Although it has been many years and there is a new relationship, a friend of mine still wishes every day that the sociopath that preyed on her will “drop dead.” Wishing and hoping that some horrible end will come for the sociopath takes up time and energy in my friend’s life; as she searches for evidence that something bad has indeed happened to the sociopath and then is disappointed.
Recently, I discussed the topic of forgiving psychopaths with a psychopathy researcher who is not a clinician. He said he received a letter from someone complaining that friends were pressuring the victim to forgive. It was the psychopathy researcher’s opinion that people should NOT be told they have to forgive a psychopath.
Upon reflecting on this opinion, I believe that this psychopathy researcher may have a special insight that informs his view —that psychopaths should not necessarily be forgiven. Perhaps this insight is: in spite of their brain disorder, psychopaths still have a choice about what they do.
My son is now 7, he and I rough and tumble play every day. It is impossible to wrestle and not have some kind of slight hurt come to one or the both of us. From the time he was very young, perhaps as young as 3, my son has appreciated the idea that mommy didn’t “do it on purpose”. If he pokes me in the eye or lands rough on my stomach he’ll say “Sorry, I didn’t do it on purpose.”
This example illustrates our inborn social contract that says we do not hurt each other on purpose. If hurts happen in the course of life, they are usually unintended side effects of other behaviors and so should be forgiven. Cheating on a spouse could even be forgiven as an unintentional hurt if the person succumbed to temptation in a moment of weakness, realized the wrong committed, then repented. Even murder is not punished as much if it is an accident.
The problem with sociopaths is that their behavior is no accident. They hurt people on purpose, carefully planning, then executing their plans. After 7 years of reading research articles and talking to victims, I believe choice is part of a complete explanation of sociopathy and victimization. If you watch any of the TV shows about sociopaths you too will see that the theme of their choices permeates the media.
Friday night, Gangland on the History Channel told the story of Billy Wadd, a member of the Devil’s Disciples motorcycle gang who gained notoriety when he broke the biker’s code of silence and testified against his nephew who murdered a family during a home invasion. Wadd said he decided to aid the prosecution of his nephew, John Wolfenbarger, instead of “taking care of things the usual way” because “You just don’t kill kids.” It is clear he believed these murders were performed with an intention that not even another sociopath could accept, so even sociopaths believe in their own capacities for choice.
Now let’s reconsider whether victims should be told they have to forgive. It seems there is a natural human instinct that says forgiveness is reserved for accidents, unintended consequences, and perhaps intentional slights that are out of character. How then can you ever forgive a psychopath?
Psychopaths have been compared to predators. I think this analogy is seriously flawed. A predator such as a lion or wolf has to kill in order to survive. Psychopaths don’t hurt for survival. They hurt because they want to, because they like hurting. Their enjoyment of hurting increases the likelihood they will choose to hurt if given the opportunity. They also seek out opportunities to hurt -not for survival but for pleasure.
Since sociopaths, with intention, repeatedly violate our inborn social contract, perhaps they should never be forgiven.
Instead of forgiving, I hope, my friend, you will think about all this and thoroughly digest the reality of the sociopath you shared life with. The reality is terrible— you shared life with a truly evil person, someone who regularly, with malice and forethought, chooses to harm others. Don’t stop hoping to see the day the scourge of this evil person’s existence will be wiped from the Earth, but do not waste any more of your time on him.
silvermoon
Flower Power,
Who ever this woman is, she’s on drugs!
Call Steve Becker and get a conference call between her supervisor you and Steve or Dr Leedom. Or both of them.
She won’t believe you so get some nationally recognized experts on your team to support you and get her off your case!
Get guns loaded and go in with the intention to get REAL.
Cite the case in CA where the judge didn’t get it and the kid ended up dead and others like that.
