This is a big topic, and I fully intend to flesh it out in future posts. But allow me, here, to consider this question from the perspective of the work I do with couples. It is often surprisingly easy, from a couples therapy perspective, to weed out the narcissists from the non-narcissists; and more importantly, the salvageable from the unsalvageable narcissists.
Narcissists, as we know, will struggle to see things from their partners’ perspective. But let’s be clear: it is the reasons they struggle with this, not that they struggle with it, that signals their narcissism.
At the risk of oversimplifying, narcissists struggle to appreciate their partners’ perspective fundamentally because they are deeply self-centered; and their self-centeredness does not arise from a neuro-developmental disorder.
But why do narcissists struggle to see things from their partners’ perspective? Mainly, because to do so, in their experience, would concede the primacy—the overwhelming significance and importance—of their wants and needs.
For narcissistic personalities, the mere notion of others questioning the primacy of their experience is felt variously as insulting, outrageous, unacceptable, threatening and punishable.
In contrast, less narcissistic personalities are less threatened to consider their partners’ perspective, because they have a more equitable view of whose perspective matters. To be clear, for less narcissistic individuals, their perspective matters a lot, but their partners’ perspective also matters a lot.
But I want to be very clear: it’s not that less narcissistic personalities don’t take their own perspectives seriously, maybe even more seriously than their partners’; it’s just that they’re not inflexibly wedded to the idea that their experience—how they feel, how they think, what they want, what they need—is always, by definition, more important and valid than their partners’!
Believe it or not, this is a virtual litmus test for problem levels of narcissism. When I work with couples, I am interested to encourage, and then see, something very important. I’m interested to encourage, first of all, the idea that “validating” your partner’s experience is not the same as endorsing it, agreeing with it, or even, necessarily, fully understanding it.
And “validating” your partner’s experience certainly doesn’t obligate you to abandon your own, possibly very different perception of the situation.
And so I often discuss this model of validation with couples in some depth—especially, the idea that you can recognize your partner’s experience; be willing, interested and curious to appreciate, and better understand, your partner’s experience, from her perspective; and recognize the sanity and sense of your partner’s experience, again from her perspective, without any of this effort and interest requiring you to concede your own, and perhaps very different, experience of the situation.
As you can see, validating, in this model, is the process of recognizing your partner’s experience from her perspective. It is not a process, as noted, of necessarily agreeing with, or even fully understanding your partner; and most certainly—and I can’t stress this enough— it is not a contest of whose perceptions of any given situation are more accurate and right, versus less accurate and more wrong.
Many find this a liberating concept, as it can allow for a relaxation of a common and unhelpful defense: I can’t validate what you’re saying or feeling, because to do so would effectively invalidate my experience.
In other words, from the perspective I’m describing, it’s possible—indeed, with motivation and practice, surpisingly easy—to validate another’s experience without in the least invalidating your own. In fact, this is a model of validation that’s relatively easy to practice because it respects the integrity of one’s own perceptions and experiences.
Once the need for the above defense is removed—and I work hard with couples to remove it—the couple’s capacity to appreciate each others’ experiences of each other often improves significantly.
Partners discover that, because the integrity of their personal experience is preservable, they can actually listen to each others’ experiences with more interest, curiosity and less defensiveness.
In marriages in which some goodwill remains, partners who buy into the model of validation I’m describing often find themselves striving for even more—that is, more than merely endeavoring to listen to each other more effectively, they often find themselves striving to make their partner’s experiences less frustrating and more satisfying.
Conversely, where no goodwill remains in the relationship, everything I’m discussing becomes pretty much moot. Narcissist or not, the marriage, with no goodwill left, is almost certainly dead. It’s just awfully difficult to recover goodwill in a relationship when the “goodwill tank” begins in the therapist’s office with the arrow on empty.
In any case, what happens in my office is often very interesting. The highly narcissistic and, in extreme cases, sociopathic client, cannot do what I’m discussing. Specifically, he is unable, with sincerity and effectiveness, to apply the model of validation I’ve described.
I suggested above the reason for this: he is simply too deeply, inflexibly invested in the significance, if not superiority, of his experience to make enough room for genuine interest in his partners’ experience, even after he’s been introduced to, and given ample time to digest, the proposed model of validation.
That is, this model of validation still falls well short of his demands. Sure, it’s nice that his partner is making efforts to recognize and appreciate his experience from his perspective. He’ll certainly take that, but he wants more than that.
Not surprisingly, what’s necessary—that is, what he still insists on and continues to demand—is his partner’s total capitulation to his way of seeing things.
