“How did he really feel?” and “What did he want from me?” are two questions that often haunt victims of sociopaths. The reason we are haunted by these questions varies but often stems from the habit of over-focusing on the sociopath instead of ourselves. That being said, victims also have a healthy ”˜need to know’ that can help with recovery and healing.
I struggled with these questions in my own healing. I remain baffled by my observations of enjoyment of affection on the part of sociopaths. Early on, I told my own therapist that I had come to the conclusion that sociopaths exploit those close to them to the point of death, then, cry at the funeral. At the moment the tears are shed, I believe they do represent a grief of sorts. The feelings of loss experienced by sociopaths are however, short lived. Victims also have to beware because, although sociopaths are said to be incapable of feelings for those in their lives, they do become obsessed with them. Psychologists have not yet explained this obsession. If they don’t attach, why are they obsessed? Those who have read my other entries know that I believe that sociopaths do attach. It is what they do with attachments that is disordered.
How did he really feel?
In response to the picture of a sociopath crying at his victim’s funeral, my therapist said, “He feels what he tells himself he feels.” To help you understand what my therapist meant, I will explain what is known about how people usually experience feelings.
There are two components to feelings. The first is a physical sensation. When we experience a feeling we feel something in our bodies in relationship to that feeling. Think about loving someone close to you and sense how your body feels. Is it warmth in your heart? That is usually what people report.
There is much evidence that these physical sensations are disordered in sociopaths. Sociopaths do not generally experience the physical and hormonal changes that go along with feeling emotion. If they do experience them, it is to a lesser degree. Physical responses are blunted.
The second component of feelings is called attribution. Attribution is a cognitive process. When I feel that warmth in my heart as I see my children, I attribute the sensation to my love for them. Thus the physical sensation alone does not make emotion. Emotion is physical sensations and our interpretations of these sensations. There is also evidence that the parts of the brain responsible for attribution do not function properly in sociopaths.
There is one emotion that many sociopaths experience in a not so disordered way. This emotion is anger. Sociopaths do have blunted physical responses to anger. Despite this blunted responsiveness, they seem aware of angry feelings and make correct attributions about what makes them angry. Again, science has not even addressed, much less explained this observation.
Since the physical sensations and attributions that allow for the experience of emotion are disordered in sociopaths, their inner world is very different. They are left to make sense of themselves and others without the tools most of us use. Other parts of the brain fill in the missing processes. The person who is credited with first describing sociopathy in depth is Hervey Cleckley. He proposed that sociopaths are at least of average if not above average verbal intelligence. This makes sense because they have to use their verbal intelligence to make up for their lack of emotions. They do indeed feel what they tell themselves they feel. Scientists say they mimic other people’s emotions, yet again there is no real proof of this.
What did he want from me?
This question is easy to answer intellectually, but very hard for victims to accept emotionally. There are three pleasures we get from our love relationships. The first is pleasure in affection. The second is sexual pleasure. The third is pleasure associated with dominance and control. Sociopaths experience sex and dominance as enormously more pleasurable than affection. Therefore, they are in relationships to get sex and power, pure and simple.
If you love deeply and feel affection for others, you cannot fathom the inner world of an emotionally disordered person whose primary pleasures are sex and power. To understand another’s world you have to imagine yourself experiencing what the other experiences. You can’t do this with a sociopath.
Louise Gallagher said in her post The six steps of healing from a psychopath that the first step is acceptance. We have to accept that we can only know in part how sociopaths really feel and what they want from us. We can understand intellectually, but never emotionally.
still reeling,
I think it is especially hard to heal from sociopathic encounters/relationships, when infidelity is involved (whether it is emotional or sexual). Infidelity is such a strong taboo, an “unpardonable sin” among many, that it makes it even harder to seek support as we sort out the situation, our part in it, the other person’s part in it, etc.
There is truly not enough studied or written about this topic that is helpful to people who get caught up in it. Both players in the dynamic tend to be viewed as equally immoral, without any conscience at all, no respect for vows, spouse or children; sexual addicts or only concerned with themselves. Some people are serial cheaters and spathlike in having no remorse, empathy, etc. And others are seduced to one degree or another (however far it goes) by spaths, and seem to be in some kind of fog where they can’t think straight, and act in ways they later come to regret. Yet this aspect of the dynamic is hardly acknowledged, and mostly people are viewed with disgust as “cheaters.” There is a lot of shame and guilt.
It would indeed be helpful to fit this type of infidelity into the mix of spath relationships, so that it is something that can be talked about and not hidden in shame and condemnation (by self and others).
It is not enough to say, “cheaters don’t deserve any support,” or “I would never be unfaithful myself, so I am fit to judge you,” or “you cheated so that erases anything else good about you,” or even “well, there must have been some lack you were feeling in your marriage, which made you vulnerable to an affair,” because as anyone who has ever experienced this knows, it can come out of almost seemingly nowhere, when people are in good and strong marriages. Our behaviors can end up surprising us. And that can shake us to our core.
