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Another Way of Looking at Things

By OxDrover

In the book Games People Play, by Dr. Erick Berne, M.D., he explains what he calls “strokes,” or social exchanges. It has long been known that people require social interaction with other people and that this is a biological requirement for life itself in some cases. In orphanages, children whose basic physical needs are met, but who are not held and cuddled, literally die from a condition called “failure to thrive.”

The term “stroke” can be used as a general term for any intimate physical contact, but in practice it may take many forms, including conversation and recognition of another’s presence. In Dr. Berne’s opinion, “any social intercourse (even negative intercourse) is better than no intercourse at all.” [Parenthetical explanation added.]

He says that in experiments with rats, it didn’t matter if they were handled gently or shocked with electric shocks, they received many benefits from the “strokes” over rats that were not “stroked” at all.

The purpose of social contact revolves around somatic and psychic equilibrium. It relieves tension, helps avoid noxious situations, procures strokes and maintains the established equilibrium.

We (humans) have a stimulus hunger and “strokes” help us avoid emotional starvation, which can lead to biological deterioration. Even the most hardened prisoners and convicts need strokes—they fear and dread the punishment of solitary confinement above all others.

In Games People Play, Dr. Berne explains the theory called “Transactional Analysis” which is used to visualize human interaction, both healthy and unhealthy interactions. This is represented by an “Internal Parent, an Internal Child, and an Internal Adult.” These are symbolized by P, A and C.

The P, or internal Parent, is composed of the “shoulds and should-nots” that you internalized from your primary caregiver as you grew up. The “tapes” inside the P can be both negative and positive, or nurturing and critical, such as, “You are so stupid” or “You are pretty.” These “tapes” are absorbed and believed without any “editing” by the internal Child.

The A, or internal Adult, is the rational part of you that says for example “two + two = four.” There are no emotional components to the internal Adult.

The C, or internal Child is made up, not of “childish” things, but is the part of you that is creative, loving, wondering and fun loving.

Our internal Child needs strokes and stimulation, and the job of the Adult is to meet those needs. Unfortunately, sometimes the Adult works on faulty information derived from the internal Parent. Therefore the Adult doesn’t do a good job of finding what the Child needs.

The Child may be continually punished or put down by the internal Parent, so is in continual pain or confusion about what he (or she) needs or wants to be happy.

If our upbringing has been nurturing, we will have a more nurturing Parent who will not continually “beat” our internal Child. We will have a nurturing Parent who will comfort our Child when it is scared, lonely, etc. If we have had a more Critical Parent implanted in our soul and mind, then our Child may feel that he is “Not OK” and continually seek ways to receive strokes that may be negative, but ”¦ better than no strokes at all.

Have you ever noticed that when you are around a two year old and you get on the telephone, the child immediately begins to try to get your attention? If pulling at your leg doesn’t work, or climbing in your lap, it won’t be long before a lamp goes over and breaks. The child has learned even by age two that they want attention and if “positive” behavior doesn’t get it, knocking over the lamp sure will. It may be negative behavior, but it does get your attention. Even negative strokes are better than no strokes.

Learning how to get positive strokes, and not resorting to negative stroke behavior, is a life-long learning process, especially if you grew up having difficulty receiving positive strokes from those closest to you.

Psychopaths learn how to give FAKE positive strokes to hook us in. Strokes that we accept at face value as positive, and come to depend on. Later, when we are addicted to the strokes from our own personal psychopath, the strokes turn negative and painful, but we are so addicted to receiving strokes from this “super stroker,” that, contrary to any messages from our internal Adult saying “Hey, there’s something wrong here,” we put tape over the mouth of the Adult to shut him up.

Or, our internal Parent, if it is more critical than nurturing, reminds us that we deserve these negative strokes because we are not worthwhile individuals worthy of respect.

Transactional Analysis also uses the “Triangle” of Rescuer-Persecutor-Victim. We and the psychopath learn to play the “triangle game,” changing chairs like a game of musical chairs. One day the psychopath is our Rescuer, and we are the Victim, then the next day we Persecute their role as Victim, and on the third day we Rescue their Victim, only to start and stop the “music” on an almost daily basis.

“Games” are unconscious maneuvers in which roles are accepted, the “triangle” is utilized, and there is a “pay off” at the end for all parties playing. Dr. Berne, in Games People Play, describes these “games.” He also shows us how we can stop playing “games,” which preclude intimacy, and get off the “triangle.” Some of the names of the various games are very descriptive, like, “Let’s you and him fight.” Other games are “Why don’t you, yes, but ”¦” “Alcoholic,” “Cops and robbers,” “Let’s pull a fast one on Joey,” “Look how hard I’ve tried,” and my all time psychopath’s favorite, “If it weren’t for you.”

Transactional Analysis may not explain everything about the human psyche, but it does go a great ways in making our inner and outer world understandable in a simple language. It gave me a way to think in an orderly fashion about the “internal dialog” between my Critical Parent tapes and my Child. It gave me a way to use my Adult to nurture the Child inside me and to hit the MUTE button on the critical Parental injunctions that kept me from insisting on respect and reasonable treatment from those closest to me. It helped me distinguish the fake positive strokes from the real positive strokes, and helped me to decide that I can stroke myself, and don’t have to depend on negative strokes to survive.

Books I would recommend for further reading are:

Games People Play by Dr. Erick Berne, M. D.,
I’m OK-You’re OK by Thomas Harris M. D.\
Scripts People Live, by Claude M. Steiner.


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70 Comments on "Another Way of Looking at Things"

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This is a really great approach to looking at OUR inner mechanisms, OUR motivations and how we ourselves relate to those around us. As we move into more positive interactions with others, we can examine our own motivations through this lens, and make more conscious choices about our interactions with NORMAL people.

However, we should not try to understand the psychopath through this model. When the FBI and their teams of psychologists and psychiatrists examined the Columbine shooters, Harris and Klebold, they uncovered important differences between the two. From a 2004 article, written by Dave Cullen and published in Slate, “Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were radically different individuals, with vastly different motives and opposite mental conditions.” Klebold appeared to be the more easily understood angry and depressed teenager. Harris, however, was remembered as “nice.” From an in-depth analysis of his actions and journals, the experts ultimately diagnosed Harris as “a psychopath.”

The article says, “Because psychopaths are guided by such a different thought process than non-psychopathic humans, we tend to find their behavior inexplicable. But they’re actually much easier to predict than the rest of us once you understand them. Psychopaths follow much stricter behavior patterns than the rest of us because they are unfettered by conscience, living solely for their own aggrandizement. (The difference is so striking that [FBI psychologist Dwayne] Fuselier trains hostage negotiators to identify psychopaths during a standoff, and immediately reverse tactics if they think they’re facing one. It’s like flipping a switch between two alternate brain-mechanisms.)

