I recently received this note from a reader in Ireland:
The reason I’m writing today is I have a friend who is in the same position has just recently had contact from her 2.5yr old son’s sociopathic father, looking for access.
She is learning all about what having a sociopathic father actually means, has read the book (Just Like His Father?), but is still unsure whether to allow it or not.
What do you think? Any new research? Anything that shows clearly kids do better without contact?
I do not know of any new research on this topic. We previously discussed two papers parents should be aware of; one concerns antisocial fathers and the other concerns antisocial mothers.
Antisocial Fathers
The common belief is that children are better off having a relationship with a father even if that father is a sociopath. In a landmark study, the only of its kind, researchers proved this is not the case. This study examined the children of 171 fathers high in sociopathic traits and 167 fathers low in sociopathic traits. In the two groups taken together, the presence of the father and his caretaking behavior weakly correlated with less antisocial behavior in children. However, when the two groups were examined separately a startling finding emerged. When fathers who were low in sociopathic traits were present in their children’s lives, children did substantially better. When fathers high in antisocial behavior were present in their children’s lives, children did much worse, especially if the father lived with them. The risk of conduct disorder in the children of antisocial fathers doubled when the fathers resided with the children.
“When highly antisocial fathers reside with the family, children experience a double whammy of risk for antisocial behavior. They are at genetic risk because antisocial behavior is highly heritable. In addition, the same parents who transmit genes also provide the child’s rearing environment. We found that a father’s antisocial behavior accounted for his children’s behavior problems independent of any genetic risk he may have imparted, particularly when he resided with the family and spent time taking care of the children.”
-Sara R. Jaffee, Ph.D. and Colleagues
Antisocial Mothers
There has been one scientific study of mothering and sociopathic traits. In this study, researchers linked scores on the sociopathy scale of a common personality test (MMPI-2) taken during pregnancy to later mothering behavior. This test is often given to people undergoing custody evaluation so it is important to know about this study. High sociopathy scores are linked to problem parenting in six areas:
1. Lack of warmth
2. Passivity/neglect
3. Harsh/abusive discipline
4. Inconsistent/ineffective discipline
5. Poor monitoring and supervision
6. Aggressive values
In this study, mothers completed questionnaires and their parenting behavior was observed during two laboratory tasks. Direct observation is very important, because it is difficult to understand sociopathic parenting without first hand observations. During the observation periods, mothers high in trait sociopathy were observed to show a lack of warmth and to use harsh and ineffective discipline. The ineffective discipline of at risk children is just as important in the development of sociopathy as is lack of warmth. Ineffective discipline does not enable a child to learn impulse control. Lack of warmth impairs Ability to Love. The aggressive values cherished by sociopathic mothers also impair a child’s moral development. It follows that sociopathic mothers pass on the disorder to their children by poisoning The Inner Triangle.
Other considerations
Remember all the research can only give you guidelines. Sociopathy is a spectrum and it can be difficult to tell just how affect a mother or father is. Below is a list of questions you can ask yourself when considering a child’s involvement with an antisocial parent. It is my hope that those outside the family making decisions on behalf of children will consider this list as well.
1. How likely is sociopathic parent (SP) to encourage the child to form a bond only to disappear, abandoning the child?
2. How sadistic or potentially sexually abusive is SP? Is there a risk of parental kidnapping?
3. How likely is it that SP will use child to harm others- get new relationship by playing parent of the year?
4. How likely is it SP will use child to harm other parent?
5. Will SP teach antisocial attitudes to child? eg. suspicion of others and pleasure in aggression or getting over on the system?
6. Will SP expose child to other antisocial adults?
7. Will SP be overly permissive and not set limits or neglect the child- Put child in front of TV and not feed him or help him toilet etc.?
8. Will SP induce fear and guilt if the child does not do what SP wants?
9. Will SP be intoxicated infront of child? Will SP drive while intoxicated with child in the car?
10. Is SP doing illegal things and at risk for arrest?
11. Is SP so disordered that to give the child the idea SP is normal will harm the child’s view of humanity?
12. Is SP preoccupied with weapons or own them?
13. Is SP partaking of sexually explicit or violent media and at risk to expose child to these?
14. Will SP attempt to alienate healthy parent?
15. Is SP in treatment or has SP taken parenting classes?
16. Will SP dump child off on other relatives or baby sitter during supposed parenting time?
17. Will SP spend “support money” buying the child’s loyalty by purchasing toys? or taking child places SP cannot in reality afford if SP was supporting child as SP should?
