Donna Andersen has been a great friend to me and has done so much for victims of sociopaths. She deserves an award. The latest thing she did for me personally was to lend me her copy of The Psychopathic Mind by J. Reid Meloy. When I initially thought about reading the book it was more expensive than it is now; the price has come down quite a bit. That is good because I am going to have to buy Donna a new copy since I’ve marked up the entire book with notes about material to discuss here. My overall reaction to the book was negative to lukewarm until I got to page 318 (that I’ll discuss next week). After that page, I came to believe that on the whole this book is a great contribution to the field.
This week I want to use a quote from a judge to begin to discuss some of the myths regarding sociopaths. Here is the quote found on page 359:
“Well I tell you, the world is full of productive sociopaths. Some of them hold high public office. Some of them are lawyers. It could be that a couple of them are judges, and sociopathy by itself is not necessarily a dangerous condition. It can be productive. I think it was Clarence Darrow who commented on that”¦”
Let’s cover these numerous false assertions out of order.
- Sociopathy by itself is not necessarily a dangerous condition. This statement is completely, absolutely, categorically FALSE. Sociopathy/ASPD/psychopathy is always a dangerous condition. It is the most toxic personality poison and only a drop in a swimming pool of water will sicken an entire city. By definition sociopathy involves serious harm to other people and a track record of serious irresponsibility. If these characteristics are not present, the individual is not a sociopath!
- It can be productive. Sociopathy is never productive. Unless you measure productivity by ruined lives and the number of dead bodies left along the road. But where would the judge and possibly Clarence Darrow get the idea that sociopathy is productive? These people are confusing sociopathy (a disorder) with the power motive or dominance drive. It is this motive that is both productive in terms of leadership and harmful in terms of aggression. This motive is present in all humans to a certain degree. The aberrant unmitigated expression of the power motive that is seen in sociopathy is neither normal nor productive. Sociopaths may be productive in spite of disorder not because of disorder. See the next point.
- Some of them hold high public office. Some of them are lawyers. It could be that a couple of them are judges, Connecting this statement with describing sociopathy as a benign, productive condition is where the judge goes wrong. When sociopaths manage in spite of disorder to attain the power they crave, the results are disastrous for society.
- The world is full of productive sociopaths. This statement is partly true but this truth is not a reflection of points 1 and 2 above. As a group sociopaths are hands down losers. They die at early ages, get many more serious illnesses, and abuse substances. They usually end up losing everything and occupationally disabled. There is an appearance that the number of productive sociopaths reflects the disorder, simply because of the sheer number of sociopaths in the country. At any one point in time a given sociopath may be “successful” but that is only a snap shot. There may be a few who die before they fall but these are the extreme minority. Since there are so many sociopaths even this extreme minority may seem like a lot. If you consider the life histories of sociopaths two truths emerge. Sociopaths waste energy hurting people that could have gone into building rather than destroying. Also, the only reason they survive is that others help them. They may have power but they are by no means autonomous. This is the great irony of the disorder, antisocial individuals require a society to survive and operate!
- I am still trying to verify the origin of these false beliefs on the part of the legal profession stems from famous lawyer Clarence Darrow. If anyone can produce a quote, I would be grateful.
If you think about it, this judge is exemplifying a reasoning error due to lack of training applying research to practice. It is very difficult to apply group data to an individual because any one individual at any one point in time may not display all the characteristics of the group.
The message is clear. Judges and lawyers should stop rationalizing the leniency they extend to sociopaths. They should realize them for the dangerous, parasitic individuals they are. They should stop enabling them by forcing us to be with them. That “us” includes former spouses, children and society at large.
Clarence Darrow said that? Really? I wonder how much he knew about the condition, since he died in 1938 and couldn’t have had the advantage of more modern findings.
Dr. Leedom, I think i would amend point #1: changing ‘track record of serious irresponsibility’, to ‘track record of reckless irresponsibility.’
best,
one step
The notion that anyone in a position to make decisions about these disordered and the people they affect is not educated succinctly in what the disorder is, how dangerous it is and how devastating to the families and society is simply disgusting.
Every Law School in the country should have a requirement for a psyche course that teaches what is in FACT true about it.
Period. I vote that we boycott paying for any attorney or voting for any judge who doesn’t get it. And we work more at getting the word out.
This is beyond stupid. Beyond. Productive Sociopaths, My Butt!
Personally, I think the judge that said all that is a sociopath himself, that is how they would interpret a diagnosis of ASPD if it were applied to themselves.
