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By | November 23, 2008 208 Comments

LETTERS TO LOVEFRAUD: Pulled in by the child in the sociopath

By PressEject

It seems so odd. I wasn’t exactly in love with this person! But I was entirely caught up in his breath, his every sentence, his needs and desires. He charmed me into thinking it was so much more that we shared. I sensed early on he was not exactly mature in conducting a one-on-one relationship. But I assumed I could help guide him and show him how to trust and become closer. He came across as unique, at times humble and often very sweet to be with. I heard his “story” and understood how difficult it had been for him trying to feel close to others and I was honored he felt he could be close to me. The story, a true “pity ploy,” pulled me in. But I didn’t think twice. After all, didn’t I also share a similar story of having struggled to achieve deeper intimacy in my life? But the pace was quick, and it went from instant sexual attraction to having him call me almost every night. It felt wonderful but almost too good. Was I all of a sudden being looked after or being kept in a jar? Was I his focus of warm, kind attention or some kind of lab experiment, something he would slowly dissect each night, probing with questions, appearing to share a sincere interest in my life? At the time, I didn’t know to question this but instead sensed I had a man that truly thought so much of me. The compliments were lavish, his desire never hidden. I had a wealthy, accomplished, healthy, active and athletic man returning to me with an uncanny and precise regularity. I could almost sense when the phone would ring.

Six months have passed since I discovered the ugly truth to the type of love I thought I had in my life. That none of the words of love he had written on cards and in emails meant anything. That the desire for sexual passion was his highest state of consciousness, that all else was secondary, frail constructs made of echos he mimicked to sound like adult conversations, or even less substantial gestures used to form a connection based on reflecting my own personable warmth right back to me. Where was the love? Where was his piercing focus on me after he said “that was it, it’s over,” that he could not continue with me. As fast as the relationship had cemented together, it cracked apart!

Grieving, and confused

I had been idolized then tossed aside. From high in the sky with visions of perfect romantic sunsets to merely a shadow in a deep dark ditch where even the reflected glow of one last fading sunset could not reach. Something had died. I was grieving to be sure, but I was confused. The person I thought I knew wasn’t the person that left at the end. So even the death was beyond comprehension. To have this kind of trust shattered went beyond my understanding of the relationship, it pulled into question everything I had ever thought or done in my life, every action, every desire, and every hope I had ever felt was all suspect now. I didn’t know who I was anymore, my mind struggled to find something to hold onto that would be stabilizing and comforting. A friend helped me to get to church. I wept in front of friends, a priest and my even my understanding of God and His angels would also be clouded by tears.

Days went by, eventually months. I followed a rule of no contact even though at times my heart and mind demanded some kind of better explanation. I learned to let the feelings try to run through me. To let the memories play over and over if they needed to, each time running into the same dead end, deprived of justice or consolation. In support groups I went back into my childhood experiences of abuse. It took my mind off what had happened recently to me as an adult. I learned others shared similar stories, that we had at times bonded with those that would only perpetuate victimization in our adult lives as we had simply been blinded to how this all worked. The gift I was given this year was a raw new sensory awareness of how others are simply not able to love the way I had assumed everyone could. I have been left holding onto this gift, not quite sure how to use it as I still feel somewhat paralyzed from all that happened this year. But I know this is the gift I have been given, that the pain, like a birthing pain, was necessary to give me a new life.

Out of the dark ditch

In dedicating myself to recovery, I was aided greatly by much that makes up the site at Lovefraud.com. I benefited from so much that others have shared. I could start to see clearly again, and find a way out of that dark ditch. A new awareness came to me to understand that to eventually transcend the hurt, I might need to eventually think of others more than myself, but also to know I could find my own respect again for myself. Once I had reached for help and received a certain amount, I learned there were new ways to heal by sharing my own recovery with others. In this spirit, there are a few thoughts that came to me I wish to share and hope that somewhere out there, someone might read this and find some kind of benefit or comfort through this effort. Perhaps these observations will shed further light into the discussion we at Lovefraud are all a part of. In particular, I wish to share something that I have questioned for many months and now finally feel I have some better sense of, a deeper personal understanding of the reason why the pain seemed so great. I think it comes down to something very simple. (Please note, this may not apply to other peoples experiences but it seems to make sense of what I went through.)

Child in an adult body

It occurred to me, that being pulled in by a sociopath is similar to being pulled in by a charming child with needs that one would like to help. Yet we are deceived as this is a child in an adult body. In the early stages of the relationship, I received gifts from the S that seemed to come from genuine caring and adoration. Yet they were very impulsive purchases when I think back. In numerous accounts, a sociopath is described as having an underdeveloped or missing sense of empathy, and it only becomes fully realized when one is discarded abruptly. And therein lies the shock and the bewilderment. My feeling is that the S pulls us in by appealing to the child in each of us. That we too wish to be completely spontaneous and playful, like carefree children. To be free of adult responsibilities.

If we allow this fantasy to take root, we are then a captive to this, the way any addictive mind-altering drug might make us happy too. Those of us that suffered pain or abuse in our own childhoods, those of us with feelings and adult emotions will often carry some of that hurt with us over the years. Then, when we meet a childlike sociopath, seemingly free of worries and typical adult neuroses, we are able to “join in” and experience a type of childlike innocence (a trance that suspends reality) that never suspects abuse, has never felt abuse and carries no more scars of any of our abuse from the past. We are dangerously deceived in this way. We are liberated yet captive to the drug that deceives us this way.

When the drug wears off, when we are discarded, our nerve endings which only knew the childlike euphoria, along with a sexual high must then experience quite the opposite; abandonment, lost self esteem, and all the adult responsibilities we had been alleviated from temporarily. Imagine when a child is lost or left behind, that abandonment I feel is the same sad state we are in as we were simply caught up in playing a strange game with an even stranger “child” all along. We cry and hurt and feel it is unfair, and indeed it is. But we are caught by surprise, and it is this numbing and deceptive child-like trance that we are pulled into and have experienced over some time with our S that factors into how deep the hurt is when it finally arrives. It is like suffering a crash without a seat belt on. We are too innocent in our trance to think we ever needed a seat belt.

The healing process

I believe I return to the discussions here at Lovefraud because the pain I experienced was just so unusual. It is self-protective to try to understand what led us here and to hopefully prevent this from happening again. Sharing here a couple of months ago was helpful. I had struggled to make sense of it all, had put down my experience into words, and in the process, my pain was acknowledged and I felt less alone. Thank you Donna for including me. The healing process is not easy nor is it uncomplicated. I still feel some of the pain from this, but month after month, I walk with my head up a little higher. I still don’t have all the answers and am learning to accept we never will, but the healing this site alone has given me has been enormous. Hopefully the thoughts I am sharing here will be read as a part of my sincere gratitude. Thank you also for helping me to remember to use a seat belt! As always, I wish all good things for those that read and share in the site, that we each find the gift of deeper understanding and, in turn, peace from this understanding along with a new found grace in how we apply this into our lives each day.