Not an excuse, just that there is more to this in some cases, than is commonly believed. For instance, unawareness of the existence of spaths as seducers.
still reeling:
OMG…your situation sounds a lot like mine!!! Wow! The only difference it sounds like is mine hasn’t been fired…YET. Hmmmmm, very interesting. I completely understand how this messes us up psychologically. I left my job to get away from it all! I hope you find peace.
Still reeling, welcome! Sorry it is under this circumstances, and sorry this is not a “garden club” (unless a troll comes by! LOL) they do get us to let go of our moral compass sometimes and then we feel like double fools. I hope you stick around and read and learn, and blog with us…KNOWLEDGE IS POWER and the more we know the better off we are.
I also suggest taht you get a copy of Donna’s new book RED FLAGS…(no, I don’t get a commission! LOL) it just really is a great book and lots of great information in it!
Again, welcome and thanks fo rsharing your story. God bless.
Ox and Louise, thanks for your kind thoughts, understanding and wishes for peace. I wish the same for myself as well! And of course, for you. I’m not sure of your stories but thinking there has been p/spath pain in your lives if you’re posting here.
20yrs, I don’t really know how to respond to your post. My marriage, like so many others, is so complicated and I can’t really explain it except to say that I prob. should never *have* married. Too insecure, too anxious, too obsessive, too needy, very low self-esteem, way too many expectations, plus I chose men that only increased my self-doubt and never gave supportive guys a chance. Like you, I wanted so badly to be a partner, felt marriage was sacred, wanted to be one with another. It just didn’t turn out that way. When this man came into my life, I knew it wasn’t the *right* thing to do but I allowed myself to judge neither him nor me. I am a guilt-ridden kind of individual and I figured “What the hell, this guy seems to see something in me that is very special and I like it.” It sure beat going home and walking past each other like two wooden statues. It distracted me from the fears and anxieties I’ve lived with all my life. I wanted to live in the moment. It felt great. I didn’t want to deal with guilt or feeling low or beaten down. I felt high and young. I even looked different. People commented on that in a + way. Yes, he completely threw me for a loop and made me feel desirable and just plain old happy. The terrors in my head quieted and I was able to see things in a better perspective. I didn’t make so much out of little things that don’t matter. I was a better wife.
There was never a relationship with this man outside of the office besides email. We talked on the phone once or twice. I don’t like the phone at all. Plans never happened to eat dinner together. He asked me out one time and I didn’t go. It was a meeting of the minds, a sharing of ideas, someone who thought I was great. Someone to talk to instead of being less interesting than a TV commercial..someone who asked me to sing instead of telling me NEVER to sing again around him. My husband is a good man and a trustworthy man, I think. He just doesn’t or can’t share himself. I am certainly not fault or blameless. I accept my part in letting this marriage fail. We still watch TV together and go on trips but there is no warmth.
That’s about all I can muster today. I don’t miss this man anymore. I just feel depressed. Once he left, he never contacted me.
Still reelilng,
It sounds to me like you got an “emotional” divorce quite some time ago. It could be worse, you could be going at each other like two dogs over a bone, but at the same time…what a shame to just be “room mates” who don’t particularly like each other.
Maybe you could get him to go to counseling…maybe not…maybe YOU can go to counseling and deal with some of your own issues and that might help the marriage some, who knows. I know one thing…we start out learning about THEM but end up learning about and changing ourselves….making ourselves into better people, stronger people and wiser people.
Keep on reading and learning. You ARE WORTHWHILE and YOU ARE worth working on…loving yourself, valuing yourself, validating yourself! God bless.
still reeling:
Hmmmm, this man sounds very strange. I didn’t realize that you two didn’t sleep together. I just assumed that you did from your earlier posts. I am questioning what his motives really were other than to screw up your head. I thought he was really out for sex, but apparently not. And when he left, he never even contacted you? It all just seems weird to me…especially for someone who was so into you. I AM glad that you don’t miss him anymore…good for you!! I can’t wait until I no longer miss the guy who messed me up.
still reeling:
Too bad you still need to be at that workplace. So after he left, have you ever heard confirmation from anyone about why he was fired?? If not, do you really think it was because another woman turned him in? Do you think he was scamming multiple women?
Hi Louise,
Sorry you’ve experienced this ghoulish waste of time and spirit and hope you get over it soon….he has been on my mind big time since he left and I angst over him quite a bit but little by little, it’s getting better. These personalities know how to choose well. Give yourself some time to grieve, but if you’re obsessive like me, it will take even longer.
I had a huge emotional investment in this guy as I saw it as my last chance for some fun and connection. It’s really difficult to explain and I don’t think anyone would find it particularly interesting.
No, no sex. I think when he figured that out, he wanted to get out of the “friendship,” but was afraid it might p me off. So we email’d, talked here and there, and he said things at times, as I noted earlier that kept me on the string, they were so out of the blue and genuine. He must have enjoyed my company though, as he did ask me to spend the day with him once after he was quite sure I was not going to have sex with him. I think he enjoyed my company….I don’t get it. The roller coaster of sociopathy. Once I googled his weird behavior, and read about this disorder, I could see where he fit right into it. My therapist as well. She was astounded at his behavior too. Thought he was in love with me. Then we realized his dropping out of sight mentally, physically and emotionally right after a day or experience that was so nice, was pathological. He told me he was “complicated.” Um yeah.
