Lovefraud received the following email from a reader whom we’ll call “Lorna.”
I thought I’d write and tell you a success story, thanks to all the information you provide to help people to survive a sociopath.
I’ve met them at various times in my life, however, I was lucky that I never married or got pregnant or lived with one. A couple of years ago, one crossed my path, and in a short time caused a lot of disruption before I dumped him. I pretty much forgot all about the narcissistic sociopath since then.
I wanted to watch the Will and Kate wedding live, but didn’t have TV, and on the West Coast it would be shown at 3 a.m. I posted on the activities partners section of Craigslist hoping someone was planning on being up to watch, and might let me come join them. I was surprised to get an email from a man, with whom I exchanged emails and phone calls before I felt comfortable going to his place to watch the wedding.
I made chocolate covered strawberries and brought a bottle of champagne, and he had some too, so we laughed and had a wonderful time staying up til dawn watching the wedding — competing on who knew the most wedding trivia, etc. I had a blast, so did he, or so I thought. He was 14 yrs younger, worked part time as a baseball umpire, had a bright and witty mind, and was a total gentleman. We ended up snuggling a bit, and even kissing a little.
I wasn’t going to chase him, so I did send a quick email letting him know I got home safely, I left it up to him to reach out to contact me for future dates, if he wanted. A week went by. I finally got an email telling me he’d been out of commission as he’d pulled muscles in his back. I took him dinner and a heating pad and massaged his back. I waited another week before he contacted me again, which I thought was a bit strange. We emailed and planned to go for a hike at the ocean to his favorite place.
Previously, he had told me he was a confirmed bachelor, and he had “been played” by some gal a year before, and his feelings were evidentially hurt over that break up. He made another comment I didn’t quite catch, however, I think he said if I got too romantic he’d just end the relationship. Huh? I didn’t understand.
Hike to the ocean
The day came for us to go on our picnic hike to the ocean. I was to meet him at noon at his place. I had misplaced my keys and was running about 10 minutes late, so I called and got his voice mail to let him know I was on my way. When I arrived, he pointed to his watch and let me know I was late and he has a “thing about that.” Hmmm, kinda uptight, I thought to myself. After all, I did call and left a message. It wasn’t as if we were going to a concert that started at a specific time. We had all day, and what was 10 minutes? I was on “observe and take mental notes” duty, as I’d learned to watch for signs from the very very beginning, as people will give plenty of clues as to who they really are if you take off your blinders and stop making excuses for people.
My next clue came when he drove like a maniac, and made me uncomfortable tailgating. My telling him so and asking him to slow down only helped a bit when I pointed out he had 364 days a year to drive as he wished, and this one time to consider me. He did slow down, a bit, but when we came to a very curvy section of road I asked him to take the easier detour so I wouldn’t get car sick, and he refused! Ok, now my alarm system was on full alert. I was getting too many clues of his selfishness, and little comments he made to upset me. He even noticed something about me he said he could use to “push your buttons.” I didn’t think highly of that, either! Instead of being comfortable in his company, I was becoming quite wary. He seemed to take pleasure making me squirm. Not good.
We arrived at the beach, went on a bit of a hike to get there, and he helped me up and over these huge boulders on the beach. However, he wanted to be out on the edge where huge waves were crashing up on the rocks. He stood out there like a crazy guy, and I could see he was addicted to adrenalin. I couldn’t keep up with him and didn’t want to. I was getting tired, and yet he kept pushing me to go further and further, though I knew if I did I could fall and hurt myself, and told him so. HE wanted to go further, so we did, and that was that. I just made more mental notes realizing how selfish and somewhat antagonistic I found him towards me. I actually should not have been climbing on those rocks, I’m 64 years old and have had knee surgery, but he pushed me and said he didn’t drive all that way not to see it all. Eventually, we left to return towards home.
He had originally suggested we go to a local seafood restaurant for some clam chowder, but now that it was time to do so, he changed his mind and we drove back towards home. He did stop at a taco wagon that is parked in the grocery store parking lot and got less than $10 worth of tacos. He did make a point to pull out about eight $20 bills and fanned them in front of himself as he was paying for the tacos. He let it be known he had the $ to eat in a real restaurant, but instead here we were sitting at a picnic table in a grocery parking lot eating $1.50 tacos. Mind you, I’m not a gold digger, and I had brought food for the picnic. I eat at that taco truck myself from time to time. It was just the way he did this felt more like he was intentionally avoiding spending any money on me, and not keeping his promise to go for chowder as originally planned.
