UPDATED FOR 2020
A Lovefraud reader who posts as “LadyA” sent Lovefraud the following email. At the end, I suggest how she can recover from the sociopath.
I’ve spent a lot time thinking about my experience with my spath, and how it affected me and the people around me. I have read article after article, story after story. I now fully understand what spaths do and how they do it but I didn’t understand why I don’t feel any better about it. What was I missing?
When I left my spath it was a fairly dramatic experience. He had just been sentenced to serve jail time on the weekends for an obstruction of justice charge. My mom flew into town and in one swoop we packed up everything we could get in the car and left the province to go back to my hometown. I had to quit my job over email and send a goodbye text to all my friends.
I am thankful every day for what my mom did for me. I sure wasn’t happy about it at the time but I knew I needed out and this was my chance. What I didn’t know is how much moving back to my hometown would affect me emotionally. I had originally planned on only being back for six months. Just long enough for him to move on and get me out of mind, but it has now been just over three years and I still haven’t moved back. I got settled in a new job, new friends, and a new relationship. Even after all of this I haven’t been able to figure out why I’m not happy. Until three days ago.
Pride. I was proud of myself for the life that I had built. I moved 1200 km’s away from home right after high school to a big city. I was on the fast track to a strong career in a competitive field. I had a brand new car, paid all my bills on time, and was saving to buy a house. I was independent, reliable, strong, caring, and had a really great outlook on the world. Not many people can say that at 22.
All of that was ruined by a six-month “whirlwind romance.” I’m no longer proud of myself. I feel like I have failed because I came back home with my “tail between my legs” to my mommy. I no longer have a new car because it was repossessed as soon as I got back here. I am jaded, I don’t trust people easily, and I am no longer as strong as the face I put on the outside. I’ve gained weight because deep down I just don’t care anymore. My career is now on a plateau due to the location where I live. I don’t have one reason to be proud of myself right now.
How do I get my pride back when I know what happened? I want to feel proud of myself for my life but I just have zero idea where to start. I’ve thought about moving away again, but I don’t really know if that’s the answer. How can I be proud of what has happened in my life? I’m really honestly just so ashamed.
Donna Andersen responds
Dear LadyA,
I am so sorry about your encounter with a sociopath. Although this is not a normal breakup, the good news is that you can recover from the sociopath.
Right now, however, it does not seem that way. Why? I can see two reasons.
The first is that betrayal by a sociopath is a huge emotional injury. In the beginning of your email you said that, after all your reading, you now “fully understand what spaths do and how they do it,” but you don’t feel any better.
Understanding is a critical first step to you to recover from the sociopath. But understanding is an intellectual process, something that you do with your mind. The wound you experienced is also emotional. It needs to be dealt with emotionally.
How do you do that? You allow yourself to feel the pain of the injury.
This means letting yourself cry. Letting yourself scream and wail. Letting yourself experience anger — I’m sure there is anger — perhaps by working it out on a punching bag.
This isn’t pretty, and you probably want to do it privately, because other people often have difficulty being around this. Or, you may have a good therapist who can help you.
One way or another, any bottled up emotion you have within you needs to come out.
Underestimated the injury
Next you wrote that you identified the reason that you’re not happy as “pride.” But it seems like you are regarding pride as something bad, like one of the seven deadly sins.
You had every reason to be proud, because your pride was based on your achievement. And the sociopath took this away from you.
Here is what I think has happened: You have underestimated the scale of the injury, and the severity of the betrayal.
LadyA, you were building a life for yourself. You went out on your own; you started building a career; you were moving forward.
And some manipulative, deceitful parasite, who did something bad enough to end up in jail, ruined it for you.
Not only did he cost you money and hurt your career, he corrupted your outlook on life. You’re jaded; you don’t trust; you don’t care. You are not the young person you once were all because of the sociopath.
Recognize that this was not a normal breakup after all, you had to flee your home, job and friends.
Your life was shattered. Your psyche was deflated. This is a massive shock to your system. It’s no wonder that you are still struggling.
Drain the emotion
So what do you do? In my opinion, you do exactly what I suggested earlier — allow yourself to feel the pain now, knowing that the pain is bigger than you originally thought.
So you cry. You stomp. You imagine him standing in front of you and yell at him. (Do not, however, attempt to confront him in person. This would be counterproductive.)
The idea is to drain off the negative emotion.
As you drain the emotion, a void will be created within you. It’s very important to fill that void with joy.
This may sound preposterous to you, like you have no reason to be joyful. But don’t look at the totality of your life right how.
Do any small thing that makes you happy: Go for a walk. Play with your pets. Have lunch with a friend. Listen to music.
To recover from the sociopath, it may require many rounds of draining off the negative and replacing it with positive. But with time, you’ll find that your entire outlook will change, and you’ll be able to get back on track.
Importantly, with the wisdom you gained through this experience, you’ll never fall for a sociopath again.
Lovefraud originally published this article on May 12, 2014.
High school boyfriend pursues her, then abuses her
In the middle
you say you want him because then you feel better about yourself. Does he really make you feel special, does he make you happy, does he make you feel wanted and loved? I don’t think this guy is capable of loving anyone but himself. Why would you want such a selfish person as your partner?
I know where you are coming from. I still wanted my ex husband for months after he left…after he did all those horrible things to me…after he told me he did not love me…after he really wanted me dead….and I still wanted him back. Because I could not think clearly, rationally and smart. I was addicted to him and nothing he did would make me think differently.
Only when he pushed it over the edge and tried to get a restraining order against me, because I caught him in his cheating lies….my eyes were opened for once and I saw the devil that day in court. This was not my husband , not the father of my son, claiming all these horrible things about me in open court. It was not the man who promised to love me for better of for worse, it was truly the devil. But God was on my side, along with the judge and my lawyer. When I walked out of this courtroom I HAD ENOUGH…there was no more addiction, no more love, no more tears about this guy. I was done.
In the middle, maybe you will have this Aha moment like I did. You need to let him go. Whats wrong with being single ? You don’t need a man to make you feel good about yourself. Ask God , he loves you unconditionally. For once in my life I made God the priority. And he gave me strength, hope and faith through this trial. And in the end, I am a much better person now.
Please let this guy be with his wife, with Amanda, with whomever he chooses. Don’t let him play you like a fool.
For Lady A
With you being back with your family, is there a little piece of land in the sun that you can dig up. Plant a little garden. Flowers to see God’s true gift you helped to make. Also plant tomatoes, so you can bite a warm, fresh picked one with a little salt or other fruit and veggies. As the garden grows the physical activity will take away the mental hurt. The sight of the flowers and the taste of the tomatoes and fruit, will help with your heart and sense of pride. Doing gardening will make it so you can’t think of him, you will be busy…. physically and mentally. The heart will soon follow.
Does anyone know if counselors have to report clients to the US government, about any patient that comes to see them regarding PTSD and a lingering anger about having it in the first place, and the depressed feeling that doesn’t seem to want to lift, due to the ASPD/NPD asshole that caused it? Our current administration wants to limit our 2nd amendment rights to bare arms, and I’m afraid that if I talk to a professional about my continual flashbacks and the blues that make me feel like I am faking wanting to get out of bed and go to work or even eat or sleep enough, and that I might need a professional suggestion on how to make it all stop, that I will get on a ‘list’ of “Has been depressed and can never own a gun”!
I don’t know, and it may vary from state to state. In my state counselors must report physical and sexual abuse of children to social services. You may be able to find an answer through a google search or by asking a counselor.
jenni
Counselors need to have ablity to keep things private or their work wouldn’t work. So for the most part they don’t report any details to anyone. They check off a diagnosis on an insurance form and submit that.
They are obligated to report if they expect you to be a danger to others. In retrospect, they can testify if there’s been a crime committed and what they have is significant to it. (So if you hated, and wanted to kill and the person turned up dead.)
There are specific legalities. So google may turn up the exact rules in each state. There’s a licensing and professional violations organization in each state. They should be able to tell the details, and point you to sources. Also every therapist you talk with, should be willing to answer that question over the phone.
“PTSD and a lingering anger about having it in the first place, and the depressed feeling ”
Very very unlikely they have to tell that. Everyone comes in with upsets and many with anger and plenty with PTSD.
I posted this somewhere, but now I’m not seeing it posted. So I’ll post it here too?
inthemiddle,
Nomorewool is right — used purely professional excuses and interactions. It will remove his power faster than anything else — and humilate him when he has no power over you. Try something removed… and see if it doesn’t make you feel more powerful. (So much so eventually, that you might go back to your office and cry from that feeling of power.)
On “Justice for him lying to me, humiliating me, and making fun of me. I want justice so he suffers like i suffer.”
You already have it. This person has no ability to feel loving committed connections to anyone. He is so lonely inside that he thinks harming others IS a form of connection. You have so much more than he does, or ever will (unless he finds serious levels of help).
The reason the breakup hurts, is the nature of breaking up with a non-loving person. When you part ways with someone you care about, even if it will be a permanent ending, the natural thing that caring people do — is re-connect in that last moment and recognize the caring and value of the relationship. (For instance, it’s why leaving high school, we write cute dumb things to each other in the year book just before leaving at the end of the year.)
In a relationship where it’s ending because one person is irresponsible, uncaring, and lacking in genuine connection — they don’t provide that. The normal person then keeps trying to go back and get that last connection to complete that piece of themselves, so they can move on. When it’s not present, one tends to feel humliated for having cared in the first place, scared at what’s missing that feels abnormal, confused because it’s dizzingly odd to deal with, and disgusted because of the shaming that it does to you. Those are normal reactions to have, but they are “real” and are instead, purely “reactions” to what you are dealing with. Because they are reactions, it’s actually a little harder to figure out that’s what they are…again, because it’s all so odd to deal with (i.e. outside normal).
So to separate and part ways, instead, one has to feel the disdain and dislike they have for that incapible person. And fill in caring by starting up other activities and eventually filling it up from inside themselves. It’s much harder to do and to find that path that’s not our usual way of ending things. You will eventually find this path and start to feel much better.
You seem to be making progress!
C
Typo correction
“but they are “real” and are instead, purely “reactions” to what you are dealing with. ”
Should be “NOT real” feelings. They are reaction feelings.
First I want to thank you for your words. This has been hard.
I did get some closure the other day. I meet with him and he finally admitted to my face that he slept with Amanda twice drunk but 2 times the same night. I don’t believe that but the truth is once anyone sleeps with someone else I don’t want to be a part of it anymore. I was shocked to say the least he admitted anything but he said he went to a party with his wife in separate vehicles and he got too drunk to drive home, which I am sure on purpose and he said that the VA doctor confirmed he has control issues when he drinks. Yea right. It still hurts to be honest but I need to sit in this do nothing to distract myself and understand what choices I made to be in this place. I did contribute to it. I did nothing to deserve the other nonsense cruel behavior.
I understand that people say I should volunteer, get out do something, look at pretty flowers etc. First I am not that way I don’t work that way. When I do something I immerse myself in it which is what I would do when I do something else and then I would not ever deal with the problem at hand bcs I would not want to feel the pain. Hence why I had multiple addictions. The other problem in my life I was always told stop thinking of yourself you’re a selfish person, its not all about you. Well from where I am seeing it it was never about me ever not once and it seemed to be like that with everyone.
I am sitting in this right now. I need to feel it understand it and move through it. It will be as long as it needs to be. I don’t have a time frame and it will be day by day for me. I am never going to be the same and I need to be ok with happened to me and not blame myself. But if I distract myself and push myself through this too fast I wont learn the lesson and be back where I was.
I told him im done with him and I am not wasting my time with anymore of this chatter with him. One thing about me with all of my relationships, my first John, Wes, Drew, I don’t go back after I know that they have had sex with someone else. When I caught him in the act with another girl I was done, when I saw wes with the hooch I never went back. I don’t want my np. I just get upset when I think that I was discarded for a person who sleeps with everyone. It still hurts and I try not to think too much of the act itself with her but it is painful. He asked me a month ago to meet up with him and he was still interested in me. Someone on here called it the rubber worm. I will move through this and will figure it out. My truth is it hurts, I need time, I need to learn and need to take time and sit with it or whatever so I can get through. Its at my pace and what I want to do. If I don’t feel like doing nothing but crying then that’s what im doing. This cant go on for months and months but I need to grieve and heal and work through the anger of the betrayal.
The worst of all of it is that I did get something from him. The next morning after he told me he slept with her I was at the gyn office for emergency visit to get tested and follow up on the problems I have been having since Nov. I have meds and it might be clymidia but he took the panel and got blood work. I am being tested for everything. That feels horrible and for someone I believed I loved to do this. So today I don’t want this anymore. I want someone who will respect themselves and not get drunk and do stupid things.
I need to tell everyone that I am not following everyone else’s rules and let them decide if they are going to be a part of my life and not the other away around.
