By | August 24, 2008 65 Comments

After the sociopath is gone: Inspired Change

I receive a weekly newsletter from Brian Willis at Winning Mind Training. In his latest newsletter he quotes Lon Bartel, a law enforcement trainer in Arizona who said, “People change out of desperation or inspiration. Desperation results in short term change. Inspiration, results in powerful and lasting change.”

When I was in relationship with the sociopath, I made desperate changes. Living in constant fear, I was desperate to keep him happy. In my desperation, I contorted and distorted myself to fit the image he told me I had to fit. Most of what I did was about keeping him happy and my life, as it were, intact. Often, the changes I made were ‘inspired’ by his anger. I would do just about anything not to have to experience his anger, and he knew it. Because I believed him when he told me I could never be free of him, I didn’t look beyond the narrow corridor of my life with him, to see that away from him was where real change happened. Away from him was where my freedom started.

Using intermittent reinforcement, he trained me to be his co-conspirator in my self-destruction. He would rage and I would succumb. The breaks between rage and ‘happiness’ grew shorter and shorter, and I became less and less willing to tempt the fates by disagreeing with him. I learned very quickly that my silence and acquiescence bought his ‘good humour’. Eventually, it took less energy on his part to keep me silent as I fell beneath the weight of the sorrow that was pervading my life and my fear of his anger. Desperate for the return of Prince Charming, I kept letting go of what I knew to be right so that I wouldn’t have to face the Prince of Darkness raging before me.

And then, one day he was arrested and I was set free. In that moment I was inspired to make lasting change. To accept the gift of his removal from my life as a miracle, and to soar free.

Lasting change comes easy when we are inspired to create the life of our dreams away from abuse.

I am often contacted by women and men who are involved with an abuser. They write to tell me their stories, and to ask me how they can change what is happening in their lives. My response is always — love yourself enough to know you deserve more than his/her abuse. Love yourself as an abused woman/man and give yourself the gift of freedom by naming what he/she is doing and choosing to accept you have the power to change your life. You can’t change him/her. In fact, whether or not he/she can change is not the question. Are you willing to make an inspired change in your life by stepping away from him/her and stopping the abuse in your life?

Sounds easy — it’s not when the abusers voice is roaring through your mind, telling you lies you can’t believe but don’t dare disbelieve.

One of the hardest aspects of leaving an abuser is naming what they’re doing as abuse. Our minds recoil from the reality, fall back from the precipice of the truth. How could someone who says they love me, willing, knowingly, consciously choose to hurt me?

Believe it. Name it. They will. They can. They do.

Accepting that truth is frightening. If they could do it willingly, then what role do I play in what is happening, in what happened? Answering that is tough. We don’t want to be participants in abuse, and so cannot accept that we had something to do with what has happened to us.

The inspired choice, the choice that will create lasting change, is to accept — I am 100% accountable for what happened to me. Doesn’t make what he/she did right. And it doesn’t make me accountable for what he did. Abuse is never right. What it means is, I accept I can’t change the past, or what he’s doing. I can, however, turn up for me today and take 100% responsibility for what I do, right now, in this moment.

“Nobody can go back and start a new beginning, but anyone can start today and make a new ending.” Maria Robinson

It accepting that I am 100% accountable for my life today, I also accept I have the power to make inspired, not desperate changes. I accept the challenge of choosing long term change over short term relief from his/her abuse.

Hard stuff. Life changing. Liberating. But hard.

When we ‘love’ someone who is an abuser, our minds become twisted into the insanity of their crazy-making behaviours. Love shouldn’t hurt as much as it does, but we begin to accept the pain of loving them as part of the norm of our existence. In that acceptance, we let go of our belief in our right to live free of abuse. For some, living free of abuse has never been their reality. For others, the crazy-making of the abuser is new — and thus, a surprise, an unbelievable occurrence in their lives. Regardless of whether we were conditioned to accept abuse or accept it because of current conditions, we repeatedly explain it away when we say, “I can’t believe this is happening to me”.

Believing we are being abused is the first step to creating lasting change.

Believing we have the power to change our lives — and acknowledging we cannot change the abuser, is the next step.

Inspired change requires courage. It takes guts and it takes a commitment to self that overrides the voices in our heads telling us ‘this (the past, abuse, pain and turmoil…) is all we deserve’.

No one deserves abuse. No one deserves to live in fear.

And no one can give us the gift of freedom except ourselves.

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Thank you M.L. I find your writings to be very helpful and inspiring. I believe that the longer you are away from the abuser, the more clear your thoughts become and it does take courage and guts. Even the healing.


If I am “100% accountable for what happened to me,” then how on earth can I accept myself as worthy of something better? You get what you ask for, no?
…or do i just hear the ringing of my parents’ admonishments in my ears?


Thanks for the post M.L.!

I agree that acceptance is so very important along with the realization that someone saying they love you means nothing if they treat you abusively. It brings to mind, 1 Corinthians 13:4-7:

“Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.”

Even if someone is not a Christian, this is a great example of what love is and what it is not.

We are accountable for what happens to us TODAY. The title of this article is, “After the Sociopath is Gone: Inspired Change.” As someone very wise told me following my abuse, “there is no need to keep looking in the rearview mirror.” That was in response to me continually beating myself up for not seeing it and not doing differently. I had learned great lessons and my job is to put those to use TODAY.

To get out of the traumatic bonds we were in, caught up in the cycle of abuse, it is empowering to accept that it is what it is and if we stop participating in it we can free ourselves. Often during abuse we start to think and believe that our well-being lies in the hands of the abuser. We are dependent on them. So we change our behavior to get the “best” out of them so we can have that Prince Charming and be happy. This happens through control and intimidation by the abuser. Recognizing this is what helps get us out of the situation. Recognizing that we have a choice that we were somehow made to believe that we didn’t have. That’s what abuse does lostingrief. It makes us think we are nothing and can’t have anything outside of them. Please understand that and don’t let the words of your parents ring in your ears. No one asks for abuse unless they are a self-proclaimed masochist. I know I’m not and I bet you aren’t either.

One of the lies that I was brought up to believe is that I am responsible for how other’s treat me. I was told that no one would treat me badly unless somehow I did something to deserve it. That is a lie. A bold faced lie that led me to think somehow I had control over other people’s behavior. It would be nice to think that at the heart of everyone lies goodness. On LF we all have found out the hard way that evil does exist. That people’s ill behavior towards us does not come from something we’ve caused. It comes from them.

So are you worthy of something better lostingrief? Hell, yeah! Must better than what you experienced! I have written before and I believe that no one asks for abuse. We believe lies when we stay in abuse and most notably the lie that our abuser loves us. One cannot love someone and inflict such abuse. It contradicts the very description of love like that noted in the bible. So please take care of yourself and walk strongly down in your present journey taking the lessons you’ve learned to empower yourself. Not looking back in the rearview mirror kicking yourself. Kick them LOL. Not yourself. But note how knowing what you know now can prevent you from getting mixed up with that type of abuse again.

Love and hugs!!!


