By | August 22, 2011 250 Comments

Hastening the demise of sociopaths

Millions of sociopaths roam the planet. They inhabit all segments of the population. They are male, female, rich, poor, old, young, all races, all religions, all education levels, all demographic groups. Most of them are not in prison, so they move freely among us, living their lives by exploiting others.

Many take pride in their ability to manipulate others. Some who are criminals view crime as fun. They see nothing wrong with their behavior. As long as they keep succeeding, sociopaths will continue to behave the way they do.

So how do we make them fail?

Sociopaths only want to win, so failure is losing. Failure is not being able to exploit others, or at least not being able to get away with exploiting others.

I see four steps to shutting them down, and they all revolve around education.

1. Educating the public about sociopaths. This is the first step. So many Lovefraud readers who have tangled with sociopaths have told me, “I didn’t know these people existed!” Yes, they exist. Sociopaths live among us. And they are dangerous to our mental, emotional, psychological, financial, sexual and physical health.

This is why I launched Lovefraud. This is why I’m embarking on the Lovefraud  Education Program to teach high school and college students about sociopaths. (If you’re in a position to bring the program to your school, please contact [email protected].) And there are so many more people who need to be educated, including therapists, lawyers and judges. We all need to know the warning signs of sociopathic behavior, so that if we see them, we can respond appropriately—especially by running away.

2. Exposing known sociopaths. This, I believe, is the only strategy that really works against sociopaths. We can’t count on winning judgments against them and actually collecting our money. We can’t count on them being prosecuted or locked up. Sometimes the only way to keep them from harming others is to blow their cover.

We do need to be cautious about this, as I explained in a previous article, Exposing the sociopath. Many of you may not be able to skewer your exes publicly, as I did with James Montgomery. But you may be able to quietly speak your truth in your community, profession, church or wherever you know the predator is trolling for new victims. In the future, a few words of warning, coupled with growing public awareness of the disorder, may be enough.

3. Stop breeding sociopaths. Sociopaths are hard-wired for sex. They have a lot of sexual magnetism, and many Lovefraud readers have said that sex with the sociopath was the best they’ve ever had. But a consequence of sex, of course, is children. And because sociopathy is a highly genetic disorder, children born of sociopaths are at risk of inheriting a predisposition for the disorder.

One of the big things I hope will be accomplished through the Lovefraud High School Education program is to help young people understand that romantic relationships with sociopaths lead to nothing but trouble. If more people refuse to get involved with sociopaths, that will mean fewer at-risk children.

4. Appropriate parenting for at-risk children. Although sociopathy is highly genetic, inheriting the genes doesn’t necessarily mean that every at-risk child will grow up to be a sociopath. It is the interaction of genetics and the environment, including parenting, which actually creates the disordered individuals.

Many people realize, after a child is conceived or born, that their partner is a sociopath. If this is you, you need to take steps to raise the child so that he or she does not develop this disorder. I realize that this is immensely difficult and complicated, especially when the sociopathic parent will not let go of the child, which is often the case. But the healthy parents should try, as best they can, to teach the child how to love and feel empathy. (For information on how to do this, read Just Like His Father? by Dr. Liane Leedom.)

Perhaps with education, perseverance and time, our descendants will see the end of sociopathy. And they’ll thank us for taking the first steps to hasten the demise.

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Very well said. This is an important subject for me as I have 5 children with the sociopath
In fact the entire culture he comes from is a breeding ground of sociopaths, like a petri dish full of gentetic bad seeds. They are raised to believe the world is there for their taking, and if they dont take advantage of every person they come across that makes them a loser. Im hoping keeping contact at almost nil will be the thing that saves my children. Ive had a few close calls with them and their actions, but am hoping growing up around people now since Im disconnected totally from him will be the healing ground for them. Blessings to you all:)

Ox Drover

Dear Wisergirl,

Do get in touch with Dr. Leedom and get her book “Just like his father”—-and go to her blog of “parenting the at-risk child”

Even children whose GRANDPARENTS are psychopath are at some risk. My P son had two psychopathic grandfathers and he is just like them.

