Since Lovefraud launched in 2005, I’ve collected 2,850 cases—people who have contacted me to tell me about their experiences with a sociopath. In nearly 100 of these cases—3.4%—the person who contacted me was not actually the victim, but was a friend or family member who was trying to pry the victim away from the sociopath. For example, here’s an email that Lovefraud recently received:
I have a sister-in-law who is dating a married man, who claims he will be getting a divorce, which is still yet to happen. Now she’s pregnant with his kid so things are more serious. They were supposed to move out together a couple months ago, but when the day came he disappeared, then a couple weeks later she found out she was pregnant by him then they were in contact again. Anyways, they went ahead and got an apartment again, which he’s not living in because he is still living with his wife, so it’s a come and go when he pleases”¦ He’s using her! This is not his first child out of wedlock, in fact, he has no contact with the other one and he has now cheated on his wife six times! All these red flags, and all she does is cover up for him. I’ve noticed she’s been depressed and been doing irresponsible things with her health as a result of this guy! Everyone also bluntly tells her that she’s basically his whore, so she knows how everyone feels. What do I do to open her eyes?
Lovefraud’s standard advice in this situation is that there isn’t much someone else can do—it’s up to the person who is involved with a sociopath to open her own eyes and see what is going on. In order to break away, the victim must feel, and own, the negative emotions associated with being controlled and/or abused. This will spark the victim’s desire to get out.
The best thing loved ones can do is stay in contact with the victim, because the sociopath will try to isolate him or her. Friends and loved ones should be emotionally supportive of the individual, but not supply material support, such as money or a place to live. The idea, essentially, is to wait it out, and then, when the relationship crashes and burns, be there to pick up the pieces.
Dr. Liane Leedom explained this approach in her article, “How can I get my _____ away from the psychopathic con artist?”
I’ve sent many, many people the link to that article. But every time I do, it is so dissatisfying. Isn’t there anything a loved one can do?
I understand that people become deeply bonded to sociopaths, especially when they are emotionally and physically intimate, and more especially when they are pregnant. I wrote a whole chapter in my new book, Red Flags of Love Fraud, that explains exactly how this happens. Chapter 6 is called “Sociopathic sex and bonding,” and it explains the psychology and biology of how this powerful psychological love bond is formed.
Here’s a chapter by chapter summary of the book.
Still, I don’t like the idea of just waiting around the victim hits bottom. Sometimes, by the time that happens, the victim is so broken that there is no recovery. And sometimes, when the victim hits bottom, she is dead.
So, I ask Lovefraud readers: Have you ever conducted a successful intervention? If you were the friend or family member of someone in the clutches of a sociopath, were you able to get him or her out? How? Or, if you were the person bonded to the sociopath, did anyone ever do or say anything that gave you the strength to leave?
If anything works, please let us know. I’d love to be able to offer more heartening suggestions.
Welcome Joss,
This is a healing place, and KNOWLEDGE IS POWER, so learn and keep on learning….but remember, he does not even have to be a “sociopath” for you to dump him, just a liar and a creep. It doesn’t matter if he is a full fledged sociopath or not, if he is TOXIC and not honest, he doesn’t deserve your time. You won’t be able to change him no matter what. Get rid of him ASAP is my advice.
NO CONTACT is the best way….no contact of any kind, no emails, voice mails, nothing. BLOCK all avenues of contact! YOu will feel better soon. Again, welcome and God bless.
Ox – thanks for your thoughts. We have heard through some cousins that they heard our niece is doing well, even in a new relationship. She has moved on and that is something we are grateful for. She deserves true happiness.
Joss – all I can say is go with your instincts. Move on, if he does not get involved with your friends another red flag. He lies – another red flag. There is no changing him.
I’m a concerned father of three, and I e-mailed Donna for some advice and she told me about this blog she started. I have read a lot of your comments and for the women who made it out of their abusive relationships, I admire you so much. My story is different, as I’m coming from the ex-husband viewpoint and how my ex-wife and her relationship with a sociopath has hurt so many people.