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blondie

this might be off subject, but im wondering do any of you ever just sit back and reflect? when i read books about sociopaths or read this site, i sit back and reflect what events happen that were like others, or things he did that was so wrong. is this part of healing? i dont obsess about anything just sit back and think of what i went though and the sociopath he is. do you ever get tired of reading books about personality disorders and protecting yourself?

something came to me the other night. when all the lies finally came out about my x, i realize that the truth came to me. everything that happen that day and in the weeks before i left. everything happened for a reason. the truth was staring at me right in my face and i couldt run anymore from it. it was god sending me more signals to run get away, this man is not right for you. it was like god was giving me another chance to get away. stop making excuses for him anymore. i had to face it and i did. looking back even though that day was painful and embarssing it was my wake up call and im in a better place in my life.

Ox Drover

Dear Presseject,

Thank you for this wonderful post. Today has been a tough day for me, only the second “tough day” in quite some time (several months.)

Son C went over to my mother’s house to let her know he had moved back home to the farm, and was staying here with me. He found, lying on her table, a lettter from my P-son acknowledging that she had been in communication with him, and had been lying to my son C about having sent money to P-son. He probably shouldn’t have done it, but C slipped the letter into his pocket and brought it back to my house and I read it.

I knew better, but I read it any way. I got “back door contact” even though my mother doesn’t know that son C and I know she is lying to us, and sending money to my P-son, money that can and will be used to target us.

I want so badly to go over and get up in her face and tell her I KNOW SHE IS LYING. I know I have done enough damage to myself today by just reading the letter in the first place, but I still have that overpowering desire to spit in her face for the devaluation she has done not only to me but to son C. She has traded us BOTH for the lying, manuvering, murdering psychopathic piece of garbage. Yes, I am angry, and yes, I have more work to do, this is twice in as many months that I have had “back door” contact that has PISSED ME OFF. The only justification for today’s breech of TOTAL NC is that if my P-son has money, it makes my life physically more in danger, and less safe. At least there is NO wondering if she is sending him money, there is KNOWLEDGE. “The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off.”

Wini

Blondie: I it back and reflect, but not because of them. I already knew all about the likes of anti-socials for years … because I worked with an entire building full of them. Oh, they were exhausting to say the least.

You are right about reading the books about them. The books are good to read to get an understanding about what you are dealing with … because they are such a big part of society today. Dwelling on them or the books is not positive towards our healing … it is, but it isn’t. It is for the fact that it explains the truth, it isn’t because you are still focusing on the evil, so you are stuck in mid air … put the book down eventually … and go and live your life. Run into another one, pick the books up again as a refresher course.

Peace.

bird

my mom told me a true story when I was 20 years old of her friend who had been in love. She was in love with a man, who had lost interest in her and went with another women. For years my moms friend was heartbroken and jealous of this other women. The man and the other women eventually married and had children together. Then the day came when my moms friend got the news that he had killed his entire family. The other women and their children were deceased. My moms friend was shocked and of course thanked her lucky stars that she had been discarded. It’s always a blessing to be discarded. A guardian angel protecting us.

OxD-I am sorry! Don’t be hard on yourself. Take care of yourself. You deserve it! Of course she is lying, you just proved to yourself what you already knew. Take care

Wini

bird: Great story and the right place to post it … on this blogg.

That’s it in a nutshell … having or learning to have patience to be able to go quiet, sit back and wait … on God’s time frame, not ours to see the bigger picture to any situation. Working through our own ego gratification for not having the patience required at the time … then acquiring patience to find the faith in God to just let go … for reasons that we do not know in the present but will see more of the explanation as the future comes to unfold.

Peace.

Ox Drover

Dear Bird,

Yes, of course “this, too, shall pass!” and I know it. I just shouldn’t have even read the letter. It wasn’t like I didn’t know she was lying. My son C had already decided she was lying by the way she answered his questions when he asked her, this was just “frosting on the cake” so to speak, prooof of what he already knew. The same with me too, but none-the-less, it did piss me off and though I didn’t contact her, and knew I should not do so, I WANTED to so badly, and part of me still does, just to verbally “spit in her face” but I know that is not the right attitude or behavior, so I will work on myself and get my “head right” about this.

I knew my mother didn’t care diddly about me and I could not get her to quit “feeding” the monster, but I had hoped (unrealistically it seems) that she cared enough about my son C that she would not risk losing him in order to support the P-son.

Son C’s attitude about it all is much better than mine…he stayed about 30 minutes with her today, then left, without mentioning that he had seen the letter or that he knew for a fact that she was a liar. He said it wasn’t even worth arguing with her about. He is done with her.

As far as “counting your blessings” I know that my blessings are manifold. Having my sons C and D here with me, and the three of us totally on the same page, and to hear them in the dining room with their friends, playing board games like children and laughing like they used to when they were kids, and then seeing them get up and work together on the farm, planning their days and priorities, and still laughing and teasing each other as they work is the biggest blessing of all.

hens

Presseject – Great post – thanks for sharing. I relate so well. For some reason I feel like I am more (in love) with him now than when he was here – when he was hear I always felt that something, that was not clear – not right – and questioned every thing he did. The time he was here was spent in thought’s of (will this ever end) will he ever leave me. Yes he did and I went somewhere I wasnt prepared for – but – it is that life lesson we need – so we don’t continue these same futile pattern’s. And it is not him I feel more in love with it is me I am loving more. He only reflected the love I am capable of. I am only responsible for my happiness – I cant make anyone happy and complete – and no one can do that for me. So as I heal from a life of setting myself up for pain and disapointment I am seeing the truth as painful as it is – I have to take control of me – and set boundaries – and stop rescueing those that have no hope of feeling love – for they will wander through life on survival mode oblivious to the love that stand’s right before them….he yearn’s for love but can never know it – never feel it ….

Wini

Oxy: Anyone living in their egos is like a kid in a candy store … try and tell a kid who is consuming all the candy that they can shove in their mouths to not swallow the candy.

Puuuuuuuulllllllllllllleaaaaseeeeeeeeeee. It’s not going to happen.

Selfish is as selfish does.

Only when a kid gets sick of the candy do they stop shoving in their mouths. They had to learn what it felt to get sick and go through that sick feeling to learn how to stop. That’s the same theory wisdom teaches you when you take a righteous path. It’s what we learned taking righteous paths that allowed us to have breaks …

The more you read the Bible, the more you see how clever God is and how he built into us (all of us) … that if we stay humble and follow righteous paths the way he wants us to live … certain things happen to us. If not, let your ego take off and certain things won’t happen to you …. he just allows those living in their egos to keep spinning their wheels.

blondie

just cant believe how fake it was you know? its amazing how they just pretend.

Stargazer

OxD, I’m sorry for this setback, but glad that your son is now initiating NC from your mother. I wish for you peace again. It is a reminder of just how destructive they can be, even by proxy.

