UPDATED FOR 2020
A Lovefraud reader who posts as “LadyA” sent Lovefraud the following email. At the end, I suggest how she can recover from the sociopath.
I’ve spent a lot time thinking about my experience with my spath, and how it affected me and the people around me. I have read article after article, story after story. I now fully understand what spaths do and how they do it but I didn’t understand why I don’t feel any better about it. What was I missing?
When I left my spath it was a fairly dramatic experience. He had just been sentenced to serve jail time on the weekends for an obstruction of justice charge. My mom flew into town and in one swoop we packed up everything we could get in the car and left the province to go back to my hometown. I had to quit my job over email and send a goodbye text to all my friends.
I am thankful every day for what my mom did for me. I sure wasn’t happy about it at the time but I knew I needed out and this was my chance. What I didn’t know is how much moving back to my hometown would affect me emotionally. I had originally planned on only being back for six months. Just long enough for him to move on and get me out of mind, but it has now been just over three years and I still haven’t moved back. I got settled in a new job, new friends, and a new relationship. Even after all of this I haven’t been able to figure out why I’m not happy. Until three days ago.
Pride. I was proud of myself for the life that I had built. I moved 1200 km’s away from home right after high school to a big city. I was on the fast track to a strong career in a competitive field. I had a brand new car, paid all my bills on time, and was saving to buy a house. I was independent, reliable, strong, caring, and had a really great outlook on the world. Not many people can say that at 22.
All of that was ruined by a six-month “whirlwind romance.” I’m no longer proud of myself. I feel like I have failed because I came back home with my “tail between my legs” to my mommy. I no longer have a new car because it was repossessed as soon as I got back here. I am jaded, I don’t trust people easily, and I am no longer as strong as the face I put on the outside. I’ve gained weight because deep down I just don’t care anymore. My career is now on a plateau due to the location where I live. I don’t have one reason to be proud of myself right now.
How do I get my pride back when I know what happened? I want to feel proud of myself for my life but I just have zero idea where to start. I’ve thought about moving away again, but I don’t really know if that’s the answer. How can I be proud of what has happened in my life? I’m really honestly just so ashamed.
Donna Andersen responds
Dear LadyA,
I am so sorry about your encounter with a sociopath. Although this is not a normal breakup, the good news is that you can recover from the sociopath.
Right now, however, it does not seem that way. Why? I can see two reasons.
The first is that betrayal by a sociopath is a huge emotional injury. In the beginning of your email you said that, after all your reading, you now “fully understand what spaths do and how they do it,” but you don’t feel any better.
Understanding is a critical first step to you to recover from the sociopath. But understanding is an intellectual process, something that you do with your mind. The wound you experienced is also emotional. It needs to be dealt with emotionally.
How do you do that? You allow yourself to feel the pain of the injury.
This means letting yourself cry. Letting yourself scream and wail. Letting yourself experience anger — I’m sure there is anger — perhaps by working it out on a punching bag.
This isn’t pretty, and you probably want to do it privately, because other people often have difficulty being around this. Or, you may have a good therapist who can help you.
One way or another, any bottled up emotion you have within you needs to come out.
Underestimated the injury
Next you wrote that you identified the reason that you’re not happy as “pride.” But it seems like you are regarding pride as something bad, like one of the seven deadly sins.
You had every reason to be proud, because your pride was based on your achievement. And the sociopath took this away from you.
Here is what I think has happened: You have underestimated the scale of the injury, and the severity of the betrayal.
LadyA, you were building a life for yourself. You went out on your own; you started building a career; you were moving forward.
And some manipulative, deceitful parasite, who did something bad enough to end up in jail, ruined it for you.
Not only did he cost you money and hurt your career, he corrupted your outlook on life. You’re jaded; you don’t trust; you don’t care. You are not the young person you once were all because of the sociopath.
Recognize that this was not a normal breakup after all, you had to flee your home, job and friends.
Your life was shattered. Your psyche was deflated. This is a massive shock to your system. It’s no wonder that you are still struggling.
Drain the emotion
So what do you do? In my opinion, you do exactly what I suggested earlier — allow yourself to feel the pain now, knowing that the pain is bigger than you originally thought.
So you cry. You stomp. You imagine him standing in front of you and yell at him. (Do not, however, attempt to confront him in person. This would be counterproductive.)
The idea is to drain off the negative emotion.
As you drain the emotion, a void will be created within you. It’s very important to fill that void with joy.
This may sound preposterous to you, like you have no reason to be joyful. But don’t look at the totality of your life right how.
Do any small thing that makes you happy: Go for a walk. Play with your pets. Have lunch with a friend. Listen to music.
To recover from the sociopath, it may require many rounds of draining off the negative and replacing it with positive. But with time, you’ll find that your entire outlook will change, and you’ll be able to get back on track.
Importantly, with the wisdom you gained through this experience, you’ll never fall for a sociopath again.
Lovefraud originally published this article on May 12, 2014.
High school boyfriend pursues her, then abuses her
Kitty,
There is a spiritual aspect to this…
I couldn’t agree more.
🙂
I think you should leave up to God. God has a plan. As harsh as it may sound , you cannot worry about his mom. We are compassionate and empathetic but have to take care of ourselves. I cut of all contact with his entire family. A therapist once told me it would be in my best interest. Whatever I tell his mom he can eventually use it against me in some way. We cannot trust them or their families.
Like my ex’s mom was very empathetic towards me after the discard. Only for a few weeks. During that time he fed her all kinds of lies. How I am so mentally ill, what a bad person I am. How I made up the story about his coworker and him, how he should seek an injunction against me for his protection , how evil I am, how I brainwashed his son, etc. none of it was true but his mom believed him. When I got that feeling I never called her back and changed my number. She is thousands of miles away but she cannot be a part of my new life. She is his mom. And she will always take his side no matter what lies he comes up with.
My advice in your situation would be not to interfere with his mom.
I have the opposite and I wonder if he has killed part of my ability to empathize. Or if it is just part of me being in shock?
I don’t care about his wife that I just discovered he had. I know who she is. She is the woman he told me he broke up with. The woman who stalked him (yeah, right). The woman he claimed he had to call her parents in order to get her to stop.
I have no desire to show up on their doorstep. To warn her that he has been with me for the past 4 years.
I don’t hate her. I don’t blame her. She is a victim. Probably moreso than me. She/her family placed the obituary listing him as her husband (and rightly so). I saw his mask slip for the first time when I called it out. I’m sure he took his anger out on her.
I feel like a monster typing this. I just can’t focus on him or anything that has to do with him anymore. He has taken so much from me.
Hi, a lot has happened since I have been on last. My NP got transferred to the other station. He however lied and is continuing to deny our relationship. Some others things have happened but I am not at a point where I can share them and feel safe. I am empty. I have no friends at all, no husband and no daughter. If one more person tells me to go out to something to make friends i will scream. I am unable to trust anyone nor do i have the capacity to invite someone in as a friend. what this f*ing psychopath has done to me was leave me alive and be dead at the same time. I feel slightly better i dont have to see him everyday but he threatened my job, and threatened me and I went to the higher ups and got it documented. I did not believe that any of this would happen this way. I really thought that it would and could remain amicable. He even had his wife show up at work to start a fight with me. the good news was i went home sick early that day. thats when i realized he was going after me.
When i tell you and think about it yourself, how would you like getting up everyday and know you have no one. I dont have family, friends, my daughter, or the ex husband. I dont even have the other people i work with as they are turning in me too. I was honest and told the truth. This really sucks. I am very lost and throughout this i have had very little support. so when you respond if you do, please do not jump all over me. i wish that other people would understand when you have had your whole live taken from you, since 4 or 5 years old and been told how to think, look and behave and like it is very hard to do that for yourself. My emdr doctor i am very angry after sessions and my regular counselor doesnt know what to do for me. I am truly lost and i dont even know what i like or want to do except stay in bed dont talk to anyone because i am scared. i am scared of everyone. my daughter has pulled so much stuff on me lately i am sick of it and my ex tried to rip me off with the house. it never ends it doesnt. i feel like the only thing i did right was speak to his wife and do the right think. i will explain that later but i wanted to save her because saving her meant i was saving myself too.
Inthemiddle,
It sounds like you are going through an incredibly bad time right now. We are here for you, even if it is just a virtual pat on the back.
Sometimes when you have had a gigantic truckload of crap piled on top of you, it takes a while to dig yourself out and clean off the stink.
Just know you can do it. Stay in bed if you need to. Wallow in your misery for a bit – I have had points in my life where I have had no energy for anything but wallowing. Eventually you will find that point of light that will lead you out of the pit you are in.
One thing I have learned is that you cannot be afraid to be alone. This is where learning to love yourself comes in. Look inside yourself and underneath the giant pile of crap find that point of light. IT IS THERE. Do you know how I know it is there? Because it is what the sociopath was trying to suck up for himself because he has no inner light.
Hugs.
NoMoreWool…wow, just hit a nerve with me. I had a really bad day on Saturday.
The fear of being alone. I have never experienced that before. Until now. In the aftermath of the spath.
And wow…that the spath trying to take our inner light….to take that from us because they don’t have it.
Very insightful. Very much appreciated. Thank you.
Amille –
glad it helped. Sometimes I worry about being too blunt.
NoMore, I need blunt ( and I do not think you are ). I need all of you that are farther along in this process to keep putting the truth right in front of me….
I need truth about what I have experienced. How to find my way out.
Thank you.
yes she is an adult but still in school and by court order i have to have her covered under my insurance. the father insurance is not as good and judge opted for me to have her covered. so i would love to just dump it all but legally i dont believe I can do that.
inthemiddle-
I understand all about court orders tying you to something destructive. I am sorry you are in such a bind.
I am sorry to hear that things are still going so badly for you, and that you are still stuck dealing with several painful situations in the present, in addition to issues you are dealing with going back to your early childhood even.
Losing family members, even a child, is a lot to grieve for.
Good that you have the satisfaction of knowing you did the right thing. That is at least one thing that is peaceful for you. It also sounds like you are doing a good job of asking for advice here that you feel will help you.
I understand that your trauma is too deep and too complicated to be cured by “going out and making friends.” You are right about that, serious problems don’t go away overnight.
