It can be pretty tricky navigating the continuum of narcissistically disturbed individuals, attempting to separate the salvageables from the unsalvageables. Yet, there are two awfully basic, interrelated questions that can help you cut to the chase, and guide your decision to keep going, or cut bait.
Here they are:
1) Is your partner someone who genuinely recognizes he has a problem respecting you?
2) If he genuinely recognizes this, then does he have the genuine motivation to confront his disrespectful behaviors and attitudes (be they chronic or episodic; devastating in their impact or more quietly, gradually corrosive of your goodwill)?
Ultimately, it comes down to these separate, yet related, questions.
If the answer to either of them proves no, or probably not, then it’s boogie on out of the relationship time. If the answer to both questions proves yes, or probably yes (and it must be “yes!” to both questions!), then you have a basis to hope for improvement in the quality of the relationship.
But wait a second! I hear the shrieks! “How do you evaluate how genuine someone is, especially a manipulative personality?”
Well, the truth is, it’s difficult to assess how “genuine” someone is, on any level, no less a really good manipulator. But you must still make this assessment in an ongoing fashion, and you must make it without certainty of its accuracy.
Now, we always need to be clear about this: Sometimes, when you are dealing with a sociopath tremendously skilled at dissimulation (as a great many sociopaths are), it may be impossible to bust him before he’s had the chance to wreak terrible, longstanding and long-lasting levels of destruction. God knows this is too often the case. Of course, Donna Anderson in her upcoming book will arm her readers with incredible tools to do precisely this—bust these harder-to-bust sociopathic types.
But in many cases, more than one thinks, partners can be flushed-out for lacking true recognition of their disrespectful behaviors and the true motivation to modify them.
Of course I can’t stress sufficiently that it’s not enough to flush these individuals out: once flushed out, you need to be willing to overcome defenses like denial and pathological hope to heed the red flags you’ve identified. (I’m going to write about what I call pathological hope in my next article. I see it as a defense mechanism that can be almost as self-destructive as the sociopath can be destructive.)
So what are we really looking for here? What do we really need to see? Yes, we are looking for recognition, but most of all we are looking for change. Recognition without change is ultimately useless, a big tease.
And we are looking not for signs of small, itty bitty changes, but real, durable, meaningful, yes big changes. If the changes are too subtle, too slow in coming, too contingent on things like his “moods,” or the alignment of the stars, or if they’re subject to “relapses” of any sort (and especially rationalized relapses), then”¦bzzzzzz”¦.it’s time to send him back to the dugout, permanently, to sit his a** on the bench with his fellow underperformers.
Why do I emphasize big changes and downplay small, subtle changes?
Because we are talking about a big problem, and big problems, on which the quality, integrity and perhaps even safety of your life literally depend, demand big changes. The evidence of the commitment to these changes needs to be absolutely unmistakable; but again I repeat: the key thing is less the evidence of such recognition than the evidence of the changes!
Let me give a small, somewhat tangential but, at least, one specific example of what I’m saying. Let’s say you’ve been feeling disrespected by your partner and for you this is a very serious problem. You’ve been feeling variously misunderstood, blown off, violated, neglected, abused, mistrustful; feeling, let’s say, relegated to a hurtfully low priority in your partner’s world.
In a word, you aren’t feeling respected, and this has become, for you, a serious problem that you share with him. You request that he join you for couples counseling to address your, and perhaps his, concerns?
His answer is “no.”
Well, the answer, “No,” to your request for his participation in couples therapy, is a “You just struck out, pal” answer. That’s a damning, indictable answer. “No” is a virtual affirmation of what you’ve shared with him you’ve been experiencing—his disregard of you and the relationship.
“No” is an utterly lame answer, especially if you’ve requested his participation in couples counseling in a non-belligerent, sincere, and utterly serious fashion.
“No” is tantamount to declaring officially, “I am uninvested in this relationship.”
It may come in countless forms, among them:
“You’re unhappy, that’s your problem.”
“Go get help yourself.”
“I don’t need help. You’re the one with the complaints.”
“Nothing makes you happy. You are insatiable.”
“It’s pointless”¦seriously, get your own sh*t together first and then let’s talk.”
