UPDATED FOR 2020
A Lovefraud reader who posts as “LadyA” sent Lovefraud the following email. At the end, I suggest how she can recover from the sociopath.
I’ve spent a lot time thinking about my experience with my spath, and how it affected me and the people around me. I have read article after article, story after story. I now fully understand what spaths do and how they do it but I didn’t understand why I don’t feel any better about it. What was I missing?
When I left my spath it was a fairly dramatic experience. He had just been sentenced to serve jail time on the weekends for an obstruction of justice charge. My mom flew into town and in one swoop we packed up everything we could get in the car and left the province to go back to my hometown. I had to quit my job over email and send a goodbye text to all my friends.
I am thankful every day for what my mom did for me. I sure wasn’t happy about it at the time but I knew I needed out and this was my chance. What I didn’t know is how much moving back to my hometown would affect me emotionally. I had originally planned on only being back for six months. Just long enough for him to move on and get me out of mind, but it has now been just over three years and I still haven’t moved back. I got settled in a new job, new friends, and a new relationship. Even after all of this I haven’t been able to figure out why I’m not happy. Until three days ago.
Pride. I was proud of myself for the life that I had built. I moved 1200 km’s away from home right after high school to a big city. I was on the fast track to a strong career in a competitive field. I had a brand new car, paid all my bills on time, and was saving to buy a house. I was independent, reliable, strong, caring, and had a really great outlook on the world. Not many people can say that at 22.
All of that was ruined by a six-month “whirlwind romance.” I’m no longer proud of myself. I feel like I have failed because I came back home with my “tail between my legs” to my mommy. I no longer have a new car because it was repossessed as soon as I got back here. I am jaded, I don’t trust people easily, and I am no longer as strong as the face I put on the outside. I’ve gained weight because deep down I just don’t care anymore. My career is now on a plateau due to the location where I live. I don’t have one reason to be proud of myself right now.
How do I get my pride back when I know what happened? I want to feel proud of myself for my life but I just have zero idea where to start. I’ve thought about moving away again, but I don’t really know if that’s the answer. How can I be proud of what has happened in my life? I’m really honestly just so ashamed.
Donna Andersen responds
Dear LadyA,
I am so sorry about your encounter with a sociopath. Although this is not a normal breakup, the good news is that you can recover from the sociopath.
Right now, however, it does not seem that way. Why? I can see two reasons.
The first is that betrayal by a sociopath is a huge emotional injury. In the beginning of your email you said that, after all your reading, you now “fully understand what spaths do and how they do it,” but you don’t feel any better.
Understanding is a critical first step to you to recover from the sociopath. But understanding is an intellectual process, something that you do with your mind. The wound you experienced is also emotional. It needs to be dealt with emotionally.
How do you do that? You allow yourself to feel the pain of the injury.
This means letting yourself cry. Letting yourself scream and wail. Letting yourself experience anger — I’m sure there is anger — perhaps by working it out on a punching bag.
This isn’t pretty, and you probably want to do it privately, because other people often have difficulty being around this. Or, you may have a good therapist who can help you.
One way or another, any bottled up emotion you have within you needs to come out.
Underestimated the injury
Next you wrote that you identified the reason that you’re not happy as “pride.” But it seems like you are regarding pride as something bad, like one of the seven deadly sins.
You had every reason to be proud, because your pride was based on your achievement. And the sociopath took this away from you.
Here is what I think has happened: You have underestimated the scale of the injury, and the severity of the betrayal.
LadyA, you were building a life for yourself. You went out on your own; you started building a career; you were moving forward.
And some manipulative, deceitful parasite, who did something bad enough to end up in jail, ruined it for you.
Not only did he cost you money and hurt your career, he corrupted your outlook on life. You’re jaded; you don’t trust; you don’t care. You are not the young person you once were all because of the sociopath.
Recognize that this was not a normal breakup after all, you had to flee your home, job and friends.
Your life was shattered. Your psyche was deflated. This is a massive shock to your system. It’s no wonder that you are still struggling.
Drain the emotion
So what do you do? In my opinion, you do exactly what I suggested earlier — allow yourself to feel the pain now, knowing that the pain is bigger than you originally thought.
So you cry. You stomp. You imagine him standing in front of you and yell at him. (Do not, however, attempt to confront him in person. This would be counterproductive.)