Yes! I was also brought up with the lie, although in my family it was, “no one can ride you unless you bend over.” (how crass)
I’m doing okay. Just in the ”I-can’t-believe-there-are-people-like-this” phase. And especially the person who I loved so dearly for so long, and who I thought loved me. Yikes!!
Already feeling better, less anxious … less on edge every second. I just wish the dreams of him telling me, “gee, you told me you’d love me no matter what and NOW you don’t want me anymore? what a LIAR you are!”
LOL … the lies!!! Wow!! Never-ending, unbelievable, countless.


Good article M.L. I remember when I was in the fog with my abuser and I didn’t have a name for it. I told him “we have something very unhealthy going on here” and we have to figure it out or let go….” I knew I didn’t want to live like that, at the begiining their were moment’s when the hair on my neck would stand up and I would think to myself ” oh god what have I done? what have I let into my house?” but I waited too long to end it, I gave him the rope he intended to hang me with. But in the end the rope I gave him saved me, he found fresh humanity, someone that didn’t see the evil that I had come to fear and love. He took my identity and became part of me and I became part of him. And when he looked at me he saw himself and that was too painful for him. So I was devalued and discarded…and still trying to put me back together. And yes this has inspired change in me. I never want to experience anything close to this pain ever again. So I am changing, not desperatly but with inspiration and a clear mind…….


as much as my relationship with him, was bad, and hurt like hell. im so happy that im not in it anymore. i thank the other women for coming into my life and taking the loser from me. as much as i want to be mad at her im not. she doest see it, and if she does she doest want to believe it. in time she will learn on her own. I sit here and i think, he doest deserve any of my time. he doest deserve my company. He and they will never understand what it means to care for someone else and to respect them. I deserve to have someone be faithful to me and not have other relationships behind my back, and i will never allow that ever in my life again. If you cant be true to me then you dont deserve me.

This weekend i was looking at some court information though my county website and there was a link to look up previous cases. I just happen to look up my x. the things i found on him was unbelieveable. every girl that i heard about though my relattionship with him, and every girl he was involved with the past years all sued him. some had PPOs on him. he never told me that these girls sued him. i wish i would of found this website two years ago. any man that i consider dating i will be checking out.


hiya Blondie, you sound so much better… I think you and I are gettin on with life. Someone said in an earlier post “If somebody steal’s your man, the best revenge is to let them keep him” and Like you I am so glad it is over, but still feeling betrayed and used and humiliated, but not listening to anymore sad song’s he ain’t worth that……good to see ya on here


i have blogged on every thread, making up for no internet at home I guess. Part of my anxiety is thinking he is in love with the new guy and will be happy ever after and I failed him. (oxy where is your skillit?) Intellectually I know this can’t be, because he was still wanting to get nekkid with me after he met new guy. And he is all over the “CHAT”room’s looking for NSA sex….


yes henry im moving on with life. it feels good and nice. it might be sad sometimes but just think about all the these you dont have to deal with anymore. just think of all the things you can do now. i still wish i never spend two years with someone like him, but everything happens for reason, never forget that.


You know what guys.. you know why I think they leave us? I don’t think they are discarding us in their minds.. I think they feel like they are about to be “made” (unmasked).. so they just bolt.

The new peeps they draw in is not about people to them, to us it looks like the betrayal of love.. to them I don’t think there is any more to it than another patch of camouflage to hide in.

They are just trying to make themselves look good with someone else, in case we blow up and tell the world.. I now advocate tattling, at least to the general public, because dammit, the only reason these people get away with this stuff is because victims don’t band together.

I got saved from a bigtime S one time by a group of ladies that had formed a “society” to get the word out. They had all been taken in by the same man, who at last count had over ten kids spread around Michigan, and proposing to at least three women a year, (while living off his wife’s inheritance money.. oy).



A few months ago you commented on one of my posts about responsibility and fault. I was having a hard time coming to terms with my part in things. What you wrote helped me turn a corner in my healing. I just want to thank you. I still have a way to go, but the times of clarity and “inspiration” are longer and much more frequent now. I have made the choice to be 100% accountable for my life today.

I also want to say how no contact was and is critical for me. The longer I go without his twisting my reality, the stronger I get. I no longer feel crazy. ( I have to text with him-we have a son. It’s funny, even in the texts he won’t answer a yes or no question with yes or no. He goes into a story – not easy to do in a text message.)


I realised that my ex-P kept me in line (so to speak) by expressing hurt and disappointment, rather than rage and aggression.

How did he know that would work with me? I inadvertently told him it would. Early on in our relationship I mentioned that I had often witnessed casual violence growing up and I’d promised myself that if a man ever hit me I would hurt him back twice as badly. I also told him that my mother rarely had to spank me as a child because just telling me she was disappointed in me made me feel awful and wanting to make it up to her.

It’s amazing how he used every scrap of information I gave him, in ways I would never have imagined. More interesting than that however, is how I responded to the same triggers from childhood to adulthood. All it took was for anyone I cared about to tell me I had disappointed them or hurt them through my behaviour and I would be devastated. I hated thinking that I had hurt someone I loved and would do anything and everything to make it up to them. I think I over-empathised because it would seem to me that I was actually feeling the pain they were experiencing, or rather, said they were experiencing.


Ive have just joined this blog and find everybody’s comments really inspiring as i have recently been taken advantage of by a sociopath and a clever one too.He never used violence just a lot of evil mind games and was a money user. hes now gone off with another woman and they are together right now which hurts so much because i gave him everything my love, my money, my time and now hes found someone else whos got more money and more status than me and has just tossed me to one side and is throwing it in my face and keeps on going on how pretty she is etc and just makes fun of me now.
how do u stop the mental hurt of all this? because he and her are in the same circle of friends as i am and she seems to be enjoying all this aswell. i wish they would both just disappear because i do believe in the no contact heals but i cant seem to get away from them and as a result every minute of my day is filled with all the hurt of the past and new fear and hurt of seeing them together again soon. but i think both of them are getting a kick out of this because when i see them together they both look at me and smile like its some kind of game. but it hurts so badly i feel so used, disrespected laughed at. And the worse thing everyone thinks hes great and because hes hanging around with this new girl all the people we know are all more friendly with them now, im just left on the sidelines like they know hes dumped me for her but they don’t care because they just think hes a top man. Infact im treat a bit like dirt now, this was not meant to of happen all I wanted for me to be friends and to be happy. I don’t like evil mind games and all this manipulation to get what you want at all cost despite the other person feelings, its all so wrong but im starting to feel like am I the only one left in our circle of people who has any morals or feelings for others?
I’ve spoken to some very close friends about it as a support but all i get from them is: oh just get over it or just forget about them. but i think about the situation every single day no matter how much self-help stuff i read. It really hurts and is making me ill, my personality has change so much over the past few months, and all aspects of my life is suffering because of this I want to change I want to move on, how do I change after the aftermath of this sociopath?
Sorry if I have posted in the wrong bit I am new to this blog site but I am so glad I have found it. X


Dear Maria

Welcome to the site. I’m so very sorry that you were hurt by this man and you’re going through such a difficult time. My heart goes out to you.

Rest assured, on this site you will be believed and supported. We know what you’re going through. You can’t just “get over it”. It will take time and lots of healing first and it’s ok to take as long as you need.

