Editor’s Note: This letter was sent in by Lovefraud reader “truelove.”
Wow where to start. I am in my 40s and started dating a girl in her late 20s back in April 2013. I had met her a couple years ago and thought she was a nice, caring person. We started dating and things got hot and heavy really fast. It was like a fun roller coaster ride, but little did I realize she had plans to purposely make it jump the tracks once I was most vulnerable and hooked.
Taking control
She played the hot and cold game with me from the beginning. I was hurt by it but always went back to her when she wanted to see me. She was taking control of the relationship at this point through manipulating my emotions. She asked me all kinds of personal questions and complimented me a lot. I never felt so appreciated in my entire life, and it felt so good having a woman tell me so many nice things. Then she said things that made me think this is my soul mate whom I have been waiting for because she felt the same about a lot of the things we talked about.
Texts and sex
The sex was unbelievable and often experienced. We spent so much time together and texted constantly. I thought this was kind of odd at first, but this was my soul mate so it seemed all right. Later I realized it was to keep control of me and not because she cared, because she did horrible things behind by back while having this intense communication with me.
Then I noticed that she would get offended really easily over silly things. For example, she got mad at me for replying to her text messages with K instead of saying OK. Then I noticed that she would say things to hurt me. She mentioned that I had a bald spot on my head when I didn’t. It was like she was testing me to see how to upset me. I just thought she was joking. Then she would ask me strange personal questions that made me feel uncomfortable, but I figured she cared about me and simply wanted to get to know me more.
Many personal questions
She asked what caused previous relationships to end and I said it was due to cheating, wow, go figure. She asked me what my greatest sexual fantasies were. Everything with her was sexual. She even said that my filtered fresh water was sexual!
As I look back, she would often stare at me in a really intense way. We even had staring contests and she won every time. It was like she could see right through me and her eyes were like two lifeless blue doll eyes in her head that wouldn’t flinch.
Lies and manipulation
Then the lies and manipulation really kicked into overdrive. We were upstairs watching a movie one night and she took a call that she said was her cousin. She ran out of my house like it was a fire drill to take the call. When she came back up, I had this pain deep in my gut that it was another guy she was talking to. She lied and I dropped it since I started to ignore my gut instinct a couple weeks before and how could such a sweet, nice loving girl do such a thing as lie? The brainwashing had already kicked into high gear.
Oops, the wrong name
My friends couldn’t understand why I didn’t just ditch the bad nasty apple for good and stop going back and move on. They obviously didn’t understand how addictive it becomes to want to work things out and still believe all the lies, since I thought we had a deep spiritual, mental and emotional connection and I didn’t want to be wrong?!
Then when we went to bed and she called me by her ex-boyfriend’s name by accident so she said! I was so naive and “in love,” that I kicked her out of bed and later overlooked it and figured she was with him before for a year and a half so people make mistakes, right? This was in late June 2013.
Truth is like pulling teeth
A week later I caught her texting someone late at night right next to me in bed after saying she didn’t want to have sex earlier that evening. It was like she got a thrill out of getting caught possibly. Then I badgered her into the late hours to tell the OBVIOUS truth and she finally said it was her OTHER EX, yes another ex boyfriend! Just to get a shred of honesty was like pulling teeth from a tiger. I see now that she was messing with my emotions and hurting me on purpose.
I thought she was a victim and being used by these other guys when it was likely the opposite. Really sickening now that I think about it. I was in complete denial at this point and in fantasy land since I was so into her and she was into me, right?! I later found out that she was sleeping with her ex and they had a fight and that’s why she took the phone call in a fire drill rush in my apartment.
Sleeping with the ex
She told me in late August 2013 about sleeping with her ex and about almost having a threesome with him and her best friend! She told me she loved me in the same sentence and how she prayed for me! I was devastated and felt so betrayed; I cried a lot.
When she “came clean,” by telling me that she slept with her ex, I later found out she was hooking up with another guy she met through the sex pages/personal ads of craigslist! This was when she was, “coming clean?!” She is almost thirty and the guy was 19 years old!
I found out she likely had a threesome with this kid as I saw her text messages one night. I know that was wrong, but I guess I needed a bigger dose of reality and humiliation.
Three days before she had sex with the kid, she had asked me to be her boyfriend and I said yes! It was like the more screwed up stuff she did to me, the more it made her feel good. This whole experience has been so humiliating as a man to have a woman do this to me and to leave and come back to it several times thinking it would stop. I think the word I am looking for is I felt emasculated?
The sex weapon
So she told me about cheating on me not because she felt bad, but it was intended to hurt me emotionally, which it did. I broke up with her initially when she called me by her ex-boyfriend’s name. But time and time again I don’t know how she did it she was able to get me back into her game. She was able to slither her way back into my life every time by using the powerful weapon of hot sex, now that I think about it.
Intentionally hurting through lies
I later determined that she was trying to turn me into a willing victim. Every time she would do something horrible to me, she would want to get closer to me and love bomb me again. How can someone purposely go out of their way to hurt another person?? I don’t get it! Why waste so much time!
While all this was taking place she told me lies within lies and deceptions within deception! I wanted to believe her, but I didn’t believe her. Such outlandish lies! She likely lied to me about difficult things from when she was younger to get my pity. How could such a hurt person who is so vulnerable do such monstrous things to me? It made no sense to me. As a result I remained in a fog mentally and emotionally, wondering if I was losing my mind.
Girlfriend and boyfriend
Now after Thanksgiving, she wanted space from me and I was dumbfounded and upset! A week before, she started a fight with me and justified going out with another guy and told me the details about how she was a good girl even though they talked about sex! After she told me this, she held my hand like she was my girlfriend!
Oh yeah, during our relationship, we spent tons of time together and she would put her arm under my arm while walking my dog, etc. She was making me think I was all hers and she was into me, basically my girlfriend. It was all a facade. I fell in love with a person who didn’t exist.
Smirks
This part was really creepy to me. A couple days before Thanksgiving, she was over my house and as she walked out of my bathroom, she gave a big smile, but I only looked at her from the corner of my eye. What I saw was creepy! Out of the side of my vision, I saw that the smile was fake and I caught a quick glimpse of a person wearing a mask! Every other time she smiled at me I looked at her directly and it seemed sincere.
When I caught her being deceptive and lying, she didn’t seem sorry but instead had a smirk on her face and duper’s delight as they call it after I researched it. There was another time she asked me if I wanted a particular thing, and I said yes. After I answered, I saw a quick smirk on her face. Later it was her feeling good about duping me again about the question she asked. Now that I think about it, every time she upset me and hurt me through deception and lies, she probably enjoyed it and I believe got a rush from it. Crazy!
Needing space
Now after we both agreed for the umpteenth time to give space to each other after Thanksgiving, she broke the agreement and contacted me three days later wanting to see me etc. I ignored her because I had come to a definite conclusion that I was dealing with a sociopath and dangerous person emotionally for me.
I began researching online back in early October 2013 to try and make sense of what was happening to me. I thought I was going crazy and needed to deal with some personal issues since I was constantly mad at her and expressed it verbally several times. She later tried to get me to believe that what I said to her was just as bad as what she did to me.
Anyway, I read a lot of websites, articles and the book by Dr. Stout and it all began to make sense. I found Lovefraud.com and read the testimonies of people and saw parts of my experience in almost every story. It was comforting but still painful and shocking to come to grips with what I had been experiencing. I identified with some of the traits that made me a potential bulls eye /target for her.
Wanting me back
Ok, so since I ignored her after Thanksgiving, she started to call me several times a day and sent 30 or 40 text messages to get me back into her game. I still ignored her, despite how difficult it was. It was extremely difficult since I care about her, but the more no contact with her, the more the fog lifted and I saw how many horrible lies and things she did to me and how I was duped by her.
She eventually wound up in a mental hospital early December with OCD from contacting me and depression. She tried to blame me for it, but I was simply breaking free from her control and saw through her manipulation. I thought that when she contacted me often she loved me, but it was just to control/own me, so to speak.