It sounds like even though it’s better for you at work not having to see him every day, that there are still issues there that cause you a lot of consternation, pain and stress. I don’t think I would have been able to recover if I had to continue to deal with my ex psychopath in any way. Even small reminders set me back for a couple of days, and I am several years out now.
Is there a way you can get completely away from him? What are the pros and cons of getting another job? Something that comes to mind is that you have lost everyone and everything in your life. Maybe it is possible for you to move to a new place and get away, make a new start? There were times I wanted to do that, but friends, family, other ties and obligations prevented me from doing so. Of course, these where sources of support for me, too.
Do you have any thoughts of what changes you can make to make things better for you? The sad truth is that the ways other people and circumstances could change to help us are out of our control. The only changes we can control are the ones we can make.
Are there any small steps you can take to make things a little better for you, even if you can’t solve all your problems? It sounds like a better life for you and your happiness can’t be achieved overnight; that it’s something that will take a lot of small steps over a long time.
I believe you can have a good life someday and be happy, but it will take time and hard work.
Keep taking good care of yourself and doing things to help yourself feel better, like seeing the emdr counselor.
I meant to write “especially” a child….
inthemiddleofheartache, I am sorry to hear that he threatened your job – I was afraid that was where it was headed. I hope with him at another station things can begin to stabilize at work for you. I hope you can overcome the damage he has done to your career. (I do know, as my ex did this both to me and to other women at his office that didn’t do his bidding – it became a local scandal in the press.)
I have said many times that I have walked your path of having no one. I am walking it still now. I know what it is like to not trust anyone and to be scared (very, very scared). Believe me, others DO know how hard it is.
But it is not impossible. You have you. You are alive. Start there with gratitude.
I guess the hardest part is how do you begin to fix this mess. I dont have any way of knowing what a healthy relationship is and what I need is someone to be there and be a supportive person which i do not have.
I never thought that he would go after my job or set it up to send me down the river but i am now seeing the type of person who he is. I never imagined another human being acting this inhumane to another person.
I asked his wife to forgive me for what I did. I told her I was wrong and i was sorry for causing her and her family pain. I have admitted it here on lovefraud and i am sorry. not because i am in pain, but it was wrong no matter how much he lied, and love bombed me. I was gullible but not anymore.
It turned out there was 5 of use so far and may be more. I did this because I wish someone would have done this for me. I gave her a chance to be with someone who will not cheat on her. He has been doing this since 2008 so far. And amanda said she was not proud of what she did but she was not sorry. this is what she said to the wife. Yuk.
I wanted to know that i righted the wrong. I felt that it was the right thing to do.
very sad, very lonely and scared.
wish it was different.
inthemiddle-
You are a very brave, generous and honorable person to take responsibility for your actions and ask forgiveness from his wife. It takes a great deal of inner strength to do what you did and I commend you.
I am not a psychologist and I certainly don’t claim to be omniscient. It won’t hurt my feelings a bit if you say, Wool, you don’t have a clue what you are talking about.
What I see is that you are hurting because you don’t have anyone to be an anchor for you. You have an incredibly difficult path to walk, and you are being forced to walk it alone. We (LF) are there for you in spirit, and I am sure I am not alone on here when I say if I could be there to hold your hand and give you a shoulder to cry on I would.
From my viewpoint, I am seeing that you need to focus on yourself. Love the person in the mirror. If you can’t do that yet, love the dandelion in the sidewalk crack or the squirrel in the tree or the way the morning sun feels on your face. You are hurting too much to try wading into the messy pit of loving other people right now. Take it slow and easy and love the gentle things in life. When you are able to smile at the person in the mirror and feel good about that person, then you will have the strength of self to wade into the messy pit again. But do it from a place of strength. Otherwise you are at too much risk of having your love torn to shreds again. Take care and be safe.
The other thing that is hard is that with me being alone with no one how do i nurture myself when i hate myself. i just read the other womans story about the guy and the trash bags in the oven and telling the other woman. well, i found out the wife went back. i dont want him to come after me for giving his wife the messages he sent me about our affair. he is denying it at work and telling people it never happened. but all the while saying that he did sleep with amanda. i guess having someone in your house and banging them is somehow better? I dont know if he is doing that on purpose but i hate this too. all the lies watching your back worrying if they are coming for you. I dont know how to fill an empty pitcher with holes in it and sorry looking at myself in the mirror i want to break it and looking at a flower isnt going to fix it either. i have no self esteem and dont know how to get it as i have been trying several things. religion, trying to meditate, reading it isnt working i hate myself and knowing he is back with her its like laughing in my face.
In the Mid,
It sounds like you have done the right things to make amends and to fix a lot of the mess your ex created.
I understand about being surprised at how evil these spaths are. I was forever amazed at what my ex psychopath was capable of. It helped me to understand that there are no limits to what they will do if they think they won’t get caught and if they think that it will get what they want. No limits at all. They have no conscience.
I understand about needing support; that is the normal human condition – the need for positive relationships between people who care about one another’s well being. I am sorry that you don’t have that in your life now.
Besides coming here to LF for support, do you have or can you find a good counselor who is helpful?
When I felt overwhelmed by problems, it helped me to write them down, and list them. I also wrote down the steps I would do to make things better, and have a plan of what I would do. Writing it out helped me to organize my thoughts and get a handle on what I could do.
Recognizing that you don’t know what a healthy relationship is, is a big step in learning. Many people are on auto pilot and don’t really know what they don’t know. Recovery from your childhood traumas and adult traumas is probably your first task. You can unlearn wrong info you were taught, and learn what healthy relationships are, from reading, from observing others.
It’s a difficult and overwhelming job to make sweeping positive changes in your life; you sound like you are headed in the right direction.
I found Susan Elliott’s story inspiring. She has a blog, and some books. http://www.gettingpastyourbreakup.com/gettingpastyourpast/
http://www.amazon.com/Susan-J.-Elliott/e/B0038HHM4E
Inthemiddleofheartache, you have gotten a lot of great feedback here today. You don’t want anyone to make suggestions of what to do, and I get that. I have said it before that I identify very much with your pain, because for me, a central part of my pain was that I was all alone in the world. I understand your work situation and the mechanics of what he pulled on you more than you know. I was, and still am, at least as alone as you are. It may be a tie, but trust me, you are NOT more alone than I am. So I get it. You say that you hate yourself. Sweetheart, I hope that is just frustration and blowing off steam, but if you truly do feel that you hate yourself, you need psychiatric intervention. If your team of counselors is not helping you, try some other ones. If your town is small and there are no more, go to the next town or the next. Do what it takes to get yourself help.
Now I’m going to talk about ME. Maybe in a month or two or six, one of the things I say will help you. Maybe you will just flip me off. That’s ok too.
Today could have been a really ugly day for me. It was four years ago today that escrow closed on the dream home that we bought together. I still have the picture in my phone of the photo that someone took of me signing the papers, so we could text it to my ex – so he could feel like he was there. He gave me power of attorney to sign for him, because he “had” to work, the reality is that I know now that he didn’t care enough about what we were doing to be there. That spoke volumes, but I “understood”. I am glowing with happiness in that photo. I look a full 10 years younger than I do today. It was the happiest day of my life, and it looked good on me. Little did I know that less than 90 days later my whole life would implode.
I felt just like you do, but I had to keep going. Had to keep my head above water. Had to find a way to save myself. One day at a time. Four years later, my life’s savings gone, the house sold over a year now, yep, this could have been a really ugly day today”remembering where I was 4 short years ago.
But it was an ok day. I have a job now. I am back in the area that I wanted to move from for 20 years, back in one of the worst commutes in the country, going to a job that is far below my capabilities. But they pay me well for my expertise, and when I am sitting in my 90 minute + one way commute, I am grateful that I have a car that I can rely on, even if it is old and beat up. The people I work with are all nice and the day flies by. I am healthy. I have something good to eat for dinner tonight. My pets are here.
It still gets to me that I am alone. Today several people have commented that alone is fine for now – we need to heal and this will not be forever. I agree.
I’ve said here before that I realized that when I said “I’m all alone”, what I really meant was I didn’t have the ex, the man I “thought” he was, the relationship I “thought” I had, or the so-called friends who all bailed when times got tough for me.
I want more, when the time is right, but now, I take comfort in the small ways I can see I am not as alone as I claim when I’m feeling sorry for myself. It may be small, but I take comfort and joy in the small things. There are people in our lives, if we just look around with an open heart and mind. I get my teeth cleaned four times a year and I look forward to that hour catching up with my hygienist and her life. At my volunteer gig (oops! I mentioned volunteering!) when I walk in each Sunday there are three people who light up with smiles to see me and are interested in how my week was. I have a friend who I haven’t seen in person in maybe 10 years and often there is a cute cartoon or animal video in the email from him. This weekend, someone left a package of home made cookies tied in a ribbon on my front porch. Even though it is 99.9% certain they are from a neighbor, I am afraid to eat them, lest they be from a maniac and meant to poison me, but I think the intent is nice. It made me smile.
Two years ago, maybe even a year ago, I would have said these things were pathetic. Now, I see it is a part of life, and it is good. I don’t have anyone who would come to see me in the hospital if I was there, but, I’m not there, so don’t have to worry about that today.
I look for opportunities to make people feel good about themselves, and in turn, it makes me feel good about myself. If I see a little girl who has obviously spent time styling her outfit for the day, I will compliment her and believe me, it will make her day. Today I went and wandered around a craft store to kill time at lunch and an older woman with a cane was looking at pillows beside me. I commented to her about the pretty spring colors and we exchanged a few sentences. We both benefited from the exchange.
I’m still recovering from what happened to me, and who knows how long that will go on, but I’m still alive too, and I deserve a little bit of pleasure in my day. Now, I look for ways to make myself feel good, and avoid what I know will make me feel bad. It’s ok not to wiggle the rotten tooth to see if it still hurts – it does.
So, today could have been a sad day for me, but it wasn’t. I was dreading this anniversary, and it was just another day.
Have you ever been close to anyone who had a terminal illness? I have. They will tell you that they would do anything for just one more hour here”even if it wasn’t the best of hours.
I am so damn proud of myself that I could burst. There is much in my life that is not right, not where I want it to be. But I have so much, even after he thought he took it all. I don’t want to miss any more than I already have due to him, so I look for the good, no matter how small. It is all those small things that add up to a life.