I know you mentioned that you and your ex have the same circle of friends but it is very important that you establish No Contact. He will play his mind games for as long as he still has contact with you. Even if it means you don’t see your friends for a while you must stay away from him. Please, please try to do this…I know it’s very difficult.

In the mean time, do you have at least one friend who sees how serious this is and who will listen to you?


Kat – In one thread you talked about our “loss” in another you compared them to “demon’s” – someone said they will never be the same. I am fighting the urge (already) to have my internet reconnected at home. I deleted all his pictures. Sometime’s it feel’s like I am winning, but for the most part I am a mess. I will never be like I was before him. I hope I come out better on the other side of this. But f–k you would think after 4 month’s I could get a grip on this….I hate to even blog on here I am so embarrased that I still think of him every waking moment. He is a big lie, nothing but pain would I get if he came back. But the pain I am in now is at times unbearable. This is horrible to say but it would be easier if he had died, at least there would be some kind of closure….


AHA … YES, it would be FAR easier if he died!!! and i think that’s okay. i’ve said that many times since i found out the level of betrayal my p/s perpetrated on me. i wish i never met him, i wish i never knew there was anyone like him living on this earth, and i wish he would die. and so what. after what we have endured i think it’s a completely normal response to a completely abnormal situation, AND a completely abnormal person! i just found out this morning from a mutual friend that he was actually bragging to his ‘buddies’ about coming over here to be with me, eating my lovingly-prepared dinners, takinga nap, showering and then going over to boink his new way-younger girlfriend — the one who is now pregnant!
yea, closure in whatever way, would be a good thing.
i’m hoping i can recover enough of a life to NOT think about him every minute (which i’m still doing). the guy is a total PSYCHOPATH!! he actually told me “you’re the last woman i’ll ever do this to.” well, that makes me feel SO MUCH BETTER!
but i know it’s a lie, like everything else was. Hang in there. Karma is koming!



Welcome to LF. I’m so sorry to hear about your situation. So sorry to hear your pain. You don’t deserve what’s happened to you. It is despicable what sociopaths do! Please know you are not alone in what you’re experiencing. Myself and most of us here have or are going through what you’re experiencing right now. We’ve found this site so helpful as so many people in our lives didn’t get it or were manipulated by the sociopath and so never saw the truth.

Part of what sociopaths do is just what he’s doing to you right now. He has to maintain that “top man” image you described at all costs. So he makes you the enemy and wins over your mutual friends. Usually they do this by lying and saying bad things about you behind your back. I’m sorry. You’re right that they play evil mind games and use manipulation at all costs to get what they want despite your feelings. In fact they don’t care about anyone’s feelings either only their opinions of him and their attention in order to maintain that fake image.

To be devalued and discarded like that from someone who is just a user and abuser is traumatic and painful. Especially someone we loved and gave so much of ourselves to. But sociopaths will get others to do their dirty work just as he’s getting his new victim (she’s not his g/f, there’s never a real relationship there, she is another object to him that he will use and abuse like you, don’t forget that) and others to ostracize you. He may be passing off the break-up like it’s nothing or telling them a different story than the truth. It’s a huge betrayal to our emotions and to everything we know that’s good and decent.

But these folks aren’t good and decent as you know. As for other close friends, they often don’t get it. They will say exactly what yours have said. “Just get over it “and “forget about them”. I do think that they believe they are being helpful. However, they don’t fully understand what you’ve just gone through and their words are often invalidating.

There is a thread here about the steps to recovery. You can find it if you use the search option. It’s important that you understand the steps to recovery so you know that you’re OK. What you’re experiencing is normal although it feels very abnormal. It’s a psychological trauma. What you’re describing is common as a result of that.

Changes in personality (i.e., losing a sense of who we are), intrusive thoughts about the abuse and becoming physically ill are, unfortunately, all parts of it. Parts I also experienced. My abuse was pervasive in all aspects of life as I had difficulty concentrating, withdrew from friends and family who didn’t understand what was happening to me, had difficulty doing everyday things, suffered at work trying to concentrate, had constant anxiety which increased when out in public, couldn’t seem to shut my mind off as intrusive thoughts kept flooding in, felt I was obsessing day and night, etc.

I would encourage you to tell someone whom you trust about sociopaths and help educate them on what you’ve learned and what you’re experiencing. Let them know your need for support and how all this has affected you. Building a support network is crucial. Many of us use LF as part of that process. It’s difficult for others to understand unless they’ve experienced PTSD or abuse. But it’s worth trying to get that support. Some of us see therapists and some even take medications to address the symptoms of anxiety and depression experienced after the abuse. It’s a personal choice. But make sure to find a therapist, if you’re interest, who has experience with treating trauma from abuse and PTSD and who knows about sociopathy (has experience with treating victims of sociopaths). This is important or else your therapist may invalidate you like your friends have without meaning to.

If you haven’t learned about narcissitic abuse I’d encourage you to read up on that as well as trauma, betrayal bonds and psychological trauma. Understanding what you’re going through often makes it less scary. You can also look up how to cope with trauma for additional resources on what to do. I would encourage you to have no contact with your ex and to stay away from those who continue to trigger your pain and devalue you. I know that this may feel like a loss but if that circle of friends is drawn into your ex’s web, they are lost right now. If they don’t see that what he did was wrong and how it’s hurt you then you want to make sure you spend time with people whom you can trust and who are safe people to you. I doubt what they’re doing is intentional, they’re most likely being manipulated by him too. Staying away also helps you avoid being further harassed by being laughed at. That is bullying and just plain wrong! Unfortunately, it’s par for the course with a sociopath.

Part of the recovery process is to think about it all the time. It is our brain’s way of handling the abuse. We thought one way and believed one thing about the sociopath and were somewhat brainwashed into looking at them a certain way. Then suddenly the switch and everything about them is a lie. You realize you were victimized and this is a heady process for our brain to cope with. In it’s defense, our brain continues to process and reprocess details of that experience. That fight or flight mode kicks in to protect itself. To reach some understanding of a situation that is againt our very nature of the world as we know it is hard. It takes time for this to stop. Talking about it and working through it to understand your experience is extremely helpful. Blogging on here is a great step as well as we all understand what you’re going through and we’re here to help and support you. But don’t negate the power of talking to someone about it person.

The aftermath of these folks make us feel crazy because of what their abuse does to us mentally and physically. But you are OK. Please tell yourself that. Your body is an a state of hyperalertness right now for a reason. It has been traumatized. You asked how to change all this. It’s more a process of healing. You can’t rush it and shouldn’t. It is uncomfortable but trying to move past it too quickly could make it more difficult. You can get stuck on judging what’s happening and not allowing your mind and body the time it needs to heal. The best thing you can do is to find people you can trust to talk to and who support you. Take care of yourself and understand what you’ve been through. Move away from things and people who trigger you. Don’t avoid others though and don’t isolate. Try to spend time with others but also respect your need to be alone when you need to. Find the balance that works for you.