I will keep everyone posted what the results are. Today is a bad day for a little while lunch time it was ok so we will see what tonight brings. I am sad, lonely and hurt but that is ok. It is only temporary because I am a kind hearted person who had someone else take something that didn’t belong to them or deserved. I learned be on guard watch, watch and watch some more.
First I want to thank you for your words. This has been hard.
I did get some closure the other day. I meet with him and he finally admitted to my face that he slept with Amanda twice drunk but 2 times the same night. I don’t believe that but the truth is once anyone sleeps with someone else I don’t want to be a part of it anymore. I was shocked to say the least he admitted anything but he said he went to a party with his wife in separate vehicles and he got too drunk to drive home, which I am sure on purpose and he said that the VA doctor confirmed he has control issues when he drinks. Yea right. It still hurts to be honest but I need to sit in this do nothing to distract myself and understand what choices I made to be in this place. I did contribute to it. I did nothing to deserve the other nonsense cruel behavior.
I understand that people say I should volunteer, get out do something, look at pretty flowers etc. First I am not that way I don’t work that way. When I do something I immerse myself in it which is what I would do when I do something else and then I would not ever deal with the problem at hand bcs I would not want to feel the pain. Hence why I had multiple addictions. The other problem in my life I was always told stop thinking of yourself you’re a selfish person, its not all about you. Well from where I am seeing it it was never about me ever not once and it seemed to be like that with everyone.
I am sitting in this right now. I need to feel it understand it and move through it. It will be as long as it needs to be. I don’t have a time frame and it will be day by day for me. I am never going to be the same and I need to be ok with happened to me and not blame myself. But if I distract myself and push myself through this too fast I wont learn the lesson and be back where I was.
I told him im done with him and I am not wasting my time with anymore of this chatter with him. One thing about me with all of my relationships, my first John, Wes, Drew, I don’t go back after I know that they have had sex with someone else. When I caught him in the act with another girl I was done, when I saw wes with the hooch I never went back. I don’t want my np. I just get upset when I think that I was discarded for a person who sleeps with everyone. It still hurts and I try not to think too much of the act itself with her but it is painful. He asked me a month ago to meet up with him and he was still interested in me. Someone on here called it the rubber worm. I will move through this and will figure it out. My truth is it hurts, I need time, I need to learn and need to take time and sit with it or whatever so I can get through. Its at my pace and what I want to do. If I don’t feel like doing nothing but crying then that’s what im doing. This cant go on for months and months but I need to grieve and heal and work through the anger of the betrayal.
The worst of all of it is that I did get something from him. The next morning after he told me he slept with her I was at the gyn office for emergency visit to get tested and follow up on the problems I have been having since Nov. I have meds and it might be clymidia but he took the panel and got blood work. I am being tested for everything. That feels horrible and for someone I believed I loved to do this. So today I don’t want this anymore. I want someone who will respect themselves and not get drunk and do stupid things.
I need to tell everyone that I am not following everyone else’s rules and let them decide if they are going to be a part of my life and not the other away around.
I will keep everyone posted what the results are. Today is a bad day for a little while lunch time it was ok so we will see what tonight brings. I am sad, lonely and hurt but that is ok. It is only temporary because I am a kind hearted person who had someone else take something that didn’t belong to them or deserved. I learned be on guard watch, watch and watch some more.
ITMOHA-
Mariel Hemingway recently drew from a line in”spirituality.” It goes like this: “You’re done with something when it doesn’t affect you any more.
I, and I’m sure others here, wish you abundant success in achieving that goal. No one but you can tell you when you have.
Joyce
Joyce,
This is so true.
I am in month 4 of NC.
I am over him but being alone(by choice) has forced me to look at myself in a way I have never done before.
I am not sad because he is out of my life, I am sad because I let him in.
This is hard work, but necessary.
I will NEVER fall victim to another manipulator, love or work.
Stonginthecity-
Unfortunately, having fallen prey once, does not guarantee that it won’t happen again. But if it does, there’s a good chance that you’ll figure it out sooner, and be less overwhelmed by it.
In order to trust our ‘gut” instincts, we first have to experience the harm we can now instinctively avoid. Now that you understand what sociopathic behavior looks like, it’ll be more difficult for someone to build your trust to the extent that you throw caution to the wind. But even if you misjudge, you will know you can recover and survive.
All the best!
Joyce
“Satan and his evil hordes are sore losers. Once they find something that shakes you up they will keep trying over and over relentlessly until they are absolutely convinced that their tactics will never again work with you. When, finally, they seem to leave, it is only to bide their time for a surprise attack. Their persistence is so very unpleasant for you. However, this will make you stronger and stronger as you keep resisting his lies. The enemy of our souls is the master deceiver because that is all he can do. The devil cannot change reality. He cannot change the fact that God love you will ALL of his unlimited love. So all he can do is mess with your feelings, hoping that you will start to believe them, rather than believe in the power of Christ and the love of God.”
The only way we can keep Satan away is to refuse communicate with him.
This too shall pass
Yes, it is very difficult to resist emailing or texting. What helped me when I started no contact, was that I knew the consequences. Talking to him meant more tears, more hurt and pain for me and more cobtrol and victory for him. I did not want to go back there. You have to think with your brain and not your heart.
After I went through a few times when I really wanted to cobtact him, I stopped myself and brought me back to reality. No more communicating with the devil.
Kaya48 and Remember,
Yes, exactly! That’s the place I’ve come to. When I talk to him I feel horrible for days and his words stick with me forever. I try and consider his pattern. We talk, he’s regretful and matches my persona (he mimics me) and then he contacts me after and tells me how crazy I am, either by yelling, criticizing or saying the most hurtful degrading things in sweet, sweet ways. It’s horrible. The blame when I talk to him is horrible. It’s always “YOU, YOU, YOU.” If I never here the way he says “YOU” again…..
I have many coping tools at this point. I email him and send it to myself, I journal, I have an anger box I write messages and release my feelings into (it’s called Ahole box for both spath #1 & 2), I use a foam roller, and have a “dammit” doll my mom bought me that you beat things like furniture with (it’s awesome and you an purchase it online). My counselor also suggests I call her and leave messages (I do). I have one friend I call as back up. I called her tonight and feel better. So many coping tools! I work with kids who have significant behavioral problems and teach coping tools daily. Yet, even with all the tools I struggle……
Like you said, the consequences as a result of him is more than I can bare.
Thank you for your loving support and for hearing me out. The talk with my friend and your messages are a GODsend. I WILL not contact him. I am strong and wonderful! I am telling myself that so that one day I believe myself…..
Thstoo,
I knew you had a tool box! And, you ARE wonderful, isn’t that why they want to destroy us?, they want that wonderful- they are haters to the nth degree! And I say this so I can believe it too. They are haters.
TT,
I want a dammit doll!!!!!
Once upon a time in a land not far away, the psychopaths drank some juice, the juice was called hater-aid. It filled them with hate and turned them into psychos…then they decided to share this juice with others, others not like them, they couldn’t tell us what it would do to us, so it was secretly called fool-aid. We drank the juice.
The difference between haters and fools: we go to the dentist and fix the cavities, while their teeth ROT OUT!
Here’s the Dammit Doll Website:
http://www.dammitdolls.com/
Mine is a creepy looking little thing but it’s awesome! They have different sizes. Mine is smaller and I wish I had the bigger one! The description on the doll reads:
Whenever things don’t go so well, and you want to hit that wall and yell, here’s a little dammit doll, that you can’t do without. Just grasp it firmly by the legs and find a place to slam it. And as you whack the stuffing out yell “DAMMIT! DAMMIT! DAMMIT!”
Hahaha. I’ve come to really find it useful. My mom got it for me for Christmas to deal with my first spaths stalking…
Remember,
YOU are wonderful!!! What they don’t realize, they haven’t made us weaker. We are stronger! Even if we don’t fully believe ourselves yet, our gut, heart and souls tell us. I feel that’s why we keep fighting. We are stronger and even more wonderful than we know. Some day, we really will believe. And no one will influence us to feel or believe differently because we will know the truth! We will know our worth. Our worth is up to no one but ourselves.
Thank you for your faith in me.
TT,
Amen. What you said is truth.
The dammit dolls are cool! i’m so getting one! Trying to find one that reminds me of him. Lol!
Remember,
Buy one and post a picture of him on it! That’s what I’ve been meaning to do. Visualizatiion has been enough for me so far. He’s such an ASS. Picturig his face in my mind on the doll is all it takes!
I deleted any and every picture I had of him, and any little things he gave me. Burned his name on paper and threw the ashes in the cemetary by my house lol.
I did keep a few items that I liked so I saged them. Lol!
I’ll try to picture his face on the doll. I got a scary looking one.
Thanks, i’ll be getting it soon!
🙂
Remember,
I like your style! I threw away all sentimental things, gave some things back I knew he would harrass me about. He gave me a lot, nothing I ever asked for. It was all about control. I plan on selling some stuff and have certain things I want to keep that I’ve stored away. I saged my bedroom because there were too many memories there. I’ll have to sage the stuff I want to keep. Good thinking!
Thistoo,
I didn’t discover what he really truly was until recently like last month, after reading for a few months and coming here, or when I really accepted it or maybe, when I came here. Anywa
Uggggg. Cont….
Anyways, all I knew was that I felt like had a hex on me like I said before.
I couldn’t flip my kind of mattress so I rotated it, now my feet go where his head was, so I used to imagine kicking him in the face. I did every meditation to cut cords and ties available. Lit candle and let it burn until the end with a prayer to archangel Michael.
Boy oh boy.
And now i’m on the part defining/accepting that he is a covert slickster. Obviously, or I wouldn’t have been with his ass…
Uggggh
Remember,
I love that you rotated your mattress and vizulize kicking him in the face! Again, I like your style. Seems like we have a lot in common. I was on the same path as you after #1. It took me a little while after the relationship to figure it out. His stalking was further proof. Both #1 and #2 had a hex on me. So many mind games, manipulation, gaslighting and brain washing! I didn’t even realize all of that was even possible until these men!
I also light candles, pray to archangel Michael to keep me safe from him and to cut the cords. Some days it works, some days I still struggle. It helps though.
Oh course you wouldn’t have been with that ass!! We were victims of fraud hence this site!). I feel dirty even imagining having sex with him now. Yuck! I feel even worse knowing that I opened up to him and that he’s twisting my words/experiences so that he can use everything I said against me.
It’s crazy because even though I know what my ex is I STILL want to contact him! WTH?! Why do I want to contact a monster that I wouldn’t even allow around children?
Along with visualizing cutting the cord I also picture archangel Michael putting up his hand and blocking my ex to protect my inner child. I’m working on loving my inner child, building her up and protecting her.
Yes, my therapist was telling me about my inner child. I haven’t seen her in a month probably, and after the last visit is when I went in through the er to get on meds, because I knew if I made an appt anywhere it would take weeks and I was then physically ill from the depression. I have my first appt with the psychiatrist Tuesday. I was thinking about trying a different therapist, I have been with her since Sept or Oct but I need something more clinical I feel. A more clinical psychologist. LOL
I get you wanting to talk to him. It’s that bond- or the urge to use…like a drug. I have been treating myself this whole time as if I were an addict. In recovery, and he or that relationship were the drug.
But, yea, I did before break no contact, and saw quickly what he was capable of, so now if I want to, I run the tape- he will either kiss my ass and fake charm, not apologize, tell a sob story (lie), or…drop hints or push buttons about another woman. It’s a NO win!
So, when you want to reach out….
Run the tape!
Never ends good.
🙂
Remember,
Running the tape definitely helps! I’ve been holding strong. His responses are always the same, just like yours. It’s like they all have a script or something!
Why don’t you want to see your therapist again? I understand wanting to try different avenues of therapy. You need to find the right fit for what you’re going through right now! I’ve had a clinical psychologist in the past, a trauma therapist and since last summer I’ve been seeing a counselor from the local womens shelter. All of my therapsists have been good ones, depending on where I am at the time mentally/emotionally.
I have to say I LOVE my counselor. In this situation she has been so helpful to me. She gets the ins and outs of abusers and is almost always spot on when it comes to my exes next moves. She has been my savior through stalking. She’s pays attention to patterns and her predictions have saved me. She also encourages me to live on my own time, for me, and to take the time I need when it comes to making changes.
You are a strong woman, I know you’ll find the right fit in a therapist to move you in the right direction. I’m very impressed with the tools you’re already using. Yay self awareness! You go girl! 🙂
Thank you!
She is very into energy work and healing which I definitely like, but I didn’t even know what I was going through when I was going through it, and she doesn’t say too much. I want someone who has worked with this type of stuff and or trauma. I also like you, am now dealing with or being faced with stuff from childhood, that I brushed off or filed away…my mom is a something…bi polar, borderline, N, whichever.
Also, I don’t know why they never diagnosed me after the 2nd time I had cancer with ptsd. I was mentally paralized for about 5 years after. I did stop going to drs though.
This has all come full circle I guess. We are onions- so it’s time to peel back the layers.