NoMoreWool is right, there is a point of light inside you. Give yourself a break for just one minute to open yourself up to it. It might lead to two minutes. Then five. Whoops! I said I wasn’t going to tell you what to do.
HM,
Your response to Inthemiddle has brought tears to my eyes. This is the most beautiful post I’ve read. Thank you for your insight, thank you for sharing, thank you for seeing all the good I wish to fully embrace someday. No matter where we are in life, through our healing process and pain, we are valuable. Along with so many gifts we overlook in our day to day lives. We are surviving.
Inthemiddle,
My heart goes out to you. We are all pulling for you. Please listen to Hanalei. You may be alone, but you have us and you are surrounded by so many things to be grateful for, even if they are hard to see right now. Hugs.
Thistooshallpass, thank you! After I made that post, I instantly wanted to take it back, because it seemed all jumbled up and not as eloquent as it sounded in my head. So thank you again.
We’ve been so harmed, and we owe it to ourselves to be our own best friends instead of our worst enemies. When we identify what we are doing to bring more harm onto ourselves, (wiggling that rotten tooth, YES IT STILL HURTS), we owe it to ourselves to plant some flowers, eat an ice cream bar, get a pedicure, or fill in the blank something nice.
It’s not always easy, but it IS possible. I am proof. I am imperfect, am up, down and all around, and cranky and pissy way more than I wish. But less than before. It’s going in the right direction. xoxo
Next time you’re driving by and see someone working in their yard, slow down, roll down the window and holler out “hey your yard looks great” and give them a thumbs up. I guarantee you will feel great and so will they.
Thank you for your words. Yesterday bad day. I am still in the middle of this mess. he is at another station but bashing and denying doing the things that the psychopath does. I am hurting as i really in my heart am trying and its not working. as far as volunteering, i was asked not too because i am too depressed. Yes he stole the light out of me and with it being so new him trying to get me fired and crap i am tired. my home stuff went to crap too. i am still not out of the house that i was supposed to be in april so ok dealing with that but getting MF ing by my ex, because as my counselor has told me he is also a passive/aggressive narcissist. so i am surrounded. i need a break from work and i cant right now because without a job behind me and as i said in the past post my daughter has chrons and i need to make sure she has coverage bcs i def cant afford the obamacare ins. so i am trying and wish it was diff. i am lost and so used to having someone tell me what to do. i do take the suggestions on here but it comes up flat. i dont know what i am missing or what it is that i cant get passed this. i guess not ever asking for i want ecause i never knew what i wanted bcs someone was always there to tell me. i feel bad that your alone too. i think it is great where your at and i applaud you. i hope i get there one day. i have so much to go over and deal with and i think until i can get out of the house and be by myself to just figure it out i dont know. i dont know what the magic formula is to make this work. i really thought i was going in the right direction then bam another hit. i am just here today looking for a good reason to leave work and not be here. i need to be careful that it is not noticeable for the situation i am in and i can do it because i need to pack or do something for the house. i do appreciate everyones comments. i feel empty totally empty.
In the Middle,
It’s possible that your recovery is being blocked by information about your ex and by contact with him due to your work situation. Every time you see him or hear something about him, especially hearing that he is bad mouthing you, is a new injury. If you’re continually being re injured, you don’t heal. It’s not really possible to quit thinking about him and the past if you are reminded of his existence.
This is not a normal breakup, and it is never possible to be friends with or get along peacefully with spaths, because they do not do friendship nor peace with anyone ever. You have seen him without his mask and that makes you a perpetual target of his evil forever. He does not have your well being in mind like a normal person, and he never will. He does not care about anyone, but you are on his radar.
I am several years out, and my life is good now. If I even hear stuff about him, it sets me back. It creates a new injury, and it puts me back in bed for 2-3 days. It’s because he’s evil and he did terrible things to me. I have to avoid everything and anything about him in order to stay happy.
If there is a way you can arrange your life, where you work and where you live, to protect yourself from anything about him; it may be the key to your recovery.
If your counselors are not helping, it may be they don’t understand sociopaths and the type of harm and abuse they cause. If you are up to it, it might be worth trying to find a counselor who understands the disorder of psychopathy.
Inthemiddleofheartache, I’m just sort of teasing you about the volunteering, I know it’s not right for you right now and might not ever be your thing. That’s ok.
You mention that you are trying and it’s not working and it’s coming up flat. I’m really glad to hear that you are trying and here is something to consider: it WILL feel like it is not working, and coming up flat. If you are anything like me, it will feel that way the first 20 or 47 or 103 times, because it is an effort, it feels forced and we just want to feel like ourselves and “normal” again. Amirite? The thing is, it IS working, we just can’t see the benefit”yet. That is why we have to keep doing these things that feel unnatural, and trust me, you will reach a time when all of a sudden, it doesn’t fall flat, and you feel better. It WILL happen. It did for me, and I was so used to it falling flat, it took me by surprise.
It’s like maybe learning golf? It takes a very long time to get good at it, or even be able to play a halfway decent game on a course. But every crappy swing at the driving range that falls flat brings you closer to that game.
I hope this helps.
A few weeks ago on Oprah’s Super Soul Sunday she interviewed Tim Storey. I haven’t watched the whole episode yet, but I was intrigued by something he said early in the show. It hit home with me. “A comeback isn’t a go back””meaning, I think, that we don’t go back to “normal” (for me, this has been a huge yearning and it ain’t happening). But we CAN come back.
I agree so much with Annette that arranging your life and work so that you are blocked from any information about him may be key to your recovery. I know your reaction will be that is impossible, but just write it on a post it and set it aside. You may find that at some point, it is possible. Don’t discount it totally.
I also feel that your therapy team may not be the right one for you and that you should explore other options. Again, don’t jump to discount this, just look around and see what other options are out there for you.
What he did to you is abhorrent. My ex indirectly messed up my career, but he did to several women at his work what this guy did to you and worse (they lost their jobs and did not even get them back through legal action). I think I might have warned you this was coming months ago. It is because I have seen it first hand, seen how they work and see how it ruins the woman while they come out smelling like a rose. I understand the added pressure and discomfort his new actions have put on you, and it is the last thing you need right now. Do the best you can to keep your head up, do what needs to be done, and show everyone at work that you have it all together and are above it all, even if you have to play a role. You do not need to give them more ammunition. Quietly make plans for your future. It may not include this job.
Yes the best thing was i got warned by all of you here that he would go after me and it happened. i was prepared so i was able to stop the nonsense before it got bad. i am glad your confirming what he did to me. here i was being told that he slept with that girl gave me a diff story than the wife to see who i would be telling it to. he used me to the very end. and i cant believe a human being would do such a thing. now, i dont trust anything. you could tell me the sky is blue and i wont believe you. this does suck and i thought yea get back to what i was but i guess it wont ever be like before. the house now i have to wait until next tues to have the real estate guy to come out again. i hate the flat feeling. i want to go home and go back to bed.
Yes you were right and the only thing i did do in my favor was to document. i also went to the union and stated what had happened so at this point i beat him to it. I am on guard now because I dont know what will happen to me. There are several people who are just waiting for the opportunity to get me. I have removed myself from situations that would require me to offer my involvement. they are taking his side. and like you he was my person i confided in. i can usually tell him on radio when he is acting smug bcs he got a hit that day. these are all the things he did with me. which were all lies i have to remind myself of that. it is a terrible existance for sure. i am open for a change and i may see it sooner than later. i dont feel like fighting anymore. but yes the betrayal factor is like none other. especially since i waited 11 months before i did anything with him. I need to take my power back somehow. i wish that i had the power to punish and force the people in my life to do the right thing and stop screwing with me all the time. its like a game to all of them doing this to me.
Inthemiddleofheartache, your last post shows me that you get it. That makes me feel better.
Hang in there.
It doesn’t sound like you are a monster. It is normal to care deeply and emotionally for those closest to us, but no one has the emotional capacity to feel for every person in a personal way.
People are designed to be monogamous in romantic relationships. The concept of another woman in a relationship that is meant to be love based between 2 people, is not one that can be dealt with. It is normal and natural for you not to feel sisterly compassion for your ex’s wife.
It sounds like you are a considerate and nice person to be understanding of her victimization.
It is very healthy emotionally that you do not spend your mental energy on him and whomever else he is married to/victimizing at the moment.
Thank you Annette. I guess I am finally feeling a bit on anger beneath the surface. Not full on. I’m still too numb; too bewildered.
I had another memory surface when you wrote about monogamy. I asked him at the beginning of our “relationship” if he was involved with anyone. He replied that he wasn’t currently sleeping with anyone else.
I wish I would have paid more attention to that answer. LOL. Currently could mean right that minute; that afternoon.
I wish my memory would stop surfacing all these lies. Painful. Feels like it will never stop.
Amille,
I was like that, I bet we all were, when all the lies kept surfacing. I was so mad at first I wanted to let him know I know, but I did not, no way!
If I was brewing with anger I would go to my journal, (I filled two of them) and write them all down and tell him off in the journal. I would write furiously until it passed.
It works….
It will get less, and then stop eventually.
🙂
Amille2
Again you speak my words..I used to sit and analyze each sentence that came out of his mouth. If he had said currently not sleeping with anyone..I would have dissected that statement until it drove me nuts. The end result would have been that I went ballistic doing that but he said it that way purposely so that when I approached him, he would say “but I said I wasn’t currently, meaning this very second”
Things like this were forever happening with him and how he manipulated me. He would say one thing bit it could mean many other things..it was exhausting having to figure it out. It was like a puzzle, always playing mind f**k games and he would laugh when I would go crazy asking him and proving him wrong. Saying things “you’re so cute when you get worked up for nothing”
Looking back on the whole thing, yes I miss him, yes it gets better over time and the continual thoughts disappear, but those kind games really did me in. I hate dishonesty in anyone and if they want to play those stupid games and make me nuts, I do not need that..arghh!
Hi Amille2,
Since you are only remembering a few things that he said mixed in with all his love bombing maybe it would help you to go to the top where Donna has the “traits of a sociopath” listed and run through that list & see how they applied to your ex…this exercise might get you to see more bad behavior he did that you are not fully seeing or recognizing. Write them out here or on a piece of paper (or both). This will help open your mind from his brain washing & mind control. Also watching Donna’s videos at the top under the red tab “video’ will help you also.
