The following unfolded after she witnessed the first “slip of the mask.” She questioned what had just happened, since at the time, she did not understand. However, she quickly learned that she was not allowed to have thoughts or ask questions. Doing so constituted “interrogation” or the “the third degree.” He became angrier and angrier, blaming her for the mood shifts she observed.
Confused, she noted that they had not seen or spoken to each other in days and asked what she did to cause such upset. The exchange was out of control, and like nothing she had ever seen before. Things were wrong and she wanted out. She pulled her luggage from the apartment’s outside storage closet, with the intent to backtrack the 1500 miles she had just moved to be with him. What came next is uncommon, unless, of course, we are dealing with disorder.
The cold reality in disguise
The angry words took a pitiful turn. In a sad tone, he advised, “You should leave now. If you don’t, I will ruin your life.” Although now years in the past, she remembers the words as if they were spoken yesterday.
Why don’t we heed their warnings? Although psychopaths or individuals with a number of psychopathic features utter few truths, when they do, we often fail to hear what is really being said. They frequently tell us of their intentions, but in ways we just don’t understand.
He went on to tell her that her life with him would be miserable. He cried as he told her that things would never be as she wanted, and as long as they were involved, she would have nothing. He told her that there was no predicting just how bad it could get. He then professed his love for her, and told her that he didn’t want to hurt her in the ways he suspected he might. He told her to go and never think of him again. She should find a “nice guy.”
Confused, she suggested they work on making their lives together great. She asked how he could know that things would not ever be good. No explanation. He simply responded by saying that he was sorry for dragging her into “such a mess.” Then, as abruptly as the “crying” began, it stopped. Looking into her eyes, he coldly told her “this” was not something he could control, but rather, something that would just “happen.” Now, seeming happier, he smirked, and said, “…but I would like it if you’d stay.”
Of course he would like it. And of course she stayed. She ignored the instincts responsible for her churning gut, which were telling her to run and never look back.
What she heard
Although she had trouble rectifying the conflicts between the words and actions, she heard a “wounded” person speaking. She heard the words of a person who didn’t believe in himself or the potential of the universe. She heard the words of someone kind and gentle, who had been beaten by life. In spite of several years of work, he was making very little money and having trouble breaking into his industry.
He had a “depressed” ex wife, who ran up thousands of dollars of credit card debt in his name and became pregnant in an effort to either trap him or “save” the relationship. He couldn’t be sure which.
She heard that he was sad and did not feel worthy of real love or the good that real love could bring. He could not seem to find it anyway. She heard guilt for involving her, the love he knew was real, since he worried about his future lack of success possibly bringing her down with him.
She heard wrong.
What she thought
She thought that with a little hard work and a lot of love, everything would be fine. But she did not realize that the conversation she thought was happening, was not happening at all. Had she known then what she knows now, she would have understood things – heard the words and thought the thoughts – very differently.
What he meant
In the exchange described above, he was telling her about himself. He was letting her know that he was not the kind or gentle person she initially thought. His actions and behaviors were not influenced by the stresses of emotional burden, as his words suggested. Nothing he did indicated true sadness either. He was strangely content.
He did not seem bothered by the fact that he could not provide. In fact, he seemed un-phased. So much so, that rectifying the finances became her burden. When she questioned this, he alternated between asserting that it was all just too much for him to handle and that he was used to “having nothing,” so it didn’t bother him. However, she noticed he made sure his wants and needs were met, even if those around him suffered. She began to suspect that the credit concerns were not created by an ex or anyone other than himself. The future would eventually become history and prove her correct.
He also knew what his previous relationships had been like. Although the specifics varied from person to person, with the individual actions and personalities playing roles in how things ultimately unfolded, none were successful. Some lost more and were treated worse than others, which may be why he was unable to predict how bad it could get.
He mentioned love and caring
When they speak of love, it is often nothing more than a means to manipulate. However, there may be some they actually do care about. But they do so very differently from the rest of us and it is always self serving and potentially dangerous. What they feel is superficial and may whimsically change.
While they tend not to be terribly insightful, they do have some level of awareness of what is occurring. While they generally don’t see themselves as wrong, if and when they do, they simply don’t care. They may have fleeting notions that the results of their actions may harm others. Yet, they carry on unconcerned.