This is a good article donna, and I agree with every word of it….what it makes me FEEL though is “hopeless” because it is like telling me that I have to “fix global warming before the world will be safe”—-I know that there is NO way to educate everyone in the world about psychopaths, or that every little 16 year old girl who is conned and sweet talked into bed with a sprouting psychopathic man is going to keep her legs crossed because of the program she heard at school. LOL It FEELS “hopeless”—heck half the people on the planet cant read and write, and way too many people in this country aren’t literate enough to get a job…so, what I have to do is to OVERCOME MY FEELINGS OF “IT’S HOPELESS” and realize I am just ONE person, I can’t fix the entire world, I cant educate every person who comes into contact with a psychopath, but I CAN DO WHAT ONE PERSON CAN DO….I can reach out to others one person at a time, one word at a time, one day at a time, and do WHAT ONE PERSON CAN DO and do it every day. Thank you so much for all you do, Donna. ((hugs))) and God bless.



Thank you for this! Right on!


I would love more than anything to expose my ex-husband’s name on one of the other blogs that allow you to publicly name them. But I don’t for 2 reasons.

1. My present husband wouldn’t want it and would probably be livid if I did.
2. My ex-husband is a biker and very dangerous. I believe if I publicly called him out there would be repercussions.

However I did put his name into several of the sites that allow it and although no one has outed him there have been many searches for his name. They’ll let you know how many times the name has been searched. My ex-husband’s name has come up 8 times on some of these sites and I know it has to be him and that other women are looking to see if he is listed in the data banks.

He’s middle age now so I know he’s wracked up a bad history.

Ox Drover

Joanie, there comes a time for some of us eventually when “outing” them publicly is no longer so important, we just no longer care enough about them to CARE what others think about them. I am getting there slowly but surely. I hope you can too. It is the NIRVANA OF INDIFFERENCE.


Joanie be careful. Personally I dont want to antagonize a sleeping nest of killer bee’s..he is gone and he is history, he is someone else’s problem now. He warned me not to cause him any grief or he would Rock my World, I took him at his word because I have experienced his wrath and it aint pretty. I do however educate people about people with spath trait’s.

Ox Drover

Yea, like the old proverb “let sleeping dogs lie” because you never know what might bite you in the arse if you wake it up!


Thank you Donna for all the work you’ve done with this site and the awareness that you’ve brought to the general public about Sociopaths!!!

Like most people, I did not know what hit me nor how to label “it” until I came here….and since then I’ve been able to “educate” someone else who dealt with my X S and sought out understanding.

Your book has also been a tremendous encouragement to find meaning in the experience and realize my own spiritual path!

Keep up the good work!



They are vindictive creatures….BUT, the Sociopaths bring about their own demise sooner or later….they are so miserable even when they have money and power. People in their lives do realize there’s something terribly wrong with them, and sooner or later abandon them as well. I’m seeing it happen with the ex-S in my life.



I am so grateful to you. Truly. You’ve saved my life, you’ve saved my family. You, Oxy, Sky, and everybody here. There is no way I can ever repay you except to spread the word, and, hasten the demise of my spath.

I would love to have a letter that can be sent to a current victim that might be an “awakening” of sorts. One that might, just might, be written well enough so that bells start going off.

I know i can’t write one. I can’t write it without anger and emotion.

If anybody is up to the challenge, I would be standing in line to use it.



Joanie what are the sites you’re mentioning? I can’t find any.


Superkid10: There are several sites where folks will call out the “sociopath.”

1. Don’t date him girl
2. the

There are some others but I don’t know them off-hand.

If you type your exes name in Cheaterville they may not have his story but they will tell you how many women have typed his name in their search engine.
My ex has had his name typed in 8 times by various anonymous women.

There is also a site called This is so the spaths can get their names removed from the bad boy list they get put on but they have to pay for it.
And it doesn’t mean their name will stay off the list because if it can be removed it can also be put back on.


Superkid10: Here’s 2 more: (you can report scammers; including exes)


My spath is too sneaky for that. Nobody would ever believe that he is a spath. He plays the innocent right down to the end. Those he has killed and those he has tortured, all believed to the very end that he was just a normal guy, with some flaws, human flaws.

The ONLY way you can know what this MOFO is, is to read a blog like this, or read a book on sociopaths. Then the red flags will inform you. It is ONLY the red flags which identify spaths that will tell you about people like my spath.

And my parents are really sneaky too. The link to the Narcissist mother, is the only one that helped me get past my cog/dis. It was there in black and white, telling me that, YES, she is doing these things on purpose. It isn’t a faux pas.

But all spaths hide behind the “faux pas”, the “inconsiderate behavior”, the “thoughtlessness”, the “I have problems because I was abuesd”… all the little things they mimic that make them appear human and forgivable. It’s beyond disgusting.

Knowledge is power and protection.


The good news is that we are not alone.

