As human beings, we all want love and companionship in our lives. It’s a basic human need, right up there with the needs for food, water and shelter. When we are lacking an intimate relationship, most of us try to fill the empty space. That leads to dating.
Here is what you need to know about dating and predators.
1. Evil exists.
What the evil is called—psychopath, sociopath, antisocial personality disorder, narcissist—really doesn’t matter. There are evil people out there, and they can be found in all segments of society—rich, poor, male, female, all races, all religions, all communities. They look like everyone else, but they are predators.
2. If you are dating, you are a target.
As an unattached person, you’re probably feeling a bit lonely—that’s why you’re looking for dates. This is natural and understandable. What you need to realize is that predators specialize in targeting lonely people. They know exactly how to find this vulnerability and exploit it by seeming to take the loneliness away. They shower you with attention, flatter you and promise you a lifetime of happiness—exactly what you’re looking for.
3. Meeting people on the Internet is extremely dangerous.
Yes, there are normal people on dating sites. But there are also predators, and communicating via the computer you do not have the tools you need to spot them. Most of the true meaning of conversation comes from nonverbal cues—voice, facial expression and body language. None of that is available in an e-mail. So what do you do? You fill in the missing pieces with your imagination, and the person becomes what you want him or her to be. You fall in love with a fantasy. For more information, see Internet Threat and Online Seduction on Lovefraud.com.
4. Predators are often charming.
If you meet someone who is glib, charismatic and has a quick answer to every question, be aware that these traits may indicate excellent social skills—or a psychopath. Pay close attention to what is actually being said. Are there gaps or inconsistencies? Is the person evasive? Does the person change plans or break promises—and always has an excuse? If you’re nodding your head, proceed with caution. For more information, see Key Symptoms on Lovefraud.com.
5. Watch for the pity play.
According to Martha Stout, author of The Sociopath Next Door, the best clue that you are dealing with a sociopath is an appeal to your sympathy. If you’re dealing with someone who tries to make you feel sorry for him or her, blaming other people or “the system” for his or her problems, consider it a warning that the person may be a sociopath. For more information, see The Pity Play on Lovefraud.com.
6. Predators are often great in bed.
Many people who were involved with sociopaths have told Lovefraud that the sex was amazing. Sociopaths are often skilled lovers for two reasons: First, with an excessive need for stimulation, they are hard-wired for sex. Second, they get a lot of practice, often with anyone who comes along. In reality, sociopaths want only two things: sex and power. They do not feel love.
7. Do not ignore red flags.
Maybe something seems wrong but you can’t put your finger on it. Perhaps there’s a nagging feeling in your gut. Pay attention. Do not let him or her explain away your doubts. Do not tell yourself he or she has gotten a raw deal and your love is the solution. To avoid becoming the victim of a predator, your instincts are your best defense.
Tami – having contact really clarifies why we don’t want to have contact! You have analyzed why he contacted you, and I want to add one thing – i suspect those words and ‘worries’ are being put in his mouth by the gf. I am not saying he isn’t responsible, but questioning someone’s mental health a classic spath set up.
p.s. I LOVE your husband’s response to him.
Hello, all! I’m a (grateful) troll for almost a year now and have finally gotten the courage (or healing) to recently start posting. I LOVE< LOVE< LOVE this site and look forward to reading all the comments because I can relate to so much having a P father, N mother that was murdered along with my baby brother by a hitman he hired. The motive was money. He's in jail for LWOP and me and my lil sis are the remaining kids. She has since scapegoated me with my mom's very large extended family so I've had barely any contact with her over a year after I didn't attend her wedding. I suspect she married a disordered man she knew for barely six months who appears more than happy to support her decision to have NC with me and my two teenaged kids. My mom's sister, who raised my sister is a Malignant N, and is also ECSTATIC that she finally succeeded in separating me and my sis after decades of trying.
I just posted on the investment banker letter thread about an S I almost got involved with this summer. I just jumped back into the dating pool this year after spending a few years grieving the death of my ex-hubby and my children's father. He was an active alcoholic/addict and he crashed his motorcycle while drunk driving on his birthday. So, yeah, I was a mess all over again because all of my grief over my mom, my baby brother and my ex hit me like a TON of bricks.
Now, I'm dating a guy I've known casually for 3 years. He's caring, supportive and seems eager to finally connect on a deeper level after a few times of us casually dating. The problem is I've dealt with so many traumas, tragedies and crazy situations, my life is like reading Tolstoy to his Marvel comic books. Not to be dismissive (maybe I am) but he's a few years younger than me – early 30's, no kids, no long term relationships and just beginning his career path.
