Editor’s note: Lovefraud received the following e-mail from a reader whom we’ll call “Veronica.” She fears for her granddaughter’s life, and it appears that she has reason to.
I’m desperate and very afraid. I hope you can help and help quickly.
My daughter was married to a man, who by all accounts, appeared to be the most wonderful guy in the world. It wasn’t until after she left him that she finally confided in me as to the truth of their relationship and I was horrified. I know he is definitely a sociopath.
For 5 years he made her life a living hell. The only reason she stayed with him she said was because it was the only way to protect her daughter. She left him over a year ago, and filed for divorce in May of this year. She was also given an order of protection (which he has violated numerous times), as he threatened my daughter and told her he was going to take my grandchild out of the country. We even showed the judge a video this man had made using his cell phone of himself badgering and pushing my granddaughter when she was only 18 months old. He cried when he saw the video. He told the judge my daughter made him do that. He said that’s the method they were using to potty train her. I sat there stunned when he said that, but I thought the judge would see through such an obvious lie! They lived with me during that time, and none of that happened. My daughter asked the judge to let me testify and he said no.
In the end, the judge saw in him a loving father and would not give her sole custody without any contact with the father. This has proven to be a grievous mistake on the judge’s part.
Injuries and threats
Twice we have had to call the police because my 4-year-old granddaughter came home injured. The first time he kicked her. They took pictures, they talked to him and of course he said he had no idea how it happened. Then he started sneaking into my daughter’s yard at night. Parking two doors down at the abandoned house. Each time we tried to get a picture, all we got was his back or a blur as he ran away. The police said that proves nothing. I’ve seen him several drive real slow in front of my daughter’s house with the dome light on, giving us the finger or a sinister smile. He’s gone by the time the police get there. He drives different cars, a black 4 door sedan, a tan Camry, a red Aveo and a dark small truck.
On the 3rd of October he had visitation. When my daughter when to pick up my grandchild, my grandchild ran away and said she didn’t want to go with my daughter. “Daddy” picked her up and put her in my daughter’s car. When they were on the way home, my daughter asked my granddaughter why she acted that way and was told “daddy said if I didn’t do that he wouldn’t play with me anymore, but if I did, he would play with me every day.” My daughter called me and told me about the incident. Unfortunately, I got mad and called him. I asked him to stop using her as a pawn. Naturally he denied it. “I would never do that.” He kept yelling so I hung up. He called back and started yelling again. I said “Look, I just called to ask you to stop playing these games with her.” He said “You think this is a game?! I will show you the kinds of games I can play and you won’t survive.” He yelled, “Leave me alone” and hung up.
A few minutes later he sent me a text message. “You guys need to tell her if she continues to say things that aren’t true she’s gonna get in trouble. And apparently you need to think REALLY hard before you open your mouth about anything.” I know from past experience that was a threat to me and my grandchild. As it was a Sunday, I went early the next morning to court to get a protection order for myself. It was granted. However, it took almost 3 weeks to serve it as he kept avoiding the Constable.
Cigarette burn
On the 16th of October he again had visitation. When my daughter picked up my granddaughter in the evening and got her home, it was about bed time. As my daughter was helping her get her pajamas on, she saw blood and a sore in the middle of her back slightly larger than the diameter of a pencil. She asked how it happened.
“Daddy poked me.”
“Why did daddy poke you?”
“I don’t know, he said it was fair, but it wasn’t.”
“Why did daddy say it was fair?”
“I think he thought I poked him, but I didn’t. I kissed him on the cheek.”
“What were you doing when daddy poked you?”
“I was rolling the ball to (her half-sister).”
“Show me how daddy poked you”
She got up and took her index finger and poked my daughter as hard as she could in the back and moved her finger in a manner like you’d use to crush out a cigarette.
I was in the room and looked at the injury. Something didn’t look right so I went and got a magnifying glass. I said, this doesn’t look like a “poke” this looks like a burn. Because the local police had told us before not to call them, but to contact the police in the city where the incident occurred, we bundled her up and drove to my house and called the police from there. They came out and talked to all three of us. My granddaughter again showed the policeman how the injury occurred and they took pictures.
Two weeks later the detectives finally called him in for questioning. But naturally, he was shocked, he cried, he demanded to know who did it. He even brought in his other two daughters who said they had no idea she had been hurt. Even though my granddaughter had told the officers her older sister had kissed the owie to try to make her feel better. Obviously, he’s threatening her half sisters, too. The detective knew it was a cigarette burn, but here is what appears to be a loving father, so they let him go.
“Make us disappear”
Saturday, October 30th he saw my grandchild again. When she came home she told my mom and my daughter, “Daddy said if I tell the truth, he will kill us all and make us disappear.” We have no idea what to do. The police are starting to think we’re the crazy ones, so we didn’t call to report it.