These, and countless similar responses, which blame you and exculpate him, while simultaneously affirming his perspective of the relationship not as a unity or partnership but more as a “sole proprietorship—¦these kinds of responses tell you all you need to know.
But now let’s say he says “yes,” and joins you in couples therapy. That’s nice. If he’s a sociopath, as I’ve written previously, you will hope the therapist will be shrewd enough to know that he, the therapist, is dealing with a sociopath. Because sociopaths do not belong in couples therapy. But for purposes of this argument, let’s imagine he’s not a full-blown sociopath.
In any case, as I’ve been suggesting, it is the evidence, ultimately, that will tell the tale.
He will either change meaningfully and permanently, and begin making these changes in earnest, very soon; or, he won’t.
He may or may not talk the talk effectively, persuasively. But if he doesn’t walk the walk and maintain the walk, you will have gotten your answer.
Walking the walk doesn’t mean it’s necessarily onesided; you too may have changes to make on your end. Nobody’s perfect, and even if you’re involved with a salvageable jerk (the best case scenario and hope), that doesn’t mean you too don’t have room to make some changes.
But let’s not kid ourselves, or let him kid us. If he isn’t motivated to leave you feeling more fulfilled, loved, respected and less neglected; if there isn’t evidence of his sincere desire to do this, and evidence of his willingness to work hard at doing this, and finally, evidence of his success at doing this, well then again”¦.we have our answers.
And let me repeat this point: the changes need to be sustained. Transitory changes made from desperation are more likely to revert as complacency creeps backs in. The regression, as complacency reenters the picture, will tell you something very important, namely that the changes weren’t made from a deep, or deeply honest enough, place.
The interesting thing, here, isn’t that any of this is a news flash or rocket science, because to the contrary I’m aware how almost insultingly obvious it is. The really key thing to beware of is the pervasiveness with which we’re inclined to put, or keep, the emotional blinders on in such a fashion that we either fail to proactively seek this evidence of a parnter’s commitment to change or else, seeking and discovering the partner’s lack of commitment, we find ways to minimize and ignore the urgency of the evidence’s meaning and message!
I will write about pathological hope as a defense mechanism next week.
(This article is copyrighted © 2011 by Steve Becker, LCSW. My use of male gender pronouns is for convenience’s sake and not to suggest that females aren’t capable of the attitudes and behaviors discussed.)
Next time I see her I will
Liz have you seen the video that circulates about the guy giving the elephant an enema? LOL ROTFLMAO!!!!! Toooo funny. I wish I could find the link, but I think I lost it somewhere among the 10,000 e mail funnies I have saved! LOL (CRS)
I bet if you asked the nurse she might let you start volunteering with her, most of those orgs are glad to have people help out and it could get your foot in the door. Start out shoveling elephant poop and work your way up to trimming toe nails.
Good luck with your new job.
Thanks Oxy.
What a timely article – THANK you, very much for posting this!!!!
It seems that my spouse is demonstrating “sincere” efforts. He had begun individual counseling – this is HIS problem, not mine. And, he’s beginning to take stock of his own behavioral choices. If he is, indeed, just an asshole and not a sociopath, his progress will be life-altering. His changes, if he chooses to make them, will require some serious effort and brutal honesty. He is speaking in terms of what his actions have wrought, and this is an important step. He has said that he’s beginning to process how far-reaching his personal issues go, and this is a positive step, I think. Not just the sexual addiction, but his overall attitude towards human interactions – he recognized that porn provided a platform that didn’t involve emotional attachments.
Having said this, I am still intensely reviewing all of my options as if I’m intending to move forward with a divorce. My trust is no longer in his keeping, and this is a difficult (and, maddening) position for me to be in. I am still full of fury and “mean,” but it’s simmering down to a managable level. One of the things that is helping me to manage these feelings is keeping myself very busy in the studio. Redirecting my focus on something other than my desire to inflict the damage back is a lifesaver, and I cannot describe how important it is for all of us who have been damaged to consider. By doing something else that requires my attention, I’m slowly taking back my Self – my own soul.
I know that there are sociopaths out there and I’ve had my share of experiences with all different types. I can’t say that my spouse is, indeed, a sociopath – narcissistic? Absolutely. Only time will tell whether or not he’s actually interested in changing himself or just going through the proverbial motions to avoid a legal battle.