There are a few other sites dedicated to exposing spaths.
Yes, this site seems strange in some cases, but that’s because after realizing that spaths exist, Laura suspended her disbelief and now opens her mind to many possibilities.


I think the letter is a fine idea! I have a few people I could share it with right now. How about something like this. Feel free to change it and make it your own:

Dear Friend,
Please do not be alarmed. I am writing to you in good faith. You see, I believe you may be under the influence of a sociopath. Before you put down this letter thinking it some kind of prank, there is something you should know: if you have been feeling like you are “crazy” when you know you aren’t, you are right. Sociopaths know how to make you feel like you are crazy. Sociopaths look normal and blend well into society, at first. After a while, their abnormal behaviors show themselves little by little. It is so insidious that you might think you are just imagining it! If you bring it up, they may tell you that you are imagining it. What you are experiencing is the power inside yourself to recognize red flags. Even when we don’t want to acknowledge them in our own minds, our bodies have a way of telling us what we are experiencing without the mind’s approval.

Please follow up on this concern by researching sociopathic behavior on the internet. You can find lots of information at And you can talk to me anytime about your situation and I will be there to listen. You see, friend, I have been through it already and stand ready and willing to give you some benefit of my horrific experience. You do not have to go through this alone.

Your friend


Dear Friend
You are are about to get a life lesson – dont fail it…
Best of luck ~!

Ox Drover

That site is very SCARY to me….sorry, as much as I hate what psychopaths do, and as much as I realize that they are AMONG US, and that 99.9% of all the human misery in this world is caused by psychopaths… sounds too much like eugenics to me. It is unfortunate that there is no test that is foolproof in picking out psychopaths except for BEHAVIOR such as murder, rape, robbery etc. and we must wait until AFTER the deed to incarcerate them.

Even then, innocent people are incarcerated and/or executed even here under “democracy” to say nothing of the world at large. Look at What is going on now in Somilia, many countries in the “third world” and Iraq, Iran etc. now. How many dictators, presidents, governors, and kings have been or are psychopaths? Look at History as far back as it is recorded, many many psychopaths became the Hitlers and Stalins and Maos of this earth, causing tens of millions of deaths throughout all recorded history.

Sometimes in order to fight “injustice,” we (humans) become just like those we fight against.


I hope you got my email. UGH!! I did all the appropriate things to get rid of the hacker…this time it’s gonna stick, I’m sure of it. I would never do something like that/put people at risk on purpose…nevah, nevah, nevah.


a letter would have to be the length of a book.

I’m looking at things from my perspective of how long it took for me to “get” that my spath was evil: 25 years.

I remember thinking that life was so hard. it shouldn’t be but spaths make sure that it is. I thought I just had constant bad luck. Why did life have to suck so bad? Why was I sad all the time? Why was I depressed? was it chemical?

The letter cannot target people who are in the “happy” phaze of spathticity. It will have to target the desperate:

Is your life hard? Your life isn’t how you imagined it should be. Your plans always fail. What was the last good thing that you can remember happening. I spoke with a therapist who told me, “Lots of people come to me for depression, only to find out that they are living with a sociopath.”

You can’t tell when there is a sociopath in your life. That’s very important to know. The sociopath will be someone you love more than life itself. Someone who needs you, someone that you know to be your soulmate, or a saintly parent or your very best friend. The only way to uncover the sociopath is to know what to look for: the red flags. When you see them, you will know and no longer doubt.



the site doesn’t advocate killing anyone who fails the test, it is only trying to make a case for how pressing this situation is.

They are in control of everything. They are everywhere. We are like cattle being fattened up and led to the slaughter.

We need to find a way to identify and de-activate the spaths.
Gray rock is my contribution. It only works on spaths because they are addicted to drama and our emotions. It is harmless to the normals.

That is why studying them is so critical. We must know their weaknesses.

Ox Drover

Skylar, Gray rock only works with SOME of the psychopaths, being “boring” to my psychopathic son ain’t gonna work…..neither is NC, he is a STALKER, and even though ignoring them (NC) and being Boring (gray rock) works for SOME psychopaths, for some there is no answer as long as they are alive and/or free. Some of them just will NOT quit or move on to another victim. They have had “N-injury” if you escape them, and they cannot stand that, they must get revenge at ANY cost, even to themselves. Even when they lose, it is always someone else’s fault and therefore they must seek revenge to even the score.