Knowledge is power
Wow knowledge is power and wisdom is acting on that power ”¦
I contacted her in the hospital because I love her and that’s when she asked me in a negative tone why I never returned her calls and blamed me for her hospital stay. I got upset and hung up the phone instead of yelling. Yet again she was successful at messing with my emotions.
She would send me poems and tried to contact me for the month of December 2013 and I continued to read them because I liked the attention and wanted to believe she could actually change and love me the way I need to be loved.
I still didn’t contact her until after Christmas when she wished me a happy birthday and Christmas. I contacted her and the whole games began again for a couple days and I broke free again. I find it ironic that she would up in the hospital instead of me because of all the abuse I got from her.
Start from scratch?
In January 2014, she wanted to start from scratch with our relationship and I said no unless she tells the truth about something she obviously lied about before. Ridiculous, I know, for me to want to have a friendship with benefits kind of a thing. I had not been acting sane at this point.
So she continued to tell her ridiculous terrible lies; the truth was blatantly obvious. I told her I want nothing more to do with a liar!
This was when she told me she slept with her OTHER EX twice while being with me. She called me the following day begging to come sleep in my bed. I was shocked and speechless and she hung up on me. Even until the end she was hoping to keep me as her willing victim. She chose to keep her lies and dirty secrets over having anything to do with me in the future.
I gave her so many chances to change and do right by me. I knew that the new person was simply another mask she was putting on. All her actions before were in the past to be forgotten and forgiven, but saying sorry and making false promises gets old. Come to think of it, she had mentioned herself as a phoenix! The scary thing is, I don’t think she is done with me yet.
Emotional sobriety
It has been 10 days since last contact through Facebook and it has been like starting over with emotional sobriety. Every time I wound up in any kind of contact, it had been awful and emotionally painful as it brought up painful memories.
I believe she didn’t like the fact that I dumped her finally for good, and that she wasn’t able to hurt me again emotionally by sharing other guys she slept with while being with me. It is shocking how she would share different emotionally painful things right when it would hurt me the most. The 19-year-old guy she slept with I found out on my own and foiled her plans to hit me with that zinger. My God, the betrayal and lies/deception! She knew what she was doing to me. After I caught her in a deception, she got a parking ticket and claimed it was karma getting back at her!
Today I am slowly recovering. I feel depressed, shocked, angry and hurt all around.
I am still dumbfounded that there are people like this in the world. Also the bad luck I had of coming across a female sociopath, where there are around three million in this country I believe? I have watched a lot of horror movies and seen things that are evil, but this takes it too a whole new level as they are monsters with sweet caring masks and a dagger behind their backs. Also they aren’t usually discovered until damage has been done.
But I also see how this negative, painful experience will make me a better person in the long run. They say the best revenge is to live a good, honest and happy life. I have every intention of doing so by Grace.
BOOK REVIEW: Living and Loving After Betrayal
Truelove, all our stories are SO familiar, its like they all read out of the same manual!! I know exactly how you feel, I have been out of my relationship for about 2 years and he still continues to contact me of which I have no way to stop, he is just going down the list to see who will nibble on the bait, NOT ME! AND I still find out the lies and truth, I was devastated when the reality of what he is came to me. That these people exist is scary, I was in love with an actor not him, he took advantage of all the best in me, he messed with me mentally, emotionally, financially, physically and spiritually and left me a mess! Thank God for Lovefraud!! It especially hurt that no one around me really understood the damage he caused and how deep the trauma was and still is sometimesthat was frustrating beyond belief, I had to quit talking with family and friends about it and get support from fellow “survivors”. I still feel like everyone thinks I’m over reacting but I dont care, I will never be quiet or give up, I do what I can to get information out there!! I know I shouldnt but I still keep an eye out for him so I know where and what he is up to but I dont warn anyone personally anymore, I cant get sucked back up into the drama! I know one day I will be 100% done but I still have the obsession to keep tabs??? I used to take it 1 hour at a time, now its much better, I can go weeks without him bursting into my reality and it will get better for you!!! We are all here if you ever need us!! Good Luck
Frandee
Thank you so much for replying. Yea I stopped talking to family about it because they got sick of it and likely didn’t understand. It is so hard because they made us feel so special and wonderful! Like being in “Candyland” and then winding up on the “Operation” table! I am using older board games as an analogy. Its been a little over 2 months since seeing this person and 3 weeks since last contact through facebook. I still have disturbing memories and nightmares and anger early in the morning and throughout the day. Its like I am hurting myself by reliving the painful memories/words shared by the monster. I got tested for all STDs and still waiting for results. I remember me asking her when she told me about sleeping with her ex whether he wore a condom. She said essentially, “you don’t have a right to ask since we don’t use a condom.” Again I felt a pain in my gut and ended it. Later by her wearing me down, she wound up back in my bed again! Boy I feel like a dumb shallow guy now that I look back, but I was definitely under a spell that overpowered me obviously. Anyway thank yo for your comment:)
Wow,
Im surprised you noticed these things so quickly,,,with mine I didn’t notice anything wrong until 8 months later after we moved in together.
Mine never admitted to sleeping with others, however I suspect she did, but she always had an excuse for texting other men, or meeting up with them, sometimes even blaming me. It got to the point where I was going through her phone several times a week cause it was the only way I could catch her, the last time I caught her she was making plans to go out with some guy while I had the kids out of town the whole weekend, she had met this guy at a bar while we were broke up for a month, when I busted her this time I called him and found out she lied to him too, he knew she had been with me for long time and split up, however she didn’t tell him I moved back in, she then put a numerical lock on her phone after that.
We know man,,,we know we want it so bad, and they are so good at selling the lie, we want to believe it no matter how much our common sense is screaming at us that this is just way too fishy.
You weren’t married or had kids, count yourself lucky, and just keep trucking without her, just don’t jump into anything real quick with someone else until your beyond this.
Dave, this is a good example of a person who is not emotionally attached to you.
When normal people have a relationship breakup they need time to get over it so they can move forward. It’s a grieving process. In a normal relationship, people decide they aren’t meant for each other, wish each other well, and stop seeing one another. None of this is true with sociopaths. They typically will keep try to keep reeling you back in, if you still have some “use value” to them, until you decide to make it stop. Sociopaths pick up a new partner immediately – IF they hadn’t had an old flame simmering on the back burner or were already grooming a new victim before you were even gone.
My ex-spath was grooming a very young and naive woman before we even broke up. She didn’t know I existed. My side of the bed wasn’t even cold before she was sleeping in it. Even then, he kept trying to reel me back in as the other woman. I still had things that he wanted to use.
ouch, sry to hear onmyown, that is IMO outside of abusing ones children the worst treachery you can commit (cheating/adultery) or to immediately hop in the sack with someone right after breaking up. The devestation to know someone gave themselves sexually to somebody other than you is tremendous, no wonder you hear of these love triangles where someone winds up murdered, it can break people and drive them insane. I still love this woman yet hate every fiber of her being at the same time, so my emotions swing back n forth right now. I am finally starting to face the reality that this is truly over and its best for me and my kids.
I feel sorry for all of us on here, but at the same time I think its good lessons learned to help us become stronger and less dependant on a spouse, I still want to find love and be happy with a partner an EQUAL and share my life, but I now know I cant let that person completely determine my happiness, only add to it, and I cant wait to find her once im ready!! Will be nice to lay in bed at night with someone I feel like I can trust, and not sit there looking for opportunities to snoop through their phone, and not get verbally/emotionally bashed.
Good grief yes, it’s like having someone reach into your chest and rip your heart out. Everything you believed, everything you trust, is gone. As much as it hurts to discover the truth and find the strength to leave someone you love, it doesn’t hurt as much as staying with them and continually being lied to over and over again. You dig deep and discover what you’re made of, and chances are you’re much stronger than you ever thought you were. Eventually it just fades to distant, unpleasant memories that doesn’t have those strong emotions attached anymore.