The idea is to drain off the negative emotion.
As you drain the emotion, a void will be created within you. It’s very important to fill that void with joy.
This may sound preposterous to you, like you have no reason to be joyful. But don’t look at the totality of your life right how.
Do any small thing that makes you happy: Go for a walk. Play with your pets. Have lunch with a friend. Listen to music.
To recover from the sociopath, it may require many rounds of draining off the negative and replacing it with positive. But with time, you’ll find that your entire outlook will change, and you’ll be able to get back on track.
Importantly, with the wisdom you gained through this experience, you’ll never fall for a sociopath again.
Lovefraud originally published this article on May 12, 2014.
High school boyfriend pursues her, then abuses her
Annette-
I just noticed your comment about PTSD. You are so “on the money!” People often don’t realize that they have suffered a trauma in dealing with a psychopath. Their lies and other behaviors are a form of betrayal (abandonment) which undermines us at our very core, stripping away everything we believe and value.
PTSD can not only take hold in violent shock but in emotional shock as well. And many folks need serious therapy and support to put their lives back on track. This blog, and others can serve as a support for victims who are struggling to make sense of their condition.
Sandra L. Brown provides therapy and guidance through her books and Institute for Relational Harm Reduction. And I am attempting to bring about a paradigm shift in the laws regarding sexual assault so that society understands that when someone defrauds you of sex and intimacy, they are committing a crime.
At the moment, attention is being focused on the states of NY and NJ. If you have been victimized in either state, (or elsewhere,) please contact me through facebook: Carnal Abuse by Deceit, or my blog: http://www.CADalert.blogspot.com. “Liking” my facebook page costs nothing, but creates support for this effort.
Duplicity Undermines Consent in all things.
Fraud is a crime in all states.
Defrauding a person of sex is not seduction, it’s rape.
Many thanks for all of your support!
Joyce
Hanalei
I so agree with you. I don’t miss the sex, since it was so “robotic” anyhow. I do miss the drama and plans we had for the future. We wanted to travel more and have a condo on the beach and so on. I miss that the thought if having a secure life, being able to pay our sons college. But he took that all away because he thought of himself and himself only. He wanted a young girl next to him on public, not a 48 year old woman. But at the same I realize that the dreams we had were my dreams. He was planning his “escape” for years, just waiting till the son graduates high school.
But Hanalei we can pick up and build new dreams. That is what I am working on. It includes just me and that’s ok for the moment. I do miss my old life, definetely. Minus the abuse he inflicted on me for over 20 years. Minus the lies and cheating. If I subtract all this, there is nothing left to be missed.
I will never forget what he has put me through but I don’t think much of it anymore. I can tell that I can think rational about it instead emotional. In the end hd is the one who must live with consequences of his selfish behavior. Maybe all the sex and pervertness in him can make up for that. He has a very sad life now. Like I said before ,whores come and go, but family is for ever. He only had one child, my son , and losing the son was not something he planned. He had planned to put me into a mental institution or a jail but even his cop “powers ” were not enough to succeed.
We will be ok Hanalei. At least the thorn in our bodies is taken out. A thorn that caused do much pain.
kaya, I agree with all you’ve said, especially “the dreams we had were my dreams”. That was sure true in my case. When I met him, I doing a good job working on my dreams, and having someone to share them with enhanced them.
I was really in my stride when I met him and open to sharing and exploring with him. He took full advantage. I’m sure he used all he learned from me to make himself more attractive to other women and to hook his new wife.
I’m working on picking up and building new dreams too. I’m still finding my way. I know it will get better all the time.
kaya48 and HanaleiMoon
Again, it is so similar for me. There was a point in my marriage where I had this feeling that I was to be my ex’s social director, that as long as I kept him entertained, he would be my husband. But if he got bored with what I offered, he’d go find someone who did entertain him. If my ex misses anything about me, I think that’s what he misses. He lives only for immediate gratification, HIS dreams were Only about immediate gratification, but I was a VERY GOOD social director because I had MY dreams and they were about pursuing a life of quality, events that were varied and fun but for me, they were emotionally connecting, they fulfilled me. For him, my dreams were just entertainment, he enjoyed the DOING of them, but he wasn’t capable of the emotional enrichment of them.
When you list some things that you will never miss, I share the same list! (and probably quite a few that we don’t need to list!)