“for some there is no answer as long as they are alive and/or free. Some of them just will NOT quit or move on to another victim. They have had “N-injury” if you escape them, and they cannot stand that, they must get revenge at ANY cost, even to themselves. Even when they lose, it is always someone else’s fault and therefore they must seek revenge to even the score. ”

This is the case with my ex. Absolutely. I do Grey rock, just to keep myself as hidden to him, as possible. Grey rock enrages him though.

Tonight, on his 6:30 phone call with Lil’bit, he told her, ” Mommy and (Friend) are DEAD. He was in the middle of saying that since we were dead, he was planning to use our carcasses …I grabbed the phone and hung it up at that point…

I can’t stand that inhuman spathdard! 🙁

Ox Drover

Dear Safeguard,

OMG! That is horrible for him to talk to her like that, the man is a monster, a dangerous monster.

Is it legal for you to tape these and play them for the court?

I can’t bring myself to advise someone to break the law, but my my I can’t believe a court would put you and your daughter in such danger and there be no other option but to take your child and run into hiding. There was a case a few years ago where a woman went to Holland and sought and received asylum from the government there. After he kids were 18 they came back here and the US was going to prosecute her for kidnapping but ended up not doing so. I can’t tell you what I would do, but “he wouldn’t like the outcome.” (To quote Erin Brock.) God bless you and your child and keep you safe. (((hugs))))


Holland huh? I like it…

He is more dangerous than I’ve written about here… It’s all so whacked. it’s a tough tale to tell…

The courts own forensic psychologist heard it though, and although she reported that she felt I was truthful, and said spath was “evasive and deceitful”. She did not make a determination, she just said, “there is more to this man than can be known at this time”.

I’m going to get some advice and keep logging everything. But I rule out nothing.


I think thats a good start on a letter. Depression, red flags are part of it. Sky, in your 25 years of marriage did u realize he was a liar? Im wondering if the lies are a red flag or if u didn’t recognize he was a liar.

Ox Drover

Safeguard, whatever you do, play your cards close to your chest so that you do not leave behind a trail of “breadcrumbs” which someone could follow to find you. Not verbally, not in the history of your searches on your computer or anywhere else. NO advance notice to anyone, and realize that if you were to bolt and run, you must do like the government’s witness security program, cut all ties with everyone in your life COMPLETELY.

There are some books on the internet and some here that I have reviewed on HOW TO GET AWAY FROM A STALKER….one woman was stalked for over 40 years by both of her husbands, beaten and bones broken etc. back when the cops wouldn’t do a thing. One of her husbands was mentally ill, the other one was a hardcore psychopath she suggested that California was the best state in which to live and get help from the state to HIDE, check out my reviews either under OxDrover or my name. Good luck.


Skyler spoke my story when she said, “I’m looking at things from my perspective of how long it took for me to “get” that my spath was evil: 25 years.

I remember thinking that life was so hard. it shouldn’t be but spaths make sure that it is. I thought I just had constant bad luck. Why did life have to suck so bad? Why was I sad all the time? Why was I depressed? was it chemical?”

It only took me 21 years though..yay me (sarcasm intended). He went off truck driving when I gave him the “grey rock”. My story has many details which some here like Oxy and I think Skyler have gotten bits and pieces. I am trying at the present moment to stay on topic and not ramble about my story.

As for hastening the demise of the sociopath, my two cents…mothers tell your daughters pay attention to him. Put hormones and the sex aside and pay attention to what he says and does and how often he makes you feel bad.

In the beginning mine would purposely make me feel bad, make me cry, and then come to my rescue, laughing and apologizing, and hugging me. I see in hindsite that it was just a game to him.

I am not sure the public in general can be educated about sociopaths. We have been trained to believe there is good in all people. I think, however, that people would be open to learning about “tactics” and manipulation. To me it is about the tactics not the label we give them. No matter the label we give them it is the slick tactics they use that mess up our hearts and minds.

A while ago I mentioned the book, “In Sheeps Clothing” by George K Simon, Jr. I personally believe if I regconsized manipulation as a young girl I would never had been with my P or N or whatever he is.

This site scared me when I first came across it, I guess the horror of the truth was too much. Reading that book allowed me to first accept just how munipulative he was. Then I was able to start accepting just how bad of a relationship I was in.