I made myself a promise that the minute I feel like I have to start checking up on the person I’m in a relationship with, it’s time to GTFO. I will never live that kind of craziness again.
Oh yeah its craziness, the sneaking around trying to find out whats going on behind your back, whats worse is when you actually find it!!!!
And if you aren’t mad enough finding it, then when you confront them, they deny, lie, manipulate, swear its not what you think, or blame you for it, then get mad at you going through the phone lol.
Its insanity. Especially when you find these things repeatedly and everytime they justify it or lie and you don’t have enough proof other than they just did it behind your back, I would have had to literally catch mine in a physical sex act to finally bust her cheating and I guarantee she would have said its all my fault that she did it. I think part of me wanted to catch her cheating as I knew that would push me enough to leave.
One of these guys she actually dated once while we were broke up, I spoke to him years later and told him I knew about them seeing each other and he said “if that’s what you want to call it” I asked what he meant and he said “I fealt like she was using me” “she only seemed to call when she needed something” Whatever it was about him, she told him to take a hike then called me back that’s when she lifted the first CPO off of me in 08. I still to this day believe its cause he couldn’t have kids anymore and she still wanted one, cause less than 2 months after I moved back in she wound up pregnant and said she forgot to take her b-control,,,yeah right!!!
I can relate to that onmyown. I didn’t know about sociopaths until he’d been gone a few months. As soon as I told him my money was gone (he never worked or contributed a penny to food, bills, cars etc) he started work on ending the marriage, but made it my fault. He wore me down with his many, many memberships of dating sites, receiving hundreds of emails everyday. I saw his profile on some of them but he lied and said ‘somebody was having a joke and posted it without him knowing.’ There were even photos. He put on his profile he was honest (lie), caring (only for himself), liked to make people laugh and make jokes (he has no sense of humour). He groomed a woman before he left me because he knew she had money, a big house and 2 cars. He had an affair with her for a year then stonewalled her when she wouldn’t give him more money. She knew nothing about all the other women he was having sex with and getting money from. I tried to warn her, but she wouldn’t believe me until she was stonewalled. Then she sent me a letter telling me she should have believed me. It should be a crime but a s/p is very very manipulative and a very, very good liar. I know he’s doing it now – taking money and sex from innocent women. He tells them he’s ‘already in love’ with them, then moves in, abuses them then leaves.
Thanks Dave for replying and the encouragement; God knows I need it. Another thing I didn’t share in my story is that we were both facilitators and she left the group to go hook up with some guy. So she is likely out banging some other dude while I am left running the group on my own! I think it was the whole taboo of it for her. These things turned her on. When I asked her about it, she admitted that it was effed up that she did that. She never told me who she was with but it was clearly one of her exes with other details she left. Anyway take care and thank you again. Oh yea when we first starting hooking up, she was the facilitator of the group and I was a member. She was turned on by this dynamic and I thought it was odd but didn’t care as long as she was turned on.
truelove,
I have to say this first: NEVER HAVE CONTACT WITH HER AGAIN, NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS TO HER, OR WHAT SHE SAYS.
That said, if you made her a man and changed her eyes to dark brown she could be the liar I was involved with many years ago. You nailed the ‘play book’ with your keen descriptions of her games.
But, despite knowing all the plays in the book, if you don’t completely severe ties and continue to learn and heal yourself you will either go back into the crapper with her, or find yourself attracted to another energy vampire.
Don’t do that. You don’t sound like you have any legal reason to have anything to do with her. Be strong. Resist the addiction urge to ‘use’ with her again. You will feel differently as time passes, and you will not have the urge to wallow in the s*** with a pig. Because that is what sex is with these types.
YOU should be the most important person to YOU.
Take care,
Slim
Slimone
Thanks for the advice. I think my sanity impinges on that. So far so good but feeling depressed, anxious and actually reminiscing of the good times…Yea your are right, wallowing with pigs. Next time I will make sure I pick high on the tree and leave the rotten apples on the ground for the worms..
Slimone wrote:
“I have to say this first: NEVER HAVE CONTACT WITH HER AGAIN, NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS TO HER, OR WHAT SHE SAYS.”
Why? Actually I need to hear it from someone else as lately I have been missing this person!!?
I know crazy but from what I have read, rather common.
Please make it crystal clear why I should never have contact with her again.
On a side note, I just remembered where we had our first kiss on a park bench. She took me there after telling me she cheated on me and kissed me. Then cried that I didn’t look at her in the same way! Its crazy how different things she did that were off or really messed up are coming back to memory. Its like when you have repressed memories. Its seems like she was bringing me back to the scene like a killer does to “get a rush.” Or maybe I am just looking into it too much. Either way it was manipulation.
Why? Because you love yourself and are a slave to no one. This craziness isn’t living! It’s a slow painful death. You lose you motivation and love for life. You lose you health. You gain weight and maybe turn to addiction. Your Dr visits will become closer and closer together until you are prescribed a cocktail of med’s all designed to allow you to exist (not live) just a little longer. Why would you let someone control you like that? ONE life!! Thats it….no turning back. Find yourself again. Once I morned the loss of the high (not the person) I started to look at myself and what I wanted. I traveled and did it alone. I needed to like myself again. It was and is wonderful. I started doing crossfit and training for endurance races and triathlons like i use to. It wasn’t easy getting back because as we age, if we don’t stay in shape, even for just a few months, injuries are a given and recovering is harder. But I stuck with it and now I plan my year around races in destinations I want to travel. I dine alone almost all the time (although I can talk to anyone) I don’t hang out at bars and I am not looking for anyone. I finally like myself and hopefully Mr. Right will come along but until then. I live my life, I love my life, and I love me. Thats why.
Ok, not an idiot
Thank you for the encouragement and advice!
Thats what I need to learn is to like and love myself again! No wonder I allowed some creep girl in. You are right on about enjoying your own company first. How will you know when the right one will come along? I thought about this and being early 40s, I have spent too much time contemplating, preparing myself yada yada. I feel like if I do anymore soul searching etc, I will be 60 and ready for a healthy relationship!
I have been wanting to get back into art etc. things that used to get my mind off things; meditative activities. I think I will take your advice, its what I have been lackiing lately is self respect and self love and caring…Here here…!:)
Truelove,
Her sociopathy aside….(and she does sound sociopathic)….people in their 20’s are still finding their identity. And part of that is their sexual identity. It is very rare for a relationship with that age difference (in either direction) to last. They are of a completely different generation. When I was in my 40’s, I dated several guys in their 20’s. Every one of them broke my heart. When I was in my 20’s, I broke a lot of guys’ hearts. Granted, there are some very mature 20-year-olds out there. But the majority are just too young to know who and what they want. And a 20-something-year old who wants a guy in his 40’s is suspect to me. I dated a lot of older guys when I was in my 20’s who all wanted to commit to me. They were like father figures to me. Part of me wanted to be with them, but part of me still wanted to have more sexual experiences and just experience the world. I needed and wanted the security because I’d never had a real father. But I was not ready for a committed relationship. I had no idea who I was. I was going through my own version of borderline pathology, depression, and ups and downs trying to just take care of myself! I’m just telling you this to give you a little perspective.
The great thing about young people is that they have not had a chance to get beaten down by the world. They are open, full of energy, and not jaded and of course they are very attractive. But there are obvious ways they don’t match up with someone who is their parents’ age.
I think you have become so addicted to the great sex and the emotional bond that goes with it. When you have that bond, it feels like this is your one and only and NO ONE will ever feel like that to you again. It is the addiction. When you are away from her for long enough, the bond will start to break.
But the point I was making is that even if she were not a sociopath and just an ordinary 20-something year old, the cards are stacked against you anyway, and it’s unlikely that it would be a fulfilling relationship over time.
Similarly, I have many guy friends in their 40’s and 50’s who have a lot of opportunities to date women in their 20’s. They stopped because they say it is a lot of drama. No offense to any young members here.
