By Ox Drover
After reading Steve Becker’s article yesterday, I commented that most of the articles here on Lovefraud that could be entitled “1001 Things I Did Wrong in Dealing with a Psychopath” were the ones that applied most to my own dealings with them.
That was meant as a joke, but after I left that comment for Steve, I got to thinking about how right-on it was, joke or not, because I have done so much wrong in dealing with these people. I got my self deeper and deeper into trouble, doing the wrong things in interacting with them. Not that I was intentionally doing something mean or “wrong” per se, but I didn’t make choices that led to positive outcomes in dealing with the psychopaths in my life.
One of the reasons I did 1001 things wrong was that I didn’t know what I was dealing with. I thought I was dealing with people who had good intentions toward me, just as I had good intentions toward them. Boy, was that a wrong thing to assume. But because I assumed this error in fact about their intentions, I tried to “be reasonable” with them. That sure didn’t work. They broke their word to me time and time again. It took me a long time “to get it through my thick skull,” as MaryJo Buttafuoco said in her book, and then, when I did get it through my thick head that “Person A” couldn’t be trusted, I didn’t “generalize” that knowledge to other people who also broke their words to me over and over and over again.
Learning to generalize
Even animals can learn to generalize. A friend and I trained steer, getting them used to “something that rattled.” It didn’t matter what rattled; we would use plastic milk jugs with rocks in them, and tie those jugs to their tails so that every time they took a step, this “rattling monster” attached to them would make noise and follow them. For a little while they were scared and ran from it, but eventually they got the idea that the “rattling monster” wasn’t going to be outrun by them (it always kept up), and it wasn’t actually going to hurt them. Eventually they decided anything that rattled and made noise was harmless.
With one set of young steers my friend trained though, if you got them used to a white jug with rocks in it, and they weren’t afraid of it any more, if you used a yellow jug, they would go back to SQUARE ONE PANIC AGAIN, with each tiny change in the “monster.” They didn’t “generalize” very well and were always hyper-alert and on guard. He eventually got them so they were “dynamite proof,” so he could take them out in public without being afraid they would panic at the first sound they weren’t used to, or the first loud retort from a fire cracker, but he and I both thought for a long time they might not ever generalize enough to be safe from panicking and running away out in public.
Abusive behavior
I think in a way I also didn’t “generalize” the abusive behaviors of the various psychopaths I encountered. When a boss would be dishonest and verbally abusive to me, I was upset and “panicked” at the unexpected behavior, trying to figure out how to not get hurt, but when a relative would do this same kind of behavior I, again, panicked and didn’t realize that the “rattle” was just the same kind of “monster” that I had encountered with the other psychopath. Of course I didn’t realize then that the psychopathic “monsters” had a name or that their lack of empathy and their damage was definitely destructive, unlike a milk jug with a few rocks in it.
I not only tried to be “reasonable” with the psychopaths, but I also tried to placate them, to make them see, by being extra nice to them and not “bowing up and fighting back,” that I wasn’t trying to hurt them. I wanted to be “friends” and get along.
Of course, when a prey animal tries to get along with a predator animal we know what happens, don’t we? The prey animal gets the worst end of the deal. Yep, I did get the worst end of the deal trying to “make nice” with the psychopaths, but again, I didn’t learn that a psychopath is a psychopath is a psychopath is a predator! Rather than generalize this hurtful behavior to a class of people, I saw each one as an individual person with “reasons” and “excuses” and the “potential to change” and “see the light” when there was no chance that they were going to have any empathy, much less sympathy, for the pain they caused me or anyone else. They didn’t give a hoot how badly they hurt me as long as they got what they wanted.
Wanted to get along
I also didn’t really see what it was that they actually wanted. I didn’t want to cause anyone any pain, I wanted to love people and get along with them and share good things and help folks out. This is what I thought that everyone wanted. What they actually did want, however, was to control me, humiliate me, and to get me to provide them with their own twisted idea of a relationship—all take on their part and all give on mine.
Just like the hyper-alert steers, I didn’t feel comfortable, and was always jumpy, expecting something to hit me, but I wasn’t sure where it would come from, so each time a psychopath lied to me, stole from me, took advantage of me, I was totally surprised again and again.
Eventually that young pair of steers got to where they were not surprised by anything in the way of a loud noise and they calmed down and became a reliable pair of working steers (oxen). But it was only because they learned to move from the individual to the general concepts of what would or would not hurt them. They learned that a little yappy dog running at their feet was not a danger, but that a large aggressive dog was something that they should kick at or hook at with their horns. They learned that the sound of a fire cracker or a car back firing, or a cannon shooting at a historical reenactment, wasn’t going to hurt them and they didn’t need to pay it any attention. They learned to distinguish between harmless noises like people yelling or laughing and their drover saying “get up” and meaning it!