Take care of yourself. Soothe yourself with things that in the past made you feel better. Learn relaxation strategies to manage and reduce anxiety (like relaxation breathing). Some of us pray and turn to our spiritual beliefs to strengthen us. Meditate, light candles, etc. Take walks and exercise to help reduce symptoms of anxiety and depression. Read or watch “safe” movies to take your mind off the pain as means for distraction to get a break from intrusive thoughts. Journal to express your feelings and problem-solve ways to address stressors. Draw or paint as this is actually a common tool to healing from trauma (right brained activities are good…these are usually creative activities which help your brain to process the trauma).

Part of recovery is also working on remembering and recognizing who you are. Your identity gets challenged by the nature of the abuse by the socioipath who exploits what’s good in you and projects what’s bad in them onto you. What you’re experiencing is not permanent in terms of changes to your personality. His devaluation and discarding of you, in itself, is enough to affect your self-esteem negatively. In addition, you’re most likely not feeling in control of your thoughts and your behavior has changed. So much about you may feel foreign right now. It’s important to recognize why and not be frightened by it. The more distance and time away from your ex and those who trigger you, the more this will change as you’ll start to untangle the confusion your mind is going through.

Take care of your physical health. Make sure that you’re eating right and getting the rest you need. Exercise is also helpful in getting rest. All these things can be very difficult right now but try your best. I know I lost my appetite and had to make sure I ate and had to stay away from caffeine for a long time as this made my anxiety worse. I also got very sick afterwards but my body healed once I was able to regulate my diet and sleep cycle. What is happening to you is the physiological response to trauma and abuse.

Also, try to maintain a normal routine. Structure your day. Our worlds become disordered in response to the trauma. So try to bring back some order. Do the same things each morning, day and night. There can obviously be variation but having some consistent things you do each day can help. Like taking a brief walk before work or make yourself a decaf cup of coffee, eat breakfast while reading the comics or do a morning devotional or meditation. Take a break during work and do something that feeds you. For instance, journal about how your day is going or get some thoughts and feelings off your chest through writing. Bring your favorite snack, take a brief walk by going outside and getting a change of atmosphere, take time to socialize with co-workers, etc.. At night, create a routine to get ready for bed. For example, drink a hot cup of decaf tea and read or watch you favorite tv show or dvd (tv may trigger you unexpectedly so be careful), do a devotional or meditation.

Think of things that feed you positively and attend to these. Even if you don’t feel anything in the moment, in time it will have more effect on you than you may realize. This could be church, a social club, a gym, etc. Also stay away from anything that may worsen symptoms of anxiety and depression. I mentioned caffeine but alcohol and drugs (of course not just illicit drugs..I’m not implying you abuse substances LOL but some prescription and over-the counter drugs) can also exacerbate symptoms.

OK, I know this is a novel but I wanted to try to answer your question as thoroughly as I could LOL. My last bit of encouragement is to keep sharing with us and let us know how you’re doing! Share the good, the bad and the ugly. This place is so supportive and such a gift to all of us. We’re in this together as we explore ways to heal and share our experiences. If you take care of yourself and treat the symptoms of the trauma and process it in healthy ways, you will get there! It takes time so please be patient and good to yourself!!!


Henry and Lostingrief…I love you guys!!! You say it like it is! Despite your fears about recovering past the stage of obsessive thinking, I have every confidence that you will. I broke up with my ex at the end of June last year. We had intermittent contact until November (not much face-to-face at all). But between June and November was the worst of the abuse and manipulation actually. The last actual face-to-face encounter was in May of this year when I knew who I was dealing with but was still in and out of denial. So I don’t know how you measure that in time…from the break-up, last contact or what? LOL But look at the time that has passed. Now how long has it been for both of you? Also, I live in a different state and don’t have to have contact with him. Although he blogs his life away online, it’s taken me a long time not to give into temptation and check on what he’s been up to. It only led to grief and more anger knowing how grandiose he is and such a liar and manipulator. If only people knew the truth!

I want to emphasize that we all work within our own timeframe. My “relationship” lasted a whole 4 months (the time we were actually together as a couple). In sum, he was a part of my life for about one year. Look at how long it’s taken me to get to where I am from that. The obsessive thinking has pretty much stopped and thoughts of him do not pervade my very existence anymore. I can still be triggered and I still have a ways to go but I feel like I’m past a majo
r hurdle. You both will too in time. Time my friends! Time!

It is an agonizing experience isn’t it? I had PTSD in 2005 and I thought I’d never be the same. Depending on the trauma, length of exposure and nature of it, and other variables, the time to recover varies. But both of you are working on recovery and will get there. I have no reason to doubt otherwise. Henry, you WILL be better for this. Lostingrief, you WILL have a life that doesn’t include thoughts of him. Believing in this and being determined to reach this is important. Telling yourself differently is self-defeating and this happens often due to the depression we expereince as a result of the trauma. They hurt our self-esteem and we end up developing negative self-talk as a result.

I’m pulling out Oxy’s skillet Henry!!! She’d be all over you right now but in that sweet way she has about her that makes us all smile! Love yourself Henry. Love yourself Lostingrief. Make up for the love you were deprived of from those psychos!!! You are free and can gain such wisdom and power through what you’ve experienced. It may feel like it sucks right now and it does. But please get yourselves out of self-defeating thinking and behavior when you see it. Do something nice for yourselves. For some reason when we’re traumatized we seem to temporarily lose our ability to nurture ourselves. Nurture guy!!! Go eat your favorite ice cream, watch your favorite movie, listen to uplifting music (no sad love songs Henry!), etc. Even if it feels like pulling teeth do it until it feels good! Am I being bossy or what? LOL Oh but don’t stop venting on here! Get it out and then go take caer of yourselves.

Hearing that you both are at a place where you recognzie that it would be easier if your exs were dead is actually great! I told my ex this while we were still in contact LOL! You two are so right. The loss we experience would be easier if we could put it in a perspective that we could better understand. Grieving someone who is still alive is so freakin’ difficult. But it’s a reality. It’s like there’s a monster on the loose who swallowed up the man we fell in love with. Only we didn’t realize that he was never that man. It was the monster in disguise. So we mourn the loss of the “man that never was” and abhor the existence of the monster. Talk about complicated grieving!

Henry, please DO NOT be embarassed to blog on here. Ugh! If I had a direct line to Oxy I’d be contacting her right now! LOL Let me think of what she’d say….Henry you sweet, adorable man. I’m taking my iron skillet out of the cupboard. Stop being so hard on yourself…

Is that close? LOL Honestly, no blame, no shame, no guilt. Not for what happened or how difficult the struggle is in recovery. It is what it is. You’re not making it hard, it just is. It’s a process. I can’t tell you how many times I repeated this to myself to allow myself to go through it. It’s a process and as with all processes, it takes time.

I’m sending you guys positive vibes via internet! Lostingrief, aren’t you the one who says Towanda! Me thinks this would be a good time for that!


Oh and when I had PTSD in 2005 I did recover from that. The sad part is that I only had a few months of starting to feel “back to myself” again when I encountered the S. I was still vulnerable and I beleive this was his way in. So when it comes to PTSD, I am, unfortunately, no stranger to it. But having experienced it before I can tell you that there is a way through it and there is relief and healing. Hang in there!


You’re a great counselor!’s all there in a nutshell.

