Lovefraud recently received a letter from a 17-year-old high school student–we’ll call him Brandon. He wrote that another boy at school was using manipulation to bully him.
When Brandon resisted, the bully asked what he had done wrong, and why Brandon was being so mean—I can almost hear the false concern and sincerity dripping from his voice. The bully told Brandon to apologize.
What happened next was classic sociopathic behavior. Here’s what Brandon wrote:
When I moved away from him, he came and found me and was aggressive and wouldn’t leave me alone. And kept getting other people involved by asking them to ask me why I wouldn’t talk to him.
He then punched me and blamed me for punching me saying, “you made me do it.”
When I went to teachers to tell them they said that they can only talk to him not discipline him.
However, after I spoke with teachers about the incident he came back and wanted to know why I’d complained and then swore at me.
He is very good with words and can make himself look like the victim all the time.
My school isn’t doing anything about it and whenever I see teachers they say that he doesn’t mean anything by it all and didn’t know he was doing anything wrong.
So I’ve seen a very sinister side to this kid, which the teachers haven’t seen themselves.
Because he punched me… should I go to the Police? Would that work?
I wasn’t sure how to advise Brandon. Generally, of course, we tell people to have no contact with the person who has targeted them. But how do you have no contact in high school? Brandon already moved away from the bully, and the bully continued to follow him.
So I discussed this case with a good friend, who is a high school supervisor. She advised that Brandon file a complaint with the school’s guidance counselors.
Because of the legal concept of in loco parentis, or “in the place of a parent,” schools are legally responsible to act in the best interests of students. School officials are representatives of the state, and have authority over incidents that happen at school, or during school functions. If the bully assaulted Brandon outside of school, his only option would be to go to the police.
This happens. My friend told me that there are several cases at her high school in which students have restraining orders against each other.
The importance of reporting the incident to the guidance counselor, or whatever the procedures are at this student’s high school, is to establish a paper trail. School officials can’t do anything without documentation of an individual’s transgressions.
I imagine that Brandon needs to be very strong to take these steps, especially when bully is conning the teachers with the pity ploy, and the clueless teachers term his behavior a “communications problem.” Brandon didn’t mention his parents—I hope they are supporting him.
But still, for practical purposes, what works in this situation? Will reporting the bully enrage him, and cause even more bullying? Or is it important for Brandon to take a stand, file a report with the cops, and let the bully know that at least one student is not taking his crap?
If you have any advice for this young man, please post it.
I’m in California and here is a link to our state’s website on bullying. It has been an important subject out here and the schools are saying they are not going to tolerate it. Brandon, you have got to get someone to help you, this happens to many many other students and is a serious problem. You know there is something wrong with him, normal people don’t act this way.
http://www.cde.ca.gov/ls/ss/se/bullyres.asp
Jim,
you must have missed some of the NOTs in my post. Otherwise, I am completely confused by your statement:
“Well, back on the soapbox”Cedrus”.”Intimidation” is defined and listed as a criminal offense in the legal code of the State of Indiana.”
——
I said (new emphasis):
“… ignore him…minimize interaction, but be “polite”… PRETEND not to be afraid or intimated if you are… if the bully gets physical again, defend yourself, physically. (But) DON’T over do it, DON’T use a weapon, DON’T threaten to kill him OR to put a bomb in his locker” but please, show him he can’t violate you like that….
This sort of thing happened in my kids’ school…. The targeted kid got so frustrated that when he finally acted defensively, he went over board. HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN EXPELLED….”
——–
I was definitely NOT advising Brandon to intimidate or threaten the bully, but to be smart in his interactions with him, and defend himself if he has too.
Cedrus
Cedrus…must be my day…I meant the bully intimidating Brandon….NOT Brandon intimidating the bully. Oh, well….I’m confused, too. When that happens, I take a vacation….might be a while. Continue healing on Lovefraud….
Jim — DOES THAT MEAN YOU TAKE LOTS OF VACATIONS ?? BECAUSE IM ALWAYS CONFUSED AND YOUR SOLUTION SOUNDS LIKE A GOOD ONE!! LOL
ALWAYS COUNTING ON YOUR TIMELY SENSE OF HUMOR HERE AND YOUR COMMENTS AND YOUR MALE EQUIVALENT OF “OXY” ADVICE !
AND BTW..ARE THERE VEGAN HAGGIES! LOL
Hey, Jim, you are now the “male equuivalent of “oxy” ” Are you going to sit still and let her call you “names” ???? Ha ha ha ha
Good morning, actually, afternoon, it is 12:01….
The schools here have the “no bully” logos up all over the place. I see them when we go to the schools and do our living history things.
I am sure that most schools are trying to at least stop the PHYSICAL intimidation of the physical bullying but I don’t see how they can ever stop the emotional bullying that goes on. The kid who is different, who is left out of the social circle.
Kids can be so cruel at that age, even the “good kids” who will still emotionally wound someone who wants to have “friends.” There are some experiments here iin AR with Junior high separate schools for boys and girls. That may help some, I don’t know. It may make it worse.