I thank my lucky stars that I broke away from the psychopath (or whatever his exact label is) in my life after a very short time. Still, I don’t dare call the army to find out what happened to him. I don’t dare check the other reptile sites to see if he still posts there. I know I am still very fragile with regards to him, and I may always be.

hens

blondie – I wonder if they know they are fake and pretending or is it just such a normal way of life for them that they just race through life not knowing the devastation they cause? How can they care if they don’t feel it? if they don’t have a conscience or remorse or empathy – then they are not fake – they are not pretending – they are just doing what they do – and we got burned and they will never know or care about the pain they left behind – that is why it is so important for us too never get in the grip of another one…

hens

Blondie – I think all we can do is just let go – learn from this – we will never comprehend what motivates them. We will never know or understand them. What they do is not rational – it makes no sense too us anyway we look at it – as hard as we try to sort this out I don’t think we ever will. Hopefully somebody good will come into our lives SOON too help us FORGET the pain. I dont think he is worth all this grief and anguish, but learning about me and avoiding them in the future makes it all worth it – when somebody destroys us the way they did – something has to be learned from it – just thank goodness we are past the possibility of ever taking them back – you are past that aren’t you?

Ox Drover

Dear Star,

BOINK! BOINK! that’s the sound of me hitting myself firmly on the head with the BIG skillet for reading that darned letter! I knew better but I was curious and you know, “Curosity killed the cat”–I wish I had been a bit wiser in that, but maybe I have learned a lesson from this. DIFFERENT DAY, SAME CHIT.

You know, she has read the derogatory remarks he made in his letters about her when he and the Trojan Horse were plotting, and he was telling the Trojan Horse how to “manage grandma” and I saw her eyes spit fire when she read those passages in his letters, and how she commented tht the letters he wrote her (which were filled with Bible quotes and platitudes) were so different from the letters he wrote the Trojan Horse P, (which were filled with the F-word and every kind of jail house cant you can imagine.)

Yet, she is back in the FOG again. All I can do is to get my act back together and get back to the best revenge–LIVING WELL.

Letgoletgod

Ox…
Thanks for your response to my other post BTW!~ (I lost a fantasy, he lost a nifty person 🙂
As for your mother ‘caring enough’ about your son not to lose him…you KNOW she is INCAPABLE of caring. It just goes to show that these monsters will use anyone as objects. (We) are USED, we are not appreciated or cared about.
Ya know what, :), next time, just don’t (read it). You have proven a valuable lesson that even one ounce of contact in ANY WAY, SHAPE or FORM, will hurt us. But you have proven how strong you are and have been, you are very admirable with every word you share with us, so my advice to you personally, would be to just brush it off. Don’t let the anger build up in you anymore for her or him. Move past it without another glance. You can do it, I have faith in you 🙂

Stargazer

OxD,
I was thinking more along the lines of sending you a giant HUG for being human. Sometimes when the information is that easy, it’s like a train wreck, isn’t it? You just can’t help but look. That is why I’m resisting the urge to call the army and ask what happened to my ex. If I hear that he’s alive and well and living off a nice pension from them because they were too cowardly to prosecute him, I’ll be very angry. And the next thing, I’ll be checking out the other reptile site to see him gleefully blogging away with all my internet friends. YUCK!!! I don’t want to see it.

Whatever seedy deals are happening with your mother and P son, I have faith that you will be okay and can protect yourself and your other two sons. Those P’s are clever and manipulative, but they are not invincible.

I have to admit, when I first saw the BOINKs in your post, my first thought was….”Uh oh, what’d I do???” LOL

onajourney

Press eject:
Thanks for your story. It helps me in my situation. My daughter is with a s and has no contact with her family and I often wonder how this could happen?

Your mention of childlike/trance/suspending reality helps me understand it from your point of view. Two of my friends, that know part of my story have commented to me, “she must be on drugs”. They know what she used to be like and don’t understand at all how she could change so much. I don’t think she is on (literal) drugs, but it could be a drug like/ trance state that she is still under.

What about your thinking while you were in this childlike/not reality state. Did the s influence your thinking then to be negative or against people/organizations/etc. and now you can’t believe the s influence could change you so dramatically?

Going along with the “smear campaign” and targeting others is part of what I am talking about. The s twists words and situations and leaves out important facts to make things sound totally different than they actually are. Does anyone remember having any experiences where you had two senses of reality at the same time? You knew you were saying something to please the s, but that might not be true?

My daughter used to be very positive, not complaining, etc. It seems hard to believe she could be sucked in to so dramatically change her perspective on the world/people/her convictions. It is hard to comprehend that a s has such “power”/charisma/charm over another person.

presseject

onajourney, yes! I think the “trance state” for a sociopath can, just like any addictive drug, take the person away from healthy relationships, family, etc! That is what happened to me. It wasn’t the S doing a smear campaign though, not at all. The S just simply hooked me in (targeted me) and all else became secondary. The over-valuation at the beginning (the literal opposite of the “D&D” – devalue and discard at the end of the relationship) is very seductive!!! When people take mind altering drugs, they (to use an appropriate 60’s reference) “tune out” by letting the drug take over and nothing else has much importance including their own safety. If your daughter is with an S, it is possible this is happening. She is taken in by the targeting adoration and possible child-like spontaneity that seems very appealing at first. I certainly was. But I am only speaking for myself. I have read may instances where the S or more likely a P (Psychopath – which I tend to think are characterized by more devious and plotting behavior) actually do what you are mentioning, using gaslighting or smear campaigns to keep their prey to themselves or under their control for their own selfish purposes. I don’t think this is too hard to comprehend though. After all, even when two Non-S or Non-P persons start dating or fall in love, one or both might take on some new personality traits or interests or dislikes from the other partner. This normal mirroring can occur as part of the bonding and finding a familiar ground to share. The S also uses this technique since they have no deeper emotions on which to draw, are NOT creative and know it gets them something they want (sex) but after a while it wears thin. They know they have little else to work with and then start becoming frustrated and then the devalue part kicks in and finally their true nature is revealed. I am not sure how one might rescue someone from this ultimate hurt, someone such as your daughter. I was too convinced by the S that we could somehow make it all work… until the final moments when he let the mask slip….

Wini

onajourney: For me, I believed everything my EX said to me, thinking he said or did anything for the benefit of both of us. I was reflecting myself and my parents and family in our relationship, giving him respect before he ever earned it … Your daughter is probably doing the same … believing what he says is the truth …not knowing that he has an ulterior motive behind anything he says or does with her. If she received trust from you (her parents) she is projecting that same trust that she knows onto her husband. It’s really simple if you see it in these terms.

Just be there for her when he wants to move on and her bubble bursts … she will definitely need you and please, please don’t say anything like “I told you so, you should have listened” … it’s awful when the bubble burst right in your face and space and she will be up-heaved in all areas of her life until her mind grasps any of what happened.

Just be patient and listen. Funny, my mom knew what my EX was like the first night she met him. It was 2 days before my birthday and she asked me right in front of him to stop by the following night after I got out of work. I did … then she followed up with writing a note to me of the same thing in my birthday card (obviously she mailed it to me before I stopped over the following evening). It was the last birthday card I would ever receive from my mom, for she died later on in the beginning of the summer.

Peace. I keep that birthday card in a frame on my mantle over the fireplace. I wished I had listened to her wisdom.

onajourney

Press eject:

I just think it is wonderful you are “out” and free. That is what my overwhelming feeling is as I read the posts on this blog.