Another thing I was thinking is you keep saying you are logical which is a wonderful trait but it might also hinder you in some ways if you are not listening to your gut feelings. For all of us we saw signs & behavior with our ex’s that we ignored for many reasons ie did not know how to react, or society has taught us to be polite to others, or because the sociopath used mind games to control us such as pity play, blame shifting etc.
You state your ex husband was an alcoholic & logically you left him knowing he was not going to change his bad habit…what you are not recognizing is the logical think lead you to date him & marry an alcoholic in the first place. There must have been signs that he was drinking excessively before you married that you ignored ie he would have hangovers, or his family were heavy drinkers etc.
Also know that alcoholics & drug addicts are very manipulative and lie so that they can continue their bad behavior. This guy you were dating was a liar & manipulator too. So you need to recognize that something in these guys were drawing you to them. This is where the logic side of your thinking needs to shift to your first gut reaction side.
The book Gift of fear by Gavin Debecker is an excellent book that will remind you that you need to listen to your gut reaction and never weaver from it.
Keep in mind that our logical side of thinking is influenced by our parents, school teachers, church, peers etc and these people might have planted myths in your mind that are not good logical sense in keeping bad people at bay. I hope you understand what I am stating as I dont want you to misunderstand my direction for you to open your mind up from his brain washing/mind control. Once we leave the sociopath we need to go back in our mind and see if “myths” that we believed in prior to meeting them may have caused us to not see things as clearly as we should have when we first meet them.
Google “Oprah Gavin Debecker you tube” to watch their video on following your gut.
Take care
By not having any more contact with your ex, you won’t be adding new lies and hurt to the load he already dumped on you. I found myself thinking about many things my ex said and did as I understood the truth about his motivations. It was part of the process of reframing my impression of him from all the deception to the truth about him. It did stop eventually. While you’re going through the turmoil of grieving and thinking about what happened, it may help to deliberately take a break and not think about him. If you can do something that distracts you. I also found humor helped me – watching or reading something funny, jokes with friends, etc.
The funny thing is I see 3 diff counselors and no one can tell me what to do and how to do it. everyone seems to be at a loss to tell me what to do to recover. I hate being alone and alone with no one to share the pain of anything with. All i have is the continual take stuff from me people. I hate my life and that there is nothing to look forward to. I have tried over and over again and it doesnt change and as soon as i think i am going in the right direction it goes bad again. I am tired of all of this and what it has done to me. i dont know what to do anymore.
Jan7. As always, thank you for taking the time to help me.
You are absolutely correct. I focus on the logic and ignore my feelings. Why? Because I can accept a situation more readily if I understand it.
In both the spath and alcoholic cases, I thought too much; stuffed my feelings. Why? I was too busy worrying about their feelings. Theirs were more important than mine. Don’t good partners put their significant other feelings first? I absolutely cannot stand the thought of hurting someone.
And that made me the perfect target for the spath; And why I kept trying to help my ex stop drinking even though it was fruitless. I didn’t want to walk away from them because I didn’t want to hurt them.
With that said, in both cases I really didn’t know what I was dealing with. I didn’t grow up around drinkers. I thought alcoholics were people who could not control their drinking…..ever. Mine went through periods of control. I thought Sociopaths were all murderers; not someone you could meet in a class (where I met him).
Once the lightbulb went off and I educated myself? I could leave my ex with a clear conscious. I knew I couldn’t save him. And by then I had children that I had to protect. The spath? I can’t hurt him either. You all/my readings taught me that. I can walk.
Why was I drawn to both of them? They were both very outgoing and so charismatic; I’m not. I tend to be more introverted and shy. They had wonderful senses of humor. I loved how they could make me laugh. They were carefree; I am a worrier. In other words, the definition of opposites attract. LOL, do I now avoid outgoing, funny men (that’s rhetoric, I know the answer)?
Now don’t get me wrong. I am not a complete pushover. In other aspects of my life (business dealings, work, my friends, etc.), I will fight tooth and nail for what I need. My kids? My family? Mama Bear, here. I have a black belt in martial arts.
In picking up the pieces of this mess, I know I need to do a far better job of voicing my feelings…immediately. I understand what you are now saying. Had I done so earlier with the spath….I would have received the silent treatments, the disappearing acts, etc.
Hi Amille2, we are both logical thinkers & other traits of being shy quitted introverted (although going through this nightmare has helped me to open up) is the same too. So I totally understand where you are coming from with regard to seeing things logically.
What i have learned is if you are with normal people logical thinking works great but if you are with narcissist or sociopath you can not think logically or rationally with them because they are crazzzy. Their behavior and words never match up. They play games that have no logical rules or patterns. You can tell them how to treat people with respect, love & kindness until you are blue in the face but they will never treat people well. This is why you have to throw logic out with those types of people. This is why the no contact rule is the only thing to do.
I logically knew my marriage was not going to work before the wedding but he keep me busy so that I had no time to sit and really see & think about his behavior and that I did not want to marry him or be with him for that matter & he rushed the wedding because I started to question things. He knew I wanted to end things…he also knew how to control me because his fiancee before me left him. So this time around he was not going to let a girl get away. For you did he occupy your time with countless emails/text/phone calls through the day so that you could not think about this behavior?
I come from a quite family. My father said to me that he did not worry about me going off to college because I had a good head on my shoulders, was book smart & street smart. Well look were that got me LOL. I look back and realize I too held my tongue with people out of politeness when I should not have been polite but then there were other times I would muster up my strength to speak my mind like you. Not liking conflict, I avoided conflict…not good…life is about solving conflicts and if they cant be solved then you need to determine if that person should be in your life which we both have found is a necessary step in life also.
Life is crazy for sure! Who knew when we popped out of our mom’s belly it would be this complicated..lol
As for being drawn to them…me too same reason I gravitated towards friends that had good communication skills…and for my ex he for many reasons the main reason was I had just moved to a new state for a new job and he was a friend of a friends. I thought he was crazy/tornado but still hung out with him because he had a lot of friends…I had ZERO interest in dating/marrying him ZERO!! But he manipulated me so much & loved bombed and he was also masterful at pity play. So there you go a combo lead me down his path to hell.
The great thing about going through what we all have is now we are educated on how to spot these evil people. We know hold one of the keys to how this planet operates. The oz curtains has been opened.
So cool you have a black belt!! Congratulations on that great accomplishment!! And for being a Mama Bear!!
Learning to voice your opinion will come. Honestly for me venting here on this site and other support sites really has giving me the power to express my self. And the fact that you came on this site to share your story and continue to express yourself is working for you also to have a strong voice in your daily life. Everything is a learning block…building our minds everyday. You should be very proud of yourself for all that you have been through with your ex h & this guy while still holding your head high through it all.
Amille, I just wanted to add that it is not our jobs to make others happy (speaking of the sociopath) it’s only our job to be respectful towards others. But once the other person disrespect us we must voice our opinions to them immediately. And then really listened to their response and hear each word they say.
Makes you wonder if dogs & cats could speak what they would vent about to their owners since they have to hold their tongues their whole life LoL. 😉
Jan7. With the memories/lies coming to light, I’m seeing more and more how the words never met the actions. I was too swept up by how wonderfully he spoke to me………yeah, the mind control again.
I read your post below and the one about keeping us busy to avoid examing their behavior. I physically am busy on my own. I have full custody of two active teens, full time job, friends, families, a cat (who by the way, never hesitates to let me know when he is not happy with my service/lack of attention to him :P). He absolutely bombarded me with texts and emails……the cards…….gifts……..letters. In fact, there were times I felt bad because he would bring me cards for no reason. How thoughtful……sigh.
I don’t know if I can say I felt disrespected through the “relationship.” Our schedules meshed. I had time for him; time for my children; my friends. We were taking weekend trips. That’s the weird part. There were two times when his actions really made me mad. WHen I called him on it…I heard I’m sorry……tears…..he was good at crying..he knew he had to work on himself….he talked to his friends about it/about me..I forgave and kept going.
Side bar. That was another good game he played. He always “talked about me” to his friends. Yet I never met them. That was always just about to happen though (lie).
I grew up the same way. I did not come from a family where we talked about our feelings much. You just dealt with things and moved on. I completely agree that you need to address conflict instead of avoiding. As mentioned, I can handle that in some aspects. In relationships, much work needed!
I met him in a similiar manner. In a class. We were acquaintences for a year before the “relationship” began.
Therefore, I can see how I fell for some of his lies. The kernels were planted in class. I thought I knew him a bit.
Yes my eyes are open wide. I’m not the same person I was 3 weeks ago. I hope that in time I will be stronger, wiser, able to really pay attention to actions and what is being said.
Venting has been invaluable. Everyone chiming in and providing such wonderful words of wisdom. I don’t know where I’d be without all the support of this group.
I can’t imagine the heartache you endured. You are so right that it is much easier being the other woman. I just handed him a bag of his stuff and shut the door. YOu had to go through divorce. Disengage from someone you said you were going to spend the rest of your life with.
How did the other women respond when you sent them letters?
Amille2, your mind is opening up that is a good thing, please keep in mind that when (if) the feeling flood gates open it’s overwhelming you will go from crying to anger to sad to crying. Be kind to yourself during these emotional changes if this happens to you. This is where reading up on the grieving stages helps to understand the emotional range you are going through and also journaling or calling the domestic abuse center hotline to talk with a free counselor.
I think when you are not a talkative person like us then you connect with talkative people so during this time when we meet the sociopath we were not analyzing everything they said we are just happy someone else is doing the talking (at least for me up until the past year). If that makes sense. And at times we are like WHAT!?! at what they are saying but we are not equipped to challenge someones words because we are shy/not good communicates/brought up to be polite/etc….
who would also believe that there would be such good liars in this world like a sociopath…that 99% of what they say is a lie. Why lie..it’s just easy to tell the truth in my book. I had never meet someone where I had to analyze every word they said up until that point.
Yes as the relationship progressed his actions would not match his words but I would have conversations with him and he of course would say he was sorry blah blah blah none sense bs. He would say anything to end the conversation or shift the conversation to a new subject to a point I could not remember what we were discussing.