Maria, welcome. I’m new here too, and this is a great site for healing.


yep, that’s me.
just ran into a friend of ‘ours’ who told me that my p/s told him that we broke up because i was ”way too into him and the only way he could get me — get this — ‘off his dick(!!)” was to cheat on me!!!
well, against the explicit DEMAND of my p/s, i told that friend the TRUTH!! and i don’t care WHAT the repercussions are for that!
he can BITE ME if he doesn’t like it!
i read this recently: the truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off.
hang in there, everyone.


[QUOTE]You know what guys.. you know why I think they leave us? I don’t think they are discarding us in their minds.. I think they feel like they are about to be “made” (unmasked).. so they just bolt.[QUOTE]

This is exactly what I think happened in my case. He knew he was about to get caught any day. He didn’t exactly bolt. He did something so cruel that he knew I would not take him back. Then he said “I have no excuse. I know I went too far. But I will always love you though.” It was his out. The wording “I know I went too far” gave away his motives. Normal people don’t say stuff like this. It is obvious he knew he was playing a game and that he knew it wasn’t the first time he’d played that game with someone. It really creeps me out to think about it.

With normal relationships, the best way out is through. Talking, communicating, confronting, trying to understand the other person…..

You cannot do this with a sociopath. The only way out IMO is to walk away and cut your losses. In order to do this, you have to believe better things await you and that the S will receive his/her due karma. This takes a great act of spirit and will to walk away and “change the channel”. I gave up my favorite website and most of my internet friends from that site. It killed me to do it, but I think ultimately it will bring greater peace of mind.


Thank you for u kind words and advice ODETTE. X

TAKEMEBACK, your post made me cry so much, everything that your saying is so true. It is very difficult to get over it and the healing never seems to never get off the ground, I’m still crying everyday especially in the mornings and last thing at night and I cry at work too when I go to the toilet so no one can see me.
Yes that ’top man’ image really gets me down ive seen the otherside of him but they all think he’s great man but he can be very persuasive and charming with others. And yes I do think he is talking about me behind my back to gain what any power he needs for himself eg the ’nice guy’ image. Being discarded was one of the most traumatic things ever, it makes me cry now just thinking about it”I was so down at the start of the year that some of my hair fell out I thought I was going to get alopecia but the two patches grew back over recently thank God, I know it was some kind of stress and it was related to this situation.
When we go all go out I don’t talk to him no more haven’t done for months but I must admit I did use to try and talk to him but then he would blow hot and cold with me, mainly cold so I stopped because it was hurting me so badly. What hurts me aswell his new woman knew that he and I were together but she still wanted him, is she a sociopath too? Or does she just think she’s better than me because he picked her over me and thinks she’s got a great new man? Well I think she’s going to be in for a shock soon”
The sly smiles they keep on doing is making my life hell. Why can’t they just be nice and for all of us to be just friends? Why does he feel the need to keep on playing these games and being nasty towards me? Do u think I should not see these “same friends” that we have? I don’t want to stop because some of them are my friends, but should I disappear for a while instead so I can heal? Like maybe for 6 months or more?

Your advice is so valuable to me”. because im not getting any from anywhere and my doctors are useless, my close friends try but they’ve got there own problems and think im just being obsessive and silly.
Ive tried the reading, eating healthy, doing overtime at work etc but its not working much but I must admit right now the only one that’s works most is the exercising, I walk everywhere and the fresh air clears my head. I can’t do more than that right now. I tried running but it was too traumatic for me; mentally. Also I won’t play love songs, your right it triggers the hurt and pain. And TV i won’t watch the news.

Thank you so much, talking(writing) and reading all this is making me realize im not alone and try to remember I didn’t deserve this and there so much to read on here that all relates to it everything!
I need to read all this site there so much stuff on here. Thank u again X

Maria welcome,,,,,and your not alone …it takes lots of time before the crying stops but its all part of the healing and don’t be hard on yourself ….this takes a long time its be 9 months
NC for me and I still think about him every day but I know that I have too stay focused on my new life …time will give yu the clarity that you need and you know that yu deserve better……..stay focused



I’m sorry my blog made you cry but I’m glad you know you’re not alone. Crying is cathartic. I’ve cried more over this experience than anything else. Emotional and mental abuse is horrid. But there is healing.

You said that your doctors aren’t helpful. Are you seeing a therapist or psychiatrist? Do they specialize in trauma work? Do they have experience with sociopathy? If they’re not helpful then I’d encourage you to find someone else who is. Don’t give up on what you need for yourself. If one doesn’t work, try another until you find someone who gets it. If you’re seeng your medical doctor I’d encourage you to see someone who specializes in mental health.

As for your questions:

Is his new g/f a sociopath?
My ex came onto me the very night I met his g/f. He began telling me how awful she was and how much he liked me and had always liked me. We live two states away but went to college together over 10 years ago. I hadn’t seen him since then. I told him I was attracted to him and found it hard to be his friend as a result. Afterall, he had done a great job of wooing me when we were “friends” and even stole a kiss the night I met his g/f. He bought me presents and all sorts of stuff. Mr. Wonferful right? He said he broke up with her weeks later and we got together. Had I believed that she was mean to him? Yes, by what he told me. Had I believed they had broken up? Yep, but now not so sure. They were together rather quickly again after me (which he so denied despite the evidence) so who knows. Anyhow, I am not a sociopath and look how it turned out. There’s no way to know about his new g/f. They lie to get people to do their dirty work and they lie to get what they want. Whatever she’s been told about you, I’m willing to bet it’s a bunch of lies.

Why does he keep playing games and being nasty towards you?
Maria if there’s one thing I would like you to pay the most attention to, it’s this answer. He lies because that’s what they do. It’s about POWER and CONTROL. It’s an addiction for them. The more he hurts you, the more you react and respond, the BETTER he feels. His control over you gives him power. This allows him to hurt you at will if you give him the control to do so. You being hurt means to him that he’s still important. He has some meaning and significance through your pain. He does not feel empathy and will not recognize your pain. Rather he will do what he can to elicit pain and hurt you. This is what they do unless you have something they want. Then the charm comes in and it’s all pretend and another big game. He is a sadist by the nature of who he is.. The better you understand this, the easier to see it and accept it.

I have no doubt that my ex wanted me dead. Some sociopaths aim for this. The ultimate of control. They drive their victims crazy and to the point of suicide. Some can be homicidal. The point is they can be dangerous both physically and emotionally. I don’t want to scare you but I do want to warn you. This is a disordered personality. I thought I knew my ex pretty well and I didn’t know him at all.

Don’t forget your ex also wants to look innocent after what he did to you. You can destroy his reputation with the truth so he will do what he finds necessary to launch that smear campaign against you. If he can make you look bad, he can make himself look all the better. It’s sick and cruel. But a reality.

Should you see your “same friends” anymore?
Friendships, as with all close relationships, requires trust. Can you trust your friends? Have they shown that they will not betray you? Have they supported you? Are they willing to go somewhere else without your ex being present? Are they willing not to discuss or mention your ex in your presence? Answer these and you’ll have your answer to that question.

