Editor’s note: Lovefraud has received another question from Andrea, who wrote in a month ago. If you have any suggestions for her, please share them.
I am looking for some strong advice on how to help my children deal with their father ”¦ my ex ”¦ who is a sociopath. We have been divorced for 4 years and I have been terrified of this man. Not so much physically, but more just afraid of his bullying and threats. Even though people have told me that his threats are just words and he cannot follow through on them, it is still hard when he is so confident that he is so right and I am so wrong. I have tried very hard to take the high road through all of this and he falls in this gray area between legal and illegal, but suffers no consequences. I have been told that once I stop letting him get to me, he will get bored and move on to someone else.
Recently, I have broken free of his hold and I don’t care anymore. I’ve started living my life and doing what I want. I’ve met a new man who was in the Marines and is an avid hunter. My son has expressed interest in hunting and went with him one day. My ex found out about it the night before and went insane. He told my son that he forbade him to go, but I told my son that he was with me and I was allowing it. My ex started calling the house at 1:15 in the morning and called for about an hour. I tried to talk with him one time, but it was ridiculous. He told me he would stop paying child support and would fight for sole custody if I let him go. (Wish I had that all on tape). Anyway, I let him go because there was no danger, he had an apprentice hunting license, and he was with me that weekend. Now my ex has decided to bully my son. It has been horrible. He is now threatening him and scaring him with things that he can’t possible do. Even though I try to explain to my son what he’s doing, it’s too hard for a 12 year old to comprehend. My son is withdrawn, angry and scared. He won’t talk to me very much, so I don’t exactly know what he’s thinking or how to help him.
How can I help my son (and daughter eventually) not suffer? Has anyone had any similar experiences? My biggest fear is that my son will just give in to my ex and do what he says to keep the peace ”¦ to get positive attention from his dad. The worst case scenario would be my son moving in with him when he’s 14 (something that my ex is working on because he knows it will hurt me). How much should I tell my children? How can I help them? We already have a pact that anything that happens at our house stays between us ”¦ terrible, I know ”¦ but it’s the only way to keep them safe (emotionally).
Thanks for any advice I can get.
Dear Jill,
Your story sounds very dangerous and potentially harmful to your baby as well as yourself again.
If there was any advice I could give to you it would be four words for life….
TRUST YOUR MATERNAL INSTINCTS…
Maybe you dont need to leave the country but find friends or relatives out of state that might be able to help you…and during that time limiting contact with friends and family that he may be able to interrogate…
Perhaps another attorney could assist you in addressing the courts again… the information you have is compelling…and there are many news media articles you can provide to the judge about cases where protective orders were dismissed or not granted for technical reasons only to find the perp either harmed, abducted or killed the concerned party seeking the court ordered protection.
Stay safe…. take care of yourself and your baby… and always trust your instinct/your gut….IT NEVER FAILS…except when we ignore it! (((HUGS)))
JillSmith: I’m hoping you’ll check in. Learn is right about protecting yourself. I have a story I’ll share when you’re online.
Rune, OxDrover and learnthelesson:
Thanks for your insight and comments. I find it so difficult to not second guess all of my decisions these days. Especially after having made the decision to marry this man in the first place. It’s so hard to know what the right thing to do is. I always try to guess what he will or won’t do when I make my decisions and that is making me feel crazy.
I do just need to trust my gut feelings. Then the tricky part is figuring out exactly what plan I should follow. I do know that I don’t feel safe. It’s more than just the general PTSD feeling of not feeling safe these past few days. It’s a very strong feeling of a “calm before the storm”. I don’t know how else to explain it besides I know that things feel like they are very wrong. I just moved to this new apartment, away from a Domestic Violence shelter I was in and now I feel very vulnerable. I just don’t like the idea of those handguns being back in his possession. Maybe I’m not in more danger at all. Perhaps he’s just trying to scare me with that picture. He was so physiclally violent though when I was married to him. I was only with him for a couple of months, but it was long enough to see a lot of abuse. That was before he even had a reason to treat me that way. Now that I told the whole story to the court and filed for an Order of Protection, I’m afraid I fanned his fire.
Do any of you have difficult trusting your judgment after choosing to be with a Sociopath in the first place? I just can’t believe that I didn’t see any warning signs, so it makes me think that I have poor judgment.
Rune, yes there is a certain mentality with many people in the climbing community. I made a rule for myself to not date any more climbers. ha. And yes, he did the climb to create the photo. It would have been difficult to climb with that bouncy seat. There’s not another approach to this climb. It’s a tower in the desert. I can’t imagine who he got to take the picture. He might have asked his brother to do it. His brother is a jerk who hates women. I have no idea though. I waste so much time trying to figure out senseless details like this. I’m driving myself crazy. If he just posted it to upset me, then I need to stop thinking about it because if I obsess over it, I’m letting him win. On the other hand, if he’s serious about harming me and/or my baby again, and he posted the picture as a warning, then I should pay attention to it I guess. I’m just so tired of thinking about him and all of this. I don’t really have a choice though. I have to think about it when considering the possible risk to my baby’s safety. Rune, I am very interested in hearing your story.