I’m not sure why these particular steers were so difficult to train. Perhaps it was because the breed was the wilder Spanish cattle from Mexico whose ancestors that had not jumped every time there was a noise in the brush had been taken out of the gene pool by the wolves, coyotes and mountain lions, so only the “jumpy” ones were left.
Changed my response
I’m also not sure why I didn’t generalize from the abusive behavior I endured over and over, or change the failed attempts to get it to stop by doing repeatedly something that had not worked. Someone once said, “insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.” I sure did enough of that for two lifetimes. Now I have changed the way I respond to abusive behavior. I am learning to distinguish the difference between “harmless rattles” and “real threats” from predators.
I have made some general “rules” to guide me in my differentiation of what is “harmless” and what is “threatening.” First off, it depends on how close to me the threat is. A rattle snake at 10 yards from me is no threat at all. I know he could hurt me if he was closer, but I will not let him get close enough to strike me, so I don’t have to fear him. If that same rattle snake is 3 feet from me, I take a different view of the potential for harm from the same snake, and react in a different way than I do to the one who is 30 feet away.
If a person who is not “close to me” lies to me, it probably isn’t going to be much of a danger to me, unless it is a big business deal. I don’t fear that lie from someone I don’t really have any connection with, I just notice (like with the rattle snake at a distance) that the person is dishonest, I don’t want him to get closer to me.
If a person who is “close to me” lies, that has a much bigger potential for harm to me, both emotionally and otherwise. Therefore I will move away from that dishonest person, put some distance between me and them so that if they do strike, they won’t be close enough to hit me or do any significant damage.
Threat or benign
Once I have determined that a person, animal, or object is a potential threat rather than a benign creature, I will keep a wary eye on it. I won’t make excuses for the potential damage, and once it has tried to hurt me, it won’t have another chance. I no longer trust anything or anyone without assessing the potential damage that could be done.
Cynical? No, I don’t think so, just cautious. I don’t venture into the world like there are no dangers out there, no evil people. I do know now that there are some evil creatures in the world, some potential threats to my life, sanity and health. But I no longer walk in terror, because I have realized what the evil creatures are. I am no longer terrified of the “rattling milk jugs,” but I give a wide berth to the “poison snakes.”
I’ve finally personally learned from the “1001e things I did wrong in dealing with psychopaths.”
You know, it’s amazing when I look at my family, which was probably even low on the “dysfunctional” scale before today (I just got beaten by my Mom this morning, what the hell??!) — well, what about that made me a target for spaths? Probably being that one person in the family who was supposed to just smile and handle it all gracefully while everyone else freaked out. I should have been a monster, really. I should have told them off when I was 14. But no, I had to be such a good kid. It only groomed me for a life of abuse. . . . And now, being told pretty explicitly that I’m expected to be that person who just takes it like a doormat is pretty eye opening. Thanks at least for the clarity! I guess I just “don’t live here anymore.”
Sistersister, one of the books that I”ve read that was a true personal epiphany for me was, “Healing The Shame That Binds You,” by John Bradshaw. It’s a bit older, but the discussion is still VERY much applicable to me, personally. I recommend this publication to anyone who has been victimized, on any level. Not necessarily because all victims had dysfunctional childhoods, but because the greater majority of victims suffer shame after their experiences, regardless of what they endured.
Brightest blessings
The Betrayal Bond: Breaking free of exploitative relationships.
That’s the title, Dupey.
Sister, sister, you got beaten up by your mum today? WTF???
Are you ok!!
Dupey, glad you had fun yesterday at your Granddaughter’s recital. And you sound so great..a poster child for Lexapro? Any side effects of note? I’m sure it just gave you the boost you needed to be your strong, best Dupey! I always carry nuggets from your posts with me. Very appreciative.
Yes, strong and Dupey, I do have a hub that cooks. I’m lucky there. He is a good person. Marriage has always been a fantasy goal for me. Way too many expectations. As a child, I would get physically lovesick over movie stars. It’s very pathetic. But I suppose it all has to do with my wiring and that love/hate deal with mom, not really trusting dad. It’s too much to even consider.
Strong, thx for the nice compliment…..as to why path may have been attracted to me…the hard part is realizing they just want those things for themselves, they don’t really want to be with you. It’s so difficult to grasp. I often wondered why it was so easy for him to just leave me stranded emotionally and physically. When I would see his IM button go white, which meant he was gone for the day, my heart would sink. No goodbye, no email, nothing. OK enuf of that.
I was a teacher as well and have many happy memories from those days. Love, love, love music, as well as knowing what a strong and positive effect it can have on kids. Good on ya Strong!! We need more like you in the classroom.
Dupey, be well and know you are loved and well appreciated…hey I know that you know that already.