My ex too could have won an Oscar for his sobbing when I finally had proof that he was having an affair I was done…so what better way to suck me in again then to sob and beg me to stay with him. He told me that his mistress was trolling for him and that he did not love her etc. Then he told her he loved her then began the triangulation while he stepped aside. They know exactly how & when to bring on the water works to control the situation = pity play.
My ex told me that he “talked” about me with his co workers…only because he did not want me to call them ( I knew them all)…when I finally had proof of his affair he was on a business trip with his co worker (his mistress) and I called him told him I knew & to put her on the phone…the first thing she stated “we never talked about you” (WHAT!?) so it was all just a mind game for him to say that he talked about me with them or just a game on the phone call at that time, who the heck knows with their games. So crazy. And I am sure the same with your ex…he used it to control you so that you would not say “I want to meet your friends”. This way he could keep you separate from his married life. It was a way to connect you to his friends without you ever meeting them. It’s so crazy that they use the same tricks…this blows my mind.
As for expressing myself better…this whole experience has taught me that I have a right to be on this planet and I have a right to be respected by others. This is my power. Obviously you have to pick your fights..some are not worth fighting for but we have a right to be treated as we treat others. So you need to speak up at that every moment in this doggy dog world.
I think that if you are a younger sibling in the family you also learned to just keep quite and not make a fuss it was easier then conflict in your childhood home. Each sibling has a place in the family hierarchy…the first usually more loud in their opinion then the middle and the younger siblings. So this is another issue.
I am sorry that your ex manipulate you for a whole year in school. Like a cat playing with a mouse. Makes me so mad how these guys set up their victims in a long line.
How did his mistresses respond?
The one that was in another state he sent her flowers on V-Day and two other women in that state also. I looked at the flower companies “your flowers had been sent” email and had all of their address on the email so I sent all of them the same letter (I am not sure if they were all friends or not) and said in the letter that he was married and all the manipulation he did during the marriage & also that I was done with him that he was all theirs but hoped that they would look at sites like lovefraud etc. She (they) dumped him immediately thank goodness she (they) was/were spared. To this day I am not sure of the connection of those three women…I think one was his mistress and the others where her friend just by what he wrote on the card that went with the flowers. Never the less I sent all of them the same letter thinking that if they were her friends then they would protect her and if they went then they would know that he sent 3 women flowers in the same town. My h (I had just filed for divorce) called me and said “What do you hate me”…I knew then the women had received my letter.
The other two, One I know for a fact she knew he was my husband so I called her and gave her the site LF she still denied their affair even though they spent time together and I had proof….I kept my emotion out of the phone call because I was not about telling her she was cheating it was about warning her of the danger she was in with him.
I did not care that these women where cheating with him..I was not shocked this time the first time yes…but by then I was done with the marriage. The other woman I sent an email to her because a friend told me who she was (they saw him/her in town) I told her that I had filed for divorce that he was all hers and that he was cheating with two other woman & gave her details about the abuse I endured and sites like LF for her to look at. She send an email back and said I was stupid but by then I knew he had her in his grips & that he had triangulated her against me.
With all of these women I kept my emotions out of all the contacts because I sincerely did not want them to get killed by him or abused since I had by then been told my counselor that he was a psychopath with narcissist personality.
For me all of those women where my escape out of my abusive marriage.
For you reading the obit was shocking & heart breaking but it was a gift for you to end your relationship with a lying manipulative man. That is a blessing.
I am glad that you are posting, venting & asking questions here. This site is a God Sent…it’s sad to read all of the victims post but I am so happy that we all have a safe place to come to so that we do not feel alone & that we can lift each other up.
Amille2, I am very complexed about the fact your ex and my ex both stated that they talked about us with others. So mind blowing.
I wonder like others on here if there is a site that these sociopaths go to for a “list things to do if you are cheating”.
This stands out for me because his mistress said “We never talked about you” when I called and confronted them both…I knew then and there that they were having an affair. But now makes me wonder what mind games my husband was playing through her on the phone that day.
So crazy their mind games.
Jan7….you made me laugh so hard this morning. It was much needed and appreciated.
It was when you talked about how it was so nice to have someone in our lives that were doing the talking; that we could just sit back and let them entertain us; no worrying; no analyzing…..but then they’d say something that made us go “What?!??” LOL again. Sorry, I don’t know why that strikes me as funny. But it is so true!!
It was actually something that endeared me to him early on. He was one of those people who could take a nothing situation and turn it into the funniest, most entertaining story. I realize now, it is because he would embellish/lie about the situation.
On a serious note, I broke NC this morning. He sent me an email stating that he knows I’m trying to hurt him. That he can see why I misinterpreted the obit….blah blah blah……how he has trust issues (Yeah, HE has trust issues) was preventing us from getting closer (uh, how about his wife?) more blah blah blah…..and he needs to know if he still has a chance because I wasn’t clear.
I responded for me. I responded to let him know that I now know he is married/living with her. That I am making myself clear when I say that I’m done. I was very matter of fact, precise and to the point. I will not let him see more of me; of how I’m feeling. It doesn’t matter to him how I feel anyway.
If nothing else, the email brought up some tears……..many tears…….something I have not been able to do yet.
I think you already answered the thought about talking to their friends and coworkers about us. It kept us thinking that we mattered in their lives. That they were telling others how much we meant to them. That we were connected to people when we weren’t. More words that didn’t match.
I found the obit on a Friday night. I text him Saturday morning (he didn’t answer when I called) letting him know what I found. No response from him until Monday afternoon (there’s my AWOL/silent treatment). The first thing he said? “I know you are upset. I have been talking to my father all morning about you”
What??!!??
Do you remember what finally made you go from zero interest to getting involved? Was there a moment? Or did he just wear you down? Decided that how can you not? I mean look how much he loves you/claims to love you? What did your friends and family think of him? Did he have them fooled too?
I give you much credit for fighting back and notifying the other women. If they failed to heed your warning, that’s on them.
I understand what you mean about them saving you. I think in time I will realize him living with someone else ultimately saved me. Gave me a clear path to move on…..difficult as it is right now.
I think your point about the right to be respected is very valid. It is eye opening to me actually. I never looked at it that way.
You are very wise.
Amille,
Keep in mind that your ex sent you that email because he wanted you to respond. He doesn’t care about the contents, he is just like poking you with a stick to see if he can rile up a response, any response, from you.
If you are ready to stop contacting him for your sake, consider blocking his email so you don’t have to know when/if he sends you an email.
I know he did Annette. That was my goodbye letter to me. I probably should have wrote it in a journal. But in my mind now, I have made myself clear.
I know it means nothing to him. That his words to me meant nothing to him.
He sent via another email address that I use for school, the kids. I forgot he had that address at one time. It too, is now blocked.
And I appreciate you reminding me of his intent. I need to keep hearing it.
I’m thinking more about what you wrote Annette. He got me didn’t he? with my achillles heel……hurting people.
Funny how I just divulged that last night too.
This is why I don’t talk about my feelings.
It never ends well.
Amille,
It took me a long time to stop having contact with my ex psychopath; and he could always push my buttons, no matter how determined I was not to allow it. I could never do the greyrock technique on him. http://www.lovefraud.com/2012/02/10/the-gray-rock-method-of-dealing-with-psychopaths/
It takes most victims at least a few rounds of interaction before being able to extricate ourselves. I wrote many emotional angry emails telling my ex exactly what I thought of him and what the truth is over a couple of years but I never sent them. It became my journal, and a record of his words and actions while we still had contact.
I have also regretted sharing my feelings with the wrong people. We can protect ourselves by sharing our feelings only with people who are trustworthy and who care about our best interest – in positive relationships with real friends. It’s a balance that’s difficult to discern sometimes – not to share too much with the wrong people, and not to withhold and isolate oneself from good relationships.
This is the score card
i have a ex husband, who is passive/aggressive narcissist
i have an ex boyfriend, who is a psychopath/narcissist i work with and is still married and tried to get me fired from my job at the firehouse.
i had a 2 yr relationship with ex boyfriend who i thought was leaving his wife only to have another relationship with a third person but finding out there were more.
i am trying to get over this as he was transferred but the people i work with it is a little uncomfortable. also the ex boyfriend np is denying we did anything and admitted to the other girl he slept with at his home.
i have been looking for another job but with the health concerns of my daughter and the need for good insurance which i have i have not just left.
this is tough every day i hate being here and hearing his voice at times, even though i hear him in my head day and night and i am trying to figure out how to fix this mess. i am trying. it is not as easy as it sounds because of the close proximity of working with him. i sit here all day long by myself with no one speaking to me and being treated like i was the bad one and that its my fault. i was the one manipulated and betrayed and lied to.
it seems that my life and my whole entire life has been surrounded by bad people.
inthemiddle
I know I am not there with you and don’t understand all the nuances of your life. This may sound a little harsh, but it is a question that keeps popping up in my mind.
You have a daughter. I get the impression she is an adult. You have stated that she has a health problem and that is why you keep your job, so that she can have your insurance.
If your daughter is grown, why are you still insuring her? Especially if she has made clear that she does not want anything to do with you and that you are pretty low on her list of priorities in life? You have written before how she constantly abandons plans to be with you so that she can be with her boyfriend or her father.
Why not let her be a grownup and get her own insurance? If she prefers her father so much more than you, why not let him insure her?
I know you love your daughter, but sometimes loving a child means forcing that child to stand on her own two feet and be a grownup, to experience the consequences of her actions.
Keeping a job that is destroying your mental and physical well being just so you can insure an ungrateful daughter that can’t be bothered to spend time with you seems a little self-destructive. I am not saying cut off contact with your daughter, but have you considered the possibilities if you are not shackled to your job?
Inthemiddleofheartache, yes, you’re taking the hit for something that was not your fault. He set you up and for that I am truly sorry.