I don’t really know alot of your story. How did the mask slip? How did the beginning of the end come? Was it super, super fast just like the beginning of the relationship? Did you notice any warnings? Was there devalue, before you recognized it, now that you are looking back?

Wini: That was interesting about trust. Yes, she totally trusted in our family and friends as she was growing up. Now, I am wondering if she was in too much of a good, trusting, supportive environment? Now, I wish I would have talked with her about NOT trusting.

I never told her he was “bad”. I tried to be very supportive of her choice. In fact, many of her friends and relatives came forward over the last year and expressed reasons they didn’t like the s. I constantly found myself “sticking up” for him to other people, because I trusted my daughter and I didn’t know why others didn’t trust her judgement. At the time, I didn’t understand the kind of state she was already in.

The first time I met the s, I didn’t think he had any chance with my daughter. I was very surprised she let him into her life.

It wasn’t until after they married that, the s told us we could not have contact with our daughter and any communications had to go though him. The first thing then, I thought was, wow, he’s CONTROLLING!!!

So thanks for the reminders and all your experiences. It is all very helpful and healing for me.

Wini

onajourney: I don’t know how you can contact her to warn her if he’s watching every move she makes. And, they do hover over you … except she, if he doesn’t anything like my EX did to me, will not be aware that anyone could do this to another person. I never witnessed my EX doing this to me … but he did, as I realized and saw the unpaid bills he left behind that he hid from me and never mentioned, lies that he verbally told me versus the truth, statements or any written material that came into our home addressed to me, that not only did I ever see them when they first arrived, I never knew they existed until I saw them with my own eyes years after the fact of the post dates. Sme thing goes with phone calls left on answering machines … they conveniently erase what they don’t want us to hear … so we have no clue to who has called our home while we aren’t personally there to answer the phones. They are very very clever individuals and can twist anything they want to so they come out smelling like roses. My EX actually got my bank ID to sign in on the computer to access my account. After he signed up on his computer, he left me the paperwork. I tried and tried to sign on and it never worked. I even wrote the bank and told them that their instructions didn’t work on my computer. I had computer analysts writing me back walking me through other instructions. In hindsight, I realized that the reason I couldn’t access my account was that he installed my account with his password on his own computer and could see everything going on in my bank account. Because I was so destroyed over what my bosses did … I never really looked at my bank statements over the years, so I had no idea that he was stealing money out of my bank account … $100s of dollars at a time, several days per week. It made my head spin in November, December of 2006, and the beginning of 2007 to see what he did to my bank account back in 2004. I think that’s why they add so much added stress in your life … because you can only handle so much … and other normal routines have to go to the way side so that you can deal and handle the stress they dump in your life and still hold up without collapsing. I know my family and friends all wonder why I didn’t handle normal routines when I dealt with my managers harassment for 6 years. All those 6 years too, I never checked my bank account thoroughly like I normally did. I couldn’t. Too much added stress … I had to let others things go to be able to handle what my bosses dished out. I would come home each and every day exhausted over being in there 8 hours a day … and all along my fiance smiled to my face, pretended to be there for me … and clocked me every step of the way. By the time I found out, not only was I broke, he ensured all the deadlines for suing was over and done with. He played me right up to the mark of when I could have sued to get my house back … so didn’t the attorney down in GA … he kept his mouth shut too … as did my bosses and their cronies … all doing me under, and by the time I figured it all out, deadlines were passed. That’s why I know my EX purposely left the paperwork behind. It’s his last smirk in my face without him being here.

Plus, there are conversations he will have with people in your daughters life … and deny, deny, deny knowing anything they should complain to your daughter about, chalking it up to her friends or family are jealous over how great his relationship is with your daughter … how they never had a man in their lives and they are jealous of her … anything that will make sense to your daughter … he will use. They are NOT stupid people, actually, they are pretty ingenious in the manipulation department. Now, if they could only bottle this genius and use it to good use instead of evil use … they’d have something substantial to offer society.

Peace. Just pray to God for your daughter … that’s all you can do … and secretly, without him knowing or her knowing … keep an eye on her from a distance. Actually, you should incorporate all her friends on knowing this and keeping an eye on her too …just swear them all to secrecy, that no matter what they don’t breath a word to her that they know what’s going on. Everyone has to act stupid. I know this for a fact … one of my best friends has been married to her HS sweetheart that is a Narcissist. I’ve always voiced my opinion about him and their relationship to his face. I made no bones about telling him what a selfish, jerk he was and how he used my friend (his girlfriend then his wife). Well, you guessed it, I was the first friend he ensured got booted out of her life. She chalked it up that she had children now and had nothing in common with me, that I was single again after my divorce. And beside Wini, you make single life look so easy, and if our husbands knew it was just as easy to live without as it is to live with us … well, you know, we don’t need you putting ideas in their heads and looking all happy now that your single again … Yadda, yadda, yadda.

Good luck.