I'm starting over from scratch in every way, so maybe it will work. I just keep him at arm's length but he really seems okay with it. He is a little "slow," which is hard to adjust to after years of being love bombed and quickly "possessed" by disordered men- including my own P dad. I tend to gravitate toward all the bad things in S, P's behaviors due to that subconscious conditioning. This guy just doesn't create a sense of excitement in me, so I focus on how stable and responsible he is. We had our first fight and he willingly backed down and tried to make things right, whereas most of the disordered men I know would project on to me and find a way to cunningly bring up a trigger in order to "win" the argument. He seemed genuinely concerned that the argument upset me. Wow, dating after being tormented by disordered folks is so dang complicated!
Tami,
Yea, I think you are right…he is “projecting” the “worried about you” when in fact, he is I think worried about HIMSELF and that there is a “back up plan” (run to mom) when things go south with the GF!
Welcome IMTMR74–Glad you are “starting over in every way” Learning about “them” is a start, then learning about ourselves is the last part of the healing. God bless.
Tami, I’ve read all your posts and just wanted to say I really admire you and feel for you with what you’re going through with your son and gf. Horrendous!
So glad you’re feeling your life is back on track and you are as you say “living life for yourself”
Too many times we put up with shiat because we feel morally bound to do so. Theyre my child, hes my lover, shes my friend! He’s my dad. It is because you care. Simple. They know that. They take advantage and before you know it you are on the merry go round again. I’ve gone back more times than I can remember. Given more chances than I should have
“I’ll be a fool for your loving no more” in the words of Whitesnake. I wish
you strength. It’s ok to say no. No and er…..no!!!!!!!!!
Of all things! I ate the words I typed in my last message. Got a text from my son on Tuesday apologizing for not coming down on Saturday…claimed he had a “bronchial infection”. Okay, so my 31 year old baby is sick! I signed into the blasted gmail account that HE asked me to set up in order to communicate with me…just couldn’t STOP myself! I asked him if he had seen a doctor…seems like he’s been sick a LOT over the last 4 months. Kind of worries me since the spath got her LPN’s license last May and now thinks she’s a doctor! At any rate, he said “no, that it was just the same old ‘sinus’ infection that he’d had for the last few months”. Unless my son is picking up the spath’s lingo…I don’t think I’ve ever him use the word “bronchial”…he would have said that he’d had “bronchitis” and he certainly knows the difference between his head and his chest! I told him that he needed to see a doc and get some antibiotics to clear this sinus infection up that he’s had for months before it turned into something more serious. No response.
Also, he designed the webpage for my husband’s company and it’s down right now. Apparently, we somehow lost the spot we paid for it and it’s going to have to be set back up with with whoever it is that we purchased the space from to publish it with online. We paid for 5 years and only my son knows who to contact. My husband asked me to ask him if he could get it back up and running. All the files live SOMEWHERE on our home computer. My son said he could get in published if I’d send him the files! I told him that I had no idea where he’d saved the files and that it would be much easier just to come down here and do it! No response. I finally shot him another line and told him to just forget it and that we’d either hire someone else or I’d purchase a do-it-yourself website program. Call me mean but I told him that I just kept forgetting that someone has a tight grip on his balls these days! He then responded with “ok, I’ll come down there”. He’s NOT going to come down here because he’s not ALLOWED to! I’m sick of this “shiat” as strongawoman referred to it.
And, YES, Oxy, it’s clear to me that he is conducting “checks” with me to make sure that MOM is still going to be in the pic. It’s quite clear to me that he is NOT allowed to communicate even though the spath told me in that last conversation that his not talking to me was “his choice”. That was during the call a couple of weeks back when I screwed up and answered a number that I did not recognize and that she should not have been anywhere NEAR the area code that the call came from. Well, it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that the only time he contacts me if from his work computer when he is at work! I NEVER hear from him before or after his work shift nor on the weekends when he is off work. Mama ain’t no fool! If he doesn’t want to hear her screaming and cussing him for “disobeying” her by talking to his mother, FINE, just admit it and stop covering for her sorry ass by acting like I’m out of my mind for thinking such a thing! Or, if he’s afraid of the witch, he should realize that he needs to run for the hills!
