UPDATED FOR 2020
A Lovefraud reader who posts as “LadyA” sent Lovefraud the following email. At the end, I suggest how she can recover from the sociopath.
I’ve spent a lot time thinking about my experience with my spath, and how it affected me and the people around me. I have read article after article, story after story. I now fully understand what spaths do and how they do it but I didn’t understand why I don’t feel any better about it. What was I missing?
When I left my spath it was a fairly dramatic experience. He had just been sentenced to serve jail time on the weekends for an obstruction of justice charge. My mom flew into town and in one swoop we packed up everything we could get in the car and left the province to go back to my hometown. I had to quit my job over email and send a goodbye text to all my friends.
I am thankful every day for what my mom did for me. I sure wasn’t happy about it at the time but I knew I needed out and this was my chance. What I didn’t know is how much moving back to my hometown would affect me emotionally. I had originally planned on only being back for six months. Just long enough for him to move on and get me out of mind, but it has now been just over three years and I still haven’t moved back. I got settled in a new job, new friends, and a new relationship. Even after all of this I haven’t been able to figure out why I’m not happy. Until three days ago.
Pride. I was proud of myself for the life that I had built. I moved 1200 km’s away from home right after high school to a big city. I was on the fast track to a strong career in a competitive field. I had a brand new car, paid all my bills on time, and was saving to buy a house. I was independent, reliable, strong, caring, and had a really great outlook on the world. Not many people can say that at 22.
All of that was ruined by a six-month “whirlwind romance.” I’m no longer proud of myself. I feel like I have failed because I came back home with my “tail between my legs” to my mommy. I no longer have a new car because it was repossessed as soon as I got back here. I am jaded, I don’t trust people easily, and I am no longer as strong as the face I put on the outside. I’ve gained weight because deep down I just don’t care anymore. My career is now on a plateau due to the location where I live. I don’t have one reason to be proud of myself right now.
How do I get my pride back when I know what happened? I want to feel proud of myself for my life but I just have zero idea where to start. I’ve thought about moving away again, but I don’t really know if that’s the answer. How can I be proud of what has happened in my life? I’m really honestly just so ashamed.
Donna Andersen responds
Dear LadyA,
I am so sorry about your encounter with a sociopath. Although this is not a normal breakup, the good news is that you can recover from the sociopath.
Right now, however, it does not seem that way. Why? I can see two reasons.
The first is that betrayal by a sociopath is a huge emotional injury. In the beginning of your email you said that, after all your reading, you now “fully understand what spaths do and how they do it,” but you don’t feel any better.
Understanding is a critical first step to you to recover from the sociopath. But understanding is an intellectual process, something that you do with your mind. The wound you experienced is also emotional. It needs to be dealt with emotionally.
How do you do that? You allow yourself to feel the pain of the injury.
This means letting yourself cry. Letting yourself scream and wail. Letting yourself experience anger — I’m sure there is anger — perhaps by working it out on a punching bag.
This isn’t pretty, and you probably want to do it privately, because other people often have difficulty being around this. Or, you may have a good therapist who can help you.
One way or another, any bottled up emotion you have within you needs to come out.
Underestimated the injury
Next you wrote that you identified the reason that you’re not happy as “pride.” But it seems like you are regarding pride as something bad, like one of the seven deadly sins.
You had every reason to be proud, because your pride was based on your achievement. And the sociopath took this away from you.
Here is what I think has happened: You have underestimated the scale of the injury, and the severity of the betrayal.
LadyA, you were building a life for yourself. You went out on your own; you started building a career; you were moving forward.
And some manipulative, deceitful parasite, who did something bad enough to end up in jail, ruined it for you.
Not only did he cost you money and hurt your career, he corrupted your outlook on life. You’re jaded; you don’t trust; you don’t care. You are not the young person you once were all because of the sociopath.
Recognize that this was not a normal breakup after all, you had to flee your home, job and friends.
Your life was shattered. Your psyche was deflated. This is a massive shock to your system. It’s no wonder that you are still struggling.
Drain the emotion
So what do you do? In my opinion, you do exactly what I suggested earlier — allow yourself to feel the pain now, knowing that the pain is bigger than you originally thought.
So you cry. You stomp. You imagine him standing in front of you and yell at him. (Do not, however, attempt to confront him in person. This would be counterproductive.)
The idea is to drain off the negative emotion.
As you drain the emotion, a void will be created within you. It’s very important to fill that void with joy.
This may sound preposterous to you, like you have no reason to be joyful. But don’t look at the totality of your life right how.
Do any small thing that makes you happy: Go for a walk. Play with your pets. Have lunch with a friend. Listen to music.
To recover from the sociopath, it may require many rounds of draining off the negative and replacing it with positive. But with time, you’ll find that your entire outlook will change, and you’ll be able to get back on track.
Importantly, with the wisdom you gained through this experience, you’ll never fall for a sociopath again.
Lovefraud originally published this article on May 12, 2014.
High school boyfriend pursues her, then abuses her
Under the radar
Good for you. Are you married to this guy and if you are for how long? Do you have children? I read an interesting fact today. That early on in the relationship/marriage there are usually so many signs already but we choose to ignore them. When I first met my ex I actually saw those signs. His bad relationship with his family , his lack of empathy and compassion for others , his horrible sarcasm, his pride and his love for himself and so on. I always thought he would change. But you cannot change a person. My ex thought he was perfect, he enjoyed inflicting emotional pain on me. And as my child got older I noticed that he loved manipulating my son. One thing he was not able to do was turning my son against me. When he stated that I was “mentally I’ll” my son would say “you are not a psychatrist or counselor , you are a cop, you don’t have 8 years of schooling, you went to the police academy for a few months , stop diagnosing my mother”. And then the ex would just turn around and leave, of to the little minions. Why I put up with it ? I now learned it was fear of the unknown , fear to lose my financial security , fear of losing him and being by myself. In reality I was by myself , he never cared about me or loved me, it was like an illusion of a marriage/family so it would look good to others.
And thinking back he was a pervert with his picture taking. It disgusts me and his porn addiction was very disrespectful to me.
My life is better now, maybe I don’t have this fancy house and I must work fulltime instead of part time. But that’s nothing compared to the pain I went through with him. I thought I was a princess , instead I was a prisoner of him. The receiving end of his anger, anything that made him upset.
kaya48
I do love how smart your son is.
There was a time when I thought my daughter got it. He did a lot of alientation syndrome tricks and she did follow his lead but her senior year, she caught on to how two faced he was.
But… sadly, she has rejected me and at the end, the only words I’ve heard from her were dripping with the same contempt and baseless accusations he used to abuse me. For ex: he said about me, how I was trying to live through her (no. I’m a normal mom who had expectations and standards, which form a foundation for adulthood self responsibility.) It’s such hogwash, as if I didn’t ever have friends and accomplishments and standards and a life… which I have gone back to now that I am free of him.
Kaya48
Yes to everything, it’s like my story only my path convinced all my friends that I was crazy because he never said anything wrong in public where we were involved. He’d never show his true colours to anyone we knew so all the confusion I was going through just made me look crazy….
I too cringe at how long I stayed and had all the same reasons you had although in the end I was more concerned with whether I was the one being judged. I’m so grateful that he crossed the line in his job yet I’m now not sure he’ll be convicted of his crime. He seems to be able to convince anyone of anything and this I don’t understand…
Yes to married for 14 years but while we combined a family of children we never had any together – that was a whole other mess I don’t want to think about!
Thanks for sharing as it gives me hope that I’ll be ok one day and be able to get over the trauma bonding that’s occurred as a result of spending years thinking of only what he was up to.
Not
Thank you. I am very proud of my son that he sees the father for whay he really is. He saw the truth in him even when I was under the ex’s spell.
I am so sorry about your daughter. Maybe one day she will also realize that there is no way to stay in contact with evil.