Next time, if you are truly looking for a partner, don’t let things get “really heavy really fast.” Take your time. Physical attraction is not a good predictor of a good partner.
I started babysitting at age 10. I also was aware of “inappropriate contact” with children as I saw friends’ whose family lives were really infected with incest. I also saw those friends grow up to be adults in the 40s, that had no conscience about sleeping with teenage boys. Incest and pornography seems to promote this attraction to youth. Five years is a generation gap. What does a 40 year-old have in common with a 20 year-old? Or does she just want to call the shots and play bossy mom? What intelligent, college educated woman likes to be called “dude” by some youngster she is bedding? What sane women is attracted to a youngster who is also going through many other women and men like a public restroom? (High risk behavior is what doctors call it.)
I have had to cut people with no sexual/relational boundaries out of my life like gangrene. I surround myself with women I know who will not sleep with my offspring. This is what real women/mothers do.
Stargazer
Well she was almost thirty and was facilitating a support group and seemed more mature than most 29 year olds. I was 42. True, age differences can be difficult but doable. I think the focus should be on the fact that I was dealing with a socioath so even a “20 something” can wear a mask and seem more mature than most. She even said things and felt about things that an older person would. Essentially she tricked me into thinking she was an old soul!! So I am going to have to disagree with you on that note. I wouldn’t have gotten involved with a 29 year old if she didn’t seem mature period. It was when I was already hooked that the masks started to crack. Thank you for your reply though. I think your focus again ought to be me dealing with a sp; not your typical 20 something by a long shot!!
some older ppl are immature, very young-minded, peter-pan never grow up-ers. dont feel bad she was a young person who was like this. she will be this way in her 60 and 70s.
SICK.
it rly has nothing to do with age.
granted a 30yo sleeping with a 20yo is stupid. 20yos are stupid. but a 30yo with a 40 or 45yo…not a big deal. that ten yrs in ur 20s makes a difference that the next 30 or 40 yrs wont. theres a deal of change in ur 20s. its why older men who get involved with women in their 20s regret it. the kid grows up and says, ewwww ur OLD. by then the guys like 55 and now guess what, he is old lol Shudda stayed with the wife of his youth and loved his kids too.
but for truelove…the point of the story is she’s a spath. he was targeted and tortured. she will continue to target and torture into her 80s if she can. lets not confuse or even cloud the issue with anything else.
aintgonnatakeitnomore
Thank you for stepping up and sharing the other side of the argument which I believe you have succinctly shown.:) Sociopaths know no age or boundaries. I could have been with a 40 year old sociopath and have been really screwed up more emotionally as they have had more time to develop their skills. I feel I shouldn’t have called her on her sociopathic behavior as she will likely use the knowledge to develop her incideous skills to cause more damage with others in the future.
dont feel bad for telling her that. dont feel bad about anything in that relationship. dont feel bad about others who are caught in her sticky web; you cant stop them. u wudnt have listened to a word u said if u tried to talk to urself back at the beginning, wud u have?
anything we did, in our attempt to breathe while sucking in water in the ocean of betrayal of this magnitude, we cant feel bad for. we just can’t.
and others who say otherwise have never tread this murky water of abusive torment.
aintgonnatakeitnomore
“dont feel bad for telling her that. dont feel bad about anything in that relationship. dont feel bad about others who are caught in her sticky web; you cant stop them. u wudnt have listened to a word u said if u tried to talk to urself back at the beginning, wud u have?
anything we did, in our attempt to breathe while sucking in water in the ocean of betrayal of this magnitude, we cant feel bad for. we just can’t.
and others who say otherwise have never tread this murky water of abusive torment.”
Thank you so much for writing this as I have a habit of being too hard on myself. You are right. I had good intentions from the beginning. She saw me as prey to get what she wanted and then split. Fortunately I saw through it, and told her, “Game over, you lose and move on.” I told her this a coupe times and she continued to contact me. Last time chatted a month ago on facebook and she tried to manipulate me again by putting the responsibility on me. I think once she saw again that I was unwilling to let her in because of lying etc., she tried to pt some of the blame on me for my anger and not forgiving. She tried to compare me expressing my anger vebally as being just as bad as what she was doing behind my back. She tried to make me feel guilty for blocking my phone from her #, and said how mean and unfair that was…(Double standard) I know that she was playing on my desire to see the best in people and give them second chances etc…She was playing on my conscience and forgiving nature. Amazing how they can exploit the very things so foreign to them.
I know ur hard on urself. Ur spath saw it too and used that to her advantage.
I am way, way too hard on myself. I am so hard on myself ppl are blown away by it, once they understand it. For me to cut myself slack is a precious gift I am learning to give. To me.
I’m basically looking at every time he said I was bad as I was really good and to feel good about myself in that moment. It turns the whole moment around in my mind. It turns the trauma to a gift of self-love.
Those moments just flash up in ur brain for no reason but I redeem them now. I say to myself, it’s trauma. Feel It. It’s just trauma. It’s over and will never happen again. And he was lying. He was projecting. He was flailing about, frantically looking for a way to get his sick needs filled. The very thing he was saying? Well the opposite was, is and ever will be TRUTH, REALITY.
~hugs truelove~
Truelove- It’s been a long time since I have logged into the site although I read it weekly. My user name no longer depicts how I feel about myself. If anything, It’s how I feel about him. One thing that sticks out in my mind about your writings, as it is something I have learned about myself through the whole ordeal and may be something we share, is the need for passion as it supersedes all other needs. Everyone’s needs are different. Some people, above all else, need security. Some people need money or status or to be surrounded by lots of people or they desire a large family presence etc and that’s ok. I have all these needs too but these other needs can only grow, for me, from passion. I need someone who shares the same “passion” for self, for life and for love. This, I believe, made me a target. It is not in me to change this need as it is part of who I am and I love that about me. That being said, I have finally decided that I owe it to myself to wait for that quality/connection in a healthy person. I have yet to find it and I am ok with that, as I am no longer looking. It will come when I am ready. I am completely over the S-Path, I have no feelings for him and no desire to have anything to do with him at all. It takes time but it happens! Mr. right is out there and I have no desire for Mr. right “now”. I am finally in control of my own self. You will find her, although as stargazer pointed out, I think its worth considering that the road will be more frustrating looking outside your generation. My rule of thumb is older or younger by 5 years as it’s hard to relate to those who have not gained the wisdom that comes from life’s experiences. Embracing your maturity and wisdom is a powerful realization that will help set you free. It took me a while to understand what makes me tick. I got tired of trying to change myself because I didn’t understand myself. Life is much easier now. Good luck and stay strong, you deserve the best.
OK
Thank you for the reply. The generational question. I see your point but i think the other side of the argument needs to be addressed. Any takers??:)
Thank you for the encouragement by the way:)
I guess I could have left the last part out because it was a side note and obviously took away fully from my real point.
Please don’t discount that its easier to identify flaws in people of the same. Mind.
Ok, not an idiot
Oh no I got your point. Yes passionate people are easy targets it seems because our emotions are more stronger and intense. They feed off of this intensity and I believe my sp would say things and do things just to see how emotional I would get. There was one time she told me about cheating on me and I cussed her out. She just sat there and looked emotionless. Boy was I manipulated! Then she called me on being abusive as if out of nowhere I call her a b#$CH etc etc…Any normal passionate person would have likely reacted to this in that way. Especially since I couldn’t just leave at the time. SO much to say. Yes you are right…I am a very passionate person. I think she enjoyed the whole drama of our heated debates/arguments. She even said to me one time when I got away from her for 5 days, “I wish you would just call me and tell me to go efff off and call me a blank blank.” It was the attention she wanted period. Whether it was neative or positive. I read someplace that the best think to do is stay away and ignore. They will bark up another tree. Narcissism is a part of sociopathy apparently. Someone needs to keep these people from damaging lives in the future!!!!