My ex married a man after knowing him for only a few months. He violently beat her bloody and almost strangled her to death on their honeymoon (Not an exaggeration. I have the police photos). He was arrested for felony 3rd degree battery by strangulation. She dropped the charges and he was sent to an out of state hospital for a short treatment. This would have been strike three for him and she thought prison was not the place for him. She prayed about it and knew she could fix him. She told our children she would never see him again, but they reconciled within a month of the beating.
I sued for full custody of my children, only to have them temporarily awarded until this man successfully completed the anger management and domestic violence classes and was cleared by a state counselor for the courts. She also conceded full custody of our oldest daughter to me because they didn’t see eye to eye about the situation.
He was diagnosed as bi-polar, and was told to stop drinking and take his meds. That didn’t last long. Approximately a year later, he abused her again in front of my other daughter and her friends, and she immediately divorced him. She told me he had actually been verbally abusing and grabbing her for several months leading up to this incident.
Shortly after the divorce she began seeing him in secret for about a year. She has just recently made it public that they are in a dating relationship. My attorney has advised me that if he comes in contact with my children that only then can I have a restraining order against him to protect my children. She says she has no intention of bringing him around the children, but I know this is only temporary.
She is back to being more negative towards me, obviously because of him and the fact that I have my attorney involved again. The first round of the custody battle cost both of us a lot of money, only to have the state counselor tell me he would testify against me because people can change and this man has.
Even though I had a previous girlfriend and another ex-wife of this man testify that he verbally and physically abused them multiple times and all with a common denominator of strangulation, and one incident involving the girlfriend’s young son. He has undergone counseling, quit drinking, and found religion many, many times.
Bi-polar or not, this man is much more than ups and downs. He has all the characteristics of a sociopath, but she can’t or won’t see it. She has lost all relationships of our mutual friends, our oldest daughter, her family is in disbelief, and she is standing by this man.
Our other two children still have to live with her every other week, and as I’ve said the day will come when she wants to have him around them again. She won’t listen to reason, and ignores family and friend’s advice, and even her own children’s wishes.
He is a violent predator, and he has her right where he wants her. Alienated and with low self-esteem, except she is so strong about standing by her man. Her family doesn’t know what this man has done to others, as they live out of state. Even though what he did to her was horrible and is incomprehensible.
How can there be a successful intervention? How do you get through to her? I want to be proactive instead of reactive, but I am the bad guy for trying to protect my children.
Concerned Father;
Welcome to LF! Lf is a place of support, ideas, help, hugs and just someone being here…….i’m sorry your in this position.
My suggestion to you would be to document everything…..keep your eyes wide open and continue with your attorney.
I don’t know how old your kids are, but empower them, let them know and reinforce to them that they have a voice. No one can touch them, hit them or the like.
Teach them about thier guts and to listen to their guts. If something doesn’t seem right, they don’t need exact examples to report anything to a trusted adult.
Make sure your kids always have a cell phone and KNOW how to get help…..make sure they know how to dial 911.
Enforce to them that they do not have to keep secrets and it’s okay to share their fears with a trusted adult.
DO NOT GO THE ALIENATION ROUTE……it WILL backfire on you. Kids are smart…..if they don’t already ‘get it’…..they will very soon. But if we shove it down their throat, they will be pushed into the ‘arms’ of the abuser.
“Think stockholm syndrom”. remember kids often protect their abusers…….Just empower them and don’t speak ill of this man…..empower them with what is right is right and wrong is wrong……with EVERYONE…..you, their teacher, preacher, mother, aunt……and him. ANYONE/EVERYONE!
Surround your kids with trusted adults……be involved in their school and all activities and make sure all these adults know about this mans history. Make sure that everyone has your contact info and let them know you are available for ANY concern they may have at any time….day or night.
Your attorney is right…..it’s frustrating….but until a crime is commited, there is nothing that you or the law can do. It’s scary and you can only pray that the law that he breaks is just an ‘opening’ and your kids are not harmed and you can proceed and the courts will see this potential threat as very real.
I feel your frustration and know your pain.