In an attempt to educate my exboyfriend’s bosses, I sent an email to three of his direct supervisors explaining who I was and I told them that I thought he uses a portion of his expense account to woo colleagues. He is the director of international public relations for the convention authority in the city we live in. He travels constantly and has created a situation for himself where he is one of a few straight men in a sea of women.
He had cheated on me with one of the sales girls for a hotel here in town while the two were on business together in Mexico. (They do these trips called ‘missions’ to other cities where the convention authority and the resort partners travel together in packs to sell the city.) It was truly a miracle I found out about this tryst because this girl’s mother happened to work with the boyfriend of my friend. My spath convinced me to stay with him and that my friends were the liars, not him.
This all went down in March of 2010. I didn’t move out unitl June 2010, but we stayed together until September 2010 – I even took him to the beach to celebrate his birthday last September. Days after we returned from our trip, the girl finally came clean and admitted she screwed him in September. I had confronted her in July and she denied it at the time. He always denied everything except for a conversation. I called it his ‘dirty talk love affair.’
In November, I was still so bitter, hurt and in so much pain. I wanted everyone to know what a dirty rotten scoundrel he is, so I sent the email to his bosses.
He forced me to send a second email retractiing my accusations – I did for fear. However, he had to write an explanation of the accusation to his bosses before he was granted his pending promotion. He took out a restraining order to back up his bullshit story that he had to come up with. And as totally embarassing and humiliating as that was for me – I take great pride in knowing that it is all on permanent record in his HR file.
At any rate, I suppose my point is this: it’s difficult at best to get any kind of jump on the ‘payback’ a psychopath deserves without taking a little piece of yourself out with it. In my case, by the time I realized the kind of monster I was dealing with, it was too late. I had already become a party to his lies (he left his wife who he said was a lesbian and a cheater for me) long before I became a victim of them. And when it came clear to me I did some things I’m not proud of – namely destroying my stuff that was still at his house and sending the email. I wasn’t able to avoid the consequences of my own rage.


Thank you so much for this site!!

Newly married, my husband’s ex has issues. Can’t diagnose of course, but given what I’d heard from him, and I read Snakes in Suits (she’s an exec) to read more about this, and so much rings true. Including her having targeted the job my husband had and that she pursued (prior to “taking the pill” to get him to marry her, so she could back out of that job and go for one that pays more), and she pursued her next boss, is now married to him, and has the same job he had, though at another company.

I’m afraid for the kids, really. They take really well to my giving them affection and are still fairly young (8,11). I’ve seen her traits in them sometimes, and they scare me to death. In one, I saw an incredibly well crafted bruise painted on their cheek. When I rubbed it, it smeared, and not yet knowing fully about mom, I laughed. The kid gave me that apparently well-known blank face, turned and walked away. At 7 years old. That really, really freaked me out. Given I had laughed, the kid had the perfect out, and could laugh, or be a smidge embarrassed but smile (and I think normally would have). I definitely need to look up the Just Like His Father book!

I’m fairly obsessed with how to expose, and I dream of the perfect, non-scandalous way to simply speak the truth (versus withholding, which I think women -paths use against men’s ego; they can’t possibly admit having been so duped), and anonymous communications. It sometimes kills me thinking of how much she pulls off with no one thinking anything bad about her. Somehow, in spite of the continual lies and manipulations, my husband still trusts her to come up with half of their kids’ college, which speaks volumes to me about how crafty they are. He acknowledges how manipulative she is, and how much she lies, and how much money she steals, but still somehow trusts she will come through with this [undocumented in the divorce decree] “promise”. I’m dying to understand how she pulls this off.

This one isn’t even charming, at least once she marries the poor guy. Continually putting the husbands (who I know, there is one more previous to my husband who I don’t know) down, criticizing them, pushing them to earn more money. And spending every cent they have, and goes past that, forcing them to take out loans etc. I just don’t understand how these otherwise very smart husbands continue to not see that all she does is to lie and steal, basically.

I’m basically afraid of her, though I laugh at her efforts which to me look so incredibly juvenile (pulling up her shirt at kids ball games to investigate something on her stomach (she’s in good shape)).

I am turning here to figure out how to best cope with her, given she’ll be close to my new family forever, about which I’m really quite aghast.

Ox Drover

Justus5, that is a GREAT BOOK, thank you for bringing it up again. I can understand how this site would scare someone too…it takes the sheepskin off the wolf and it is an UGLY BEAST underneath that sheep skin.

Dear ONE BELIEVER, that is an excellent post and sometimes in trying to “get even” with them or expose them we DO shoot ourselves in the foot. Glad you realized that, but now that you do, don’t keep beating yourself up about it. The past is past. Forgive yourself. (((hugs)))



two others:

..although I don’t trust as much as I do and


Ox Drover

Dear Newstepmom,

Welcome to our world….it seems that your husband doesn’t see the same thing in his ex wife that you do…so it may be that will cause you and him some problems down the road.