I was working my dream job, the pinnacle of a 20 year career when I met my ex at work. We became involved, and as we were both managers, he was adamant that we keep the relationship secret. I was proud of the relationship and didn’t really agree, since we were both single and didn’t supervise each other but I went along with it. About a year after we became involved, another manager came after me, through the boss, his story was believed unilaterally and over half of my staff was taken away from me, I was asked to move to another office from my beautiful one (because this other manager was irked having me on the same floor as he was) and at that point, I refused. I was ostracized where before I was a leader and well respected and admired. My ex was at my side, listening to all my sadness and “supporting” me. I was forced out. I was basically alone (everyone gravitated away from me because I had been targeted and they didn’t want me to taint them. None of this ever sat right with me, since the things I had been accused of were complete fabrications, but the damage was done. I worked for maybe 5 or 6 months under this regime until I found another job and left. It wasn’t a better job, it was in a crappy location, but I left with my head held high. Those months were some of the hardest times in my life – I know EXACTLY how you feel.
I spent years talking to my ex about what had happened (it really crushed me) and it never made sense, since what had been said was so untrue. During this time he told me the other manager got promoted, moved into my old office, all things to hurt me. It wasn’t until after the discard and I found out what all my ex had been doing in that office with and to other women that I put all the pieces together and realized the it was my EX who had planted the seeds and story and manipulated the other manager to come after me.
I have never said this before, because I am hell bent on protecting my privacy, but I will say it now because it may help you – all this happened in a public agency and was played out in the press.
It was horrific. My ex wanted to destroy my career (and he was my closest confidant so I was feeding him all my pain) and wanted me out of the way since he was diddling with multiple other women in the office. He made sure several of them lost their jobs. I’m not sure what happened to the others.
He eventually was asked to leave in order to mitigate any further liability to the agency (this actually happened four years ago this week when I was signing the escrow papers on our dream home but he lied to me and told me he quit), but they kept him on the books, paying his salary and benefits for 8 full months so he could reach full retirement age and not take a hit on his retirement.
Meanwhile, I was humiliated, other women lost their jobs, and yes, he came out smelling like a rose.
This is why I warned you months ago to document and watch your step with him. I am afraid for you that he might not be done with you at the workplace. That is why it is so important for you to not give anyone any ammunition. And even if you are above reproach, as I was, it may still take you down.
I tell you this not to scare you, but to ask you to prepare yourself for anything, and have measures in place to protect yourself. The reason your story resonates so deeply with me is because I have lived it. These things are not right, and they are not fair, but they happen.
Sending my support.
Amille2,
Glad you had a good belly laugh 🙂
They aways come boomeranging back & like I stated in another post they will try anything to get you back in their hooks…from Love bombing, pity play, blame shifting, reward & punishment to anger & intimidation etc.
With regards to breaking the no contact rule..this happens your not the first we have all done it…but close the door & lock it tight because you just got a very good look at his masterful manipulation, he is a puppet master and you are his puppet.
Listen to his wording closely it classic sociopathic manipulation!!!
He states:
“I’m trying to hurt him”
“how he has trust issues”
“was preventing us from getting closer”
““I know you are upset. I have been talking to my father all morning about you” LOL!! ya right buddy!!
THIS IS MASTERFUL MANIPULATION!!! He is reversing everything….this is what you are thinking this, this is what you are feeling…but guess what he beat you to the punch…this is the mind games they play. This is classic you sit there and say WHAT!?! when they say these types of things…
then guess what you start to argue with him over an email and he continues to manipulate you with his words and they you become exhausted from all this and they he will turn on the LOVE BOMBING to suck you into his game. Then he will say can I come over or can we meet etc They know exactly what they are doing…remember he has good practice manipulating his wife now you.
DO NOT ENGAGE IN HIS GAME
He has thrown the bait out to see if you will take it hook line and sinker.
IGNORE, IGNORE, IGNORE his emails…but better BLOCK, BLOCK, BLOCK HIM!!!
My husband was masterful at this game of his too to a point I would forget what the original augment was about….this is what they want for you to forget and come back to them. They exhaust you mentally so you give in.
This is why you have to listen to their words very very closely…and watch their actions. The guy was catch…he is a adulterer…he has a wife…he has had you on the side for 5 years….there are too victims in his sick game YOU & his WIFE…but look what he is doing, he is turning the tables and saying he is the victim…sick man!!!
He is now blaming you = sociopath blame shifting (google)
I never wanted to date my ex h, move in with him or marry him…but he just keep pushing my boundaries…I would voice my opinion to him but he just keep at it…he needed me to pay his bills as he was unemployed…I had a good job nice apt. He saw me only as a means to pay his bills. He would call my home 8 – 10 times per day even though he knew I was at work. When I got home I would see their would be many messages which I would just ignore because I did not like the way that that invasion made me feel…then he would just show up without calling…which I did not like…when he did come over I felt like I was under his mind control…looking back he was trancing or hypnotizing me some how still dont fully understand that but I know he was doing it because as the marriage was ending i would not look in his eyes so that he could not trance me some how I knew on a level that he was doing these things but never had read about this topic to realize YES he was doing these things.
I did not go into this relationship willingly…he conned me into it…he was not the type of guy that I would date…he was pretending to be “rich” but came from a poor family and it was at times very obvious with his behavior and this made me see RED flags.
They just dont take NO they wear you out until you say yes. This is where I lost my voice…this is where I did not know how to handle the situation of him pushing my boundaries over and over and over. I did not know anyone in this new town & phone calls at the time were expensive to call friends/family frequently. I had never been around anyone like this certainly not my family behavior what so ever. This is what sociopaths do they just push their agenda onto you until you are exhausted. He physically wore me out by packing the day full of activities & chores. He always needed “help” with something. No spare time to think on my own = total love bombing my free time.
I saw RED flags with him the second I meet him…at one point before we started to date I was at his home and told him he needed to get a cross for his home…I was raised in a catholic family but my family was not practicing. SO this was a gut reaction that I was having with him that I ignored but should not have. Never have I told someone they needed to get a cross for their home…but I realized on a level that the I was standing in front of the devil himself. This is why it is so important for all of us to listen to those gut alarms!!
I had to move out of my apt because it flooded and he came right in and said you should move in with me….I said no…but he pushed me into it…once I moved in the chaos & drama was so stressful…he was cheating on me before I moved in….I know that now…and he cheated on me throughout the dating phase and I think even on our wedding day. I was a walking zombie going into the wedding day. So crazy to look back and so crazy this world is with these evil people. Sad too!
I felt trapped in my marriage…after the honeymoon which I did not really enjoy with him…the location was great but I did not like him…did not enjoy his company fully…when we got back things dramatically changed and I literally felt like he put a ball and chain around my neck. The chaos & drama was so crazy…I really still dont understand where he (they all) got/get all of his crazy energy from it’s never ending chaos & drama. For you his wife is enduring the craziness & drama filled days because he wanted to create distraction to go see you.
I also was thinking that you might not have been the only woman on the side. I’m not sure if you have thought about this…I dont want to upset you but this is reality with a sociopath so this is why I am bring this up with you. Sociopaths have lots of victims at one time. Since you did not go to his home or see his family/friends he hide a lot of his life. So this is something you need to think about…were their other women that he was seeing?
I told my counselor after I left that I thought he cheated on me 8 -12 times during the marriage and she told me that it was more like 3 to 4 times that amount…which is more accurate because he traveled the world every month. He hid a wild life from me.
There are times i just still am in shock that I got sucked in when I saw who he was…that is the part of regret that I am still coming to terms with….I knew he was bad news…but like a moth to a flame he had me flying towards him as with everyone he has in his circle. He seriously could have a large cult church if he so desired that is how good he is at manipulating people and how many people follow him like sheep.
As for fooling friends/family: We lived in a different state originally so he did not have to impress or manipulate my family. And my family are the type to not speak up if they see something of course after I left they did.
My friends in our town were his friends wives…he would not let me really have my own friends part of the control…when I did reach out to a new club and would form my own relationships he would want to meet them and of course he would suck them into. But one group of women wanted to meet twice a month on a friday night without out husbands…just a girls night out for a few hours…7-9 pm so big deal but of course he would guilt me “What am I going to do?” and I would say go out with your friends…but then he would guilt me more and want to come out with me and I would say no this is for girls only night…but of course he would get his way and go out…then after the night my friends would be upset with me rightfully so, so eventually I would not go = he won = he got control of me back again. He would also say when I got home “what did you bash all the husbands tonight?”. He wanted to see if I told them what was really going on in my marriage.
I am sorry that you cried 🙁 it really is a good thing to get all of your emotions out of your body & mind. Some how our brain knows how to purge the hurt out of our body. Hugs to you 🙂
can I ask you what you have thought about with regards to his wife? Have you thought about contacting her? or how she is feeling?
Reread the “No Contact Rule” there is a good article if you google Narcissist free no contact rule (on narcissistfree. com).
Like I have said you are doing great…you are really fully educating yoursefl about their behavior & mind games and you are venting here & asking questions this is a huge part of the healing process. I know it’s heart wrenching right now….to find out everything was a lie..there are no words really to describe that pain….but you will come out stronger…you will have a strong voice for now on…you will see danger the minute it presents it’s self. So give yourself a pat on the back for how far you have come in 3 weeks time.
Hugs to you today not an easy day but the blessing of contacting him is now you see his blatant word manipulation in his email…his oz curtain has fallen and you see him for who he is.
Take care.
Amille, I am sorry for all the grammar/spelling errors…I type fast & then miss the errors reading the little box. 🙁
I’m sure there are other women. Why wouldn’t there be? It is why I immediately went to the doctor. I don’t have proof or specifics tho.
I did not argue or acknowledge. Just told him I was done. If he tries to email me back it won’t work. I deleted the email account. But I understand. I can’t compete or win. I just need to stay away.
I can’t imagine what you went through. How sad that you didn’t enjoy your wedding…your honeymoon….,they really are into drama aren’t they?
I don’t understand how they can juggle so many women and keep it all straight….slip up and use the wrong name or something.
I don’t see the point in contacting the now wife. Surely she knows what she is dealing with. She lives with him.
I also think it is like contacting him…only this time there maybe retaliation.
Enjoy your day
inthemiddleof heartache….
I feel for and understand you.
one thing I do not understand.. is that I found out… and in cleaing my apt and getting rid of his things… I found a letter fro the FD to him a year ago.
A warning for bad behavior.