So, his warning may have been sincere, but he did not want to lose his plaything badly enough to really save her. He enticed her to stay.
Why do they really tell?
If he did not truly want her to go, why did he divulge the truth? These pitiful tender moments may simply be part of the process, further drawing us closer or more committed. They may also be fishing expeditions to test our reactions and the measure the potential “supply” they can extract from us. It is also quite possible that they are just plain fun. Are they teasing us? I suspect it may be a rush for them to know that they are, more or less, detailing our demise, while we remain completely clueless, and feeling sorry for them in the process.
That’s powerful.
Familiar?
I don’t think this story is uncommon. While we cannot blame ourselves for our inexperience in the past, we can learn to listen differently in the future. This extends to all types of disordered interactions as well. Who, in their right mind, would have taken the exchange detailed above to mean anything more than it appeared? Few. Those with personality disorders rely on this, regardless of who we are to them.
Who would suspect anyone of discussing demise and love or friendship concurrently? It happens. When it does, it is a recipe for confusion and disaster. So, let’s practice listening. We cannot change them, but we can change ourselves. With that, we can overcome.
fight,
Oh my! To think that our body language can make us targets! I’m looking forward to you sharing all the tidbits you get out of that book!
If He asks you about the book,you don’t want to say anything that will make him mad!After all,you don’t need the stress;the headache!
However,you could just tell him that the book aroused your curiosity,and since it would take time for him to read the other books,you wanted to read this one while he’s reading the others.
Anyway,that’s what I would do.
Fightsie, this is pretty alarming, did The Lodger seem at all embarassed that you know he loaned a book on this subject? Did he volunteer an explaination? It does seem like a ‘tell’ given what you’ve told us about him he sounds highly sociopathic and they do often make clear they are such as we saw in Linda’s article this week. I know he’s mobility impaired but it does worry me. I’d ask him straight up why he wanted to read that book, and say well I’,m uncomfortable with you reading it or other books on psychopathy so I won’t bring them to you.
Tea,
Good points! Many of us had no idea what a sociopath is or the LIE that was our life~~~or the harm caused mentally,emotionally,and sometimes physically! By the time we came to our senses,we had a REAL FIGHT on our hands,BREAKING FREE FROM THE SPELL,and finding a new life and finding ourselves again!
Hi Blossom and Lightsie: Thank you for the support. I dove right into the book. It is interesting, but I’m not sure if the author is for, or against, sociopaths so far. He admits that his father was one so there would be more of chance that he is also one. The author is from the UK and he does discuss a lot of research.
So far, one thing I found interesting because it pertains to our discussions about sociopaths being DEVOLVED, but telling us they are evolved. He said that studies show that Sociopaths do not blink as often as normal people! He said they seem to use their “lizard brain” (amygdala) more than normal people. He also said that their ability to go without blinking for long periods of time would be why people talk about how long they will stare at others. I would say this would include those longing stares in the beginning and piercing stares of hatred a few weeks later. He indicated that since reptiles do not need to blink as much as humans, THAT could even be why they don’t blink as often.
I don’t like the title of the book at all because spaths are all losers in the human domain and I don’t like them thinking they can find a book that calls their spath lizard brains a “success.”
The spath called me about an hour after I dropped off his book bag and said that a book was missing, but it was listed as “checked out” on the receipt. I said, “Oh! I forgot to tell you. I thought it looked interesting and I’m reading it.” He said, “Oh, yeah. Feel free to borrow any book I check out. I have plenty here to read.” I said, “OK.” That was it. I have one eye that has a lot of problems because of lasik surgery gone wrong so he knows it takes me a long time to read a book. I have to read one day and then rest my eyes for a couple of days. He also knows I am reading another book that is 900 pages long. So, I plan to keep it six weeks which is as long as he can keep it without paying fines.
So far, it’s not a handbook of any sort. It’s just information an some research stats. I will let you know if I believe it is worth victims reading when I finish it….oh about 10 weeks from now! LOL.
I calmed down and read about 65 pages. The author seems to be trying to attract sociopaths AND their victims….larger market. I would only get it from the library. I don’t want to encourage him to write another tome about how successful spaths are! Their misplaced grandiosity will just take it and run wherever they want with it.