This is the essence of his narcissism or, if you prefer, his deep, immutable self-centeredness.
Will these individuals show their cards immediately? More often than not, yes. More often than not, whether in my office or outside it (between therapy sessions), they’ll demonstrate, sooner than later, their inability to apply the kind of mutual validation under discussion.
But what about the smooth manipulator? It’s true that a smooth operator, a sociopath, for instance, can fake this process for some time, if he perceives it’s in his selfish interest to do so. (By “fake it,” I mean that he may seem to grasp it, apply it, and be invested in it.)
Yet, in my experience, even the manipulative individual masquerading as sensivitely invested in this form of validating communication, will almost always, sooner than later, reveal chinks in his mask; almost always, sooner than later, he’ll lapse into the highly self-centered attitudes and behaviors of the classic narcissist—attitudes and behaviors characterized by high, rationalized levels of under-accountability and non-transparency.
And so, while the slick manipulator may “get over” for a while, it’s usually not for long. That is, while he may present, initially, as reasonable, flexible and motivated, sooner than later his disguise will fray, revealing his true agenda in the forms of his usual presumptions and entitlement to ongoing gratification.
And so who is the salvageable partner? Narcissist or not, I’d venture to suggest he’s the partner capable of understanding, and appreciating, the concept of validation I propose.
He will be highly motivated to apply it, which is to say, willing to work hard, consistently and sustainedly at applying it; and, of course, he must be capable of applying it.
But the nice thing is, if he’s willing to work hard at it, he’ll definitely succeed.
In which case he won’t be a narcissist or, at the very least, his narcissism will prove to have been less extreme, and less emotionally crippling, than we might have feared.
(This article, the first of several impending articles on this subject, is copyrighted © 2010 by Steve Becker, LCSW. My use of male gender pronouns in this article was purely for convenience’s sake. Females are also capable of the attitudes and behaviors discussed.)
Hey Style,
Long time no see. Sorry you had a bad day. Hope you’re feeling better.
(((hugs)))
Psyche
“I am sorry that I voiced an opinion. Steve is just wonderful, and right about everything and nothing he writes is anything but intelligent.” – this is the problem with my sorry A**. you see, Folks, I take things way too literally. So, while so many of you saw the Sub-meaning or De-meaning in that statement, I did not. I took it literally as I choose to take it all: mean what you say, say what you mean.
Steve, thank you for your view. If I can add but two cents to this conversation, please, hear me out. SO many of us (not all, and I do not intent to begin another discussion on whether this is a correct statement or not; I know others, including myself, are out there, who feel this way and are too afraid to admit to it as if it’d be admitting to our own insanity) are still emotionally connected to the Ps, the Ns and the Asses. We are so guilt ridden, wondering if we had given it our 100%, spewing anger at the un-humans but deep down craving the dichotomous surreal feeling of enmeshment we’ve experienced. Often, women will say: I don’t ever want to go back there. But, will sure miss the Sex (the flowers, the … etc)
When faced with a real and painful loss, we are now (having read your article) forced to think about our own contributions to this loss, and wonder if we indeed got to your office in time, just in time to salvage the relationship, stop ourselves from finding out the ugly truths, maybe, perhaps, we would not be so hurt.
Your article makes one think. And – it makes one wonder if there was still a chance… I have spent agonizing hours blaming myself for all the hurtful words I told him, all the cold looks I’d given him and all the ways I’d not been supportive. It is only now that I can partially admit to the fact that these were true and honest responses to someone who took down the mask and turned out to be Opposite than what he said he was. I blamed myself for “driving him” to cheat and lie and ultimately destroy my self – esteem. I was eager to admit my fault, my narcissistic, borderline, schizophrenic – you name it – qualities. Reading this article somehow fed that self – demeaning attitude, and raised my anxiety regarding my failed relationship.
Steve, I think the fact that your article brought about strong reactions only speaks to the fact that it’s thought provoking, honest and true.
Getting It — I was just like you, just believed everything as it was told to me, when my Spath/N ex was telling it to me. I used to take EVERYTHING so literally. I carried all the guilt that he didn’t want to carry himself. I was his perfect little punching bag. If he was upset about anything, guess who got beat up emotionally? Moi.
And I even beat myself up emotionally and psychologically *for* him. I was always willing to take on the blame for anything, and I believed I was guilty for things HE did. My parents taught me to be like that, they were both Ns.
I think if you’re a really honest person by nature, it does come as a COMPLETE SHOCK to find out that someone who seems so charming, so full of vitality and fun and coolness can be such a hideous lying dirt bag of a monster beneath the mask.
