I address this post mainly to my female audience because, in my experience, the pathology I’ll be discussing, while not exclusively male, is more often than not expressed by men against women.
I revisit here what I regard as an important relationship red flag: When you meet a man who seems to be “Mr. Perfect,” someone “you can’t find anything wrong with,” you need to take a good long pause; otherwise, trouble bodes.
Now I’m not talking about, or maligning, the experience of “great chemistry.” Great chemistry, even electric chemistry, where you hit it off instantly, is a good thing and sometimes a good omen.
But there’s an important difference between “great chemistry” versus the sense of having met and experienced “perfection.” The genuine Mr. Right, in other words, is a very different creature than Mr. Perfect, who almost always will be a quack.
There are a number of reasons for this. First, men perceived by the women they meet as “too good to be true” are often men with an agenda to be perceived as too good to be true. These men are often calculating narcissists or sociopaths for whom the game, the challenge, the principal goal, is to disarm their female [target] objects with their apparent, and compelling, perfection.
To advance their agenda these men may exhibit inordinately seductive qualities right from jump—inordinate levels, for instance, of charm, politeness, thoughtfulness, soliticousness, sacrifice and attentiveness (in a word, responsiveness).
But this isn’t a case of their being on their “best behavior,” as new partners normally are with each other; rather, it’s a case of their being on their best “contrived” behavior, their intent being to effect an impression of perfection as if they are cut from a different cloth—specifically, the cloth of male romantic perfection.
These men may want you to regard them as Princes heaven-sent; they may want you to feel that it took something like your lottery-like good fortune to have found them.
Many of them will be seeking the approbation of your social circle; they may want those around you to ask as with shaking heads, “Where did you find him?” “What planet did he come from?” “Oh my God, he’s like”¦perfect!”
These men will often “groom” you not unlike how the sexual abuser grooms his victims—with promises of his special attentiveness, gratification and protectiveness. This exploitive strategy is extremely potent as it accesses deeply-held fantasies to be perfectly loved, protected and embraced.
Other LoveFraud columnists and astute posters have correctly noted that not all of these men are consciously operating as predators. While true, it’s also important not to minimize just how many of these men are, consciously, operating with predatory agendas.
In either case, these are not men who love, respect, or even like women. Rather, they use women for ego-gratifying and ego-masturbatory purposes. And just as the thrill of a masturbatury experience fades fast, so too does the thrill that women give such men fade with often startling, disorienting suddenness.
While this dynamic may or may not confuse the exploiter, it will surely confuse the unalert woman.
In their “grooming” process, these men will often pull out all the stops: they may, for instance, be the best, most attentive lovers you’ve ever had while all the while they’re not actually enjoying the sex because they’re not present; rather, they are watching themselves, and watching themselves with you, as if they’re porno aspirants determined to make a name for themselves, determined to stamp themselves (to legendize themselves, if you will) in your mind.
Many of these men are desperate to be the fantasy of their perfect selves–that is, the fantasy of themselves as special, unique, memorable. And so they tend parasitically (and compulsively) to seek cooperative, vulnerable hosts (such as you) as if to hold for them, store for them their slippery, empty gestures at immortality. (I intend to flesh this idea out in a separate post, recognizing the incompleteness of my explanation.)
We’ve discussed some of these concepts before, but another of them bears repeating: Narcissists, sociopaths and their like will chew you up for the temporary ego-gratifying nutrients you can supply them in the short-term; and then, like a piece of chewing gum from which they’ve extracted all the sugar, they’ll spit you out, devalue and discard you, now that you’ve lost your flavor (and thus use).
(This article is copyrighted (c) 2009 by Steve Becker, LCSW)
I’m all for it, ThornBud. I don’t want anyone to feel uncomfortable, but I think this conversation is important. I’m learning a whole lot about my P from others’ posts on this topic. And there’s so much more I want to understand.
Some of what I’m exploring is related, but not having to do with sex per se. My big (non sex-related) questions at this point have to do with my P’s long distance girlfriend.
Why is he committed to her, seeing her two or three weekends a month, driving hours to be with her, never on his dating accounts or in touch with other women when he’s with her?
Why does she get his weekends and seeming full attention for long stretches of time, and I got rushed out the door in the morning and sat home alone on Saturday nights? He takes her to the beach, to play golf, out to lunch. He reads with her in bed. They cook meals together. I got quick dinners and sex. So what makes her the “keeper” and me, along with the dozens of other women he’s seen on the side in the past eight months, disposable?
This is what I can’t fathom at all. I need help understanding this one and would like to know if anyone at LF has any clue.
He met her online. From her notes to him, she seems sweet and kind and affectionate. She seems very devoted to him. She’s a very high-profile woman in her field, well educated and very accomplished, yet from what I can tell from notes and online videos and recordings, she’s not at all full of herself and she’s someone I would choose as a friend if we met socially.