HanaleiMoon even lists the main form of abuse that I suffered. It was a nuance but so emotionally devastating for me. The set up where he lorded over me how I needed to be “punished” for failing to meet his unspoken demand. The rule was, I was to Please him (in his immediate gratification standard) and if I didn’t think of something NEW to entertain him, then he took pleasure in watching me emotionally suffer his rejection, his dismissal, his pronouncement that I had failed and “no. No! it’s too late. You can’t please me now. You made me have to go find it from someone else.” He ordered me to “learn my lesson” and left. I will NOT MISS that pit of my stomach feeling of knowing I was a failure, failed to please my husband, failed to show he was a king of his home, and that failure meant he was unable to show me I was his queen. In his logic, the reason I wasn’t going to receive what I desperately wanted, his good consideration of me, was ALL MY FAULT. After nearly 20 years, it was HARD to find new and fun entertainment for him. My dreams had dried up so I didn’t have that resource anymore. My friends had all disappeared so we had no social life. I was looking old, haggard, I was sick, sad, crying all the time. My time had run it’s course. He found NEW supply. Only in the end, they weren’t as good as I was, and he wanted to come back. But by then, I had chosen to LIVE, by then I’d rather be homeless than suffer anymore “blessings of marriage to him”.
I don’t miss the ridicule, the humiliation, the look on his face when he was a “WINNER”, won’t miss the constant rug being pulled out, won’t miss that sick in the pit of my stomach feeling. The horrid nuances that only I knew was the awful emotional abusive trap of him getting me to emotionally abuse and devastate myself while he looked on in GLEE!
And all the stuff that I do miss? I now give to myself or share with REAL friends, people who don’t withhold caring, concern, joys, encourgements, laughter, happiness, enrichment, etc etc.
NotWhatHeSaidofMe, I thought I’d report back on my friend and the planned lunch date. I’m a little sad, but proud of myself.
I texted her and said that I wasn’t ready to meet with her, but would like to write her an email if she was open to that (still giving the benefit of the doubt). She said ok. I wrote that over time she had said some things that hurt me very much, as well as some things that made me believe that I had no value to her as a friend (example: I don’t need friends, if someone wants to leave my life, whatever). That this was why I had taken the distance.
She responded by saying that she was aware that things she had said had “upset me greatly” and that she was sorry for being herself.
I replied that I was sorry that she didn’t say she was sorry for hurting me.
Her answer? I don’t write well, I guess I blew it and there is nothing left to say then.
I guess I should have left it at that, but I did respond this morning. I said, I practically handed it to you, you could have simply said I am sorry for hurting you and I value your friendship. I guess THAT says it all.
She was never going to say that, and I knew it in my gut. I no longer want to have false friends who can take or leave me. I will no longer accept being hurt by someone who calls themselves a friend, overlook it without saying anything. If I say something hurts me, someone who cares would acknowledge that.
Well, that was the last friend left from my life before I was discarded. Clean slate.
Oh HanaleiMoon
I am so sorry she turned out to be that way. I know how hurtful that is. We want so badly to be mistaken, that our friend will step up and show that they are caring afterall, that it was just a misunderstanding. It’s moments like these that I wish we were physically present. If I were, I’d at the very least, look you in the eye, squeeze your hand, and tell you what you already know, all your friendships will be real after this.
I had a best friend, someone from when I was 12, someone who was my ONLY friend in the days of huge abuse from my mom and siblings who HATED me. She was VERY important to me. There’s a whole story about how she was towards me, much of it not very nice. After I married my ex, I NEEDED her to be my friend, needed her to be my support, my encourager. Instead, she wanted him. She wanted to have sex with him. And I wouldn’t let her. She hasn’t spoken to me since the day I got married. For her, not giving her what she wanted was the end of me. She would ONLY be my friend if I let her have sex with my ex. But when I married him, I thought he was a certain kind of man and I didn’t want her to poison him. She told him and his family things about my childhood that they used to smear me to my community, she is my ex inner circle. I was excluded. And smeared big time. As a best friend, she knows all my hopes dreams, worries, mistakes, humiliations, she provided the ammo.
I was the one who didn’t ask the questions, when things weren’t right in our friendship, I stopped short of have that conversation with her that would reveal the truth that I didn’t want to know. It’s the same conversation you had with your friend. The one that finally irrefutably reveals they are empty and void, incapable of being a true friend.
