Just Like His Father? (available through this site) was released in October, 2006. At that time I fantasized that the audience for the book would be single parents or grandparents raising the children of personality disordered individuals. I thought that most of the disordered parents would have abandoned the family and want nothing to do with the kids. While we still do not know what percentage of personality disordered parents abandon their kids, I have come to believe that that those who do not are a much bigger social problem.
Within 6 months of the release of the book, people who were trying to co-parent with severely disordered former partners began to write me. At first I did not believe the stories because they so contradicted common sense and my clinical training. What sane person would believe that the family courts would grant unsupervised access or even custody to severely personality disordered abusive parents? Well I discovered that is just what they do, and since that discovery have been working obsessively to change things.
If we are to change the insane system the first thing we need is valid, objective reliable data regarding how it operates. We also need valid, objective reliable data about the parenting and intimate behavior of people with cluster B personality disorders. I have set a goal to collect that data not for a “pop psychology” book but for its scientific value. That has meant Ethics Committee (IRB) approvals, funding, questionnaires, interviews, research assistants and statistics. I am still collecting this data from former partners and adult children of disordered individuals but have made substantial progress (send Donna an email if you want to consider providing data).
Last year I was teaching a research methods class to graduate students in counseling. We were discussing qualitative and narrative research when one of the students raised her hand and said she enjoyed reading autobiographies of people who had unusual experiences, a light bulb went on inside my head. I looked at her and said, “See me after class.” Last summer that student, another student Emily, Linda who blogs for Lovefraud, and I read and analyzed using modern qualitative methods 18 memoirs written by former partners and adult sons and daughters of psychopathic individuals. I am happy to announce that one of the papers generated from this research is now available.
The paper provides substantial data that might be useful for women who are trying to protect children from a psychopathic father. The paper also explains to professionals how and why women get into these relationships and the damage the relationships do. Here is the abstract:
Abstract:
This is the first in-depth study of the influence of psychopathy (as assessed by the PCL-R) on the intimate relationship behavior of men. Using well-established qualitative methods, Leedom, Geslien, and Almas examined the published memoirs of 10 women who had long-term relationships with psychopathic men. They also examined articles, videotaped interviews, forensic evaluations where available, and author feedback. The authors determined that these relationships consist of four phases: induction, commitment, disengagement, and recovery. All of the women they studied had been conned, manipulated, or coerced during all or most phases of the relationship. The data from the 10 memoirs have been triangulated with that of a memoir written by a woman who had been kidnapped at age 11 and held 18 years by a psychopathic man, and with a case well known to the first author. Although the resulting data are qualitative and come from a limited number of cases, they have enabled the formulation of a model to explain the relationship between the facets of psychopathy and intimate partner experiences, exploitation, and abuse. Psychopathic men may occasionally demonstrate “affectionate” behavior and express concern for children, but psychopathy is not compatible with a healthy relationship or a nurturing home environment for children.
You may obtain the paper from The Civic Research Institute
I am unable to provide data regarding the experiences of men because there were no memoirs written by men. The paper presenting the data from adult children has not yet been accepted, but that paper contains data regarding psychopathic mothers.
I hope to continue to do the very difficult task of objectively collecting and reporting data while at the same time advocating for social change. This paper is a start.
Liane, Children are still considered chattel just as women were in the past…unless they commit some awful crime, and then they are charged and prosecuted as adults with full responsibility.
Our culture is skewed and crazy…a boy can join the marines and go to combat at 17 or 18 but not buy a beer…he can vote at 18 but not buy a beer…a minor girl can get an abortion without her parents being told but the doctor can’t sew up a cut on her finger without parental consent. It is a crime for a 12 year old girl to have sex, and a physician/nurse/educator is a mandated reporter, yet that 12 year old girl has a “right to sexual privacy” and if you report you violate confidentiality.
And PARENTS have “rights” to their offspring but the offspring have no rights…well a few do, that kid who “divorced” his parents, and Drew Barrymore emancipated at a very early age because of her parents taking her money among other things, but over all the child has few rights.
Liane, I applaud your efforts and I totally agree with you, and I don’t want to throw cold water on your efforts, but feel like you are pissing in the ocean to try to raise the sea level, the task is so HUGE….but, every change must start with at least one person who is dissatisfied with the status quo, and you are NOT alone. Hopefully, there will be some changes made in our society and culture, even if they are very slow. Look how long it took to get the vote for women in this country, and it was only in the 1970/80s that women could have access to the joint credit score of their spouse in the event of a divorce.
So you and the others working hard on this change may not be fast, but I do sincerely hope to see some measure of progress in my lifetime.