The Lodger brought up the book in an “off the cuff” way later saying “I thought you left it there.” Hmmmm. Why would he think that? I said, “No. I figured if you were going to get a handbook to make you think you’re a successful psychopath, I needed to read it first. You’re all the same and I know more about you than you’ll ever know about me.” He said, “Sociopaths don’t need handbooks.” !!!!!! I said, “Well, then you shouldn’t be worried about it.” He then acted like there was no conversation about it and changed the subject. I laughed inside. I know him. I doubt he will even want to read the book now!
I have read a little more of the book and I am going to try to stop calling him “foster monkey” even though it makes me laugh. Apparently monkeys are better and acting human than the average sociopath according to the studies.
One interesting thing. They did research with the hypothesis that a psychopath could not recognize things like empathy, hurt feelings, etc. What they found is that sociopaths actually can recognize those things BETTER than the rest of us. They can see them in our eyes, our faces, our body language…sometimes before we are even cognitive of them. They are constantly scanning people for the “look” of these human feelings and reactions. However, they only know the “definition” of them and how to con people feeling/showing them. They don’t feel them. They then use the definition of what they are seeing in us as their design for how to get what they want from us individually based upon those readings and understanding of the definitions.
Another thing they are studying right now? Sociopaths don’t do human subconscious things we do like yawning when we see or hear someone else yawning! They said that, so far, when they do studies, people who are known to be psychopaths do not yawn after someone else does. They said that even chimpanzees and dogs will often yawn if they see a human yawn…just like normal people like us have that strange reflex of yawning when we see someone else yawn. But, psychopaths don’t do that. So, even little social cues like that that we all know about, or laugh and wonder about, when it happens in a group of people, psychopaths naturally DON’T do it without even consciously knowing that are not doing it.
Wow! That could be a new red flag when meeting someone! Yawn and then watch to see if they yawn! 🙂
I tested The Lodger on the yawning. He has needed my help more since getting out of the hospital. I yawned several times on phone calls today. Nothing. I walked out front and he was smoking. I yawned a few more times. No yawn. Someone can’t be consciously stifling a yawn! I have never even heard of these studies and this book was just written last year. Spaths are too lazy to look up studies about themselves if they even recognize that is what they are. But, the guy writes that they don’t yawn after someone else does the way we subconsciously do and my spath is proving it to be true around me. This book could be so helpful to US.
I didn’t read any of it today. I plan to take my time and try not to let him read it. He usually gets very bored with non-fiction. I doubt he will even read it if he asks for it again. At this point, I think it would be interesting to run the blink and yawn test as well as any others in the book, let him read it, and then see if he mimics those cues the rest of us do without thinking once he has read it. The Lodger Experiment.
I am glad others here are remembering and experimenting as they can. We need as many clues and cues as we can get about these people. I do think the author may be a narcissist at the very least and may even be questioning researchers around the world about sociopaths to see if they recognize that he might have some or all of the traits. I’m not sure yet.
Yes. First Date: We blink and yawn a lot and watch to see what they do. LOL. If we yawn and they don’t and get mad because they take our yawns as boredom, we will have gone out with a sociopath narcissist!
Quickly browsing the site and came upon the “social cues” of the sociopath which you posted, FFWR. It occurred to me that “not blinking often” was what I had initially interpreted as intensity in my s-path husband. He is very intelligent, 14 years older than myself, and he would bare down upon me with this guru-like focus. I was intimidated and mesmerized. When I first brought him home, before we married, I remember that my father asked somewhat irritably, “Why does he LOOK at you that way?” I was actually a bit embarrassed by the behavior. It seemed like some socially awkward way of expressing unwavering devotion. This quirk was just one of many cues. I think “the predatory stare” may be a combination of a neurological quirk, theatrics, and an attempt to mimic social connection.
I happened to cross paths with him this morning and watched to see how often he blinks. Sure enough. He doesn’t blink much.
As an aside, he also never dreams. You shared a nightmare with your lodger, FFWR, but I’ll bet he doesn’t personally experience nightmares.