I know that school can be hell on the kid who doesn’t fit in. I was never part of the “jock in crowd” but was one of the “nerd crowd” but my school was small enough and had enough programs for the “nerdy” kids that I never felt excluded. I had to change schools in the middle of the 11th grade due to my dad taking a job in another town, and it was very anxiety-provoking for me to leave the school group I had attended since 4th grade and knew my “role” in that group of students and teachers. It made enough of an impression on me that I vowed then I would keep my kids in the same school from 1st to 12th—it didn’t work out that way though, but that was my intention.
There was only one time when I was bullied, and that was 2nd grade, where an older and bigger kid in my class would beat the snot out of me every morning. I actually was ashamed of being beaten, and didn’t tell anyone. When she broke my jaw with a coke bottle one morning, it became obvious and was handled immediately. I still to this day can’t understand why I was ashamed and didn’t “tell”—maybe the “don’t be a tattle tale thing” that is pounded into our heads, so one thing I did with MY own kids was from an early age tell them the differences between being a “tattle tail” and “telling.” Being a “tattle tale” is coming and saying “Johnny called me a doo doo” and TELLING is saying “Johnny is setting the house on fire.” They seemed to grasp that concept from 4-5 years old and would come and TELL me when some kid was doing something dangerous (rock throwing etc) and the problem was handled immediately.
I think as long as there are Ps and budding Ps that there will be bullying. Remember the book “Lord of the Flies?” I think that book clearly indicates what happens with kids if there are no adults to teach them civilization.
Oxy… t’was a compliment to the dear lad…quite the compliment I might add! 🙂
DEar learned,
Thank you sweetie!!! I knew what you meant, just making a little joke! Being complimented actually embarasses me, I guess part of me loves it and part of me feels I don’t deserve it. That’s another thing I am working on.
I don’t know if you have ever read the book “The Impostor Syndrome” but it is about as an adult feeling like we really are NOT competent etc. and that we feel like we are just “imposters” who have the other people fooled.
I can remember feeling that way when I was in 7th grade. I had taken a spelling test and made 100% (the only one in the class to do so, but spelling is NOT my big asset) anyway the teacher praised me for this and my thought was “Boy, did I have her fooled.” WTF? I did deserve the praise, I did a good job, but I felt I hadn’t deserved it, that I had “fooled” the teacher into thinking I made 100%!
I got wonderful job evaluations as well (with one exception) and I never felt I “deserved” them…yet I tried harder and harder to do the right things and did a “bang up job” in my career, yet, I never felt I was “good enough.” I focused on my lack of PERFECTION, nothing but PERFECTION was good enough to me, and I knew I wasn’t perfect, so therefore I wasn’t “good enough.”
I set the BAR WAY TOO HIGH FOR MYSELF and WAY TOO LOW for others. I a working on changing that. I am working on giving myself permission to NOT be perfect and stilll be OK. I can accept imperfection in others, but it is difficult to do it for myself.
And, Yes, I think Jim is a very level headed sharp guy with a great sense of humor! He is an asset to LF! If I wasn’t already “engaged” to Henry (if he decides to go straight) I might start to flirt with Jim! But you know, being “enagaged” to Henry keeps me from flirting too much with all these other great guys! Where is Henry lately? Haven’t heard from him in a while. I guess that’s what happens when you get a new job!
Jim,
no problem.
Ced
I think it’s unreasonable to expect a high school student to be able to deal effectively and safely with a person who exhibits psychopathic and or sociopathic traits. Look at all the stories on this website that show how difficult that is for adults.
When the adults at school are powerless (baloney, but as long as they don’t intervene, the net effect is the same) there isn’t much Brandon can do but avoid this bully or leave the school.
Brandon is obviously motivated and intelligent. For a high school student to contact Dr. Leedom shows a startling level of insight or perhaps the guidance of a good parent. Either way, Brandon would probably do very well as a homeschooled student.
My own son had a problem with a boy I believe to be either psychopathic or sociopathic – the behaviors we saw fit with those labels and beyond that, this boy just felt “bad” in the same scary way another sociopath I had the misfortune to come in contact with felt. Since there were only a few weeks of school left, we decided to allow my son to stay in school but advised him to avoid the other boy as much as possible. Most importantly, our son was NEVER to speak or be around this boy without witnesses. We felt that (as in Brandon’s case) the teachers and guidance counselors would probably do more harm than good (this boy was an astonishingly accomplished manipulator) so we didn’t even bother asking them for help. We did give our son a crash course on how a psycho/sociopathic mind works so he’d have the proper respect for the danger we saw.
Because my son is not a psycho or sociopath, it was hard for him to empathize with the other boy. We used the analogy of a rattlesnake to help him grasp the concept. There’s no communicating with a rattlesnake, no explaining your perspective.
Since my son was no longer interesting to torment, he was left alone. I feel sure this was because this particular psycho/sociopath is young (two years younger than my son) and because high school is a rich hunting ground for someone like that.
I sincerely hope Brandon survives this contact without the consequences that so many others have suffered.
Dear Gentlepath,
Thanks for posting your perspective on this. It sounds like you gave your son a good LESSON IN LIFE, and many times, the things you suggested and your son seemed to implement well, WILL work if the bully is not too vested in THAT particular victim.
You are so right that HS is a “rich hunting ground” for psychopathic kids. Especially the larger schools. Thanks for sharing your take on this.