Should I disappear for a while so I can heal?
When we talk about NO CONTACT that means forever. Those who have children with their ex’s or work with them, etc., have little choice and so they keep contact to the bare minimum. Those of us who have a choice and who’ve been through this know that NC is forever. It would be worthwhile to ask yourself why you would want to be associated with your ex in any way. This guy is playing games and making your life miserable. His ability to manipulate is scary. So do you want to have any involvement with any of your “same friends” who don’t get that? Do you want to continue to get triggered and hurt by being in his presence, hearing his name or being with friends who dismiss what has happened to you? Recovery takes time and part of it is taking your power and control back. Making better decisions for yourself and surrounding yourself with those who love and respect you.

Maria, I can’t imagine what it’s been like for you to see your ex with his new g/f, to have friends who continue to exalt him rather than treat him like the dirty, rotten pig that he is! It’s invalidating. They have no idea what has happened nor how badly you feel. I found myself feeling like I was burning people out because they didnt’ get the obsessive nature being part of the recovery. I felt they dismissed it or rolled their eyes at it. So I took to blogging on here and journaling my butt off. I also have a therapist and I say what I need to in session. I have educated some friends and family enough to have a support system but I know they don’t truly understand and I’m afraid that they will invalidate me and hurt me so I keep things with them to a minimum. But I know if I need somewhere to go so I’m not alone I have people there for me. This is important.

I’m glad to hear that walking works for you. Glad to hear you’re staying away from certain triggers. But eventually you’ll need to work through these when you get stronger as you can’t avoid certain things forever. That’s why it’s important you have a support system before doing this. Important to have someone working with you on trauma too.

Please take care of yourself and keep reading :))


I am thinking about what Maria said about her ex “blowing hot and cold” with her. I think this is one of the most useless parts of trying to maintain contact with them, once the anger and rage is winding down. Even when they aren’t mad at you, they really aren’t that interested in your well being. They may be nice to you one day when they are in the mood, but they will never really be there for you. They are pretty useless as friends, just like they were as lovers.


Hi, Maria. I hope I can help by sharing what I’ve learned.

not many people have walked in your shoes so most people wont get it. But you can find people who do. Plenty of people also know about liars and what sociopaths are like. A good place to go just to talk is domestic abuse support groups at women’s shelters. You can hear from people who have been in similar experiences and who can relate to you and also you can learn new things.

every little thing you can do to rid yourself of him will be a relief to you. Things that seem difficult and like sacrifices will actually be easier than you expect and rewarding. Even if you give up those friends temporarily, you will feel better if you decide to do it and go through with it, because you will not have to deal with him. if you can visit some out of town friends who don’t know him that could do you some good. it helps to get out of town, somewhere new or comforting, i find.

something we have to do is accept that the sociopaths used us. it is a bit like pulling off a band-aid. initially it hurts, but not as much as you would think because then he becomes easier to understand. In order to put up with a P/S/N you have to tell yourself lies and swallow lies.


the other day i had to have contact with the bad man. its unbelieve that people are friends with him. i just cant understand how anyone can be ok with who he is. he steals from his friends and family and yet his friends still hang with him. its really sad, i feel pity for them. what also angers me the most is how he does not get what he does to people. how innocent he is. he tells me i left him! wow such blaming. can never take responablity for what he did. i noticed how he changes his image towards me. at first he wasnt dating any girl. not that he thinks im dating or iam out living my life, and starting to move on, or now he is dating someone new. a different story everyday. its soo sick



That’s funny. The Bad Man did the same thing, copying. It was so weird. He used phrases I used in my dating profile. I dyed my hair and then… he dyed his hair. This was when we were broken up. The area in which we lived was small so I often saw him on the road, at the beach, etc.

Also, I have noticed at the Children’s Shelter where I work that sometimes the kid with the most disturbing behavior can be quite popular. If they are charismatic, it doesn’t matter if they just pushed another child down… the victim will forgive almost instantly if the perpetrator throws them a bone… some positive attention on compliments. One little girl told me she liked a certain boy who, at age 10, had already stolen a car and had very bad anger issues. She was also aware that he asked all the other girls to be his girlfriend too and she still liked him even though she told me she knew it wasn’t right for him to be everyone’s boyfriend. This kid is totally a Sociopath in the making. He can run all the other kids into a frenzy and yet the counselors can see how disturbing his behavior is… just like what you were describing above.

People seem to pay more attention to what others say rather than what they do. It’s strange. I have observed this in myself and in the children too.

The word is powerful.


It really is amazing how they change like the wind. it makes me feel really sick inside. this bad man steals from his own family and they never do anything about it. his own friends watch him live a double life, and lie to many people yet they seem to trust him, and stay friends with them. he even steals from some of his friends and they stay friends with him. to me its like how can you be part of someones life or talk to someone who you see hurt people over and over. who you see steal money, or see them have double lives. i remember dating the bad man and his friends would say to me yes he has some issues and is f*** in the head. maybe they just dont understand what it means to be a sociopath, or maybe they dont get how bad it is.

lately ive been so mad at myself for allowing myself to ever stay with someone after everything i saw him do. after ever lie i found, why did i stay and accept it? its so embarrasing. how did i make it ok in my head. i wasted two years of my life. when i saw the first lie after two months and just believed him when i knew something wasnt right. i will never ever again do this to myself. the first lie, you have to go. any red flags im running for cover. after finding anothers girls items at his house, why the hell did i stay???? ahhhh it makes me sooo mad. i was such a sucker…



Thanks for the compliment :)) You have great things to share as well. I am still learning a lot from you and everyone else on here. We’re all virtual counselors in a way helping each other learn and grow. Proving nurturing and support along the way. The compliment warmed my heart :))


Boy do they ever change like the wind! Grabbing onto what’s seen as popular and taking aspects of other people trying to project that favorable image. I used to see my ex as “wannabe” in college over 12 years ago. I wasn’t interested in him then because he was so fake. He wasn’t attractive to me physically and despite any reason I could find for him to be like this, he had an air about him that he thought so highly of himself. His meek image was just that, an image.

I guess through the years he perfected that image and it won me over right away. But he showed himself in the end. I remember shopping with him once and him finding a t-shirt with a popular phrase on it. “That’s how I roll.” He grabbed it and said, “The guys at the bike shop will love this. They’re always saying it.” Now there’s nothing wrong with liking a t-shirt like that. It was the notion that the guys would like it that caught my attention. His sister later told me that he was dressing very differently than when his late wife was alive. That would be because he’s a chamelion and now that she’s gone he doesn’t have to dress in her style to fit in. He is trying to dress and keep up with everyone else’s style. The way that he could change his appearance so quickly was disturbing. But his “self” had passed away and he was trying to find a new one. So he identified with whomever was feeding his ego or whoever he was trying to emulate.

The kicker is that on his website he titled it, “The Wannabe…..” Boy does that fit. He is one overgrown wannabe…well I guess it depends on the day. Who knows. Last time I saw him he was wearing a hoop earring. I had to supress the desire to ask if he was trying to be a pirate now LOL. He’s changed hobbies more than anyone I know. To me, as diverse as people are, we’re also stable and consistent. Those who roam from one sport or activity to another are red flags to me now. Gaining new interests is one thing. Gaining a dozen and changing yourself accordingly is another.