Maybe this happened for a reason. It wasn’t a relationship, it was a lesson. Bleh.
Remember,
“We are onions”. Awesome analogy! Peeling back the layers is difficult, yet I have to believe that there is a lesson to be learned from all of this. I’m am discovering a self worth that I always thought existed. I’m realizing I didn’t really know what my self worth meant before. Self worth and bounderies. I’m able to identify what those truly mean now and how I let go of my self and beliefs to fufill the needs of others, especially my spaths.
As for therapy, it’s definitely key to find a therapist who has experience with this kind of thing. An uninformed therapist is able to cause more damage. It may take a while to find one that benifits you — you’ll know when you find a good fit!
Are you still in contact with your mom? Just curious, how was she towards you when you had cancer? How long have you been cancer free?
PTSD can be overlooked and not recoginized, especially from outsiders and when you don’t have treatment, as I’m sure you’re already aware. It definitely helped me understand things about myself when I was diagnosed with PTSD at 20. Unfortunatley, the combination of my PTSD from the past and the trauma from my spaths makes for a wicked combo!
Thistoo,
And you ask the million dollar question…! My mom abandoned me in the cancer hospital in NYC, bscause she got angry at me for NO valid reason. I live in the south, went to ny for treatment. We were waiting all day for chemo…long story short, she flipped out on me in the waiting room, and said i’ll see you in Fl, if you live!, got on the elevator and flew back home.
She’s a nut. I grew up with my father, he was the responsible one. Been around her always but she left when I was 5 or 6. Been with her husband since then. She’s been doing shitty things like such my whole life. I NEVER knew that shit effected me. I was always the kind forgiving one. Lol
I had cancer 2 times, last time was 10 yrs ago. Since this relationship, all thejunk is comming up, I don’t go by her house too much. She had me go over there the day before I went to get on meds. She was all crying bc I was depressed. Boohoo. Never supportive. And how ironic the socio lives right by her!!!
I started writing a book years ago about the hospital incident. Lol
Remember,
I bet your book is an interesting read!
If your mother truly is disordered (sure sounds like she is), of course she needed to pick/imagine a fight with you in the hospital! It must’ve been too much about you and not enough about her. 🙂 I’m not meaning to be insensitive with my humor, it’s just unbelievable. You deserved support that day, I can’t even begin to imagine how much you must have been struggling…
Interesting that she also made your depression her show. There’s a very big difference between a mother crying for attention and a mother who is being sincere. I feel like that’s the battle I face similar situations with spath #2 talking to my ex best friend. He tells the truth, twists it and makes it about him (plays victim). He SEEMS supportive and caring but I know his true intentions behind his actions and words. It’s not hard for him to convice others. Grrrrrr.
It figures your ex lives near your mom! Why wouldn’t he?! Otherwise, life would just be too easy for you. 🙂
Thistoo,
Yep, always about her. She knows about him, and my therapy and that i’m just now dealing with my past. Lol. I’m sure it doesn’t matter, but I definitely see her in a whole other light! I see clearly now. The veil of denial has been lifted, thanks to psycho boy. I joke about all this crazy stuff, humor has always helped me get through. Laugh at myself. At work they’ve known me for a while and now 2 number changes back to back. They make jokes n stuff (fun group)… I just say, yea, my life was too boring so I had to go and make some bad decisions!
That’s my story and i’m sticking to it.
Thanks for posting today you guys….
I’ve been feeling a lil anger brewing yest and today. Been entertaining thoughts of covert revenge.
Hmph.
Just thoughts.
When I get my dammit doll I may poke it with pins like a voodoo doll. Hahaaaaaa. Waaaaah.
Remember,
You’re in luck because the dammit dolls actually look similar to voodoo dolls!
I’m posting a ton today because I’ve been having a rough few days with staying NC. I’m so grateful for your and others posts.
My humor about all this is in full force these days! I also joke at work about 3 differnt phone numbers this year. Coworkers keep calling pasts numbers and I’m like, “Wait what, you can’t keep it straight! What’s wrong with you, this is perfectly normal!” Ha! I like your story, and that you’re sticking to it.
You’re seeing your mom in a different light, and it sounds like in her true light. Proof that we need to be grateful for the learning process we’ve been forced into. Thank GOD.
Thistoo,
Well then I guess we’ve both had a rough couple days.
Mine is like yours, acts so sweet and caring and charming, but it’s fake.
It’s great, your name Thistooshallpass- This#2shallpass.
Lol.
Yea, my number change was really 3x, because he got the first one by accident.
Stay strong!
I don’t want to talk to mine anymore because when I broke no contact after a month or so via email, he acted, then added a sob story, then turned it around, then love bombed me for a few weeks- to which I did not reply after day 1 1/2…
I hate him. All his contradicting lies.
So, no desire to talk, j
TT,
Uggh.
My phone sometimes, it hits the submit comment by accident, or maybe I do it by accident. Lol
Anyways, rough few days, stay strong!!!!!
Remember,
This#2shallpass. You’re funny! I LOVE it!! 🙂
Thank you for your support. Mine did all the crap yours was doing when I went NC. #1 was so easy to stay NC because of his terrifying stalking! I’m racking my brain and am trying to figure out why I want to contact #2. Do I miss who I thought he was? Meh. Do I feel lonely? No, I actually feel free. Do I want to know what he’s up to? Not really, I already know he’s a gross liar and figure he’s doing gross things. Is it because of the bond he created? Maybe.
My counselor thinks in the past I contacted him out of fear. She thinks I want to know what he’s up to so I feel safe and to make sure he’s no where near me. His threats of stalking bother me. He hasn’t seemed to be up to much. I broke NC about a month ago and he said that if he were #1 he would drive around my house with a different car. I have cameras so I would know if either of their cars drove by.
Sure enough, a week or so later, a white car with tinted windows drove by my house starting 5 minutes before I got home from work and drove by 19 times for the next 3.5 hours! It would park behind my house for periods of times and I would see a green flash through the widow, like someone was taking pictures. I called the nonemergency police line and they seemed very concerned (this surprised me!). The police pulled the car over a half bolck away from my house. The officer reported back to me and said it was a process server serving papers and although it’s uncommon for a server to stay that long it can happen. Okay, sure, driving around my house/parking behind my house and taking pictures. And only a week after my ex claimed how he would stalk me if he were #1 at that! It seemed too much like a coincidence and if there’s one thing I learned from #1, when it comes to strange events coincidences are rare. At least I have a paper trail started.
This also reminds me that my ex said when we lived together he was going to hire a private investigator on and off to keep me safe and make sure #1 was up to no good. Um, controlling much? I would’ve been his prisoner!
Btw, congrats on maintaining NC! You rock. How are those covert plans of revenge coming along? 😉
Thistoo,
Wow, Oh my God, and holy shit!!
Driving around your house those number of times!?
Weird that they said it was a server…
Those things that make you say hmmm…
I think, just my thoughts that it’s the person you thought he was. That’s what it was for me atleast.
The person they reall, really, pretend to be. They have all their aquaintences fooled. So crazy.
I have no doubt that his children’s mother was indeed his prisoner!
Didn’t work, two babies, no family anywhere around, him either, isolated, financially dependent. Whew!
If it’s not the thought of who he was, it’s probably that damn bond.
I am really plotting and piecing together some possibilities in my head here.
If done right, all could be well.
Just some little things to annoy perhaps.
I risk him smearing me on fb, and at this point I do NOT care anymore. They are losers too and if they really are a friend they won’t believe, and he only talks to aquaintences. Nobody who is MY friend would be around him. And maybe a picture or so if he wanted to post somewhere, but again, I really don’t care!!
Remember,
The things that make you go hmm, hmm, hmmm! I so appreciate your lines/references!
The police asked me if I thought it was my stalker or recent ex. My gut syas #2 on this one, but who knows. I definitely don’t think it was a legitimate server. For all I know he could’ve hired someone (he has the resources). I spoke with my cousin who is married to a police officer in the same county. He said the person wouldn’t have to show proof. Good enough for me! It’s been peaceful since, as far as I know, so that’s good.
I will support you regardless what decision you make, but I have to say I’m worried about you trying to annoy him, if even a little. I know originally you said you were just plotting in your head and not going to act out it on. I hope it stays that way. You say you don’t care anymore and I believe that’s how you’re feeling at this moment. If you annoy, you may end up caring more than you know. He will also know that you’re still thinking about him, which will fuel the fire.
As I’m sure you know, they ALWAYS win. Always. The game is fun to them. He may go beyond smearing. From what you have described about your situation and his ex, he is a dangerous man both mentally and physically. That’s not something to take lightly. I’m just worried for your saftey and want you to be okay. I know how bad things can get when these people escalate.
You are getting to such a great place. Stay there, think about only your progress and continue to heal! I say the same things to myself as well. One day we will believe!
Thistoo,
Has #1 left you alone yet? That is too much. They do get terrorizing. I had never been terrorized like they do before, I didn’t think it existed, and never to me! Ha ha. Sure.
I know you are right, it’s just how I feel right now. I do ok for a few days, and then I have a few days entertaining revenge. I don’t get sad anymore since I have been on medicine, but it’s aways on my mind- and comes out as anger.
The therapist said all that thinking is the ego. Tell it thank you and be on it’s way, that I can handle it.
Thank you for your help. I appreciate it so much, and it’s free and has done more then my therapist, I do like her though.
Stay strong, fight the temptation, pray, meditate, say the serenity prayer.
I know you won’t talk to him…lol.
I listen to the Socio next door now on youtube, and I read The gift of fear, and reading Without a conscience, and I started The road less traveled. I believe The road less traveled is going to be great!
Remember,
Good for you for recognizing this is just a moment! I’m like you a few good days, and a few bad. I have a lot of anger. We both have so many coping tools! I’ve found that physical outlets work best for the anger….my dammit doll, running, my foam roller that has become my best friend. These mean torture our souls and we are left to pick up the pieces. Stay strong, Lady! You can do this!!!
Spath #1…he’s laid off of me for the past few months, only small signs that he’s around sometimes. Freshly stepped on cigarette butts by my car often (I know they’re his), things like that. He’s has a serious girlfriend from what I could gather before I got off fb. From what I can tell they started seeing each other while we were still together and she’s moved here now. I think that’s helping me. I don’t believe he’s done and I heed my counselor’s warnings that he’s most likely not done (she’s always been spot on when it comes to him). She has saved my life.
Our history is long. I’ll try my best to keep this short. We went to high school together and had the same friends. I stayed clear from him because I thought he was a creepy loser (I was right!). Over the almost 20yrs before he heavily pursued me, he would find ways to insert himself in my life and I didn’t pay much attention. Most of it was small encounters through mutual friends, social networking. Once he came to a party I had with my ex husband. He claimed he contacted me via social networking to ask if he could attend. I don’t remember that. Looking back, there was some strange stuff but he didn’t matter to me so it didn’t matter. He started pursuing me lightly for a couple of years before I took his bait. When we started dating I thought I was crazy for ever thinking he was a creepy loser, he was so charming and fun to be around!
I had two mystery stalkers along the way. One in college when campus email had just been developed. I was being messaged very creepy love things for months until campus security stopped it. Four years or so ago a stalker began to terrorize me. First by trying to break into my home in the middle of the night. Then the person began entering my house. I changed the locks. It continued. I’d come home and all my lights would be on, my doors and windows unlocked and my suff would be moved around. It was very creepy. The police came to my house at least 5 different times. I was terrified to leave my home for 3 months. I got a home security system and the first day I went to work after having it installed it was set off within 10 minutes. The police came and there was no one there. It’s apparent the stalker was watching me leave and didn’t know about the system. The stalking stopped.
When I was with my ex, he told me of all the grudges he held on people and the revenge he would get on them, with or without them knowing. I now know he pursued me to get revenge. He talked often about what a bitch I was in college because I wouldn’t say hi to him in the halls. I didn’t even know we went to college together. While we were together he sent me a picture he had randomly found in his condo — a closeup of me and my prom date (who he despised) at our senior prom. I don’t remember him being there and we weren’t close enough for him to take a close up. At the time I didn’t think anything abnormal about it. While we were together I also memorized his license plate number because I suspected he was following me. Again, didn’t think too much about it at the time. That’s how far gone I was with him.
I didn’t start putting the pieces together until I started counseling. When I revealed things about my past to my counselor she became concerned. She says we’ll never know for sure, but that there’s a big possibility my mysterious stalkers were him. I believe this to be true. He’s a very bad man, who has shared crimes with me. He is a drug addict (I didn’t know this) and he knows very bad people. If he has in fact been stalking me for 20yrs I don’t believe he will stop any time soon, if ever. I pray I’m wrong. Since our break up at the end of last May, he has made my life hell. I am the star of my own horror movie.