“None of his victims means anything to the psychopath. He recognizes other people only as means to obtain what he desires. Not only does he feel no guilt for destroying their lives, he doesn’t grasp what they feel. The truly hard-core psychopath doesn’t quite comprehend emotions like love or hate or fear, because he has never experienced them directly.”

The article quotes extensively from Dr. Robert Hare as well, and it is an illuminating look at the differences between “normal” aberrant behavior, and the psychopathic. http://www.slate.com/id/2099203/

As a side note, Thomas A. Harris, M.D., author of “I’m OK — You’re OK,” was a noted psychologist and his work has had a major influence. He is NOT the author Thomas Harris who wrote “The Silence of the Lambs” and other books describing the infamous Hannibal Lecter.

Oxy, this is great stuff. I’ve heard from other people that TA was really helpful to them. The only piece I knew about was the Drama Triangle.

My understanding was that the only way out of the triangle was to act on your own behalf, rather than being eternally conscious of everyone else’s position. And that would, inevitably, make you the Persecutor from their perspective, because you weren’t being sufficiently conscientious about considering their issues.

I’m not sure if I have that right, but the idea has helped me when I felt like I was being stretched (like on a rack) between a lot of things other people wanted me to do and think, and I had to risk irritating them to get back in touch with myself.

Don’t sociopaths like to position themselves as the victims to try to get us to rescue them?

KH,

It seemed more to me like the XS/P liked to position himself as the victim but like to always “look like the rescuer”. He hated EVER appearing weak to me or others. He LOVED when people viewed him as the SEAL hero that he never was. Or when he worked in the biker bar as a bouncer and they used to call him “Super (insert name here)”.

Ox,

In fact the more I read about BPD, his issues seem consistent with this disorder, particularly a touch of psychosis, considering he tells people he was a SEAL and worked killing terrorists for the NSA. But from what I read it seems this is predominantly a female disorder? What do you know about it?

Kathleen,

It seems to me (IMHO only) that the “games” that they play are a way of appearing to “emote” and since the “rules” are easily observed, and the “moves” from one position to another are easily predictable, by observation they learn the “moves” to the various games.

They get the “pay off” with out really being able to”feel” anything much but rage. The participants in games don’t actually “realize” consciously that they are in a “game” or it then becomes a “maneuver” or something consciously done.

I think the Ps also learn to do these things consciously because they know if they throw out the “hook” that we will pick it up as bait and the “game is ON.” We of course don’t know it is a “game” but THEY are maneuvering us where they want us.

An example I read in a book once about TA was a person “looking for a fight.”

The person who is “It” (wants to play) comes home and throws out a hook (bait.)

I”ll call him White, he comes home and says to his wife, in an irritated voice “Where are my cuff links” (what he is actually doing, is APPEARING to ask for information –an Adult to adult conversation—but what he is actually doing is going to a short cut from previous games that really says “What the hell did YOU do with my cuff links, you’re such a lousy housekeeper.”

Now, Black, the wife can either play the game or avoid the game, depending on how she feels that day. If she wants to play and get into a fight before they go to the opera she says, “Well, White, look for them yourself, you lazy chit what do you think I am, your personal maid?”

Or if Black wants to avoid the game she says (ignoring his under tone of criticism) “They are on your dresser dear.”

Now, if he REALLY wants to fight, he will continue to throw out hooks with more and more “appealing” bait to make her want to take it so he can take out his anger aggression or whatever he is wanting an excuse to do.

Reading and learning about games can help you “see” some of these obvious ploys on their part. I always loved the names they gave them which really describe the games well and give you a laugh at the same time.

Playing “games” doesn’t necessarily mean you are a psychopath, but the psychopaths are very good at playing games where the pay off is they control your moves, and belittle you.

TA also goes in to the “positions”that we take early in life: “I’m okay-you’re okay” or I’m not okay–you’re ok” or I’m not Ok and You’re not OK, and I’m OK and You’re Not OK.

The psychopaths seem to be stuck in the “I’m OK and You’re NOT OK” position, especially the arrogant ones like my P son and my P-bio father. This is a difficult position because they are continually seeking “strokes” (notice) from others, but since others are NOT OK, those strokes are not “valuable” strokes since they come from NOT OK people. It is a pretty bad “catch 22” for those people in that position and they are never “satisfied.”

Since most of the books on TA are written for the “public” reader, rather than for the professional, and are written in such a way that they are fairly easily understood, I recommend reading on this subject as an adjunct to our other information on our healing journey.

Most of us play benign “games” such as “Water Cooler” (where people talk around a water cooler) for a past time, and they really don’t do a lot of damage to our psyches, but the “hard core” third-degree “games” that the psychopaths play with us can lead to “tissue damage” or death! It also gives us an idea when we recognize a “game” they have been playing, how to avoid picking up the hook in the bait. To stop playing games we are accustomed to, we must first recognize that is what is happening, and then we have to make a conscious decision not to “”play.”

Ox Drover: This example has helped me so much. I am someone who need to learn not to take the bait of a sociopath…bait, after all, is WORM! LOL. I appreciate this.

KF,

Just as more males are diagnosed as Ps, more females are diagnosed as BPDs. There are some aspects of BPD such as many of them cut themselves or do other self harm that generally is not found in PPD persons. Though, according to an article I think on LF by Dr. Leedom, BPDs can sometimes behave as PPDs, especially when under a great deal of stress or fear. My XDIL has aspects of both BPD and PPD, and I am not really sure which she would be diagnosed clinically but the point is, it doesn’t matter, she is a TOXIC person.

BPDs have the “Oh, I just met you and you are my best friend/lover etc” aspect to them that the Ps do, courting you either as a friend or lover very quickly and wanting to establish a bond with you. They will frequently just as the Ps do, do all kinds of nice things for you in an effort to get you “obligated” to them.

BPDs seem to have more of a “Push-pull” thing than the PPDs do, but frankly I wonder if the PPD and BPD are actually the same thing or very closely allied, maybe the hormones make the differences between the two sexes. Personally, if you label them ALL “TOXIC” you will cover the field, so which is which is really pretty much a moot point I think except for clinical trials, for our lives, “if it looks like a duck….”

Ox-D & KF: I’ve heard BPD described as a “little PPD.” I got mixed up with one in a work/roommate situation this past year. She told me early on that she had been diagnosed “BPD.” Since I was working for her business and staying in a room in her house, I had an up-close look at her behavior, beginning to end. This was not a friendship/lover situation at all, so there weren’t any emotional ties for her to yank on, but frankly her behavior was fully as toxic and destructive as any psychopathic abuser I’ve ever heard of. She used rage to control her environment, but could put on a very persuasive facade for anyone new that she thought she could use. Remorseless about defrauding people: the kind of thing you don’t really know until you’ve witnessed the pattern over time. And, no, she didn’t pay me for my work.