My son absolutely refuses to communicate with someone so selfish, so cowardly, so deceiving. He told me “how would it benefit me in any way? I am so happy this jerk is out of our lives, I don’t have to see my mom cry every day”. So true. I am so glad I was able to stand up and say “enough”. It was the best for me , my son and even my pets. They also seem much happier. 🙂
Kaya48
It’s early days for me but I have noticed something quite peculiar with my cat. He was a rescue while to young to be taken from he’s mother so he was very skittish and terrified of everything. I was his soul focus and for 8 years he followed me everywhere around the house.
The strange thing that has occurred since we moved is the return of his thick luscious coat of hair? You see, my cat would lose the hair on his back and around his tail every time he’d get stressed, which was more often than not, and spent most of his time hiding in my bed when visitors came. The thing is, we moved to a unit under my sisters house and they decided to renovate it for me so we’ve had trades here for weeks, every day, but the hair has returned? No amount of chaos and changes has affected him at this new home. Last week the path dropped my lounge off to me and came in to say hello to his much beloved and truly missed cat but the cat went berserk and couldn’t get away from him quick enough, the cat just cried at me to get him away from the path. I now wonder what he did to my cat when no one was home?…cringe!
undertheradar, I wouldn’t be surprised if your ex was doing something to your cat. It’s so terrible to think of! A short time before the final discard, I walked into a room to find my ex lifting my cat up and trying to put him on a high shelf in the closet, and the cat was struggling and hissing. I asked him why he was trying to do that to the cat, and said that I never had heart him hiss even once! He casually put the cat down and said oh the cat likes it and that he hissed at him all the time! I told him cats don’t hiss for no reason. After that, I noticed that my cat is very friendly with women but won’t come near men.
Before I got this cat, I had adopted a young kitten who was a few months old. It was during a mini-discard and shortly after my 16 year old cat had died. The ex had strictly dictated that there would be NO MORE PETS, but at the time, I thought the discard was permanent and so got myself the kitty. The ex came back into my life and was very unhappy about the kitten. I had him maybe three months when I got up from work in the morning and he was very listless and it scared me. My ex had been there the day before, and it had not been a good weekend. My gut said not to go to work, but to take the cat to the vet, which I did. I left him there, with the vet saying she couldn’t find anything wrong with him but would keep him for the day and I could swing by and pick him up on the way home. Mid-day she called me and said I needed to come right away, my cat had taken a turn for the worse and they could find no reason for it, but he was in an oxygen tank and near death. I had to have the poor thing put to sleep. The vet had done X-rays, blood tests and an ultrasound and couldn’t find anything wrong, which lead them to think he had been poisoned. They asked me if he had vomited, and I said no. I knew I had nothing poisonous that he could get into, and something didn’t feel right. When I told my ex, he acted like no big loss.
I didn’t think of it until after the final discard and recalling the cat in the closet incident, but I believe that my ex poisoned my poor kitten. It’s just terrible.
Under the radar
Wow, your poor little cat. That is so sad. When my ex left and came back to pick up a few thingsy pets didn’t even look at him. And usually they get so excited to see visitors. I truly believe they can tell who is evil. When anything would be wrong with my pet, it was my fault too. I was always blamed. Once my little dog got stung by a bee and I had to rush her to the emergency vet, my ex told the vet it was my fault. I was cussed out in the car and I arrived at the vet crying. Crying not only because of my little dog because of the ex ‘s insults. Luckily with vet Carey dog was ok.
Isn’t it nice not to walk on eggshells anymore? am so blessed I survived 20 years of his abuse. Just today I received a note from him again. He will not get any response , if necessary my attorney will respond. It’s the only way he cannot take my energy away. Energy I need for the healing of my scars of the past years. He will not succeed , no matter how hard he tries, he does not exist for me anymore.
hi everyone…i actually had trouble finding this forum on the left side of the page where i usually look, i thought for a minute it had been discontinued and i got nervous for a minute !!!
it seems as though things have been quiet through the week for most of us…
i feel as though I’m in a rut, yet again, and am not improving, its like i want to email him and see whats going on…i know damn well whats going on and if i contact him i will just hear the lies that he loves his new 30 year younger, pregnant wife, but on the other hand he loves me and what we shared and nobody can take this away from us…this is his usual statement each and every time we have spoken since he has done his crap to me and it was also what he would say to me when we were together…i even told him he is very scripted, everything he says is always the same as though its coming from a memorized statement….so why am i pining over this and want to contact him?? i have been up and down all week as far as my moods and eagerly waiting to hear from him as he promised…we have been NC on my part for five weeks and its because he is too busy or disinterested to contact me and i am sticking to my guns, but i feel as though the person i loved has just gone on and i am no longer anything of importance any longer and trying to convince myself that he is a sociopath! I’m having trouble with this…i was ok with it all for the first month and now the second month is approaching and its getting harder..why??? i am so confused lately 🙁
hi janedoe
just a user friendly note to you:
I had the same problem, trying to find where I had posted. Here is the same info someone gave me…
On the left, under the “Recent Comments” list is a box “Search Comments”. Just put in your name and it will display your posts. Click on any post and it will take you to the article.
NWHSOM
yep thats what i did and i ended up here on the right page….thanks 🙂
Hi Janedoe
It can be maddening when we realize we’re in PROCESS and it feels like we aren’t progressing. Breaking free of a predatory relationship is HARD! I can tell you truths, but until they are in your feeling part of your brain, they won’t take hold.
For instance: Try not to convince yourself that he’s a sociopath. Rather, assess whether he is. There’s a list of traits. Does he have those traits? If he does, then you have been validated by FACTS. You don’t have to wonder or guess or beat yourself up by thinking you have to convince yourself. Rather, you now know that you can make your decisions based on a baseline fact: He’s a sociopath.
There is NO reality with a sociopath. That’s why it’s so crazymaking!! That means the person you loved NEVER actually existed. What existed was who he PRETENDED to be in order to trap you and feed off your essense. Sociopaths are PREDATORY. They use guile and subterfuge.
YOUR feelings and your half of the relationship was real. But HIS was not. So without two halves, there was no real relationship.
It took a lot for me to finally get it into my thick skull, that he didn’t just not like me, that my ex actually hunted and trapped and drained me of my wellbeing. But once I got it, that he was ALL lies (like Donna wrote, from hello to goodbye), that there was NO meaning for him in our interactions, there was only USING ME, I stopped thinking of him and started working on making choices that empowered and supported and elevated ME and My life and My dignity, and MY honor, and filled my life with what mattered to ME. (haven’t gotten to dating yet, just have built my life around what interests and makes me feel energized and enriched.)
Stay the course Jane, more growth and reward that has NOTHING to do with him is coming.
NWHSOM
thanks for your reply and everything you say is so true and I know that..I just go up and down alot it seems and once the feeling that I’ve accepted the situation is gone I start all over again lol
I have gone through the list of traits for sociopaths/narc/ psychopaths and he has a few traits from each category…regardless if I were told he is none of them, his behavior is not that of a normal adult man. It is that of a very sneaky, cruel, manipulative con. That being said, and I know it’s so wrong, I can’t get over the hurdle to accept that he is not who he portrayed himself to be…I know he is though. I guess I keep coming bak to “what if” and that’s when I want to contact him, but I won’t, I know better.
Going from speaking many many times a day, being together when possible, someone who I relied on, someone who relied on me, someone who wasn’t perfect but certainly had “qualities I loved” to making sense of how in literally 24 hours he switched to not contacting me for weeks after he left for his new life, is so unlike what I knew! It almost seems impossible and that’s when I feel like this. I try to get my head full of the things he’d done that were wrong and cruel. I just wish the feelings of him doing no wrong would go away…logically he IS NOT someone I’d want to be with and knew this from the beginning but of course, ignored it and dealt with our time together. I almost feel like my ego has been hurt badly for him dumping me for someone he prefers…although is it even what he wants…he’s so mentally unstable in my idea of what normal is…and I know that
It feels good to vent and get it out of my system..it’s almost as though I want to do that with him, let him know again for the 20th time what he’s done, just so I can hear his fake crap of how he loves me, etc and then I can tell him tht I don’t want him…I almost want to hurt him with words to make him feel bad, although he hasn’t contacted me so I guess what I’ve said in the past has not affected him anyway…
Lol I’m rambling on, I know, thanks for letting me NWHSOM
yep Jane, you know things far sooner than I did. Like I said, I have a VERY THICK SKULL. God had to bashed me over the head more than once!