I have it somewhere.
it says other officers were saying he “pushes peoples buttons”
has to control everything including the tv remote, but thinking of others.
seems to intentionally “ruffle coworkers feathers ”
and……………
GET THIS EVERYONE……
it was REPORTED THAT HE WAS HAVING TOO MANY WOMEN AT THE FD… ESP AFTER 10 PM!!!!
It was suggested he changed his behavior.
If I had only seen this letter back then.
not only was I one of the women…
but he begged me to have sex in station… when they were out on a call and like a stupid , in love idiot… I did.
and other girls I have contacted have told me the same. and in our cars at the FD.
I feel so guilty so disgusting.
why did I do that?
and to think I was one of many… and he told me I was his forever… one and only… the end to his search.
why did I degrade myself so much?
My gramps was a Chicago fireman for 38 years And a fireman… that was a true humanitarian. hard working. supported his family. catholic, irish church going, volunteered…. never ever cheated on or hurt my grandma….
was a man of INTEGRITY.
so like a schmuck…. (my gramps died 3 years ago… 99 years young)
I would talk to my FF about my grandpa and show him photos…
so did my parents with him. God he manipulated my poor mom… created a comradery with her! Oh so sick and evil. Put his arm around me in front of my parents who literally worry for my life since I almst died of anorexia August 2013.. and attempted suicide as well.
put his arm around me and said to my aging, humble, loving parents,
“I want you guys to know… you do not have to worry about Megan anymore.”
My mom’s eyes welled up.
I was so sure he was genuine. who does this?
I am not rich. I am poor. why did he bother?
for free rent… a car… amazing sex and someone to cook for and nurture and look beautiful ?
I am sick with myself.
he is what he is. gross. evil nasty.
But I am sick with MYSELF FOR ALLOWING THIS TO HAPPEN TO ME.
for not protecting myself… although at the same time.. I did not know such deceit and manipulation and evil existed in human form
My best friend…. of 23 years.. loveh er to death. she never met him… but she tole me a year ago to stay away… just from his facebook page.
I told her that was kind of shallow and he was a 45 year old.. single guy….
so now… and she is not being mean about it…
she says I deserve this.
she got married at 23 in the Mormon church, has never had to work… and has never looked back.
My ex would tell me… Who is Nancy to judge You?
it is my fault and that is the most difficult part of this.
Part how could it be my fault… when I did not know the true depth of his deception, plotting, stealing, cheating, lying…
oh.. I am confused.
30 mins and I leave office.
thank God.
Kitty,
It sounds like you’re working through your memories of your experiences and understanding them in the light of the truth of your ex’s motivations. It’s devastating that everything he did and said was a lie, to you and to your family. It’s beyond understanding.
I think that your friend’s comment that you deserve what happened to you because you didn’t listen to her observation based on FB is mean and arrogant; though she may not mean any harm since she doesn’t know what she’s talking about. I would be hurt by a comment like that from a friend.
amille2
ok i see now you’re not in touch with him, i had just asked that in another post…sorry
you mistakenly discovered he was married by reading an obit, listing him as someones husband? yeh that is pretty disgusting, and I’m glad you unmasked the bastard…
i feel exactly like you about the wife, not her fault, but i really have no empathy towards her. she will soon discover what he is and it will be worse for her than when i did..they can have each other..
but mine has hoovered quite a few times since last summer…claiming he does not like his new wife and how he made a horrible mistake…mm hmm…bull crap!!!
he has begged me to let him see me and visit and he can pull the wool over her eyes…then he will contact me the very next day and take everything back and tell me right now he can’t do this to her and he apologizes to me…only to rehoover again…
don’t feel like a monster, you do have empathy, he just destroyed the part you have towards him, but you are normal…if it weren’t for this site i swear i do not know where i would be today, i had never heard of this behaviour before!
Janedoe, as a former wife of a sociopath I hope you will open your mind up to having sympathy for his wife. The reason being is as the “wife” it was hell on earth to live with them and endure their daily chaos & drama. For me his daily chaos & drama let me to a point I was literally emotionally, mentally, & physically exhausted that I could not find the door out of the marriage.
Count your blessing that you were the other women because your escape door out of your relationship was much easier then a wife’s escape door. My marriage was hell but the divorce was the bottom of hell.
The lies, manipulation, gas lighting abuse, reward & punishment, and all the other mind games led me to bed ridden exhaustion and eventually I had a break down from all of the stress my ex put me under.
Like Tiger woods my ex had countless other women in his life and to control me from leaving he abused me mentally & emotionally ever second of the day. And when I did finally had proof of one of his affairs the abuse become 1000 times worse. I knew something was wrong with him the second I meet him but he sucked me into his sick world and I tried desperately to get out…I reached out for help with friends & marriage counseling but because they were not educated they did not give me a life line out when I needed…I literally needed someone to carry me out of my marriage.
For me I have let go of any animosity towards any of this mistress for the simple reason we are all victims of an evil evil sociopath….I hope you will really think about the hell the wife endures being married to a sociopath and I hope that you will find sympathy for the wife…remember everything the sociopath told you about his wife were all LIES to get you hooked into his con game. EVERYTHING he told you about his wife was a LIE!!!
Please find it in your heart to have sympathy for his wife she endured more hell then you.
Jan7
Oh no..pls I did not mean it in that sense at all. Of all ppl being the wife of a sociopath having to put up with the abuse you went through must have been more than enough and I feel 100% horrible for you and I sympathize your situation.
It’s so hard to explain through posts and may have come across very harsh. What I meant was, in my case, my ex was not married when we met, he was a con and a very sneaky man throughout our whole relationship. He went out behind my back looking for whatever thrill he was looking for and came across a girl thirty years younger. They’d never met and were having something via the Internet. Keep in mind we were still together and although I knew how conniving he was and those red flags that haunted me, I did nothing about it figuring as long as physically nobody existed (a wife) I had nothing to worry about. In the end all behind my back he married this girl. Was she part of this with him? I don’t know, but I was so hurt and angry, as you rightfully were, I blamed them both. I figured she must be out looking as well, for a 30 year old woman to hook up and marry a 60 year old who lived across the world from her…I found it weird.
If they were married while I was with him, she would be the first one I would sympathize with because what he was doing to her would be unacceptable.
Please know I didn’t mean for you to think that I blame your position in this at all (being the wife who was so cruelly crapped on). I’m on your side because I felt I was “the wife” being cheated on…because he always referred to me as his wife.
Hope I’ve explained it more clearly 🙂
Hi Janedoe, what an awful story. I am so sorry at how you were discarded. it’s a nightmare all around for everyone who gets sucked into their crazy world. I did not take your post personally what so ever please know that. We are all learning & understanding all the chaos & drama each of us endured some on different levels of abuse while others at different relationship types.
Just one word in your original post stating that you had no “symptathy” for her made me want to post a comment for you to see the other side but I want you to know I fully understand where you were coming from now with your clarification…in reality you like you state were his wife or at least his long term girlfriend which meant he should have been monogamous not trolling.
I can tell you only from my own nightmare experience that each mistress that my ex h sucked into his con game (there were many) some who knew that he was married to me other did not know he was even married were all victims just like me. Just like you and this other most likely naive young girl that your ex has sucked in. I spend so much wasted time after being triangulated being mad at my ex mistress and not where the blame should have been on my then h.
Is it possible that she had money? and that is what he was after a comfy life style for his old age? Or an ego building trophy wife on his arms? what ever the reason I am glad that she was your escape route out of the relationship…
I am sure the heart ache was intense & shock/confusion was heart wrenching and I am sorry that you endured this nightmare & aftermath. When I finally escaped my ex h he had 3 mistress in two different states, one from another state had no idea he had a wife, the other two one knew the other did not know. I did not care at the point I left him and now look back and those women saved my life by cheating with him. they were my escape out of hell…I pray for them often that they too will find their way out from his grips.
I now fully understand how his mistress each were sucked into his game…maybe not specifics as that doesnt matter any longer but I know he used pity play, smear campaign (against me), triangulation, gas lighting etc etc to such them in just like he did to me. The only difference now is I know who he is and his games while his ex mistress most likely & sadly do not know…which means the door still could be opened for him to reenter their lives and for them to become wife #2 or #3. Scary to think about that even though I sent them a letter with the info.
I am so sorry that you were cheated on and then found out he married the woman…I cant even image the shock & confusion in your situation. I am shaking my head at how blatant and evil these guys are…my brain could never come up with any of the craziness they live not even if I was writing a movie plot. Their behavior is just so beyond my world even after living in my ex’s crazy world.
Thank you for your post. Take care.
Jan,
Reading your post, it had me thinking, the whole relationship was everyday, ALL day, texting. Email if necessary, and then talk.
When he wasn’t coming over as much during the week anymore he would say let’s have a phone date, and sometimes we were on the phone for 4-5 hours.
Whenever I had alone time, YES I would be evaluating and going over things.
He would say often, i’m afraid to leave you after the weekend, because when you go back to work on Tuesday you want to break up with me…
I would have Monday’s off all to myself.
So…I guess as you mentioned, the constant communicating literally ALl day for us, about everyday, is yet another tactic.?
Is there a school they go to- to learn these tactics?
How do they all have the same methods?
Guess is doesn’t matter.
Are we all the same to them?
Remembertoforget, YES they control our time…they slowly remove us from our old life by occupying our time. first with love bombing then it’s did you pick up the dry cleaning or can you go to the store and get me such and such thing, mean while while our time is occupied running their task or doing their chores they are out cheating & conning people.
Cults do this to their followers…Jim Jones not only moved his followers to the jungle but then he had them work all day long to keep them tired so they would not think to leave.
The movie 9 1/2 weeks is about a socipath controlling his latest victim. In one take he gave her a watch and told her at 3 pm everyday he wanted her to look at the watch…well can you imagine…you would be looking at the watch all day long…this is the mind control these evil people have over their victims. I think the site psychopathyawareness.wordpress has info on this movie on their site…very interesting how Hollywood depicts sociopaths not just killers but this guy was a sex addict sociopath.
I would not recommend the movie as it might trigger you. But reading on the site above will give you some insight about occupying the victims time.
Remembertoforget, I know do they have a book or website that they learn all of these evil mind games?
Such a crazy world!! 🙁
Remember and Jan,
Both my spaths had constant contact. It was all time consuming. Even with down time, there was no down time. We were left exhausted and wrapped up despite time to ourselves.