Generally, courts will not (and don’t have a way)
I found that walking the line with my spath ex husband in regards to our (kids and I) safety was the only option, sometimes you gotta “bend the rules and the truth’. I kept an eagle eye on the spath and the minute he stepped out of line……I hit him with the law.
You must fight a spath with spath like aproaches.
If you play by the rules…….the consequences may be great.
Don’t step too far off the rule line……and keep your character and morals in tact publically. If you lose credibility…….your doomed.
Keep in mind……loose lips sink ships. Careful who you trust.
Never throw any documentation away…..keep it all, be organized and build your case, surround yourself with folks who will support you and keep an eye out on your children and help you protect them. Be completely involved in all activities they do. Attend all school parent teacher conferences, games, cub scout stuff….whatever your kids are involved in. If you can coach and be the leader in all activities it will give you A. more time with your kids and B. a better opportunity to protect them and get to know their peers parents and build trust with them.
Keep in mind, with your ex…..it’s best not to burn bridges…..burned bridges cut off information. If you play the emotional support role of her…..she will come to you with her fears and stories. She is in the front lines. You don’t have to like her…..just play the game to keep the communications opoen. This may take some ‘work’ on your behalf……but it will serve you well in order to protect your kids.
Take a step back and take a moment to plan a strategy.
You will need one to go the length with this one!
Remember to breathe!
XXOO
EB
Concerned Father,
Welcome. Sorry you had to be here.
It might help for you to know some thing of how these people operate. They gauge you for your boundaries. Some women would never accept physical abuse, that is their boundary. Yet, they will take emotional abuse to the point where they are sick or they kill themselves. It’s because they were not taught emotional boundaries as children. For me, I was with a spath for 25 years and he knew never to hit me. Instead he used every emotional manipulation you can imagine – AND MORE. I had no emotional boundaries.
So you might wonder how I managed to escape? He had been going after my money for the entire time but he went very very slowly because he knew I had a BIG money boundary. When I finally told him that I had no more money, he went for the kill and tried to take the business and put it in his name. Not directly of course, there was a ridiculous con involved where I was supposed to believe that homeland security was after him and it was “safer if the business is in his name”. That’s the point where I was able to clearly see that he was crossing a line.
My point is that different people have different boundaries.
Your ex obviously doesn’t hold her physical safety or that of the kids above all else. You know her pretty well. What would you say is the one thing she would never allow? How was she raised? What was her childhood like? How did her parents treat her and what are THEIR values?
Answering these questions will give you some insight into how he is manipulating her and how you can shine a light on his manipulations. It’s only when he crosses the final boundary that she will wake up.
Welcome concerned father and I can sure understand why you are concerned!
Erin Brock has given you some good advice and she has “been down the road” so to speak with her X.
Many psychopaths are ALSO Bi-Polar and/or substance abusers so it looks like he got the triple whammy!
They do “trauma bond” victims to them with the alternating beatings and love bombing. And Yea, think Stockholm Syndrome. I suggest that you read “Trauma Bond” by Patrick Carnes it is one of the books that I think will help you understand why she stays. Why she goes back. She is ADDICTED to him the same way someone is addicted to crack.
Just as a meth head will sacrifice the welfare of their children for a fix, so will she.
The therapist is an IDIOT who lives by the GREAT LIE that “there is good in everyone and everyone can change.”
This man could very well kill your x wife….and I won’t say the rest. Yes, cell phones for your kids or those portable alarm buttons they sell for old folks if they are too young to have a phone. God bless and protect you and your children…and your x wife as frustrating as she is.
Concerned Father, you do not say how old your children are (and don’t need to, here) — but that can make a difference in how you play this.
The advice and words above are solid — I don’t have much to add, except that I have 3 children and shared custody with my abusive ex-husband and at times I have been concerned for their safety, and I’ve had the experience of the legal system and therapists not getting the situation.
You are in a difficult situation with very few possible moves, and the courts/therapists are not reliably on the side of your children.
So my suggestion is, if you think this will help or apply in your situation, try to strengthen the relationship with your ex-wife (or give a reasonable approximation of genuinely trying to do that, if it is not actually possible) — if you can be or appear to be in her corner, there is less chance of her cutting off communication with you, and if his behaviors should worsen, she might feel she has someone to turn to. I realize this might not work or might not apply.