quest

I don’t believe in God , but I sure as hell know where the devil is hiding

I am a psychopath victim who has been separated from my female psychopath for 7 months . I dated this woman for 1 year and then moved in with her . I lasted 6 months before I realised that if I did not leave I would be emotionally destroyed . Having left it did not take long for me to realise that the damage was already done and since that time I have been on a quest to not only understand what this woman had done to me but also figure out how she had done it . I have also been trying to understand the essence of the psychopath in order that I do not fall into the same trap again . I will not go into all the details of our relationship at this point as it sounds much the same as many other relationships that I have read and heard about . In the past 7 months I have read about 15 books on the subject , some by victims and some by so called PHD experts on the field . I suppose that one conclusion that I have come to ,is that the medical experts would perhaps be better off studying the victims rather than the psychopaths themselves . I feel that it is us victims that are the experts on psychopaths rather than the doctors that study them from their somewhat outside the situation environment , similar perhaps to studying an animal at the zoo behind the bars of a cage .
As a consequence of my time with this woman I have acquired what can only be described as a 6th sense . That being my ability to spot psychopaths relatively quickly . Having said that I do not believe that I am infallible as some psychopaths are definitely more cunning at hiding their true selves than others and I believe it is easier for me to spot a female one than a male one , although that to seems to be changing as well as time progresses .
I have a couple of theories about psychopaths that I feel may be worth considering and would appreciate any feed back as I am convinced that the more people that are thinking and analysing the whole psychopath dilemma the sooner the world will come up with a answer as to what to do with the problem . In this case knowledge and awareness is power . When I say power , I mean the power to overcome the ignorance of the masses to the whole psychopath problem , which I believe is a far greater problem to humanity than say global warming or global economic depression .
My first theory is that psychopaths are not really male or female , however they are experts at playing the part of which ever body they happen to find themselves in . The fact that psychopaths have elevated testosterone levels may merely be a side issue .
I base this theory , as unscientific as it may sound , on an incident I experienced in a local bar .
What happened was this . I entered the bar , one of the more seedy in town , and bought a beer and sat at a vacant table . I observed the surroundings and the people . Needless to say it was a creepy bunch . It was about 10.30 at night and there were about 40 people in the bar . As I gazed about wondering at the wisdom of being in such a place , I noticed a woman at one table talking with a group of people and was immediately suspicious that she was a psychopath . I was sitting to the right of their table , about 20 feet away , and was somewhat stunned when she turned and looked directly at me , as if she had some 6th sense that I was observing . At this point I was convinced I was dealing with a psychopath as the look she gave me could only be described as predatory . I decided at this point that I should test my intuition. I took my beer and headed over to the crowded table . Everyone there had definitely been drinking for quite some time so it was relatively easy to join in the conversation . The psychopath was immediately on guard . Well , feeling somewhat confident I asked her if she was a psychopath . Well as soon as she opened her mouth I realised that this was not a woman at all but a transvestite and she admitted as such . My immediate thought was , well don’t this just mix up the pot a bit . Was this a psychopath masquerading as a transvestite , or are all transvestites psychopaths or was there something else going on that I had not read about in the books . By now my curiosity was definitely stirred . The transvestite also had a woman with her that was apparently her partner , lover , who knows . We discussed the whole psychopath subject for quite some time . Initially they said they did not know what a psychopath was . After giving as detailed a description as I could, of what a psychopath was the transvestite said “ I think I was one once , but not any more “. As the evening progressed I became amazed at the chameleon like abilities of the transvestite . He would talk to me as a woman but talk to the women at the table as a man . He seemed totally at ease switching from female mode to male mode . Bizzarist thing I had ever seen . At some point I realised that his female companion was also a psychopath . The whole situation was becoming more complicated by the minute . As the evening progressed I became aware that the transvestite was directing all his attention at me . He then proceeded with manipulation and head games that were all to familiar to me , having experienced it before from my X . At this point things really turned weird as the way he spoke reminded me of my X and the way she spoke . I now realised that I was psychopath prey and the 2 of them seemed to think they could charm me . I realised It was time to flee . Who knows what their plan was . I suspected they were at least going to rob me . I headed for the toilet and slipped out the back door into the night .
This encounter with the transvestite and his ability to change from male mode to female mode mid sentence made me think about my relationship with my X . At the beginning of our relationship the sex was out of this world . From the day I moved in until the day I left that wonderfull sex life went down hill so fast it was unfathomable . In the end , 6 months later, it was hard to imagine we had ever had a good sex life .
On to another theory . It seems to me that when psychopaths are talking the whole weaving in and out nature of the conversation is actually done on purpose to confuse the victim rather than something that the psychopath has no control over . I believe this whole manoeuvre is an attempt to shut down the logical mind of the victim and perhaps gain access to the subconscious . Whether the psychopath realises the mechanism or not I don’t know , but they sure as hell seem to know how to do it Some times when me and my X got into one of our many arguments , by the time the argument was over I did not even know what we were arguing about . Her ability to befuddle my mind was uncanny . Of course at the time I was hardly aware of what was going on . It is only now when I think back that I realise what was going on .
So I guess the question is , what do psychopaths do to other people’s minds and how . I find it hard to believe that a psychologist who has never been manipulated to the extent that a victim has , while in a relationship with a psychopath , can understand what it is really like .
One other thing I noticed is that when my X would talk and believe me ,it was basically all the time , she seemed to be talking at me rather than too me . We would start off having a discussion that would turn into an argument and at some point I would basically shut off as she rambled on . I think it was at these times that she gained access to my subconscious . I remember on a number of occasions she would say something totally off topic to see if I was still listening . Was she really testing to see if I was still listening or was she testing to see if I had shut down , and was this her cue to add tidbits of manipulation to my subconscious . I know this sounds crazy but there was something going on that I seemed to be not aware of .
As the months have gone by it would seem to me that there are more psychopathic women than might be realised . I have certainly met at least 10 in the last 7 months . I have also met women who I am sure were not psychopaths as well , if one was wondering if perhaps I thought all women were psychopaths , as I am sure they are not .I suspect that female psychopaths are less likely too end up in jail like so many of the male ones . This statement would seem to contradict my first theory about psychopaths being neither male or female in some sense . What I suspect is that in a male body the psychopath knows that he is physically superior to his female victims and as such is more likely to use violence . The female psychopath would find that using violence would not work against the average man so they have to be more cunning . They tend to attack the mind instead , which is not a criminal offense .

Indigoblue

I dont believe in the wind or the rain or that the Earth is round or stars are real or Penutbutter or puppies or Roses!

I do Know what a Fireant is ,so there put that in your Book! LOVE JJ

keeping_faith

press eject,

Like probably so many others, I could have written this article too. Thanks for doing so. It feels like it came right from my heart onto these pages.

It seems to me that what is most difficult to understand is the love we shared with these sociopaths was one sided yet it felt like the kind of mutual love we hope for our entire lives. They want us to believe that and maybe they believe it themselves for a very short time…… until their arrogance gets in the way of human imperfection and their disordered ideas. Then we become the victim of their abuse, projection, discard and lack of ethics and moral fortitude.

It’s hard to believe that an individual can abuse and discard so easily when that love was so perfect (from their own mouths). Makes no sense to otherwise emotionally healthy individuals. But we leave because we are smart enough to realize (as you were early on) that this would have meant our ultimate destruction. It was killing me. I couldn’t focus at work. I was depressed. It was making me crazy….. and then I learned what I may not have otherwise understood if I did not have first hand knowledge.

Thanks for the post. I’m sorry this has happened to you. I can relate so clearly.

As far as the ambiguity of sexuality- I agree. ON Lovefraud there’s the a blog on the “sexuality” of psychopaths- I believe it is stated that they are neither gay nor straight, and not even bi, but rather opportunists.

I believe this wholeheartedly based on the two psychos I know well.

And as far as playing “male or female” sure they play all sorts of games, why not mess with gender? It’s all games.

Yes, just dildos we are. : )

Oh, I am going to be ill.

Wini-
What’s Lowen’s book?

Wini

holywatersalt: I tend to believe what Lowen (since he is a proclaimed Narcissists) wrote about sex and the narcissist …that we (the partner) are an extension of the masturbation process … variety of sorts for them. Hence, why the numerous partners going on concurrently.

That made total sense to me, since their is no remorse when leaving or staying with the main partner (place of dwelling location is what I consider the main partner).

Peace.

Wini

holywatersalt: Alexander Lowen is the doctor who wrote the book “Narcissism, Denial of the True Self”. He’s a self proclaimed Narcissist. I forgot if he’s an MD or Ph.D. Has a practice as an analyst. He wrote about the condition and gives about 7-9 examples of his actual patients to back up his conclusion of what the narcissistic condition is all about.

At the end of the book he summarizes something like …A life devoid of emotion is beyond your imagination. To my mind, this meant every second of every minute of every hour of every day is the same thing over and over and over … year after year after year. No highs, no lows, no waffling, nothing … NODDA … the dead zone … living, walking, talking zombies … the living dead …the lives in the abyss.

Hey, maybe they are HELL and we realize this. Maybe that’s their damnation to go through life like this,

Who knows?

Peace.

