“The motivation (for lying) is particularly baffling in endogenous deceit when the psychopath may appear to have everything he wants yet continues quite predictably to commence the manipulative cycle.” So says Dr. Reid Meloy in The Psychopathic Mind, p121.
“I don’t think they even eat an ice cream cone just for pleasure, I think they do everything for the effect it has, or the image it presents. It isn’t about what is REAL it is about what they can appear to be. To them, I think, if they can get others to believe it, then it becomes “reality” as far as they are concerned.” So says Ox Drover in a comment on this blog.
There is complete agreement about one thing regarding sociopaths, that is lying defines them. While studies show that many people lie daily, the lying behavior of sociopaths differs in both degree and kind from “normal” lying. Sociopaths do not just misrepresent the truth in small ways to spare someone’s feelings, avoid an argument or avoid trouble. Sociopaths misrepresent themselves and this misrepresentation extends to everyone they know. (For more advanced readers, there may not be much of a self there to misrepresent.)
You don’t need a checklist
So today I can tell you with confidence that you don’t need a checklist of symptoms or a forensic expert. If you are astounded by another person’s capacity to lie and misrepresent reality you can be sure you have encountered a sociopath.
I said a few weeks ago that I think Meloy’s book The psychopathic Mind is a great contribution to humanity. In this book, Meloy puts forth the idea that we can identify “psychopaths” by observing what he calls “the psychopathic process.” I searched the book for a precise definition of “the psychopathic process” and couldn’t find one but he implies that psychopathy is defined by the way a person interacts with others and with him/herself. He also says that it is possible to identify a “psychopath” by the way that person makes you feel. If you can look within yourself and monitor your own reactions you can learn to tell when you are face to face with “the psychopathic process.”
It doesn’t “work” on me anymore!
I have learned what it feels like to be “worked” and because I know what that feels like, “it” doesn’t work on me anymore. Sociopaths do not just lie, they work people. Their relationships are an occupation for them and it’s not just a job, it’s an adventure. They will even work when there is no apparent reason to. Why do they do this? They do this because there is nothing else they can do. They have little or no capacity to look within and find an inner compass of values and pleasures. As Ox Drover points out, the only real pleasure they have is their “work.”
Dr. Meloy gives a great example of a psychopath “at work” on page 138 when he discusses a professional who was “worked” by a psychopath. Knowing that he was going to be assigned a certain probation officer, the psychopath asked others who knew her about her interests. On discovering that the woman was interested in metaphysics and the writings of Alfred North Whitehead, the psychopath went and read the writings. He then gained the respect and admiration of the P.O. because he discussed these writings as if he too had a genuine interest in them that predated his knowledge of her.
Meloy says, “He does not just play the role, observing the limits of his character, but lives the part.” People are taken in by the psychopath’s work because in the moment the psychopath really thinks and feels the part. His part is real and yet also a deception.
You know you are being worked when the things you love/enjoy are mirrored in this way. You can tell the difference between this mirroring and real sharing by the extent to which the other person tries to build your enthusiasm and point to the apparent “twin-ship” you share. This mirroring and twin-ship can occur with big things as in the metaphysics example and it can occur with little things as in the ice cream example.
Now if you know what I am talking about, you have been worked; you are likely far along in the recovery process because you know what this feels like. If you have only a vague notion of what I am saying, Dr. Meloy has other words of wisdom for you.
In the psychopathic process there is a “complete disconnect between words and actions.” If you notice that a person’s actions point south and their words point north, you are dealing with a sociopath. To be concrete, if the person says they love you and either doesn’t spend much time with you, or repeatedly harms and stresses you, you are in the middle of a psychopathic process. But remember since the person “lives the part” at the moment he/she is with you and says “I love you” there is some vague reality to the statement (especially if the person has the disorder in a lesser form, see last week). To see the psychopathic process, you have to train yourself to pay attention to both a person’s words and to remember that person’s deeds at the same time.
If you do this you will be able to see the disconnect between words and deeds and the psychopathic process. If you begin to see the psychopathic process, it is very important that you not share this observation with the psychopath. He or she will not benefit from your feedback and may even become violent. At the moment you see the process, you must discipline yourself and disconnect. If you have problems with self-discipline you likely need a therapist to help you disentangle from the psychopathic process.
Recovery and discovery are about learning to pay attention. Pay attention to yourself and pay attention to what other people say and do. Most people need help in order to learn the skill of paying attention. That is the kind of help a good therapist can give you.