If you pay her child support and can afford to do this, you might suggest helping her out by taking the children more to help alleviate her stress, but not reducing her child support payments. I don’t know if she would take you up on this or not.
And yes, empower your children with cellphones or the equivalent — absolutely! At least there are 2 of them; maybe they can look out for each other.
If your kids are old enough to speak up well for themselves, they can advocate to the court that they want to live with you for safety reasons. But EB is correct that you have to be careful that you are not “alienating” the children from their mother because that backfires. Safety first, though. How do your kids presently feel about being at their mother’s house? Do they seem stressed/afraid/avoidant, or do they seem to be handling it normally? How do they act upon returning to your house from hers?
Is it possible/helpful to be in touch with her family to inform them of the grave danger their daughter and the kids are in, or would that make things worse? I don’t know.
These suggestions may be off base; I am drawing on my own experience and it may not apply to your situation.
I feel for you and the kids…
Thank you all so much for the advice and support. You all are amazing to have endured each of your situations. I never thought in a million years I’d have to deal with this much drama, from having an uncontested fairly easy divorce to total chaos, because of a spath. But I’m beginning to understand more where my ex is at, mentally. I realize I am the obvious target to project negative attitudes towards because I am the one threatening to get custody of our teenage kids.
Our oldest is in college and is quite frankly done with her mother, with all the drama, lies and conceding custody to me years ago. My 13 and 17 year old have already formed their own opinion about this man, which will be harder for my ex to try and sway them towards spending time with him again.
They don’t want a thing to do with him, but my youngest is suffering the most. He is failing 7th grade and is a somewhat of a quiet boy and has become more withdrawn lately. He’s angry and scared, and I’m really worried more about his well-being. I made a promise to him that he will never have to be around this man, and although the courts won’t allow me to be proactive, once he comes around, I’ll have a restraining order in a few weeks. My daughters are tough and have told their mother what they think about the situation, and that it’s her life if she wants to throw it away on this loser then whatever.
I will follow your advice to try and educate my children more on spaths, and try and alienate them from their mother. I never talk bad about their mother to them. I just say she’s making some really bad choices and that this man is dangerous. They don’t realize how many spaths are out there, and how many women like their mother are affected. It’s hard to comprehend how a very strong willed person can be torn down to her lowest mental state, leaving her embarrassed, depressed, alone, ashamed, but yet they still love the person. It just amazes me, but we will get through this. My kids know I’m a good dad and have always taken the high road, only to come out on the bottom.
I also like the idea of trying to get her to confide in me, even though she won’t believe me or want me to, because she has his influence right now. But in the end, I’m the one that will be there to pick up the pieces. I’ve already done it twice before, and I’m the first one she calls. It’s the right thing to do, no matter how much damage she has caused to our parenting relationship, my financial situation, and the mental damage to our children. I will tell her when the time comes; I’ll be there for her. I’ll also try and educate her family, as to what this spath is and what he has done in the past to other women and children, although that could backfire on me. Maybe the third time will be the charm. I pray she will come to her senses, but he has quite the control over her.
Thanks again for caring. My anxiety and stress is to the max and I have had many sleepless nights. Stay tuned, the 2nd round has just started”
I’m trying to think Concerned father, what would be a good book for your kids to read about psychopaths. For your older kids “The Disease to please, curing the people pleasing syndrome by Harriet B Braiker, PhD, and ” Men whjo hate women and women who love them” by Dr. Susan Forward.
I can’t think of a book for your younger son. I would get him into therapy ASAP though. He has a lot t o cope with at that age. Maybe change schools or put him into some sort of different environment maybe, whatever you are able to do.
It sounds like you have some heavy problems but at the same time, I also hear strength in your posts. You will make it. Keep on educating yourself about her and where she is coming from, and also about him. God bless.
I don’t care what your politics are please contact your representatives and express your views on this important bill coming up.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/15/us/politics/violence-against-women-act-divides-senate.html?_r=1