OxD, I sure hope this research is helpful in change for the rights of children. When a child is concieved, they don’t have a choice as to whom they will be born to, or in what type of environment. When people – well-meaning people – attempt to intercede on a child’s behalf (re. exspath’s relative), they are DEMONIZED for interfering, even when the “parent” is clearly not suitable to raise a healthy, well-adjusted child.
Children DO need advocacy and changes have to start, somewhere. If a concerned parent or abused child doesn’t have a legal voice, then, perhaps, the professionals might. People, in general, tend to “listen to,” or “hear,” what professionals in their field have to say LONG before they pay attention to what is perceived as a bitter ex-wife or ex-husband to a sociopath.
I hope to see change, too. Changes for children and changes for “No Fault” divorce!
My state is not a “no fault” but it is community property…there WAS NO community property in my son C’s divorce from his P wife, and she did NOT have to show up in court, but she DID for some reason, I guess to hear me testify that she and her BF tried to kill my son and that they went to prison and jail and that we had photographs of her in bondage made in my mother’s home. LOL
When she had been released homeless from the jail they sent her to the local DV shelter and she of course told them how abused she was and she was escorted to court by one of their advocates who looked at me like I was Satan himself. LOL
The CASA program here in the courts are advocates for the kids in foster care….I got involved with the program for a while but am no longer active with it (court appointed special advocate) It is a good program for the kids from abused situations who are in foster care. Unfortunately too many of these kids are disordered themselves and it was triggering me to the point that I had to opt out for myself.
OxD, in the first divorce, I still didn’t have a clue what I was dealing with, and I was flabbergasted by how the courts didn’t “hear” my concerns about my children’s well-being. The Judge just wanted the both of us to shut up, get along, and get the hell out of his courtroom.
The children need advocacy, to be sure. But, the non-spath parent needs resources, as well. In order to help their children “adjust” and recover from a divorce, the non-spath parent needs intensive counseling therapy, as well as the children. But, given the fact that spaths turn courtrooms into their personal performance stages, I don’t have any idea how to address this.
It takes a tremendous amount of courage to volunteer for such an organization, OxD. I don’t know if I would be able to summon up the courage and maintain the strict boundaries to do that, personally. That you did it, at all, is incredible!
Brightest blessings
Hi Everybody, it’s Denise (Ledden) Escher, from the True Lovefraud Stories ~ Mark Ledden. My psychopathic ex is now, for the second or third time, I forget which, suing me, from court asking for visitation. He is asking for every weekend phonecalls, holidays, weekly mail correspondence…oh it gets better….asking or HIS FATHER to take my kids to see him in the jail. Which is over 4 hrs from my home, oh what else, oh, all their psych evals, medical records, school report cards…..you would think this man was a FREE MAN with what he wants. So, back to court I go on March 6 to continue my fight to keep them from him completely. I think that it needs to be determined that the ex is in fact a psychopath! Otherwise, I think the more and more he throws up there, the judge/master will let something stick and my poor kids, who have PTSD, as do I, will be forced in some way to have contact with him. In 3 days, he will start day one of year FOUR behind bars. He was sentenced to a minimum of 7 and a max of 20. I know that he is doing this ONLY because he sees these children as his property that I am keeping from him. It’s not about them, it’s about ME. I will always believe that. I am fairly certain that the court will at least order that HE and BOTH CHILDREN be psych evaluated. I want to make sure that whomever evals HIM is NOT someone from the prison, and someone experienced with psychopathy. AND I want the SAME PERSON to eval my kids. Some days I feel like NO SANE PSYCHIATRIST would EVER find it in the best interests of my children and family for them to, at ages 10 and 7, have any contact with the man who stabbed their mother 11 times in front of them. Other days, I remind myself JUST how manipulative my ex husband is, and think someone out there might say ‘we ahve to give him a chance’…..I live in fear every single day 🙁 if any of you can help me, please let me know!
I Win, I am horrified to read of the attack that you survived, and I am grateful that you recovered.
Okay, I am NOT a professional or savvy in legal matters, but I’m reading from your post, above, that the psychopathic father stabbed YOU in front of your children and is now demanding “visitation” with the children who witnessed this attempt at murder?
First things first: are you AND your children involved in strong counseling? If yes, then have your therapist and their therapists write a “NARRATIVE” with regard to the ramifications of forcing visitation on these children. A “Narrative” is a discussion by the therapist that doesn’t involve diagnoses and a great deal of psych-speak. If you and your children are not involved in strong counseling therapy, I would urge you to do this, ASAP. There are many reasons for this with the first and foremost being your recovery and that of your children. You will each have your own counselor who will assist EACH of you in processing the horrific experiences and managing PSTD, depression, anxiety, etc. so that you can all recover.
Next….do you have representation by an attorney? If not, contact your local Victims’ Services office or domestic violence hotline. No doubt, you’ve been acquainted with both of these agencies, already, but they can put you in contact with strong, competent ADVOCACY, especially for your children.
