By Ox Drover
After reading Steve Becker’s article yesterday, I commented that most of the articles here on Lovefraud that could be entitled “1001 Things I Did Wrong in Dealing with a Psychopath” were the ones that applied most to my own dealings with them.
That was meant as a joke, but after I left that comment for Steve, I got to thinking about how right-on it was, joke or not, because I have done so much wrong in dealing with these people. I got my self deeper and deeper into trouble, doing the wrong things in interacting with them. Not that I was intentionally doing something mean or “wrong” per se, but I didn’t make choices that led to positive outcomes in dealing with the psychopaths in my life.
One of the reasons I did 1001 things wrong was that I didn’t know what I was dealing with. I thought I was dealing with people who had good intentions toward me, just as I had good intentions toward them. Boy, was that a wrong thing to assume. But because I assumed this error in fact about their intentions, I tried to “be reasonable” with them. That sure didn’t work. They broke their word to me time and time again. It took me a long time “to get it through my thick skull,” as MaryJo Buttafuoco said in her book, and then, when I did get it through my thick head that “Person A” couldn’t be trusted, I didn’t “generalize” that knowledge to other people who also broke their words to me over and over and over again.
Learning to generalize
Even animals can learn to generalize. A friend and I trained steer, getting them used to “something that rattled.” It didn’t matter what rattled; we would use plastic milk jugs with rocks in them, and tie those jugs to their tails so that every time they took a step, this “rattling monster” attached to them would make noise and follow them. For a little while they were scared and ran from it, but eventually they got the idea that the “rattling monster” wasn’t going to be outrun by them (it always kept up), and it wasn’t actually going to hurt them. Eventually they decided anything that rattled and made noise was harmless.
With one set of young steers my friend trained though, if you got them used to a white jug with rocks in it, and they weren’t afraid of it any more, if you used a yellow jug, they would go back to SQUARE ONE PANIC AGAIN, with each tiny change in the “monster.” They didn’t “generalize” very well and were always hyper-alert and on guard. He eventually got them so they were “dynamite proof,” so he could take them out in public without being afraid they would panic at the first sound they weren’t used to, or the first loud retort from a fire cracker, but he and I both thought for a long time they might not ever generalize enough to be safe from panicking and running away out in public.
Abusive behavior
I think in a way I also didn’t “generalize” the abusive behaviors of the various psychopaths I encountered. When a boss would be dishonest and verbally abusive to me, I was upset and “panicked” at the unexpected behavior, trying to figure out how to not get hurt, but when a relative would do this same kind of behavior I, again, panicked and didn’t realize that the “rattle” was just the same kind of “monster” that I had encountered with the other psychopath. Of course I didn’t realize then that the psychopathic “monsters” had a name or that their lack of empathy and their damage was definitely destructive, unlike a milk jug with a few rocks in it.
I not only tried to be “reasonable” with the psychopaths, but I also tried to placate them, to make them see, by being extra nice to them and not “bowing up and fighting back,” that I wasn’t trying to hurt them. I wanted to be “friends” and get along.
Of course, when a prey animal tries to get along with a predator animal we know what happens, don’t we? The prey animal gets the worst end of the deal. Yep, I did get the worst end of the deal trying to “make nice” with the psychopaths, but again, I didn’t learn that a psychopath is a psychopath is a psychopath is a predator! Rather than generalize this hurtful behavior to a class of people, I saw each one as an individual person with “reasons” and “excuses” and the “potential to change” and “see the light” when there was no chance that they were going to have any empathy, much less sympathy, for the pain they caused me or anyone else. They didn’t give a hoot how badly they hurt me as long as they got what they wanted.
Wanted to get along
I also didn’t really see what it was that they actually wanted. I didn’t want to cause anyone any pain, I wanted to love people and get along with them and share good things and help folks out. This is what I thought that everyone wanted. What they actually did want, however, was to control me, humiliate me, and to get me to provide them with their own twisted idea of a relationship—all take on their part and all give on mine.
Just like the hyper-alert steers, I didn’t feel comfortable, and was always jumpy, expecting something to hit me, but I wasn’t sure where it would come from, so each time a psychopath lied to me, stole from me, took advantage of me, I was totally surprised again and again.