Stargazer

Wow! I am going to have to go back and read some of the previous posts since I saw Alexander Lowen’s name. I was reading his book (Bioenergetics) when I found this site. It’s a fascinating book, especially if you are interested in psychology from an energy perspective, as I am. He is the one who feels that psychopaths have a particular form of energetic blockage that can be released. After reading other literature, I tend to disagree with him, and don’t think he ever worked with a true psychopath. I have not read his other works, nor did I realize he considers himself a narcissist. But keep in mind that from his perspective, EVERYONE has some body armoring to some degree. He believes we all have some characteristics of either narcissism, masochism, psychopathology, shizoid personality, or rigidity. Or we have a combination. He believes (and I tend to agree) that it’s absolutely impossible to remain completely free of body (and psychological) armoring in our current society.

I know I have seen narcissistic/borderline characteristics in myself, and I believe they are prevalent to some extent in many people when they dig deep into their psyche. I feel that this is the reason so many people are fascinated by psychopaths, because deep down many people have some little part that wonders what it would be like totally ignore the rules of society and just please ourselves. Obviously, there would be more criminal behavior if there were no consequences.

keeping_faith

But for some, there are no consequences for lying, being fraudulent, cheating and hurting people emotionally, career wise, or psychologically unless money is missing or someone gets hurt…..

That’s the problem. That’s what frustrates me. The XP I was with keeps telling the same lies over and over. Life for him stays exactly the same. How does it end for them unless they do something illegal and get caught?

janetf

Literally Sleeping With Mr. Wrong

There he was stunning and charming as ever. He swept me off my feet upon our first meeting. It was on the line of a New York City cruise where we first laid eyes on each other. He had all white on and was very neat. He had a bald head and a goatee. He smiled a lot and had very intelligent conversations. He told me that he had written a book and that he was in law enforcement. He had been working for Sing Sing Prison as a Corrections Officer (at least that is what he said). He also told me that he had three beautiful daughters.

We started dating slowly but continuously. First there were flowers, cards and then the chocolates. We dined at very nice restaurants in Brooklyn (where he was from). This man knew how to treat a woman. I felt special because I was treated like a queen from a handsome, smart and professional man.

We started to get in a serious relationship. He asked for my hand in marriage. I was so happy that with all the bad happening in my life that I had someone good who was by my side. We got pregnant and we were excited. We decided to combine our lives and children and get a new home to support our upcoming union.

Well we found a beautiful condominium that was perfect for us. Mr. Wrong asked my mom for my hand in marriage and my mom happily told him yes.

We moved in together and things were fine for the first four months. He went to all prenatal visits with me and still paid a lot of attention to me. It was great, so I thought.

Tragedy struck

I had four children of my own. Life was routine up until one day I had a family tragedy. One of my children did the unthinkable, took the life of their partner. The charge was manslaughter. I felt like my life was in a world wind. I was about to lose my child to the system and I lost their partner to death. Could life have gotten any worse? Well that wonderful man who was in law enforcement came to my rescue. He came with me to court, jail to visit my child and even helped in choosing a lawyer for my case. He was my media spokesperson. I was indebted to this person. There was nothing I wouldn’t do for him. I was now vulnerable.

I was in the media a lot because of my child and circumstances surrounding the case. I started getting threatening phone calls from people I didn’t know. How did they get my number? To make a long story short I received a phone call from someone I didn’t know. They were asking me to come to a hotel room; they claimed to be an attorney and said they could help my child. I immediately told Mr. Wrong what happened and he asked me to find out the information of the hotel room and such from the caller. I gave it to him. Well, Mr. Wrong claims he went there in stead of me and he told a chilling story to me that included kidnapping and murder. He claims that in order to protect me and him he would not give me specifics on who these people were or where the bodies were to be hidden. I wanted to go to law enforcement but with what evidence. Was this even true? They would laugh me right out of the police station.

Blessing & Curse

As you would expect the fun didn’t last long. I had spent all my savings on our condo. I was pregnant and I found out that Mr. Wrong had two more children whom he didn’t have anything to do with, four girlfriends and a mentally ill mother in which he collected her social security benefits for himself. He fathered 5 children 3 of which were 2 years old. When I asked him why he didn’t tell me about them he said because it was before me and none of my business. I soon found out that he had four residences prior to living with me in one year.

I was 7 months pregnant and Mr. Wrong left me. No explanations just left. My son is 2 months now and I have not seen Mr. Wrong. I went to court to seek child support and was told that if I can not get him served (process service) that they would have to dismiss my case. I eventually found out that Mr. Wrong left and ended up living with a woman (supposed wife of 15 years) and took his two daughters who he told me about in the beginning there to live with him. These were not her children and to top it off she introduced herself to his daughters as there step mom of 15 years. His daughters knew me because they lived with us in the condo for 6 months. To get them to dislike me, he told them that I killed there hamster and stole money out of their room. Now technically he has 6 children by 5 different women but only cares for 2. Not surprisingly he receives social security benefits for those two daughters. They are an additional source of income for him.

My blessing was giving birth to a 7lb 9oz beautiful baby boy and the curse was having a sociopath as a father.

Please visit me at my personal website: http://www.whenyoucryicry.com

blondie

YES HENRY!!! 100% never going back to my x. nothing will ever change my mind about that one. ive really come to understand this game they play and understanding the no contact. if you understand what they are doing or why, its much easier. for me i can predict his behavior. he may still try to call but i dont pick up …one day he will give up trying to reach me.

my one question that i dont get yet is, doest my ex get that i know what he is up to? doest he see that i know his game and i found out he is a liar? its like they still think and act like we have no clue.

Ox Drover

Dear Janet f,

Quite frankly, if he will stay out of your life and the life of your child, the price of no child support is I think, well worth it.

I suggest that you visit Dr. Leedom’s blog site about “Parenting the At-risk child.” She too is raising the child of a psychopath and doing her best with parenting to overcome the genetic tendency (if any) for that child to grow up to be disordered. Good luck and God bless you and your child. A good and final discard is a blessing for you and your son.

Tood

Hello all,

Excellent letter, press. I think you are onto something–they do tap into our “child minds.” The total abandon, freedom and happiness we feel when in the first stages is very much like a trance state.

I was just thinking the other day about the initial stages with mine. Besides giving me the validation and the praise I had never gotten as a child, he gave me another very important thing I had never gotten before–permission.

Permission to have fun, permission to feel good, permission to enjoy myself without guilt. I fell backward into that pool of permission, never dreaming that it had such a dangerous undertow.

This is the way they live every day–they give themselves permission to do anything they want, anytime they want. Because we are fairly normal, we know that feeling of permission cannot be constant, and we accept that we must return to the world of adult responsibilities after our little interludes in Permission Land. They never even enter into the adult world, much less acknowledge that we are correct to return to it. In fact, the opposite. When we return to our adult responsibilities, they see us only as “no fun,” and they give themselves permission to do whatever it takes to get themselves back into a “fun” state. That might mean taking all our money. That might mean molesting a child. That might mean having an affair, or robbing a store, or stealing a car. Whatever gives them a thrill.