Blondie I keep wondering the same thing too, why did I stay when I saw how it was? Was I so hooked already? I guess I was .. I was hooked from the first hug. The last time I saw him he tried to hug me like that.. then he just ignores me for months.. what kind of message is that? Why do I still care? And how on earth do I get rid of this empty haunting ache in my heart?


With the truth Kat. Someone came in, stole your heart for a time, and then handed it back battered and bruised. No wonder it aches. It needs to mend.

You are not alone. We were all hooked. And when you love someone you can’t just detach. It takes time. So please be kind to that heart of yours and don’t judge yourself for caring. Just do your best to turn that caring towards yourself. You’re the one who deserves it.

I’m virtually sending you a big band-aid full of love, box of chocolates and full day at the spa!

Ox Drover

I can’t believe I MISSED THIS THREAD! Oh, BTW, takingmeback, thank you for BOINKING HENRY ON THE HEAD for being so hard on himself, for me! He needed it pretty bad! LOL Just goes to show what he does when I’m not waving my skillet at him! Hear that Henry! I now have RECRUITS to keep an eye on you for me, even when I miss a thread! I’m E-mailing them cyber iron skillets even as we speak. (((Henry))))

This is such a good thread, thanks ML. As always, you cut right to the core of it all!


a little gem, courtesy of my mom:

a tear met another tear floating down a river.
said the first tear: “i am the tear of a woman who’s handsome lover treated her poorly and left her for another.”
said the second tear: “and i am the tear of the woman who got him.”


Dear lostingrief: Thanks for your mom’s gem. It made my day (LOL) … how true.

Remember, we are to turn the other check and forgive the way Jesus forgave … and he died on the cross for us … and forgave those that persecuted him.

We have to pray for them to … to stop being the obnoxious (Tolle’s definition), the trouble makers (the churchs’ definitions, the surface dwellers (my definition … that they only skim the surface of life, not venturing into the deep waters of emotions) and all the anti-social definitions (mental health professionals definitions) …

Peace everyone … we will get there … we will be happy again and free from those that hurt us.

Peace and Harmony to everyone.


In the movie “Must Love Dogs” it states that when your heart is broken, the universe mends it better than it was prior to the heartbreak.

Just a goal we can all strive for. We deserve it!

Peace and Harmony everyone.


WINI it is good to see you here. it has been awhile. I always (take something good from your post.) So I thought you were going to intruduce me to your cousin or brother or some nice guy you know? LOL lostingrief I love your little gem from your mom. Somebody else posted something similar (the best revenge when someone steals your man is to let them keep him)


Hey Henry … I had things I just had to do. If I sneaked in to see who was chatting … well, you all know, it gets addictive blogging with everyone. So, I put my nose to the grindstone and did what I needed to get done … which wasn’t mentally healthy for me to relive dates/times of my EX … but, ya gotta do, what ya gotta do … sometimes (SMILE).

I told you about my cousin Bobby … cute, cute, cute. He’s one of my favorite cousins … even though I love all my cousins (tee hee) extended family … we all grew up together except for the 4 “D”s … youngest cousins living in another state from the rest of us … so when they came in to our state … we all had fun … I say 4 Ds cause all their names start with D.

My cousin is single, single, single … for a long time now (years) or at least that’s what I know … he hasn’t brought anyone to meet the family … I can’t even remember when. If I pop over his house, there’s never anyone that he mentions … he’s just been hanging out with his friends for years (all platonic friendships). All his friends are the same … after major breakups … they all haven’t seen anyone … for years now.

He’s in his mid-50’s. Is that a good age for you? I don’t even know your age (LOL) not that it matters … and don’t ask me mine, except, I did slip and mention it way way way back when… He’s blonde, 6 ft tall, great build … down to earth, very funny (always makes me laugh), great cook or at least snake foods (which I’m good at too), throws great parties, has great friends, has great taste in artwork, play piano (has a baby grand in his living room (we always make him play, especially around the Holidays) … conservative dress, I want him to decorate my house … his taste is impecable … and what I absolutely love the most about him is he has this kid outlook about life … not immature, just very open and giving and loving … what everyone used to be when we were kids. I absolutely love that about him … not judgmental … allows people to be who they are. My Dad had that quality too … It’s an unconditional love thing that they both have/had. He’s a great son to my Godmother, great brother, great brother-in-law, great uncle, great cousin, great friend. If he wasn’t my cousin, I’d still feel the same way about him if I ever had the chance to meet him. I guess I was lucky to be born in the same family as him. Oh, and all his customers love him … making him goodies to eat … etc. etc. etc. That’s how my Dad’s customers felt about him … always doing something for my Dad and vice versa.

Let me know … ask Donna for my e-mail.



wini – sounds like a match to me – I am 54 – most men my age are looking for someone 24 – Perky can vouch for my sanity and irresitible good look’s – everybody want’s me to decorate their house or landscape their yard. I can’t play the piano but I can cook up a good ole okie supper. I would love to correspond with your cousin but you ask him first. He may have more going than you are aware of. LOL Wini I know what ya mean about getin addicted to blog site’s. This has been my first blog experience and I have tryed to move on but ya know what? it’s only beem 5 month’s of no contact for me and I still need the support because my resolve comes and goes – and beside – what would oxy do if’n I left? I think she kinda get’s into boinkin me on the head with that cast iron skillit…good too see ya wini


well, here’s another … again, from mom. (my dad was an s/p/n. … she gets it).

a woman was walking along a path and came upon a beautiful yellow snake. she greeted the snake, “how are you; aren’t you a beautiful snake!”
he smiled at her and responded: “well, thank you, and you are beautiful too! but i’m not so well. i’ve been travelling a long time and i’m very tired. won’t you carry me since we are going in the same direction?”
the woman thought about it. “i don’t know if i should. you are a snake after all, and snakes can bite.”
the snake replied: “now would i do that to someone who greeted me so lovingly and told me i was beautiful?!”
good point. the woman relented, picked the snake up and walked with him down the path.
suddenly, the snake looked up at her, smiled and lunged at her, biting her on her chin.
“OUCH! why would you bite me after i helped you!”
the snake replied. “hey, bitch, you knew i was a snake when you met me!”
just a bit of s/p humor for y’all.


Lotta truth in that snake story. Altough I didn’t realize it at first that I had a snake, once those red flags started waving, I chose to ignore the obvious. My P sctually told me I had been “too easy”, that I was his “best dupe yet”.


Being a P, he turned around about a week later and denied he ever said that. Said he’d never used that word before in his life, didn’t even know what the word meant. Told me I must have “dreamed” it due to my hormones making me crazy. Interesting cause I have it on TAPE. lol


Wini.. so good to see you. I hope you can match henry .. cuz he deserves a good match.

Also..what you said about praying for them, that helps me a lot when I remember to do it, not just because it helps me forgive. Praying for them helps me remember that their problems aren’t my fault, that they really are bad people that need forgiveness and change, and that I don’t have to face my struggle with them alone.


Henry, I like blogging on this site … at least I know everyone is upfront where they stand on this blog … we’re all in the same “giving” boat. No manipulators and takers here … whereas, other sites … you open yourself up to all sorts of anti-socials giving you lip service again to get what they want from the world .. all types (I don’t need to meet more and have it even more elaborate personalities), saying anything they want to anyone to get whatever anti-social need they have to get that fix they’re looking for …

Did it, done it … got the ripped T-shirt to prove it.

