“The motivation (for lying) is particularly baffling in endogenous deceit when the psychopath may appear to have everything he wants yet continues quite predictably to commence the manipulative cycle.” So says Dr. Reid Meloy in The Psychopathic Mind, p121.
“I don’t think they even eat an ice cream cone just for pleasure, I think they do everything for the effect it has, or the image it presents. It isn’t about what is REAL it is about what they can appear to be. To them, I think, if they can get others to believe it, then it becomes “reality” as far as they are concerned.” So says Ox Drover in a comment on this blog.
There is complete agreement about one thing regarding sociopaths, that is lying defines them. While studies show that many people lie daily, the lying behavior of sociopaths differs in both degree and kind from “normal” lying. Sociopaths do not just misrepresent the truth in small ways to spare someone’s feelings, avoid an argument or avoid trouble. Sociopaths misrepresent themselves and this misrepresentation extends to everyone they know. (For more advanced readers, there may not be much of a self there to misrepresent.)
You don’t need a checklist
So today I can tell you with confidence that you don’t need a checklist of symptoms or a forensic expert. If you are astounded by another person’s capacity to lie and misrepresent reality you can be sure you have encountered a sociopath.
I said a few weeks ago that I think Meloy’s book The psychopathic Mind is a great contribution to humanity. In this book, Meloy puts forth the idea that we can identify “psychopaths” by observing what he calls “the psychopathic process.” I searched the book for a precise definition of “the psychopathic process” and couldn’t find one but he implies that psychopathy is defined by the way a person interacts with others and with him/herself. He also says that it is possible to identify a “psychopath” by the way that person makes you feel. If you can look within yourself and monitor your own reactions you can learn to tell when you are face to face with “the psychopathic process.”
It doesn’t “work” on me anymore!
I have learned what it feels like to be “worked” and because I know what that feels like, “it” doesn’t work on me anymore. Sociopaths do not just lie, they work people. Their relationships are an occupation for them and it’s not just a job, it’s an adventure. They will even work when there is no apparent reason to. Why do they do this? They do this because there is nothing else they can do. They have little or no capacity to look within and find an inner compass of values and pleasures. As Ox Drover points out, the only real pleasure they have is their “work.”
Dr. Meloy gives a great example of a psychopath “at work” on page 138 when he discusses a professional who was “worked” by a psychopath. Knowing that he was going to be assigned a certain probation officer, the psychopath asked others who knew her about her interests. On discovering that the woman was interested in metaphysics and the writings of Alfred North Whitehead, the psychopath went and read the writings. He then gained the respect and admiration of the P.O. because he discussed these writings as if he too had a genuine interest in them that predated his knowledge of her.
Meloy says, “He does not just play the role, observing the limits of his character, but lives the part.” People are taken in by the psychopath’s work because in the moment the psychopath really thinks and feels the part. His part is real and yet also a deception.
You know you are being worked when the things you love/enjoy are mirrored in this way. You can tell the difference between this mirroring and real sharing by the extent to which the other person tries to build your enthusiasm and point to the apparent “twin-ship” you share. This mirroring and twin-ship can occur with big things as in the metaphysics example and it can occur with little things as in the ice cream example.
Now if you know what I am talking about, you have been worked; you are likely far along in the recovery process because you know what this feels like. If you have only a vague notion of what I am saying, Dr. Meloy has other words of wisdom for you.
In the psychopathic process there is a “complete disconnect between words and actions.” If you notice that a person’s actions point south and their words point north, you are dealing with a sociopath. To be concrete, if the person says they love you and either doesn’t spend much time with you, or repeatedly harms and stresses you, you are in the middle of a psychopathic process. But remember since the person “lives the part” at the moment he/she is with you and says “I love you” there is some vague reality to the statement (especially if the person has the disorder in a lesser form, see last week). To see the psychopathic process, you have to train yourself to pay attention to both a person’s words and to remember that person’s deeds at the same time.
If you do this you will be able to see the disconnect between words and deeds and the psychopathic process. If you begin to see the psychopathic process, it is very important that you not share this observation with the psychopath. He or she will not benefit from your feedback and may even become violent. At the moment you see the process, you must discipline yourself and disconnect. If you have problems with self-discipline you likely need a therapist to help you disentangle from the psychopathic process.
Recovery and discovery are about learning to pay attention. Pay attention to yourself and pay attention to what other people say and do. Most people need help in order to learn the skill of paying attention. That is the kind of help a good therapist can give you.