Eventually that young pair of steers got to where they were not surprised by anything in the way of a loud noise and they calmed down and became a reliable pair of working steers (oxen). But it was only because they learned to move from the individual to the general concepts of what would or would not hurt them. They learned that a little yappy dog running at their feet was not a danger, but that a large aggressive dog was something that they should kick at or hook at with their horns. They learned that the sound of a fire cracker or a car back firing, or a cannon shooting at a historical reenactment, wasn’t going to hurt them and they didn’t need to pay it any attention. They learned to distinguish between harmless noises like people yelling or laughing and their drover saying “get up” and meaning it!
I’m not sure why these particular steers were so difficult to train. Perhaps it was because the breed was the wilder Spanish cattle from Mexico whose ancestors that had not jumped every time there was a noise in the brush had been taken out of the gene pool by the wolves, coyotes and mountain lions, so only the “jumpy” ones were left.
Changed my response
I’m also not sure why I didn’t generalize from the abusive behavior I endured over and over, or change the failed attempts to get it to stop by doing repeatedly something that had not worked. Someone once said, “insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.” I sure did enough of that for two lifetimes. Now I have changed the way I respond to abusive behavior. I am learning to distinguish the difference between “harmless rattles” and “real threats” from predators.
I have made some general “rules” to guide me in my differentiation of what is “harmless” and what is “threatening.” First off, it depends on how close to me the threat is. A rattle snake at 10 yards from me is no threat at all. I know he could hurt me if he was closer, but I will not let him get close enough to strike me, so I don’t have to fear him. If that same rattle snake is 3 feet from me, I take a different view of the potential for harm from the same snake, and react in a different way than I do to the one who is 30 feet away.
If a person who is not “close to me” lies to me, it probably isn’t going to be much of a danger to me, unless it is a big business deal. I don’t fear that lie from someone I don’t really have any connection with, I just notice (like with the rattle snake at a distance) that the person is dishonest, I don’t want him to get closer to me.
If a person who is “close to me” lies, that has a much bigger potential for harm to me, both emotionally and otherwise. Therefore I will move away from that dishonest person, put some distance between me and them so that if they do strike, they won’t be close enough to hit me or do any significant damage.
Threat or benign
Once I have determined that a person, animal, or object is a potential threat rather than a benign creature, I will keep a wary eye on it. I won’t make excuses for the potential damage, and once it has tried to hurt me, it won’t have another chance. I no longer trust anything or anyone without assessing the potential damage that could be done.
Cynical? No, I don’t think so, just cautious. I don’t venture into the world like there are no dangers out there, no evil people. I do know now that there are some evil creatures in the world, some potential threats to my life, sanity and health. But I no longer walk in terror, because I have realized what the evil creatures are. I am no longer terrified of the “rattling milk jugs,” but I give a wide berth to the “poison snakes.”
I’ve finally personally learned from the “1001e things I did wrong in dealing with psychopaths.”
KatyDid,
The Tarus is great for an in home defense weapon, but TOO HEAVY for carrying around. Mine stays, literally, on my bed and if I have to go out or in the car, I carry a smaller revolver. Though they dont’ have as many bullets, I like a revolver as there is NO chance of jamming or having to worry about a safety catch—the “Tarus Judge” will use the 5-pellet home defense shot gun loads which is the same as five 9mm slugs. Accuracy is not great at over 10 yards but it is not meant for long distance use in any case. If you are defending yourself in your home, you are more likely to be at a 3-5 yard distance in any case. That is very effective at that distance.
For those people who are not able to own a fire arm for whatever reason, ErinB likes a can of WASP SPRAY which shoots a stream of insecticide about 10-20 feet with reasonable accuracy…canned oven cleaner is pretty good for self defense as well, it is pure lye and very caustic. If it is sprayed in someone’s face it will take their attention OFF OF YOU and put it on to finding a water source IMMEDIATELY.
A heavy cast iron skillet is another good self defense object.
Taking a class in self defense is another good option as well. I am not one to sit back and beg a psychopath not to hurt me. There are various ways of defending yourself, and frankly, I am 64 this week and I’m not going to master Judo in 5 days! LOL and really, no one is, but taking some classes in self defense and learning a few moves might be a good idea and some good exercise for younger folks—for me, I figure “God made man and Mr. Colt (or Misters Smith and Wesson) made them EQUAL.” Again, though, if you have not got experience with fire arms, a gun is just something to be taken away from you and used on you. So whatever method of self defense you choose, it needs to be done thoughtfully and carefully so it doesn’t backfire. (literally!)