I don’t know who made the “BPD” diagnosis, but I’d say — having witnessed her business dealings and her interactions with family (including young children) and “friends,” I’d just call her a full-blown P. Laughing gleefully after she’d soaked her 10-yr-old granddaughter who was helping her in the garden on a cold day in May, etc., etc.

There was a great article here a while back comparing sociopaths to borderlines. I will see if I can find it. It helped me a lot as I have dealings with one of each.

here is a link if I can get it to come through to some more information on TRansactional analysis and Dr Eric Berne, the originator of the concept.

http://www.businessballs.com/transact.htm

Not sure why that didn’t link up, but maybe you can copy it and paste into your browser.

A simple google search will give you lots of hits on Eric Berne.

Rune, I agree with you a BPD can be AS DESTRUCTIVE as a PPD and some of them are quite capable of murder. It does help when we are not emotionally involved with these people and allows us to get out at least emotionally unscarred but sometimes they can wreck our lives anyway, and they tend to be stalkers as well. They seem to me at least to LOVE revenge when you “injure” them.

I have had several of them admit to me that they ahd been diagnosed BPD (almost proudly in some cases) and I don’t think they really “get” the true meaning of that diagnosis.

My husband rented one of our rental units to a gal that I quickly sized up as a BPD, she was coming on to me hard and fast wanting to be my “best friend” (that’s a big clue usually) and I kept her at arm’s length but she did tell me that she had been diagnosed as BPD and also bi-polar (which actually makes me think she might have been a misdiagnosed PPD, but she was a “piece of work” I can tell you for sure. Beautiful young woman and very bright, but I think she was dangerous and I am glad I spotted her right away as “off.” At least that ONE time I spotted that one before I got hooked in.

One thing I noticed in working with adolescents with that dx in an inpatient setting was that one minute they would be trying to claw your eyes out and the next minute wanting to hug you. They saw NOTHING strange with this “180 degree about face” in a period of 2 minutes.

Yep, they are scary!

Thanks for the responses Rune and Ox…..and yea I know if it walks like a duck…….it doesn’t really matter. What do you think about this though? This issue is disturbing to me because when the “chit hit the fan” (as Oxy would say)…..he came on accuing me of having BPD. He is not very savvy with a computer so I don’t think it’s something he came up with out of “concern for me” as he said. I DO think he may have been diagnosed and was projecting. Plus, he has these psychotic ideas of being a legend and killing on behalf of the US gov’t and I have the facts. He was kicked out of the Navy after 4 months. or is this something consistent with a P also??? What do you guys think? I honestly don’t see a big difference in what I read. I say BPD because he plays the role of appearing to have a conscience very well. But I don’t think most people will see the other side of him.

I do agree that any are capable of murder. His mood could go from 0 to 100 in 3 seconds. HE definately played the obligated card….. “I moved here to be with you”. “I left my family to be with you” Hell, I didn’t ask you to move and you told me you were already divorced asswipe!! Sorry.

OK, coming from a beginner, I’m afraid I’m having a problem with a lot of the acronyms on this site, let’s start with BPD and PPD… I finally figured out D & D. There’s another one, Oxy I’ve seen you use it a lot about 6 characters long, it almost feels like a name but I’ can’t ever figure out what it is. I’ll look for it and bering it up later.

The other thing I wanted to say was in regard to the article, really great BTW (see I know that one – LOL). Much of the therapy I have been involved with in the past has been about honoring the pain of the inner child. Literally imagining her in a chair across from me and being able to see her hurt, or what her needs are (that has always been tough for me, recognizing my needs) . Reprograming the words that caused the hurt to begin with (what did she need to hear) and when I found myself in a situation where that hurt was triggered, replacing the shaming, disconnected, belittling voice with one filled with compassion, love or whatever was needed. It has helped me heal some of those old wounds and give me a little more heart when I totally screw up (like being involved with a S). It’s not foolproof by a long shot, but very helpful and with time I have gotten better and better at it.

Oxy, we had an exchange here last week I think, regarding the x neighbors and you had said they really don’t care what goes on or went on as long as they are not affected…..here’s something I thought about. None of us really knew we were being affected until later. We may not have felt comfortable with certain things but it took most of us a while to realize something not right was happening.

So the S/P buys a lot, not just in their subdivision, but right next door. Then he moves his x con friend in and convinces everyone what a nice guy he is (in and out of prison most of his 45 years). They have loud parties and women in and out. Then the x con’s sister (former stripper, S/P’s girlfriend moves in. The whole family comes and parks in the front yard (all the brothers have been in jail at one time or another) with their bikes and work on trucks. (trying to set the scene).

Suddenly the neighbor is convinced to tell his children that Joe the x con was “in college”. The S/P thinks this is funny. Because he came up with the idea. So they are already getting conned and roped into something that I believe would otherwise be unacceptable. Who wants to be in a neighborhood of $400,000 plus homes with music blasting outside and engines revving day and night? I think they ARE affected they just don’t know it yet. I think they didn’t care when it was me and him. But I do think at some point they will care if they haven’t seen it already. Don’t you? What do you think?

Oxy,
the other one I don’t get, but have seen frequently is ROTFLMAO, what is that?

Dear Blew,

LOL= Laugh out loud
ROTFLMAO=roll on the floor laughing my arse off
D& D= devalue and discard
GAslighting=twisting reality, name comes from a movie in 40s I think where a guy was using gas lights to drive his wife crazy
BTW=By the way
IMHO=in my humble opiinion
IMO=in my opinion
BPD is Borderline Personality disorder
PPD (or just P)=Psychpathic personality disorder
NPD (or N)=Narcissistic personality disorder
ASPD=Antisocial personality disorder (about the same as a PPD, some argument about the terms)
S=Sociopath (about the same as a PPD, some argument about the terms)

The CHILD inside us, according to TA is the FEELING part of us. Happy, sad, guilty, etc. i.e. emotions

So what you are doing taking care of that “little child inside” is very theraputic. Getting in touch with our Child (notice the capitol letters, it is NOT “childish” but the Child. That wonderful part of us that has needs, feelings, desires, etc.

Another “trick” I have learned is if your child is feeling say “guilt” then get into the Adult state and ask yourself “why is my Parent beating my Child?”

In determining which “state” you are in, if you are feeling sad, mad, glad, etc. you are in the Child. If you are hearing “voices” (tapes) telling you that you are “stupid” etc. then your Parent is talking to (beating) your Child.

Your Adult can protect your Child by assuming “control” simply by consciously asking it to. If you feel really “sad” or “guilty” asking the Adult to take over CALMS the Child. The feelings quiet down for a while. This may take some practice though.

Your Adult can also go through the Parental Tapes and hit MUTE by saying “My parental tapes tell me I am “bad” but I know this is not true.”

Most of us have contaminated Parental Tapes to one degree or another, but not all tapes are “bad” they do give us good information that we don’t have to continually think about or make decisions about like “Always brush your teeth before you go to bed.”