I learned to substitute, a little at a time. I purposely made NEW traditions, ones that I chose for a family of one. Me. All those years I was married, all our meals were cooked by me, but they were HIS fav foods. I didn’t have a single pizza in 20 years that I liked. Now I do. I also notice, when I am busy pursuing MY interests, I forget him. I don’t think of him at all when I am doing things he never liked. Yes, there are things I enjoyed WITH him, but for now, I don’t do them. I only do things he was NOT interested in doing.
Maybe later in life, I can enjoy those things again, but I prefer to not feed my heartbreak with memories of his false pretend, that I was so worthless as a human being to him that he could throw me away, that I was disposable. And as bad as he was to me, my greater pain is what he did to my vulnerable, innocent child. Convinced her that her mom did not love her but that HE did. Only to dump her, to dispose of her, when he dumped me. Because… he couldn’t have my daughter talking to the new girlfriends. She would know what he said was lies and she might tell the new victims the truth!
ps Jane, You can’t hurt him because he doesn’t have those kind of feelings. He can only pretend to have feelings because he knows YOU DO and he can try to trigger that guilt and pity in your heart and try to control you.
But… you can get some satisfaction by being and doing what feeds your heart and soul. After all, NOTHING he does will ever come close to joy. You are capable of good things. He can only pretend by eating his plastic grapes (a reference to the fox and the grapes fable.)
NWHSOM
you mentioned it took you a long time…how long is a long time?
Jane doe
I know you asked “not” but I would like to respond. It took me almost 2 years to emotionally , mentally and logically detach myself from my ex. I fivally find myself without a “racing ” heartbeat , without a rash when getting stupid notes from him with my alimony check. I was surprised at myself how calm and detached I stsyed during court hearing. But for that I have thank my attorney. He just told me the other day how proud he is of me. Not only as his client but as a person he go to know over the past 18 months. I took this as a great compliment.
I think by going no contact you don’t allow him to take your “good energy” from you. I started to focus on myself only. Before I woukd wonder “who is seeing , where he is living and so on”. With time I noticed my focus shifted totally away from him.
By far I am not ready to date anyone or have a close relationship. When a man at my work asked me out to go fishing the other day, I immediately said “no way”. I am not ready and I am content and peace on my own at the moment. It’s like I sm afraid that someone or sonething will take that peace away. This is why I am very close to God and my church. I know God will always be good and that’s just great.
Jane doe, your ex married someone else and they are having a baby. Let them be, I promise that he is not happy. And knowing that my ex is miserable is my greatest victory in all of this. I have no contact with him but if he was so happy with his minions why would he not just go on with his life and be happy. Because he can’t.
Hi kaya48
Although I addressed my post to NWHSOM, I prefer others to get involved as yourself because I value and appreciate everyone’s advice here so thank you
It took you two years you had mentioned to finally overcome the ruins of your ex…you had it much worse than me and you are doing wonderfully because people in your case have been destroyed for a lifetime. You moved onward from a man who could have continued destroying you and your son and that is probably your biggest achievement you’ve done in your lifetime not just for you, bu your son. I would pay myself on the back for doing what you’ve done, you shd be so proud of yourself. And you were alone because your family is in Europe, that’s a very difficult thing to do and YOU HAVE WON 🙂
When you say he my ex has moved onward and isn’t happy, I know this. He isn’t a happy person to begin with and he has ALOT of issues on his plate. He is a very nervous person to begin with and I feel this situation is not what he “really” thought would happen to him. He is now doing something that any normal person would not decide in a matter of week but would take at least a year to think things through..his impulsivity has caused him to move across the world without a job, marry someone much younger and get we pregnant, move in with her family, including her parents which are my exs age, and possibly rely on them for support at this moment. Now normally you and I would look at this situation and say “hmm I don’t think Ishd pick up to move across the world when I am very unsettled in my own life at the moment. This decision needs to be put on hold”. But kaya, he doesn’t have the normal function of a brain and picked up and left to do this, all the while being fully involved with me. What’s so stupid is while contemplating that sort of life, he was fully promising me with future plans of moving to be with me and continuing to get his masters and continuing with a career..this is a very unsettled and disturbed man, and I know NC is the way to go.
Why would anyone logically want to be with a person like I’ve described? What on earth is the attraction to someone so disturbed? It’s these thoughts that stop me from. contact plus of course what he’s done. But his decision (which is the best in this case) not to be in touch with me is not a nice thing to do on his part. I know when he is stressed he takes his present stressful situation, forgets the world around him and others that are important, and gives that situation his all. I know at the moment I haven’t been given a thought by him, so that too stops me from contact. I just have the difficult time trying to think like a sociopath, like him, because I know I would never be able to leave a person so distraught and laying there helpless, like he did because that side didn’t show when I was with him…for me, venting like this is very therapeutic, and thanks for your trusted advice kaya and NWHSOM xoxo
Kaya48, NWHSOM..
Oops I meant to say “I prefer others along with who I addressed message to (in this case NWHSOM) to get involved…etc
I didn’t mean to make it sound the way it came out above!! Sounds rude and as though I excluded NWHSOM…sorry 🙂
Jane doe
Thank you for your wonderful kind words. It feels great when people tell me that I have come so far. Severing a bond with a narcisisst /sociopath is not an easy thing to do. Divorce is always highly emotional and financially challenging. Adding the personality those evil mobsters are to the mess equals battling your worst enemy. Their sense of entitlement goes far beyond any legal orders or court orders. They do what they want to do.
I was addicted to him, just as you were or maybe you are still are a little. I knew like you how bad of a person he was and still mourned for him and begged him to come home, to not destroy the family. Only the long time of no contact got my emotions under check. My brain functioning as an individual again , not as a “prisoner ” of his treatment. It took a long time for me to think like a rational person. Andy attorney helped me more than my counsellor. When he asked me “give me one good reason to stay with this evil man and not get a divorce ?” I had no answer because he was right. The counselors still made some excuses for him, his childhood, his army career and on and on. Now, the lawyer told me how it is. No sugarcoat ing it. He said “let’s do it, I don’t want to see you destroyed. “. I know he wanted to make money, a lot of money, but he was still right. As a criminal defense attorney he met many people just like my ex in the course of his career. And he said “there is not one ounce of good in this guy”.
All this helped me to finally put my attachment aside and I started to see it for the truth. The truth set me free. What the ex is going now , who knows. He probably can be the pervert he always was trying to hide. If that gives him happiness , great.
Very strange about your ex to move across the world , get married and live of the in laws. I don’t see any clear thinking there. But I truly believe they act out of selfishness and self want and never realize the long term consequences. Then it’s too late.
Thanks again and so much good luck to you. I feel for you. It really sucks but I promise only better things come out of it. It can’t get any worse because evil is gone. :).