Last night I got an urgent call from my daughter at 11:30 pm. She said he had been there messing with the outside electrical main box. She said first the back yard light went off, then came on, then various house lights went off and back on. She ran to the back of the house to look through the window at the junction box, but all she saw was him running away.
I went over and we looked at the box. It was obvious it had been opened. We got a padlock and locked it up, then spent most of the night awake with fear. The dogs went wild with barking at 2:30 in the morning. We couldn’t see anything outside, though. We have no idea what he has in mind, but we do believe he is planning to make good on his threat to make us disappear.
My daughter says she regrets divorcing him because now she can’t ensure my granddaughter’s safety. She said she would gladly put up with the abuse if it meant she could be sure her daughter was safe. I told her there would have come a time when not even living with the man would guarantee the safety of my grandchild. No one is safe from a sociopath, and I know it’s the hardest illness in the world to prove.
We don’t have money for security cameras or even a video camera. My mom who lives with my daughter is on Social Security, my daughter has been looking for work for a year and all she’s been able to do is sell cosmetics, and I don’t make enough to provide much support to them. We’re living in fear every day. After last night I don’t feel safe going home, as I live alone. There doesn’t seem to be any way to stop him and nobody is listening to us. Please, if you can help us. Tell us what to do now. We are all out of ideas and he’s got visitation again on November 12th. I fear most for my granddaughter’s life.
This is a very scary story. Once again this is such a wonderful site to reach out to others that can give us all advise and support. I know I come here to relate to my situation and everyone is always very helpful and supportive. An idea I had in a case such as this being as time is of the essence and they seem to being having financial hardships as well, is what if there was a way one of us who may have a little extra money could donate to help her buy a camera or a bus ride? Maybe this site could appoint a secretary that could collect donations to be used in situation like this? I know I would help.
confused1,
I think that is a good suggestion, having a way to contribute financially (via the web site) to people who could use the funds to help them with their immediate concerns.
Veronica~
Keep in mind……when it comes to the police or anyone else who may think you are all ‘crazy’……
Every oak tree started out as a couple of nuts who stood their ground.
Veronica – EB is the big gun, so i don’t have anything in terms of security to offer, but want to say – it really doesn’t matter what anyone thinks of you. facts facts facts, ALWAYS call when he breaches an order or comes around or hurts your gchild. ALWAYS. you have to funnel your fear into being relentless AND covert. don’t ever tell him anything – it only gives him fuel and a heads up. don’t call him. block his number. block his email. give him NOTHING.
he is not normal and he will not hear or heed the voice of reason or feel contrite or threatened in such a way as to make him back off.
you have every right to call the cops and they have NO right to tell you not to. period.
Guys, your idea to contribute financially to help others is a worthy cause, but because this is the internet, how would someone be vette4d to see that they are not just conning Lovefraud…believe it or not we have psychopaths who come here disguised as “victims”—but if you really want to help others who are NEEDY, then contribute to your local DV shelter. Send them money, seen them things you no longer need but that are still good. Donate your TIME! Donate your knowledge of psychopaths and your caring heart!
I can see at sometime that LF may have a foundation to help people in financial need from the devastation of the psychopaths, but right now there isn’t a foundation, but give Donna time, she’s already accomplished a tremendous amount.
In the meantime, donate to your local DV shelter, they can use all the help they can get, and then some! I actually wanted to help very badly and took in a woman that I believed had been very badly abused, and turned out she was just a LOSER PSYCHOPATH who had been tossed to the curb by her former victims who caught on! She did a great job for a little while though in presenting herself as a victim. About all I can say about the situation is that she was smart, she was crafty, but I did keep enough of a “clinical distance” that she didn’t take me for anything financially and I didn’t get so emotionally involved with helping her that I was emotionally hurt. I did learn though, and now I give to the local DV shelter and let them use the money and time as they see fit and need it the worst.
Oh, EB, an oak tree is ONE NUT that stood it’s ground! LOL when more than one nut stands its ground it is called a FOREST!!!! LOL (((hugs)))
Veronica,
Money is a problem that can be helped if you shop wisely.
There are two websites I use to get office supplies, computer gear and electronics for free after rebate or for very low cost.
Fatwallet.com and slickdeals.net. The forum users post hot deals at places like target, Staples, office depot etc…
here’s one now for 29.99
http://slickdeals.net/forums/showthread.php?sduid=0&t=2341887
Sometimes people post deals on diapers and stuff from walgreens or riteaid, so maybe you can save money on that to pay for the spy gear.