Trying to “educate” someone about a psychopath when they do NOT SEE what you see about the lies and manipulation is almost an IMPOSSIBLE JOB. “Outing” her may backfire in your face.

Just because it is EASY for you to see this in her does not mean that it will be easy for others to see it.

I suggest that you focus on making your marriage the best it can be, and bonding with your step children, get a copy of “Just like his father” and some of the other books recommended her on LF book store and in the BOOK REVIEWS. Learning about psychopaths is a big project, but one well worth while. Learning about healthy relationships and spotting the RED FLAGS of disordered behavior is a good thing.

Not all bad behavior is psychopathic, but it is all dysfunctional. So work on making your life better,, more functional, and your relationships better with those people in your life who ARE functional. Again, welcome to LF.


Onebeliever. My heart goes out to you. Somebody here said revenge is best served cold. Yours was fraught w emotion. Best revenge is a life well lived. Somebospdy here recommended the song MEAN by taylor Swift. Its inspiring. You have my support.


I just had a chilling revelation this morning.

First, the background story:
Spath did a con on a restaurant owner, B. He came up with an invention and B invested $10,000. He also got his main Supply S, to add another $30,000 or $40,000, can’t remember exactly. Then he wanted another $10,000 from B, but B’s wife got suspicious. She said, “Why would you give $10,000 much less $20,000 to someone who doesn’t even want you to know where he lives? He knows everything about us, and we don’t have any information on him.” So B, had to back out and lost his first $10,000. (A couple of years later, it turned out that the invention, had already been invented, in the 1930’s. So everyone lost, except spath.) But Spath hated B’s wife for not falling for his scams and slandered her constantly. Spath continued to be friends with B.

A few weeks later, Spath was in B’s restaurant in the bar. It was near 2AM closing time, but the place was empty. 3 people walked in. 2 guys and a girl. They ordered drinks and B served them. Then the 3 whipped out their ID’s and showed that they were cops. And B had been too distracted by Spath and hadn’t asked to check their ID for legal drinking age. He got busted. He had all kinds of legal problems to deal with after that. Spath came home and told me about it. And he had that look that he has when he’s just manipulated another con. I know now that Spath maneuvered those cops to do that sting. It fits his MO perfectly.

I’m pretty sure that he begins these maneuvers by creating hate in the cops, towards a targetted individual. He convinces them that they should do this because B’s bar sends so many drunks out on the road, blah, blah … anything to instill outrage or hatred.

He also does this thing where he keeps all his relationships clandestine and compartmentalized. He pretends he doesn’t know certain people, then nobody would believe that he was involved in the cons. He sends his minions in to do the dirty work and they will never admit that they were taking orders from him. BF, told me that the last time he saw him, they walked into a casino and Spath said, “My name is Steve and you don’t know me”

Well that brings me to another Spath tell:
At one time, he told me that a retired US Marshall had a hangar 2 doors down from his. The Marshall had worked for the witness protection program as an Eraser (erasing identities).

When my sister was marrying the trojan horse (who is also a cop) , they decided to get married in Hawaii and spath was mad that I was going to Hawaii and he refused to go. He said, “you can tell them, that I’m never going to interact with them again, tell them, “You don’t know me anymore.” Then, he gave me two tee-shirts he got from the Marshall. They were funny teeshirts that said, “Federal Witness Protection Program” on one side, and “You Don’t Know Me” on the other side. When trojan spath saw them, in Hawaii, he insisted that they put them on and that I take their picture for spath. OMG, it was all a tell.

But here’s realization I had today:
Spath is addicted to manipulating cops. He can’t stop. That’s why I know that this is what he will continue to do. I’ve finally got his act all the way down. These are his methods:
Meet the cop, assess the cop for hooks, make sure the cop will pretend not to know him, sick the cop on his mark.

There is no gain here. Only revenge.