I understand the heartache of discovering she was NEVER a real friend, that she was shallow, self absorbed, and thinking only of herself.
It’s been 18 mo since my divorce was final and I am amazed that I have made a couple of REAL friends. I thought I’d be alone the rest of my life. I don’t discuss my marriage, people have to know a sociopath to understand the nuances of the abuse. But these are smart women who are solid, not afraid to protect and defend their friends, are still friends when I wasn’t considerate of them as I should have been in the beginning. They said, they knew something bad must have happened to me in the marriage and that since I wasn’t immoral or unethical, they decided to let the door remain open to friendship. I don’t know how it happened, we just enjoyed doing the same things and we are all very opinionated but willing to hear others without ridicule.
I say this to encourage you that I lived a life with my ex and similar jerks, And when my ex dumped and discarded me, and then I refused to allow him back, it seems all my bad friendships went away too. I was alone. But now, all my friendships are deeper, based on SHARED values, respect, and most telling of all, empathy and encouragement.
Clean slate is sad, but also clean slate is wonderful. I can’t wait until the same magic happens for you, because I know I thought it would never happen, no friends for me. And I was FINALLY wrong about a GOOD thing! Ya want Proof? Look here on LF, there are many who would reach out and be REAL friends with you. It’s the same in the physical world.
Sending you my best, in prayers and happy thoughts of encouragement… NWHSOM (soon to be: It’s What I chose to be that matters)
Thanks for your encouragement Not and Kaya. Well, it seemed the story wasn’t quite over, since I just got an email from her. Here it is:
“The shame is I gave all I could to be your friend and it was not enough for you. Also, if you don’t see it there is nothing more too say. I do hope you find the life you want and the perfect friends who will say exactly what you want.”
UGH. She had to throw one last poison dart, and I’m not surprised that this would be it. She has completely discounted my feelings. Of course, I never expect anyone to say “exactly what I want”, but to just be KIND. She repeatedly said things like “you need to accept your life is over, you can’t have what you want anymore, just find a place where you can live out your days” (I am NOT making this up) and worse, that I can’t bring myself to write, basically pooping on things that really, truly matter to me. Friendship is not being cruel, it is being kind and encouraging. Her comments were not constructive, they were cruelty under the guise of friendship. They weren’t along the lines of you’ve been hitting the chocolate too hard, and it’s starting to show, maybe you should cut back a bit.
If someone I cared about said I had hurt them, the first words out of my mouth would be I’m sorry, I sure didn’t mean to. This woman wouldn’t have said this no matter what I said.
My therapist once told me that when someone hasn’t been treating you well but has been getting away with it, and you finally (kindly) point it out to them, you can tell how close to the truth you hit with them by how strongly they react. She said if they turn it around on you, you can be certain you are right on in what you are saying. Bingo.
Not, your experience in making new friends is inspirational to me and gives me hope for the future.
It has taken me 59 years to learn this lesson, but I think I’ve finally gotten it. I have a right to be treated with kindness and respect. All I did was speak up for myself, telling her kindly that she hurt me, hoping for acknowledgment. Instead, all she did was defend her right to be herself and hurt me one last time as she walked away.
Good riddance. Maybe getting this last bad egg out of the basket will clear the air, change the energy and open the door to good things.
Sounds like it’s time to stop interacting with her. You did all you could; and it’s her loss. She doesn’t value you nor your friendship; there are people out there who will. Sad, but you got some valuable information and you can have peace that you took the high road.
HanaleiMoon
EWWEEEEEWWW. Just in case you doubted yourself, she gave you more carp showing her true colors. She’s angry.. a narcissist angry that you might find “perfect” friends, that you have a standard of decency. SHE constantly sabotaged your well being. This is one “friend” that must feel empowering to be the one to say NO MORE to.
Care is not a hard thing to give/express, except when someone is narcissist/disordered. These type have no idea what the heck compassion and empathy is so they can’t give it.
I’d rather have NO friends than a friend like her. Now that you’ve taken out the garbage, your world will smell a lot better. And she won’t be able to run off the decent friends coming into your life. YAY!
NotWhatHeSaidofMe, thank you for your comments and support! Yes, her last words sure did show her true colors. She IS angry in general and clearly that I’m not willing to continue to take her sabotage.
