Although it has been many years and there is a new relationship, a friend of mine still wishes every day that the sociopath that preyed on her will “drop dead.” Wishing and hoping that some horrible end will come for the sociopath takes up time and energy in my friend’s life; as she searches for evidence that something bad has indeed happened to the sociopath and then is disappointed.
Recently, I discussed the topic of forgiving psychopaths with a psychopathy researcher who is not a clinician. He said he received a letter from someone complaining that friends were pressuring the victim to forgive. It was the psychopathy researcher’s opinion that people should NOT be told they have to forgive a psychopath.
Upon reflecting on this opinion, I believe that this psychopathy researcher may have a special insight that informs his view —that psychopaths should not necessarily be forgiven. Perhaps this insight is: in spite of their brain disorder, psychopaths still have a choice about what they do.
My son is now 7, he and I rough and tumble play every day. It is impossible to wrestle and not have some kind of slight hurt come to one or the both of us. From the time he was very young, perhaps as young as 3, my son has appreciated the idea that mommy didn’t “do it on purpose”. If he pokes me in the eye or lands rough on my stomach he’ll say “Sorry, I didn’t do it on purpose.”
This example illustrates our inborn social contract that says we do not hurt each other on purpose. If hurts happen in the course of life, they are usually unintended side effects of other behaviors and so should be forgiven. Cheating on a spouse could even be forgiven as an unintentional hurt if the person succumbed to temptation in a moment of weakness, realized the wrong committed, then repented. Even murder is not punished as much if it is an accident.
The problem with sociopaths is that their behavior is no accident. They hurt people on purpose, carefully planning, then executing their plans. After 7 years of reading research articles and talking to victims, I believe choice is part of a complete explanation of sociopathy and victimization. If you watch any of the TV shows about sociopaths you too will see that the theme of their choices permeates the media.
Friday night, Gangland on the History Channel told the story of Billy Wadd, a member of the Devil’s Disciples motorcycle gang who gained notoriety when he broke the biker’s code of silence and testified against his nephew who murdered a family during a home invasion. Wadd said he decided to aid the prosecution of his nephew, John Wolfenbarger, instead of “taking care of things the usual way” because “You just don’t kill kids.” It is clear he believed these murders were performed with an intention that not even another sociopath could accept, so even sociopaths believe in their own capacities for choice.
Now let’s reconsider whether victims should be told they have to forgive. It seems there is a natural human instinct that says forgiveness is reserved for accidents, unintended consequences, and perhaps intentional slights that are out of character. How then can you ever forgive a psychopath?
Psychopaths have been compared to predators. I think this analogy is seriously flawed. A predator such as a lion or wolf has to kill in order to survive. Psychopaths don’t hurt for survival. They hurt because they want to, because they like hurting. Their enjoyment of hurting increases the likelihood they will choose to hurt if given the opportunity. They also seek out opportunities to hurt -not for survival but for pleasure.
Since sociopaths, with intention, repeatedly violate our inborn social contract, perhaps they should never be forgiven.
Instead of forgiving, I hope, my friend, you will think about all this and thoroughly digest the reality of the sociopath you shared life with. The reality is terrible— you shared life with a truly evil person, someone who regularly, with malice and forethought, chooses to harm others. Don’t stop hoping to see the day the scourge of this evil person’s existence will be wiped from the Earth, but do not waste any more of your time on him.
hopeful6596
Your sociopath might be “happy” with the new partner but she will be the loser in the end too unless she is more disordered than he is.
The choice they have is not to be what they are it is to do a specific hurtful act.
If you search through my past posts, you will see that I have written before on the topic of people worrying that the S is going on with life “happy.” What you are going through is very common.
Try to focus your attention on yourself, your health/recovery and your real loved ones. Things will get better for you over time if you try to move on.