Hi Cherith,
The author seems to wonder if they do not blink as much because they are run by their amygdala, AKA: the lizard brain, that is our ancient brain with no impulse control, runs with addictions, and we would not really be human if that was the only part of the brain we had stayed with as evolving. He says they really are reptiles. He also compares the worst ones to Cobras listing the biological reactions they have similar to a snake! He says that cobras stay calm and their anxiety levels go down before they strike. Basically, as I have been reading this book, he compares sociopaths to reptiles with the ability to act like full human beings. And, NO!, my spath rarely dreams at all. Last night, after I had nabbed this book from his library order, I went over to see if he needed anything as he just got back from surgery recently. I had cookies in the oven, so just planned to pop in and see if I needed to come back and help him with anything. HE began to tell me about a nightmare he had supposedly just had. I know he was lying. He didn’t have a nightmare. I DID. He tells me about remembering bits and pieces of dreams about three times a year. They usually seem to be about the Navy. With my newfound education from Lovefraud articles and sharing here, I immediately thought, “You are making this up.” Luckily, I remembered my cookies and had to run out the door just as he started his “dream” story. What are the chances that he happened to have one of his few dreams the very day I had an unusually bad nightmare? I’ll bet no reptile dreams!
I plan to continue reading this book and reporting anything here that can be helpful to help everyone to recognize some of the subtle body language of the sociopath cobra. It sounds like your father recognized it right away.
Hmmm,interesting! I’m glad you brought this up Cherith! Please keep us updated fight! I remember at times spath telling me he had dreams or nightmares.Sometimes he would say he “heard” a word and ask me if it was a real word or not.Sometimes it was;sometimes not.
So…When I found out my ex s/p was cheating, extensively, called me a pig and a parasite (which is probably what he had been called at one time or another)…I told him I was leaving and that I was not going to live like that, nor my children (and that was after he pushed me down the stairs from behind in front of my kids). He told me if I leave him, he would take my kids. I told him “my kids are my life”. He told me, “I’m going to ruin your life!” Scary, because he has spent the last 10 years giving it his best shot. The court system is corrupt and an ideal avenue for the s/p to manipulate and facilitate legal abuse…which my children and I have suffered, EXTENSIVELY! However, nothing he has tried, schemed, plotted, planned…NOTHING has worked. I guarantee he had expended 10 x the energy trying to “Get Me” or sabotage my parenting to take me back to court, hold me in contempt, bribe GAL’s and court appointed evaluators…He has spent thousands of $$$…”God before you, who can be against you”. My kids are wise, overcomers, smart, beautiful, strong, prayerful, and refuse to spend time with their “abuser”. I have been through Hell with this maniac and his wife and her whole family…showing up to court, hoping to see me fall…It has not happened…will not happen…knowledge is power. Knowing what an S/P is and knowing that they are so damned predictable is the best defense ever. The GAL that was court appointed, “drank the Kool-Aid” and told me on our first meeting “we’re all sociopaths…we all lie” (she had met with my ex s/p on 3 separate occasions prior to meeting me once…I have doubted, repented, doubted more, believed, praised, loved, exhausted myself…But the main thing…I kept moving forward! Keep moving forward and eventually all of this shiznit will be behind us…To God be the glory for ever and ever. Amen and Amen…Peace, Love and Hugs…
Hi everybody. My pseudo wife is back. It’s usually too much work to be able to share posts while she is here, but I seldom go a day without catching up with articles and comments. As a bonus this week, I just found out her mother will be staying in town locally this week so we will no doubt have some lovely performances. Oh the depths of delusion there just boggle the mind. Anyway I wanted to jump in with you on this subject.
Body Language. While we were dating my spath shared many of her strategies and techniques. Asserting dominance and subconsciously manipulating – in her real estate business she explained that when clients would come in she would begin to establish control immediately by the way she would direct them to where they would sit. Staging. She has many times explained how the peripheral surroundings have ensured or swayed even a C L sale for some inexpensive piece of furniture or whatever. When they walked in they weren’t expecting it. They kept commenting on how the shiny the floor was. The presentation affects the perceived value of the item being sold. She is highly aware of every aspect relating to this and uses many variations of theses techniques effectively. Personal Presentation. With a small residential house cleaning business she had for a bit, she explained that during the first meeting she would never show up in casual dress or dress like she was going to while doing the cleaning work. No, she dressed up very high end and presented herself as a sophisticated, superior alternative to the frumpy average cleaning lady. She was sure this kept her pricing higher than the average. Dreams. She says if she sleeps on her back she always has nightmares. Otherwise she says she can never remember dreaming, or almost never. Btw she falls asleep almost instantly when she is ready, but sleeps very lightly as her hearing is almost superhuman. More on sleep, her naps, she Must have them in the afternoon, falls asleep immediately and awakens completely refreshed almost exactly 20 mins later. Like a robot charging its batteries. Eyes. On the blinking, now that you mention it, I’d say that’s pretty accurate. She has very intense, expressive eyes and most definitely uses them in many ways to assert dominance, to seduce both sexually and otherwise. She is particularly fascinated with her eyes and loves to draw attention to them in conversations with others about their unique color and shape because of her ethnicity blend. I forgot until just now, but she did liken them to a lions before, and they are similar. While she wears no makeup on her face itself, her skin is practically flawless ( sickening I know, but true ) she outlines her eyes heavily, drawing attention to them. I remember too hearing I think it was Jack Nicholson explaining how not blinking during pivotal scenes brought more power to the performance. As many of you have already stated spaths know and do these things instinctively, and when they have fairly perfected their craft, be glad you are able to see them at least finally, now.