I don’t care what kind of happy family myth she wants to perpetrate faking it for the kids isn’t cool and putting you and possibly them in harms way if just plan STUPID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
silvermoon
EB_
HERE!!!! BIG WHISTLE WITH FINGERS!
one/joy_step_at_a_time
flower – you said – ‘The ex is not allowed to even get out of his car at child exchanges due to angry outbursts and profanity at me in front of the children’ do you have a protection order in place?
she can’t ‘order’ you to contravene this.
silver’s advice is great. don’t worry, i think there is a way around this stupidness – take control. keep calm. work it out. hold tight to your boundaries!
flowerpower
Thanks Onestep and silver
no protection order. tried to get one when divorce filed but judge wouldnt sign it..ex is a well known MD. we settled bc I could not afford to take him all the way . I signed a prenup that gave him all property except what I brought to marriage , I have custody of kids and living in a house he bought and owns (otherwise me and kids were on street). He’s a multimillionaire with 5 homes including my residence….
His outburst came when I objected to him coming in my house and sent email stating he should wait in car from then on. He arrived to pick up kids , even had a copy of the email , got out and surprised me at back door,,screaming “this is my f-ing house and I will do what i want”….so PC enforced my rule.
Except now he wants to continue his same “good ol boy” routine in public and be a monster to me in private. I have had it. Set the no contact rule and will not budge. He is calling me bitter, rigid, uncooperative, difficult in emails bc he cant dictate. Still owes me furniture (divorce final one year) and refuses to send movers, instead uses kids as movers and brings it himself.
jeannie812
I kinda got stuck dealing with a sociopath. The father of my oldest three kids.
He tells the kids that his plans are IMPORTANT. I finally figured out if I want to be in my kids plan, it will have to include my ex.
I actually have fun. My ex is the life of the party. Even though our marriage was a nightmare.
I used to wish that my ex would die in a fiery car crash. I quickly took back that wish. It occurred to me that he would walk out without a scratch while an entire family might die. Also, my kids would have to deal with the grief of their dead father.
And they would put their dad on a pedestal if he died. That stopped me from wishing the bad thoughts.
My ex is still not done with me. He will blurt out accusations. He will blurt out “he never pushed me, I pushed him”. On another day he blurted “you didn’t have to pay for driving lessons, I already taught you how to drive”.
peggywhoever
I agree that it is a semantic issue here as to the definition of “forgiveness”. Here are the googled responses:
•compassionate feelings that support a willingness to forgive
•the act of excusing a mistake or offense
•Forgiveness is typically defined as the process of concluding resentment, indignation or anger as a result of a perceived offense, difference or mistake, and/or ceasing to demand punishment or restitution.[1] The Oxford English Dictionary defines forgiveness as ‘to grant free pardon and to give up all claim on account of an offense or debt’.
I have “forgiven” the sociopath in my own heart because by doing so, this process has helped to heal and forgive my own (naivete, blind trust, or foolishness). Furthermore, I believe that in not forgiving, it is like an open, festering wound within us, rather like a cancer in our soul.
I understand sociopaths. I had the “aha” moment and I “get it”. I obsessed, ruminated, studied, blogged, wrote articles, talked to people, and figured it out. Sociopaths are predictable and all do (slight) variations of the same sicko stuff.
However, forgiving and condoning are different. In NO WAY do I ever condone their behaviors. And although sociopaths do make choices, they make choices with a miswired and malfunctioning brain; and those of us who understand sociopaths can predict their behaviors.
So overall, although I am disgusted, appalled and horrified by what sociopaths do, I also am sad for them in a small way. They will never feel the love, joy, friendship and heartfelt sentiments we do. By either nature or nurture, they are prewired, by circumstances outside of their control, for evildoings. So is it really a choice for them? I can entirely relate to the story, “The Scorpian and the Frog”. Sociopaths are scorpians, and I do not believe they can be otherwise (hence they cannot be cured).
http://allaboutfrogs.org/stories/scorpion.html
Forgiveness (understanding and concluding anger and resentment) of HIM has helped to heal ME.
Blessings and Peace,
Peggywhoever
gypsydi
Hi..first time to make contact….scared…I want to end this facade.