And Wini, upon your recommendation I read the Eckhart Tolle book “A New Earth.” Much of what he says makes sense, but be forewarned: Tolle says almost to the letter what my New Age culty friend said many, many years ago.

Oxy, sorry about your recent upset. It is so hard to make a clean break with a family member. Almost impossible. I hope you continue to do what makes you stronger and more centered, and I hope you can leave all their game playing to them. Remember, P-free is the way to be!

Does it make you feel better to know that others know and understand what it is like to have a mother like that? I truly do understand, and I am sorry that you are made to reexperience the pain.

Now I have a question for the board: What are we, post-P? I really don’t think there is a classification for us, and sometimes I find it distressing.

I mean, I can accept that I was immature to have craved a parent-like figure. I can accept even the co-dependent label.(I just resent being equated with them, as if all disorder is the same. It’s not. They are on a different plane of disorder; they are monsters.)

I can accept all the character flaws and deficiencies that led me to be susceptible to an S/P. I can and I have worked on what I have been able to see in myself. It’s a process and I still have far to go. I guess until the day I die, I’ll still be trying to be a better person.

But this experience–no, correct that–this lifetime has given me so many shocks, over and over and over again. So many opportunities to learn about the human condition, and try to rise above my own flawed nature…those of us who have survived one or more of these monsters have this sense about us. I wonder how others “get along” in the world now.

Because I was forced by circumstance to become an “expert” on psychopathy, sociopathy, narcissism, what-have-you, I now find myself much more detached than I once was. Able to see through the many layers of bullcrap that are the P’s stock-in-trade. Able to see the masks that are part of the everyday personalities of so many other, non-pathological, people. I can see the phoniness and machinations where I couldn’t before, when I was a trusting, immature, every-cloud-has-a-silver-lining sort of person.

So what am I now? What are we now? We’re not the dependent Pollyannas we once were. And, even though we have been forced to create this detachment in ourselves, we are still not like the psychos that we escaped. We all have moral codes, consciences, empathy. We don’t seek to harm others. But we can see the world the way they do, in a sense.

It’s like that old story we read in high school: The Man Without a Country. That’s the way I feel. I can’t go backwards and be the person I once was, and yet I fear that the new version of me is too detached to ever love again. Like before. Certainly I’ll never trust that way again. Is it even possible to trust, post-P?

Does anybody have a term for us, a category? With naming comes power, and I wish I knew what to name us, besides survivors.

quest

I think we should be called psychopath slayers . half the battle of slaying a psychopath is being aware of them , the next part is a little more tricky . When i say slay I mean reveal them to the world and expose them for what they are . The next step is to destroy their ego and along with it the essence of there evilness . Take a lesson from hellboy 2 . Hellboy is a reformed psychopath . The rest of the wierd creatures are all psychopaths . There is a scene where the mist guy that has a space suit looking outfit on says to hellboy he will take him down . Hellboy thinks he is joking and suggests he try . The mist guy then starts to criticise hellboy . Hell boy immediately looses his temper and attacks and appears to have killed him for a minute . The next thing that happens is hellboy is getting the shit kicked out of himself by the locker doors. I guess the moral of the story is , if you want a psychopath to reveal their true colour criticise them . Make sure there are other people around before you do it though

Wini

quest: I think we should start taking the psychopaths out of corporate world … take them out of their suits, put them back in overalls … let them rebuild the infrastructures for the bridges/dams let them do what they do best … danger … dangerous work out there that needs to be done. Back to work where they will do the most good … besides, I’m sure none of them will mind it a bit to be swinging thousands of feet up in the air … walking across girders … etc. Remember, they have NO fear and it would release all that crazy energy they seem to be carrying around.

Just a thought. (LOL)

Peace.

hens

Great post Tood – I will have to ponder this. I have survived many thing’s – so survivor is too general of a term. Maybe The Wounded One’s? Then of course that would mean I am stuck in my misery. Should it be a positve or negative term? I like your question and am waiting for others to comment.

Letgoletgod

Wini,
A nice thought, however, the only problem with that theory is that they are cowards and it takes courage to do what some of those people do. They literally have nothing good about them, let alone doing something ‘good’ for the rest of us, like taking risks. They only work for themselves. They are lazy, and they get by with doing things the easiest AND SLEEZIEST way (although I would assume living life as a 100% LIE MUST be exhausting…, and in acutality, maybe the HARD way of doing things!). In no way do they do anything that is admirable.
My x-s ‘owns’ a business that his grandfather and father started. It is a well-off business here in N. Cali, and he definitely gets all the benefits. A business to be passed on to him, (he didn’t work for himself), a huge house/yard/pool/hottub (his dad bought long ago and sold to him for cheap, (which is so hard to own a house in N. Cali, his house is probably worth half a mil, and he bought it for 200K I think), and has much freedom with money as he wants. Its quite distgusting how much he has that it makes me so incredibly angry–NOT jealous. Where is the justice?!? He gets EVERYTHING he wants, and probably always has. Sure, its all materials, but he gets whatever he wants. He has the money for whatever, and the ‘prestige’ of owning a business. He has the charm too, of course, and is well known throughout the county, due to his father’s business. He is looked at as a great son, (but”I know some dirty details”) BUT…BUT…he did not work for it. He got out of college and fell into this job. Where are his dreams? Absent, so that makes him less admirable. Then, as the saying goes, BOY is he a gambler! And, when he loses, out of the petty cash comes the bill! At one time last year he owed his bookie $3500 in a matter of weeks. I can just see him being the downfall of that business eventually”.that is if karma and justice kicks in. But, I can just say that I wouldn’t feel bad, sadly for me. His whole family is a bunch of sociopaths. He would call his younger sister with the smear campaign every time we got in a fight and she would freak out on me. Seriously, what a little boy in reality! And Wow! Its just makes me crazy that he goes on and on and on, and he has been given the power of money to continue doing it. Without his business, he would be nothing! (Not that he’s much anyway)!
It’s just so annoying that these creeps get away with so much. He discarded me(which I will eventually be so thankful for once I open my eyes, lol), and moved on like I was just another object he could replace. I know its wrong thinking on my end, but I hate thinking that I was just another object. A flavor of the week, another notch on his belt, and nothing more. He is living his life, in complete greed, after taking so much from me.
I feel terrible that I am sitting here, HOPING for the worst to happen to him. Wow, I am so bitter, its sad. I am angry, resentful, a little jealous I’ll admit, and I have bad thoughts constantly. Will I ever have room for love again in my heart?? I feel like I have forgotten what is and how to love. 

Letgoletgod

Tood-
I am certainly in a stage of ‘Bittersweet’ to say the least!

James

Thanks PressEject for sharing your view about the “child in the Sociopath” and believe it merit some thought and insight. I do believe it is in fact this child like quality that does attract us to them insomuch that it allow both to behave in a child like reunion. And yes that sometimes after we are discarded and devalued do we then understand what happened. Strange how our grieving process is like a child who mourns the lost of them we bonded with. Like a child who is hurt our pain is more emotional and longer lasting. As for them the child like ability to attach so quick to someone and behave at times less responsible and carefree like a child. And/or a child who is wronged and wounded by others (so they tell us) bring out our child like stand to help and assist them in their healing and ours. Yes maybe the sociopath does allow us to behave like a child again giving us false hope of another chance to undo the wrongs done to us as children.