In the next few weeks we’ll talk more about the psychopathic process. Please feel free to share your experience of being worked or the disconnect between words and deeds.
Karen,
From what I understand, they will always come back, even if it is years down the road.
Honestly, in my opinion, the best thing that you can do is read everything you can get your hands on. The more you learn, the more you can ‘understand’ what has happened to you. ‘The Sociopath Next Door’ by Dr. Martha Stout was the first book I read. A really good intro to the crazy world of spaths.
LF was/is my saving grace. I read comments for about two years before I actually commented. As much as it upsets me that other people have been through similar experiences, it is so good to be able to come to a place where you are understood and not perceived as an over dramatic, out in left field, over-thinking, crazy person. The things that you will learn here will become invaluable!
Your son will always be the reason for you to go on. I’m sure I don’t need to tell you that!
There were so many times that I prayed I would just not wake up. I couldn’t take anymore. I just wanted my brain to stop thinking. My children are what made me, and still at times, make me fight through this craziness.
The psychological damage that is done by one of these monsters is truly unbelievable! Until it happens to you, it is inexplicable!!!
Take good care!
And EB, you are right! You do, just do it!
Aeylah,
OMG it really happened! He left you alone with a bear!
I am so sorry to hear this. I think that it is criminal what he did. Cause if someone walks away when they see a mugging in progress they violate the “good Samaritan” law. Leaving you to deal with a bear is much worse.
I’m so glad you are ok.
I’m so sorry you had to go through this by yourself. What it must have done to you! To have this guy click off the phone saying your too busy to talk. He doesn’t care if you live or die.
Please post again.
Jeannie
Aeylah,
I feel so bad cause after I posted you the first time, I wanted to post more. But, I looked twice at your post and I thought it was a hypothetical example of sociopaths, an ‘over the top’ example, and I felt silly for getting emotionally involved.
But, oh my god that is how far some of them will go.
Jim didn’t care that he stressed me out to the point where I had high blood pressure. Doesn’t compare with a meeting with a bear and no help. Same end result. They don’t care if we live or die.
one_step_at_a_time,
I think I have a story that is similar. Well slightly similar.
I met a woman at the quit smoking group. We got along great. We laughed and it was great.
I ran into her months later at the library.
I was sitting at a table by myself by the newspapers. I was looking at the local newspaper ads.
She came over and we chatted.
She walked away. But, she left her purse behind with me.
I froze.
The thoughts going through my head. I don’t know her from Adam and she is leaving her purse with me? I didn’t like it.
I kept an eye on her.
She walked to a set of books and pulled one forward then pushed it back, then pulled the next book forward then pushed it back. She went through the row of books doing this. She never picked a book out to look at it.
I thought she is acting busy.
Finally she comes back to the table. She began digging through her purse. She loudly stated that she had $7.00 in her purse and now it is gone.
I kept my eyes on the newspaper. I didn’t speak, I didn’t look up at her. I kept my eyes on the newspaper.
She kept digging through her purse loudly saying her $7.00 is missing.
I jumped up and said it’s time for me to go……. see ya!!
I don’t know how this con works but I gotta imagine if I gave her $7.00 to save embarrassment that she would have claimed that diamonds, rubys, emeralds, and pearls were missing from her purse.
It doesnt seem to matter if they gave birth to us, or we gave birth to them. Whether they were loves, wives, husbands. If we had ANY association with a spath or multiple spaths, THEY ARE TOXIC TO US and BAD NEWS.!
The only thing that works is total NC.If we see them, talk to them, read their facebook page, their emails anything,we will be tainted by them .THEY ARE TOXIC POISON! No exceptions! For years and years I second guessed myself. What if Id done more? been more? Understood more? Forgave more? What if they are right and Im the crazy one? On and on and on.I now know that NOTHING I said or did would have made the slightest difference to my 3 spaths, ie, my ex, and my 2 spath daughters. They DONT love me. End of. Probably havent since they were around 8 years old, maybe not even then.