I love your phrase: “People expect me to submit to that which they would NEVER tolerate for themselves”.
I feel a sense of relief, and validation that I am once again learning to listen to, and trust, my gut. YAY!!
HanaleiMoon
You need to accept that your life is just beginning, that by not accepting bad behavior from unfeeling jerks and not associating with those kind of jerks…
is what leaves potential space for loving positive energy people who are LIKE YOU, that is, willing to make IMMEDIATE amends because of reciprocal regard, such as how we apologize if we inadvertently hurt their feelings because they and their feelings MATTER to us, as ours matters to them… because that’s what REAL friends do.
You now have an emotional place where you can live out your days with people who cherish you, want to share good times with you, think you are a super inspiring and life affirming friend, who can’t wait to spread their blessings onto you, whom you will share good times and memories that make you happy to keep in your heart.
ps Sounds like your therapist is the same kind of jewel mine is.
HanaleiMoon
its enough we had and have physical and emotional stress with a sociopath/narc etc…now a friend has to be the same? i would think she’s being quite selfish and would want to help you instead of being rude at this time…you don’t need that
janedoe, isn’t THAT the truth!
I’ve had poor luck with most of my so called friends since the discard. Some just turned their backs on me, some drifted away when they realized I might need a little support from them for a change instead of the other way around, and some were condescending trying to “help”. This is the second one who was openly mean to me when I had the nerve to speak up for myself. Personally, I think she liked it that I was “down and out” (her often repeated words) and wanted me to stay that way. I had never once thought of myself as “down and out” even at my worst.
Thankfully, after the discard, I met a true friend. Everything about our friendship is a joy. She is the daughter I never had. She lives a joy filled life (and reminds me of me before I met my ex) and has a wonderful, loving husband who has also become a friend. Looking back, maybe none of my old friends had joy filled lives. My new friend has friends from childhood and college that she still sees regularly, even though they are far flung. I think this says a lot. She lives in the state I moved away from six months ago, and we’ve kept in close touch and visited once already. I’m looking forward to finding more keepers like her!!
Hanalei
You did the right thing concerning ypur friend. I admire you for having the courage to do that. I have a few friends left from before the discard. They were my friends and remained on my side. Those are true friends. The people who made stupid comments like “it takes 2 to destroy a marriage, you should remain friends, he is still the father of your son, I cannot believe you are letting such a handsome guy go ” and so on , those people are not my friends anymore. I don’t need that .
The only thing is that most of my best friends are married with a family. I just don’t fit in much anymore. Oh well, that’s not so much of my worry. I have the love of my son and my pets because their love is unconditional and won’t lie to you, ever.
Hanalei I think we are going to be just fine. Looking back I came so far and I am really proud of myself for standing up and saying “enough is enough.” I never thought I had the courage to do that, but God gave it to me.
kaya48 and HanaleiMoon,
I have a phrase that I say about those people who made similar stupid comments. About them, I say…
“People expect me to submit to that which they would NEVER tolerate for themselves”.
We’re going to be fine. We are already far better off than we were ever going to be allowed to be while in (UN)relationship with them. Hallelujah.
kaya48
Sometimes friends come into our lives and we share good times and we bond. But then we no longer have certain things in common and the friendship isn’t the same anymore. It’s not because either are bad people, it’s just that we’ve gone different directions. That’s the NORMAL cycle of friendship. We move on to make new friends that align to the people we are becoming.
Some of my past friends, from over 20 years ago, (before I met/married my ex) are now slowly coming back into my life. Our lives have circled back because they also grew in maturity these last 20 years, and we have things in common once again. Just like you found strength and courage from divorcing your ex, that kind of character is VERY attractive to people who share those values. It’s a kind of energy that draws happy people to you. But you do have to go out and about so people can interact with you and give the same back to you. I met some really terrific people just by walking my dog and met others at my community Leisure Learning classes.
Wish you were in my town! Don’t deprive someone like YOU to have a chance to meet you!!
Ironic
You are so funny. I feel the same way as you do. Towards the end of my marriage, he constantly pushed me away . Deep down I knew he was getting his sex somewhere else. Often he went to bed early and he just checked out of the marriage mentally, physically and on an emotional level. It made me so sad that he sometimes yelled at my son, his son for no reason at all. He was full of anger and hate.
