falling out. Not enough in the clumps you are describing to donate to locks of love, but, well, enough to notice it in my hair brush. I also had heart palpitations, and was exceptionally exhausted all the time. My doctor noticed the changes and wanted blood work done and sure enough, my thyroid was dangerously low. My rbc’s were totally off as was my white cell count, monocyte count and one other count. I”ve been told that my rbc’s could be off because i smoke. Really? THey’ve NEVER been off in any blood count I’ve ever had. I have to take the thyroid meds the rest of my life. I am now going through menopause and am having less periods than I’m having them, but with that comes major mood swings and hot flashes that may, undoubtedly, find me in a heap of ashes in a grocery store check out line! My weight, however is perfect and I have a great figure. Go figure. It’s what’s inside that is a mess. I’m now struggling with an ear infection, and I understand your anger, Eden. I have an std so bad right now, and I’m murderously pissed that I got it from him. I try NOT to think about it too much, because I either dissolve into tears or I want to hit someone, mainly HIM! Once in awhile I think about going into another relationship someday. Well, I’m NOT going to lie about my std. I’ll have it the rest of my effing life. And he walks away without any signs of infection and i say SIGNS of infection. Bastard. And you can bet he’s not telling his new gf either. BASTARD!!!! **sigh**……it’s the one thing, Eden, the one word that passes my lips more than at least ten times a day. The bad memories, as I get out of the fog, are more so than the good ones and if I dare feel my dancing into “I love you, J”….it turns immediately into a bad memory, followed quickly by “BASTARD!”. The other night, I came home from the store, contemplating the mean, rotten nasty horrible things he did and I screamed and cried in my car for what felt like an hour. Damn him. Damn me. I hate that I’m in this place because of what he did to me. I HATE IT!!
Eden, I want to apologize if I came off as minimizing your experience. I DO understand how you feel and saw a post the other day acknowledging your anger. I admire that you can so readily own it. I also admire that you did come from a background that reinforced good emotional health. ONe of the things you said about your parents resonates with me so well and helps me in my own parenting. ANY time I saw something out of line with my kids, or if I found out about it, it was to the therapist LOL!!! With every single child, it was meds/therapy or a combination of it all. Today, my son, who is now a recovered juvenile sex offender, told me “Mom, I’m so grateful that you kicked me out of the house and into the system…if you’d not done that, I wouldn’t be the man I am today”. A mother’s love, sometimes means giving up that child to face incredible pain…and/or consequences. I was and am and have been, always willing to do that, no matter the emotional cost to me, to my pride, to my well being or not. That situation with my son was traumatic. I’m still not over that part of it. And spath owns that about me too. Those secrets. Soooooooooo many secrets of which I refuse to keep anymore…..keeping everything a secret was also part of spathy’s plan as well as from bio fam spath plan…..sssshhhh don’t tell…….well, when there is abuse I WILL SPEAK UP!, even if it’s my own damned kid……this is the first place I have gone where I have not been kicked out, judged, blown off, wounded, traumatized further and kicked around the block because of my son’s actions. I think Ox was one of the first to express such loving kindness towards me with something that my son did that people equate to murder if not worse. She has been through it. And that alone provided immense healing to a wounded, hurting soul. Mama bear ((Ox))…
UGH!! Rambling again!!!
Eden, your intelligence, insight and perceptiveness in going through what you are going through so inspires me. You are wise beyond wise, given your experience. I’m constantly blown away by those here who weather these experiences and go through and cross to the other side stronger than when they showed up here. I SEE this in you. Please don’t think I’m minimizing what you’re going through and I DO understand it.
Sky….your experience is just horrendous in what your spath was doing to you. I’ve often wonder if my spath was not drugging his wife too. If he was not, he was sure killing her emotionally. She was sick A LOT. Now she’s the healthiest she has ever been in her life too and one HOT MAMA!! LOL!! HE IS SO STUPID!!! I’m so incredibly HAPPY FOR HER!! After all the years he put her through help, with me as an accomplice, she deserves love and peace. So do you sky. If there is a way to get rid of the slime left behind, do it. Does it matter that you were there first or does your sanity mean more? That’s a judgment call on your part and I’m supportive. I know you’ll do the right thing.
About the trigger with being “wrong”…..after hearing it so long…….there is one thing I have learned not to do with others. If I do it, I APOLOGIZE………when someone says point blank, “YOUR”E WRONG”……….or “WRONG!”……that is an effort to make that person feel LESS in my opinion. That word was used to do that to me my entire existence. I don’t think there is anything “wrong” (lol) with saying that you believe someone is wrong, but is it really WRONG or is it just a disagreement? Even if it’s “Wrong” who is it that you’re saying that too? Saying that someone is “wrong” for me, means that you’re denying THEIR opinion and reality, which is, well in fact, WRONG lol!! We all have a perception as to what is right or wrong FOR OURSELVES….and there are definitely things that are wrong that are just flat wrong…….spaths being one of them lol…….ok, now that sounds contradictory **sigh**…..
If someone says “I disagree with you”, rather than “You’re wrong!!” it opens up room for discussion. What “YOU”RE WRONG” or “WRONG” means is that that person no longer cares to hear your opinion, it doesn’t matter and so move on……
It’s ENTRENCHED, this idea of YOU”RE WRONG! ………..I like the exchange of ideas. Something that was NOT allowed in my spath family or with past spaths or my exP. I disagree with you, opens up lines of communication for an invite for an exchange of ideas, which a spath WILL NOT ALLOW….this is why the word bothers me when put forth as an accusation of sorts. It’s a stop gap measure to shut your mouth. It’s unfriendly and is dishonest. What would be simpler, in my opinion, is “Ya know what? You’re wrong, my opinion stands or I dont want to hear your opinion so fuck off”.
Well fuck off isn’t nice, but I heard that too when I stood up to “you’re wrong”. I’m mindful of this when I’m with my loved ones now. I’ve also noticed that those that give a shit about my opinion, even if they don’t agree don’t say “YOU”RE WRONG!”
To me, it’s not a matter of being too sensitive. It’s a shut down mechanism. And it’s one of the subtler ones used by spaths on a continuum.
Anyway……..you both give me something to think about……….
Roses….