Sent from my iPhone
hi kaya48
no its not an easy thing to do but you have, and as well, you go on to give great advice which helps others, as well as myself, to see clearly when we feel we are at rock bottom. hearing from someone who has been there and who can’t judge you is more helpful than speaking to a friend who has not experienced what we have…they don’t know and just tell us “just get over it, move on, the guy is a jerk” That doesn’t help me at all, so know your experience is teaching others to be wise, perceptive and a chance for us to give our input when you need it.
when you begged him to come home, what was his response? or did he come home only to be the monster you knew he was? in your case, family is involved, you were married..that makes a world of difference and worth fighting for…i know in your case, in the end, you are much better off, but you didn’t know then as much as you do now, living through this gave you the wisdom and power to be what you are today. imagine a total stranger like your attorney even noticing “there is not one ounce of good in this guy” thats how apparent your ex is/was.
were you the first marriage for your ex? did you ever speak to other women who were involved with him, who received the same treatment as you?
yeh its nots too surprising for mine to pick up and leave across the world…he was always a restless soul, couldn’t stay put and got bored and antsy rather quickly…i used to make fun of him all the time about it and tell him he had ADHD…which he probably does.. he always had been on computer looking for women since i knew him, i let it go though..but the odd thing is that the women he stalked or try to seduce, never, ever lived in his own country. they were always from other countries and/or continents..he used to promise them visits and all kinds of sex…truth is i knew this whole side of him as i caught him on many social networks trying to set up things with them. i don’t know if he ever actually followed through or if it was just him “making promises” to these women just so he could get online sex? anyway, thats why it doesn’t surprise me he moved across the world..i could see a young guy maybe being curious whats out there, but a 60 year old man? i believe thats how he met his newest victim (his child bride i call her), through the net, she probably saw him as exciting, made promises to one another, he met her once last summer and wrote me to tell me that our visit coming up was off because he met someone and they are solidifying their love!! omg i laugh now but really? meeting one time in person and they were in love?? i should have known, he did this with me too…anyway it was only as i have mentioned so often just a couple months ago they married and yes he lives with her parents, how weird is that…i don’t know what they think, but its downright odd, if you ask me…shouldnt he be supporting their daughter especially someone 30 years older than her? like i said before i am not 100% he is a sociopath/narc, he has quite a few characteristics of each. if he isn’t, then he is just a cruel evil man, which in my book, is still just as bad…we know all this but we still love them!!?? arghhhh
we never had proper closure, we never said goodbye…its been 5 weeks now NC and i won’t write, although i expect he could possibly contact me eventually being the restless soul he is..
it just feels good to be able to explain and write it out on here and get my thoughts out…
your attorney said a great statement: “give me one good reason to stay with this evil man and not to divorce” when we can’t think of an answer, we know what to do….
Hi janedoe,
I haven’t posted in awhile but I still try to follow the blog. I’m so sorry for your hurt and anger, I know the feelings all too well. I know the ups and downs too, of doing really well for a few weeks, feeling good, feeling strong, then suddenly crumbling for days or weeks, full of anger, hurt, depression. I got to a point where I didn’t want to go out of the house. I’d go to work, but in the evenings or weekends, I’d not leave the house at all, and if I did, it was a quick run to the store or something and then back at home. It was like I felt so insecure and I felt like everyone (strangers) knew what had happened to me, like there goes the fool that fell for and got used by a sociopath. Sounds crazy, I know, but that’s how it went for me. I did not miss my ex spath at all (I don’t know if you remember, but mine was very evil and vindictive at the end, put spyware on, tried to put me in jail, stole from me, etc) so my feelings turned to disgust for him and that made the “missing him” part easier for me because he was so evil to me. I’m sure had he still been his “loving” and nice self, it would have made my no contact alot more difficult. But I admit, I had a hard time with the anger stage, if you will. I was so angry at all he did and took from me, and then off to move right in with another woman. Moved right in, no time wasted. It took me a long time to try to comprehend how someone just does this to another with no feelings or emotions. I struggled with it, but now, I guess I just let it go maybe? Or time is healing? Not sure if I can give you a definite on that, but all I can say is that for me, all i was doing was spending every moment of my time trying to research stuff on my ex. I’d find out bits and pieces of his past, or get information of the exes before me, some I’d speak with and all the stories were so similar with all of us. Each new little piece of info I’d dig up, I’d think Aha! See, he’s no good, or whatever. Then I thought to myself why are you doing this? It was bringing me further and further down. I wasn’t healing myself, I was still consumed by him, I felt like I needed to know things, but for what? To prove what he is? Maybe for closure? Not quite sure, as its such a maddening experience with spaths and its so hard for us to even fathom that someone could be so cruel and evil and just move on like nothing! Like absolute nothing! They don’t know closure, so why bother. They do not think like normal people do.
I lost my home because of him, which he then tried to sabotage the selling of the home, and some things backfired against him plus at settlement the perfect opportunity came for me to call him out on his behavior and tell him I’m on to him and I know he’s a sociopath and abuses all these women, basically it was like me being able to have the last word, and I thought Ahhh… Here is my satisfaction! But in truth, there really wasn’t much of satisfaction no matter if I had last word, or defeated him a little, because it was such a terribly sad moment where I lost my dream home, that I didn’t feel the satisfaction. It wasn’t a game to me, it was my life and my feelings that he destroyed, there was only heartbreak within me. Because that’s what we NORMAL people do in these situations, we don’t go running off to another country and get married right away or move in immediately! I know it’s spath style, but it kills me when they go on any kind of smear campaign against us, when doesn’t it look more unstable of THEM getting married right away, or moving right in? My family and friends would probably want to have a sit down intervention of some sort if I said “oh yeah, I just left so and so after ten years or more, but I’ve decided to get married to someone else next month”! They’d wonder if I was stable! Haha!
Jane, time is the only true, true healer in this. It’s not easy, I’m much better than I’ve been, but I can occasionally get those rock-bottom days. The no contact, and for me, no more digging up any of the past, his past, otherwise your still stuck in their world of wonder, of what ifs, etc. I did do a comparison of the good stuff vs bad, to see what I was actually missing and it can help when you see it in words on paper in front of you. We become addicted to their abuse, after time, it’s all we know for so long so it’s hard to break free. I started making myself go out more, even if it was just walking around the shops, or the park, wherever. Sometimes I just sit, (I love to people watch) but I’d also try to chit chat with strangers. I have a social personality (well I used to) but I was in his shadow for so long, I became so insecure, I was worried i,wouldn’t be able to have conversations with people, but as I’m breaking free, I’m realizing I’m finding myself again, I’m digging myself out from the grave that my ex was trying to put me in, so to speak.
You deserve so much more, more respect than what your ex gave you. To lead you into believing your relationship was more serious and moving forward then to marry someone else. I can’t remember, did he just tell you one day that he was marrying someone else? Did he tell you how it happened? Or how did he explain himself especially after leading you to think he was moving forward with you and that you were the one for him? If he can so casually do this, what kind of actual closure can you expect? And could you even believe it to be true, of anything he says or promises? And if your ex works for the gov or CIA, I would think that he shouldn’t have to live with her parents, right? That’s very odd to me. Think about what you lost, a man who lies, who leads you on about the future of your relationship, yet marries someone else, appears to live or have a fake persona or facade in his life, disrespectful, no empathy, among whatever else. If your good friend was with a man like this and was asking you for advice, what would you tell her? Probably something like you deserve better, to be treated with respect, and not someone who lies to you so much. You wouldn’t advise any woman to waste their time with a man like this. I’d think of my ex and even though he moved in with another woman, he still is an empty shell of a person, a black empty hole without a heart or soul. He’s a sneaky stalker, paranoid and trusts no one, and has a slew of exes whom he did all too similar abuse to. That is the entirety of his life, faking and deceiving. Now what kind of life is that?
My thoughts are with you my friend, stay strong! Tomorrow still comes and it’s a new day, a new start. But vent away, that’s what we’re all here for 😉
Thanks sashastrong for your response to janedoe, I got a lot from it 🙂
Hi undertheradar
Yes everyone’s advice is so good on here. I either am on here to post or just sit back and read what everyone has to say..I’m glad this is a grounded place to make me come back to reality when I just want to cry and I’ve had enough!!
Wouldn’t it be nice if it were a weekly meeting group and we could put the names to faces?
How are things with you? I’m sorry I didn’t have much to say last week when you wrote..but if I remember you had the kitty problem? 🙁
Hi Undertheradar,
I’m glad you were able to get something from my response, sometimes I find I’m able to give insight or advice but I can also be the culprit of not being able to hear my own advice! Haha! But I suppose we tend to be harder on ourselves either way.
It’s been awhile since I’ve commented here, so I’m not familiar with your story? Are you still involved or have you been complete no contact? Were you together long?
This is a great place for insight and strength for those days when you feel like you took 2 steps forward but then 10 steps backward! Some days I’d read comments and realize that others were describing my exact emotions that day or I’d feel so alone and after reading the blog, I felt alot better. We’re all here for one another, strength for each other.