“Bad boy”
After we got back to his place, he didn’t help off load any of my stuff to put in my vehicle. He just gathered up his own and went up to his apartment leaving me to do my own. Once I did, we watched TV for a while, then he started kissing and it was warming up. I was about to stop it to leave when he came out and made a comment that after a while of a relationship going along nicely that he “likes to mix it up” and will let his “bad boy” come out. He said he would do things like cancel plans with me at the very last minute because something he rather do came along.
I told him that wasn’t a problem as long as he gave me enough notice to make other plans so my time wasn’t wasted. He said no, that it would be at the last minute, and why shouldn’t he go do something he liked better? I thought about it for a minute, looked back over the times I’d been with him, especially all the signals he had been giving me throughout the day, and I realized what I was dealing with. I figured out I was with a selfish brat narcissistic, probably abusive, and I felt like he was trying to set me up to expect less of him. Once I had him pegged, I instantly knew I had to get out of there immediately and have nothing more to do with him.
So, after taking in his bad boy comment, I replied back to him, “You wouldn’t do that with me if you ever wanted to see me again. Thank you for the warning.” I stood up, went over to where my car keys were sitting on a table, picked them up, went to the front door and left. I walked out on him and never looked back. I know he wasn’t expecting that! For once in my life, I had my eyes and ears open, didn’t believe a word he said, watched his behavior and believed that, and when the picture emerged, I didn’t waste another minute trying to change him or hope for the best. I just got out before any damage could be done.
In retrospect, I realize he was sizing me up to see if I took any Rx, had any jewelry and money, investments, where I lived, etc., and assumed I had $$$. He picked the wrong person! I know I’ve not heard from him either as he realized I really don’t have anything to offer him, and I’m certainly not going to have anything to do with him anyway.
I wish I had used my head in the past, but at least I did this time. I am grateful for your website for helping to ID a sociopath and pay attention to the signals. Also, the most important is to know not to get involved in the first place, because you cannot change the person and he’s not anyone you should have in your life anyway.
So, I dodged a bullet and the info on your website helped me to do just that.
LORNA
How did you know he was a spath? I mean, how did you know there WAS such a thing?
And how is it that you came to LF even when you weren’t damaged by this relationship? If you haven’t been hurt or damaged, it’s surprising that you’d spend any time on the net or stumble across this site. Seems like you might just, oh, go to the movies or something.
I’m curious.
Great job, good for you.
Superkid
To: kim frederick. You wonder why the psychopatic type would brag about being a bad boy, and what would he be testing.I think he believed, that that being a bad boy was cool and adorable and he was merely showing off. Such types are self confused. They confuse having a momentary advantage with being strong, they confuse lying to relatives with signs of superior intelligence.
Peterd, I think you have a point there….the bragging about being “billy bad ass” makes them more attractive. Sort of like a teenage kid brags about how fast and reckless he drives, or how much he drinks. GOOD POINT.
I think it also is testing to see if “we” will like and tolerate that kind of behavior as well. Or got along with it at least.
It is definitely a RED FLAG.
Lorna
I’m amazed and impressed at how smart uv been with these guys.
I’m 54 and have only just got it. Now my ‘spathdar’ is so high I don’t think I’ll trust anyone again.
Sistersister & Eden –
I’m interested by the fact that other people have had the experience of being accused of being the abuser. Nutjob would make me feel really bad when I didn’t want to give him more money. Said I was depriving his kids etc etc. I met him on a dating site but he originally came to my house to do some (paid) work on landscaping. He moved in before I could catch my breath and never paid a penny towards bills.
I am still mystified as to why I would let that happen – the red flags were waving in my face!
Do you think they do it as another way of isolating us, by making us feel guilty or ashamed?
momom: I wasn’t aware of Chuck Missler but now that you brought it to my attention I’ll take a look. The belief in the “nephilim” thing is not limited to Christian preacher’s, rabbi’s are into it as well.
lifegoeson: I just think these guys are smooth talkers, sexy, and know how to work us. They say all the right things and entrap us. Normal guys can’t work it like a spath but the relationships are healthier and safer. I also think spath’s actually hypnotize us and put us under some kind of spell.
Joannie
I think you have something with the hypnotism idea. I can’t explain why I got involved with him at all. Well I first saw him he looked ‘interesting’ but a bit wild. He wasn’t my normal type and I was always a bit wary of him. Although he was tall and not bad looking he was unkempt and disorganised – he never, ever made it to date on time! I posted further up the thread about his farting on the first date. Although I can see the funny side of it now, I found it disrespectful and embarrassing at the time.
I don’t think I ever really relaxed and trusted him but still let him into my life to do untold damage. Maybe I thought he must be a decent guy underneath it all?