And, another thing, I heard from a long time friend of mine yesterday that moved 3 hours away a few years ago. She was at work and said she was having a slow day and just had me on her mind. She updated me about her life and told her that all was well with me except for this situation with the upcoming grandchild that might not even belong to my son. She asked when the baby was due and I told her. She immediately told me the date of conception which does not match up with my son’s involvement with the spath. Duh! Totally forgot that she is a nurse ans works in an ob/gyn’s office. She had the chart right in front of her. I also told her about the spath’s claims that her doctor had said that the baby is going to be an unusually large baby. She claimed that she herself weighed over 10 pounds when she was born! LMAO! My friend said everyone knows that pill heads’ babies have a low birth weight and that more than likely the baby will be born before the due date given that she was a heavy user and is now on the med used to managed her withdrawal symptoms which the baby will ALSO be born addicted to. I told my friend that I had read everything she was telling me a zillion times! And, that this elaborate lie about the baby being unusually large due to HER being a large baby was NOT going to match up when she delivers BEFORE the due date that she has now told everyone. Premature babies do NOT weigh as much as full term babies and especially premature babies born to drug addicts! She would have been better off to have kept her mouth shut! More than likely the baby will have a birth weight a little lower than normal and then she might have been able to justify its early arrival! But she’s always thinking ahead about how to cover the next lie yet she thinks so highly of herself that she believes everyone is too stupid to do the math or have any knowledge other than herself! I expect the baby to be born around the first week or second week of January IF it’s full term and any day now if it isn’t. And, if it’s a full-term baby, there’s NO way that it belongs to my son. I think that’s another reason she HAS to keep me out of the picture. She knows that she might be able to convince my son of these things but she can’t convince me.
Well, there’s my rant for the day! I appreciate all of your kindness and patience. Oh, I also shot my son a quick message informing him that this weekend would be a great time for him to work on the webpage because I’m going out of town for the weekend with a friend but my husband will be here.
Tami, oof she has got a tight grip on him! You are such a threat to her any wonder she wants you out of the picture. If it’s anything like my relationshit with my ex spath…….your son knows deep down that something is seriously wrong here but is powerless to change it. For now!!
(Esp as she is, allegedly, carrying his baby. Time will tell).
You must be worried sick. Sending you extra strength. Have a nice day
Tami,
it’s hard to understand how you have never seen your son’s disorder before. He is clearly triangulating you with his new gf.
He doesn’t even care if the baby is his, he just wants to feed off your emotions. I would say he’s a spath. If anyone had come here and described his behavior but told us he was their husband or bf, we would all have immediately said: SPATH.
I do agree that is gf is a sick person, but he is equally sick – maybe more. He likes the drama with YOU. And he is using HER personality disorder to create it.
When I first met my spath, there was a woman hoarder who lived upstairs. In hindsight, I’m sure he was screwing her. She would come down to our matchbox apartment while I was trying to sleep. Spath and I were laying in bed and she sat on a chair making small talk.
Because I don’t feel jealousy, I just thought she was strange. It never occurred to me that their was something going on between them. But now I know that he was trying to triangulate me with her and create a jealous rivalry. LOL! I don’t do rivalry or jealousy so nothing happened except that I was nice and polite to her.
I think that’s where you have to go: GRAY ROCK.
Don’t go NC because that will only make him call you with more fake illnesses and drama. You won’t be able to resist. Instead, your goal should be to make HIM go NC with you. Be boring. Do not react except with platitudes. Act like you’re on prozac.
Be a ditzy mom who doesn’t “get” anything. Do NOT react with drama. And make sure you don’t talk about him to anyone who MIGHT leak the info back to him. If you need to vent, come here. But otherwise, play your cards close and channel a gray rock.
If you want this drama to end, you have to stop participating in it.
Dear Tami,
I agree with Sky on this one, “if you want the drama to end you have to stop participating in it.” STOP BUYING TICKETS to the show.
Of course she is lying and anyone with “one eye and half sense” could see through her lies, but it doesn’t matter that she is lying.
YOUR SON is doing exactly what MY son C did with his P-wife who didn’t like me…he is using her as an EXCUSE of why he isn’t coming around, why he is in financial trouble, etc. when in fact, the point of the whole thing was HE DIDN’T WANT TO COME AROUND, HE DIDN’T WANT TO MANAGE HIS FINANCES well….etc.
It is difficult to face, Tami, and two years ago in January I asked my son to leave my house, and have had a VERY distant relationship with him since then….and only communicate with him about business that we have to do together in order to try to keep his psychopathic brother Patrick in prison. Otherwise, NC.
I don’t expect he will come rob my house, or shoot me, I’m not afraid of C, he isn’t a psychopath, but he is not the kind of man I want for a FRIEND and I sure can’t TRUST him to do what he says he will do, and I can’t DEPEND on him.
This whole drama with your son and the baby and all the other stuff has you in the “spin cycle” going round and round, trying to figure out some way to get HIM TO SEE WHAT IS GOING ON. Well he DOES SEE and things are JUST THE WAY HE WANTS THEM, with LOTS OF DRAMA RAMA.