I think there is some value in feeling bad about the relationship because taking ownership of your role is helpful in the healing properly process. I have not for one second lost sight of why I allowed myself to fall for someone like him. It is what has gotten me to where I am today. If I may be blunt. If your anything like I was, overflowing with untamed passion, or maybe call it a love for dopamine, you will soon learn that you too got what you needed at the time from the relationship. Granted you would not have used it for evil like she did. It’s a high. The crazy, for normal people, in small doses can be fun and keep the spark lit. You, I, all of us got more than we bargained for. We played with fire and got burnt. So we learn from it. What I have learned; I learned in many ways I was selfish. I wanted the feeling he gave me. I wanted him to make me happy. All the while forgetting my job was to make my partner happy. Keep in mind, this tactic would have changed nothing with him but I can’t help but be grateful for the experience as I may have never learned the lesson which will help me in future relationships. The lesson being that if I love someone it is my job to make them happy. If in turn they make no effort to make me happy then it’s no match. That i want To be with someone who when I wake up every morning I ask myself what I can do today to make them happy because it makes me happy in the healthiest of ways is now what I strive for. It’s amazing the transformation for example, your having a bad day and u get a call and instead of acting sad you act like you’ve had the best day ever. You then continue to have a great conversation and all of a sudden your day is really great. There is a time and for venting. Anyway I hope this makes sense to you. To recap, I didn’t know how to give as much as i do now. Had I known I may not have gotten caught up because I quickly would have identified what he wasn’t giving and seen his desire to tap into, what is typically charming in small doses, the crazy aka passionate side of me. He gave me nothing but a dopamine rush and I guess I gave him what he wanted. Learn and become a better person for the right one.
truelove,
Mine did the same, she would say very hurtful things, things that lowered my self esteem, eventually I would get upset and raise my voice, or tell her shes acting like a b##ch, she would on occasion get physically in my face and yell, telling me im a POS, and a loser, and im just using her, she would keep doing this until I would get so angry I would throw something or hit an object, then proceed to tell me how violent and abusive I am. I never in my life have acted like that around any woman but her, I told her this several times and of course she didn’t believe me, she would say yeah right if you did it with me you acted this way with others.
Mine also had some bi-sexual tendencies. I know she has some female encounters years before I met her, but I never knew of any while I was with her, although judging by paintings on the walls, and some things she said, I think she still finds women sexually attractive and just wont tell me cause shes scared ill tell everyone.
She was the most sexually energized woman I ever been with, I mean she wanted it more than a man!! And many times it was her chasing me for it (which I liked cause then I didn’t have to chase it wondering if I would get told no lol) Once our son was born that all stopped, her sex drive went down the tubes for a whole year, then some came back, then after my daughter was born, she got almost back to what I would say is average but never near what she was the first year.
If you’ve seen my comments on here, I have always said she used sex as her way of making up,,,she would not apologize, and rarely could we speak of the problem without arguing again as she always justified it, or claimed it was my fault, so instead we would go silent treatment for a few days then poof she would magically hop in the shower one night as if nothing ever happened. I didn’t mind it the first couple years but after that I got sick of that, made me feel like a stupid piece of meat, like some dumb caveman, and it wasn’t helping the problem, only putting a bandaid on a gunshot wound.
Listen to the others on here and just enjoy the blessing that you weren’t married or had kids with this woman, cause it would have hurt 10 times worse and that’s saying a lot cause I know your hurting bad now and you have every right too, its messed up when men/women play with others feelings like toys.
Mine slapped a civil protection order on me last week claiming that 2 months ago I physically harmed her when she is the one who initiated the contact that night, now I have to go to court next week and fight this without a lawyer, so I have to write up a statement for myself as well as a list of questions when I put her on stand, then questions for my two witnesses who seen the marks on my body and know our history. Thankfully one of my witnsses knows both of us, he has known her longer than me, I met him through her, he was married to one of her good friends, so that will help, and my friends sister was on the phone with me twice the night we fought and she heard some of the commotion.
I get nervous as hell when all eyes are on me like that, but ill be damned if I go down without defending myself from bogus accusations that I assaulted a female!!!!
Ok, not an idiot
I am passionate but not an addict with the passion. All I ever wanted from this person was to love and be loved, period. No ulterior motives etc. I disagree with you about me looking at what part I played because my intentions were honest and true. I believe once I heal more, it would benefit me to look at why I was an easy target and how I can protect myself in the future. One thing I can say is that I was naive and thought people in general wanted what was best for everyone involved. You know, the glass half full attitude. It is likely that when I was assessed by her, she saw that I was a passionate person (emotional zest). Zestful people can have their emotions manipulated much easier than others. You are right though about the strong attraction that I found out can be attributed to her high testosterone level. I guess maybe the dopamine was what kept me coming back for more.
On a side note, the picture of the girl at the beginning of this article looked a lot like her:) Just thought that was strange.
Also I thought about how she had a language concerning truth and lies that blew me away! For example, when I asked her about her ex, she said that he had a gf and that he was a jerk, creep, weirdo etc. Later when I found out about her cheating on me with him, I asked her just because you don’t like him doesn’t mean you wouldn’t frack him. She gave a duper delight smirk that would make any seasoned sociopath proud.
Also I later found out that she didn’t think sleeping with a woman was cheating. She told me this later on. Oh yea did I mention that we had clearly agreed to me monogamous? All she had to do if she wanted to have an open relationship is tell me! Also I was open to experimenting sexually with her as she had asked me about this often. Side note, no I am not a sex addict or perverted etc. Just cared about this person and wanted be with her. But I think she enjoyed the deception and duping me too much. Doing things behind my back that would cause the most damage emotionally when she shared out of callousness rather than conscience. So psychopaths have their own language that allows them to not even consider truth or right and wrong. It was like she could not even define truth without it being mixed with some kind of lie and/or deception.
Another type of deception was while she was sleeping with multiple partners, she had asked me if it was ok for her to go to the beach with a gf to a guyfriend’s beachhouse who I know she wasn’t interested in. She did this so that I would think she was being honest and could be trusted. Some real devious crap here let me tell ya!!! I could tell other examples but I think you get the point. I was only with this person for 7 months off and on…
Don’t fool yourself, no one hates to share more than a sociopath. They want you to share but they don’t want to. It’s an ego bust and that’s what they are trying to protect at all costs. Her taunts using other sexual desires were well calculated. Question; where you really open to an open relationship? Have you asked yourself why you would share? My guy loved to tell me about all the girls who hit on him. At one point he admitted his intention was to get my attention so I would step things up. This was at the beginning and there was no way I could step it up anymore unless I acted jealous and started a fight hummmm.
I’m curious, imagine the same exact girl. You meet her and she provides no drama. This means the passion is not as intense and the sex not as electric. What quality would “she” need to possess to make up for the deficit? Would you still like her without the drama? You don’t have to answer publicly but I think it’s worth an honest pondering within. I ask you this because I have asked myself the same question over and over again. I now know the answer for me but I think it’s worthy of answering for yourself.
Ok, not an idiot wrote:
“Don’t fool yourself, no one hates to share more than a sociopath. They want you to share but they don’t want to. It’s an ego bust and that’s what they are trying to protect at all costs. Her taunts using other sexual desires were well calculated. Question; where you really open to an open relationship? Have you asked yourself why you would share? My guy loved to tell me about all the girls who hit on him. At one point he admitted his intention was to get my attention so I would step things up. This was at the beginning and there was no way I could step it up anymore unless I acted jealous and started a fight hummmm.
I’m curious, imagine the same exact girl. You meet her and she provides no drama. This means the passion is not as intense and the sex not as electric. What quality would “she” need to possess to make up for the deficit? Would you still like her without the drama? You don’t have to answer publicly but I think it’s worth an honest pondering within. I ask you this because I have asked myself the same question over and over again. I now know the answer for me but I think it’s worthy of answering for yourself.”