Glad you are here Blew, learning different techniques and information about THEM and about ourselves as well is the path to healing. The support and validation you will find here in this wonderful group will help you walk that healing path. (((hugs))))

We were posting on top of each other, Blew!

Oxy,
thank you so much, this helps! Now I have the map!

The P, or internal Parent
The A, or internal Adult

and

The C, or internal Child….

I believe it is this part of us that cry’s out for the ex S/P and is also the one the is most hurt and damaged by this experience. Also this C is the internal part that is so addicted to the ex S/P.

The C part of us wants their attention whatever it be “positive” or “negative”. And felt the withdrawal effects (i.e addiction) most devastating. It is also the part that at one time was hurt rejected or even emotionally abandon from a caretaker or parent as a child in our past. The C received more “negative” strokes then “positives” ones and would have a problem differencing from the two in part by the P and A in us. I also believe it is C we all must work (strokes) more so after having the experience from a S/P relationship and “retrain” ourselves not to get involve with people like our S/P. In short we take ourselves back to the basics and stroke the C part of ourselves using the other two counterparts ( the A and P). To stroke and retrain ourselves into believing that we do deserve better and should know better. Once all three come into a total understanding of the whole and allow it to be expressed without fear and anxiety we then will began to grow more emotionally complete and whole both mentally and spiritually. All this of course will have a psychology effect on us in the long term which will bring about an more positive way of thinking and solving internal conflicts within ourselves..

Oxy – this is brilliant. My goodness – this was so helpful. I’ve been wondering a lot recently how the hell I let certain things happen. I consciously watched him do things, heard him say things, which were CLEARLY indicative of really bad betrayals….yet I said nothing. I “shushed” myself in a way I never had before. I behaved differently in this relationship than others. That’s perfect – it was like my inner child put tape over the mouth of my inner adult! Perfect! The inner adult was seeing what was happening, but could not speak up. The inner child had her hostage. That’s exactly what it felt like.

My question is this – what is is that the S does that is so intoxicating to the inner child that she will take the adult hostage? What exactly are these “strokes” and how are they different than the strokes we get from others, particularly other romantic partners?

PS

Oxy,

Yes thank very much for your article. Really insightful and bring about some thoughts about one’s self…

Update:

psychology effect (sorry should be).

“psychological effect”

🙁

Wish we could edit on these blogs…

I suggest that you google Eric Berne and/or Transactional Analysis, but basicly “strokes” are just that, attention. Physical strokes are physical, a touch, a hug, or sex etc. and + strokes are “I love you” or – strokes are “I hate you.” At least you are being noticed.

I think that NC drives the Ps so wild because it is like “solitary confinement” to them, we don’t RESPOND, we don’t NOTICE them.

I dont’ know if you have little kids or had them, but I noticed when my kids were little if I got on the phone they kept wanting attention (I was distracted and not paying attention to them) If they couldn’t get my attention by being “nice” they would start to tear up things, but whatever worked and got my attention was BETTER than being ignored.

Children are very sensitive to being ignored or not noticed. I have a little house dog that is like a 2 yr old child, wants on my lap all the darn time, and touching me. Very needy for strokes. If I ignore him and don’t give him positive strokes, he will chew up something—it gets my attention! LOL

I think we sort of get used to how we get our strokes, and reuse behaviors that get strokes that conform to what we expect. If a person has a low self esteem then negative strokes may be “easier” for them to get than positive ones. You can too, I think, become addicted to certain kinds of strokes or from certain people.

The more important the person is to you, the more value the strokes have. A “Hi, how are you” from a stranger doesn’t mean a lot, but a “Hi, how are you” from a guy you’ve been scoping out means MORE. “I love you” from a stranger doesn’t hold much weight or value, but “I love you” from the person you love as well has more “value.”

BEcoming aware of our feelings and what we need, and learning to ASK directly for what we need from our friends and familys is the first step to learning to live game-free.

Being honest and direct with our family and loved ones is the way to true intimacy. If I am feeling kind of wanting to be alone, I will ask my sons for some “space” rather than play a “game” and start a fight and then stalk off in a huff. It achieives the “alone time” either way, but the ASKING is the healthy way.

While TA is fairly “simple” to get the basic ideas of, I do suggest that you start by reading “Games People Play” and then move on to a couple more of the books that expound on the concept. It is fairly “light” and entertaining reading and I think most people who read about TA have lots of “Ah Ha!”moments.

James, that is the basic concept right on. There are also other parts when you delve more deeply into TA, of the dividing of the P into the Critical P and the Nurturning P (which are the tapes from our parents) and some people have a huge Critical P and a small Nurturning P, and vice versa. How our Child feels will be determined by this, but we can to some extent use our Adult to “reprogram” the Parent tapes, and mute the bad ones.

Becoming aware of the tapes and what they are telling us (using our Adult to “screen them for truth”) helps us to use our Adults to nurture and protect our Child from those contaminated tapes.

For example if you were raised by a parent who was bigoted, and the tapes were “All black people are bad” your Adult might accept that as FACT until it examined this tape and saw that it was NOT true. Therefore your Adult could MUTE that tape, so that your Child would no longer be afraid of black people.

If you think about the tapes that must be playing inside the heads of the Ps who were raised by Ps and how much contamination they must have, plus the fact that their Child has bonding problems, it’s a wonder to me that they don’t all run off with guns blazing away at the rest of the human race. There is NO way they can protect or Nurture their inner Child which is a lost and abandoned soul, but there’s no way to reach that Child with therapy or love.

I think too, that we SENSE that lost Child inside them and want to nurture it, which they use against us. Trying to “help”them bites you in the butt every time! But, because we ARE nurturning and caring people who have empathy for other people’s inner Child, it is difficult for us to turn our backs on that Child—even at the expense of our own Child.

Their Child screams for immediate gratification or throws tantrums and doesn’t care what it does to our Child. Or, even enjoys seeing our Child cry….it really is SAD, but at this point in time, I have finally realized I have to take care of MY CHILD with my ADULT and not allow the contaminated tapes to make me pity that (evil) Child within my son or the other Ps.

Hmmmm….Interesting – just checked out the site. I guess what I am interested in is why the strokes of the sociopath are so seductive…because they are so intense and frequent in number? I’ve received strokes from other boyfriends, or from bosses or friends, but something about the S’s strokes were addictive. I think maybe because he delivered SO MANY in those first three months that my C thought she had FINALLY hit the jackpot and FINALLY found someone who would give her all the strokes she missed in childhood, and in rapid succession! It was a feast of strokes. And then he gradually withdrew them…..and my child became hysterical. And, as you said, Oxy, the child then decided to gag the Adult because she was going to get those strokes back no matter what. Or continue the negative strokes.