Ox Drover .. you wrote

“Gray rock only works with SOME of the psychopaths, being “boring” to my psychopathic son ain’t gonna work”..neither is NC, he is a STALKER, and even though ignoring them (NC) and being Boring (gray rock) works for SOME psychopaths, for some there is no answer as long as they are alive and/or free. Some of them just will NOT quit or move on to another victim. They have had ’N-injury’ if you escape them, and they cannot stand that, they must get revenge at ANY cost, even to themselves. Even when they lose, it is always someone else’s fault and therefore they must seek revenge to even the score”

Sister, do I GET that one! Even when the move on to the next victim, some STILL won’t stop SPATHING their ex victims. Mine, I think is a stalker, too.. his favorite tricks these days, I think, are

1. entering his victim’s email addy into junk marketing email lists;
2. call-hangups (I call them “breather” calls)
3. entering his victim’s phone number into “robo” marketing call lists

Even though I remain “gray rock” and NC with him.



oh..and don’t think they won’t get another (2nd) cell phone to use, or a “disposable phone” with an “unavailable” or “non trace” #, to make those harassing calls. I thought, “well two can play (that game)”.. I, too, could probably call back that #, from a pay phone, make a couple of “breather” or “hang-up” calls on him, too, but that would be a waste of my energy and time [Too bad, sucka spath! NOT gonna bite! ha ha..hope it RILES you..causes you BLUE BALLS! Too bad you never wore underwear, otherwise they’d be “in a bind” or you’d probably pee in them from fright and frustration. Ha ha]



I think that might be a red flag: they don’t wear underwear.
Why is that?
Can we take a poll here?
Who’s spath did or didn’t wear underwear?

Mine did not.



I’ve always suspected that he didn’t wear undies because either:

1. he’s a flasher
2. so any gay guys he meets up with in those “glory holes” can have easier access to his butt or his “package” .. don’t mean to get crass here, but..

Dang! How many of you felt that earthquake today? And what states are you in, if you did?



Since I profiled him on a couple of those sites as someone who didn’t wear underwear all those years with me, he’s probably changed his “M.O.” to wearing underwear, with his new victim..possibly to make me look like a liar.


I agree with Skylar..let’s have a many of your ex’s (spaths) didn’t wear underwear (went “commando” style)?

romanticfool no more

Um, wow. Count another in the commando squad. Although he wore them sometimes, at least to work where he became “normal”. Perhaps they were part of his “good guy” costume.

I’ve had concerns for years about how spaths breed. Most the ones I know of have multi kids. Like my neighbor who I suspect and cheerfully says “I have sociopathic tendancies”. Um, no kidding! Plus he is in an “open relationship” so he has 3 kids so far by his wife and at least two others. They are on welfare of course. Another I know has at least 6 kids…two of the moms were only sixteen…at last count. Maybe because so many of them are oversexed they need the ready access?

I do feel education is the answer. Since it would be dangerous for me to go public, I constantly refer people to this site. I said since I first got here it should be taught in schools, I’m so thrilled that is actually happening now! I made my twenty year old friend sit down and take the spath test about her boyfriend. He hit every mark. After that she got serious about NC and being willing to take out a restraining order if necessary. After all, I’m living proof of what a spath can do to you. As for revenge, well, my best revenge is still being alive and spreading the word, no matter how quietly.

Because my X is dangerous, I’ve gotten very good at camouflage. I’ll see if I can put him on those sites, but it won’t be under my name or from a trackable email. I help track spaths by internet, so I’ve learned some tricks. If mine contacts me or my family again he’ll be slapped with a restraining order so fast it will make him dizzy.

Skylar, I have a friend who’s spath sounds like a clone of yours. He also cultivates cops and has literally gotten away with murder. He stalks her constantly, however once when he jumped her in a dark parking lot after she’d had a really crummy day, she screamed at him to go ahead and kill her, she didn’t care. He laughed, said she was tough, and went back to terrorizing her in other ways. I’m willing to bet he didn’t wear underwear either.


OMG!!! ok now I am experiencing the racing heart effect…my socio ex NEVER wore chonies, EVER (chonies= California slang word for underwear) He always said they made him “uncomfortable” I could never understand this, kinda grossed me out a little…


Please, please, please do not try revenge with a spath unless legal, they manipulate everyone, listen to Oxy, Hens those with experience and far worse experiences than I cna ever contemplate.

I have been arrested 14 times due to false allegations by a spath, they lie and are believable, they are con artists. I learnt the hard way, gather all the evidence and do it through the courts. I know this sounds trite and many of you will laugh at me but by our own behaviour due to frustration we come across as mad, vindictive etc and they use this like a leech sucking on blood ..we are insane they are ‘normal’.

Do not use web sites, or make any contact, they are sick, they don’t get upset, it turns them on, they get their rocks off on the attention. I have children with the spath so I have been through the mill for 6 years and am abut to go back to court. I am somewhat non-plussed due to 40 court appearances, and of course reflective now I understand the mental disorder.