In the next few weeks we’ll talk more about the psychopathic process. Please feel free to share your experience of being worked or the disconnect between words and deeds.
I’ve just read your article and finally realise I’m not going mad, I’ve been living with a sociopath!
How do you break the addiction?
Thankx OxD! I just had a thought! oh noooo:..haha.. Good Morning America is looking for an advice person to be on their show regularly. Kinda like a Dear Abby person. I think you should try out.. It’s on their website. I nominate Oxy!!
I generally do have a list like you mention. A deal breaker list but when I ran into Mr. Gorgeous at the gym I kinda got hypnotized and it sorta went out the window. It was the old persona of the gorgeous young teacher who looked like a young Elvis that did it. Only now he is more distinguished and “mature”( Yeah right) . I was a goner even at this age.
I am very thankful that I did in fact learn the lesson: RUN LIKE HELL FROM SPATHS!! I have heard the saying “when the student is ready the teacher comes”. Only my teacher didn’t come-too much pot 🙂 That is true you know. Marijuana inhibits orgasm. 🙂 That could be a very good thing, in retrospect! Gotta have a sense of humor about it.
I have to admit that I am proud of myself that I was able to recognize that something was not right and I needed to back away big time. Kinda like when you run into a bear in the woods. Yikes! In my younger years I would have walked into it blindly. So even tho I am older now I can still grow. That’s great!
Thanks Oxy and don’t forget to check out the Good Morning America job, you would be awesome!
Adamsrib, Your anology of running into a bear in the woods, reminded me of this: When I was a little kid, my mom and grandad and me took a trip to yellowstone. We saw a bear in the distance and my mom wanted to take a picture….so she put the small instamatic camara to her eye to focus, and started walking toward the bear…well, she finally took the picture, and when she brought the camara down, away from her eye, she was only about 6 feet away from the bear. Good Lord, Yikes is right……but isn’t that kind of what we do when we obsess on them, trying to get an accurate picture of them, trying to understand why they do what they do?
We lose pespective and get way too close to them for our own good.
Will a spath contaminate his envirnment? Does a bear —- in the woods?
Kim, THAT IS A PRICELESS STORY AND ANALOGY!!!! YES!!!! Through the “lenses” we see them through, PERCEPTION IS DISTORTED and we get way too close before we even know it.!!!
The answer to your question is YES!!!!!!
ROTFLMAO Great Post Kimmie! Thanks!!!
Dear Adamsrib,
Well, I thought about the job, but it would mean I had to get up EARLLLLLLY in the morning (no longer my thang) and I’d have to move off the farm, so I guess I’ll pass on the “Dear Oxy Job” and just stay here on the “”DONNA’s LOVEFRAUD CHANNEL—tune in tomorrow for what’s new!” ROTFLMAO
Kim,
I loved the analogy about your mother & the bear. Man! Isn’t the truth! We see this great beast—so magnificent in its wildness & overwhelming musk—& our first reaction should be to have a righteous fear of it. But, no, we want to get closer, even tho we know it’s dangerous…..& when it doesn’t immediately maul us to death, we’re overawed at its gentleness—->& sadly, begin to think of ourselves as someone very special because the beast has been tamed by our wonderfulness!! Or at least that’s the way I apply it to my own experience.
And, yes, as Oxy said, our perception is distorted by our closeness to it. We should change the zoom on the lens, but we don’t do it in time!!
Oxy,
also what you said earlier about our believing that ANYTHING & EVERYTHING they say to us is TRUE! Oh my!
Yes, he always had an answer for everything, he knew how to do anything, & he was (is) so intelligent, so of course I knew I could accept everything he said as being true. NOT TRUE, as it turned out! Reading the chapt 9 excerpt of Donna’s book yesterday, & the recounting of allll the grand tales her hb told her about his business dealings….Oh My!
We think, “How could anyone spin so much detail, all woven together so neatly, if it weren’t true??” And, of course, the “grain of truth” that’s always thrown in makes it impossible for us to see as even doubtful.
So therein is the trick bag of pain: following their yellow brick road of half-truths & lies & empty promises—& so sure that we can see Emerald City just over there—& then BAM! We’re told that we were never good enough to be allowed into Oz. Lies to build us up & lies to tear us down.
Dear Whyme,
Yep, you are getting the lesson! The one we all have to learn.