Very interesting, 4light2shine.
One strange little thing that happened at my wedding annoyed me, but I just brushed it off. Now years later, I realize that “a social cue” was given, but I just brushed it off. When the pastor said, “I now pronounce you man and wife. You may kiss the bride”, my new husband kissed me hard and held the kiss and held the kiss and held the kiss. The congregation started to laugh. They must have thought, “Look how much he loves her!” Meanwhile, I was feeling pressed, forced, uncomfortable. Finally I pushed him away, laughing a little. I knew he was showing off. But I accepted the behavior and moved on. Years later, I realize that, as the bride, I was part of the stage set and that this was theatrical. It wasn’t an expression of passion. That saddens me because I’m not sure how much insight he really has. I feel sorry for him. I know that is a dangerous thing, to be sorry for an s-path. But I don’t think he really knows what he is suppose to feel or how to express it.
The “kiss of death” for your well being! I think spaths get a lot of what they do and say from movies.
One last comment because this article struck home — thank you, Linda Almas. I write it as testimony to the fact that a sociopath will sometimes give a warning. Before I ever married my husband, he said to me (two times), “You don’t want me. I’ll never make you happy. I’m irresponsible.” We were in college at the time. He was (by his own account) the Director of Student Counseling and he was heading for graduate school. I didn’t believe him. He also told me that he had nothing to offer me. I was so infatuated that I told him “I would live with you even if we had to live in a tent.” When you are 22 years old, you don’t realize what this means. I didn’t know what terrible financial condition he was in. After the wedding, I moved half way across the country to live with him. I arrived to a mailbox stuffed with overdrafts for a trip he had taken to Europe and Israel. He owed a number of people money. He had even put our wedding rings on a credit card — which I eventually paid for through my work as a nurse. When the time came for us to move to an apartment, he admitted that he couldn’t pass a credit check. I persevered with him. It seemed that he was a complicated person with many other likeable qualities. He managed to complete graduate school although he was the first person, probably in the history of that college, to find a way around writing a thesis. His professors allowed him to take one additional course instead. He appears very credible, full of potential, intense, charming, and likeable.
Once as newly-weds, he curled toward me in bed and whispered, “I knew you’d be an easy person to fool”.
It’s difficult, even now, to admit that I was consciously manipulated. There are so many questions I’d like to ask him. But it is impossible to get a straight answer. He is able to rationalize his actions and lies about even little things.
Having said all of this, I need to accept responsibility for my part in this relationship. I need to move on, forgive myself … even forgive him. And I must have hope that my life isn’t “ruined”.
Cherith:
Another interesting “cue” you’ve mentioned. Whispering. It’s just creepy and it is a powerful tool to control. My spath brother in law has used whispering all of the time. He used to murmur and whisper things into this kids ears and it was creepy. He also used to whisper to my sister while she was asleep…I believe a form of brainwashing. One time, when she was considering leaving him and he knew, she told us that “they” had awakened and heard someone whisper “Don’t leave me.” She was the one who woke up and I am certain he was already wide awake. He convinced her they had a ghost! We all knew he had whispered it and she wasn’t supposed to wake up and hear it. She is still with him and she and their kids are completely brainwashed by him.
Mine doesn’t whisper. But, I have had to sleep in separate bedrooms since husband number one. So, he might be capable of that kind of thing. He does a lot of verbal stuff designed to manipulate.