I’m riding out the storm for now. I started from scratch and built up my finances from my divorce 6 yrs ago. I own my house now. I have a great job. I’m surrounded with my support system. My counselor is encouraging me to move under a hidden address far away (there are nonprofits for this sort of thing). I can’t think about that right now. I have too much healing to do before making big decisions. My counselor supports me in this. Time will tell at this point.
I’ve been shaking like a leaf writing this. I haven’t spoken about it as a whole for a while now. Guess it’s still getting to me more than I realized. I’m so used to one day at a time and watching my back while moving forward…
So much for keeping this short! 🙂
Thistoo,
Wow.
As I was reading about your house being entered and things being moved around, I thought it was him too.
Unbelievable. See how over the years you just are busy and don’t really notice some things…then he gets you and he’s so charming.
We just really had no idea about this phenomenon,and learned the unfortunate way.
My eyes filled up because I don’t think it’s fair that you or any of us have to change our numbers, change jobs, social circles, or MOVE,because of THEM?!
Ok, they are sick, we will heal our past wounds, after tons of work and who knows how much time…and I guess the end goal is us not thinking about them anymore, when they don’t rent space in our head anymore, but it sucks and I think of punishment. I read that’s part of the process. You are such a survivor. We all are. Boy oh boy…
Uggggh.
Life.
God Bless you.
Everyday I wake up and say Thank you God, and several times a day out loud…I think he hears. 🙂
Well, there were 2 emails from early this morning saying this week would have been a year for us- and we don’t even talk. With the friendship we had such a shame, that I don’t have to hold a grudge forever, we should say hello.
Oh well, whatever. He doesn’t know that I know he’s a textbook socio/psycho. Doubt it. I didn’t know it. I was with him and kept searching for answers to what the problem could possibly be. What a joke. What a game. Before this I would have went back out there and got a new boyfriend and forgot all about him. Not this time. I’m scarred.
New day.
Thank you God.
Thank you, remembertoforget. For reading my story and for your kind words! I thank God every day as well. And I know he hears us! My faith is stronger now then ever and I know He helped me discover #2 sooner than later. I’m grateful for that. I was preyed on when I was weak and in fear. It was convienent for him that we had dated before #1 and that he could use #1’s abuse to his advantage.
I’ve been crying on and off since my post to you. Holy hell! I normally feel angry but now I feel so bad for me. Not sorry for me, just sad, like I’m an outsider reading my story. It’s hard to explain. I’m starting to wonder if I’m in some kind of state of denial….
None of us should have to make any big life changes because of these people, I agree! I had only some problem (a lot of anger) getting off social networking, changing my phone numbers and emails. etc. because it’s helped me get away from the stalking and pain. Moving and uprooting my life, that’s a different story. My family is here. My parents mean the world to me. Like I told you before, after we broke up #2 said if he was my ex he would drive by my house in a different car. He also knows I may move under a hidden address. In the same conversation as the car stuff, he said to me that all he would have to do if I moved in the same city is to go to my parents house and follow me home to find out where I live. He could be bluffing to upset me, but still….two men stalking, two many. It gets more than stressful sometimes.
Thank you for listing the books you’ve read before. I haven’t read any of the ones you’ve suggested, other than the sociopath next door. The gift of fear would probably be insightful to me at this point? I also read “Women Who Love Psychopaths”. It was very informative. I recommend it. My spaths match almost all of the characteristics listed. I will definitely be reading the books you listed.
Thank you, again. For your support. WE are strong and so many of us on here fighters.
Btw, how are you feeling about the whole poking the bear thing now? I trust you’re still just in your head and was a moment? 🙂 Now you know why I was worried about you. No need to play with fire, it burns!
Rmember,
Damn anniversary times. I’m not surprised he contacted you today. Not one bit. And I won’t be surprised when he comes around again during a “special” time of year! I assume you stayed NC? Better that he doesn’t know you know he’s a spath, even if he suspects you’ve put some pieces together. It’s safer. Both my spaths know I know. That wasn’t smart on my part. #2 would always tell me that #1 would feel it when the bond was finally broken. I find that interesting now….
Like you, I’m scarred as all get out! I used to be a dater. Now I can’t even imagine talking to a man romantically, let alone having sex. Maybe some day, but sure as hell not now!
Remember,
My mom just sent me this quote she got of fb. “Everyone that comes into your life is either a blessing or a lesson”
True enough! Too bad we had to learn the hard way!!
Btw, I was laughing with friends today at work about how ridiculous this situation is! I was complaing about not be able to use my library card because #1 changed my library account info (he used to be a librarian and clearly has an in) and I don’t want to give him the satisfaction of trying to use it, he would know I know. My coworker gave me her card because she doesn’t use it. The humor we had in all of it had us rolling! Anyway, made me think of you. 🙂
Thistoo,
I didn’t respond to him. He sent two messages a few hours apart. He may have sent more, but I resisted the urge to look and see. 🙂
He is full of it anyways because it’s not until next month. This is when we started talking, but whatever.
When I read The Gift of Fear, the author talks about harrassers and how say, if they call 20 times and you pick up on the 21st time, then they know it takes 21 times!
Crazy!, but we know that already…
I find that eerie how #2 said that #1 would feel it when the bond is broken.
Hmmm…..
A blessing or a lesson, that is true.
I realize how all my life mostly, I will end up talking to people again later on, after the pain is gone and you forget the bad and time has passed. I’ve done it with friends too.
I know now that this is a pattern that has to end. It’s time to grow up and hold more value for myself and relationships of all kinds.
I’m glad you were laughing about it all!
My new one in my mind is yea, I had to join a psycho support group after being with you!
You know how we talk about our inner child and how these relationships have brought up all kinds of past stuff and childhood stuff…?
Did you ever hear the old song by Fergie, Big girl’s don’t cry? I heard it randomly and was like wow. Sounds significant.
Glad you were able to finagle a library card! Hahaaaa.
🙂
Remember,
I have to say I so love that you make me laugh and put a smile on my face! I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again, I like your style! And I like your new line! Hahaha.
I’m am so proud of you for not responding or checking for further messages. You are a strong woman and doing the right thing. I’m still at the point if he sent me a message I would read it after contemplating for 5 minutes whether or not I should read it and then I would read it quickly and immediately mark it as unread. Give me a red button right now and I’ll push it! Ughhhhh
I also find it eerie spath #2 said that. He seemed to have a lot of insight about #1. I believe he would steer me in the wrong direction at times and sometimes revealed himself. My counselor wanted him to see her supervisor for a couple of sessions so he could better understand my situation and be able to support me better. He was so damn critical of me about it all! He said he wasn’t ready to go and would say over and over “You think I don’t understand abuse?” Now I know why he didn’t want to go and knew all too perfectly about abuse!
I’ll have to listen to that song. It’s been a while. I find myself listening to more songs that resonate with our experiences. We’re not alone!
I’m going to read The Gift of Fear. Seems like it’d be insightful to me. I’ve been avoiding it in ways…the whole stalking thing and all….It’s easy for me to read books about spaths but stalking is a trigger for me. Hmmm, I wonder why?!!
Thistoo,
I don’t read some of his, and I freak a bit too. Today for some reason, I had a feeling he would be sending soon since he hasn’t since the 1st.
Intuition I suppose.I was calm though and read them. And today the thoughts of revenge weren’t lingering.
Check back next week. Lol. I’ll be on my master plan. Jk
I love how he never sends any emails on the weekends. Lol.
The Gift of Fear is very insightful and all about trusting your gut.
I can’t wait to get my dammit doll.
🙂
I don’t know if mine knows he is a full blown psycho.
Yours does it sure seems. That’s even creepier,but maybe it’s like being an addict. Hi i’m so n so and i’m a psychopath. Hi so n so!
Mine did say once, i’m different. Another time said, i’ve always been the guy who didn’t care. And one time…he said something, I was joking about being crazy and he made a comment about how he could be committed.
Lovely!!
Remember,
From what I gather during the enormous amount of reading I’ve done, your spath most likely knows he’s a spath. He just doesn’t want you to know it. #1 told me he was diagnosed as a sociopath. He knows I’m highly interested in behaviors, it’s my job. I believe he was planting a seed so he could watch my reaction to his confession grow over time. I believe he has more going on than just a sociopath. There also seem to be psychopathy there. I’m no expert, so who really knows.
I told #2 I believed he is a predator. I did not tell him I thought he was disordered but I compared him to #1 when I was upset. He knows I know and he’s trying like all hell to hide it! This is not in my mind as he claims. He is what he is, I know the truth.
I’ve thought often about how #2 doesn’t contact on weekends! Hmm, I wonder why that is? haaa. #1 contacted ALL the time. Even when it was apparent he was out, sometimes with women I’m sure.
I seem to predict contact as well. Is it our gut? Is it the bond? My counselor encourages me that when I get the feeling “they” are around, trust it. This happens at least once a week. At least! It’s a strange feeling. If I’m outside and feel that feeling, I’ll immediately go inside and lock the doors. Paranoid? Maybe. Maybe not. I’m starting to trust my gut more. Like I’ve said before, I’d rather not play with fire, it burns.
Thistoo,
I just remembered one time we were watching a youtube astrology report and the lady was talking about sociopaths, and he got all defensive saying I called him a socio. I said no I didn’t, he’s like you made a face.
Whatever. I sure know now. I have always been interested in behaviors and psychology, and he would say you’ve been analyzing me the whole time.
He even went to like two therapy sessions, walking in all crying like a five year old. He wanted us to go to couples tnerapy. In my mind i’m like yea right.
He thinks it’s all about the giant lie and the 100 lies that accompanied it. As if that wasn’t enough. No, there were lies everyday, but yea, he probably thinks I don’t know what he is.
I like how he said today you can’t hold a grudge forever….hmm, a grudge? For what? Jk
I did tell my one friend that if my name does get brought up- or his…feel free to blast! Pleeease.
🙂
Remember,
Watching about sociopaths and he assumes…Blah, blah, blah. So easily wounded by even a facial expression! Poor men. ;'(
I was always interested in behaviors too…an empath thing? I originally pursued a career as a classical musician. I did it professionally for 7 years and after divorce pursued a special education degree and got my masters (I completed my masters program wihile with spath #1…holy hell I can’t believe I got through all of that). I work with kids who have severe behavioral needs. I love it. I’m curious to what you do…if you want to share, I respect you if you don’t want to share.
Spath #1 said he was going to therapt to deal with his crap near the end of our relationships. The stories he told! I was like, “Your therapist said that??” It was strange stuff. Now I know he was lying about going. He also said he made a vision board (I have a huge one) but he’d take it down when people came over so he wouldn’t seem like a “pussy”. Sure he did!
Couples therapy for you would have been hell on earth, guaranteed.
You and your covert revenge in you head. Bring it psycho!!! I feel like you can handle his smear. It sounds like it’d be fine. I still believe it’d hurt you like hell….or at least add fuel to the fire. I don’t know about you, but I’m over sleepless nights. Even slight comments from them can leave me sleepless….
Thistoo,
Classical musician, wow, how very cool!
My step brother is a musician.
I am a cosmotologist. 🙂 but, I had changed careers a few years back and was the registrar at a private medical college. Great learning experience. I even won Employee of the Year! That’s my big claim to fame. Haha. I did end up leaving the company and moved back to the county I always have lived in. That job was an hour away.
I am back at a salon now. I ended up going back to one I worked at for 3 years previous to the school.
My dear friend that passed away last year from the same cancer I had, she did just what you do for work. She got her masters too, I forgot what in, but she was a teacher for handicap children and over the years ones with severe mental health issues.
I only went to technical college, my sister has her masters, she is 11 years older than me. Same parents. 🙂
I’m the black sheep perhaps?
I wouldn’t say anything about him but if someone asks my friend what about that guy, she will say he is bad news. When we broke up before I truely knew, I told a mutual aquaintance he was abusive. He follows her friend on fb. Who knows…the girl he flirts with or whatever, HER friend congratulated us when we got together saying he is the sweetest guy ever. She knows him from the 90’s and didn’t date him, so the girl may get conflicting opinions.
He is not super cute. I know it doesn’t matter, but if I was out in public and didn’t know him I wouldn’t look twice.
He’s a loser.
🙂
Thistoo,
And no i’m not gonna try to do anything.
I’ve already gone extinct around town.
It’s as if I don’t even exist.
I don’t even want to drive down the highway where you can see his place. I take back roads to my mom’s. I don’t want to see because I don’t want to know. And, if I was out and stuff and gossip came to town, I can’t keep my mouth shut- not on that, so I would rather stay away!
Btw, sounds like this girl is playing with fire! She clearly doesn’t know better.
Like you, spath #1 was cute, handsome in a different kind of way. I wouldn’t have paid attention either. Now when I picture him all I can think is “gross.”
Remember,
Remember how just a few days I was trying to talk you down and help you through the sweet revenge in your head? I’ve been feeling less angry lately and suddenly it’s hit me…AGAIN….and hard!!! Here I am, even trying to plot revenge/annoyance in my head and am blank (unsucessful revenge thank GOD), yet all I keep thinking about is how I wish he, both my spaths, would get hit by a car and die. Not by my hands. I’ve never wished death on anyone. Why do they even matter to me at this point??