The horrible part is that when we first start to learn it we are in such pain that it just eats our hearts out! There will come a time, though, Whyme, when you can have the lesson without the pain.
You can look by and see the things you should have seen then, and you would have seen if you weren’t “blinded” by the rosy-colored lenses of our vision of love. Once we get them off, the vision is cleared up and we are no longer in pain with it.
We can retain the lesson without the pain involved. I’m not sure WHEN exactly I passed through that change-over, but I can realize now that I did pass through it.
I remember once after my very “traumatic” divorce from my first husband, about 18 months later, It just DAWNED ON ME ONE DAY I WAS HAPPY. “Happy” had kind of sneaked up on me without me noticing.
I think the same thing has happened again. It has sort of sneaked up when I wasn’t looking! You’ll get there, just keep on trucking! (((hugs))))
Well guys, you’ll be interested to know that I ran into the old man in the gym today. I had changed my time, he knew I had changed my time, I specifically told him we need to take a break and when I walk in (at my time) there he is. He gives me this sad sack routine “what happened I thought we were doing good. I get a card from you (before LF) then this dear John phone message (afterLF) ” wahwahwah..
I had made a promise to myself NC so what now? I sucked it up and here’s the dialogue and it is classic spath:
Him: So there you are
Me: you’re here early
Him: Well I have to watch the grandkids this afternoon (liar!!He dragged his sorry ol azz in like we knew he would to hook me in again).
Me: We need to talk
Him: Talk about what?
Me: the confusion
Him: Confusion? What confusion? I’m not confused.
Me: Well you’re not the only one in the relationship. In case you haven’t noticed I’m here too (the whole time his eyes are darting from side to side like one of those cat clocks from the 60’s like he’s trying to figure out what to say) so let’s come up with a time to meet (he does not say a word but leaves to take his shower. When he comes out of the shower room he starts to tell everybody goodbye and acts like he is leaving).
Me: Before you leave we need to come up with a time to get together so we can have a chat (a bluff, of course I know that will NEVER happen)
Him: (he is really nervous and wired because he knows he is caught ) Well, I don’t know why you are feeling like this!!
Me: this is why we need to meet to talk, so you’ll know
Him: Well, I’ll be here on Friday (at the gym with all his cronies-his time).
Me: I won’t discuss our personal issues in front of your crew. This is how it works, You call me, we set a time, we meet for coffee and lay our cards out on the table (he is looking mighty gobsmacked by now-didn’t think Mother Teresa had it in her) and if you can’t do it that way then forget about all of it!!
Him: (he is pissed) Ok, then forget it! $%#$@.......!!! (he slinks away like the snake he is).
Everyone in the gym is hearing this whole exchange and when he leaves I practically expect the gym folks to break out into applause. I am feeling like Sally Fields in “Norma Rae”. I go into the women’s locker room and pump my fist with a loud “Yeah, I am Woman hear me roar baby!”
It feels so good to stand up to him and watch him slither out. Will he gaslight me? Probably but the beauty is he is so much older than me that he will look like the proverbial old fool so it is a win-win for me. He is in check mate!
To quote Jame Brown: “I feel good dadadadadaduh OW!! 🙂
I am soooo proud of myself. I pulled out Oxy’s skillet and kerpow!! 🙂
This site is da bomb. A week ago I would not have known what to do or that there was even a name for his weirdness much less how to read him and give it back.
Thanks guys!!
Just a NOTE: this would not work on many spaths. It works on this one because he is an old buzzard who knows his time is dust, A younger person could go violent and it could be dangerous to try this. I think the crew on here would agree. My gut tells me he will retreat into his man cave and plot how to screw some other dumb woman over without a hint of remorse or concern for me. It may not be the last of him but he will be seeing stars for a while. KERPOW!!
Dear Adamsrib,
I’m so proud of you!!!! TOWANDA!!!! And yes, I agree with your note that this might not work on all kinds of Ps but on this one I think you are right!
IF HE ACCOSTS YOU VERBALLY again at the gym, just say something sort of “whisper” but loud enough that others can hear (of course!) “John I tried to get you to meet me privately so I could let you know, but due to the differences in our ages it isn’t going to work, I REALLY DO NEED SOMEONE WHO CAN STILL GET IT UP!” Then turn and prance off with your bouncy hair!
I think he will change gyms.
See, I can be as BAAAAAD as EB! LOL
Good job!