I had the sense that he first treated me like a beloved child, and then later demanded that I be the parent. I remember feeling like he really took care of me those first couple of months, and then gradually it flipped until it was entirely the reverse. I parented him constantly. Gave him unconditional love and positive regard, even when he was doing monstrous things. Is that what they want? To be loved unconditionally, not matter how hideous their behaviors?

Healing Heart: So glad you are here. There was an article recently about the conditioning that may be experienced with a sociopath. Look at the left top of the page and I will try to bring it back up for you.

Good article OXY – You forgot to mention Cluster B – but like you say – don’t matter what we call them they are Toxic – I have been around the block and have encountered lot’s of weirdos in my life, I have had my heart broken and broke a few myself. Have encountered some bad people, survived a toxic N mother and a abusive father. But nothing has ever effected me the way the Sociopath has. And it was mostly after he was gone. Maybe some of us take and take so much until that last straw breaks our backs and we get one more chance to pick ourselves up and we have to turn the attention onto us, something I have not been comfortable with, but I have to work on me in order to avoid toxic ducks.

That is why I also see the concept of the “okay parent” or is it the “good enough parent”. The P (internal parent) in us gives or withhold the strokes for our C depending on these “tapes”. Both the A and P can work on these tapes and come to understand some of it as flawed or faulty information and must then be revised or as you stated “mute” the tape. I see the A P and C parts of us as a group of people in a room. If they aren’t connected or in some kind of agreement then we have a very chaotic room and confusion at best. But if we can get all three aligned or in some agreement then a type of harmony will exists within ourselves. This also goes with the theory of “your okay and I okay” principle. If one have a deeper understanding and acceptance about one’s self then we can extend this to other people who we come into contact with. We see the flaw in ourselves and with empathy can understand that same flaw in others. Of course in someone who is a s/p only see the flaws in others and denies it in themselves and believe in “I okay but your not okay” line of reasoning and relating to others. Anyway Oxy I am a very big supporter of Transactional Analysis and believe it as a helpful tool when trying to understand our inner self more and resolve conflicts within our self. Which in turn will help us resolve conflicts we have with other people.

Dear Healing heart,

That UNconditional love and approval I think may be exactly what they want! It is kind of funny, actually. A minister friend of our family corresponds with my P-son. After the initial attack none of us (even my mother) were writing to P son and he was DESPERATE to get information from us about WHAT had happened, so he could “fix it.” He wrote friends and got them to call us to “check and see how we are” and we gave them no informatin other than “We’re fine, thanks for calling” and hung up.

Anyway, he wrote this minister and was decrying that we were NOT CHRISTIANS because we were not giving him “UNCONDITIONAL LOVE” Of course he did not admit to the minister that he had tried to have me killed. LOL But,yes, I think they DO expect UNconditional acceptance and love no matter what they do.

Years ago after my divorce, which was pretty traumatic and involved my X-FIL who was a raging P, I took my children and went to counseling. My counselor introduced me to TA at that time and I read about TA and put it to work in my life in many ways, to a great deal of benefit both for myself and my kids, but like many people who go to AA a few times or for a year, I slowly fell “off the wagon” and slipped back into the the “Games People Play” again. It was easier to quit working so hard on staying “clean and sober” in my relationships because those old familiar patterns were so EASY and so FAMILIAR to me. I didn’t even have to think about them, they just were easy to do….much easier than working hard on maintaining my “sobriety” (game free life). I realize now that STAYING healthy in a life long problem, that it will require a LIFE LONG COMMITTMENT to take care of me and not fall back into those old patterns. Not slip back to reading lines from a SCRIPT that was written for me by my internal Parent.

While I am doing much much better today than I was a year ago, it has been a daily struggle to stay “sober.” Originally I wanted to “heal” and be “okay” and just stay that way without any further effort. Just like if I had a bad cut on my leg, and sewed it up, then it would heal and I would never again have to worry about it. NO SO with emotional healing, we have to keep MAINTAINING THAT HEALING on a daily basis.

If you throw a ball up in the air, as long as it is rising it continues to go up–but the second it STOPS going UP, it starts to fall back down. WE CANNOT STAND STILL or we will begin to FALL. I’ve thrown myself UP “a 1000 times” but because I didn’t keep the UP ENERGY going, I stood still and then began to fall again. That too has been a pattern in my life.

Just as an addict to alcohol or drugs craves that familiar “high” from their substance and has to fight that every day for the rest of their lives, I somehow “crave” that “high” I get, that “high” I learned to expect from the DRAMA of the script that was written for me….the moves and the dialog of the script are so memorized inside me that it is sooooo easy to slip back into the role and play it.

Making up my own words and new moves takes work, and I guess I am basicly lazy, and would like to just “coast” along without the effort of writing my own life-story rather than reading the words already written for me.

NO MORE, will I read that script, no more will I engage in that horrible drama of “American Family Tragedy” but day by day, I will write new words, and LIVE a life instead of go through the motions of ACTING like I am living when in truth I am only play acting a predesigned role.

Hey Oxy – this is all so helpful, thank you. I have studied “Internal Family Systems,” but not transactional analysis. It’s similar in some ways, but I think the specific Child, Adult, parent, parts of the personality are just so accurate in the S relationship.

Interesting what you said about your son trying to “figure out” what was wrong so that he could “fix it.”

After I started NC with my ex S and maintained it (much to his surprise), the ex S started reading all of our back emails from our relationship. For the first time, he commented on pain I had expressed 7-8 months prior in the D & D phase. He never cared at the time – was disdainful of the pain, and then indifferent. But suddenly was showing an interest, and seemed to muster up some attempts at empathy. It rang so hollow – and it seemed that he was becoming desperate (I was not behaving as if under his control for the first time) that he had gone back over our communications to “figure out” what had happened so that he could fix it. He didn’t care at all about my feelings at the time, or months after, but suddenly showed interest. And, like your P son, it seemed to be so that he could strategize.

I get so steamed about this.

I looked back over our emails during the D & D phase. IT looks like every few days he would send me a sappy “I love you so much, let’s make this work, I want to be with you forever” email. Meanwhile, he was abusive and cheating every day – his behavior was horrendous. But those emails kept me hopeful – I ate them up (much wanted strokes) and kept me in. It’s like he threw me a bone every few days. And email was the easiest, least effortful way to do that. He’d take five minutes to send me a “love you, let’s make this work,” email and then earn the ability to be abusive and philandering for another 3, 4, days before I would object. And then the cycle would continue. I was a junkie.

All this discovery makes me so mad. I guess that’s good. I SHOULD have been really mad at the time.

Dear HH,

Yep, that’s the way they do it. I actually read the letters my son wrote to folks, and the minister sent me a copy of the one he wrote to him, and how “justifiably angry” P son was because we didn’t give him the UN conditional “love” he DESERVED. DUH???? HUH??? LOL

They will use anything they can to hook us back and holding out that “I lvoe you” crap is just that—a HOOK. But in the past we always ate it up, so they expect that it will work. When we maintain NC it frustrates the heck out of them because they can’t tell if we are eating it up or not. THEY HAVE LOST CONTROL—that was another thing P-son said, “How can I fix it if you won’t correspond with me?”