I sign up for alerts so that if anyone posts a deal on an item I need, I get an email alert. I’ve bought a few webcams this way and you can get coupons for cheap digicorders. black friday is coming up and lots of these come up as loss leaders. I also got some software called video patrol which you load onto your computer and now your web camera can function as a security camera. I’m not sure how good it is, since I never installed it. (I’m kinda a recovering free-after-rebate shopping addict. I used to buy stuff I didn’t need just because it was free or get-paid after rebate. Had over $5000 in rebates one year!) 🙁
Lastly, women’s shelters now give out emergency cell phones to dv victims to make sure that they are safe. they get loaded with free minutes. GET 3 of them. If you already have a cell phone with a MINUTES plan, you get your daughter a very tightly stuffed teddy bear, open it up, put a cell phone inside with the ringer turned OFF AND AUTO-ANSWER ON. Put it into the child’s backpack. Better yet, get her a backpack with a built in teddy bear or some other decorative stuffy and sew it in there. When you call the teddy bear phone from your other cell phone, you should hear it auto answer and then you can hear the conversation going on with who ever is near the bear. Test it several times until you have it down. When your daughter goes to her dad’s, you drive down to the police station and sit outside and call the teddy phone. If you hear him harming her, go inside and let the police or anyone else who is around here it too.
I don’t know the legalities of this in your state, you might want to talk to a lawyer or research it. Maybe Erin B knows.
Further, where I live, the cops are so corrupt that the P had already ensnared them into illegal behavior so they wouldn’t act on the recording I gave them. hopefully, you will have better luck than I.
Lastly, I don’t want to imply that there is no danger, because there is ALWAYS danger with the psychopath and that danger is life and death. But consider a few things:
Fear doesn’t help you think clearly. It is only useful in the fight or flight mode, not the planning stage.
The psychopath uses gaslighting to frighten us because that is when we slip up, we seem crazy (and they seem sane) so no one believes us. Plus we make mistakes. also, they just plain LIKE it when we’re reacting emotionally. it’s WHY they do it. they suck up emotions and they want yours. DON’T GIVE THEM ANY. no drama.
Also consider that when a psychopath REALLY wants you dead, they don’t warn you. On the contrary, they get all lovey-dovey. Remember the Judas kiss when he betrayed Jesus. That’s when you should be really afraid. Oxy’s son sent a trojan horse who befriended the family members. That’s how they like to kill and get away with it. My exP was nice to me while he plotted my demise, and his threats were veiled, “I’m going to punish you for that.”
I’m so sorry that you have to endure this, but stay calm and you can think your way through it.
I love the Oak Tree Analogy! lol OXy & EB
Skylar, some very good advise there! My Ex S ran around like a maniac for a few months making death threats, ‘Trying’ to get a Intervention order on me before I could get one on him, making sure he always drove past my children’s school when I went to pick them up, driving past my parent house, driving past our beach house which was 2 hours away, when I there. If I went to the Supermarket magically he was there, if I went to the Petrol Station magically he was there too.
But for me it was all intimidation, scaremongering and I was terrified, I felt I could trust no one not even the Police and I thought I sounded like the crazy one! He was making me crazy!
Usually people that say they are going to kill you, usually dont but I also dont want to down play any S & P behaviour as they are dangerous! The times that the ex s physically hurt me it was reactive, it was about control in that moment, he would just fly into a rage in an instant. While he was busy telling me and everyone else he was going to kill me and plotting my demise nothing happened….
But I also had to move to a secret address, change my phone number, changed cars, and have household accounts in my name and went into hiding! But mine and I only speak of mine always ran out of steam and then would go onto the next victim and I hope this is the case as with Veronica but if you expect the worst and prepare for the worse then you know you have done everything to protect yourself and your family.
Veronica never talk to him, advise your daughter never to engage in conversation with him at any time.
Milo mentioned The Forensic Psychologist and that is who I saw and she was brilliant! She helped my rationalise it, understand it and help me with what I needed to do. Fear is the most distressing emotion and S’s know it.. I turned my fear into anger and fought back and thankfully the law was on my side!
Document, Document, Document!!!! and I love Oxy’s advise about seeking out Shelters for advise! Try anything, everything,everywhere and everyone, that may have answers!
Dear Dani, LOL EB and I both have twisted senses of humor. or is it sense of HumorS? Not sure. We each got a twisted sense of humor. That gets it. LOL
Skylar’s advice is very good and technology is great too! There are all kinds of things out there from pin hole nanny cams to directional mics that you can point at a window and record what is going on inside the house, and the price of all of them is coming DOWN DOWN DOWN.
I am a technological dummy and don’t even keep up with what is available now, but my son does. If i hear about something and say “Hey, guess what they have now” he says “Oh, yes, that’s been out since august 1994, the price is $xyz now down from $ABC only a year ago.