Several times per day in the US a woman is killed by her significant other—and that is not to take away from men killed by the SO either. If we think that psychopaths won’t kill us, then we are delusional, so better safe than sorry is my motto on the subject of safety.
Ana, I agree with One_step, I think you need to find out if there is some treatment available. Your insurance will determine if you need to go through your primary doc or not, but even if your doesn’t pay there are probably other alternatives available. A grief group is sometimes available through Your local Hospice. Check it out. I went to one through them for my husband’s death. They are good sources of support! (((hugs)))) God bless.
KatyDid, Ox, One-Step, Thanks for the words. Thing is, I don’t know if he has a girlfriend or not so I don’t want to be judging too quick. He is picking up some stuff for me this week at Home Depot. He has a truck and I didn’t want to rent one. I’ll ask him while we’re out if he has a girlfriend and then I’ll have to say you guys were right.
Dancingnancies:
My Spath said the exact same thing…he would say “You’ve changed”. “I want the old Je*** (my name) back”. “Where did she go?”…..etc.
Like maybe I wasnt the same mamby pamby anymore. I read between the lines (lies) with him. I started to get a backbone and realize that I was nothing more than a “supply” for him. He wanted me to remain submissive to him.
Isn’t it amazing how once your eyes are opened to this that it is like a great big BOINK on the head!
I would always tell him that I felt like a was ramming my head into a brick wall….and that eventually the wall would give or my head would split open. Well I didn’t wait for either to happen. I disowned his behavior for good!
And YES, the good ol’ Je*** is back and I LIKE HER!!!!!
Schnoodle
Iwonder,
If you ask him “Do you have a gf” and he says “No, do you want to be my GF?” What are you going to answer? (you dont have to tell me or the blog the answer to that question, but just think about what YOU want to answer. Are YOU keeping him around, waiting for “her” or “them” to go away so YOU can be the GF again?
Why am I asking this? Well, because you said how it hurt you when you went from GF to “friend”—and I can imagine it would hurt if that wasn’t what you wanted.
Just some questions for you to think about.
I have noticed that most i(If not all) sociopaths I have encountered are Type A personalities. Aggressive, insistent in having their own way, and very controlling of the people around them. My S woman is like that as was my father and most recently the now ex auto mechanic who overcharged me last week for putting on a radiator hose for $127 dollars. These people “think they are the smartest people on the planet as well and that makes you(in their minds) the dumbest rock on the planet. You aren’t going to change them and if you think you are you are setting yourself up for one more fall. Staying the H-E- Double Hockey sticks away from them is the best thing you can do for yourself. Period.
Dear Renewedhope,
That narcissistic bent, that feeling of entitlement and superiority is quite common among them, but there are others of them who (once you get to know them well) show that side and that attitude, but up front can appear so HUMBLE AND CARING (excuse me while I lean over and PUKE!)
The ones that are so openly “superior” are irritating but at least they give you some advance warning of what they are, it is the ones who have learned to disguise this attitude under a false mask of caring and humility that are dangerous because it makes them more difficult to figure out as they are conning and screwing you over.
I have some newspaper and magazine articles where my P-sperm donor (somewhat famous) would tell the person interviewing him that he was smarter than Alfred E., and actually was the SMARTEST PERSON ON THE PLANET, he even once compared the rest of humanity (compared to himself) as just malicious chhimpanzes and he felt so alone because no one on the planet was even CLOSE to as smart as he was. DUH!???
Yep, he really said this, and he didn’t even get it that people LAUGHED AT HIM, that people thought he was an arsehole, or that they looked at him with DISGUST…it got him ATTENTION even if it was derisive but he didn’t know the difference between positive attention and derision. As long as he got attention, he didn’t care. He wanted people to envy him, to want to be him, to think he was wonderful—yet he despised and looked down on the very people he wanted to worship him. Since they were WORTHLESS (in his mind) though, their “worship” was meaningless to him. Catch 22.
You are right, renewed, getting AWAY from them is the best solution.
I wonder,
I just read your posts and I’m scared for you. The thing with the firearms is A CLASSIC PLOY. The RED FLAGS ARE GOING OFF AND THERE ARE SIRENS TOO. It triggered me because it is exactly the kind of thing my exP would do. Your friend is the WORST kind of PSYCHOPATH. He is the extremely smart and subtle kind. He is a frog boiler. He works slowly.