Anyway, sometimes to make myself feel better, like it wasn’t just me who got beaten in the game of ‘love’, (and to laugh at the hideousness of it all) I listen to this song:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luhnj7ZPWL4
Psyche
ErinBrock,
You are correct – a spath is not working WITH YOU on the relationship, building a life together, lacking goodwill altogether. A marriage becomes one-sided, only one person present. My h-spath is a sneaky, deceptive man who treated me just like he’s treated everyone else in his life’s path, at one time or another, doing things that were dishonest and/or underhanded. When I “woke up” (if you will) and realized (post-separation) that “he doesn’t want to do what’s right” (eg. he will keep lying, stealing, etc.), there is no way anyone can have a relationship with such a person, trust is out the window. He definitely doesn’t have my best interests at heart, ever. My h-spath is screwed up and doesn’t seem to realize it. I am a compassionate person who is still torn up over the mess of it all, our lives in disarray. I’m holding it together, but like anyone who has dealt with one of these folks, it’s baffling. I would like to put the whole mess down and “forget about it” (as the h-spath would say about complaints I had). What I find mystifying is that he will destroy his life, blow it up, taking his family members along with him, being clueless about cause-and-effect – that’s why you want to get out of the boat he’s in, getting to safety. If he keeps doing what he’s doing, you can forsee what’s up the road and it ain’t good.
This was a no-brainer for me.
“Is He a Narcissist?” Yes, he WAS (unbeknownst to me at the time).
“Is He Salvageable?” No. He was not (unbeknownst to me at the time).
In fact, I wish I could go back and UNDO the whole thing….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT_WICCqeGc
~Steve:
This is one of my favorite articles you have written.
I love it when you go a little farther, and get down to the “nitty gritty”.
I think the last time one of your articles caused this much “discussion” was “The Sociopath’s Pseudo Insightfulness & Sensitivity” article.
I think the 2 articles tie together nicely.
My H said that during one of our “fights of the century” when we went on a driving trip, if he had shown understanding for why I was upset at the time, it would have meant DEATH to him. DEATH>
That’s when Steve says, “I can’t validate what you’re saying or feeling, because to do so would effectively invalidate my experience.”
And I am thinking of his choice of words–how severe. Those moments when I’d try to tell him how his actions were so hurtful, and he’d show no empathy, were WORSE than the hurtful event/action/words themselves.
I relate to GettingIt’s experience that the loss hurts so much, the impulse is too search what else could I have done? Was I wrong.
I just go on day by day, afraid to admit to myself how devastated I feel, because I am afraid I’ll fall apart and won’t be able to put myself back together.
And to this day, after a 2 yr separation and divorce in the works, I STILL long for the security, the family, the “caring,” the good times that I think I cannot have without him.
Psyche,
Just listened to Undo It. Thanks for posting the link.
Great song.
I think it’s basic failure to learn that certain acts will cause certain reactions. So, they go from one of us to another, basically trying to find the ONE who would Understand that THEIR acts are Perfect and not to be questioned. I had changed so much when I was with him. At first, I gave a little – he wanted more. The more I gave, the more he wanted. Finally, I gave all of me. He had it MADE. But, this too was not adequate. Now I was simply Abandoning HIS needs to attend to such mediocre things like household payments, raising the kids, and putting food on the table. It is because of my such OBVIOUS neglect of his needs, that he spent his days sleeping around, drinking and pretending to be busy – with WHAT?
Yeap, Psyche, My Mom is a perfect example of a Histrionic Personality. And the man who contributed to my birth is a top Narcissist. but, none prepared me for the P.
http://www.energymeditationsecrets.com/core-energy-technique.html
GettingIt,
I don’t know if this helps – during one of my therapy sessions, my therapist said to me that the love of a sociopath is “an immature kind of love.” This is true. My h-spath is damaged (due to upbringing and genetics, in my opinion). Long before I met the h-spath, he was doing the same stuff then that he does now (eg. lying, stealing, etc.), acting out what is scripted in him. I have deluded myself at one time or another into thinking that he is like everyone else, capable of making our relationship work, changing for the better. It’s not true. My h-spath has shown me that he’s not interested in and/or capable of changing – I would try and steer him “on the right path” to no avail. You end up beating your head against a wall because something is missing in the h-spath’s wiring – you can’t get past the surface, going too deep – the messages don’t penetrate where they need to go, thus change is impossible. You realize it isn’t you, it’s his disordered brain that prevents him from being the person you wish he could be.