I wasn’t wiling to share her with tom, dick and harry; even though that what happened essentially. She had asked me about watching her with another girl and how I felt about that etc. Then she asked me if I would want to join in if I had a chance, hypothetically speaking. Little did I know that she was gauging my response and then planned to cause even more hurt by having a threesome with tom, dick and harry and tell me when it would hurt the most. Kind of like being stabbed and then having the knife turned. Think about it. Its bad enough that she slept with guys behind my back but then to have threesomes??!! So I was open to her bisexuality but not her dual secret heterosexual tendencies. Oh yea she told me that I was the best sex partner she ever had!!! Wow I guess that ones a lie as well.
If it’s a lie, let it be a lie. Her opinion of you in any capacity doesn’t count. AND–Would you like to be the dream lover of a SOCIOPATH?? ewwwwwww
Change ur mindset about her. She wasnt ur lover, she was ur predator, ur tormenter.
And her prey was ur SOUL.
U r rite on there sista:)
The last time I had sex with her was gross and mechanical….Once I knew what she was on the inside, no amount of physical attraction could help. Hence the last time i saw here was this last time being with her. I also saw that she was into exchanging instead of loving and caring. I read somewhere that spaths are this way. She offered to sleep with me to help her with modeling preparations etc. I would have helped her without expecting anything, she knew that. I guess the whole exchange was deviant and she liked it. It was just another confirmation that I was dealing with a bad person all around. WOW! She was this way with others likely, that is gross!! The more and more I think about this, the more it becomes shocking at how I stooped so low to pretend a bad apple was a golden one high on the tree…I was so easily manipulated by sex! Feel like a dumb caveman!!!…lol
Yea real dumb caveman! Got tested for every STD and still awaiting results!!
Well I gotta laugh about this at some point anyway:\
I remember her asking me about how I felt about relationships and I told her I was a one woman man. She told me she was a one man woman. I think she had here fingers crossed as well as her twisted soul. She probably thought she was a one man woman at that moment but truth is so relative with them. They define what is true and make rules about it and don’t tell you unless they confess it or you find out…then they redefine truth again. Very devious characters and I still am blown away by it all…
aintgonnatakeitnomore
True her opinion does not count. My pet dog Bear is more human than her. Seriously not joking.
You are right, she was not my lover nor friend; she was my tormentor in a convincing disguise.
Evil people and so unhappy to get off on making others unhappy!! What a sad, sick existence they must live. Their own pathology could be punishment enough for these monsters. As long as they are prevented from spreading their poison.
NO MORE! Yet her negative influence I m still scraping off my soul. Time I hear helps. Anyway thank you, I get a lot from your comments and challenging questions as I know they come from a good heart:)
I wonder if their goal is to hurt or is that a byproduct of their desire to extort all your emotion no matter the cost. Your hurt is just a consequence they must deal with in order to drain you even more. I’m not sure they even care if you hurt or not, so long as they get what they want. This leads me to my next question; 2 S-Paths meet up. It has to happen from time to time. I wonder what that looks like. Is it drama x 1000 or will they go their own ways because they see themselves in the other. Would it be the ultimate challenge?
Regarding the comment “the best sex she ever had” first I think it’s OK to assume that is true and not just because she is so young (after all based on your writings she has had a few) but because it is a pride thing and guarantee with the right person, what she says would be true. To the wrong person you could be the worst but to the right person you could be the best. Don’t think for one second that she is the best you will ever have, assuming you told her the same thing, know that she is not at all the best you will ever have. Promise!!
I wanted to touch on something that may cause controversy; I hope my intent comes across. I notice more men on this site than one would think. I think it’s important to keep in mind when raising children that boys seem to me to be the most delicate of the human race. I would not be surprised if more men were affected by these S-Paths and just don’t say anything. It’s been my experience with 3 brothers and a son that men want so badly to be loved by a good woman. The instinct for starting a family with a good woman is at the top and also It’s as if their masculinity rides on it and when they fall they fall hard. I believe men may be even more susceptible to these perpetrators than woman. Now a day we raise our girls to be strong and smart and independent and it’s working. When I hear things like “my brother is 25 and lives at home but my parents have hope because his girlfriend is a nursing student so she can take care of him” horrifies me as it’s the next step in the emasculation of men. We coddle our boys way too much and I believe this hurts them and makes them a target. I think sometimes when rising boys we ignore this and assume they are tuff and strong. Reality as I see it, that describes our girls, not necessarily our boys. All this to say, parents, our boys break so much easier than our girls. It’s worth keeping in mind when dealing with the raising of children.
Ok, not an idiot
Wow you have touched on some good issues I haven’t thought about and are very insightful to say the least!
“I wonder if their goal is to hurt or is that a byproduct of their desire to extort all your emotion no matter the cost. Your hurt is just a consequence they must deal with in order to drain you even more. I’m not sure they even care if you hurt or not, so long as they get what they want. This leads me to my next question; 2 S-Paths meet up. It has to happen from time to time. I wonder what that looks like. Is it drama x 1000 or will they go their own ways because they see themselves in the other. Would it be the ultimate challenge?”
I think they can both enjoy hurting another emotionally and also be a byproduct of trying to extract what they want from their target. In my case, I believe she wanted my undying love and attention for only her. When I found out she hooked up with her ex, I went on a dating site and found her on there!!! She kinda stalked me on there; didn’t want me to even think of anyone else. Hypocritical to the extreme!! She never wanted money or things like that but she sucked all my time and energy focusing and thinking about a person who truly wasn’t a real person…She stole my time and focused energy since I am a one woman man and even when things went crap, it was difficult for me to get focus off of this female monster. She temp. got what she wanted but she wanted to extract more and I cut it at the root. She became crazy obsessed and must have called and texted a coupe hundred times in a week to keep control over me…It was like withdrawal from drugs from what I understand from people I know. She was like an octopus with me. I was like her favorite play toy to kill the boredom in her life. She was always bored all the time. Even when we were doing kool stuff..
I have seen her with a guy who was a narcissist and they clearly don’t like one another. The reason is that they both want to be the center of attention and the one to extract from others. There is a territorial element happening without them even knowing it I believe. Someone ought to write a joke about this encounter:)
I was at a bar with Jess and a big dude sat on the other side of it. She said to me that she wonders why some guys just look at her like she is a guy. I said I have no idea. Now I do understand. She has a high testasterone level even though she looks feminine. She also had unusually strong upper body strength now that I think about it. She massaged my back one time and it felt like it was a big sweedish woman with strong arms! Seriously I am not making this up. I mean she looks like the girl in the heading on this story of mine. So I believe there is a dynamic that occurs. Two predators don’t get along when there is prey to be had…or someone to let them suck all the time, energy, emotions from just to suit their needs and wants, ego trip boost…you name it.
“Regarding the comment “the best sex she ever had” first I think it’s OK to assume that is true and not just because she is so young (after all based on your writings she has had a few) but because it is a pride thing and guarantee with the right person, what she says would be true. To the wrong person you could be the worst but to the right person you could be the best. Don’t think for one second that she is the best you will ever have, assuming you told her the same thing, know that she is not at all the best you will ever have. Promise!!”
She told me that she has had a lot of sex in her short life. Yea, it was an ego boost for me to be honest. She told me she was with 15 diff. guys. Then it was 30 a couple months later:) So likely it was around 60. My exp. is much lower. I think you are right. If at first it was all testasterone and depamine from her and myself with one sided emotional response, I imagine with a normal, healthy empath, this would be better as without emotions, sex is just like blowing your nose only more intense. Now that I think about it, we would have sex and it seemed like at times near the end, she was just riding a bike or something. Just doing it to, well….do it!
