I love my wikipedia. I learn a lot I didn’t know and I refine my thinking by finding fault too. (The problem is knowing what is worth learning and what needs unlearning!)
Consider the wikipedia definition of evil:
Evil is generally defined as any activity which takes advantage of another person for one’s own benefit….(In contrast, good is helping others, even sometimes self-sacrificially; see saint, sainthood.)
There’s something dodgy about the form of this definition and also something very familiar about its implications. For one thing, it fits with the the lable ‘anti-social’ which refers to behaviour which has ill effects, but good intentions – “well, in his culture that behaviour is normal”. Whatever happened to ill intent, though? (For another thing, what’s the counterpart to sainthood?)
According to this view all employers are evil because they necessarily pay their employees less than they earn (‘necessarily’ because otherwise there would be no profit).
The definition attempts to define evil by contrasting it with good. So far so, um, good. But then it weighs them up wrongly, and we are left with a picture of evil that is indistinguishable from graspingness and greed. According to this view evil might have ill effects on the other, but that is not the intention; its primary intention is to gain advantage.
This is a fine example of how thinking about evil can go askew. (And, I suspect, thinking about good too.)
By re-balancing the wording of the above definition another meaning of evil becomes clear.
If good is helping another (possibly involving self-sacrifice) then it follows that evil is harming another (possibly involving self-benefit).
This is all the difference in the world. Now we can see the true intention of evil – it is to do harm. Evil is only secondarily about want, appetite, greed, jealousy; it’s true nature is malevolence, envy, cruelty, viciousness. Indeed, for evil the getting of things is happily foregone if what is primary can be achieved: power over another.
What say you?
holywatersalt
Sarah,
The Blessed Virgin Mary was one, perhaps some Saints- but I’d say the vast majority of people, even the canonized, at some point in time have had evil thoughts- those include: sloth, lust, revenge, greed, envy etc.
Evil is multifaceted.
Sarah999
James.
You wrote . .
– Well we all have “evil” thoughts and feeling from time to time.-
I do not agree with that. I think there are some people who never, ever have evil thoughts and feelings.
Sarah999
Based on my “simplified” definition of evil below, I think there are more people that don’t ever have evil thoughts or feelings.
EVIL IMHO is trying to get another person, (through lies/deceit, rage outbursts, manipulation, force, etc) to DO or BELIEVE something, that may be harmful to themselves, that they otherwise would not do (had they not been lied to, raged at, manipualted or forced).
James
Free
“It was horrendous when I wrote a list too, but writing it down is important and it gave me more knowledge and truth about myself and it is validating. When we write it, we start dealing with it.”
Yes I agree and had to start a personal journal just to deal with all the issues going on (and this was only after she left, if I wrote down all the BS, it would fill a couple of books)
Strange, but please let me ask all you members a question. You see I always had a love for poetry and even wrote one poem that took me a couple of months. But something strange happen after she (ex-P) left me. I soon started writing poetry but this time it just came pouring out of me. I can’t tell you just how many I wrote.. In fact if you don’t mind, I would love to share one with you all…
Narcissist for a Day
By James X. XXXXXXX (not sure if we are allow to give our real names here?)
I woke one day, in a terrible way
Short with my children and not caring for their needs in anyway
Not talking with my wife, oh what a pig she is
She is always that way
Not seeing how special I am in everyway
Getting ready for work, thinking how they don’t see me, oh the
wonderful me! Why, should I care about them in any oh way!
Going to work, I saw people who are fools
Just like tools that I can use and use
Not seeing how special and great I am and will always be
These objects are just for my fun and wants for whatever I need.
At work, I talked with Andy, oh what a fool he can be
taken my position that was promise to me
Why can’t Andy see, that it was meant for me
I’m so special, not like Andy can ever be
I came home oh, what a horrible day for me
Why can’t they see the wonderful me
I cussed at my children, so selfish they can be
My wife I told her I don’t need you and don’t
want you with me
You are just a pig, not special like me
The room got dark and numbest surrounded me
No feeling of love or caring for me
No one would talk or look at me
Oh, dear God what is happening to me
Awoke in a sweat wanting someone to hold me
Oh, what a horrible dream that happen to me
A Nightmare no, no not a dream
A Nightmare it had to be
How horrible it must be
To be a narcissist being in everyway and everyday
Oh no that’s not for me in any oh way
No, I love my children who are so
Special to me in their own special way
My wife so sweet and so kind to my children and me
Loving and special to us in all and each one in their own way
Oh no dear Lord, that’s not for me in any oh way
A narcissist I can never be not even for a day
This one is my favorite…
James
“Strange, but please let me ask all you members a question.
Oh the question is.. Did anything like this happen to another member, like getting a “life” change experience? Like I said, I love poetry and always wanted to write it, but this was so strange how it came pouring out of me.. It’s like my love for poetry blossomed! With a passion so deep to my soul and heart!
I now have a passion for writing poetry I never had before?
Ox Drover
James,
“life changing event” or whatever you want to call it—yes! YES! I started to see God, the Bible, spirituality, and love, forgiveness, etc. in a NEW WAY. I’d looked right at it, but I let the FOG obscure my spirituality, my self love, my confidence in myself. Once the dealing with the Ps and the P’s-by-proxy (enablers) was OUT OF MY LIFE, I started to bloom like a flower inside. I started to be HAPPY, not always questioning myself. Still, I want to know, I want to grow, I want to learn ALL ABOUT ME—I never knew me before, only the shadow of me projected by the evil light of the Ps on the wall.