Dr. Leedom,
Thanks for your response. I am just beginning to snap out of the depression and getting the perspective that I really need to start caring for myself and getting on with my life. I also just read your post, “A Deepr Understanding of Love, ourselves and the Sociopath. Crystal clear. Thanks for the reminder. 🙂
Hopeful~
I relapsed a few weeks back, and I looked at his facebook page. I had a horrible dream that night because he portrays the perfect life. He is lies…nothing he ever says on a public forum is true. The truth is in her facebook page, which she has protected so I can’t access it anymore (thankgod!). I know in my heart that I won and she lost, because he is living with her. When he left, I looked at him and said “the worst thing I could do to her, is send you to her.” He looked at me and smiled; he enjoyed that I would want to do her harm; and further, that he was the harm.
Dear Bird,
It is sometimes easy for us to “relapse” and have emotional contact with them even without physical contact–especially in times of stress.
I realized recently that my over-reaction to my son C’s lie to me was because I was already stressed from the documents I had to read and go over in the preparation for my P-son’s upcoming parole hearing. It was a form of contact with P-son. Sure, my son C shouldn’t have lied to me, and I no longer trust him, and do not want him living in my house, but the absolute “melt down” I had over it was I am sure, made worse by the stress from the parole hearing which caused a form of “contact” by going over those letters he wrote to his Trojan Horse psychopath on how to manage our family to get me out of my own home or if all else failed to kill me.
I’m currently at my best friend’s house or at her cabin in West texas and just relaxing some. I need the time to chill out. I am having night mares every night about people hunting me to hurt me, or interacting with my son C, but I’m doing some better since I (with my doctor’s okay) raised the dose of my antidepressants.
I’ll get through this mess, just like I have gotten through all the rest of the mess.
Sure, Hopeful, Sherry Winters, and others, it takes TIME and we may never be exactly the same person we were before the betrayal, but different doesn’t have to be “bad” it CAN be “better”!!!! ((((hugs you all))) and always my prayers!
What a great insight. To me, forgiveness means understanding of the reasons why the hurt occured, seeing it from the other person’s point of view and accepting their reality. I did forgive. Once. Twice. Three times. Each time, more hurt followed. The P will continue to hurt as long as the door is open. But, when the door shuts in their face, they are just that – pathetic beings, not worthy of the thought. In great times, and bad times – never forgive a P. Forgiveness is for those who learn from their mistakes, and these ones don’t want to.
Oxdover,
I hope the seperation you have, will give you the clarity you need to make the decisions you need to make. I am sorry you are dealing with what you are. I know your nightmares well, because I have had them as well. You are a strong mama, and you do what is best because only you know for sure. I wish you the best with caring. Do you have a dog? Get a big one!!
Dear Sherry Winter,
I just saw you post. This is the first one I have seen because I don’t spend as much time here as I used to. I just wanted to speak to you from where I sit now… I am 4.5 years past my “Bad Man”experience.
That is a tough question you ask…
Will you always define your life by this moment in time?
Maybe. Probably. That’s okay.
An experience with a Sociopath is very very painful, violating and confusing. It changes how we see the world and at first we will feel as if we can trust no one and it makes us angry…. “Gee, I used to be so trusting! Now I don’t trust anyone! I am so angry!”
But what is wonderful now, from where I sit, is that I do trust.. when trust is warranted. Aha! Sometimes, I even take my trust back if evidence shows that an adjustment needs to be made. And that’s okay! You know what? I feel a little safer in the world somehow.
I have grown up tremendously. I wasn’t taking care of me before. I was taking care of everyone else.. and their feelings and their crapola. If someone beat me up and then told me it was my fault, I would have believed them and then tried to fix myself so they wouldn’t have to chew me out or treat me bad again. What the heck?
Since the Bad Man, I have learned that other people’s behavior is not all about me anymore. It’s about them. I didn’t know that before. Also, these days, I am more of an observer than a reactor.
So, will you always define your life with a division? Before Bad Man vs. After Bad Man? Probably, but it’s okay.
It is a long journey and this lesson is one you will carry for a long time. It’s the hardest times that give us the most knowledge. I suspect that as you heal and move along the road, you will eventually find that your life is better. Mine is better now, and I am not talking about fancy cars and perfect relationships. I rent a room from some friends and I drive my poor old car that I have sent on 4 trips across the ocean. But my life is better.
What I have now that I didn’t have before is me. I have me in a way that I never thought possible.