So, why her and not me? Not that I would want him under any circumstance at this point, but I just don’t get why she gets all the emotional “goodies” and what seems like a full relationship with him, and I got the typical P treatment.
In ThornBud’s article (thanks for posting, by the way!!!), the author talks about these guys being incapable of intimacy and love, and that they don’t mix sex and what they believe is love. I’m sure his girlfriend isn’t sticking around just for the sparkling conversation. And I’m sure she’s completely in the dark about what a train wreck his life actually is (sued by ex-landlady for back rent and several other vendors; saying he left his job and started his own firm, and is now making gobs of money when I suspect he got fired and he’s unemployed; active on at least six online dating sites; on online porn sites for most of the day, etc.).
Clearly, she is being taken and I don’t envy her at all (who wants a boyfriend who’s leading this horrendous secret double life ”“ and lying???). But I still don’t have a handle on why he’s been with her for years and plowed through me in three months.
Does anyone have a perspective on this one?
EM:
” Thinking back I remember that he always could spot the gay rainbow stickers on cars (like 5 cars away). Who’s looking for them – I wasn’t”
See: these are just little signs that we should have picked up on at the time…and I do think we did…I think that is the reason we can recall them later after the ‘relationship’ is over. I can recall numerous things that sent a chill thru me at the time. Adding all these up, especially much behavior towards the end-make me think mine was/is bi. [when I caught him cheating again..I pressed him hard as to why and he finally screamed because he wanted this girl to introduce him to their ‘group’ because they had group sex ….and personally..after what I witnessed in his behavior patterns…I think it’s because he wanted to watch himself and the males] I believe he had much difficulty coming clean with this side of himself but I do think he wanted to come on out with it…and was doing so more and more at the end. His father was very critical of any type of gay behavior so my x was careful to hide that from him…so maybe I was cover. Also: after his father died…my x’s behavior escalated.
Sexual behavior is a powerful insight to a person’s [especially a male-since I believe they express many things thru sex] true personality. So: a proper discussion on sexuality is very helpful, IMO, in understanding who/what we’ve been thru.
Just my experience and opinion and not intended to flame anyone.
they do like group sex, that seems to be a common thread. But mine wanted to direct it all. Every actor had to play his part, while he was the ring leader. I think this was so that he could then form relationships with each person based on their weaknesses and based on his abiltiy to manipulate them into other situations.
There’s one thing, I had noticed sociopath pretend to be someone else, as if they are living their lifestyle for they can gain your trust and when they think they have you, they just do some harsh damages, they manipulate you like you are not even nothing, just take from you. I did not understand the way he was thinking on alot of things, he was saying crazy things and when I call it to him, you are looking me up, you do not believe me. He even taken money and rental from me and than told me something different happen. One time a police pulled him over like minutes from when he had left the airport and he had the vehicle for almost a week, its like the report states this and you say something totally different, it is scary.
Guys,
Lily is “old school” and explicit (though not graphic) talk about sex is upsetting to her…that is HER problem, not ours, and something I think SHE needs to deal with. Each of us has their “triggers” and that is hers. There isn’t any way we can talk about ANYthing and not “offend” someone, and I have told her (off line) that I thnk she needs to be more accepting of others speaking about sex, and if she sees that a topic or post is “offensive” to her, sh eneeds to just quit reading and move on to some other topic. I think we all should practice tolerance of each other in ALL respects.
I have never been offended in any way by how people blog about sex with the psychopaths, it is all handled very well I think. I totally agree with Donna on this matter, I think sex is a BIG part of how they abuse their victims when the relationship is one of intimate contact. It is one of the things that people who have been in intimate relationships NEED to discuss, because sexual intimacy is a BONDING experience for normal people, and is NOT a bonding experience for the Ps, but simply an “animalistic function” without any bonding or love.
Oxy: “It is one of the things that people who have been in intimate relationships NEED to discuss”
You are so correct. Most of us do not discuss this with anyone, not even our counselors. We just don’t feel
comfortable doing so. This is what makes LF so great for
us >>the ability to discuss these intimate details with people
who understand and have lived thru these things…because let’s face it…much of it is bizarre and not believable by the average person. What we have witnessed upsets us, let alone someone not subjected to it. These are things we don’t expect anyone to understand and we get that understanding here on LF. It’s a real help to me…I really find acceptance, understanding and validation here.
Trixie…Yes I have a handle on it. It is because there is something she has that he wants that he hasn’t gotten yet or finished with.
It could be money. It could be he wants her submission, her finally acting like she can’t live without him. It could be that he sees she is not done “cooking”, to the point that she will be REALLY hurt when he dumps her. It may be that she reminds him of his mother. It may be that she lets him beat her to a pulp. It may be the type of horrendous sex she will put up with that lets him get out his hatred for women. It may be that she never complains if he brings along another woman. It may be that she gives him access to a young child to rape. WHO KNOWS??!! WHO CARES!!!