Stay strong and positive undertheradar. 😉
Janedoe
I’m the same, but here because I don’t trust myself with the spaths ability to con me back into his life. LF is a constant reminder of what and who he is as I’ve got this strange ability to forget pain and suffering, or bury it so deeply that I’m easily lead into forgiveness…strange but a conditioned response from an abusive childhood, al in the name of self preservation!
I too apologize if I’ve missed responding to you! But I do value every contribution to this feed x
undertheradar,
It no longer surprises me what my ex can convince people. He speaks softly and so sincerely. But when a person has NO conscience, then sincerity is easy for them.
When things were bad at the end of my marriage and I was at wits end trying to figure out why, I went to his best friends wife and asked her for insight, or information about my husband’s history… anything that would explain his behavior. She told me that even though my ex claims them as best friends and knew him from birth, they weren’t actually close at all. They had no “real conversations” ever, just shallow chitchat about weather or town gossip. No sharing of emotional times, not even the normal “uncloseness” of men. She said they had acquaintances that were closer to them than my ex. So… even saying he had a “best friend” was a lifelong lie and that’s why he could smear me to them and they’d believe him, because it’s the closest he ever got to being emotional or connecting in a personal way with them.
Sashastrong
I have been on here for a while now but went under a name that resembles my real name too much so had to change it to avoid detection after I discovered several diaries had gone missing….
I only left my spath 13 weeks ago but it was in the planning stage for most of a year as I needed to rud myself of debt before I could afford to rent on my own. My spath was a policeman until he crossed the line and is currently under investigation for a child sexual assault while on duty – sad but not the only allegation! I never really had enough proof of anything except 1 affair he’d had but in the end I realized he just couldn’t have had so many allegations leveled against him without an element of truth to them, that and the energy he gave off, those little signs and instinct triggers! The arrogance and vanity was also a huge warning sign to me but I lived in the hope that it was all my own neurosis and I could fix it if I was the problem… I’m also in Australia if that rings any bells?
hi sashastrong
yes i remember your story vividly…and you are right when you say because he was so evil it was hard to miss him…i agree 100% with that…i wish mine had been not so “loving” and “remorseful” because it would be easier to hate him
i am at the point where you stated you couldnt understand why or how he could just pick up so quickly with another woman and move in with her?? i am stuck with that! if he had been doing the mean things yours had done, i would be saying “good riddance” and “good luck to the OW”
your so true when you say they are not remorseful, there will never be closure with this type of person…and to look info up on them, yes is a no-no…that i can say is my only strong point in this situation…i had to stop that otherwise each time i felt a little better, finding something new would just bring me down. you were right to realize that and only with time and when we are ready do we allow ourselves to stop punishing ourselves that way! its pure torture and not healthy!
a friend of mine wanted me to see his wedding pictures he posted so she sent them to me…i would never have gone on his fb to check up on him, but she sent them and i saw them and exactly what i knew would happen, happened…it set me back further and was so upset.
he didn’t tell me he was marrying this young girl until the day it was happening, til he was leaving for her country..i believed it up until then. we had just spent a week together, he went home to his country, then he told me what he was doing…
i knew through our time together he was lying, i caught him numerous times, i let it go. i knew as well he would sleep with others, he told me, i was hurt, but let it go…he told me when he met this woman…he emailed me telling me a year ago when they met, he loved her, she loved him, they were marrying and our upcoming visit wasn’t going to happen…i should have ended it right there…he didn’t end up a year ago with her like he said, he went back home to his country after being in hers “for work” and insisted that we continue, i was the only one ever in his life…blah blah, i fell for that too…we continued our daily lives and numerous daily communications together and spent much time together up until this summer…he left here to tell me a few weeks later, he was marrying her…so he kept me around that whole year lying that she was a tramp, a lowlife, scum from the lowest part of the world…never would he touch her again…etc…
up until he had to leave for the airport he was in constant touch with me, even saying he didn’t know if this marriage coming up should happen…he didn’t know what to do, but he had to go there because thats what they planned..he would continue contact with me as i was the most important person to him..well…i didn’t hear from him for three weeks and i contacted him finally to see what the hell happened with him…his response was “my fate has been sealed, we are married and she is pregnant”
we continued on and off contact for a short time, again i was so important and loved me from deep within..etc.
the hard part is trying to understand how they have that niceness to them and there must be some mistake that he has this conniving and sneaky, cruel side to him…
as you said sasha, time is the true healer…i don’t want to hear from him or check his fb or see what he is doing because I’m scared to do it and fall backward….
you know how you were saying you said nothing to him, that at one point it was time to get your revenge and tell your ex all hehad done to you that the fact you lost your dream home and what he did to you was so devastating? I’m not sure if you meant you did or did not say anything to him? what has happened with the situation now?
i am glad you are finding happiness and moving on..you sound very much at peace with yourself and it sounds beautiful!! i thank you and everyone who gives such wonderful inspiring words…xo
janedoe
My ex had the unique ability to string people along, women and men. I called them his back burner gals. (My ex also was able to have LOTS of men have mancrushes on him, those men loved him completely and were like women, they were vicious and angry, accusing me, his wife, for coming between them in their relationship, as if I should know to step aside for the one who truly loved him.)
Anyhooo. LOTS of women were kept on the backburner. They were used when the front burner exited the scene or failed to come up to snuff, as punishment for failing to keep him entertained or punishment for whatever infraction that my ex felt annoyed by. My ex would NEVER lose his temper, NEVER reveal to anyone that they displeased him. He just got even. He dangled that carrot and those women waiting for him to call, they went on with their daily lives, but at the drop of a word, they were instantly available to my ex for whatever he wanted.
When I read your posts about your ex, it reminds me of my ex…. dangling that carrot, making promises to see them. My ex NEVER said goodbye to someone that he intended to continue to con. And he sure didn’t say goodbye to the ones he conned either. NO CLOSURE!
Another thought comes to me when I read your posts, how you said your ex would pick up and leave across the world? That would be so typical of a conman who learned he could get what he wanted, and skip the country without any accountability. When I think why would a 30 yr old’s parents have no problem with him living with them? I can’t help but think he’s conned them into thinking he has something to give, like wealth. And once he’s scammed them, he exits.
You’ve mentioned more than once how loving and remorseful your ex acted when he told you and left. Yet OMG… he acts like he expects you’ll want to be there for him when he is done using her and wants to come back. As if all he is doing is okay and not completely NUTS!!
Decent people do NOT do what he has done to you, and being nice about scamming you only sets you up for more. At the least, it gets you to question whether he is really that bad. Jane. YES. He really IS that bad. WORSE. He is a typical conman.
Sociopaths don’t HAVE to murder. But because they have NO CONSCIENCE, they are ALWAYS capable of MURDER. And can do it anytime. Chosing NOT to murder is not the same as being a nice guy.
My ex was 50 when he nearly murdered me. But everyone in our community would swear on their life that he was the NICEST guy in the world. Of course, they never saw how he was behind their backs…
Janedoe,
Do you believe your ex is telling the whole truth about the situation? I was only curious and then I started wondering if he’s really telling the truth about her pregnancy? It just popped in my head? What does your gut tell you about that?
At one point in time, my ex was very kind and loving and we used to have great times together. He had me right where he wanted me, had me fooled, knew my actions, knew my ways. But once things started to unravel and I was uncovering more and more of his lies and secrecy, I was done and I wanted out! I believe that he became so vindictive because things weren’t going HIS way and he wasn’t able to do his discard on me, rather i was leaving him. Overnight he went from that kind loving man that he once was to a complete raging devil lunatic! Has to be on HIS terms! I remember at one point feeling so crazy because where did this person suddenly come from? Or am I that stupid? I didn’t know the things that I know now about sociopaths. It was very difficult to wrap my head around how someone could become so cruel and evil.