So Veronica if you have a young geek friend ask him/her about what is available and where to get it cheap.
I also think your best bet is going to be a call to your local Domestic Violence shelter. You don’t have to GO there to get help form them in most cases, at least advocacy for your granddaughter. If there was no child involved you might have more trouble finding help but with a child involved I think you will get the help you need for your daughter and the child.
Professional people generally get pretty serious about protecting a child–not always, for sometimes the psychopath will “snow” even the professionals, but don’t go silently away, keep on making noise to the professionals, and I’d start with the domestic violence shelter folks. They deal with this kind of thing on a daily, HOURLY EVEN, basis. God bless.
Hello everyone,
First of all I’d like to thank all of you for your helpful advice. I was able to find a security camera for $25! I got it setup today at my daughter’s house. It’s a black and white version, but it works and that’s all I care about.
I’m really praying we get the evidence we need.
I know several of you mentioned contacting Child Protective Services. We did that, but unfortunately, they too, think this man is a loving and caring father. They said he responded appropriately with concern and tears. However, he denied everything, so they are calling it unsubstantiated. This is sick!
It’s just like we’re living in the Twilight Zone, you know?
We really need to get him on tape to prove he is not the innocent person he pretends to be.
My granddaughter has to see him again next weekend and I’m just so worried what he’s going to do to her this time.
He’s been sneaking into my yard and I had to put a padlock on my electrical box too. I’ve got my brother coming next week to put in backyard lights for me. Until then, I’m not sleeping at my house. I’m too scared.
I want to take the control of my life away from him and I want my family to be safe again, but I’m just out of ideas as to how to make that happen. How do I feel safe again?
It’s so difficult when the people you expect to protect you – police, judges, CPS, etc. – start to think you’re the crazy person, you know? Thankfully our friends and people at the church are supportive. That helps some.
It’s nice to have you all to talk to. It’s great to have a place to bounce ideas around and get a new perspective. Also, I’m not feeling so alone in this anymore. Thank you.
It’s mind boggling for me. I’ve never had any trouble with anybody. I’ve never had to call the police, I’ve never even had a traffic ticket. It’s like I’m in some sort of horrible nightmare and I can’t wake up.
I am here looking for somebody who can tell us if we’re doing the right things and help us keep my granddaughter safe. She’s just 4 years old and she is so confused. She loves her daddy and can’t understand why he hurts her and why he does bad things.
Frankly, I don’t know how to explain it to her. We’ve just told her it’s important to keep telling the truth, and keep letting us know if he hurts her. We tell her it’s the only way daddy is going to get the help he needs to become a good daddy.
Is this the right thing to tell her?
What do you tell a 4 year old that won’t get her in trouble with her dad if she repeats it back to him?
She’s on a waiting list for free counseling. I didn’t ever imagine there would be a “waiting list” for child therapy.
We’re documenting things she says and events that happen, but having seen how the judge runs family court, I just don’t think he would ever allow any video tapes we make of her into any court hearing. We tried that at the original custody hearing with no success.
Problem is, “daddy” is also making his own tapes. My granddaughter says he films her pretending to be scared and saying she is afraid of her mommy and how she wants to live with him. I think it would basically turn into a “video war” and we’d lose as soon as he turns on the tears.
She says if she doesn’t do what daddy wants her to do, he hits her on the head really hard. She’s come home with headaches. But it’s not hard enough to raise a welt.
My heart is just breaking for her. She looks to me for comfort and protection and all I can do is hold her and tell her to be brave.
I just want this insanity to end. Pray that we get him on film.
Thanks.
Dear Veronica,
I hear your pain, and your anxiety and my heart melts for you and your family!
Well, if he is filming her “pretending to be scared” then you need to film her saying she is PRETENDING TO BE SCARED. He is obviously fabricating a phony tape, so counter with one of your own, but I would make sure that the child did not know she was being filmed.
Did you contact the domestic violence shelter people? They may be able to help you deal with the child protective services. They have seen this kind of thing before.
Maybe when your daughter dresses the girl to go with her father, she can have a neighbor lady or friend there to examine the child and make sure there are no MARKS ON HER when she goes, and then have that same lady there when the child comes home and gets undressed for bed so there will be a WITNESS to any marks. Also an AUDIO recorder, the digi ones you can have in a pocket and they make pretty good recordings.
Pictures, videos, witnesses, anything you can gather. Sounds like there is going to be a FIGHT.
In the meantime, YOU keep safe.
You are in my prayers and I know that there are others here too who will also put you in their prayers.
What state do you live in? I have a friend in a national domestic violence group and I might be able to get some help through her organization. I’ll contact her on face book and then send donna her information to put you in contact with her. She might have so ideas that I don’t have or know resources I don’t know about.
((((hugs))) and God bless.