All you have to know is it is ALL ABOUT HIM. Sometimes a “P” will actually get hooked on someone. Let’s say they are involved with Julia Roberts. Someone who makes them feel like they must be incredible to have this woman….and be seen with her …and have access to her money….and have access to her house….and have access to her connections, etc. etc. They don’t EVER LOVE the person. They love whatever it is they are REALLY after. Status, wealth, the usual shallow stuff.
They will manage to keep the mask on longer for someone like that. Just like the people who instantly change when the boss walks in the room. It can be amazing to watch the transformation, can’t it? But is it because they LOVE that boss? Not hardly.
The P I was involved with, who mildly stalked me for 40+ years, was married all but about 4 of those years. You would think he loves his wife. Has 4 children, blah, blah, blah. But he married her because she was an heiress, and he cheats on her with her best friend, etc. etc. Tells her deepest, darkest secrets to any woman he is involved with. Betrays her a 100 ways that she has no idea about.
When they are with a woman long term it is NEVER about love.
And his stalking me was just that. It was never that he could not forget his first love. It might have looked like it to an outsider, but it was just that he could not STAND for there to be one woman on earth who wouldn’t give him another chance when she was about to be married. It took him 40 years, but he finally crushed me. They never give up.
So don’t think he is with her because of love or better sex or anything that would be true of a NORMAL person. HE IS NOT NORMAL.
PS…Actually, we all care if they are raping a child. We care that they are still out there hurting more people. And believe me, I’ve done everything I can to empower the loser’s wife, and to warn any woman he goes nears. But after awhile I realized that just as I would not have listened to the truth at one point, each ADULT has to realize the truth on their own, and I’m not in a position to help much, living so far away etc. So I empowered someone in the area, and have let it go.
If I really want to help innocent vicitms, I think community education is the route to go. Stuff like that. Educating teen girls. etc.
I agree with Oxy on this. I don’t generally write about sex, because it is a very complicated issue for me. But I think it’s important for us to understand the common sexual patterns in these relationships.
It is very clear to me that my ex used sex increase his influence on me. He turned the relationship sexual at the first opportunity, a moment when I was under huge emotional pressure and not thinking straight. Looking back, I can see how many ways he exercised control on that first event. It was almost another form of grooming, getting me used to being in an order-taking position and establishing himself as the center of the universe.
When I think about sex with him, I also think about laughter, because it was another way that he gained control. There were times when I didn’t want to have sex, because I didn’t want to be that vulnerable to him. I can’t say that he raped me using force. But when I said no, he would take it on as a challenge, and keep after me, always finally breaking me down by getting me to laugh. I would start laughing and stop resisting him.
At the time, it seemed like one of the better aspects of the relationship. In retrospect, however, I remember how many times he got past my defenses, times when I’d gotten him out of my life, or didn’t want to make some deal with him, or was finally reacting with appropriate outrage to something he’d done. He would get me to laugh, and it would undo all my defenses.
This is the first time I’ve talked about this, or even thought about it. I’ve always valued a good sense of humor in my partners. But I don’t remember anyone else ever using it in this way. Always before, it was more of a sharing thing, something that was bonding and mutually appreciative. With him, I still reacted as thought it were a bonding thing, but it resulted in him controlling the exchange and getting what I previously didn’t want to give.
Whew! And if that weren’t enough, as I’m thinking about this, I remember being tickled by my father when I was little until my involuntary laughter turned to tears. Now that wouldn’t be called sexual abuse, but really what’s the difference?
These are all new thoughts, and I have no insights. But I’d be curious to know if anyone else remembers anything like this.
This is so weird to talk about, and I don’t know if anyone else has the same experience. But in a way, laughter is as bonding as sex. And it involves a similar kind of surrender of boundaries.
There have been people in my life who told jokes that were beautifully constructed and delivered, but they were cruel. My last husband had a favorite joke called “the bag joke” about a man who married a girl so ugly she had to wear a bag over her head when they had sex. He was a good actor and always delivered it perfectly, and always made me laugh. But I hated what the joke was about and felt queasy about it it. When I’d say that it was tasteless and not funny, he’d say, “Then why are you laughing?”
Thanks, justabouthealed!
I think you nailed it. It makes sense that my exP is riding on the coattails of his girlfriend. She’s respected in her field, and it’s a field of great attraction to him. I know it boosts his ego to be associated with her, to introduce her to his friends, to go to parties, to travel with her. She has written a number of beautiful scholarly coffee table-type books, and he has them prominently displayed in his living room (although he has no idea I figured out who she is. He says he just really likes [her area of expertise]).
I really wish I could figure out a way to get information to her, but in all likelihood, she wouldn’t really be able to “hear” it, and would tell him. Then my exP would dismiss anything I said as rantings of a crazy woman, someone he wasn’t interested in who’s been stalking him, etc. She’ll figure it out and when she does, it will change who she is. It did me.
But it does help me to realize that he’s not with her because of love, but because she gives him something, feeds his sick self in a way I couldn’t or wouldn’t.
Thanks!!!!