“I wanted to touch on something that may cause controversy; I hope my intent comes across. I notice more men on this site than one would think. I think it’s important to keep in mind when raising children that boys seem to me to be the most delicate of the human race. I would not be surprised if more men were affected by these S-Paths and just don’t say anything. It’s been my experience with 3 brothers and a son that men want so badly to be loved by a good woman. The instinct for starting a family with a good woman is at the top and also It’s as if their masculinity rides on it and when they fall they fall hard. I believe men may be even more susceptible to these perpetrators than woman. Now a day we raise our girls to be strong and smart and independent and it’s working. When I hear things like “my brother is 25 and lives at home but my parents have hope because his girlfriend is a nursing student so she can take care of him” horrifies me as it’s the next step in the emasculation of men. We coddle our boys way too much and I believe this hurts them and makes them a target. I think sometimes when rising boys we ignore this and assume they are tuff and strong. Reality as I see it, that describes our girls, not necessarily our boys. All this to say, parents, our boys break so much easier than our girls. It’s worth keeping in mind when dealing with the raising of children. ”
This one is my favorite insight. Yes I believe men may suffer more because women spaths have so much more camouflage. Therefore once a man feels like something is wrong with the woman but not sure, the fact that she is the so called, “weaker sex”, causes that much more confusion. Most men have a caring image of women in general from their experience with their mother growing up. To believe a woman like their mother is capable of being diabolical and conniving, is almost reprehensible!
For me this was the case. With men, I can believe that many of them are callous, conniving and without a conscience. Its the propensity for greater aggressiveness and so called, “stronger sex” where society expects men to be rather insensitive and arrogant at times. Look at hollywood; many leading men are full blown sociopaths! Its ingrained in society that being a player, manipulator etc is edgy, sexy and cool. Men are more suseptable to pain and damage from a female predator as opposed to vice versa. Also women support one another more in general when they encounter a sp. Men go back in their caves and lick their wounds without sharing. To admit that a woman has stronger predatory skills/power to control than themselves, is difficult to admit. So men suffer more because men do not like to share their pain and do not support one another like women do. I think boys need to learn more of a nurturing side as true strength is never just masculine qualities. I could say so much more but with stop for now. Thank you for the thought provoking questions:)
well i was just thinking about this very issue today, that there are waaaay more male spaths than women. mostly becuz our society tolerates male abuse. we tolerate men being a-holes. a woman, however doesn’t last long as an ass.
men have always had an easy time being spaths as they had no accountability. they were covered up for by their wives and had bad actions shushed-shushed by their mothers. women were taught how to endure them…now, honey, don’t go getting him upset…daddy had a hard day at work, let him alone or you’ll be sorry…for my birthday dinner? oh dear, you pick for me, you’re so good at menu selection…
we once had a neighbor whose son used to play at our house. for several yrs he did. then one day we discovered $20 missing from my daughter’s desk. he took it. i think maybe he confessed to us, or he got caught by my son, idr. anyway i said, mike, go home right now and tell ur mom what u did. he was horrified. wasnt i going to tell her?? nope, i said YOU have to. if u dont i will. go now and do it. well he did. paid it back and then the mom called me a few days later. Can we pls stop talking about it to everyone as mike’s embarrassed? HELL NO i, and we, will not (ok, i said it alot nicer lol)! HE STOLE $20 FROM A KID!! HELLO. this mother wanted to spare her son…what? natural consequences? a life lesson? idiot mom, covering up for her son. this is whats wrong with kids today–their braindead parents.
aintgonnatakeitnomore
Interesting point. Yea there as more male spaths than women because their behavior is tolerated more. On the other side of the coin, women with sopath behavior isn’t as accepted in our society. Therefore I would say that there are more female spaths than statistically found due to their need and ability to camouflage. I think the male spaths are less because there may be men who act this way out of the sick acceptance of this behavior in society.
Ok, not an idiot wrote:
“I’m curious, imagine the same exact girl. You meet her and she provides no drama. This means the passion is not as intense and the sex not as electric. What quality would “she” need to possess to make up for the deficit? Would you still like her without the drama? You don’t have to answer publicly but I think it’s worth an honest pondering within. I ask you this because I have asked myself the same question over and over again. I now know the answer for me but I think it’s worthy of answering for yourself.”
This whole nightmare has made me appreciate the most important thing in any relationship…HONESTY! No drama, no lies, no deception, no duping, no manipulating…just HONESTY! Everything else is a far second! I still would have to be attracted physically but I guess this whole negative experience has made me a better person because I want character first and foremost from a woman.
well this is interesting to me as there was no drama for quite awhile with my last. but INTENSE passion, yes. ELECTRIFYING sex, absolutely.
I
ABHOR
drama.
so if it wud have been there the first few months I wud have walked.
by the time it was, the passion & awesome sex had bonded me TIGHT to him. ive never had it as good as with him and prob will never again.
and i can live with that.
aintgonnatakeitnomore
I have a new boundary after this monstrous experience. I got this from the book by Dr. Stout and I agree. If you lie once it might have been a mistake. If you lie again, then it may have been a misunderstanding. If you lie again, you are a LIAR and the lynchpin of sociopaths is lies and deception. If I stick to this, it will end early. I think lying is drama as well.
You ought to stay open to the possibility that your ex sopath won’t be your best lover and or sex partner. Don’t give him or her that much credit as someone mentioned this to me on this chat:)
With the lie boundary, it won’t be too long before there are cracks in their stories. Of course there are many other ways to determine. It will be a combination of these factors and I am so thankful I got outa this and now will know what to look for and what to look out for! Again appreciate your comments, Thanks
William
I just wonder, after only 3mos now, how long is it I should wait to date again. I want to. I don’t know if it’s too soon tho.
I have been sleeping again ok, I am losing wgt, walking 2x daily (in the arctic weather even, yes) and feeling alot more energy…than since I got involved with the narc to be honest, not just my physical body getting back in balance. It’s the vampire not sucking my life force dry. YAY
I am never screwing up again so I won’t even date if I shouldn’t. Hard to know when it’s ok :\
Dear ain’t, there is no time frame to the grieving process. But I don’t think it is about amount of time away from the spath but the work you’ve done healing the parts of you that made you vulnerable in the first place. When you’ve reached that point, you will probably know. If you are out there dating, hopefully, you can take things very slow and be observant of their behaviors and how you feel around them, paying close attention to your gut instincts.
Well yeah, as someone on here said, from here on out it’s GTFO when I feel anything but absolutely sure.
This will be my modus operandi lol
Which means I will miss out on some good guys just being normal jerks due to whatever, but rly worth getting to know.
BUT it’s OK, even JUST FINE. I no longer give the benefit of the doubt, just the way it is. I couldn’t if i wanted to, I am obviously unable to do that and stay healthy mentally and emotionally. Must be nice to be normal ~sigh~
There’s a lotta fish in the sea tho. I don’t think soulmates exist anymore after the spath did me in almost a decade ago, so I’m not sweating letting one of those fish get away.
I want to just date more than get serious with anyone. Shoot, that’s all most older guys want anyway. They are scared shitless of commitment and think they’re all such a prize rofl
Ah well, we shall see. I still dont know for sure about it.
Dear Wow:
Usually sociopaths can be quite charming, beautiful or handsome, and one day you’re in and the next you’re out. I have the misfortune of dating men like this, but I have to say working beside a woman who suffers from a personality disorder like your ex, who befriended (or so I thought) me, was the worst experience ever. She did everything you mentioned your girlfriend did, only she milked several men out of (that I know of) tens of thousands of dollars. She wanted them “to leave their wives, because she was their ‘soul mate’ and desperately wanted to have a house together somewhere because little her needed protection (never mind the loaded weapon she stashed under her bed).” Well, that was a lie, because she would break up with them after they gave her the cold hard cash, because there was no paper trail for legal recourse to go after her in court. This cash was usually on lines of credit or life savings with their wives. = This apple is completely rotten to the core.
It didn’t stop there. In her “friendship” with me she always told me I was her “angel of light.” Does this sound kind of like Tangina in Poltergeist?!!! I had a weird pain in my stomach when she first said it. I should have listened to my gut too. Over the first couple of months, she pumped me for information about my husband, and who I dated before him. While I drove to work, she was calling my graveyard shift husband asking him, “how good a lover am I and was he satisfied with my performance?” She went to another county, searched out two of my former married boyfriends, now divorced and slept with them. It was all about conquer, divide, and destroy with her. Never mind the hurt spouse, the hurt children, the legal mess, the cost and anything else that did not bother her conscience.