It will be a very long time before I can even think about intimacy with a man again. Just the thought makes me nervous.
Looking at his financials he turned into court I noticed that he had absolutely no problem moving on, purchasing items in a sex you store and so on. It makes me sick in my stomach knowing that once loved that pervert.
Kaya48
Mine was the same! He’d take his sex addictions out on all of us if he’d gone several days without sex or porn…. makes me sick thinking about how long I stayed knowing that…. no wonder I’ve got hang-ups!
Many of the suggestions Donna made are applicable to me as the parent of a psychopath child. We adopted him from foster care when he was three. He didn’t show fear, love or remorse. We didn’t realize what it was until recently. He is 17 now. He has a felony charge hanging over him, he just dropped out of school and moved in with his birth mom. I have so many emotions flooding inside my head. What was this past 14 years all about? He lies, cheats, steals, and addicted to porn. We tried everthing. I feel emotionally drained. I’m glad he moved out, but sad because I love him. He said he will only come back for his next court date for us to take him. We have an appointment with a lawyer to transfer responsibility over to his birth mom. She wants him to live with her. I’m wondering how long that will last. He will turn 18 in August 2015.
cherry
I have a different situation in that my daughter scapegoats me, and lies about me, and she’s pretty arrogant, but she is very successful in her work and has a very very nice boyfriend. To keep him from finding out how much she has lied about me, she has erased, dumped, gone NC with me. The emotional pain of our disconnect is emotionally devastating to me. I thought when I got away from my ex, we would finally have the relationship that my ex did not allow.
Like you, I wondered what was the purpose of all the past years, what was it all about, what was real, is there any way to reach her, can I ever have a real relationship with her. How does her behavior towards me affect other areas of her life. I want her to be happy, how can she be happy with this HUGE disconnect. SO many questions and almost no answers.
jm_short gives you very good advice. I understand your heartbreak, I am too aware of your feelings. I am so sorry for what is happening to you. We hurt beyond being able to describe how much we hurt, and yet we LOVE LOVE LOVE our children in spite of what they do. I, too, felt emotionally drained. I tried everything. Nothing mattered, nothing changed the inevitable outcome.
Here’s the thing… as hard as it is for you to accept, the BEST thing for you is that transfer of responsibility over to his birth mom. I am thinking about future nightmares, like when a psychopath decides he is entitled to all your possessions. The thing about psychopaths is they are ALL capable of murder. They may not chose to, but they are capable of it. That makes them VERY dangerous. As they learn to scam and steal, they get more dangerous. Eliminating his ability to financial gain may help your future security, it will help to have a barrier so people can’t sue you for his actions. That’s the sad reality, that this transfer is actually a blessing for you.
And with some space, without him to pull your emotional strings, maybe you can find a way to make peace. It’s what I had to do. My heartbreak has not gone away. I feel like a failure, I failed GOD who gave me my precious child. But GOD knows what’s in my heart, so I do not feel condemned by GOD. I accept my wayward child is an adult, she has made her choices. And like me, and you, and any parent, once we became of age to make our decisions, then we CHOSE our path through life. The same with your son. Not 18 for another year, but old enough to make this choice, and he also has his own path in life. Not one you chose, but one of his choosing. We can keep our love and pray for their journey in life. And be comforted by knowing that we did our best with what we had. Sounds to me like you kept him out of trouble until you no longer had control over his choices. That’s all that you had power to do. Let the rest of it go to GOD. And now, let GOD protect you from him, starting with the transfer of responsibility.
All my best,
NWHSOM
Cherry-
How painful! Children can be dee-disposed to psychopathy. Current mental health professionals have linked the condition to genetics. I have a BPD’S son, and can look back and see how early the signs appeared in his development. His father is a psychopath.
Children with this disorder are unable to bond in the manner that involves love and caring. Their attachments are all based on their need. Much as you feel love and caring for him, his feelings are only skin deep. They will blow however he see his desires and self interests leaning.
You will not be able to snap him out of it, teach him out of it or love him put of it. In fact, his mentality will get worse as he ages. The best you can do is recognize the problem, don’t heap blame on yourself…. In fact, your love and the upbringing you provided reigned in the ghoulish character that could have developed.
Create some emotional armor to distance yourself. You don’t need to stop loving him, but you need to understand the nature of his character.