Yes, I do think he was w/many women long before I came along and during his f.ship with me. Definitely. I think that finally brought him down. But darn it, as much as it might hurt, I really do want to know what happened. He did try to tell me something during the last week he was there….but he couldn’t get it out. It was so frustrating at times talking to him, because of the passive part of his p-a personality. Then he called me twice when he got the ax I guess, (I was not at work when it happened so got to hear no gossip!) but I didn’t pick up – he had been treating me so sh*tty, during those last weeks, basically ignoring me completely, I just did not want to talk to him. He would not email me…did not want to leave a trail. And I don’t trust anyone in our office. I really don’t know anyone all that well. The few people I asked said they didn’t know anything. I really have to fight asking one of the other mgrs to talk to me privately – but my gut tells me not to.
I did email him once to let him know I thought he was a fraud and was not at all the person I thought he was, that I conjured him up out of my own needs. He responded with some cryptic 3 word note, basically saying he wished me peace. G-d that inflamed me. I let him know back that I needed nothing from him but hoped he could find a way to live with himself.
At the end, he was so distraught, he started denying things that happened between us right to my face….he showed so many characteristics of the master manipulator, path liar, mal narcissist and overall socio, I don’t think he could help himself. Another reason it’s so frustrating. They can’t feel, have no soul and don’t understand those things.
Anyway, sorry to go on and on. I wish you all the best Louise. Hope that things get better for you and hang in there.
Ox, I have been in therapy all my life. My husband won’t go. There is no way to change him as he is happy with himself as he is. I don’t know what’s in his head. I enjoy his company and we do have children (grown). About a decade ago, I gave up trying (prob said that above) and we moved apart completely – yes, emotional divorce is a good description. I am still in therapy and prob always will be. I do find temp peace and perspective there. Trying so so so so hard to accept myself and having a very difficult time. This experience has really thrown me backwards. It would help to get OUT of that job but it’s very difficult to get a job at my age. I’ve been on about 3 interviews. You would not believe all the weird things that have happened since I’ve been there (only a little over a yr): hit by a car, fell on the ice and messed up my knee, dropped my badge down an elevator shaft, this horrible experience with nutman, got cancer one year ago and a lot of problems after the surgery, thankfully they got it all, but being a worrier, I have gotten very depressed, extremely embarrassingly low pay.
I’ve gone on too long. I hope somehow, my story can help others who still hurt. I wish I had time to read all the posts! Sooooooo late for work…no makeup today!
Dear Still reeling,
Well, sorry about the emotional divorce…that’s a sad way to live, but you are right, you can’t change him, and there are advantages financially etc and especially if you have grown children, to staying together.
It does leave one vulnerable though to being sucked into the fantasy of an extra marital affair. Even one like this without sex. It seems to me that many guys want this kind of a “romance” because they do not want anything other than the chase and the excitement and sex, without any real commitment or change in their lives. It’s just a “game.”
I’m sorry for your pain, but glad you are out of it. Also glad you are in therapy. Hope it will help you find wha tyou are looking for. (((hugs)))
still reeling:
I just cannot believe how much your situation and more your “feelings” sound exactly like mine.
I AM obsessed so that is why it is taking me so long to get over it. More addicted than obsessed. I would swear that this man you are talking about IS my spath except mine has not been fired…YET.
I did have sex with mine…extremely unfortunate. I would give anything to be able to say I didn’t like you didn’t.
When you said you felt it was your last chance for fun and connection…that was me!! Wow, unbelievable. I am single and have never dated much. So when this guy came along, I wasn’t interested at first, but little by little he broke me down and then before I knew it, I was hooked…I have no idea how it happened other than he is spath. I never felt so exilarated and electrified in my life. He was fun, playful, pitiful, smart, adorable, warm, everything wrapped into one. I am getting choked up and triggered just even typing this. He was like unother (un-other…is that a word??) I had ever met. One of the other women in my office who he had also had an affair with said the exact same thing…said she had never met anyone like him. She was also in love with him and she was also married. This man made women drop like flies no matter where he went. He did all the things you said yours did…would disappear after having a great time. In the end, I am convinced it’s obviously because he was married. He was separated at the time though…had been separated for an entire year, but ultimately went back to his wife. Other similarities to your situation…mine also kept me on the line because he was afraid I would turn him in…I LEFT my job because of him (gave up everything…a very good job I had been at for 12 years)…I had nothing to lose at that point. He kept me on the line for another eight months and then disappeared again so not only did I fall for it once, I fell for it again. He’s unbelievable. I am in therapy now because of all this.
Do you work in a small or large company? Whatever it is, it sounds like they don’t mess around with inappropriate behavior when it’s reported. How long had he worked there??
Sigh…I am glad you are healing and I know how hard it is. I guess at least you do have a husband and children…I don’t have anything like that.