My last tie to him was the home that we sold. At settlement, he was furious and was trying to get under my skin but I just ignored him, he kept wanting to tell me that I had some of his property that he wanted back. I thought are you freaking kidding me? He’s got some nerve! This lowlife was literally stealing personal belongings of mine and probably giving them as “gifts” to his new woman yet he has the nerve to say I have his property. But that’s how spaths are, they think they’re so entitled to anything! What’s his is his and what’s mine is his, but not the other way around! Mine was also the secretive type, he wouldn’t rage or let his mask slip in front of others, he wouldn’t expose himself, no way. But Yes, I did call him out before I left, I did tell him he’s a narcissist sociopath and I know how he goes from woman to woman abusing them. I told him what a lowlife disgrace he is. But honestly, afterwards I thought, sure i was able to call him out on that, but I’m sure he could care less! Probably the only thing that might have done for me was keep him from returning and messing with me at any point. I’ve read that they tend to leave you alone if you exposed them for their true self. But who knows for sure?
I know what you mean about looking at anything about them, especially pictures. It triggers that deep emotion in us. I agree that it just sets us back again. And we know that will happen, yet we still freakin look! Why do we do that to ourselves? I guess for me, sometimes I feel that if I saw or heard anything bad or negative in his new life/relationship, it would verify to me that he’s still the same and not a good person. Because let’s face it, I can’t deny wondering at times if he’s going to be better or different with her, a better person who won’t lie and cheat
Eventually you look back and you realize how unhealthy your relationship was. I finally feel free of that tension filled sick stomach feeling from him. I try to focus on me and my interests, I try to get involved, I make myself go out, I’m lucky to work with a bunch of great supportive people whom I’ve become very close with and we do alot of happy hours and work get togethers. Friends have commented to me about how good I look, how happy I finally seem, how I give off all positive energy. Just today at work, my friend gave me a big hug and told me how proud she is of me and she sees so many changes. It makes you feel good about yourself and makes you want to keep working on yourself and your happiness. And that’s what I’m trying to do, I’m still struggling with forgiving myself for all this. I’m not there yet, I’m still mad that I was so stupid and ignored red flags. But I know that I want to heal me. I’m nobody special, I want what every other woman wants, respect, happiness, and love to share with a companion whom I can trust and be myself with.
Stay strong, you’re worth it and so much more!
Janedoe
Thanks for showing me that I’m not alone. You are just as inspiring to everyone as they are to you.
Sashastrong
Thanks for the lift up the ladder from nothingness to hope. Your response to Janedoe has inspired me.
Notwhat
OMG! So true so true! My path never lost his temper outside of our house either. He had every person he ever met conned by the mask! Even his best mate doesn’t know the truth behind my departure from the relationship, even though he’s sat there, in front of them, crying and remorseful but only said he’d taken our relationship for granted and was determined to get me back?… When his mate’s wife told me what they were told I was shocked! If he can’t be authentic to his best mate then he can’t be authentic, not even to himself!
You’ve put into words what I’m feeling and seeing and I’m truly grateful for that x
Under,
Your observation is accurate that they are not honest nor authentic to anyone. We often think there’s something wrong with us that causes them to treat us badly. But they are the same way with everyone. If someone is honest then he is always honest. If someone is sometimes honest and sometimes not, then he is always dishonest and whether he is telling the truth or lying at any given time, it is always manipulation.
Jane doe
I am glad I can be some help for you. When I asked him to come back home I got snooty answers like “why would I come back to an insane b****like you, you are the reason I left, you are mentally I’ll, you are old, fat, you’d hair is too short”. Of course he inflicted more pain with that but in reality I asked for it because I talked to him in the phone, emailed or messaged. He was never remorseful or sorry , he never asked about the pets, rarely about his son. So my little investigations showed that he was indeed seeing that coworket which he had exchanged nude pictures with about 8 months earlier. I did confront her on the phone once after I found out of course she denied it and the next thing that happened was he placed a temporary injunction for domestic violence against me. This is when I met this awesome attorney. I needed someone to defend me in the court hearing. I went to avvo (lawyers advice website ) and found him as he was both a criminal defense and divorce lawyer. He was so good in court and basically destroyed my ex since it was all false allegations. He claimed he was in imminent danger of me. He is retired army and a cop. Sure he was afraid of me, the little housewife.
After the court hearing, my lawyer and I sat down and prepared the petition for divorce and I also started the no contact. When the ex was served his papers by another cop he immediately texted me “if you think I coming bs k by you filing for divorce you are wrong “, this is how vain he was. I served him divorce papers and he truly believed I wanted him back. I have my lawyer $4000 and he thought I did it as a way to get him back. It ended up costing over 14000$. But so worth it.
My ex was also always searching for “whores” on the Internet and of course at work. He was obsessed with havibg a young woman by his side. The minion was like 20’s. And I hate the lies. They got so ridiculous and I believed them.
You will be better without him. I would rather be by myself than have a liar or a cheater by my side. I know it hurts and it is difficult but there is no other choice. Yes my lawyer only dealt with him in the injunction and he knew exactly how evil he was Of course in the divorce my ex hired a female lawyer to represent him. But she did an awful job. His good looks did not help him much.
Life is better now. You know I am much calmer and I am satisfied with what I have. The Crazy making is over and that’s so important.
I am proud of you for the no contact. Does he try to talk to you even though he married someone and has a baby on the way ? Do you know that for a fact ? Maybe he is making it all up?
hi kaya48
thanks again for such insightful information that you always have 🙂
do you know if the woman you contacted is still with your ex? do you know if anyone or her have ever experienced what you have gone through (minus the marriage and child)?
i had to chuckle when you mentioned he said you were causing danger to him?? yeh, right! like you said, a little housewife and a huge ex army and cop!! F*** they are so unbelievable they should not even have to open their mouths to say such dumb things, it should be written on their forehead “I AM A LOSER IDIOT” when they are born..
yes absolutely we are better off without lying and cheating…but somehow i think WE think our love goes beyond that..we think of what they “offered” us and told us they were, we have to get over that, which is the hard part…i can see where anyone is skeptical in who they meet, especially nowadays since online dating is the way a lot do it…the future will be full of weirdos who mask who they really are because its done online..
thanks for the encouragement kaya…and he hasn’t contacted me for the past 5 weeks, since he wrote me and said “even though we have had twists and turns you are and will always be a big part of my life and i love you very deeply…kisses from afar”
in this message he started by saying “are you playing games by not writing me? i usually wait for your email before i respond to yours”
i wrote him back and that was the last message i sent…”no i am not playing conniving games, i was not taught to do that…i wrote you two emails dated aug 23 and 24 in response to yours you sent me..if you would like i can resend.. in them i said a lot of stuff to you pointing out what you have done to me and to us, the promises that were made til the day you married, i believe you are now twisting it around…you have no answer to any of the truth i pointed out but you don’t want to say YOU ended contact with me, so you are saying you haven’t received anything from me…respond if and when your new life allows you to”
Kaya i would never come between a married man and his wife, ever! but i am not the cheater here, we had the relationship for a few years, through all his lying and cheating with others, and he met up with her and married her…he made many promises to me that he wasn’t marrying her, that he hated her and her family, they were disgusting, etc…and i fell for it all…next thing i know, he is married and she is pregnant…
the only thing he has ever said in his defence to the damage he has done is “i never intentionally lied to you. i misconstrued things a bit so as not to hurt you”
and YES you are possibly correct that she may not be pregnant, but i won’t ask, and i never acknowledged it when he told me…he always embellished things when we were together or whatever truth he told he made it sound like it was this huge deal and very important…i guess like you, being in the army, association to police and the govt, they think they are gods gift to the world…
NWHSOM
you’re correct about everything…evrything you say, i know is true..it almost as though this whole situation has made me doubt things, or not want to believe things, until i hear someone say what is happening, i snap back to reality!
i don’t know what he has told her family, but when i called him on it, saying why would anyone so young’s parents allow this? he never had an answer…just always skipped that part of my messages …conveniently. i think he has made them believe he is “security” for her, being older, and an american citizen and she comes from a lower class background in a communist country…i think he has promised them things that he probably can never achieve, he wasn’t that high and mighty before he met her, unable to find work most of the times, just no direction in life for a 60 year old man..so yes, he most likely lied to them all..before picking up and leaving to her country he had told me maybe a week or so before, he was contemplating making his home here with me..what crazy lunatic can switch ideas about where they will settle for their life in a weeks notice…??
he was weird in the sense of all the women he “scouted” were never from his country…maybe it was too close to home for him, people would probably find out what he is if they lived in the same vicinity as him…he has been everywhere and that was his dream to just go with the wind around the world…a little unsettled..i knew all this and thought all this when with him, but figured love conquers all..
as you go on to tell me bits of your story these are details i hadn’t remembered fully but now its all coming back to me….i remember how he had men and women at his disposal as you mentioned…did they not care how he treated them?? and the fact he tried to murder you didn’t scare anyone away from him?what had he done to you?……please tell me he is not around!! was he not worried about any STDs or did he just not care…??