I write poetry, but usually only when I am down or depressed, but now my soul sings. Sure–I’m not perfect, I harbor too much wrath (Anger+) sometimes, at injustices I can’t fix and it isn’t my responsibility to fix them, I ALLOW the frustration of not being able to fix them make me anGRY. I can stop ALLOWING that, and I intend to work on that aspect of myself. WOW! How empowering to know that I can have a “fault” and correct it—don’t have to fix it for someone else’s pleasure, but MINE. Don’t have to dance to someone else’s music, I can MAKE MY OWN MUSIC. FAST OR sloooow, as I WISH. Why should I worry about my music vs your music? Your music doesn’t hurt me and my music is not yours to dictate–we can each have our own music and yet we can both dance…we don’t have to dance the same tune, or the same steps in order to dance.
I can see God my way, and you can see God your way, and we can still dance. Your life is yours, mine is mine. We can dance together or we can dance separately. We can move closer or move away and we can still dance.
We can view the same sunset and I say it’s red, you say it’s purple, but we can both enjoy the sunset.
I can embrace you witout allowing you to own me, I can love you without smothering you. I can let you be you, and you let me be me. We can be inter-dependent without being dependent. I can be me, even if you don’t cherish me. My world won’t end, because I am my own world. You are your own world, your world won’t end if I don’t cherish you. I can be complete in myself. You can be complete in yourself.
I don’t know if any of that philosophy means anything to anyone except me, but at 61 years old I have been BORN into acceptence, acceptence of myself…imperfect, but worthy–able to change, but not for anyone else, just for myself.
I’ve lived my life too much for others, and not enough for myself…I’ve “sacrificed” without realizing what I was doing consciously for others, others who didn’t appreciate my worth, my sacrifices for them, who couldn’t give back, who wouldn’t give back, until I was EMPTY, without anything for them or for myself. Now I am FILLING UP, with plenty for me, and accumulating a surplus to share with others….but not starving myself either. If you are EMPTY, you cannot give, you cannot survive. We live by having enough, and sharing, but not giving to others, neglecting ourselves, and starving ourselves so we have nothing to give.
James
“Your poetry is beautiful. Be careful though where you put it, especially on the net, it would be awful for someone to plagiarise it” you hear of it a lot and my writing teacher told our class this, just last term.”
Yes you are right and I have been worry about that myself. Still I can write more LOL!
My poetry isn’t so much on this subject anymore i.e. P’s and sociopaths , it more on love, understanding and compassion.. Love to share more but you are right, we need to be careful with our writing..
OxDrover
Man, did you say a mouth full about God, the bible and my own spirituality. My father (in heaven) has always had his hand on me. But after.. What a force and strength he has been for me! What would I do without him???
James
Ox Drover
“I’ve lived my life too much for others, and not enough for myself”I’ve “sacrificed” without realizing what I was doing consciously for others, others who didn’t appreciate my worth, my sacrifices for them, who couldn’t give back, who wouldn’t give back, until I was EMPTY, without anything for them or for myself. Now I am FILLING UP, with plenty for me, and accumulating a surplus to share with others”.but not starving myself either. If you are EMPTY, you cannot give, you cannot survive. We live by having enough, and sharing, but not giving to others, neglecting ourselves, and starving ourselves so we have nothing to give.”
Good for you! It’s all right to love yourself! Give to yourself! And know it’s alright! I am learning to do this for myself as well! Good for YOU!
James
Free
Great News about your book. And yes! I will buy it as well..
TrishNJ
Jane and Free,
Thank you again….I posted those pains, not for sympathy….I know what I experienced was serious suffering….but there are people out there who are suffering similarly or even worse….and I believe in being open about my suffering for others who suffer….and that list is not even 1/2 of it!
I’m healing every day….and I have learned that if you ignore the abuse and pain….it seems to knock on your door more often….it is true that when you deal with a situation immediately…it goes away! This is one of the secrets in life….but you have to build the strenght to deal with it right away….did you ever notice the obsessive sales man/woman who knocks on your door every day….then he/she finds their way to your back door and than even in your window….and your hiding away on the inside…He/she can’t wait to get to you because they know you are weak and you are a sale to them and they will wear you down….so the best thing to do is to say “NO” firmly. Have answers ready for them….Like I never buy from door to door….never! and they will come back at you and you say….never….never…good-bye….and if you are one of those who think that is rude….think about how rude they are being…..
I guess what I am getting at for us is to learn to build strength…..learn where your weaknesses are and change your thoughts about them….most of us have weaknesses that were passed on to us from our families….
For myself….noone in my family had ever been divorced….let alone having a child out of wedlock! I wasn’t married to my X-father of my daughter….I planned on marrying him after the baby was born…but that didn’t work out because of all the abuse….but I stayed thru many months of severe abuse….because of my belief in “Family”….work it all out….and take it….
I don’t know how many of you had parents that hit you when you were young…that was normal to me…Now I leave! But in hind site that was when the damage was done!
And I certainly understand being stuck….no money…. no job….no self esteem.
To anyone out there who is stuck…empower yourself…..don’t tell your abuser what you are up to…but plan your escape…especially if you are in fear of your life….go to out counseling with a battered womans shelter like I did…..You can get out safe and alive! You have to choose to leave for good! You have to gain your own strength……you can do it! You will finally be living when you do…
In the begining you won’t feel like yourself because yourself is weak…. your true self has not been found yet….but in time you will find it. Just believe in the coming transformation! There is no life in the clutches of an abuser! Remember that!