If you can add to the list please do so. I am also looking for your examples of the above.
Reference List
Jaffee S, Moffitt T, Caspi A, Taylor A. Life with (or without) father: The benefits of living with two biological parents depend on the father’s antisocial behavior. Child Development [serial online]. January 2003;74(1):109-126.
Bosquet M, Egeland B. Predicting parenting behaviors from Antisocial Practices content scale scores of the MMPI-2 administered during pregnancy. Journal of Personality Assessment [serial online]. February 2000;74(1):146-162.
When he stabs you with the olive branch, make olive oil. Learn how to be greasy and smooth, good tasting and healthy. Be good. Really good. When life hands you lemons….
But really, get your psychopath on! We can learn something from them. And be even better at it, because we have morals and a conscience, empathy and good will, but instead of them using our weakness against us, if we are really smart, we can use theirs against them. I think this is something, we here at LF should study. God bless.
END:
Good to see you……
Let’s hope he is soooooooo sick moms planning a funeral!!!
Best case scenario!
🙂
Go with what Matt suggests….
and….
I hope your still documenting…..EVERYTHING!!!! Every move, call, location, address, call…….homelessness….etc….
Good luck!
XXOO
EB
Erin….laughing I was thinking the same thing…I should be so lucky tho!! I will definitely follow Matts advice..I just don’t know how to proceed with him until the mediation date/court date…Its not until the 6th of January. he will obviously get the papers prioe to then..so I know he will make things difficult…or do i put on a happy face and pretend like I am doing whats best for both of us..so that we can have something set and in writing…just confused…at times I feel sure and confident and then other times not so sure what to do
Kim,
Thank you for the possitive affirmation. I don’t often feel this way. It’s a daily struggle to keep perspective.
Some new challenges are on the horizon, I had not expected. I’m noticing my oldest daughter (25) is becoming increasingly hostile toward me. Demonstrating many of the P traits; lacking in compassion toward me or her other siblings, unless it serves her a purpose. When she is confronted, she is quick to blame, project, and threaten. Since she, her husband, and my grandson live with us, it make getting some distance a bit tricky. I’m also noticing her influence over my level headed 15 year old. She is especially able to influence her, when my 15 year old has had a run in with her dad, and is emotionally charged – she is starting to take her anger out on me. And, my oldest, then flames the fire – creating an aliance, if you will. It’s all a bit puzzling, but a serious concern that is building momentum.
This week, my oldest also expressed a type of hostile jealousy when her son, my grandson was especially affectionate with me, “I love you Grandma, your the best.” She immediately took offense and began a subtle but effective smear campaigne with my grandson, who later said to me, “I don’t like you Grandma.” out of know where. When I asked him why, he said, “Because if my Mommy doesn’t like you, then I don’t like you.” Hmmmm….
And this comes at a time when I’ve just started a new job, which I’m very happy about. She gets angry when things go well for me. She gets angry and jealous of my frienships, too. She wants to be the the center of attention, the most important, the most valued, the one in control. She cannot stand to hear me compliment, or priase anybody else. She brings the attention back to herself, expressing her feelings of being slighted the same compliment.
I also caught her in a lie, to which she was attempting to gaslight me. When I exposed her effort, she became hyper hysterical, and ripped me up one side and down the other as a parent.
Much more took place, but for now.. I have much to observe and contemplate.
To this list I would like to add stealing razor blades from walmart, in front of your 10 yo child while wearing an Armani suit and then driving away in your 7 series BMW, simply because you think the razors are overpriced. I am not kidding. I thought this might make some of you laugh, tho 🙂
My four year old son’s father is a SP. He is mentally manipulative and emotionally exploitative. He’s not typically violent, although he did on occasion use physical violence and/or the threat of physical violence, to try to control me when we were together. It is possible he is rough and inconsistent in his discipline. However, my son is happy to go see him; especially this time of year with Halloween, his birthday and then Christmas. At 4, he’s all about the toys”so it’s hard to tell what’s going on otherwise.
His SP father was dating a young college student who’s parents forbade them to date, after a year of exposure. He ended up at my house (6 weeks ago) bawling about how her mother said he’s incapable of love, uses his son to make him feel and look good, and is “not a son of God”. With snot running out his nose he heaved and expressed (most likely insincerely) concern for our son’s well being. He said he doesn’t realize he hurts the people he cares about and was worried he was hurting our son inadvertently. He then requested supervised visits, with me being the supervisor.