In the meantime, I’m watching, reading, and still planning his expulsion from my life. I have to sort many, many things out for myself, first, and he is going to have to hoe this row on his own – his issues are not MY issues, and I’m not going to accept responsibility for any of them, nor will I “own” them.
What is true now is that I am not the same person that I was a month ago. I’m wary, suspicious, and very, very distant from everyone. This includes the people at the studio where I once felt “safe.” I am setting up some boundaries that I really have to maintain for everyone – forever. I’ve never been someone that could be described as “aloof,” but I’m ready and willing to morph into that, now.
THANKS TO EVERYONE for the strong support and encouragement!
Dear Truthspeak,
I hear you, sister! The things that some people do, even IF they are sincerely sorry later and own that behavior, leave consequences that DESTROY any trust that we could have for them, and without trust, there is no relationship. PERIOD. Can’t be an intimate relationship without trust.
In the raw state of your emotions with the betrayal fresh, it is normal to “pull back” from everyone or anyone who “steps on” your nerves or pushes your buttons, or who doesn’t respect your reasonable boundaries. This is normal, and this will change over time, but right now “aloof” is protective.
I suggest that you do not let him know what your plans are, just play your cards close to your chest until the time to ACT when you have all your ducks in a row. You are right, you are NOT responsible for HIS issues. God bless.
Thanks, OxD,
I’m playing the whole thing close to the vest. The main reason for this is because I need to see how these cards are falling before I take any serious action. That doesn’t mean, by any stretch of the imagination, that I’m taking the spouse’s “word” on his personal counseling, etc. – this is a silent war, here, and I’m still sorting it out.
I think that all of my experiences up to this most recent event have prepared me to be as cold and callous as necessary. In times past, I would never have described myself as someone who is inscrutable. I’ve always (without fail) put my feelings right on out there, but they were feelings without emphasis, if that makes any sense. I “felt” things, but I didn’t do anything ABOUT them, either to sort it all out, or to prevent it from happening, again.
The example of New Face is one that had me on guard, even though I didn’t maintain my boundaries with her. So, if she caused damage for me, it’s because I gave her all of the tools to do so! Shame on HER for her manipulations, but shame on ME for giving her everything that she needed to manipulate.
I finally WANT to be inscrutable. I DON’T want anyone to be able to “read” who I am. I still “feel” for other people around me, but I’m not going to take on their issues as my own, anymore. I’m only responsible for me: my own choices, my own actions, and my own behaviors. And, playing these cards close to the vest was what I should have been doing my entire life.
Ugly lesson? You bet! But, isn’t it the burned hand that remembers not to touch a hot oven? This is the only way that I learn, I guess! LMAO!!! I can read, read, and read some more, but I cannot put into practice that which I have not personally experienced.
And, for PK: YES, it is absolutely “normal” to feel a desire for revenge! I have the strong IMPULSE to see that New Face is fired. I have the strong IMPULSE to kick my spouse out and drag him through the mud by telling everyone in our County about HIS issues. We want to “out” the spath or get even, somehow. The best “revenge” is, as was mentioned, going NC and living a content, productive life. This may sound unbelievable, but the further away from the spath that I take myself, the more damage the spath will experience. One day, I actually move through the entire 24 hours without giving the spath a passing thought! This does happen, but it just takes time.
BLESSINGS!!!!
MATT
So nice to see you posting again. Glad to know all is moving forward for you – be well … HUGS !!!
When you get to the point where you ask yourself and then ask others if this is a good situation? It is NOT!
I am fixed on the narcissist personality tonight. Here is a video I saw on You tube of Charles Manson
Don’t know if this site will activate a link?
Nope! It shaved it off the post…. well?
I am so thankful to have found this site. For years I have been totally obsessed with sp and his lies. I have caught him out and he has lied some more and never shown any remorse. Thoughts of him have taken over my life and tortured me. I have obviously been trying to recreate the ‘luring’ phase of our relationship. I realise now this will never happen. Only now reading the many posts and archives do i at last realise its not me!!
I am dealing with a very sick person who will feel he owns me and thinks that I have to deal with whatever he does. I feel i now understand and am going to have to think very carefully about getting him to de value me so I can move on without any high drama. Grey rocking here we come!!