I’m with you, Oxy. That IS exactly what I was thinking when I read what the judge said about “productive sociopaths, especially when he singled out the law proffesion, as an example. “A few judges” really raised red flags for me….
I would also agree with Silvermoon, but perhaps go one step furthar, and recommend a psych eval, before we elect judges…I suppose that goes against their civil libertys, however. Sigh.
Substitute the word “sociopathy” with a word such as diabetes, Multiple Sclerosis, Lupus, or any other “physical” condition, the judge would not be out of line, or misinformed.
While any sociopath may have attained a position of authority, wealth and/or notoriety, it is not in spite of his condition, it is in the way that he manipulated it.
Good point, Shana!
You know though ANY information that is not true, upon which is based critical decisions, is DANGEROUS.
“These bald tires will be okay for a few more miles of driving” BAM! A blow out going down the road that takes 5+ lives!
“I’m not too drunk to drive”—BAM! another wreck causing loss of life!
Anytime you have BAD and ERRONEOUS information on which decisions are made that have the potential to wreck lives, IT WILL WRECK LIVES.
I watched a short video article the other day about “expert” error. How people who are NOT really very good at their jobs think that they ARE EXPERTS. How being an expert in ONE field makes you think you are an expert in SEVERAL FIELDS.
I used to butt heads with my super intelligent husband who WAS an GENUINE EXPERT in several fields –but NOT IN EVERY FIELD! And just as the article predicted, he THOUGHT he was an expert in EVERY field even when he didn’t know jack diddly about it. LOL
Great Guy! Wonderful man! Super husband! But a total jerk wadd about building barbed wire fences. Didn’t know how, thought he did, and wouldn’t listen to anyone else because he was convinced it was a simple task that he could figure out. Unfortunately, like most engineers, he tried to IMPROVE ON IT, and the fences he built 8-10 years ago are falling to pieces and they should have lasted 25-30 years before they even needed repairs. Every time I drive by a fence that needs replacement, I want to scream at his ashes “See I told you so!” LOL
From my observation, many attorneys, judges, physicians, and engineers—professions that call for intelligence and education—tend to be pretty narcissistic and have the ERRONEOUS thinking direction that they know more about EVERYTHING than they do.
Fortunately, even though on some things he would NOT take direction, my husband wasn’t abusive with it, and if there was something SERIOUS I would stand toe-to-toe and fight him over the erroneous thinking–but it did make for some interesting dinner conversations over fence building and the merits of a side by side refrigerator vs an across top freezer! LOL To say NOTHING of politics and religion!
“You know though ANY information that is not true, upon which is based critical decisions, is DANGEROUS.”
Amen! And unfortunately, I’ve had a few of my own bargaining moments such as the ones you mentioned, though not with those sad, disastrous results.
Your husband sounds like he was fun and interesting to be around.
BTW, I hate my side by side, and tend to think the freezer on bottom is the most economical. 🙂 I just wish the fact that heat rises pertained to the weather (geographically) as well. La ain’t cool these days!
Yea, Shana, my husband and I “fought” over that one for a month! He wanted the side by side with ice and water in the door, and I knew there WAS no freezer space in one of them, plus, what little ther was was shaped so wrong it was useless.
I finally gave in and he got one, one day a few weeks later, he came home from the market with a frozen pizza and tried to put it in the freezer, and of COURSE IT DIDN’T FIT! I stood there watching him try to figure out how to get it in and finally I couldn’t take it any more and I said “See, you SOB the side by sides are WORTHLESS!” I will never forget the LOOK ON HIS FACE as he ROLLED HIS EYES AT ME. Then we both laughed!
Yea, on a more serious note, any information we use as FACT and base our decisions on should be TRUE. I have based my decisions on a LOT OF FALSE ‘TRUTHS” OR “FACTS” that were NOT good things to base the rest of your life on.
“Always be loyal to family”
“Blood is thicker than water”
“there is good in everyone down deep”
“it takes two to fight”
“there are two (valid) sides to every story”
“the reason he is like that is he had a bad childhood”
And I am sure we could each add 10 or 12 more UNtruths to that list.
From now on I think I will try to base my life on TRUTHS rather than just “wing” it on things I at first glance think are “truths” without examining them first.
As soon as you mentioned frozen pizza, I busted out laughing. That’s why years after sacrificing other foods for the sake of a diagonally placed coveted pizza, I finally bought a chest freezer.
And oh, the wisdom that comes as a reward for having lived, is priceless.