How are things going with your daughter and yourself? i do specifically remember he turned her away from you very viciously where she believed him..but she seemed help if i am correct?
Hi JaneDoe,
Sociopaths bait their victims by promising them what they want but it’s a scam, they can’t deliver. There is nothing wrong with wanting financial security. The most valued USA commodity in a communist country is USA citizenship. I imagine your ex promised USA citizenship or at least implied it so strongly that he led them to assume it. I bet he’s done it before. I bet in another country in this world, he is legally married.
My ex has convinced people that the reason he treats them badly is because of me. I am to blame. They believe his smearing of me, and that I deserve whatever he did to me. They don’t know about his attempted murder. He is far away from me but I remain vigilent and protective of my safety. No, he did not worry about STD’s. Again, He has smeared me. I am sure he blames me for his STD. Yes he infected me with an STD, that’s how I found out about his cheating.
My ex has alientated my daughter from me. He did this when she was young. For a while, when she found out about the cheating, her eyes were opened to his duplicity. Plus, he had discarded her as well. But lately, she is completely hostile towards me and has cut all ties with me. Until she is willing to listen to me about what was done to me, she won’t grasp what he did to her, how he smeared her, how he divides people, pits them against each other. I am loyal to her, always have been, always will be. But I will not accept her definition of ME, because it is HIS definition, it is NOT who I am. And she refuses to get to know me and see from my friends, my lifestyle, my personal history, my patterns of behavior that I am NOT what he said of me.
I hope you are coming to understand the kind of predator your ex is. He speaks softly but that doesn’t change that his BEHAVIOR is that of a con man. And that he expects you to be okay while he cons this family and welcome him back when he is done using them. He’s so slick, he’s slimey (what I say about my ex as well.)
hi NWHSOM
what a horrible horrible way for you to find out through STDs that he was cheating…did he know he had them and purposely spread to you or did he not know?? how did that all pan out or take place?? i hope for you, you are well and have not been affected seriously by this…yes it is horrible to be married to an idiot like this but to have get the germs he has contacted or given to/from others…i just hope he wasn’t aware he had anything because that would be pretty bad if he did that on purpose
poor you to have gone through all of this…attempted murder, std and your relationship with your daughter..what happened with the attempt to murder you? had you reported this?its only now that your daughter is taking his side and believing what he says about you..is she aware of what he tried to do to you with attempted murder?i am surprised knowing from an early age what he did to you, hasn’t stuck with her? i gather she isn’t living with you and old enough to be on her own…but her being an adult, is upsetting to see she won’t budge on her decision and it’s only now she has taken his side..some people can be going through divorce and not involve their children or turn the children against either parent..its sad to see so many of the sociopaths have the intention of turning close loved ones against one another…why is this part of being a sociopath? i too, hope for you, she comes around, perhaps goes to therapy with you to discuss how her father treated you and her, while he did what he did. I’m sure you have suggested therapy to her and she wants no part of it. because for you it would be so nice to have your daughter as a friend through this bad experience..
.i do think you are correct by saying all mine has done due to his american citizenship, he also has a citizenship to live in europe, so he has dual..i wouldn’t put it past him to have mistresses he has promised all over the place, or even wives..promises he makes to them all. but in his current situation i know when he was busy trying to convince me for the past year his recent bride was scum, he told me she had only wanted him so she could get out of her country…oops! he slipped by saying that, because thats probably exactly what he promised her…if i compare what I’ve found him saying to me while busy love bombing me with marriage proposal, having children with me, a life with me, i do not underestimate his ability to promise her all she wanted. when he contacted me after he married her, he mentioned he would be staying in her country for the foreseeable future..i guess she could not leave like he promised her?only problem is i needed nothing from him, so perhaps thats why i was discarded…and also the fact i called him on all his lies and cheating which he thought was ok to do from time to time…yuck
slick and slimey for sure
JaneDoe
You give my ex WWWAAAAYYYY too much credit. My ex is a sociopath. No feelings. No morals. No conscience. He is a con man. He intended to murder me. The ONLY reason he didn’t complete the act was because he was interrupted by a surprise arrival, someone who would have been a witness. Considering that my ex is a sociopath, it puts infecting me with an STD as kinda irrelevant to him, ya know?
I am sorry but you seem to be misunderstanding what it means that my ex is a sociopath. But I do understand what sociopaths are capable of and what matters to them.
That’s why I know that Your ex has not discarded you. He just put you on the shelf until he returns and needs something from you. How do I know? Because he contacted you after he married her and threw you some crumbs (promises). He broke his promises but I predict he’ll return and make some excuse and expect you to take him back, after “allowing” you to punish him or make him show he means it this time. Your ex is like those inmates in prison who check out the guards to see which one will accept crossing the line, and once they know the guard will cross the line, the inmate knows it’s all a matter of degrees, but that the deal is done.
If you think I sure don’t like your ex, you’d be right. He’s got you questioning yourself, doubting your judgment, focused on him instead of who really matters: YOU. For that, I don’t like him one bit.
The other con man crap he’s done, seducing some young woman in a vulnerable place in a country where her choices are limited? That’s just extra proof of his depravity, proof of his controlling, predatory nature.
But then, I could just be all wrong! Right??!!! Because he’s just doing what normal people do. Yep. Yessiree. Yip Yap Yup.
NWHSOM
I 100% agree with you and how you feel abou your ex. There is no forgiving what he has done to you, at all.
I am kind of new to this all and just starting to discover what all these terms mean, as I have not heard of it all before. you have been through such trauma and am certain you know what these cruel insensitive con men are capable of.
If I said anything to offend you I am very sorry, I didn’t mean to give your ex credit, that was not my intention…like you said they are slimy and disgusting, no ifs, ands or buts
Oh No JaneDoe
I didn’t think you said anything offensive at all. You are a VERY nice person and my point was that you were giving him the benefit of the doubt, and he doesn’t deserve such kindness. I sure don’t have any for him, but then again, he did pretty much destroy my precious daughter’s emotional well being, so much so that she has no clue who loves her and whether that is anything she even wants in her life.
pps JaneDoe
It’s the same reason your ex does not deserve you. You are the epitome of what we all would define as a good woman. You deserve a man who will appreciate the value of that gift and NOTHING LESS. Your ex is NOT THAT MAN.
NotWhat, you got me thinking here…… Do you believe that most spaths return at some point if they want something from you? Do you think there are some that never return? Ive read and researched till I’m blue in the face, and it appears that if you left them first and/or exposed them then they are most likely to NOT return as they now see you as a dangerous threat to them?
Got me thinking because I recently posted about exposing my ex and thinking that he would never return but after reading your post, that uneasiness crept into me and got me wondering about mine? I know that every situation is different and anything can happen, I really don’t feel or think that mine will return, but maybe I wouldn’t be so sure?
sashastrong
My ex is a sociopath. That means he is an opportunistic predator. When he wants something, he casts his line and trolls his bait. If he’s hooked a fish before, he troll his line with his bait in the same place he hooked his victim before. Did you read the article about the 37 years of Lies man? He abandoned his wife for 37 years! Then when he got found out and when wife #4 (he committed bigotry) dumped him, he tried to go back to wife #1, the wife he abandoned in Canada, done by fraud because he committed arson and led her to believe he died in a fire of a BEAUTIFUL old barn.
