The following unfolded after she witnessed the first “slip of the mask.” She questioned what had just happened, since at the time, she did not understand. However, she quickly learned that she was not allowed to have thoughts or ask questions. Doing so constituted “interrogation” or the “the third degree.” He became angrier and angrier, blaming her for the mood shifts she observed.
Confused, she noted that they had not seen or spoken to each other in days and asked what she did to cause such upset. The exchange was out of control, and like nothing she had ever seen before. Things were wrong and she wanted out. She pulled her luggage from the apartment’s outside storage closet, with the intent to backtrack the 1500 miles she had just moved to be with him. What came next is uncommon, unless, of course, we are dealing with disorder.
The cold reality in disguise
The angry words took a pitiful turn. In a sad tone, he advised, “You should leave now. If you don’t, I will ruin your life.” Although now years in the past, she remembers the words as if they were spoken yesterday.
Why don’t we heed their warnings? Although psychopaths or individuals with a number of psychopathic features utter few truths, when they do, we often fail to hear what is really being said. They frequently tell us of their intentions, but in ways we just don’t understand.
He went on to tell her that her life with him would be miserable. He cried as he told her that things would never be as she wanted, and as long as they were involved, she would have nothing. He told her that there was no predicting just how bad it could get. He then professed his love for her, and told her that he didn’t want to hurt her in the ways he suspected he might. He told her to go and never think of him again. She should find a “nice guy.”
Confused, she suggested they work on making their lives together great. She asked how he could know that things would not ever be good. No explanation. He simply responded by saying that he was sorry for dragging her into “such a mess.” Then, as abruptly as the “crying” began, it stopped. Looking into her eyes, he coldly told her “this” was not something he could control, but rather, something that would just “happen.” Now, seeming happier, he smirked, and said, “…but I would like it if you’d stay.”
Of course he would like it. And of course she stayed. She ignored the instincts responsible for her churning gut, which were telling her to run and never look back.
What she heard
Although she had trouble rectifying the conflicts between the words and actions, she heard a “wounded” person speaking. She heard the words of a person who didn’t believe in himself or the potential of the universe. She heard the words of someone kind and gentle, who had been beaten by life. In spite of several years of work, he was making very little money and having trouble breaking into his industry.
He had a “depressed” ex wife, who ran up thousands of dollars of credit card debt in his name and became pregnant in an effort to either trap him or “save” the relationship. He couldn’t be sure which.
She heard that he was sad and did not feel worthy of real love or the good that real love could bring. He could not seem to find it anyway. She heard guilt for involving her, the love he knew was real, since he worried about his future lack of success possibly bringing her down with him.
She heard wrong.
What she thought
She thought that with a little hard work and a lot of love, everything would be fine. But she did not realize that the conversation she thought was happening, was not happening at all. Had she known then what she knows now, she would have understood things – heard the words and thought the thoughts – very differently.
What he meant
In the exchange described above, he was telling her about himself. He was letting her know that he was not the kind or gentle person she initially thought. His actions and behaviors were not influenced by the stresses of emotional burden, as his words suggested. Nothing he did indicated true sadness either. He was strangely content.
He did not seem bothered by the fact that he could not provide. In fact, he seemed un-phased. So much so, that rectifying the finances became her burden. When she questioned this, he alternated between asserting that it was all just too much for him to handle and that he was used to “having nothing,” so it didn’t bother him. However, she noticed he made sure his wants and needs were met, even if those around him suffered. She began to suspect that the credit concerns were not created by an ex or anyone other than himself. The future would eventually become history and prove her correct.
He also knew what his previous relationships had been like. Although the specifics varied from person to person, with the individual actions and personalities playing roles in how things ultimately unfolded, none were successful. Some lost more and were treated worse than others, which may be why he was unable to predict how bad it could get.
He mentioned love and caring
When they speak of love, it is often nothing more than a means to manipulate. However, there may be some they actually do care about. But they do so very differently from the rest of us and it is always self serving and potentially dangerous. What they feel is superficial and may whimsically change.
While they tend not to be terribly insightful, they do have some level of awareness of what is occurring. While they generally don’t see themselves as wrong, if and when they do, they simply don’t care. They may have fleeting notions that the results of their actions may harm others. Yet, they carry on unconcerned.