My first cousin, who is my mom’s POA now is rather frustrated with me because I won’t talk to my mom, and maintain NC. He keeps saying “How can you work it out if you won’t talk?” I can’t get him to see that THERE IS NO WORKING IT OUT. He grew up the much abused son of my mother’s brother UNCLE MONSTER and he is an injured soul himself. A nice guy, but has all kinds of social anxiety, self esteem problems etc. A GREAT guy but not one that has it “together” emotionally, just a poor guy who is a “walking wounded” from a lifetime of abuse from his father. At least he is not an abuser himself, but I know he is not a happy person at all. He is not married, doesn’t have a relationship though he would love to have one, but just goes to work comes home and goes back to work. Not much of a life, really, but until HE decides he wants to work on healing, I can’t “fix” him. But, at the same time, I can’t get it across to him that there is NO fixing my relationship with my mother. I can’t fix her any more than I can fix him. AND, she is not about to fix herself or allow anyone else to guide or help her so so. She doesn’t see a need to be “fixed”—the problem is ME needing “fixing” so that I will continue to allow her to dictate to me and “pretend we’re a nice normal family.”

Yea, we do get steamed about all this, and steamed at them, and steamed at ourselves for allowing it. Getting over that “steamed” hurdle was very difficult for me, but I’m getting there, one step at a time.

I am at least realizing that MY reality is REAL and their reality is a FANTASY, and I’m tired of “playing “Let’s pretend.”

Oxy … you said something everyone should pay attention to … that your cousin can’t see that “there is no working it out”.

To work out anything from the negative to the positive … all parties involved have to acknowledge there is a negative situation going on. All parties WANT to work on building a positive out of a negative. But, anti-social personalities give everyone lip service … so there is no working it out. I say, we tattoo them all a slime green color and call it a day!

Yes to these past posts by Wini and Oxy – It was important for me to get to a place where I realized there was NO working anything out. Months after I threw him out he started saying “let’s go to couples therapy” and then became very angry that I wouldn’t.

Meanwhile – I had been trying to drag him to couples therapy for months when we were together. He would get so annoyed – beyond annoyed, when I said things like “we need to work on our relationship” when we were living together, but apparently now I’m a negative, pessimistic, unforgiving, person because I won’t go to couples therapy.

His hooks are good – I’ve got to give him that. I guess it makes sense that so many of his exes go back to him – he promises them the world. If it wasn’t for all the research I’ve done, and particularly all that I have learned on LF, I might fall for the hooks, too. They are masterful.

Do THEY know their hooks are hooks, or do they actually think they are true? I think if I set up couples therapy (don’t worry, not happening), he would go for a couple of sessions, lie lie lie, and then I’d say the couples therapy wasn’t going to work if he lied……he’d tell me I was totally uncooperative and wasn’t going to be in couples therapy with a liar who isn’t willing to do the work.

It was so important for me to realize that he was not going to get better. Ever. And that his promises are all lies. That his lipservice to being sorry for what he’s done is purely that – lipservice.

I like the idea of tattooing them all. Make them all wear permanent scarlett letters. THat wouldn’t stop them though, they’d sweet talk victims into pitying them for being “mislabled” and branded incorrectly.

Healing_Heart: I just remembered this joke that was sent to me sometime last year.

It was people walking … as they all carried their individual crosses.

One person decided he wasn’t going to be a chump and carry the huge cross like everyone else was carrying.

What did this character decide to do? Yup, he did a short cut in life and sawed the bottom half of his cross off.

Next frame of the cartoon is him with a big grin on his face laughing at everyone … as he walks with 3/4 of his cross while everyone is lugging their full crosses in life.

Next frame … they come to the edge of a cliff. They can see the other side of the opposing cliff. Everyone takes their full crosses off their backs and lay it down over the two cliffs. The full cross cover the gap between cliff … and those people used their crosses to get to the other side.

Not so with the 3/4 quarter cross guy … he stays behind and can not cross the gap.

Peace.

Oxy,

I recall sharing with a friend about the Bad Man when I first came back from Maui. My dear old friend, an older man I loved a long time ago, said, “Sometimes we just want attention, because it makes us feel alive… even negative attention.”

Sounds familiar.

Wow! I can;t believe one of THEM just came out and admitted it.

Oxy,

I’ve been thinking a lot about the strokes piece of your article. I think for me, strokes were so rare as a child (it was always about what I could do for my mother not what she could do for me-I was a tool), that as I grew up, I looked for someone that would give me what I needed, those missing strokes. My late husband adored me, I would’ve walked through fire for that man and did, in a lot of ways. But it was mutual and worked for us both.

When I first encountered my S, the strokes I got from him in the beginning were filling that need and when they started to disappear and were replaced by the D & D, I think I would’ve done just about anything to get them back. Luckily there was some measure of common sense on my part and i didn’t do some of the really crazy stuff he suggested but enough to knock me off center and throw me into a constant state of confusion and anxiety. He used that response and must have watched me like a lab rat to see what would trip my trigger. Then would do it again in a different, more subtle way the next time. He styled himself a profiler, someone who could read people well. It never occurred to me that he was setting me up to try to destroy me. The idea that this was all a big game to get as much money as he could from me and to try to take me out emotionally so i couldn’t respond or react when he was finished, never occurred to me! How could it? It was just so evil!

The challenge as I’m sure you’re aware will be to not only try to heal that wound, and address the wounds of that abandoned inner child, but what about the future? Will I be able to tell the difference between genuine strokes and strokes with a different agenda in the future? Allowing myself to even try to trust someone feels impossible. It’s going to be a very long lonely road. Not one that I am looking forward to, I must say. How do we learn to trust again? I foresee a different kind of conversation with my inner child, my internal parent and the adult in the future.

At my job, we are currently going through a culture shift. One of the new corporate guidelines involve something called “Woodstone Principles”. The basic premise being that you approach all interactions with the idea of positive intent. Meaning if someone comes at me with a protest, disagreement, or criticisim, I should assume their intent is positive even if their delivery is less than that. Having said that, after everything I have been through as of late, this has WARNING written all over it! This is going to require something entirely different from me. My radar is up, I look at my connections differently, less trusting, not taking anything at face value any more. Not wanting to reveal too much or give anyone (unless they are part of my inner circle) ammunition that might come back to bite me later. I had always been so trusting in the past, more of an “open book” type of person. This has really shaken me to the core and saddens me deeply. I don’t want to view the world thru these glasses, but maybe it’s necessary in order to protect myself in the future. How in the world I can take in these new “principles” under the circumstances, it feels insane at best! The last thing I want to do is create a personality split so I can continue to do my job (one I happen to love and excel at). Any suggestions?