Wow, yes, just read sister’s post as well…
Sister, verbally beat up? Are you an adult?
sistersister: I am so sorry for what has happened to you.
I used to be beaten as a very small child (it started at 3 years old) and locked in the cellar for hours on end. I remember sitting down there, in the dark, crying, with my eyes closed, thinking if I didn’t peer into the darkness, there would be nothing to harm me and it wasn’t always easy to see in that deep darkness. It would blind you so it was easier just to keep my eyes closed. There were no lights at all down there.
I would always ask the Angels to come and sit with me until that door would open again. I always believed and still do, to this day, that they came and sat with me.
As soon as Grandfather would leave for work, the beatings and verbal abuse, by my Grandmother, would start and I would always end up in the cellar. It was always so dark and cold down there. Lots of creepy bugs and just horrid dirty. She would open the door just before he came home from work (he worked afternoons) and tell me to go wash up and get ready for bed. I was always asleep by the time he got home. This went on for years. From like the time I was 3 years old until I became a teenager. When I became a teenager, I used to grab a hold of her (she was a small build woman) and sit her down in a chair or on the sofa and hold her and yell at her: “YOU STOP THIS; THIS IS NOT NECESSARY.”
Shortly after that, Grandfather died, when I turned 16 and I had no choice but to leave home and rely upon and build upon MYSELF. I never had a real mother or father, my whole lifetime. I don’t know what it means to ‘have a mother’ or ‘have a father’ because I had a Grandfather who was my saving grace in this lifetime. I was sexually abused by my Grandmothers nephew. I was kidnapped on my way to grade school one day for a drug debt my ‘mother’ owed someone. Can’t remember how long they held me, I just kind of locked all that memory away somewhere, deep down inside, but I do remember law enforcement showing me mug shots. UGH! My entire childhood was raped away from me from all the drama and chaos and dysfunction and I had to make some tough choices as to what I wanted my life to be for myself. There was NO WAY I was going to walk down ANY OF THOSE PATHS I WAS SEEING. So, I built myself. I found that courage and strength inside me and rebuilt myself. It doesn’t just happen over night, though. That’s the hardest part. BEING PATIENT and setting boundaries and standing up for what you know is right and proper and just inside your heart. You must be completely honest with yourself when you make these choices. You will never be completely ‘settled with yourself’ unless you are completely honest in making your choices. Whatever they might be.
I know how very difficult it is to be in your position, I guess is what I am trying to say to you. My love and hugs and heart is with you sistersister…if you need us, we are always here for you. It is not necessary to take abuse of any kind. While I don’t know all of your situation and circumstances, I would love to know that you are not in a dangerous situation. If you feel you are, you know there are people out here who will help you.
Sometimes teenagers and parents have ‘rough moments’ and I am praying this is the case, in this instance. If it is not, please do seek assistance. If you need direction, we are here to be the best ‘back up’ we possibly can.
I will be praying for you, sistersister…
please do come back and let us know how you are doing –
Be well and safe.
Dupey
still reeling: Hello This Wonderful Day we have been BLESSED WITH; hm? (And, that’s not just the Lexapro talking…lol)
The only ‘side effects’ I have noticed is having a tendency to sleep too much (I also take a medication to prevent heart attack and/or stroke that is very potent) and the creepy crawlies that wake me in the middle of the night, like bugs crawling all over me. ICK! I so hate waking up and feeling like I am being crawled all over. lol
But, you know what? That is a minor irritation compared to the benefits I am receiving from it. I have tried a lot of different things and this has been the only thing that really works for me. So, yes, I guess you may see my mug on a poster for it some day. lol I say: I wish I had known about this 20 years ago, at least! Perhaps I wouldn’t have had to be so miserable. And, “I” am a real ANTI DRUG kind of person, so this is huge for me to say.
You flatter me, still reeling: “….always carry nuggets from my posts with you….” I am so happy to know that my screw ups are enlightening someone else. hahahahaha That makes it all seem worth it. mwahhh!! xxoo
OMG: you are sooo fortunate you have a cooking and NICE husband. Right on! Congratulations! I am always so happy for people that it works for; truly. May you be happy always and forever….what’d you have to eat??? hehehe
Thanks, still reeling, for your years of service to the world by being a teacher, as well. A lot of people have a tendency to NOT SEE “WHAT” a teacher is all about. Growing up, for me, was so enriched by my teachers in school. Sometimes the smallest kindness or word made all the difference in the world.
Love you too still reeling….Thank YOU for all the wonderful things you have shared with ME……You are a part of my life in a very special way and don’t you ALL ever forget that.
Have a happy day and be good to yourself…
And, yes, the recital was absolutely amazing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dupey
Still reeling and others who have trouble “setting boundaries” about what we do for others or expect them to do for themselves, there are TONS of books out there that talk about hhow to set boundaries and what they should be. No sense in me trying to reinvent the wheel here. Learning to set boundaries is all about what we expect others to do for themselves.