So, his warning may have been sincere, but he did not want to lose his plaything badly enough to really save her. He enticed her to stay.
Why do they really tell?
If he did not truly want her to go, why did he divulge the truth? These pitiful tender moments may simply be part of the process, further drawing us closer or more committed. They may also be fishing expeditions to test our reactions and the measure the potential “supply” they can extract from us. It is also quite possible that they are just plain fun. Are they teasing us? I suspect it may be a rush for them to know that they are, more or less, detailing our demise, while we remain completely clueless, and feeling sorry for them in the process.
That’s powerful.
Familiar?
I don’t think this story is uncommon. While we cannot blame ourselves for our inexperience in the past, we can learn to listen differently in the future. This extends to all types of disordered interactions as well. Who, in their right mind, would have taken the exchange detailed above to mean anything more than it appeared? Few. Those with personality disorders rely on this, regardless of who we are to them.
Who would suspect anyone of discussing demise and love or friendship concurrently? It happens. When it does, it is a recipe for confusion and disaster. So, let’s practice listening. We cannot change them, but we can change ourselves. With that, we can overcome.
The same thing happened to me when I was about to move cross country to be with him, in his city. He told me “There’s no predicting just how bad things could get. I’m warning you.” He also told me early on that he was an a-hole. Do these people have a book of lines that they all read from? For being so intriguing, they’re not terribly original.
I would have done the same thing the woman in this story did. There had been so much love bombing. But he also told me, in that same conversation, that he was a drug addict and that I would “stalk and chase him with a butcher knife.” A little too much for me. I thought, ‘Obviously, this dude doesn’t want me in his life, even if he’s not crazy.” At the same time, he told me to wait for him until he “returned to his old cool self” (he had at least six selves;). I bolted for the third time, but I tried to reconcile multiple times because there was that much emotional intimacy (or so it seemed of course). Emotional and sentimental people have a hard time cutting off their feelings and not dipping into nostalgia–of course memories are a lie half the time and even then there was probably a thread of fear underlying the emotions we all felt, we just numbed it out.
One thing I did learn from all of this is that love is not pity, and when pity starts creeping into love, I know it’s time to bolt. Compassion, yes, empathy, yes, but not pity.
This story I can kind of relate with. I love my husband and I believe he loves me. But before we got married, and things were finally getting more serious, I felt he was distance with me. Which hurt me because when someone you love starts being distant, you feel they are probably wanting to end the relationship. But I had met his kids and things were going great. He finally admitted and even said to me, “I’m so in love with you, I can’t let you get tangled in the mess I am in”. He had told me many times how evil (well he used the word crazy) his ex wife was. But this time he told me, if you stay with me she will destroy your life and never stop trying to destroy our marriage. At this time I was kind of in disbelief of what he was saying because I have heard so many me say “my ex wife is crazy” and personally it annoyed me. Because why so they all say that. (Even if they woman isn’t crazy). I Am all about empowering women so when a man says his ex is crazy I usually think “stupid typical man”. But he was not just saying it like a stupid typical man. HIS EX WIFE REALLY IS CRAZY. He just didnt know she was sociopathic. He said she was bi polar.
Maybe I should of listened to him. Because since being with him 5 years and married almost 4. My life has been stressful and I have never experienced chaos, craziness, and seen the unthinkable been a target of this woman has caused me so much stress. I wouldn’t say she has destroyed my life. I can say she has made it hard majority of the time. But I have learned from doing research and educating myself that I was not dealing with a bi polar person but I was dealing with someone who had no remorse for the pain she caused her own mother and father and sister, I saw the way she only used the children to make my husband feel guilty, and how she came across to everyone that did not ” really ” know her as this kind, caring loving mother And good person. But her actions spoke loudly, I saw her taking credit for the things I would do for the children, like she never bought her son shoes, he always had torn up shoes. And considering my husband pays $3500 a month to her in child support, there was no excuse. So I felt bad for him, bought him new shoes that seemed to make her angry.. Why? I don’t know but she told her mother, she just bought him new shoes and had no money and needed $100. When I BOUGHT THE SHOES! I know buying shoes is a silly thing to argue about. But it wasnt to me, considering she was telling anyone who would listen how I treated her children as if I didnt want them there, and I was evil step mom. When I was always accepting of the kids and care for them. Yes I keep my distance NOW, after almost 5 years of being bad mouthed to the kids, I realized I had to distance myself just recently because everything is so unstable with the relationship I have with them.