All the best-
Joyce
Thank you Joyce. You don’t know how much that meant to me to hear you say that. I wonder if we just didn’t get the right help soon enough. Not many of my friends I can talk to. They don’t understand.
cherry,
What I learned with my child, is that the “right” help would not change what she chose to do. You, I, could have done everything right, and still this would be the outcome because that’s they type of being that they are. So so sorry Cherry. He is who he is and you had no power to change that.
NWHSOM, Thank you ever so so much too. I knew this was the place for me to come to, and that you would understand. You have blessed me. I’m sorry you have gone through this with a husband and now a daughter. I realized the problem with our son before my husband. He would think I was being unreasonable. We argued over Aaron more than our other three bio adult children. My husband would defend Aaron. It brought a small wedge between us. Now he knows the truth and has seen Aaron for who he is. I bought one of the books Donna recommends on Lovefraud “Without a Consciense”. After I read it I gave it to him. His eyes opened because he has seen Aaron for 14 years show NO remorse, but never put 2 and 2 together. Thanks again and I pray for all of you. God knows who you are.
cherry
you have come to the right place…when i am in doubt, i come here and read everyones posts and its so helpful to either offer advice or to get advice…i ve noticed some women have had their problems many years now but are still talking about it and its great to know they are offering great support…i am more on the newer side of things, where all this is very fresh in my mind so i have a long way to get where these girls are…but its inspiring to meet such strong women and know that i too, can become that one day 🙂
I’m sorry to hear your troubles with your son, its disheartening when it involves children moreso than grown adults
hanaleiMoon
yes ick
he used to get this devious low kind of laughter when we were together if he couldn’t ejaculate..he would roll over and do this weird laugh…it was so spooky at times…i can’t believe i thought it but didn’t get the hint think more of it…i don’t know what it meant but it was sinister..almost like he was ashamed it wasn’t working,but the laugh was so evil
yes he could have relieved himself, in fact i believe he did most of the time…but i think in his empty mind it was an ego booster to connect with as many women he could find through the internet, all being complete strangers, it made him feel less rejected perhaps, due to the fact as a young child he was deserted by his mom who committed suicide and sexually abused him…was shifted to foster homes and different family members who were no good for anyone…why oh why wasn’t that my warning to stop this relationship when all those red flags stared at me waving so strongly…if someone related this story to me and they were just starting out with someone and had all these signs, ,my advice to them would have been “do not get involved with someone so damaged, you may end up being hurt”
i believe our eyes close to our own problems and open when it happens to others…
Jane D,
Was there a way that you could corroborate his story about his awful childhood? Spaths often lie about being victimized as children, and sometimes part of it is projection – they were actually doing the abusing in their past. It’s possible he really was abused and his mom committed suicide, but it’s possible he made it up.
AnnettePK
I thought the same thing about JaneDoe ex. There’s a lot I could go into but I don’t have time now.
JaneDoe.
MY ex would claim to his new found true loves that certain terrible traumas happened to him, but he was actually describing a movie he saw. I know. I watched the movie with him and the plot was exactly the same as his “abuse”. Furthermore, we were together over 20 years. If such had happened to him, he would have said so way back when we were dating and I had to tell him why I had nothing to do with my birth family (who are actually really horrid backwards trailertrash pedos, scammers, childabusers and thieves.
With a sociopath, you pretty much have to live as if EVERYTHING is a lie, because even if they do say a truth once in a while, you can’t count on it.
Cherry-
How painful! Children can be pre-disposed to psychopathy. Current mental health professionals have linked the condition to genetics. I have a BPD son, and can look back and see how early the signs appeared in his development. His father is a psychopath. He was considered “conduct disordered” at an early age.
Children with this disorder are unable to bond in the manner that involves love and caring. Their attachments are all based on their need. Much as you feel love and caring for him, his feelings are only skin deep. They will blow however he see his desires and self interests leaning.
You will not be able to snap him out of it, teach him out of it or love him out of it. In fact, his mentality will get worse as he ages. The best you can do is recognize the problem, don’t heap blame on yourself…. In fact, your love and the upbringing you provided reigned in the ghoulish character that could have developed.
Create some emotional armor to distance yourself. You don’t need to stop loving him, but you need to understand the nature of his character.
Losing a child to a character disorder is heartbreaking! I wish you all the best-
Joyce