“Helping” others when they really don’t need or ask for your help and then getting mad at them because they don’t volunteer up to “help” you is a game in which a person “rescues” others then gets mad at them when they don’t want the kind of help they are being given…. Your mother may not have known how to make friends without engaging in this sort of situation. But we have the opportunities to find plenty of good books on setting boundaries. Knowing when to help and when to say, I’m not able to. When helping is helping and when it is “enabling.”
These are things I had to learn too…and I read til my eyes fell out and then I started practicing what I had learned. I realized I was enabling lots of folks and I stopped doing that and started expecting them to do for themselves what was their responsibility.
Sure, friends “do things” or their friends but they also have the right to say “NO, I can’t do that” and not have the friend get pissed about it.
Hey Dupey!!
Thx for the cheery post. You are so uplifting. So glad the lex is working well for you…nah, no one likes the creepies during the night esp, but maybe that will subside…if you’re saying it’s from the Lexapro and not the heart med you take.
Come on!! Your golden nuggets are from your golden brain! Many people screw up and do not spew nuggets as a result. You need to give yourself tons more credit for just being smart. If we’re lucky, very fortunate, we learn something from adversity. Not everyone does!! I have chosen to be angry over some of the bad things that have occurred in my life and to not give that up…but it’s a choice. Others, I think I have learned from, and where I’m not glad they happened, I’m glad I’m a more aware and accepting person. I wish I were tougher and saw adversity as a challenge. I try to remember that. It can be very helpful in gathering your strength.
Just got home from a networking seminar and it was very depressing, I have to admit. Everyone there had amazing skills. At first, I felt pretty upbeat, but by the time they got around to me, it was past the end time of the seminar, plus I felt like so overwhelmed by all the talent around me, I couldn’t speak. They were glad because it was late, but I just felt like I’m not going to find work. It’s very scary. I am older and have done customer service work for 30 yrs.
The rest had so many degrees, multi-lingual, heavy into the sciences or corporate VIP’s…I didn’t belong there. And the whole deal with resumes today being scanned and canned if they don’t have the right terms…a diff resume for every job for which you apply. Geez, I don’t think I can do that anymore for a cust svc job….I’m kind of really scared esp since I just had to buy a car and my daughter still doesn’t have a FT job…I’m scared. I don’t see how HP could have put me out on the street. I did my job so well and I’m not just saying that…but I think I’ve bored you all with that before. I’m just too old and not educated enuf to compete. Then even the job with path, well it sucked, but at least it as a job….G-d.
I hear you Ox…an interesting take on drawing that line, But I still have trouble with that theory. My mom’s “friends” did ask her to do babysit, etc., and she did it. I know she was afraid to “speak up,” as she used to say, but then she’d get so mad, she’d blow up. I’m very much like her.
Right now, I need to call the mechanic to find out if I can leave my car there overnight. He was a little snippy to me this morning because he was real busy and I find I’m afraid to call him.
Ya know what, I’m just going to call it a day.
Thanks everyone!!!
You are all terrific…
Hi still reeling,
Thanks for the vote of confidence. I came to teaching late! In my 6th year so still reeling! Lol. No, I do love it. Why are you in customer servs? How come you don’t teach?
Totally agree with what you said to Dupey, btw. Not everyone learns from mistakes and then goes on to turn that exp into something positive and help others.
Ox,
Wise words, as always. Yes I’ve thought a lot lately about these tendencies I have as a fixer and a saver. Helping people that can help themselves. Oh dear. Futile and, well, totally undeserved! In the spaths case particularly. It’s like a type of arrogance. I believed he could change. For me. I was special enough to bridge the gap. Boy what was I thinking! Hindsights a wonderful thing, so they say. And now I’m on this path of self discovery which is good but also uncomfortable as I have to admit my part in all this. Unwittingly or otherwise, I did enable him to have that hold over me. You’ve said before that it’s acceptance and forgiveness that will let me move on. I’m learning to forgive myself. That’s a start don’t you think? Oh the guilt has eaten away and it’s very presence has stopped me really looking at me. Too painful because I felt so bad for such a long time. It’s not a time of my life I like to examine closely and have attempted to shelve it. Which I think is right. But the darndest things suddenly pop into my head…..memories that, well, I don’t know where they’ve been lurking.
Anyway, I’m getting there. Slowly. Looking forward to the book I’ve ordered. I’m lucky. I know that. And I’m not looking for someone to say ….strongawoman, you’re pain is as bad as anyone elses. I’m just looking and learning, I hope. That dark part of my life is not a period that I care to remember too well. Fingers burned and them red flags are fluttering, strong and high for me to see.