The court may, or may not, order psych evaluations and you will NOT have a voice in which professional conducts assessments. The Court typically determines this. I don’t know what State this issue is being heard in, but it is vital for you to avoid, at all costs, any attempts to “predict” what court rulings will result, what the spath is going to say/do, etc. Attempts at prediction invariably result in extreme anxiety that you cannot afford, at this time.
Keep in mind that the spath is making these motions to disturb your life, and the lives of your children. It’s pretty much the only thing that he can do to continue exerting damage. With that in mind, process your emotions outside of any legal proceedings either with your counseling therapist, or in a healthy and safe way.
Turn the fear into anger, IWin. Get ANGRY that this disease has the NERVE to make any demands, at all! THEN……then, dear heart, take that anger and use that incredible energy to make phone calls, arrange appointments, and get down to business.
Keep coming back to this site, keep reading (especially, gray rock techniques), keep posting, and keep recovering.
Brightest and most supportive blessings
Denise ~
I can’t even imagine the horror. I don’t know how much help this will be, but –
As you know, what he is asking for falls under his residual “parental rights” under the law. The right to visitation and access to medical and school records. The third, I am sure he is not requesting is the “right” to pay child support.
Have you ever considered attempting to terminate his parental rights? You may want to check out the link I posted above in the comments – under Milo –
It is the case of a mother having the father’s parental rights terminated because of his mental illness. It is a case out of California and it was upheld on appeals.
I am so sorry, may you and your children find peace.
IWin, I like MiLo’s suggestion about looking into terminating his “parental rights,” and she is spot-on with regard to these “rights,” which is what Dr. Leedam is collecting research data to address: CHILDREN DO NOT NEED DISORDERED PARENTS IN THEIR LIVES!!! Sorry for the caps, but it’s meant for emphasis and not virtual shouting.
Other readers who have far more experience in this type of legal situation can offer excellent suggestions. For the time being, the best that I can offer is to take back control of your emotions, any way that you safely can.
Brightest blessings
truthspeak and milo, I used to go to counseling but then had to quit my job due to the PTSD stress (i taught in an inner city high school where my safety was threatened, i couldn’t perform, rather than be eventually fired, i just quit ) so I couldn’t afford to continue to go. and the copay is $25 each time I go, can’t afford that either as now i don’t work much. My kids go, actually my youngest just got discharged as his behaviors in and out of school are very good right now. These children want nothing to do with their father. I don’t know much about ‘residual’ parental rights, but what about MY RIGHTS to my emotional sanity? medical records are minimal for the kids, school report cards? HES IN JAIL…why should he have ANY RIGHTS while he’s in there? i will do what the court orders, as long as it’s not allowing my kids to be ripped away from me and forced to go with virtual stranger grandparents to a prison to see the man who tried to kill their mom. I’ll leave the country before I let that ever happen.
I would need my ex husband DIAGNOSED with a mental ill ness before they’d revoke his parental rights. And, what about me, I have anxiety disorder AND PTSD, both ‘mental illnesses’ couldnt that serve as my not being able to raise them either???
just so frustrating. I will never find peace as long as this man is still breathing 🙁
Denise,
Please understand, I AGREE with you 100% on how you are feeling. This is ridiculous, YOU SHOULD HAVE ALL THE RIGHTS HERE. Unfortunately, that is not necessarily the law. The law is what I was talking about. You most likely have “legal” custody. Look up the laws in your state, most likely with you having legal custody, he still has, under the law, those residual rights I was mentioning.
In order to terminate his rights, you must attempt to get “permanent custody” and this would remove any and all rights he has to your children. Again, legally, this is not easy. Perhaps, citing the case in California, having him diagnosed with a mental illness would greatly increase your chances. This is something an attorney would have to research.
As far as your question about your PTSD and anxiety disorder falling into this same category as “mental illness” and keeping you from parenting your children – I don’t believe so. I hope Donna responds to this. She is educated on how PTSD is now considered under the American’s With Disabilities Act and can not (if I understand it right) be used against you in court proceedings.
Some thoughts – Can’t you get counseling through victim’s benefits from your state? Do you have a victim’s advocate? Do your children have a victim’s advocate?
More – I have recently heard of some “test cases” with children with PTSD. The thoughts behind these cases are that children with PTSD have suffered a permanent type of “change” in their brains. If the PTSD was caused by or a direct result of an action of a parent, that parent can be charged with felony child abuse. Were these types of charges ever considered? I’m sorry I don’t have more information on child abuse with regards to PTSD, but I know it is out there, it is just a matter of finding it. Again, something an attorney should definitely look into.
Please understand, I can’t even imagine how frustrating and terrifying this must be for you. Also, understand, I certainly DO NOT agree with these laws, just attempting to make you aware of them.