Please do not ruminate, they will never change, they don’t care about you and they never did, its just a game. Please do not endanger yourself however angry you are, and if you think they have got off scott free, they haven’t they are getting old and they are simply sick anyway.

Just be grateful you know what they are and keep safe. As my father told me and Oxy commented ‘don’t keep poking a rabid dog, because they will eventually bite back’. Remember that, stay safe and NC unless to safe guard yourself and family. Stay safe.

Ox Drover

Dear Movingon,

I am so sorry that you have been through so much with this monster. Believe me I know from first hand experience how it is to be CRAZEEEEE. LOL I came across as crazy and they came across as sane because I was UPSET and they had no emotional involvement so were “calm, cool and collected”—my story was so bizarre that even my therapist thought I was a nut job until I proved with witnesses and documents that I wasn’t the one who was “crazee” LOL

I wish you the best in your court appearance this time, and just think about it like that Verizon phone ad, you have the “network” of loveFrauders behind you. So when you go into court, just envision that WE ARE ALL THERE WITH YOU! It also helps to visualize them NAKED with a tie and shoes on (only that!) LOL ((((Hugs))))

the phoenix

>>In the beginning mine would purposely make me feel bad, make me cry, and then come to my rescue, laughing and apologizing, and hugging me. I see in hindsite that it was just a game to him. <<

Mine does this ALL of the time! If someone is to compliment me on a job well done- he is quick to swoop in and overshadow me, trying to steal the spotlight, shift the focus and 'steal my thunder' if you will.

Of course others will turn to him because he is sooo charming, charismatic or any other personality attribute you wish to heap on him… I just walk away and hold on tight to the compliments. Spath cannot steal away the words of others. Not from me. Is there any wonder why I refer to him as the vortex?

Our children have recently acquired the movie Tangled. Anyone else seen it? How about the song "Mother Knows Best"? Almost frightening how well Disney created the Spath character and the song was written to show how she places Rapunzel on a pedestal, knocks it out from under her and is there to catch her when she falls…


Thanks Oxy, I can’t even get his ‘real’ address, but I do know it as do the courts. He once turned up in court, claimed he had received no summons, so the judge asked him why he was there, his response ‘because she has made me’ ..judge ..but you are the applicant you have brought ‘her’ to court ..idiot ‘no I haven’t’ ..WTF goes on between the 2 brain cells …tennis.

I’m fine its just boring me now ..I would rather not visualise coco the clown with its blue hair naked (fat), with his now pony tail and yellow teeth ..I do not even acknowledge its even in the room, it’s just embarrassing. How can a ‘normal’ person sit there and tell a judge ‘the children are not a priority’ and then think they have a judge onside because it is traumatised having to move house. Its so extreme, it can’t even get how everyone in that court room is looking at it in utter disgust.

Thank you I just have to do it all over again, again and again, but my children are worth it, and anyway I have no choice, the spath is using the courts and manipulating the process as always ..very unsuccessfully ..but hey hoy ..spath world.

God bless you Oxy, you have helped me more than you can ever know, you are one amazing lady, far far away in cyberland but also so close x


I turned my ex in via his command and NCIS as I was holding many, many secrets about things he had done to others and the lies he told. I had to go further up the “food chain” as he advised his command I was the one who was “crazy”. Well now the ex is married to a fellow socio, and they make a great pair, she is very violent and a big bully, he is complicit in her schemes, apparently making her the dominant one of the two. Needless to say, there are ways (sometimes) to get your justice. Personally I am a “saver” I saved every piece of correspondence between us (over 12000 pieces of evidence) I have to believe in my heart that truth will out.

Movingon, I wish you much luck, and believe you will see your justice as well.

romanticfool no more

Oh yes we are! They are experts at doing little things so all they have to say is one word and you blow in front of people while they seem like the rational one. One of the things that hurt me the most is so called friends believing I would act the way he said I did. I wouldn’t THINK of those things, and nothing in my dealings with people show that. Yet he was so convincing, even those who had doubts he’d work on until they were snowed. Please imagine me standing there cheering you on while in court!

I checked out some of those websites and decided not to post any thing on the two I checked would be dangerous. To give any detail of what happened would point directly to me as giving the information. However on the map, the area I have lived all my life is completely solid with cheaters. Something in the water? Same area has an unusual amount of serial killers. I think my choice to not date just got reinforced!

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