It is your choice to buy a ticket for the festival or not. As long as you are trying to play one of the roles in this Drama either victim, rescuer or persecutor then you are involved.
Right now your son is playing the VICTIM role and trying to get you to play the rescuer role, and of course the woman is the persecutor trying to stick him with paternity of her bastard. The TRUTH is though Tami, YOU CANNOT RESCUE HIM…he enjoys the game (regardless of what he says) because he is staying with her, but it is a 3-handed game, and he needs someone to be the “rescuer” right now, but before long he will change your role to “persecutor” with the woman as the victim, along with her poor baby! Their baby. What a drama!
I agree with the triangulation observations made… yeah, he wants to check whether you’re still in the picture, but he’s doing more than that… Telling you and your hubby that you are the one who’s overreacting. That sounds pretty close t gaslighting imo.
Avoiding contact (as in not initiating it) is a first step… and I agree with Sky that now you need to play it so that he will leave you alone with “his concern fr your mental well-being”. GRAY ROCK!
Dear Tami,
Sorry that you have to go through this. But after reading many of your posts, it’s clear to me that you are in a situation that’s quite familiar to me. In fact, your son sounds like the exact replica of my former best friend of twenty five years.
I won’t go into all the details, but from my own experience, let me point out a few things. First, whether or not your son is a sociopath, he is certainly weak and spineless to a degree where it almost amounts to the same thing. (Especially since he is playing “puppet” for someone who probably is a sociopath.) Indeed, there is a very definite point where moral weakness shades off into moral evil, and the two become for all practical purposes, indistinguishable.
Second, (and with all due respect), I think you are being naive if you think the GF is the only one addicted to narcotics. I’ve seen this scenario play out ad nauseum, and I have to tell you that it’s 999 chances out of 1000 that he is using too. It might take you some time to wrap your head around this, but trust me, this is so common that it would be an absolute miracle if they aren’t both in this together. (By the way, frequent spells of “sickness” are very commonly “junkie-ese” for withdrawal periods.) I don’t want to sound preachy, but one of my closest friends is a doctor who specializes in narcotics addiction, and we’ve seen and discussed this precise scenario (i.e., with respect to my friend, who also became a narcotics fiend) for years. So for what it’s worth…..
In a way, this is all “neither here nor there.” But it is interesting how the combination of a “low” woman and narcotics, can completely compromise and undermine someone’s moral fibre. (And turning them into something very like a genuine sociopath.) My friend was definitely a good guy when we grew up together – no one was ever closer to me. But I literally watched this nonsense unfold over a twelve year period, and kept hanging on to “who he used to be” – in stark contrast to who he was gradually and hopelessly becoming. (And yes, it was a matter of a “transformation,” rather than my “not seeing it” before.)
Of all the things that bothered me (besides the thousands in loans that he refused and still refuses to repay), what irritated me most was his WEAKNESS. Really, there’s nothing more vile than a weak grovelling little man without a backbone! (Perhaps it’s a bit sexist, but I do think the phrase “MAN UP”! is quite as appropriate for you son as it is for my former best friend.) Indeed, it’s maddening to even read your posts regarding the pathetic and furtive little “scraps” he is throwing you from his work computer. And make no mistake about it Tami, they ARE scraps – and rather degrading ones at that.
My take on this is that you need to cut him off entirely, because this will certainly never get better through indulgences on your part. To be honest, it may very well never get better. But the one thing certain here is that every time you talk to him under these pathetic conditions, he is making a fool of you. That is, every time you speak with him (i.e. scamper under the table for one of his crumbs), you are basically forfeiting his love AND respect. Whereas if you go NC, you will at least keep the respect part. What’s more, on the off chance that he does reform some day, it will at least give you a foundation on which to rebuild your relationship.
At any rate, I wish you all the best. I hope my post sounds like kind advice from a fellow traveler, because that’s how it’s intended. But as you can see, it is a subject that hits rather close to home for me too – which is why I’m using forceful language to describe my view of this.
By the way, I often think about the high school days (twenty odd years ago) when me, my best friend and my sociopath girlfriend were all driving around in her dad’s car. Alas, who would have ever guessed that everyone who meant anything to me at that time, would have turned out to be so utterly contemptible, vile, and despicable?
But like I said before, Tami, I at least have the pride of knowing that that I eventually “got it,” stuck to my principles and cut both of them off forever. And there’s something to be said for the self-respect that comes from that kind of decisiveness.
Best of luck and hoping the same for you.