They dont even love themselves so how can they love anyone else? I now get it that they project all their hate, self loathing, fears, insecurities, envy, rage blame, on to us, their so called “loved ones.” If you ar exposed to this for years and years with no support or validation that no, you are NOT the crazy one,you get so tired and beaten down by them that you do start to believe that you ARE the crazy one.Until we get into Lovefraud and learn whats REALLY going on, that we are in a pea soup FOG {of fear, obligation and Guilt}, and start to learn and get better, and gradually come out of the FOG!!When we know better we do better! Love, and blessings to us all! Mama gem.XX
Gem You got it right, matters not if they are our children mothers, brother’s or friends. Growing up in my dysfunctional family I always felt different, something about me was surely wrong. I could not understand what my defect was. But recently I had an revelation, I have a conscience and when your raised by people with out one you feel odd because we think, feel and care for things that they dont. And they treated me different, like i was mentally weird. I am glad I figured this out before i die, it put everything into perspective. And I could check up on my Xbf with a click of a mouse, but I wont do that to myself, I am sometimes tempted but i wont cause it would mess with my mind….
“People are taken in by the psychopath’s work because in the moment the psychopath really thinks and feels the part. His part is real and yet also a deception.”
My x-spath’s act, both in person to me and online is the “innocent boy,” even though he was a then 35 year old gay man, HIV+ with an enormous online presence and a taste for very graphic pornography.
Examples include:
1) On our 4th or so date, walking out on me in a very fine restaurant (my tab, of course) in protest for simply asking him back to my apartment. I “offended his British reservedness.” Again, 35-year old HIV+ gay man. Flight attendant.
2) Using the chat name “jonvirgin_____” and when I joked about that name, he essentially stayed clear of any sexual content, other than to admit he had never been with a woman.
3) Online uses a profile name similar to “Cluessless Lad.” Amongst many others, often “______ Boy” or “_____ Lad”
He really had me convinced that he was something different, when in reality he is a sex and pornography addicted predator.
While he was withholding sex from me. I am certain that was active with others. Why? I did not realize it at the time, but his chest was waxed. I thought he was just “smooth.” However, one of his online profiles shows a picture of him with chest hair.
Gay men, no matter how vain, do not go through the trouble of having their chest waxed for nothing.
I actually think that in his mind he was “innocent.”
I also want make a point I and several others have. Sociopath often leave victims thinking WTF?
Often, this is in subtle ways, like their reaction to things, a comment…
Especially the nonviolent ones.
BTW, one of the x-spath’s porno profile names is a nordic word meaning “peaceful.”
I just read the link provided earlier and found this to be especially accurate about an N I have just experienced the dark side of.
I could never understand how the N managed to have so many beautiful spiritually minded friends who I had more in common with than with the N! The N stood out like a sore thumb, a totlaly different mentality. I also found this with a previous crazy person (female) who was hostile to me, creepily so, and also appeared to not fit in with the rest of the social group.
Today I read what Doug Macmanaman writes and it all becomes clear:
“They carefully surround themselves with people entirely unlike themselves, that is, with deeply empathic human beings who wish to please others, who are slow to judge, who are excessively tolerant and who have an eye for the good to be found in others. They know how to exploit to their own advantage such character traits. It is their association with such people that maximizes their chances of perpetuating the facade and keeping themselves from exposure.”
How tremendously accurate! This is EXACTLY what they do, I’ve seen it, at least twice so far. Look out for the person who seems to be more immature/less nice/less zen than their friends. And there you will spot the N. Incredible….
Behind_blue_eyes wrote:
“…Sociopath often leave victims thinking WTF?
Often, this is in subtle ways, like their reaction to things, a comment””
Absolutely spot on. The relationship always feels somehow ‘off’ and different to any we’ve felt before. Interestingly they say this about workplace bullying situations as well.
You feel invalidated, disrespected, ignored. Nothing they say stands up to logic when examined. And the relationship feels very one sided with virtually non existent mutuality. There is no ‘mutuality’ there and it feels imbalanced with them placing themselves in the superior position right from the start. There is no respect for our humanity or personhood.
This is what I’ve experienced from them – they all have this in common. Open sniping and hostility is common too, and veiled put downs. I;’ve had this from men and women Sps/Ns. And the cognitive dissonance thing oh wow yes – that’s one of the first signs. When they wish you all the luck in the world after spending the whole relationship openly stabbing you in the back. Totally obvious but so many of us try to see their good side. Newsflash – they don’t have one! And if they do, do we really want to wait around to look for it?
Something I;ve found helpful is remembering the person I am when they try to twist my behaviour into something that it isn’t. You know, when they attribute malicious or insane motives to something you’ve done when it wasn’t the case. Just keep reminding yourself of your personhood, the one thety are trying to deny. You are not a manipulative person, you are not insane, you are a good person, a decent human being and they are trying to fool you. Our best defence is knowledge of ourselves and our own strengths and weaknesses because then they can’t use them against us and their power is negligible.
Love & light xxxxx