Again thanks for sharing! 🙂

Wini

letgoletgod: Yes you will love again. You are just waffling a little tonight. But that’s natural for having the rug pulled out from under you.

Yeah, I was trying to make lemonade out of lemons. I know my EX is very talented … and lazy, along with greedy, greedy, greedy. Did I mention greedy? (LOL).

When your waters calm down and you get the rest of the rippling affects of him out … you’ll see how beautiful life can be again. I promise you that.

Other than your waffling … how are you?

Peace.

Wini

James: They act like children because they are children… and it’s no act.

Peace.

James

Tood

Some very good points indeed for I too grieve yesterdays..

What I mean is that I once believe there is good in everyone. A fairy tale that all can be saved and renewed. I once looked for good in everyone and thought I found it only to learn now how I just didn’t look deep enough. In short we lose some of our innocence’s and hopes and dreams. A lost so deep and at times very painful and dark. For your question “what are we?”. Well I really don’t know but what I do know is that I now believe in personal power which is co-creation and mutuality for that person and others. And if I can have my own personal power then others can too. For now this is what I look for in people and hope to share that with them. For with them can I and us bring about change and be able to look to a brighter future for all. I know there will always be people who live only in reality 2 which is power over others but maybe just maybe more of us will understand and start trying to live in reality 1 which is personal power and then we can become more like the people we should and can be. This at least still gives me hope and a new dream to replace that which I lost…

Wini

Tood: I would call us “The Lucky ONES”. Lucky that we survived, can see through them … and can heal after them being in our space.

I shudder to think of all the pour souls that didn’t have others to talk with regarding the likes of them.

Peace.

Indigoblue

What I have been Using to describe my Feelings of this revalation Is ;

FREE

Freedom from Oppression , Freedom from the mind control

Free To Love life again ! I don’t Fear them because I know the game! When there are no rules , I will not just survive I will WIN!

Elizabeth Conley

“I would call us “The Lucky ONES”. Lucky that we survived…”

“FREE

Freedom from Oppression , Freedom from the mind control

Free To Love life again ! I don’t Fear them because I know the game! When there are no rules , I will not just survive I will WIN!”

Whenever we realize our good fortune, and appreciate freedom, survival, wisdom and the magnitude of God’s Love for us, we are truly lucky. It’s the mindset of someone prepared to thrive. When we think like this, we can’t lose.

duped

I had to stop and think…did I write this? I could have…it’s so incredibly familiar. The rushed relationship, projected emotions, right down to the “pity” party. Mine didn’t discard me…instead he clung like he’d found a Mommy. He invaded my world until I thought he belonged in it.

When things got shaky he proposed and then got me pregnant. I thought a child of his own may have a maturing factor…ha! Once that was sealed, he quit his job and fed off of me like a baby suckling on a mother’s breast. And when I refused to be his meal ticket, he went on a mad smear campaign; accusing me of child abuse, abusing him, filed for divorce, tried to take my home I built before I met him, tried to take my baby while filing for child support and alimony. He figured if he couldn’t have the whole Mommy package he should still have all which I could provide!

Two years later, and it still stings. I could move on entirely and mend more thoroughly, but I have a shared child with which he has regular, several times a week, visitation. He lies, manipulates and still finds ways to take what he can. He’s found a new victim which, to her detriment, may be a blessing for me and my sons (I have two, one from a prior marriage that’s 12 years older than ours. He live with me and went through the whole terrible saga, from his own perspective). He recently failed a drug test and is not allowed to see our son until he passes one. Yet another, small, blessing.

The worst thing about having been or actively/passively still being involved with a sociopath is that if you speak out. If you tell people what you have or are experiencing, most will treat you like you’re the lunatic. So many people want to believe this isn’t real. That people like this don’t really exist except in the movies or in someone else’s far removed world. And so, to keep with this belief, it’s easier to treat the victim like a hysteric…no matter how calm, rational and evidenced she may be! THAT hurts more than anything he’s ever done to me, physical or emotional. I know he’s messed up! I have no respect for him. But I do respect, or did, some of those that would rather think me delusional…

At least in here, we know…

Duped

Elizabeth Conley

“If you tell people what you have or are experiencing, most will treat you like you’re the lunatic. ”

It’s good you realize that. You’ll save yourself a lot of pain if you don’t confide in many people.

“But I do respect, or did, some of those that would rather think me delusional” ”

My suggestion is that you try to rebuild with these people. They can’t help their naivette.

goingforwardnow

Thanks so much for this website and the comments. I did not know where to turn. My heart goes out to all of you.

My story: In January, 2004, my beloved husband died unexpectly after a short but horrible illness. We had had 14 wonderful years. I owned our house free and clear and had $100K in the bank from life insurance. I was, however, very lonely and still in shock.

I had been casually acquainted with Mr. S. for 6 years. He lived in the neighborhood and also knew my husband. He swooped in and did all the things that are described –

-Attention, flowers, cany, sexual passion;
-Pressure for quick marriage;
-Pressure for investments in various schemes;
-“Deals” like promising to maintain my property in exchange for valuable tools – commitments broken;
-Isolation from family and friends and controlling behavior…

I married him in September despite niggling feelings. I realize now that I was still in shock from my husband’s death. I was in no condition to marry anyone, but of course he knew that.

In the course of our marriage, he went though all my money, much of which I had given him out of trust in his many planned ventures. He rarely contributed to regular bills. He would pick fights and become violent. In our last fight, he had me thrown out of my own house for 30 days. During that time, he trashed the house, removed most belongings of value, intercepted a new credit card I had ordered to consolidate debt (his – I had to maintain a credit rating), and took cash advances. He stole a check and “paid” the Lowes balance in-store knowing there was no money in that account. He therefore opened up the balance and charged $4K more on the card, never to be repaid.

In all, I now have a home equity note on my house in order to pay back the debt he ran up. We are divorced, but what they say is true: Getting a judgment against someone who doesn’t pay anything is useless. There is no compensation; only going forward matters, I believe.

In retrospect, after reading all of the information, I now see all the signs were there – previous marraige with two children and no contact, terrible credit rating, financial irresponsibility, controlling, manipulative behavior – it was all there.

I did not listen to my family and friends at the time; I just wanted so much to feel better and to believe another wonderful relationship was in my immediate future.

I feel so much stronger now but have still struggled with the shame of it all and what I perceived as my stupidity. I have now come to believe that caring, generous people are typically targeted.

Once again, thank you all for sharing and having a place to air these unpleasant feelings.

Ox Drover

Dear Goingforwardnow,

Your story is my story, except I managed to get out of the relationship before I married him. Widows are prime candidates for the psychohpaths to pick as victims. I’m sorry for the loss of your husband. I too had a great relationship with mine.

Hang around here there is a lot of good information and support to help you heal. (((hugs)))) God bless you.

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