Then there was the acts of thievery: cash-sunglasses-makeup-credit cards-keys from my purse and my work supplies that went missing. The icing on the cake was someone* putting acid in my facial toner which made my face open up and bleed and scar permanently. I flew to my doctor. I told my doctor that day of the situation and she said, “Get out of there! She sounds like a person with no conscience and a serious personality disorder. People like that can manipulate the police and the courts.” She slept with the married chief of police. I gave my 30 day notice as she requested. To this day, she tells people she fired me and that I am some maniacal stalker.
I left, and she did not stop there! She drove a half an hour out of her way to drive by my house and my new employment. The sheriff told me of this far reaching woman, “I know Anny. I don’t why she would do this to you? Are you sure? You should not call her. Just write her a letter and tell her to back off.” I took his bad advice and I did. No threats just pointed language telling her how disappointed I was in her as a fellow human being. She went to the courthouse and applied for a restraining order claiming I was stalking and threatening to kill her and her son whom she neglected to say, she only had custody of one day a month. She was found to be a liar and even got a ticket for speeding off that day in front of the courthouse. There is a God and he was smiling on me that day.
Her husband found her in bed with her own brother. Ask any rapist in state prison what their family life was like growing up and 99% can tell you incestuous just like hers. She could not keep her filthy paws off her friends, coworkers, neighbors, clients and even her sister’s (who disowned her) past, present, and future significant others. The scary part is she has Hepatitis C and does not tell her lovers “because nobody told her they had it.” She pumps people for information only to hurt every single last one of them in one way or another.
If a woman tells you they do family members and do not seek psychological counseling for it, or when they did, THEY worked overtime in seducing their therapist…run like hell!!! If a woman says she is into: random sex with teenage boys, strangers, threesomes, anal sex and any other high risk (HIV/AIDS) behavior…run like hell!!! If a woman tells you that she has had to get more than a couple of restraining orders (mine had 6 last time I checked)in her lifetime against wives calling and asking her questions or rightfully telling her off, coworkers that wanted her rabid alley cat behavior to stop, and married men who wanted their money for her fake love shack back…run like hell!!! If a grown woman talks about her sexual escapades with every man or woman she comes into contact with, this is not normal or sexy…RUN LIKE HELL!!! If a woman who is 4’11”, has a peculiar sounding voice, has a fake tan, long bleach blonde hair, whose only hobby is the gym, who is now well into 50s and still dressing like a teenage pop star to attract the high school guys…REALLY RUN LIKE HELL!!! Sounds like your girlfriend took lessons from the tramp I had the misfortune of working beside.
Sadly, now when someone says they have had a life like hers and actually think it is cool, and never got proper psychological counseling, I back off. I don’t get close because I don’t ever want to be attacked by a leach again. I would rather eat glass.
lagioiella
You said it right on!!!
“It was all about conquer, divide, and destroy with her. Never mind the hurt spouse, the hurt children, the legal mess, the cost and anything else that did not bother her conscience.”
I am not sure you replied to my original post. It seemed like you did. Crazy story you have!!! Your experience with sp female makes my experience look ike a cakewalk in comparison! Was your sp bisexual like mine was? If so you would have been in even more possible danger!!
Your story reminded me of other details from my ex sp. She would tell her gfs of her “sexcapades” openly and offended a number of them apparently. Also, she would tell me her other best friends husband would text her for sex. She told me a number of times and I thought it was odd. She wanted to tell her friend but I think she liked the power trip it gave her as only a sp could understand. “My best friends husband wants me!”
Boy i feel better talking about all this. Getting it out there in fresh air it seems. Thank you for replying.
Be thankful your not married and or have children with her. When you wise up and they find you see their phoniness and they can’t manipulate you anymore they make your life miserable hoping you’ll divorce them and they can keep their stellar image as the victim. In my case when I failed to divorce her for the sake of our 5 children (4 adult) they start a slander campaign that makes the Salem witchcraft trial pale in comparison. They do this for their image as well a leverage in court. Be grateful for your inexpensive escape besides the financial expense you could have lost everything you stood for in life including family and friends and none of them will understand because a normal human being can’t grasp the depravity that a sociopath, especially a delusional one embodies. You need to access the void for love in your life that is making you vulnerable or you are likely to repeat your mistake. My advice also is look carefully as whether someone is loving and charitable to others when they have nothing of interest to them.
roylupton
You are right. I am going through emotional pain and turmoil; still having nightmares over things that happened; but at least I wasn’t married to her and had kids by her. Good grief!!!! Thinking about that makes me shudder!!! She told me she had an abortion and then cried in my arms but now that I think about it, she was likely lying and working on my sympathy. Heck maybe she didn’t do half of what she told me with her exes than she said, but said them and stretched out the story to hurt me more. Its the purposely hurting another person emotionally that is so evil! They do this just for kicks! I am still so angry!! And get this, when I talked casually with another girl, she flipped out in a jealous rage!! Yea hypocritical and the monsters of the worst kind!!! God I am still so disgusted with this person!!! Makes me so sick as I look back on all the bs she put me through and all the while I was just this person wanting to share love and intimacy, period…As I look back at the past relationships, I seem to attract women who are this way. In that sense I do need to look at why this is and put an end to it. Thats enough outa me.
She flipped into a jealous rage becuz she was PROJECTING. All the horrible things SHE was doing to you, she was pretending u were doing. Start thinking about wat SHE accused YOU of. Those are the things SHE was doing. FLAT OUT guarantee it.
I think that projecting is the thing i hated worst. Not that i believed it and felt guilty but that i had to listen to his crap. it was the most visible aspect of his mental illness and i cud not ignore it or explain it away. it was in my face. ~shudder~ sick sick sick narc
last contact with him he was still doing it and blameshifting and minimizing. no thanks. my wallowing with pigs days are over.
I read somewhere and I have to agree that spaths have one thing in common. THEY ARE ALL UBER EXTREME AHOLES TO THE MAX!! I also learned that there was a Native American tribe that would deal with people who lsept with their wives and stole their stuff. They would take them for a so called “hunting trip” and there would be an “accident.”
I guess the women in this tribe were sneakier or were provided for enough so didn’t need or want to live out their spath tendencies. I don’t know, but the focus was on men who did these bad things within the tribe. I heard this from Thomas Sheridan.
Slim-one and stargazer I always love your comments. They are mature and right on. Thanks!
Truelove, I first responded to your post thinking there was close to a 20-year age difference. And you’re right; I got caught up in that and missed the point. I reread your story in the light in which you intended, that is, how you got caught up in the web of a sociopath.
It’s a really unfortunate that we all learned about sociopaths and about the love-bombing the hard way. As you detach (it will take some time), you can begin to reflect on why you stayed with her throughout the blatant abuse and why you kept trying to gain her love. I know the obvious answer is that predatory people cast this spell on their victims. But there was some responsibility we all had in excusing bad behaviors and putting up with blatant disrespect.
I once was friends with a woman who was very happy and had very high self-esteem. She dated a guy for 6 months who was on the insensitive side. But the final straw came when the anniversary of her brother’s death rolled around, and she was very sad. Her bf said, “Get over it”. That was the last straw for her. She ditched him and found a wonderful man shortly thereafter whom she married I believe. I found myself wondering why that’s all it took to make her walk, when for me, I’ve let guys treat me so much worse and still took them back. That is the question I’ve been answering over the last 20 years.
stargazer
No worries:) I know you meant well. I just hear that often about dating younger women. I do feel the 5-10 age range max is a good rule of thumb in general. Just most 20 somethings are just out to have a good time and not want to psychologically destroy others.
Yea having boundaries is key to my sanity. We all could earn a thing or two from your friend. Taking care of oneself/having high self esteem is healthy and feels pretty darn good!
Side note, Do you like astronomy?