Maybe because I’d feel safe if they were gone? Or the hurt sucks and I’m tired of thinking about it? Or that no one else would be hurt by them again? All of the above? Grrrrrr
I’ve never experienced hate like this. I don’t hate people. I never had. Until THEM. I’m better than this!!
May be time for a little dammit doll action. DAMMIT!!!!!
Thistoo,
Yes, use that DAMMIT DOLL!!
I understand how your feeling. It seems like the anger or hate dissipates only to return again.
Today you’re at hate and today i’m at indifference.
It is annoying how they effect the brain. They rent space in it.
Do you think there will be a future time that we don’t think about them? I do hope so.
We need to get you a second doll so you have one for each.
I never hated anyone either that I can remember but boy I feel some days like I hate him, and wish him to get hit by a car also!
Are they even worth our thoughts?
That’s where I am today….
The reality that dude, you’re a duche and you don’t deserve to talk to me. You tried me!
They are the jack asses sending emails to people who don’t write back! Who does that…!
I say beat that doll and get it out!
It does work! Hooray for the DD!!!
Thistoo –
I know exactly where you are. I remember one time I had the perfect dinner waiting on the table and the sociopath didn’t show up. It was storming out and as the hour got later this golden hope welled up in my heart that maybe there was a fatal accident and I was FREE… nope. The sociopath turned up later that night reeking of hard liquor and furious that I was in bed and didn’t have a hot meal ready after the sociopath risked life and limb to get home to me in the dangerous storm. I don’t remember which punishment I received, but you can probably imagine with stunning accuracy the possibilities.
NMW,
I’m responding to your dinner post. So typical of them! I don’t miss the punishments. Or the mind games. Or their selfishness. Not one bit! Funny how when we “loved” them and were still together we had random thoughts of their demise and being free.
Despite the ongoing roller coaster of healing, we are finally FREE. We are truly blessed.
Remember,
I trust you won’t do anything. It’s ironic how I feel the need to help push you along but lack that faith in myself….
I think it’s great you’re doing a cosmetologist! I’ve had many claims to fame. Even with what I’m doing now I feel like the black sheep to my brother. I’m starting to see things in a different light these days. We can blame it on the whole inner child thing and the past being brought up through our spaths:)
I hardly think you getting a college degree and not your masters makes you a black sheep. From your words I know you don’t believe this. You are clearly aware and strong in your life. Your sister has a masters but how enlightened is she? I went to a state college for undergrad, my brother, who is 2 yrs older, told me I was a loser for not going to a University. Oh I’m sorry, I worked a full time job at 18 while in college, paid for my own apartment and graduated with almost a 4.0. That’s right, loser move right there!
I’m glad you can identify with my work. It’s a wild ride! Your friend sounds like she was a wonderful person and special to you. I’m sorry for your loss.
Thistoo,
4.0 woo hoo!
Smarty pants. Jk
The inner child stuff is interesting.
The funny thing here is, that I thought I had it figured out. Life, that is, that I was so enlightened…hahaaaa…not done yet!
We have to heal that past to really evolve to the next level.
I just keep thinking as I go through each day, how peaceful it is now. You, me, all of us must remember how calm and peaceful our environment is now.
No more hurricane force winds.
Oh that girl, I have no idea if she has taken the bait. Who cares. He’s probably back to the 1st ex and her BMW that she can’t afford even while working in a club! Hahaaaaaaa.
Have fun people!!
They are all blood sucking ego maniacs. I get it, and i’m out. It’s not the real me.
I chose light.
I chose God.
Remember,
“I chose light.
I chose God.”
I’m with you, sister!
I also felt enlightened. I’ve been through so much in my life. So much trauma. I’ve worked hard on so many issues, intentionally, so I’d be in a good place. I suppose in retrospect I am, because I’m somehow embracing this all. If that makes sense. Not that I agree what I’ve endured. Acceptance I suppose, knowing growth is on it’s way. I suspect this is a life long process for us. We are around the same age, still young. Ahead of our game. I’d rather go through this now and know there’s a positive future ahead. At least I pray to God there is one in store. We deserve the best.
I’m assuming your ex will always maintain a relationship with his bad ex. While pursuing and being in relationships. Like attracts life after all!
I’m headed to bed. So happy you’ve come into my life, Remember. Keep keeping on! You’re headed in the right direction. I have to tell myself I am too….
Thistoo,
So….
I saw the a new psychiatrist today after years since I last saw one, and I got a diagnosis alright!
Hmph.
I thought it would be Ptsd or ADD or what I was told years ago, GAD… but he said bipolar! I asked him is there a spectrum, severe to mild? He said mild.
Wow. But my mom is, so it’s expected, though I think she has something else too.
So he just added one med. Lowest dose.
We’ll see how it goes. I don’t drink or do drugs so that’s good. I don’t know though when I have been in a manic episode, not like the things I read so, maybe mine were so mild I couldn’t tell.
After the socio is when I got severely depressed. I Hadn’t got depressed like that before ever.
Oh well…. at least i’ll be medicated and not running the streets with the psychos!
Remember,
Whoa”.That is some news! How are you handling your unexpected diagnosis? Sorry it’s taken me so long to respond!
When I was 20 I was diagnosed with PTSD and bipolar II (I was a rapid cycler). I always felt “different” and felt at peace with the labels so I could finally understand and move forward in my life. 7 years ago I became very sick and after months of hospital visits I was finally diagnosed with celiac disease. Autoimmune disease and all, my body had pretty much shut down at that point. Long story short, I went gluten free and stopped cycling! I may have some bad days, some depression from my spaths (PTSD), but no more all over the place! I have the same psychiatrist to this day. 2 years ago he told me he’s never seen this happen and there aren’t enough studies to show that diet can have this kind of effect. He pulled my bipolar diagnosis.
Looking back, when I suffered severe depression it was PTSD related. PTSD and bipolar can have similar effects and symptoms. It might be worthwhile to do some studying online.
You say your new psych says you are mild bipolar. Not to mention you never got as depressed before as you did with your spath. You’ve had a lot of traumatic experiences. I’m wondering if a second opinion is in order? As you know, after having cancer, second opinions are worth it. If only to make certain that you know exactly what’s going on so you can move forward. Just saying, it might be worth your time. This is a label that will be carried with you forever.
Yes, your mom was diagnosed bipolar. Yes, it runs in families, but”.
Meds can be a lifesaver. Pay attention to how you’re feeling. It can be a roller coaster of a ride finding the right fit!
Thistoo,
Hi! Thanks for your response! I got my dammit doll today btw. 🙂
Sorry you got so sick and ended up with celiac disease. A gastro tested me for that a few years back. So glad you fixed all that and feel human again! Being sick sucks.
So, I like you, feel good having a label for it so I can do what I need to do to feel good.
My friend said get a second opinion, my boss said no your not, a co-worker said you don’t strike me like that. My mom says YES, and my ex non-abuser (angel) says Yes. Lol.
The psych didn’t lean towards pstd in my opinion, I told him how after cancer I was hypervigilant for like 5 years, he made me explain. I said paraniod over anything on my skin, and anything I did I thought the cancer would come back.
I told him how I always over think and obsess and anxiety always. He wasn’t too moved by spath lol, he said love-bombing? Haha I explained.
I said he stalked me!!!
I think if I am, it’s mild and I may have had mild manic episodes, nothing like i’ve seen or read. If I think about it now, I feel like being with the path I was manic-light with him because it was soo intense, and fast, and tumultuous.
Then I got the severe depression.
Also, I had a meltdown on the way there because I wrote one number off on the directions and I couldn’t find it and they weren’t answering and I was a half hour late and I waited 3 weeks to get in! I told him.
He said because I spoke from one thing to the next, and my mom, so he slapped me with BP.
I’m going to try the med before bed tonight and see how it goes. I suppose a second opinion can’t hurt.
I read how ADD and bipolar look alike too.
Now I have new material to read!!!!
Hahaà a
I’m glad I can share this stuff with you. I figured people here won’t judge!!!
🙂
Remember,
No judging on my end! 🙂
Bipolar is a life long thing. Do you remember if you cycled as a child? I would think you would know if you’ve been up and down your whole life, even if mild. If you cycled through cancer and the aftermath, and during your spath and the aftermath, that’s different. Not to mention your mother’s aftermath. I’m no doctor but it does sound like you’re questioning it. Maybe look at ADD/PTSD combined while doing your research? You may be bipolar but being educated helps in moving forward. As we all know too well with our research on spaths!
Bipolar made sense to me because I had cycled my whole like. I was also traumatized at the age of 5 throughout my entire childhood, so there’s that!
When/if you decided to get a 2nd opinion, it might be helpful to write a list to take in (episodes in your life, specific experiences/events, symptoms, etc). When I was going through my ordeal with celiac it helped to have lists. It was more concrete and helped me to sound sane. I knew the docs didn’t believe me that I was as sick as I was. Having a list helped in the end.
I love that you have opinions from all these people and their reactions. So funny! Remember to trust in you, your gut and how you feel. xxxxx
Thistoo,
Thank you Thank you!
I brought a list but didn’t get to read it to him. Lol.
I think it is possible to have cycled during my life but mildly, not severe mania, but yes.
I was mad and would freak out on a boyfriend that had another girlfriend the WHOLE time! I did make stupid decisions I would say and I would have anxiety and depression. I think it’s possible.
I don’t think some drs. consider cancer dx traumatizing, but they are starting to I believe. He was more concerned about chilhood abuse traumas.
Either way, i’ll be good. If anything good came from P-boy, it was causing me to figure out ME!
xxx
And Remember, sooo happy you got your dammit doll today. You’re going to love it!!! 🙂
Remember,
You have a great attitude! It almost seems like nothing can bring us down at this point! Thank you survival of our spaths!!
It definitely is a possibility that you’re bipolar. Just want to make sure you’re looking at it from all angles. Sounds like you are! 🙂 My diagnosis and then undiagnosis makes me a bit skepitcal. Hahaha…. Working with special needs kids I sometimes question diagnosis. Our spaths on the other hand!!!!
You made a list, you’re checking it twice. You’re realizing the crap you’ve had to endure and moving forward. You are AMAZING!!!
Thistoo,
YOU are amazing!
In my mind I imagine you like my friend that passed that taught severly handicapped kids.
I met her at the cancer hospital in 04, so it was similar to meeting in a support group!
I’ve been thinking back to childhood and teen years and I was moody and ocd, or atleast obsessive, and anxiety and depression, so i’m going with it!
Lol.I found myself thinking hmm, maybe P was bipolar and he just needs meds. NO!! Run the tape!
I hope you are doing good, keeping your wits about you- of course you are!
One day, one moment at a time…
I do love the dammit doll! Wish I had it yesterday. Lol.
We are survivors!
We have something they never will. Light.
🙂
Remember,
So wait! You have your dammit doll in your possession already?! I thought you had just ordered it! Hahaha. Creepy cute little thing, isn’t it?
I feel honored you make me think of your friend. She sounds like she was a wonderful support to you and a good person. Thank you.
Again, you may be bipolar. I’m not trying to convince you you’re not, I don’t know. I think it’d be good to keep in mind your mom has been a BIG source of chaos in your life. You said you grew up living with your dad, right? At what age? How close were you with your mom at the time? Sounds like you’re still close with her and that’s all good. If you know how to distance yourself when need be. I know you’re just now coming to terms with it all. And we knew it all!! Damn inner child. I’m starting to love mine!
That F’in tape! Keep it running!!!! I’ve been doing so good the past couple of days. Until I was unloading/loading my dishwasher tonight and BAM! Then I started thinking about this site and others kind words and support. Your words. Thank you for helping to keep me strong!!
Thistoo,
Yaay that you are starting to like your inner child! Yes, stay strong, you are strong, you are a fighter!
My mom left when I was 6ish, she got with my step dad then and they are still together. He is def co dependent. Whew. I would go be with her on weekends and such but I usually wanted to hang out with my friends by my house. I do keep a safe distance from her, and she’s bern doing shitty abandoning type things to me my whole life. I just figured she’s my mom so I gotta love her. Maybe it was the idea of a mom! My sis is 11 yrs older and she grew up with her and as an adult there was a period where she did not talk to my mom for years!!
But yes, now i’m coming to terms with it all! No denial. Veil has been lifted. I was drilling her this morning (mom) about her childhood. Lol
My dammit doll totally arrived already! It’s cute!!
Ok, have a good night. Support is only a click away!!!!
Remember,
One day at a time! I also opened up quickly. Too quick to trust. I will take more time in the future with “strangers”. I’m sorry yours preyed on you as well. They sense weakness! With #1, I was strong. The strongest I’d ever been. I was HAPPY. Him knowing so much about me, mutual friends and stalking me prior probably didn’t help!!