Hi Blewmeaway: Hopefully, OxDrover will have a good answer for you. The “Woodstone Principle” does sound like a sociopath’s paradise to me!

There is a pretty new article in the upper left hand corner where the most recent commented articles are about “conditioning” and how it works. I found it very interesting and it could give you some extra insight about how to respond to someone who seems nice and gives what seem to be positive strokes and then suddenly does a change-up on you.

Maybe some of the suggestions in that article can help you watch out for yourself and have a plan ready if someone “Woodstones” you.

I believe that I had a sociopath enter my life for ten years. The Sociopath used this book and the cons in it to destroy my life. I am a normal person. I don’t play games with people nor have I ever heard of such a book or anything in it. I think the book is foolish. He is a Sociopath, envis, jealous, evil. I cared for him and had lots of trust. But he was conning me. Lieing, stealing, tricking. I was the only person who did not know what was going on. He destroyed me in the community and a over ten year career. Once he was done with me I was forced out of work. He tuck everything. Is true, when dealing with a Sociopath you end up with nothing.

David, what is the book you refer to? Was the person who targeted you in a management position in your workplace? Or was the relationship of a personal nature? Whatever the context, people here do know how extremely painful and difficult to recover from any dealings with someone with sociopathic traits can be. Wishing you a peaceful day David.

Welcome david,
Yes,you were unfortunate enough to come into contact with a sociopath.This website is so helpful in helping victims to understand WHAT,WHY and even more importantly,WHERE DO I GO FROM HERE?!

David, You’re in the right place and you are not alone in describing the M.O. of the spath. If you keep reading articles, comments, and sharing, clarity will come your way and you will find yourself again.

I need to share, but where do I go from here? What do you do when a employer leaves you at fourty with very little way to find employment. I have lots to say, and I will soon do so. For now, thanks

David, your question is tough to answer as far as employment. I will try two suggestions I know of:

1. If you can, go to a temporary service. This is a great way, to get paid by the hour, try many different companies and your work becomes your “reference.”

2. If you have any friends or family members (with different last names than yours), see if they will be “work references” for you. This involves trickery, but you need a job and I believe in this situation (and often many others), you may have to finagle with honesty a little to get back to work.

I hope you will keep sharing here and hopefully gain the confidence and thought processes to regain your confidence and composure and get a job.

Thanks for help,and yes I will keep sharing. But the thing is I am middle aged. What, If I find a new career I don’t want. I will die In middle Management?

Hi David: It sounds as if your previous position was at a higher status in the organization and you feel uncomfortable accepting a job in middle management. Let me know if I am misunderstanding that.

When I was in college (which I started at the age of 35) I had a part time job in a career/training office. The counselors there used to tell people that the average person completely switches careers six times throughout their life time. Many people retrain into completely different careers. I started completely over at 35. I wanted a college degree and during that time, I worked as a temp, worked for minimum wage, etc.

I would like to suggest that you reframe your pain about what the sociopath at work did to you into a question: Would you rather be in upper management working for a sociopath or would you rather find a corporation or non-profit where you can work in a different type of position and be happy/fulfilled? Many people in high energy, high paying jobs who are not happy make decisions to be happy instead. They buy a small farm or open a franchise or go back to school (the medical areas are a great choice right now and many only require two years of school).

You might see if your local college or university offers a course in Career Exploration. These are usually 1 hour courses so not super expensive…especially at a community college. I know what it is like to mourn the loss of a career. I was a whistleblower and, therefore, have been told I will never be hired again unless I move far away from where I live now. I may do that when I get my home paid off. Until then, I am doing whatever I need to do to pay my bills and get that house paid off. You can do it too. I promise. I went through years of hell and chaos and got very ill. If I had to do it all over again, I would still blow the whistle, but I would have had another job FIRST. At the time, it was a situation that I was basically swept up in with only my best instincts to guide me. I did the right thing….just not in the right order!

For many people, middle management would be a dream come true IF they are in the right place for them. If WE believe in you, you just keep writing out what happened to you recognizing that you are not alone in having a horrific sociopath work environment. Donna Anderson, the woman who created this site, lost hundreds of thousands of dollars and she used it to create a life that she considers a gift. I get really, super depressed and down also about what has happened to me in my life. But, I WILL pay off this house and I will own something and I can get a little job someday somewhere and hopefully, it will make me happy. I don’t care about status. I only care about being at peace.

david,
I probably can’t answer your questions with the secure answer you want to hear.But if there’s one thing I’ve learned since leaving spath,it is that you get NO WHERE by standing still and asking too many questions~~~you sometimes just have to take a leap of faith in order to be happy! Still,”the ball is in your court”,and you have to do what makes you comfortable.

Lovely to see you Blossom. Donna passed on your message. Thank you for all your kindness to me these past months. I was thinking about oxy, truthy, Lou, and lots of others today and wishing they are doing well. We could do with their presence. Love to you.

Tea,
So glad!Yea,I’ve often wondered what happened to Oxy and the others that were here when I first came on.Maybe we’ll hear from them again soon!

I’d love to know how Lou is Blossom, she was a lifesaver to me in my aftermath as you know. Anyway let’s interpret it as they are all moving forward and doing well. So glad you’re still here. BBE also has been wonderful.

Tea,
I do remember Lou offering so many words of solace and wisdom.I remember Oxy and skylar with such fondness too! I do try to think that their lives are just full and busy,and that some day they’ll “drop in” and we’ll share a cyber “cup o tea” and catch up!

Cup o tea? Are you doing your Dick Van Dyke again?! Ok if you INSIST I’ll do my Eliza. Cor blimey guvnor! I’m in a right two and eight with all this commotion so I is! I’d give my front teef for a room somewhere so I would Professor Iggins. And so on. 😉

Tea,
LOL! That is good! 🙂 The English een me peeps out from teem to teem,wat kin I say my lady?!

Thanks two you both. I still get lost in being negative at times. I find my self comparing with others and what if. And I also know I can’t live in the past as well. But thank you for your responses and sharing. I look forward to other comments.

Hi David: Ten years is a long time to spend with a sociopath affecting you in every way. I believe it can be more devastating if putting up with a sociopath is the way you pay your bills, eat your food, the VERY roof over your head.

I hope you will be very patient with yourself as necessary. You do not have to move on quickly. That can be very frustrating…especially if you might be living with PTSD or depression in response to a sociopath. Both of those illnesses which can be caused by any types of abuse you endured from a Sociopath can cause lower self esteem, loss of faith in ones abilities, and shaming and blaming ourselves. It can take a lot of time to work on those feelings and reach a point where you trust your choices as you work through this. Allow yourself all the time you need and don’t enforce “quick” rules on yourself.