You have no idea of how life-saving this site is….I must participate and stop being removed in some way.
Kathleen Hawks posts earlier here just made me weep…..the true love epressed there made me homesick for the love I used to be……I don’t know what happened..but I am waking up and I am astounded that I lived what I did for almost 7 years.
It is like someone else stepped into me and life became surreal….I gave up all good sense….lived in incredible anxiety,yet turned my life over to this exciting, handsome, troubled young guy and watched a movie where I became separated from everyone….mostly myself.
I am in another country in Central America..of course, it all had to be an exciting “life”….the two of us..”superior god & goddess…..flamboyant, free, “evolved”…..whatever…..the dream come true…NIGHTMARE\
Denial is big…back and forth….how could this guy now appear to me as a totally different person……he is so disgusting, repulsive, and fake……help….I think I blended my mind with his ??????? sOMETHING TOTALLY F**.KED.
I will write more,,,this is important to me..I need your knowing, I need to be cared about, I need to communicate with a real person…..
How could this have happened????? This guy is good at what he does…..classic…..i feel I have to play a game with him here until I can find a way to leave….we are trying to sell house so I can have money, but I feel he is just lying and will not sign any papers..just placating me…and watching to see if I will get angry and start screaming….
Gotta go…the reality of it all is frightening…i am hanging in…staying strong……what a fucked up game now that he knows I totally get his number….he does not disagree….smooth, yet stupid to me now….I see thru all of it.I have become like him
I MISS ME….I need friends who like me.
I feel stuck…like a pawn…part of me enjoying it, because I want to win and outsmart him…yet deeper down…..my gut says run….lose all money…just go….but I have nothing but what is here in Belize……
For now….I will close I want to be a part of this healing circle of women who are like me.
Ox Drover
Dear Gypsydi,
Thank you for postinhjg! this is one of if nto THE best “quilding circles” for the purpose of healing after being traumatized by the toxic ones, the sociopaths/psychopath/narcissistic and EVIL ones. Learning about them (knowledge=Power) from reading the articles here in the archives, and learning about US also from reading the articlres in the archives, and blogging here with the rest of us. Some smart men and women here, all of them :get it” about what you have been through, Welcome, and God bless.
bluejay
Dear Gypsydi,
You are not just like him, know that. You will get out in time, to a better existence. It took me too many years (14 years) to realize that I was married to a sociopath (we’re separated), thinking that he was “normal” for a long time, but becoming more and more aware of things that he did that were nuts. Finally, after he left me, I came to the realization (on my own) that he was a sociopath. This web site has been extremely helpful to me, helping me cope with life. Sociopaths are deceptively normal, the mask eventually coming off, seeing them for how they really are. It isn’t pretty and it isn’t fun. Take care of yourself, letting yourself calm down, get to a peaceful place. I feel for you, sensing the turmoil. God bless you, keeping you in His care!
angelforyou
Thank you for the article.
I am very angry with him for what he led me to believe and want and then destroyed the dream fantasy with his calculated destruction of me.
I am angry with myself for allowing this creature into my life, ignoring red flags, not listening to my intuition gut etc.
I am angry at myself for not protecting my assets, spiritual and material. For not having boundries.
I am angry at him for the path of destruction he made before he zeroed in on me.
I am angry that he has been allowed to get away with everything he has.
I am angry at his sense of entitlement as he stealthily in plain sight leads a life of deceit and discard.
I am angry that I cannot forgive him. I can’t forget nor excuse.
I will work on prevention in the future, offense.
I will work on forgiving myself.
————-
Gypsydi,
I am so thankful for you for having found this sight! It is like a guiding light. So full of insight.
These thieves steal your life truths and make you feel lost and confused in their life of deceptions and control. They turn you upside down. Spin you.
You will get loads of information, validation, comfort, advice from others who have been there, strength, and hope. It is a place to come and cacoon and learn and release and research and heal.
Prayers for you.