To be honest, even though we had so many mutual friends (ex friends for me now) I didn’t really know him or much about his dating life. He lied so much. He once had a gf for 4 years that was an out of control cocaine addict and forced him to do group sex. So basically he did that, not her. His gf before me he was also with for 4 years. When they were together she moved out of the country for a year to teach. He encouraged her to go but was sooo hurt when she did go. They were still together and he admitted he started living a double life. He lived a double life for a year and was caught after she returned. I think he admitted it to me because we knew too many of the same people. He put this bomb on me, it sucked. Of course he would never do something like that again! I contacted her when I discovered him. I asked her to be confidential so that she would feel comfortable talking to me. She said to trust my intuition but thought it was strange I was contacting her (fair enough). He ended up contacting her and she told him! A man that she knows led a double life, led her to drinking and severe depression (I knew people who knew her) and she still she’s caught up in him. We know all too well”.
I know about his revenge on people from the past. I know about crimes and the dirty people he knows. He robbed a bank once (I believe him) and loved guns the power/fear they could instill. He loved the fear he could install in me with constant talk of he unregistered gun (subtle threats). As for him stalking others, no clue. Other than my experiences with his stalking. He’s terrifying. I’m not sure there will come a day I don’t think he will at some point try to kill me.
In some ways I’m actually more scared of #2 right now. He’s skilled. He’s so covert and has everyone convinced. He is friendly, seems kinds, volunteers, blah, blah, blah. He told me ways he would stalk me, that he had 100s of email address to weed out spam and keep accounts separate, and joked that he followed me on fb and knew when I was single again because some things were public (again, we dated for 3 months before #1). I believe he stalked my friends when we were together and I believe he poisoned his ex wife’s dog (we were together at the time), long story”. But he’s been leaving me alone. I’m uncertain about it. I feel like he’s trying to prove something. I am extremely grateful for his absence. I “feel” like someone’s around sometimes, like I’ve stated before, but I don’t know if it’s #1 or him. It’s all such a shit show.
I’ve told friends, family and my counselor to look at both men if something happens to me. Wouldn’t be hard for #2 to pin stuff on #1. Or vice versa for all I know. GOOD LORD I must sound like a crazy person!
I like your outlook, Remember”they will get old and tired. They will run out of supply. They will shrivel up and alone. I just hate to think of all the people who suffer in the long run. I find myself saying that spath #1’s gf has saved me right now. We can say the other women deserve it even though they may not see yet. But we didn’t deserve it and look where we are.
Remember, and others who have been ‘diagnosed’ with something,
Mental and emotional disorders such as bipolar can mimic the symptoms of PTSD, which is a normal response to being treated abnormally (abused, traumatized, etc.). Mental health professionals who are not familiar with sociopath abuse may mistake the normal emotional aftermath as a disorder. A survivor may be bipolar, but it’s worth considering if the emotional symptoms are due to PTSD, rather than a disorder.
Sandra Brown explains it here: http://saferelationshipsmagazine.com/when-your-symptoms-look-like-something-else-2
When Your Symptoms Look Like Something Else
By Sandra L. Brown, MA
Women tell me their therapists have diagnosed them with a variety of diagnoses, which has made them not only confused, but often ANGRY! They have been diagnosed, for instance, with disorders like bipolar disorder, borderline personality disorder, paranoia, and other not-so-fun labels.
Most therapists are undertrained in recognizing and treating the aftermath symptoms in victims of Pathological Love Relationships. The reason you are being diagnosed with various disorders is because your symptoms are similar to those various disorders—they are mimicking true mental-health symptoms.
For instance, when your moods are swinging all over the place and you are depressed and anxious, you look bipolar. When you are cranky, highly reactive and want vengeance you look borderline. When you are scared about what he will do next, fear you’re being followed, or afraid he is spying on you so he can accuse you of something, you look paranoid. When you think things are happening that you can’t prove to other people, you look delusional.
The issue is, these are ALL normal reactions to coercion and Stockholm Syndrome, similar to those found in prisoners of war—in other words, aftermath of a Pathological
Love Relationship. In THAT context, your symptoms make perfect sense! You were coerced, your mind was played with, you felt stuck and held in a pathological relationship against your own spiritual will. You feared that your emotional and physical existence were in jeopardy. And the pathological DOES do things he never gets caught for but that you can’t prove.
In Pathological Love Relationships, women emerge with signs of PTSD, Stockholm Syndrome, and coercion. Unfortunately, not all therapists understand the overlap between PTSD, Stockholm Syndrome and coercion—which is why you are often misdiagnosed. A lot of this is discussed in my book, Women Who Love Psychopaths, in which I talk about the pathological worldview and how women acquire the pathological’s view of the world and how that entraps them in the relationship.
The symptoms of coercion are:
• Isolation: The individual is deprived of social support, effectively rendering her unable to resist. This makes the individual become dependent upon her interrogator/captor. The victim then develops an intense concern with self.
• Monopolization of Perception: The captor fixes his attention upon immediate predicament; fosters introspection in the victim; eliminates outside competing stimuli with the captor, so the victim can only focus on him, and frustrates all actions not consistent with her compliance to him.
(In the mid-relationship dynamics in the book, all of this is discussed. Your Super Traits are very high in what we call relationship investment and cooperation which means you are highly cooperative because you get so much enjoyment out of your relationships that you will ‘bend over backwards’ to make things work. The book discusses when the mid-relationships ‘shift’ and what happens to the women’s perspective.)
• Induced Debility and Exhaustion: People subjected to this type of abuse become worn out by tension, fear and continual rushing about in an effort to meet their abuser’s standards. They must often avoid displays of fear, sorrow or rage, since these may result in ridicule or punishment. Rigid demands and requirements make the exhaustion and ability to resist even worse.
• Occasional Indulgences: Serve to provide motivation to her for compliance.
• Devaluing the Individual: Creates in her a fear of freedom and dependence upon him, creates feelings of helplessness, develops lack of faith in her individual capabilities.
The symptoms of Stockholm Syndrome are:
• Perceived threat to one’s physical or psychological survival, and the belief that the captor would carry out the threat.
• Perceived small kindnesses from the captor to the captive.
• Perceived inability to escape.
• Isolation from perspectives other than those of the captor.
When you look at it as a mixture of PTSD, Stockholm Syndrome and coercion, your symptoms make perfect sense… at least to me! While that doesn’t mean you can’t also have bipolar or other disorders—it’s too early to know. Very often many of the symptoms of other disorders fall by the wayside when effective and appropriate treatment is begun. Many of the women do, however, meet the criteria for PTSD. PTSD is most associated with war vets (and yes, you too lived through a war!) and trauma victims (yes, you were traumatized!). To that end, you probably do have a disorder, but it is related to PTSD or other acute stress disorders.
Be hopeful that the symptoms you live with may not always be as problematic as they are in your life today. There is hope and healing available!
Anettepk,
Thank you! That is great info! This was my 1st visit with this Dr. It Was hard to find one that takes my ins. So it’s definitely hard to find who is good at dealing with this stuff, however, I will try and carefully select a new therapist who works with this type of thing.
I think that will be a good next step moving forward and see how it unfolds.
🙂
Thistoo,
Why did that girl feel it was strange that you were contacting her? She knew he lived a double life right? Me and you could almost have that same part of the story except I got off fb, and didn’t ask the girl that I SHOULD have. She was that 1st ex and would proably have covered for him. I now see why he completely shut me down ANY time I brought her up, because that I could have EASILY found out.
I say stay low, stay no contact, and hopefully they will fade away. Tire out. Grey rock all the way!
Remember,
Thanks for you for being here for me and for reading my ranting posts yesterday (my last one was so long…). I was definitely having a moment(s) and needed to get it all out! I’m feeling so much better today and so many more days than I used to. My mad moments (not even full days at this point) hit me so hard lately. It’s frustrating. Maybe because I’m starting to see the bright side of days and want them to last?
Not sure why his ex reacted the way she did. I imagine there relationship even worse than he protrayed. She’s clearly somehow still in his grasp. From the sound of your spaths ex she would have been validating. Regardless, we know the truth. We have decided to work our way out of their holds. We are fighters!
Remember,
I got in early to see my doc and get checked for STDs. I’m scared. The labs should come back in a couple of days. I was told no news is good news. Fingers crossed!
I noticed you’ve been off here for a few days. No need to get back to me if you’re taking a step back. Just need to get this off my chest.
Plain and simple, this just sucks. Going through this stuff and our bodies being at risk because of such LIARS!!! Liars we trusted…..
Remember,
I attempted my DD. It was a weak attempt. Pathetic. I didn’t have the energy. So I used my foam roller on my back instead. These ups and downs have me stressed. I like the days I’m indifferent. It gives me a glimpse of what life can be like. Add happiness and life would be grand!
I never really got through the emotional process with #1 because #2 preyed on me while I was beginning to heal and sucked me dry. Now I’m dealing with both.
In the beginning of the book “Psychopath Free” the author there’s a chapter “Beware of the Vultures.” It reads:
Vultures often seem exceptionally kind and warm. They want to fix you and absorb your problems. They are fascinated by your struggles. But sooner than later you will find yourself lost in another nightmare. They begin drowning you in unsolicited advice. They need constant praise and attention. You are never allowed to disagree with them. They feed off drama and an insatiable need to be appreciated by others. You will find that they lash out as you become happier. They perceive your progress as a threat to their control. They want to keep you in a perpetual state of co-dependency. They do not want you to seek help from anyone except them.
This was my first AHA moment, Remember. I sent this to my now ex best friend. She said no way that was him and I should think about it for a week and if it sticks, maybe. It still stood true. A little over a week later and in reading a different book, I KNEW.
How did I allow this to happen? I was down and out. He preyed on my weaknesses. He helped me through the worst of the stalking, so I thought. Really, he was damaging me along the way to get what he wanted. My life, my being and control.
A dammit doll for both. Not a bad idea!
What I wonder….if our spaths actually did die, would the bond finally be broken or would it cause us more pain?
Thistoo,
Wow, that is a great paragraph.
It is exactly true.
That sucks you got a double whammy, but you were vulnerable. You were not your usual spiritual health.
I was depressed when he got me too. I have somewhere our first weeks messages to each other and I shake my head at myself when I read how open and sharing I was with a stranger. Mutual aquaintence.
I see that is something we can’t do anymore. Be so nice and open. Sad huh, but maybe not once we accept that there is evil and we must be on guard.
I thought about it before, if he died, I tried to imagine it. It would probably seem like they were still alive in our minds.
I think I would rather them live and suffer, running around ragged looking for supply and getting old and desperate. They will get old, and they will tire. I know mine is going to die a lonely death. His parents are gone, and he hates his other relatives. Maybe his kids will be around by then. Maybe.
I’m sorry you are so tired from it all. Two is too much.
Just gotta put one foot in front of the other, and rest when you’re tired and eat when your hungry.
All we gotta do today is Thank God, and go to work.
#1 scares me a bit. Do you know anything about his past? Any other women he has stalked?
Annette,
There was nowhere to reply to your response to Remember’s post so I’m commenting here. Thank you for sharing that valuable information. It is too common that women in our situation are misdiagnosed, especially under the extreme circumstances that we face. I know from experience misdiagnosis due to trauma (and other factors). Many psychiatrists come from a good place, but if they are ignorant to situations like this it can be harmful to us. Thank you for spreading the word and for your confirmation!
Again Remember, maybe you are bipolar, maybe not. I’d air on the side of caution and am glad you’re going to try and seek out a therapist with experience in this type of abuse.
Thistoo,
Back atcha!
I feel like yours will fade away. Let’s hope they have some shiny new toy to play with. Barf…..
I must say, the P said his ex, (another ex) died in a crash while he was working out of town. There was ANOTHER cancer story attached to her- he has a thing with cancer stories, go figure I really had it, and that they lived together, that her parents didn’t like him, and that after she died he never went back to the house to get his things or go to the funeral.
Anyways a few weeks ago, I looked up for this county the fatality car crashes for the holiday weekend he said it happened. I looked for that year and the one before and after it. The names didn’t show but you could still check details. Nothing resembled it.
I don’t know her last name. Doesn’t matter, but I feel like she maybe overdosed or something. I don’t think she crashed. When I asked certain things about it he cut me off and diverted the convo.
Maybe he killed her, or had something to do with it or he was there.
Or maybe she is alive in the witness protection program under a new identity!
How the hell do we get mixed up with these sickos.?
Thistoo,
And yay yay yay you’re feeling better today!
Funny how it comes and goes.
We are healing!
No contact.
Fade away.
They don’t deserve our attention.
🙂
Remember,
I think it’s interesting he had a thing with cancer…you were perfect prey! I feel like that’s even worse then spath #2’s thing with abused/stalked women. It’s just wrong, on so many levels.