The firearm registration being “your secret” is the Red Flag. This is the ploy my ExP uses on EVERY con where the prey ends up DEAD. He would break a “little law” or a “big law” for a good reason and get his “friend” to be complicit with him. And it would be their little secret. This not only creates excitement and a bond, but now he has something on you. You are afraid of going to jail, HE is NOT. They don’t have the same fears as we do.
I can think of so many ways he could screw you over. His weapon (registered to you) could suddenly go missing. and then turn up as evidence in a crime. What are you going to say? Or he could report HIS registered weapon missing and suddenly it turns out to be in your possession. MY GOD. Be very cunning, ask for the weapon registered in your name back and say you want to upgrade it or something. Don’t let it show that you suspect anything.
“I didn’t know what I was dealing with.” They give us the impression they’re good and reasonable people — even loving people — by simply telling us they’re that! Funny how unsophisticated this method is.
Interesting how we often get advice from others asserting that we can change something we do and our abuser will change their attitude toward us as well. Not true. I had repeated run-ins with someone in authority here at work who tried to paint an impression of me with others as a “difficult person.” The best thing I ever did was simply go No Contact — with my supervisor! I did it by asking my department head to reassign me to another section, and he didn’t even ask for an explanation. I did tell him that it was because of something she did that might even be illegal, but that was it. Zero curiosity in this guy. Sometimes . . . the person putting the drama into the situation is ME and my need to explain and to be validated; better to don’t ask, don’t tell, I have learned. The abuser still has to deal with me, and I with her, but I leave her no opening for more than the true business at hand. I was the one who made the change, yes, but I never changed her attitude one iota.
I gave someone advice this past weekend, in no uncertain terms, about a dangerous roommate. Not just immature, unreasonable, or overly dramatic. Dangerous. It took him so long to grasp that word, but didn’t all of us have trouble with it? We can hardly believe this is what is happening to us. These people are “frog boilers” for sure.
My warning is when I get “high” on an argument with someone. I start obsessing about it, and how we’re both “learning from” each other, and how I’m “making a difference.” The pleasant obsession eventually turns to a scary one. Going No Contact, such as blocking the person on Facebook, produces a feeling of relief that validates my suspicions. Once I have some distance, I can see the dynamic more clearly. E-mail and Facebook have revolutionized my perception of spaths because it’s all there, on the page, to trace back my steps and dissect the abuse. If it’s truly my fault, I can see that, too. I can see the drama queens I attract, and how my own needs might have done that.
Good example with the rattlesnake at 3 feet versus 30 feet, Oxy! I have even discovered a couple of people in my life around whom I can manage myself better or even walk out. I manage myself, not them.
Oh yes, that “wanting to get along.” That’s exactly the button they push, and they won’t be shy about it when it’s over, telling everyone that you have a social disease. They know that’s what you least want to hear about yourself. I find, though, that the rumors dissipate.
I once told a psychotherapist that I wasn’t afraid of attacks from people in New York who assumed that because I was from the Midwest I was an easy target — I actually enjoyed taking them for a ride. Checkmate! He thought I was (1) paranoid and (2) cruel. That’s just too bad. The secret to NOT living in fear and paranoia is simply learning the signals and being willing to strike without warning — to be “unreasonable.” After I realized I could do that, without guilt, I felt confident talking to anyone, even people who might be spaths. But even then . . . some people are true artists at this.
iwonder – we are telling you that we are scared for you, and you keep looking for the fantasy. we know their ways; and we can read them in what you have written. and we know about trying to maintain the fantasy, as most of us have done that to different degrees.
you are a sitting duck with this guy. please see that. your hope that he is good enough to be a friend is denial. you need to break the allusion.
I wonder, Sky caught the reference to the weapons registered and the “our little secret”—-did you know it is a FELONY to do that? Yep, my X-DIL P went to jail for buying and registering a gun for the Trojan Horse Psychopath—he couldn’t get one because he was a felon and couldn’t pass the back ground check for a pistol purchase, so SHE bought it and gave it to him, and they had this “little secret” and cooked up that if he got caught with it she would say “Oh, I forgot and left it in his truck” That story didn’t wash with the cops though and she actually got a higher level felony charge than he did for having it and trying to kill my son.
She is on PROBATION for 5 years, and he is off parole and out of prison now…so he is scot free and she’s still under supervision. If she violates any law she will go to prison big time!
My guess is that your X can’t get a gun registered in his name and is using you for a DUPE! “Our little secret” my ass! Sorry I missed that one, GOOD JOB SKY!!!!