One thing I can’t figure out is what all of his friends and our mutual friends think about this photo. It’s pretty small and maybe one wouldn’t know it was a baby chair if you didn’t know what this particular one looked like. It’s facebook though and everyone comments on everyone’s pictures, so certainly a friend or a fellow climber would have asked about it. How does he have the nerve to post this photo and not think there will be some kind of consequence? Don’t his friends think he’s unbalanced?
OxDrover, I’m happy to hear that you are starting to see some healing. I can’t imagine how difficult it would be to go through this with your own son. How terrible. I’m so sorry. Thanks for your advice. It was good to “hear” someone else say I should trust my instincts. It’s so hard to have faith in anything, let alone my instincts these days.
Learnthelesson, thanks also for giving the advice about my instints. I think it’s good advice. I’m just so hypervigilant lately that I don’t want to do anything too drastic. Part of me wants to take time with this decision to really know what is right and the other part of me doesn’t know how safe it is to really sit around and wait. I wish my mom were still alive to ask for advice. This friend in France is the only truly safe person I can stay with. I met my ex in college and we have the same circle of friends. I don’t trust my dad because my ex was able to trick him that he’s this great guy. My dad is VERY against divorce and single moms in general because of his strict religious views. I do not trust him at all. I do have attorney now that I’m back in my state and she is trying to look into some things for me. She doesn’t seem to know a lot about Sociopaths, but has represented a lot of Domestic Violence Victims before. She’s at a little bit of a loss about what we should do to proceed. She doesn’t know if my appealing the judge’s decision will do any good in the long-run, as an Order of Protection is “just a piece of paper”. It might make my ex more angry and obsessed. I don’t know what to do. She said that if I leave the country, theoretically, he could sue for custody and if I don’t respond because they can’t find my address, by default, after a certain period of time the could award him as a recognized guardian of my baby because we were still legally married at the time my baby was born. Then, I could get charged with kidnapping when they find me, whoever “they” is. He would have to follow through with a lot of work and money to do this though.
Also, my attorney is pro-bono and sometimes I feel that she might not have enough time for my case. She is a good attorney, but it’s not as if I can afford a great attorney if I paid for one myself. I feel that if anything else goes to trial, this could hurt me.
Dear Jill,
I think perhaps you have nothing to lose and everything to gain by going to the one person you think can help you and where it is safe for you. For goodness sake, you can always claim you were visiting, vacationing, or whatever you want if anything legal comes from it…dont know how it can when he isnt even listed on the birth certificate…but this gives you the green light any moment you want it.
I understand you second-guessing yourself….its all this crazymaking that comes from seeing the picture and losing the protective order and just having to constantly wonder and having recently left the shelter can make you vulnerable getting back on your feet….all the more your friend in France may be a better transition for you.
These are your words…. and probably the most important words for you to focus on…concentrate on and believe in…
“I do know that I don’t feel safe. It’s more than just the general PTSD feeling of not feeling safe these past few days. It’s a very strong feeling of a “calm before the storm”. I don’t know how else to explain it besides I know that things feel like they are very wrong. I just moved to this new apartment, away from a Domestic Violence shelter I was in and now I feel very vulnerable. I just don’t like the idea of those handguns being back in his possession.”
There is nothing else to be said. You just need to trust yourself and believe in yourself right now…and based on his history of violence and that picture it is truly better to err on the side of caution…
Did you have a chance to read Kelsi’s story?
Also, try not to wonder what his friends think…your x is a master manipulator and would probably say some ridiculous excuse or even say Im just getting back at my x…who knows..not your concern…and at the same time I understand the need to understand and know what EVERYONE else thinks…but in these situations the best and greatest thing we can do is think of ourselves and how to protect ourselves and get away. Your thought process is healthy and strong… your awareness and understanding of your situation is a gift for you and your child.
Your comment about a protection order being just a piece of paper is so true to a large degree. It does deter some from making contact while on the other hand it enrages others. So relying on that or putting your energy in that may be futile.
Having NO CONTACT with him…and really choosing to tell nobody for a good six months any particulars of your whereabouts…maybe saying you are taking a vacation or travelling to visit various friends throughout the state and will keep in touch….
If you make your decision to visit France…it doesnt matter what he will do or wont do…he wont know… only tell people you trust. Even choose a friend from out of state you could write to family members too and forward the letters to your out of state friend who can readdress them and forward them…thereby allowing you contact with family members…seems drastic ..but you seem so concerned for your safety and your babies safety that drastic measures may need to be taken. SOONER THAN LATER..
Im sorry you lost your mom…What do you think your mom would say to you? Im concerned for you…I can hear your fear through your posts and I can sense dangerous uneasiness with your ex.
I would have to agree with you that you should act sooner than later. Better to be safe than sorry. Err on the side of caution with your little one.