Is there a possibility he made the one who died in a crash up? Sympathy play? If she does exist (seems like you know she did or is), it’s definitely a possibility she had to get away. He sounds dangerous.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they’ve committed murder without anyone knowing. Look at all the stories on here, there’s a common them of people they know suddenly dying….
I’m concerned for you. Protect yourself. Do you have a safety plan in place?
Remember,
Please know I’m not meaning to scare you or project. I just want to make sure you stay safe. From all that you’ve said, he’s a threat.
Thistoo,
So there are stories about people that dated the p’s dying on here?
My co-worker had a relationship with a p (both men) and got stalked. I didn’t find out until later. He still stalks him and drives by our job. My co-worker said the two people he dated before him died!
My ex could have made the whole thing up, but I feel like she did exist. Who knows. He makes everything up!!!! His mom supposedly did die of cancer and his step dad…those two stories I believed, but there were three more cancer stories that I do NOT believe are true!
So imagine how I bonded with him at first over empathizing over his mom and dad’s cancer!!
I am not afraid of him anymore.
He doesn’t like any athority and I told him if he ever came around me I would call the police.
Guess what? His female cousin lives right across from me.
She moved in after….
hmm… I wonder if he told her to check out these apartments! Never thought about that!
I thought it was just a coincidence!
Remember,
Like I’ve said before, I don’t believe in many coincidences these days. With spath #1, I chalked up a lot to coincidences to only find out most were causes of him. With your ex’s cousin, who knows… I don’t put anything past them though. Even if his cousin thought that she incidentally found a place, he could have suggested it. It could be coincidence. How small is the town you live in? To tell you the truth, I’ve been concerned of this exact same thing. But again, I’m paranoid as hell, as we know. I look at all angles and consider the possibilities. This has benefited me, however I may not be the best resource!
I’ve been on this site under a few names now, for almost a year. I posted a lot at first and then just did a lot of reading to stay safe, until lately. I read a lot on this site and started noticing stories that people died. Parents, friends, ex lovers of the spaths. In their sleep, car accidents, sudden death. Makes me wonder”.
I still think the cancer thing is curious. Part of his charm was finding a connection with you. So if you look at it from that end, he claimed he knew 5 different people who died of cancer. As we know (and you all too well) deaths caused by cancer are prevalent. Yes, cancer reaches many people we know. Yet many people we know with cancer have survived. I’m sure you’ve known many people lost to cancer because of your situation. How likely is it for a man in your life to lose so many because of cancer? I’m sure it happens, but I question him, as you do.
Thistoo,
Two died, the parents, but the one a car crash.
The other two are living. His sister who doesn’t have it, I saw her, and his childs mother that he couldn’t provide me with details!
Yea, he could have suggested to his cousin this place.
Funny thing though, he kept me from her and avoided her when he was here. His sister too, she came knocking while at the cousins house, and he shoed her away.
He had too much to hide from me.
After he returned the car to the chick, he sold his crappy car months later, so if he did ever drive by I wouldn’t know what car to look for.
Anyways, nothing has escalated and he doesn’t want cops. He doesn’t like men but he only assults women I believe.
My neighbors all watch out here and he knows that too. They know about him.
Other then that, I can shank him, and call 911.
Btw, the cousin is ghetto and his family. He obviously is too, but hides it. That is his m.o.
For work or other purposes.
He plays it well.
Ok, that’s all for the loser today!
Have a good night!
🙂
Thank you, and thank everyone here!
Thistoo,
Hi! I read your post the other night and when I tried to reply I got an error report.
You may have your results by now.
I have my fingers crossed!
I think you are going to be good!
Ugggh. What a way we have had to learn our lessons huh?.
I hope you are trucking along peacefully. Not too much in the head. I think I am getting along better…not too much thinking, I don’t obsess anymore in my head. Lol.
Remember,
I’m STD free!!! I go back in 6 months for another HIV test just to make sure. I’m feeling soo relieved!
Bet you feel so much better not obsessing so much! I’m still up and down. Getting tested Monday definitely threw me for a loop. I’m finding I’m not obsessing as much and have moments that I live in rather than thinking about it all so much. My spaths are no longer invited (in my mind) to work or certain social events. It’s working! I have the hardest times when I’m tired and at home with too many thoughts.
Thanks for being here for me. 🙂
Thistoo,
Yippeee!!!
Congratulations!
I had a good feeling you would be fine!
I got tested in Sept. but I wat to test again. They have free testing here with rapid results, big city, so I may pop in there instead of a whole doctors appointment.
Yaaaaay!
Yea, the thoughts are becoming less I think, or no emotions attached so much.
I did think of regret earlier tonight, then googled some info, then it went away.
I like how it passes, the wave of thoughts.
Progress.
🙂
Although I wish I would have called the cops on him for domestic violence. What the hell was I thinking?
That this was a game?
Maybe the next girl will.
Here’s hoping!
Thistoo”
CONGRATS on the all clear! Yippee! Yay! I’m doing a little happy dance for you!
I am wondering if I should get tested. During the discard the sociopath indirectly accused me of having STDs by gloating about getting tested and coming out with a clean bill of health. One small statement, out of the blue and completely irrelevant to the rant at the time. It bothers me.
No More Wool,
There isn’t really any downside to getting tested, and the peace of mind could be a great benefit. Local health depts offer free testing, and some insurances will pay for it at a private MD.
Thanks, Remember! It was because of one of our conversations that I decided to make the move and finally do it! I also considered the free clinic. I was surprised I got in as soon as I did. It can sometimes take months. Getting tested Monday was hard for me. It brought up a lot of emotions I wasn’t expecting. I was too scared to get tested after #1 and #2 didn’t seem to care either way (surpirse there!). I was expecting the worst and hoping for the best, Yay for me! They put us in so much danger emotionally and physically.
You didn’t turn your ex in for domestic violence at the time because of the state he put you in. Is it still possible to file? I totally understand if you don’t want to go that route at this point. I wish I would’ve filed for a restraining order on #1 when I had the chance before he became so covert. I was getting death threats and too scared.
I have to have faith that they will finally get what they deserve. I just hope no one gets seriously hurt in the process! It makes me sad to even think about it.
NMW,
Annette is right. There is really no down side and I must admit the peace of mind is worth it. To know either way. I had been sitting on it for so long. It bothered me often. I had to do it in my own time though, when I was ready. For all of us I think it’s important for us to do things now on our own time.
If my ex had suggested I may have an STD that would bother me, too! Was he projecting or just playing with your mind? Who knows! Either way, if you take that step it may be one thing to check off that you don’t have to worry about while healing.
HanaleiMoon,
Thank you for your happy dance! I love the support on this site. Through bad times and good news… 🙂
I appreciate you!! Thank you to all my friends on here for lifting me up and helping me heal!!!
Remember
My lawyer told me that. “No more emotions, just business .” For 20 long years my husband built his power and control on my emotions. My tears fed his ego. 24/7. He enjoyed my pain, my heartache , my weaknesses and my faults. It built his “case ” against me. His case to make me think I was crazy. For me to blunt myself, for my son to think that his father is the victim. It was a slow crazy making. Thinking back now he started that many years ago. Only did he underestimate me. I was much stronger, much more resilient than he knew. And I will not let my life with him define me as a person. He is the only one to blame for his actions. He is the only one who destroyed this marriage. But he did not destroy me or my faith. Just the opposite happened. I did not fight for him , I let him go and be the pervert he always was and always will be.
Kaya, 20 years is so long, I still don’t get the loong marriages and families they have. It’s the disease of shelfishness I guess, just like any addictions…
My ex would have continued with me (well pretending), but it became obvious that it would have to be on his terms, and I would have to accept his behaviors. I just couldn’t do it. In just less than a year he ripped me to pieces, like a hurricane that blew through my place…but on the outside he appeared so calm like the calm before the storm. I have no doubt that you are a warrior. We’re all being called to our souls purpose. To remember our authentic self. To heal.
AMEN! A warrior indeed. Kaya, you are such an inspiration to us all! I’ve been following your story for nearly a year and I can’t even begin to tell you how grateful I am for your strength, past, words of wisdom and faith. THANK YOU.
This too shall pass
Thank you so much for your kind words. Believe me I had my bad days , but one thing that always kept me going was Hope.
“When you pass through the waters; I will be with you; and when you pass through the rivers ; they will not sweep over you .” Isaiah 43:2
I filled notebooks with my thoughts; scripture and hope. I always knew that I would survive. After the discard I prated to God for my husband to return home. He did not answer my prayer, he had his reasons. Instead he gave me much much more than I ever asked for . He gave me my freedom and my new life.
Sometimes our prayers are not answered the way we want. We cannot ever think that God won’t work it out for the good. Because God will work out according to his plan.
“God is the only one who can make the valley of trouble a door of hope.” Hosea 2:15
Living a better life, having my sanity , being in control is my victory now.
My ex is still whining in notes to his son about the lost relationship. You know what my son says ” I love my mother and whoever inflicts such pain and heartache and hardship on her, does not exist anymore.” He is 20 years old and nothing like his father. He is wise young men who will do things much different.
I have no pity for my ex husband , I don’t hate him, he is NOTHING to me. And will never set a foot in my life again.
I am glad I can be an inspiration here. I truly believe that this trial made me stronger in my faith. And that was also Gods plan.
Kaya,
It is truly a blessing that your son turned out good, on your side, not your ex’s. Better/good genes! You had an inner strength, I believe I do as well, as so many of us on this site, which is why we are reaching out!
I sought therapy for abuse/PSTD for many years because of what I dealt with as a child. My first therapist I had for a decade. I stopped seeing her when I was 23. Near the end of our sessions together she told me that as a child at 5 years old God had given me a gift of inner strength, resilience and introspection. Over the 10 years i saw her, I never knew she believed in God until then. At the time I didn’t believe in God, although I was spiritual. I found God through personal meditation at the age of 33.
Ironically, as I was with spath #2 and began reading books I bought about abuse/sociopaths/pshycos, I had also bought a new daily affirmation book. I get a new one every year. The affirmation book I bought is called “Words That Heal”. The first affirmation I picked in the book was “Let go and let God.” I called out for healing and to release my burdens of #1. Just so happens that same day, as I was reading about sociopaths and abuse to understand #1, I realized that #2 was a spath as well.
My counselor says that even though I had done so many searches on #1 and if I had read books even a couple months earlier, I may not have been ready to see the signs. I believe when I started my let go and let God affirmation that day it saved me.
Kaya, I got my years wrong in my last post, not that it matters. I started seein my therapist for a decade from 19-29. I did find God at 33. Just felt I needed to share that. I think I need to share because I went to therapy on my own accord. My parents didn’t approve at the time. My parents didn’t believe in therapy. Seeing how I’ve improved over the years, they see the benefits of therapy differntly now…
Kaya,
You remind me of a good friend of mine. She is enlightened at the age of 59. She imresses me. She bares no will ill or hate. I hope to be where you are someday. I absolutely love that you have no pity or hate for your ex. I know all of our paths are different and the time of healing varies. How long did it take you to get to this place?
During my healing, I am now encountering so many other issues of my past. Issues I thought I had tackled. I’d like to believe I’m headed the right direction. I’m letting myself feel. I just feel so stuck sometimes. I want to get to a new place faster! Patience and acceptance…those are other things I need to work on! 🙂
This too shall pass
It took me about 2 years to get where I am at now. The first 3 months after the discard were kind of “foggy” to me now. That is when I still wanted him back, when I still was addicted , when I was still in the crazy making stage. After I filed for divorce after the 3 months, went no contact, that is when I finally accepted everything. That my marriage was a lie, that it was him and not me, who was “mentally insane.” Over the months after I filed and went through divorce proceedings I found out so much through disclosures of financial documents and employment files, which my lawyer subpoenaed. Until then I blamed myself in the back of my head. Then I had the proof of cruises, lavish dinners, shopping sprees, tattoos (LOL), sex toy purchases and so on. I now knew while I was crying he was not sad, depressed….no, he was living it up. Spending his entire paycheck on the minions and cutting his son and I off financially. I now knew his priorities, his selfishness….I accepted his evilness.
And that is when I decided by divorcing him I will block him for the rest of my life, because he is Satan’s helper.
You will get to this point eventually…it was a difficult, painful road but now I can look back and say I did it…and honestly I could have not done it without this awesome lawyer, without the financial help of my mother, without the spiritual help of my church and friends, without an awesome, understanding boss, without great co-workers who always listened, without the love and support of my son, without this website here. The grace that God gave me, the strength and hope, is so amazing…sometimes I am just in awe what God has done for me.