Yes, Remember, there is a school. It’s called being a disordered person! It all comes so naturally to them and they learn more and more along their way, from each and every one of their victims.
With all the time and loving attention both my ex’s gave their cell phones and computers, it’s no wonder they could easily be in constant contact. And with many prey at the same time no doubt!
Thinking of their lives exhausts me. How they stay awake for so long and the need to be constantly entertained by false communications and trolling. I can’t even imagine how they keep it up and feel good about it. Thank GOD I can’t even imagine…
janedoe, I think you asked me somewhere (I can’t find the post) how he pulled off being married to someone else with me?
LOL….lots of lies!
I met him in a class. We were acquaintances for a year. During that time I heard about his divorce from his first wife; how he had full custody of his son; his daughter every other weekend; his military service; his injury that caused migraines (we even would turn the fluorescent lights off in class to help him); I knew he was seeing his now wife; then I was told by others he broke up with her.
So the seeds were planted before I even started “dating” him. He told me that his migraines were so bad that he had a hard time in the evenings. That his day started with a headache and became progressively worse by the end of the day. I saw the pain meds he was prescribed by the VA. He also told me suffered from anxiety. This was brought on by his wife and ex girlfriend. His ex wife was mentally abusive; the girlfriend tried to control him. Therefore, he preferred to come to my house. Too many bad memories at his house.
Typing all this out makes me shake my head in disbelief…….that I belived all this! But you have to remember it was fed slowly over time. His girlfriend stalking him? Made sense. The people in our class told me how she followed him around everywhere; showed up crying when he dumped her (well, sure now I get that. he probably discarded her). No one knew he took her back and is now living with her. Like I said, I feel bad for her.
When his grandmother died, she wasn’t listed as his wife. I’m not sure how he pulled that one off. Maybe they aren’t married who knows? She and her family must feel otherwise since they included him when their family member died.
But I digress.
That’s the jist of it. I invited him on family vacations and he came. Trip to Chicago with friends? He was there. My aunt died? He was right by my side when I had to deliver the readings at the funeral. The many texts, flower, letters……how could he be living with someone else?
I wasn’t at his house but once (red flag). Friends, never met though he talked about me all the time to them (I’m sure a lie; red flag) Invited to his parents house once (red flag). Said “next holiday” we’d be together as a family (never happened).
As I posted earlier, some of things nagged at me. Others, I would shrug off. I was busy with my kiddos. I enjoy being by myself. I like holidays when I can focus on my family and friends and not worry if my “boyfriend” is bored and wants to leave.
After reading some of the stories posted here, I consider myself lucky. I wasn’t married to him. I didn’t live with him. He didn’t take my money. I’m now just crossing my fingers and hope that he doesn’t come back; that he doesn’t set out to destroy me like I heard they can do.
amille2
i understand how you feel luckier than the other women, i too wasn’t used for my money, nor married, not physically abused. he was an average guy, he had no drinking problems, didn’t smoke, had a reasonable lifestyle..just average. and at times i ask how someone who doesn’t do what sociopaths “are supposed to be like” be one. he did the things yours did, the mental manipulation. somewhere on here you mentioned when he spoke, and perhaps said something like “at the moment I’m not sleeping with anyone” it was things and words like this, that i had dealt with, the crazy making. i would spend hours awake dissecting emails, checking the times they were sent, even the time zone that you sometimes see at the beginning of an email, i would try to figure out where he was really messaging me from, because from day 2 i always had reason to doubt him. something just didn’t seem quite right with his stories, which led me to obsessing about each and every word he would say..i was losing my mind..looking back it was a hell of a lot of work for a relationship, that i couldn’t handle.
how did you manage to meet his parents without them wondering why he wasn’t with his wife at the time?
the migraines, sound like something mine would use as an excuse to benefit the hours or days he would go unheard from…do you think yours used them to his benefit as well? maybe that prescription was not real? mine was so smart that he fabricated legal documents from companies saying he was accepted in a job position, he would show me these things, when he had to go away on business for short contracts..i only know they aren’t real now because he told me during his last hoover that he could create a false document sent to him for a “job position” and show it to his wife and she would never know the truth and so we could be together for a few days…so he slipped and spilled the beans, i guess he isn’t so smart after all..
No matter how sorry we feel for the other victims of a sociopath, we cannot save them – they have to find a way to save themselves.
Places like lovefraud are a lifesaver. A drowning person can hang onto a lifesaver to keep from being sucked under where hanging onto another person will just cause them both to drown. Sometimes we have to realize when a helping hand can mean our own demise.
If his mom has recognized what he is, she will eventually choose to go NC herself and grab onto a lifesaver or she will choose to get sucked under. If she goes NC, she will also understand why you have chosen to include her in your own NC with the sociopath.
Once we get past the shock, pain, and denial…
We start to remember ourselves again.
We literally get to take this experience and transform it, and re-create ourselves.
If we were good before, we are now only better, because we have been able to fine tune our old beliefs about ourselves and relationships.
We can now truly understand self-love, and it’s not being selfish.
And so, painful as it all has been, it may just have been a blessing in disguise.
We went seeking truth, and OUR truth is what we find. We will never live someone elses truth again.
Remember,
Well said. It is a blessing in disguise. Perhaps the most important for me is the self-love piece. I’m still in the process of discovering what that means. I’m discovering a greater sense of it and what loving myself really looks like. Starting with MY truth and being honest to/with myself.
The pain is still there but look at the changes we have had to face! Seemingly negative changes that we’ve had to make…changing our numbers and email, losing friends, family, and so on. In many ways these are positive changes! I find that I’m now able to chose clearly who is in my life. I’ve been able to recognize negative people I’ve surrounded myself with for years. No more!
I choose all that surrounds me for ME now, and my truth that has set me free! I may be more isolated, but now I am surrounded my people who love me. And I am safe! I chose to be safe so that I can better care for myself. I am recreating and it’s so worth while!
It all comes down to this…this is OUR life. We must always come first in our lives. To attract good in our lives we must listen to and love our selves, in all ways. Good and/or what we believe needs some work. We must accept ourselves so that we are better listeners and followers to our needs. By being “selfish” good will come. This is our life, after all! We are the masters of our souls and fate.
I just want to remind everyone that at 9 east coast time TONIGHT (6 pm west) Donna is doing a radio program on sociopaths.
She posted the link on her lasted post today for all of us to listen to. I have listened to Donna’s past radio program as as you can imagine she is information & extremely articulate and they are well worth your time.
Let’s support Donna tonight & then post comments about her program and how it relates to our experience.
Thistoo,
AAAAmen!
And as for being more isolated in our lives, we can’t forget, QUALITY over quantity. Always!
😉
Remember,
Quality over quantity! Perfect way to look at it.
I’m listening to Donna right now on Bonie Kate’s talk show. I’m so happy Donna was born and created this site. Her ex was a blessing. She is a blessing to all of us. Proof that we have the ability to transform and re-create ourselves!
Thank, Donna!
All of us will be fine. It is just a very difficult path of recovery. It takes along time to heal from this manipulation, lies and betrayals. But we can do it. We have to focus on us, on our inner strength. Once I stopped focusing on him, on what he did to me, on thf other woman , I found my peace. We have to remember that it had nothing to do with us. It is him, his inner demons and HIS insecurities what caused this. We could be a top model, we could be Miss America and it still would have not made a difference.
Narcissists have such inner turmoil. Only the manipulatio of others gives them temporary relief of it. Once we ignore them they either get new supply or they will have to face their inner turmoil. It’s painful for them to be thrown of their throne , robbed of their god like image, reduced to basically nothing. It’s much easier and less painful to get a new minion. It’s a cycle that never ends. That is why I felt like a hamster running in this wheel , never getting anywhere with him. No matter how hard I tried , I never met his standard. Nobody ever will.
My ex also threatened me with getting fired from my job. I told my director and we sat down with human resources. It made me feel safe that they knew what might come. Of course I had nothing to worry about but they were aware of his threats. My ex went to the most extreme measures to annoy me, to hurt me, to push my buttons. He got no were with it. I had my arsenal of weapons to defend me, my attorney and the court. He can try all he wants. He will always be the loser. I can laugh about it now. 2 years ago I was a crying mess, I made it to my job every day and I prayed to God to guide me, to take over. You must keep your faith to master a trial like this. You cannot do it on your own. With my legal ho and God on my side , who could be against me ?
Legal help, sorry for the misspell
Inthemiddle
NMW says it very well. I feel what she says is perfect. We all have our ups and downs and at one point you will get there when you’ve had enough of feeling sad and angry. Only you know when they time is right. In the meantime, write and blog away your feelings because most of us have alot of internal crap to speak as well.
I know you don’t think it’s possible right now and it really sucks what you are dealing with but you’re right when you say nobody outside of LF understands. Don’t go to ppl who haven’t been there because they don’t understand and it will make you feel worse.
We understand here and nobody will judge how you feel xx
The other thing that is hard is that with me being alone with no one how do i nurture myself when i hate myself. i just read the other womans story about the guy and the trash bags in the oven and telling the other woman. well, i found out the wife went back. i dont want him to come after me for giving his wife the messages he sent me about our affair. he is denying it at work and telling people it never happened. but all the while saying that he did sleep with amanda. i guess having someone in your house and banging them is somehow better? I dont know if he is doing that on purpose but i hate this too. all the lies watching your back worrying if they are coming for you. I dont know how to fill an empty pitcher with holes in it and sorry looking at myself in the mirror i want to break it and looking at a flower isnt going to fix it either. i have no self esteem and dont know how to get it as i have been trying several things. religion, trying to meditate, reading it isnt working i hate myself and knowing he is back with her its like laughing in my face.
Is there a way you can avoid knowing what he is doing and who he is doing it with?
Do you have any ideas about what will help you feel better about yourself? Can imagine a way that would lead to peace for you? I really don’t know, but sometimes one needs to forgive oneself to move on, or make amends with someone, or even come to accept certain things about life suck and then make the best of it. These are just examples, I don’t know what is causing your distress. Maybe you have a sense of what is needed for you to move forward to better times?
Also consider that if you are taking antidepressants or anti anxiety medications, sometimes these have side effects that make people feel a lot worse and cause very dark moods.