Anyway, I don’t know if anything I am saying is making sense to anyone but me.
I just wanted to acknowledge your pain and hurt right now and tell you that I have been down that street. It does get better and you will continue to heal and grow. Be open to the possibility that life can continue to get better and a life you never imagined awaits you. I know how it feels to be mad about what you gave up… I gave up my dreams of living in the islands because I let a psycho Bad Man stalk me and torture me practically from the moment I set foot on the island. I take responsibility for that too. I know for sure I will never do something like that again…
Final answer: I do define m life by what happened to me. I see a distinct line of demarcation in the development of my character. If I were a tree and you cut me in half and looked at my rings, you would see a lot of rain in those years. It’s all good now though.
This experience will change the course of you but in a few years, maybe you will have the same experience I am having… that you will see it was for the better and greater good in some way. I hope I am right. And believe me, I do not mean to diminish your pain in anyway. I totally get it… and I totally get that people don’t get it. I gave up on that a long time ago… that is why we have LOVEFRAUD. :O)
All the best… E
Sherry Winter,
I want to echo what alohatraveler wrote you. It will get better.
Healing from these relationships becomes transformational after a certain point. We become better than we were before, stronger, more certain, wiser about our own lives. For many of us, the healing triggers more healing of older issues as well, relieving many layers of PTSD.
It sounds like you are taking steps for your own wellbeing, and that you have both personal and therapeutic support. That’s good.
You have every right to be angry about what happened to you. You are learning how to take better care of yourself in the future. And that is really, really good.
A lot of what we have to get over is what we did to ourselves. But we do get over it, because we come to realize that we were dealing with seductive, but heartless people. We might have been able to change what happened by saying no earlier, but we couldn’t change them, no matter what we did. We don’t need to forgive them. But we do need to forgive ourselves.
Ultimately, as aloha says, you’ll get better in ways you can’t imagine now. There’s a lot of helpful material to read here. Stick around, and write more. We’re at all stages of healing, and you’ll find lots of support.
In the meantime, just be kind to yourself. Healing and getting all the good stuff out healing takes time. You’ve done a lot of work already. It will pay off for you.
Kathy
Oxy, my thoughts are with you. I think your analysis makes a lot of sense. You’ve had a lot of deal with, and you’ve been so brave and careful. You didn’t need one more thing to make you feel unsafe and especially not now. I’m glad you’ve got this good friend, so you could get out of Dodge for a while.
If there is anything I can do to help — editing, phone calls, whatever — just get in touch.
A big hug —
Kath
Liane:
Great article.
I was told ‘early on’ that I need to forgive the S…..I just can’t grasp this……
I think my way of ‘forgiving’ is having the peace of mind and confidence that I KNOW something bad will happen to him, I am confident someone that does such harm to others is not coming out of this life skipping and whistling dixie…..by far!
I can let that idea ‘be’ and move forward…..
I have no desire to cause harm to him…..and I never have….because of how I feel about the universe doing it on behalf of all the chaos and pain he’s inflicted….on the world….not just us.
I have to say though…..I do take some solice at how he is in misery…..losing everything and feeling jilted. I take some sick ‘power’ over him and continue to when he thinks he can play me for a fool. Each time I can ‘shut him down and out’…..I giggle when I think about it…..as if…..and YOU thought I was stupid….
MY revenge was taking everything…..and leaving him only with his million dollars plus in drug/dirty money…..
I WORKED my ass off for 28 years and I wasn’t going to be taken for my hard work too…..
I know it kills him to know we are fine, moving on, rebuilding, and working the business….shoveling the snow ourselves and still in our home. He wanted us destitute and me dead!
He got NEITHER!
This is satisfying to me……VERY SATISFYING!
But forgiveness….I just don’t see it in me……and I won’t give him my soul……I allow this situation to empower me and I see all the various lessons!
NOT bring me down!!!
Maybe one day I might feel differntly…..or at least indifferent…this is the closest I see to forgiveness….with him.
BTW…I have forgave numerous people in my life….and I got to a place where I forgave AND forgot……it wasnt worth the space…..
YET…..I’m not convinved I can do this with the S….OR my parents!
WHO KNOWS?