I still to this day tho, treat them good, care for them and make sure they are ok. I have just had to step back and let my husband do the things I was doing for them because the more I did the more I was bullied by ex wife. And I realized my husband seemed to be relieved I was having to deal with her cruelness and he was no longer the target of her mean and spiteful acts. It was best for me to let him deal with her. Since distancing myself from the situation tho, he refuses to talk to her. Kids both have phones, as they are getting old 12 and 14 (both have birthdays coming up so (13 and 15 years old ). My husband is strong believer on the no contact rule. I think it’s ok since they are older. And the 14 year old is more responsible and mature than her mother. Communicating with the ex wife, my husband said is useless and pointless. Because when he tries she just seems to go ballistic, like I think she thinks “he is talking me again, this is my chance I get back my control over him”. Because he will text her a good time to get the kids and she doesn’t respond back with a simple time, she responds with a novel long text about all her problems and how she needs this and that, and how he is a lousy dad, but she says everything but answer the question he ask. After so much of this, he realized if he text his daughter, “what time do I need to come get you guys”. The 14 year old gives a time and has her stuff ready and her brothers and is ready to go when we pick up from usually a friends or family members house. It make his ex wife SO ANGRY that he texted his daughter and not her, saying “you do not need to go thru the children to make plans and blah blah Etc…” But he has tried to co parent with her, it has never worked. She refuses to answer a simple question until he agrees to do what she wants, and he is not going to do that anymore.
Ok I realize I am rambling a little. My initial point of responding to this was the post caught my attention of how the abuser said “if you don’t leave, I will destroy you”. My husband is not an abuser, but he warned me that he felt if I stayed his ex would do anything she could to destroy my life. And she has tried but I would say she has not. She has spread horrible disgusting rumors about me to anyone from my child’s school teacher, to my husbands co workers, to our friends and all over the Internet. It use to bother and upset me. I just have to remember anyone who believes her lies does NOT matter and the people who matter don’t believe her and don’t mind.
This post triggered a memory of the “warning” my spath gave me when he said in a hard to describe but almost angry tone when we were discussing agreeing to a committed relationship with one another. The warning was something to the effect of “is this what YOU really want?”….and of course once I said yes, the tone changed completely because he knew he had me and in his twisted mind, he probably thought he had given me sufficient warning. If only I had understood what he REALLY meant!
One day my brother’s ex-wife invited our family to their house for his birthday celebration. I had left high school far, far behind me. If reminded of it I became sick. Well, my brother’s neighbor at the time was a woman from my high school class. She cornered me and mentioned a sociopath (female) that I hung around with since 4th grade and who ‘led me down the garden path’. In a typical “blame the victim” fashion this woman brought up the spath. It was accusatory. She knew someone who had observed my student teaching experience (and my spath had found a way to ‘best’ me by pursuing education and running a foreign exchange program…Japan). This spath found out I had gone into education and was a student teacher in the town where we had all lived and graduated from high school. SO…
This neighbor woman who cornered me knew the ‘someone’ who had observed my student teaching … and also knew the spath. So this ‘neighbor woman…’ her name is Susan…implied, without right-out saying it, that the spath was doing really, really well and had an exchange program. Then she asked me what I did (obviously a comparison question). I just said that I was happy and moved around a lot. Then she implied that I was a great friend of the spath…so the obvious gap in the conversation was, “So why don’t you hang with her now?” With the obvious conclusion: you must be threatened and jealous of her.
The spath had ‘followed’ me again…stealing my identity and going far past my accomplishments. The stupid thing about it is that I had no clue what the spath had done with her life and did not care. I pursued education at the time because that is what I wanted to do. So who was Susan to subtly accuse me? I should have asked her if she still hung around with the same friend she had in high school from 30 years ago…and if not, why?
I cannot believe that the spath, who used to live in Japan, still kept tabs on me and stole the show from me…in a big way. I had even forgotten about her. And I did not want “a big show”…just a job in education.