Do you have access to any counseling? If you do, I hope you will take full advantage of it. Also, if you go to the About link at the top of the page, a drop down link says “Archives.” Search through the articles or search specifically for any subject pertaining to sociopaths that might be helpful for you.

Let us be your support system, learn more about what you have been through, and be accepting of yourself and your feelings exactly where you are right now. It can take a lot of time to heal and there is no time table you must follow. You don’t need any more guilt or blaming of yourself from being targeted by a sociopath. Deal with it at your own pace and try to find a way to do something kind to yourself each day…even if it is just sitting and listening to music or going for a walk. Anything new will get your healthy brain neurons to start building pathways to recovery….but there is no hurry and no timetable.

David welcome to our community. Whether we encounter personality disordered people at home, in our families, at work, or anywhere else, having regular interactions with them takes its toll. I had a gm at work who I had to answer directly to for a good 5 years until he finally left. He was manipulative, aggressive, arrogant, deceptive, he was very sharp, he was very slick, and I was his special target. After he left several others who worked there including the owner openly acknowledged how he had it in for me. It’s hard to say in context how much damage I sustained from this one guy because I was dealing simultaneously with my new wife (which I now believe is a psychopath ), and 2 others in my other business and my place of worship. Yes I was juggling at least 4 cluster B personality types. Do Not try this at home kids ! Without babbling on too much about my situation, bottom line, it really has devastated me in every way possible. The other posters have all given you good advice. Everyone’s situation is a bit unique. I’m not out of my situation completely but at least at work the stress is much lessened. I’m doing better now. Do you know why ? Not because I’m free yet, I still have tons of misery in store. Right now my life is very small. I have very little in my life to get excited about. Most people in my community think I’m off my rocker. I’ve lost many friends. Better ? Yes because Since I have begun to educate myself the crushing weight sitting on my chest is lifting. Learning to identify what has been happening to me, finding accurate information is the first step in the fog lifting allowing more light in. Without first really digging in and researching and reading extensively I don’t think I would have the hope, the vision that one day soon I will be free of all this. Hang in there. If you need to vent come here. If you have questions you’ll find a lot of experience here as well.

Hi4Light2shine:

It sounds like you have truly been through it. I am glad you responded to David’s post because we don’t have a large male population here and I think it is very nice when men can share with other men here.

Blossom, your Cockney is …..on a par with Corky St Clare’s at the end of Waiting for Guffman me darlin’. Lol. ( check out the film or some clips on YouTube if you haven’t seen it it’s a great pick me up!)

Tea,
Me brogue ees wha eet es missy! Will check out that youtube! 🙂

Lol. Try ” covered wagons” from the film it’s great blossom

Tea,
Dearie,I havn’t had teem to chek ault yer tube.Wat with the storms that ralled thru een tha apt eenspections!Lawdy!Thunder was boomin and bells wassa ringin an mah pahppy,well she ran unner tha blankie!Here now!(plumping pillows)Tea’s ready.Jon’tan givme those glasses ore I’ll tell yore marmee yore peepin at tha neighbors!Anyways!(wiping eyebrow with apron)Sit right down!One cube or two?
There’s biskits an straawberry jam too!Now!none of that hollerin about your waist!

Oh blossom I may never stop laughing at pahppy. Hahahaha. That andthe fact you’ve called your pahppy ‘ Jonathon’ . Love an’ bahtahd crampits to you and Jonathon. Lol.

Tea,
Blimy!Tha bloke es good!Calle-fonia!Now thar’s whea I’d like ta go!But I ‘spect I’s skeered cause I havn’t been tha seence I was five!Ah!Tha smell of sea wadda an palm treez an rozez!Now the beech is prolly covered in trash,earl and beeched whaales!

“Everybody danth!!” Lol!

Tea,dear…help me set the table.I put the bred n saled on the table.You kin bring the bowls,plates,natkins and silver.The men will be in frum the stool factry soon.I’ll bring the tater soop ovar.EEeeek!Ohmygawd!mah heart!who lost they’s front teeth een my soop?!!

Fightforwhatright: Thanks, ten years is a long time. You see he was a co-worker (friend) he found this con. He just changed a few things to benefit himself. What he did was con or trick me to act out or say things that he did not like about himself over the ten years. Most of it was silly, but I was thinking what ever went on it was between us. I never knew he was keeping score, it was so spread out. At the same time he was watching every move I made. He kept tabs on me when I was not with him. At on point I believe he had me followed. He hated himself and was jealous of me. He wanted to mimic me. This sound weird, but it was like he wanted to switch the kind of people who we are and how our life would end up. He told others that I was ill, even the police. I know others knew he was conning me and I was the only one in the dark. At the end he had another co-worker push me out of employment. And another person say well you can’t take anything with you. (drama triangle) He said such vial things to me at the end, I did not know what to say. Just in shock! I could longer find work in that field again. He made sure of it. I lost my house and had to move. I found out he stole a good deal of money from me, even my wallet. I can’t prove anything. He held all the cards. I trusted him. As a guy I really carried about him. I was always kind to him, his wife, his children. I spent a large amount of money on his kids around Christmases, birthdays. I didn’t know anything about Sociopaths until a year later, when I read about it on-line. And you know by the way he was acting and talking, I believe He was a Sociopath. The projection, gaslighting. Ever since I read a lot about them. But before I left, I saw the little kid in him. The trauma I have is to much on some days. I know longer have a normal life. Everything I remember just goes on over and over in my head. After four years I still can’t find any real employment, Just like he said you will never be employed again.

4light2shine, Thank You for sharing and all the support so far. I have found counseling to help me with moving past the evil that entered my life. There is so mush more to be said. Now that I have been a way for sometime with no contact, I do feel a little foolish but I was so involved, I couldn’t see it for what it was. I do know he knows where I live in general because I felt so close to him as a friend. We shared just about everything. I didn’t see any threat. Thanks to everyone.

david,
It’s very commom for sociopaths to mirror their target because they want to either mimic certain qualities, or as you mentioned in your previous post,your entire life!

Glad to hear that counseling has helped.Did you talk to your counselor about the problem you’re having in finding employment?

blossom4th: Hi, So I have read, that Sociopath want someone else life because they see it ending up or being not the way they want it. So instead of doing the work on their own, they cheat people out of theirs. What do you think? It just so happened to be me who came by. (lucky me)

So far counseling has helped but I think I still have some time to go. One of the problems is that, Like many things right now, I have negative feelings about the future. I think I am so far behind in life. Being in a different location, I need different schooling or training to fit the unemployment.
Thanks for checking on me.

david,
Yeah,spaths are kind of like those critters in the sci-fi movies that zap people so they can use their bodies….only they need personalities instead of bodies!

Take advantage of your counseling to get as many questions answered as possible!It might do you well to write down thoughts you have between sessions.

Is there a Tech school in your area?Look into taking online classes.

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