SOME people here on LF call their ex’s sociopaths when it’s clear they are likely borderlines or merely narcissists. ALL Terrible and dead end, no cure and predatory. But I’m only talking about sociopaths.
I will tell you that I do not do ANYTHING to get revenge on my ex. I get satisfaction knowing that he will do the revenge for me, just by being himself. ps I don’t play with any type of pit vipers.
I don’t know what you’ve read that led you to believe they use you and never return. That doesn’t fit the profile of a sociopath. They aren’t intimidated by anyone, they have contempt for their victims, they don’t view them as a threat, not ever. No sociopath feels any fear. The absence of fear is a hallmark of a sociopath.
Read Dr George Simon. He’s a psychologist who does not avoid the reality of sociopaths. Here’s a link to one of his interviews.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tracy-schorn/divorcing-the-character-d_b_3001431.html
Sashastrong
So much information to read about them and some of it is conflicting…
Just to give you an example; I’m moved out 13 weeks ago from my spath, policeman, husband that crossed the line. He knows that I investigated him and have enough evidence to support the investigation and send him to gaol…yet he is still begging me to return, acting as though none of what I know is true abd thinks that I’ll get over what he did and move back in to resume the false front he portrayed. Now who is the crazy one in this picture? Not only have I unmasked him but the law is just about to expose his true colours as well – he is acting like he’s innocent and everything will just go back to normal…NUTS!
I know he stands to gain one hell of a lot if I do return. I will look like the crazy one so all focus on him (in the eyes of our friends and family) will revert to me. He gains all my possessions which was the personality of our house and he keeps his superannuation which is viewed as a lotto win in Australia as its an original government backed super fund that loses all benefits when I take my share – BIG MOTIVATION FOR HIM! Not to mention the splitting of our properties.
Having said all that… I didn’t see this reaction coming. When I left I expected the worst of him but what I’ve got is a crying, begging and pleading mess of a man that is throwing an innocent child like energy?…
Stay tuned!
NotWhat, I do believe that every sociopath is different in their own way, and yes I believe they do fear! I believe they fear losing control, and fear of being exposed. Maybe not all of them but definitely some. Sociopaths have very similar traits but they are not all identical by any means. Just as they are not all killers as people think they are. I have read and researched quite a bit, and no two books or articles say the same exact things of sociopaths. I have come across several readings where sociopaths fear exposure just as well that some do not. Also one’s description of fear can be different than another’s as well. I believe there’s a bit of a fine line with all the personality disorders as they all overlap so much and have such similar characteristics that they are just referred to as the same type or disorder.
I see what your saying SashaStrong,
I should have been more clear. I am an expert on my ex, and on no one elses. I can have opinions, and can recommend books, etc. but I can only guess about other sociopaths.
My ex (a sociopath) has NO fear. Neither does his brother, nor his dad, nor his uncle. That’s how they are made. I know my ex would have been considered a non-violent sociopath. That is, until the day he chose to murder. Then he was calm and determined to do the job, and go back to his normal every day life, as if nothing unusual happened, because in his brain, murder is no big deal, just like diving off cliffs into a few feet of water is no big deal or taking a skiff out into open freezing ocean is no big deal. I USED to think he was so brave, until I realized he didn’t react at all, and thought it was FUNNY that other people did.
I didn’t mean to imply that sociopaths murder, only that because they have no conscience, they are capable of it. But yes, most sociopaths do NOT murder and that little fact was missing when I tried to figure out the problem with my ex.
The biggest good news is that we can learn and chat and find support here. I didn’t know about LoveFraud when I was in dire straits but now that I do, and now that I know I am not alone, I can’t stop thanking God for the blessing of this site!
NWHSOM, my ex gave me an STD about 4 years into our “relationship”. When I told him about it, he immediately went ballistic and attacked ME for giving it to HIM, ruining his life (up to and including the possibility of death due to future complications from it) and for impacting his future dating prospects!!!!! I sat openmouthed, wondering where his concern for ME was, and then of course started trying to make it right. He ended up making up a story that I had had it all along, got it from my ex husband (who I had not had sex with for maybe 6 years at that time and no one in-between until the sociopath). Riiiight.
It was barely discussed further, and he refused to me to get checked. Of course he has it, knows he gave it to me, and he has probably infected many others without conscience. Don’t know what he told his new wife, but I’m sure it involves his complete innocence and him blaming me for being a filthy whore. It would make a good sob story and cause a kind hearted woman to comfort him for loving and trusting me when I deserved neither, and then of course, hoodwinked him by getting him to sign on the dotted line on buying a dream home and then becoming a complete psycho!!
HanaleiMoon
I am not surprised how your ex turned it around. Sounds like he had experience being accused, doesn’t he? Maybe fed you the words that some other woman probably screamed at him and he just automatically spouted that old cliché, blame the victim.
Well it’s a good thing the new babe was SOOOO understanding. Or maybe she already had the STD so it was no big deal to her.
Jane D,
You are talking about real issues and facts and things that matter to him. But he doesn’t care – to him it’s all meaningless. He just wants to keep you engaged, to keep your focus on him, and to ‘worship’ him in that way. The answers he gives you are whatever he thinks will engage you. He was successful in manipulating you to discuss with him his other women and other ‘relationships.’ This is what he does with you instead of either having a relationship with you, or not having a relationship with you. There is no end with them ever. They do not end relationships and move on. They engage in an endless endless endless manipulation of people that makes absolutely no sense to normal people, and they will waste as much of our lives as they can.
Bingo AnnettePk
Thank you for writing with such clarity of thought. This is exactly what Janes ex is doing to her.
And by gosh, your assessment is pretty much what MY ex did to me. Endless manipulations instead of having/not having a relationship. I used to describe it as a series of first dates… constantly dangling a carrot of what might be, but would never be because they are incapable of relationship.
You’ve encapsulated the core behavior of ALL disordered personalities… really really resonates with me. It’s why my marriage never found that place of satisfaction, and why anxiety was the central emotion, and why I was always waiting for the sky to fall. And why my anxiety has diminished so much since my divorce was final.
nwhsom
Sashastrong
Wow…I am starting now to believe my ex lied about his wife being pregnant..this is the second time it’s been brought to my attention..I don’t know why he would lie but I wouldn’t put it past him AT ALL. I think over time the pieces of the puzzle may come together and everyone will be right..although I could be wrong in thinking this too..he always was a “drama queen” and I told him so..everything with him was so dramatic when it wasn’t so his is very possible. Like yours mine too was very nice, too nice sometimes and overdid it with the love bombing, which gave himself away from the beginning, had I only known. We ha many many great times together and it’s only gone downhill this past year. An odd thing about him was how often he spoke about sex but when it came to the actual act, well, he wasn’t always lucky…there was something I just couldn’t pinpoint
You mention you don’t feel it bothered your ex when you called him out on all his deviant ways? I may have to disagree lol!! These people dot want anyone to know what they are and when it’s pointed out to them it makes so much sense why he didn’t bother with you…you brought him down a few pegs. How on earth will he discard you if you know everything about him? You coul have possibly saved yourself from further hurt and damage had he cared more or if you hadn’t called him on his actions!! You did say that he was vindictive though. In which way? I pointed out all I knew about my ex and he not once came to his own defense. He had nothing to say but “perhaps you are right”. He could not blame me for one thing in my relationship except for recognizing what I had to give emotionally to our relationship, all my hard work ad love and he knows that. Perhaps by admitting this to me he shows that he is not a sociopath and that’s his goal?
Anyway you shd be very proud you came out of this as far as you have. Give yourself a pat on the back and take in what all your friends an co-workers notice because you deserve it. How long were you together?
I, like you, still sometimes want to know things about him. I will get over that hurdle, it’s fairly new to me but being here listening to all this advice is my biggest help. The awful feeling isn’t there as permanently as it was, it’s slowly lifting, sometimes not as much as i would like. But not looking back at pics or fb or messages from the past has helped. Even thinking about them gets my stomach in knots and it’s just a step backward