I really don’t know – I’m more confused now than I ever was.
My X spath was not my type at all either!!! I am normally attracted to dark haired men…darker skinned like Italian or Greek or something. This guy is as pale as you can get with blue eyes. But he definitely hypnotized me with that stare.
Okay…..I’m not sure I can relay what i’m feeling or reading about ‘delicately’……but here’s my attempt.
Red flag number ONE…….responding to a CL ad! PERIOD!
Lorna, I’m glad you are okay……but I think it’s our responsibility to avoid danger BEFORE IT HAPPENS.
Why is it we will place personal ads, join dating sites….put our ‘stuff’ on the web or we go in with low standards….for whatever reasons, and expect nothing different than a spath or toxic to respond.
I think it goes back to the victims sense of FANTASY. If we live in an authentic- reality based life….and remove the fantasy, cinderella type romantasism from our minds……because we ‘know’ someone who it worked out for…..we know someone who met their spouse on CL or Eharmony or in a dark corner at the airport……GET OVER IT PEOPLE…..it’s a fantasy we are SOLD!
If we fish in nasty ponds……don’t expect to catch fresh, safe fish!
I am NOT blaming the victim here…..but there is ALWAYS something WE can do starting off to avoid these predators….from the getgo.
A. Don’t place ads on CL. Be safe.
B. Don’t sleep with hired help or strangers and expect anything different.
It’s bad enough in the normal life dating ‘pool’, where friends set you up or it’s a co worker etc……but the success rate drops subtantially on the web. We must ask ourselves…..is this worth it?
I know you didn’t place a dating ad on CL…..but did it ever cross your mind to call your ‘gay’ friend to stay up and watch the wedding….or check into a hotel with a TV and watch it with strangers in the lobby. The guy thought he’d hit the jackpot…..you showed up at HIS domain, bearing gifts…..with a romantic mindset of Wills and Kate and all the hubaloo that surrounded it.
You knew the guy 3 hours and you were cuddleing up and kissing…..
Lorna…..check yourself!!!!
Predators will always go with the standards WE show upfront, and work ‘down’ from there.
When we show plyability……they will continue to turn us into GUMBY. Whether we like it or not. It’s the predators way! Animals do this….and we expect different from a spath or anyone from that matter.
If someone states they will be happy with $5.00…..nobody in their right mind is gonna offer $500.
These guys do what they do. Look for easy targets.
IT”S US that must walk above THEM!
This is why Sociopaths will never go away……there are TOO many of us out there to prey on.
Again, i’m glad your safe Lorna, you didn’t deserve to be victimized or steered in that direction, but we all are responsible for how we operate in life also…….and stay off CL!
This didn’t turn out delicate…..but I hope others gain a lesson here in my point!
ERIN
RIGHT sister! Boy, did I learn the hard way.
CL is another word for DANGER.
SK
I agree that online social websites provide a place for dysfunctional people of all types to thrive. Craigslist Killer?! There are certainly nice people there too, but I think there’s a high percentage of dysfunctional ones. I joined a dating website against my better judgement (besides the potential for creeps, it’s just not for me-not my style at all) at the urging of my therapist, who thought I needed to “get out there and date again” to help break the bondage to my ex. I went on two dates before cancelling the membership. I don’t want to kiss any frogs to get to the prince! If that means never finding the prince, so be it.
But while I was still a member, and communicating with a few of the guys that responded to my profile (you know, the one where you go through the whole matching process and then communication-supposed to get you matched to your perfect potential mate), there was a guy that seemed really nice for a while. According to him, he was a single dad who just adored his children and a successful business owner who just couldn’t meet anyone to due to living in a small, isolated town. He wanted to go out on a date, but we lived a couple of hours away from each other, had busy work schedules, were both single parents, etc. We hadn’t worked out the details yet. After a while, he started dropping bombshells on me and acting like he’d already told me: he was a former alcoholic, and he was still paying his ex’s bills because she was a ballet dancer and hurt herself and he’s such a great guy (that one was a ridiculous story with all kinds of details that didn’t add up). Anyway, each time he dropped one of these whoppers casually into the conversation, I said, “Wait, what? You never mentioned that before.” And he acted slightly offended while he tried to convince me that, yes, of course he’d told me from the beginning. Red flags were going up, and I got rid of him right away! He tried to keep contact as “friends” who could be supportive of each other as single parents. NOPE!
I’m not knocking anyone who wants to try online services or has been successful with them, but for me, I choose not to make myself available in an area where I know sociopaths and dysfunctionals lurk.