I didn’t fall for his act, as he most likely was trying to illicit pity that got him far with me for a few years. It’s how he got me to love and care for him without reciprocation. I told the SP, and do believe, that whatever is filling his needs right now also appears to be fulfilling our son’s. I assured him that, if the time came when I thought otherwise, I’d make change. I held him to his schedule with his son and refused to supervise.
Three weeks later, he’s involved with another woman, this time with a 3 year old child. They introduced their son’s immediately and, within three more weeks, started having sleepovers”Mother and son at my SP’s one bedroom apt on the one night a week my son sleeps there.
I know I can’t control what goes on in that house and that opinions vary about the appropriateness of a child seeing partner after partner in a parent’s bed. I expressed my concerns, because I needed to. And, of course, he hasn’t responded to any. He just flits around like a happy man who never presented himself to his son’s mother as an evil man who might harm his own son, let alone this new child in his life.
I have applied for a new position at my place of employment that is based 45 minutes from my home. I am considering moving, if I get the position, not so much to be closer to work as to be further from HIM. My hope is that, if need be, I can move my son further away so exposure won’t be nothing at all, as he is attached to his unhealthy father in some healthy 4 year old ways. But it will be lessened. Less exposure is the best I think I can do. The question will be WHEN lessening the exposure is the right thing to do.
My son is doing well; exhibiting true empathy, compassion and the ability to love. He is like me and very little like his father. Not so much me as an adult, but like me when I was a child; innocent, happy, kind, social, generous, optimistic and adorable.
I have asked the SP to make transitions between households as quick as possible, as I find being in the same room with him upsetting. This helps me but is not lost on my son, who can sense I don’t approve of his father. I also refuse to be around his father’s extended family (the whole lot is even worse then the SP himself), even though my son specifically requests on certain social occasions. I worry about the impact this will have on our relationship.
Thanks for reading!
Duped
Isabell,
You got alot on your plate right now. Take a deep breath…..
The next few weeks are going to be an adjustment, just with settling into your new job. My wish for you is that this goes smoothly. It will give you one less thing to worry about.
The holidays are right around the corner and often times the holidays can create extra stress as well. Be good to yourself and on occasion (when you can spare a minute) do something to pamper yourself. Sounds like you have a houseful. Close the bathroom door and take a bubble bath.
I can see why you are concerned with your oldest daughters behavior. All you can do is observe right now. See if you notice this on a regular basis. Try to recollect how she normally “behaves” when she is not in the spotlight. I know some women her age that develop a “princess” mantality. In other words “it’s all about me” kind of thinking…..Self centered, YES, but they don’t necessarily display other P/S/N behavior or traits.
I would be most concerned with how she interacts with your grandson. And your teenage daughter as well.
Hello,
I couldn’t help but post here. I have an 11 year old son, with a man I have for a long time, wondered if he was a S. My son started having problems, and eventually wound up in counseling at his school. The counselor thought my son was doing better, and he is, and wanted to stop his counseling, but I said no. The circumstances with his father are getting harder, and this always reflects on my sons behavior.
I have shared custody with my P. We had been together for 7 years. He was the absolutely, most abusive man, emotionally, that I have ever met in my life. He used my son to punish and control me. His father was a respected man in the community, so even when I broke up with him, and got a restraining order on him, he got away with breaking it, by using his father to break into my house when I was gone.
Looking back, I dont understand how I put up with it as long as I did. All I know, is that I had completely lost myself, and my self-esteem in the relationship. I worry alot about my son, now 11, but thankfully he has alot of me in him too. We talk about wrong and right alot, and I have to point out that his fathers behavior (aggression, antisocial behavior, how he t5reates other people, and his violent outburst) are not right.
Though my son is in counseling, he is still afraid to talk to the counselor about his fathers behavior. Both my son and my myself, can’t tell his father alot of things…out of fear of being punished. for years and year, his father used my son to control me, abuse me, and isolate me. I would rather be hit, beat, battered than have my son used to pull me around like a doll on a string. It was a never ending nightmare…and looking back, I can now see, why I couldn’t pull my own life together. I wound up suffering severe PTSD and major depression…
it was a long road, and too many details to post here, but we still have split custody. My sons counselor had wanted to stop his counseling, but I said no. My son hasent at all, been able to proccess anything about his father, his fathers aggression or anything. The sad thing, is that his father, works at my sons school, with children with mental retardation, and he has been in many altercations with other teachers and staff at the school, (they threatened to let him go if he continued to be agressive) because of his aggressive style of communication. But STILL, I am alone, and somehow he is pulling it off.