As with my cousin, I’ve got to make a phone call to him anyway … I’ll just feel out the situation … I don’t want him to know I’m playing “match maker” or anything … hey, you never know … maybe you’ll find a good friend at the very least … Yes, you are right … I don’t know what he’s doing with his personal life … but our family is an open book … everyone knows what happened to me with my EX … it’s not like we don’t talk with each other in our family or don’t bring our relationships home to meet and greet everyone. Then there’s all the holidays … our family meets and greets family at that time … so there’s nothing anyone in our family can hide from others … too many cousins, second cousins, third … aunts/uncles still living … I’m laughing as I’m writing this … cause it is the inquisition in our family … no stones unturned … my family will open their mouths and directly ask you what’s going on with your life … And of course you know that I heard everyone’s opinions over the years about my EX … and how he “just wasn’t quit right with most of my family”… so I get (not malliciously, but said anyways) the salt-in-the wounds conversations … at the beginning … not now … but, boy oh boy if I ever bring anyone home to meet my relatives … they’ll have it on video tape … drilling the poor guy…. plus, they went through the years of what my bosses and their cronies did to me … so there’s a lot of history in the manipulation/abuse category of characters done to my life with my family members… we’re all very protective of each other … and I am the youngest of them all (both sides of the family) in my state (4 younger cousins on maternal side living out of state). So, there you have it.

Ask Donna to give you my e-mail … we’ll chat from there and I’ll let you know what’s going on. I met alot of my cousins platonic friends and they are all nice too. No users in that group … if there were at one time … they’re not there any more … Life does have a way of weeding these characters out … hey, maybe that’s why anti-socials do the quick hit and runs … knowing they will be booted out of the family loop cause it’s happened before to them over and over and over again. We do learn a lot on this blog.



Hi kat_o_nine_tales: Yes, praying does help me too. They are beyond our wildest imaginations … so I do leave them in God’s hands. If we (the victims) don’t pray for them, who will? They just sadden my heart anytime I think of them or hear about their new antics. My heart goes out to all the newbies just learning and trying to climb out of the abyss they were thrown into. Not knowing what is up or what is down yet. The imbalance they throw our lives into is incredible. I remember that I couldn’t breath and my legs were buckling out from under me … and I was already used to 6 years of this abuse from my managers and their cronies … but I knew what I was dealing with these characters. I had no clue my EX was just giving me lip service and he too, was one of them (anti-social personalities) … having the truth hit me between the eyes … years after the windows of suing him … was, to say the least – perfect calculations on his part. He manipulated the entire situation and probably loved (or was involved with my managers) every minute of my bosses destroying me … having my total concentration on what they were doing to me … didn’t allow me to look at what he was doing to destroy me. Incredible. All of them. Incredible … they may have won in the destruction and the money part … but I’m still standing and I can still feel, love, cherish, respect people. They can’t. In reality .. I am the victor in life … no matter what their MO’s for power, money, control/manipulations were. To me, they’re all walking dead (zombies) of the world … never knowing what it really is to just exist on your own right. What it is to love. What it is to feel good. What it is to be in harmony with your fellow citizens through the world. To share with others, to care about others, to grow with others.

Peace to your heart Kat.

Ox Drover

I can’t remember which thread we were talking about the subject of “Why” do some people not change when they have been abused…STockholm Syndrome (which I believe ANY human being with the POSSIBLE exception of the Ps) can fall prey to?

Why are WE different? Why do we eventually fight for freedom? What about US is there that causes us to rise up, and throw off the mantel of the “Zeta position”? Is there some common dinominator between US just as there is with them?

What is that common thread in the “suvivors” vs the ones that just “endure” forever? That stay in that Zeta position or if the P leaves them, they find another P to take over the abuser role?

I’ve asked myself this question all day and I can’t seem to come up with a single common dinominator between us except that we DO have a conscience and we HAVE started to become VICTORS instead of Victims. But what about the “Zillions” of other men and women that just stay STUCK either with the Ps and won’t leave, or stay STUCK in a helpless mode?

Donna did a thread about some woman that called her for advice and took none of it, came up with this excuse to stay, that excuse to stay, etc. and we have seen other bloggers here that even with our cheering the on, most likely stayed with the P or went back to him forever.

Is it like qitting smoking or drinking, you have to try and fail and try and fail again and evntually you do it? Or is it something else? What CLICKS in our brains that makes us different from those people who either never get out or find another P? Or live like James’ friend in pitiful circumstances, never venturing to HELP HERSELF. taking the hand OUTS but never the hands to help her lift herself UP and to safety?

We’ve all felt the ALLURE of wanting to stay with them, wanting them back, missing them etc (doesn’tmatter if the relationship is a lovers one or a friend or a family member, the allure is there) and yet, we fought it. We went NC and stuck with it. Why are WE willing to do this, to endure the pain and others are not?

Maybe if we could come up with some common thing that was part of the make up of US, we could help the ones that are AFRAID, that are STUCK. Why did WE eventually “unstick” and they not? Why are we examining ourselves to find our “weakest link” that lets us become victims in the first place and they are afraid to look for the weak link?

I don’t know–don’t have a clue. I’m amazed I got hooked in the first place by the P-XBF and I know at the time I was NEEDY, but I DID get the “blinding light” eventually and toss him to the curb, but even his X-GF that he burned her house, she still has “feelings” for him, KNOWING HE BURNED HER HOUSE, but at least she doesn’t act on them. She is moving on with her life, but the tug, the allure is still there for her and frankly, if someone called and told me that she had ditched her current BF and was marrying the P it wouldn’t “shock” me. It would make me sad for her, but it wouldn’t bowl me over in shock.

Maybe Dr. Leedom could make up some kind of a survey or maybe there IS already one and it could be put on here for us to “fill out” and then see if statisticly there is something about US that is different from the people who are “Chronic” victims, that assume that “zeta” position. It does make me wonder if there is something genetic involved with us, just as there is with the Ps being Ps–some genetic and some environment. Something that made us victims in the first place, but yet, allowed us to EVENTUALLY break free.

Ideas guys? What do you think it is about yourself that made you strong enough, determined enough to break free. Why did you succeed?


ok I just wrote something and went to preview and it disappeared..So sorry if this comes out twice…I just recently (yesterday) broke up with my bf. We were together for a lil over a year but recently found out he had another relationship carrying on the whole time. I knew about one other girl….but this was yet ANOTHER GIRL. He admits now to it and says it was wrong and only loves me and wants to make things work…but I dont know if I can trust him now. I feel like what we had was a lie..although I am confused because he does do so much good for me. He claims he is not with anyone else anymore…wants to marry me as well. ALTHOUGH I keep getting informed from one of the girls that he is STILL calling her with a sob story…she has lied to me in the past about things and obviously he has lied to me as well SO I DONT KNOW WHO TO BELIEVE. I feel bad because he has done good for me (he also reminds me of that too) He says I am being unfair that I wont continue our relationship and give it a try. HELP…..!! I FEEL LIKE I AM GOING INSANE…

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