About warning signs and judgment…we have all missed them and messed them up and questioned them…but we learn as we go…we learn to trust ourselves over them…believe in ourselves over them…and find our self-respect and self-love again… in the past our inability to have the tools to deal with these people and our clouded judgment (From being in their twistedness and in the fog) kept us in harms way. But now, today, you are aware to have good judgment and you are acting on it. You have learned and you are continuing to learn along the way…
I commend you on all you are doing to advocate for your child AND YOURSELF… think of only you two right now and what is best for your peace of mind and safety. Dont get stuck in worrying how it will affect him as all to often it is fear or the unknown that keeps us in a bad place…
Keep posting when you can and keep us updated. You are NOT crazy… you sound like an amazing person and mother… and while gathering advice and information and support you will sort it all out and you will do whats best for you both…trust YOURSELF! ((HUGS))
JillSmith: One of the people I dated was an Everest climber with a particular reputation. I thought I recognized a certain “type” from your story. So he didn’t Photoshop the picture — he actually worked that hard to send that message. I trust your instincts, but I also trust that you are a climber as well, and you know how to “mantel” out of this situation! C’mon! It’s only a 5.9, right? (I’m taking this very seriously.)
Oh, my dear. Please check in in the morning if you can. (If not sooner.) I do have a story and some encouragement for you.
Dear Jillsmith,
Your story is scattered over several threads, I didn’t realize he was married to you at the time your baby was born.
IF he has enough MONEY to persue you on that case, it might be a possibility he might try something like that.
There are several things, first—are you STILL married to him?
If not, that gives you some more leaway to “get out of Dodge” and hide out, and then it is up to HIM to find and spend the money to go to court. (If he has it)
Either gettig out of the country (US) or going into hiding in the US are in my opinion, probably your best options.
Each one has pros and cons, and yes, making decisions now while you are feeling ANXIOUS is difficult, and normally making decisions when you are STRESSEd is not a good idea, but at the same time—what other options do you have than to make decisions? I’ve been there, and made some so-so decisions, but the ONE thing I did that was RIGHT (and saved my life!) was the RUN RABBIT RUN when I felt threatened.
Going to France does get you and your child out of teh immediate fray, however, making a living while living in another country can be dicey at best, and especially in this economy. Also if you are living there with a US passport, he can find you if he has the money and the dedication to do so.
I have lived in other countries and there is definitely some down sides to it, as well as making a living. If you would ilke to contact me off line, please let donna know and she will send me your e mail address and I can give you some pointers I got from a private investigator. good luck with it all and like learned said, don’t worry so much about him as about yourself and your baby! TRUST YOUR INSTINCTS, and your FEAR FACTOR, it is a GIFT…(((hugs)))) and God bless you!
“Do any of you have difficult trusting your judgment after choosing to be with a Sociopath in the first place? I just can’t believe that I didn’t see any warning signs, so it makes me think that I have poor judgment.”
jillsmith,
Can I relate to this! Boy can I relate to this!
I believe because we are put on their emotional roller coaster for so long our ability to trust ourselves has already be compromised and this started us not trusting our own instincts and feeling. Anyway after my world fell to pieces I didn’t trust anything I would do or think and even told someone that very thing. “I don’t trust anything I do or feel” quote unquote. I felt I couldn’t make any decisions and lost all trust in myself. I guess many of us went through this? After 3 years of no contact my ability to trust myself again has returned “Thank God!”. But I remember all too well of that total lack of trust in myself and the ability to make sound and right decisions on anything and please let me repeat that “ANYTHING!
If you were able to trust your self at one time then I believe it will return but I can sympathies with you very much. Trusting myself was always my strongest and most cherished worth I felt for myself and relied on it my own life. To lose that is to lose a part of my own personality. Whenever we lose any part of our personality that lost is great and will shake us to our very core. I just thank God we may lose it but only temporary and it does return.
Hey James,
I can relate to the feeling that you ‘dont trust anything you do or feel’. But with me I have spent my whole life so far in that state.In a fog. I grew up in a climate of secrets and lies, being manipulated by family members, having my memories twisted and turned, my reality skewed in order to cover up other’s dark secrets.
Although I feel completely broken and exhausted and terrified of where to go from here, The gift I have been given by this terrible experience is to finally begin to wake from that state. the straw that broke the camels back, this broke me so much, but it also blew apart the dream (or nightmare) state I have spent 30 years in in order to ‘cope’.Rune said that the denial is a self preservation mechanism. Its not a comfortable experience. But if anything good has come of this its that I now KNOW I can trust myself and my understanding of what is right in front of my face now.
Although it feels like I am half dead right now,going through this has actually given me clarity I have never had. Courage I never had, conviction I never had, and a glimmer of true confidence in myself. A glimmer, I will continue to nurture untill its a big spangly disco ball.:)x
I also just want to say that I love the people here so much! Rune/Oxy/LTL have scooped me up off the floor with every bit of their input no matter how ‘small’:) It all feels like a bit of a re-birth, I am currently a toddler, and they are the grown ups, the guardians and guides. I will be a grown up too soon:)Chuckle.