He has bragged to me, how he has slammed his fist down in front of the mentally retarded children, because they werent behaving. He terrorized me and my own son, with the same crap. and still the school employs him. I guess because not many people want to work with, or can handle the kids he takes care of at the school.
My sons father has also been extremely guilty of leaving explicit porn all over his house, my sons entire life. this has also caused problems for my son.
So I am keeping my son in counseling, and slowly encouraging him, to confide in this counselor. It is a very very delicate situation, and I am hoping that the school, and the counselor will come to see what is really going on. The counselor did not want me or his father talking about eachother. So that has hindered the progress of getting down to the truth.
It is that situation, that if my sons father feels threatened in anyway, someone is going to be punished severely, and that will be either me, or my son. My son is getting old enough to let a judge know where he wants to live. So with counseling, support from me and my family, and the truth ccoming out about his father, I am hoping the justice system will finally work on his behal, and my behalf. His father had abused the courts also, and when I had mentioned that we needed to get couseling for our son, he got vindictive, and made a story up about how my 8 year old son was molesting him. Ofcourse it wasent true, but it was a nightmare. He had no evidence, and had led our son into lieing, and then my son told the truth. Then his father blamed our 11 year old son for lieing, when he didn’t get his way in court, and could have been busted for lieing in court. He wanted to tear me and my children apart and used my older son to try and do that…because I wanted counseling for OUR son, because he was acting out what he was learning from his father. It was a nightmare in hell, and I do everything I can to keep the waters calm for my 11 year old son. We have to do everything, as to not upset his father or get in his way. Its not a way to live.
but his father, I can check at least 8 or 9 things off that list above, that he has done, or still does do. My own family (me and my two boys) have suffered endlessly, because of what he did to us in the past, economically, financially, spiritually and physically.
His father even got away with breaking the court order and taking my son to texas for six months. Against my will, to be with another woman, who dumped him as soon as he got there. Then he had to work his way back to this state…which took too long. At that point I had a break down. I new that calling the cops would put my son at even graver risk.. I had to co-operate, for his safety, to get back. That was all just a nightmare from hell.
I always said, that you can hurt me, but dont hurt my kids. this S used my kids to hurt me, and talk about feeling like you are being stabbed in the heart repeatedly.
Today, things are just level. somehow, his father has stopped abusing me, but his agression is still there. I never ever like how he even talks to my child. He can be talking to you one minute, and belittle you the next second, and you dont even know what you did.
Witsend,
Thank you. You put perspective on the situation. Everybody is supercharged right now. With each visit the younger three have with my ex, my older daughter (his step daughter, and raised him) goes into a tail spin too. She has a lot of anger, resentment toward him, as well as myself, for not noticing and protecting her; though she admits to hiding much of his manipulative, inimidation, and abusive behavior toward him from me, as I had three babies, was nursing, and he was very stealth in his tactics.
I’ve apologized to her so many times. I’ve identified with what she must have been experiencing. I’ve done all I know how to do to let her know what happened to her wasn’t her fault, and how much sorrow it brings me that she went through this. Even still…I’ve heard her say, “Mom feels so guilty about what happened to me, I can pretty much get away with anything.” WhAT??? And, when I try to set boundaries with her, she threatens me where it concerns the case with my younger three. That I don’t understand at all.
But, you are so right… I need to go easy ang gently with myself through the these next few weeks. I’ve sent an e-mail off to three of my closest friends, asking for help. They have been extremely supportive through the past four years, and have expressed concern with how my older daughter takes advantage of me – bullying me. I, as usual, minimize and make excuses, just like I did with my ex. I am going to need as much support as I can get to counter influence the younger three, if my older daughter is truely on a campaign to discredit and devalue me in order to win over their loyalty – so she can, in her mind, one up me, feel more important, and maybe even on a subconscious level get even with me for having the other three. Who knows.
Off to work….
Isabell:
Your older daughter is 25. She is an adult. She lives in your house.
My parents are a malignant N and an S. I got so tired of the nonstop drama and battles I finally (a) realized that the statute of limitations on parental war crimes had run and (b) drew some boundaries that they are not allowed to cross.
I think you need to make your daughter aware that the statute of limitations has run on whatever she perceives your particular parental war crimes to be. Your house, your rules. Time to draw some boundaries. If she doesn’t like them, move. Plain and simple. Move.