Hi everyone. I apologize that I cannot remember who wrote it, but someone posted recently that this recent experience has brought up things from her past that she thought she had dealt with but apparently had not. I wanted to say…ME TOO! I didn’t even REALIZE there were childhood issues until my therapy appointment last week. And I didn’t realize that my first husband was also a spath, wanting threesomes and swaps and everything revolved around his member….this is all new information within the past 3 weeks. My children couldn’t be protected by me because I didn’t know HOW….as I was not protected and my own mother scared me! Everything I believed about myself and my life has come up as inaccurate…all within the last 2-3 weeks! I never wanted to rock the boat with my current husband, who loves me but is a controller….and these realizations have changed things with him and made him even MORE controlling. I have been reading that if people don’t like the changes in us, then that means we are on the right path! But it is much to absorb….that I am not the person I thought I was for 63 years. And I am angry…so very angry! At my parents for not preparing me, at my first husband for abusing me, at my children for blaming me, and at God for allowing it all to happen! I don’t know who I am anymore. And last night, on top of everything, I dreamed of my spath. I still retain about 1% belief that maybe she is a changed person, like she tells me. But I also realized last night that it just doesn’t matter! It doesn’t matter if she is a changed person (which she probably is NOT…); it doesn’t matter if she has 99% bad and 1% good…..it’s too late. It’s too late for anything with me. I created a rule which would automatically delete any email messages from her, but a wise person on this site suggested that I NOT delete them because I may need them as a paper trail. So I erased the rule, and got another “I love you” email this morning. But for the first time in forever….getting the message has not ruined my day and my stability. I am moving them to my “save for later” folder, in case I need them for court, and going on with my day.
I love to hear about those of us who have finally moved on, after a period of time. I long for that. And today, for the first time, I had a sense of peace about her emails that I have not had up until now. So I see the progress. But what I want to ask is about the anger. How does one deal with the anger of the realization of the betrayals, and the lack of preparation that could have saved us from this hell? People are telling me to just move on….even my priest at church this morning….said to just move on. How does one just “move on?” It is made to sound so simple, but it is not simple. How do we do it?
neveragin,
“Just move on…” This is a common response from people who don’t understand. I’ve found it best to avoid talking about my situation to people who have that opinion while I’m going through the healing process. Not that I cut those people out completely. Comments like those make me feel so much worse. They are invalidating and ultimately not “safe” for us during this healing process. As for the anger and getting past it, I’ve found that kaya48 and AnettePK are very helpful resources when it comes to moving forward.
Remembertoforget and I have been talking about our pasts being brought up. I thought I had done so much work on my past, only to find so many things popping up and just within the past few weeks, like you. I’m seeing things now about my ex husband that I didn’t realize before. I’m seeing things in my childhood I didn’t recognize before. I am able to see that men I’ve dated who I thought were bad, were actually disorded. Basically, I’m discovering that I was surrounded by people I thought I trusted and they were actually very harmful to me.
I’ve been following your story since you’ve been on here and I am so happy that you are in a stronger place! And you are spot on, “It doesn’t matter if she is a changed person (which she probably is NOT”); it doesn’t matter if she has 99% bad and 1% good”..it’s too late. It’s too late for anything with me”!!! I feel I’m in that place too, although I STILL want to contact him sometimes. It’s so frustrating but I make an effort to be kind to myself about still wanting to break NC sometimes, even knowing what a monster he is and that he doesn’t stand a chance with me. That’s wonderful you got an email from her this morning and it hasn’t stopped you, instead you are going on with your day! Yay!! 🙂
As for your husband, have your realizations made or husband more contolling or is there a chance you’re just more aware of his controlling behaviors? If he in fact is more controlling now, you do not make someone become anything, i.e. “these realizations have changed things with him and made him even MORE controlling.” He’s responsible for his own reactions. His controlling issue is about him, not you. My ex used to say that I pushed him to snap, yell at me and say mean things. I didn’t make him snap and be abusive. That was his choice and his choice alone. I refuse to carry that blame!
Thank you for your answer. And so quickly! And thank you for validating that it’s OK to NOT take any comfort from “just let it go.” I told the priest because I was seeking forgiveness for being angry at God. And one of the things that I am learning over these past few weeks is that IT IS OK to challenge authority. I keep thinking about that statement from high school history class that said, “people who don’t learn from the mistakes of history are doomed to repeat it.” That’s why we ALL feel into the traps, sometimes over and over. Because we DID just “let it go” and never learned from it! My husband keeps telling me the same thing – to stop thinking about it and move on. I think the intent is well-meaning, because it slows down the immediate pain. But I know now that I must FEEL this pain, completely and fully, in order to fully learn the lessons that the pain has to teach me. And after 4 problem relationships, I definitely have some lessons to learn.
I think my husband has his own agenda for wanting me to move on. It is threatening to him that I could have felt love for someone else besides him. So I am actually HURTING him by telling him how I am feeling, even through the stages of recovery. I think I just realized that he loves me and is petrified of being replaced, so he cannot listen with a clear heart. Even with his controlling tendencies, he is a good man and at the very least – has EARNED my love and loyalty over the past 26 years. I would never “replace” him, but his heart is afraid to believe it.
And I hear what you are saying – that the changes I am going through are not causing my husband to become more controlling because I do not have the ability to MAKE him do anything – that is always his choice. The dance between us is changing, and I must expect that he will not like the changes. I do not like the changes either because they do not feel comfortable. I do not know what to do from moment to moment, and am probably reacting in a much harsher way than normal because the pendulum is swinging to the complete opposite end rather than to the middle. It’s a state of learning, and I feel like I am always on guard…against control, against unwanted emails…against everyone because no one feels safe.
The ONLY place right now that I feel safe is on this website and in my therapist’s office. Home and family are not safe. I understand completely your comment about feeling that we were surrounded by people that we felt we could trust, and am learning differently. But I can live with it, knowing that my spirit is growing and that eventually my feet will be on solid ground again someday. It is upsetting to not only discover that you are not as healed as you thought you were, but that there’s so much more that needs healing than you ever realized! Digging deep to recover from recent mistakes causes very deep digging to really uncover why it all happened in the first place. In a way, there’s a lesson of gratitude to be learned here, because we are doing good life’s work now. And better late than never! Nobody likes pain, but in our case, the other side of the pain is health. And that is worth the effort.
Thanks again for validating my feelings that advice I have been given is not helpful.
And thank you for sharing this…
Our stories are different, yet all the same.
And I guess, what we are all doing here, is something they will never do, or never feel. Real support and caring for others. Must feel dead inside.
neveragain,
Yes, thank you for sharing!
Your husband has always sounded supportive. It’s normal to have controlling tendencies, I can see definitely see how your situation would make it difficult for him. I’m not surprised he has fears and I can imagine your pain is hard for him as well. I applaud you for putting yourself in his shoes! And yes, you must FEEL this pain. I’ve accepted that, although it can be so difficult at times. Has your therapist been able to give you any insight/tools on how best to communicate with your husband during your healing? I absolutely love that you said your husband EARNED your love and loyalty. That’s on my to do list when/if I’m finally ready to date again. Move slow and trust a partner to EARN my love. I realize now I’ve given myself and my trust too freely too soon in many of my relationships.
Thank you, thank you for bringing up trusting in people of authority. This is a lesson I am learning. I believe it’s a lesson that needs to be taught to young people. I now believe that if we foster self worth and self confidence we are more equiped to identify harmful people of authority. I’m not lumping your priest into this, it sounds like he was trying to be helpful but is ignorant to what you’re going through, however you are making the choice not to listen to his authority because you know he’s not correct.
Have you read “The Sociopath Next Door” by Martha Stout (you can listen free on Youtube)? She speaks in length about trusting people in authority. I found it very insightful. My counsler recently told me that the top 3 abusers are police, in the military and people who work with computers. All 3 are able to control and work within seeimingly honorable systems to harm people.
“There’s a lesson of gratitude to be learned here”. I couldn’t agree more. Better late than never! That’s what I’ve been telling my family and friends. I’m in my mid 30s and am happy that I’m learning more about myself now. I hope to learn for the rest of my life and make healthier decisions for myself along the way….Our pain is our gain. Please remind me of this when I’m posting on one of my bad days! 🙂
Neveragain, I haven’t read all the responses to your comment so forgive me if I’m repeating what someone else has said.
I was one who mentioned the idea that when we finally start standing up for ourselves, and people don’t like it, it is a sign we are on the right path. My therapist taught me this, and I’m not stating the concept as well as I’d like. For example, I had a friend who was saying hurtful things to me over a period of time under the guise of true friendship and helping. Actually, she was slowly poisoning me with her words. I finally (very, very kindly) told her her words were hurting me and her reaction was to get defensive, angry and say (very sarcastically) she was sorry for offering her opinion. A real friend would say they were sorry they hurt my feelings and stop the behavior right away. Ever the whipping boy, I said that I had hoped that she would have said she was sorry for hurting me, and she was incensed, accusing me of being high maintenance and wanting more than any human being could give. Oh!
Not everyone has nefarious motives! Your husband is probably threatened that you are starting to change and afraid of what that will mean to him. One thing for sure is that people like to have things tied up in a bow and the status quo unthreatened.
As for “moving on”, that is what eventually happens, one millimeter at a time. One doesn’t just “move on”, and anyone who would suggest it as a simple concept has never been faced with the need to do it as far as I’m concerned! Moving forward sounds better to me, and is a conglomeration of thousands of little actions, lots of time, and just living life day to day. At first, I was working to survive, now I am working to thrive.
I can’t say how I dealt with the anger of the realization of the betrayals. It used to occupy a lot of my thoughts, and over time, became less frequent. Now, I know that to go into those thoughts does me no good, so I stay away from them. I haven’t dealt so much as accepted. As time goes by, I am more and more interested in my own current life, wants and dreams, and that feels so good I have no words for it.
Just keep putting one foot in front of the other. I think you’re doing great!
PS Neveragain, that friend? She expected me to apologize to HER and, in essence, say that her friendship was so important to me I was sorry I asked for her to be kind and thoughtful to me, and (between the lines) accept the poisoning as a condition of her friendship. She expected that because I had basically done it once before with her (before I knew better). I am sure she hung up the phone and thought “that little b**ch!” but I no longer accept being poisoned as a condition of ANY relationship. I don’t miss her at all.
HM,
Just after the breakup with the P, my “best friend” of 20 years, who has been disordered, my eyes started opening and she caught me at a moment, she was having a fit over something ridiculous, and I let it out on her, don’t talk to me a certain way, watch your mouth to me, cuz I am not going to be disrespected EVER again, by anyone! She cried…she has been sick for years, and had no friends left but me, I always thought I was a good person for not judging her and being her friend. (Co dependency on my part). Needless to say, she went behind my back and literally betrayed me. Long story short, I went no contact with her right along after the P.
I am very happy to have that baggage gone, and I feel like, maybe from now on I should judge people, or discern better.
🙂
Remembertoforget,
We are better off without those kind of “friends”, sometimes a housecleaning is in order.
It gets worse before it gets better, but when it gets better, it’s amazing!
Just ask Kaya. She is the poster girl!
🙂
Thank you HM. I wish I could give credit for tidbits of wisdom to all the right sources, but my head is swimming with a million actions and keeping track of it all is just not possible for me right now. I know that you are not offended, and I appreciate that. I thank you for your personalized response.
I hear you about your story with the friend and her “words of truth.” I am experiencing that from my daughter right now… I have taken a giant step backwards with her until I figure out an appropriate response. Just having realized why I have done what I have done over the years, I don’t have the words for her right now as I am still processing my own lightbulb moment. And she is in blaming mode. So for now, I am realizing that I love her and she is family and I will never desert her, but she is not safe. And that’s OK. Everyone processes their own stuff at their own speed. I have learned that my safety net is to apologize. I have also learned that excessive apologies are a sign of weakness. So the right actions will come to me in time.
I appreciate your kind words about anger. I realize that it is not a good thing to keep in the forefront of our minds day after day, hour after hour. I also believe that anger is a normal part of this process, and for me to just push it aside is not healthy for me. The more I read, the more I realize that it “should” not have happened but it did. So it’s time to see it for what it is, and accept the learnings. And then…yes….move on.
Yes, my husband is operating from a fear base. And I don’t blame him. I would probably feel the same way if the tables were reversed. Compound that with a VERY low self esteem on his part…even lower than mine. I think he needs reassurance and understanding from me.
It has been a very anger-filled week….everyone was fair game. But the love is slowly starting to creep back into my soul along with the realization that not EVERYONE is the enemy. It’s a long process.
Thank you, my friends, for your good and kind words. As always, they make a difference!
Neveragain, I agree completely that anger is a normal part of the process! I never pushed away the feelings of anger, I felt them and felt them deeply. I still do, they are just not my focus anymore. I will never forget, and I don’t subscribe to the notion that we need to forgive in order to “move on”. There is no forgiveness, only acceptance.
Little by little, day by day that episode moves farther into the past. I am changed in ways I wish I wasn’t, but I need to accept that too. It defined my life for a few years and now”it doesn’t. There is still wreckage to deal with, and new realizations every day, but life is slowly becoming more about me again and less about that thing that happened to me.
I am 60 and so aware of how fragile life is and we are not guaranteed anything. I am so grateful to be alive and for all that I have that sometimes it reduces me to tears.
Hm,
Wonderful words.