Of course, Susan was/is ignorant of what had actually occurred but the spath did not fool everybody. In fact, the spath grew up three houses down from a great friend of mine (Betty). Betty invited me to northern Maine to visit her relatives and she and I talked about the spath. She understood what had happened to me and even said, “I just thought you were great friends…I wanted you to get away from her and she used you horribly. That last year of high school was the worst year of your life.”
wow. Linda, that is the most detailed and accurate and deeply perceptive description of the source of “cognitive dissonance” i have ever read.
One of the things Oprah used to say on her show is: When people tell you who they are, BELIEVE them. I wish I would have listened.
I’m a Gay Male, and the exact thing happened to me.
Early on he said to me “I don’t think you can handle me…” and a Big red Flag went up in my head. I started Paying Attention to what was going on and not what was being said.
Couple weeks later he did something that really hurt me and another Red flag went up. A few weeks later another Red Flag went up. But I was smart. I Ran. He woke up one morning and I was gone. Lock, Stock, and Barrel. Three Red Flags and you’re OUT!
And Yes it Hurt me more than it would ever hurt him.
It’s the only way to deal with Spath’s, or is that not to deal with them?
Cheers,
BuBu
Run, BuBu, run! Thank you for sharing that we can all run early and fast.
….if we know what red flags are, and are in good enough shape emotionally and mentally to take self protecting measures when we recognise those red flags then, yes, it is possible to minimise future involvement with the dangerously disordered. But for many if not most here, it may be a life’s work in progress to stay safe. These people can present as functional and ” normal” to such an extent that even seasoned psychiatric professionals can be fooled. And sadly, it takes time to evaluate whether someone is seriously personality disordered. And the more time we spend around them, the greater the chance of their manipulations taking effect on us. The best any of us can do is remain cautious and watchful when forming new relationships, and to know our own vulnerabilities. Because those vulnerabilities will be clear as day to a sociopath who Will play them for what they can get. Knowing our weak spots and recognizing that we are capable of being fooled is an important step in minimising the risk of it happening.
Amen, Tea Light. That is absolutely correct!
I am in shock right now and had to come here to post to my new friends. As some may know, the spath was brought home from the hospital two days ago. He has been bugging me yesterday and today about picking up library books he had ordered. He had plenty left from last time when I told him to put a hold on his books until he had two left because I wasn’t going to the library every three days.
This morning, I had a nightmare and he had called me telling me about something and sounding like he had no agenda…even though I know he always does. We all know that voice on the machine that is “just calling” for a small reason and sounds so very normal. I called him back, told him all about my nightmare (which he hates) and then told him I had to go. He didn’t get a word in. A few hours later, he called me and asked me if I could please go get his books at the library. I told him I would today, but I was only going to the library every four to six weeks, so he if he needed to put a hold on. I knew I was not going to go again for a month no matter what he did this time. It IS, after all, part of my “paycheck” so to speak.
I went to pick up his books and there was a red book I noticed. Usually, I just throw them in his bag and take them to him. The red book was called “The Wisdom of Psychopaths: What Saints, Spies, and Serial Killers Can Teach Us About Success.” Yes. Unless I am misunderstanding this book, there is a handbook to make them believe they are superior! I kept it. I am now reading it.
So far, the author states that his father was a psychopath who ripped off everyone he could. Now, he is talking about serial killers and interviewing psychologists who study them. He interviewed Robert Hare of the famous Psycho Hare scale. Hare is telling him about research he did that proved that psychopaths can tell who will be the best “target” by watching us WALK! The gait of our walk lets a psychopath know we would be an easy victim to target! I am only a few pages in. I decided if he was going to order a handbook, I am reading it first. He may not get it as long as he can’t get to a library himself. I am beginning to hope that is never. I am beginning to see that doing his grocery shopping with him on a walker is far better than having him walking to the library or buying his own things.
I doubt he will ever see the book unless the author discusses a lot more about how hideous he is than what a SUCCESS he is. The man lives in 350 sq ft I own and pays my entire mortgage for rent. He lost his nursing license by drinking and stealing drugs on the job. He is the very definition of a loser who had everything handed to him if he didn’t take it first!
I will let you know any other “tidbits” about how easily these sub-humans can know who and how to pick us out. And then I will probably return the book without his ever reading it. I put the sticker off the book in his book bag before I put it on his dresser. He will know I have it and when he asks about it, I feel like saying, “I wanted to read the book because it talks about old men on walkers living in a garage who have no one but me to make sure they get food. It was very helpful!” What would you do?
Thanks.