Editor’s note: The American Psychiatric Association is in the process of updating its Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fifth Edition, which is the main reference book used by mental health professionals. Back in February, Lovefraud invited you, our readers, to complete a survey on issues related to the new DSM-5.
We will be preparing a full scientific paper on the results of the survey. In the meantime, following is Lovefraud’s comment to the DSM-5 committee, which includes the basic survey results.
To read the revised definition of antisocial personality disorder in the draft of the DSM-5, click the following link. (The working group has recommended changing the name of the disorder to “Antisocial/Psychopathic Type” personality disorder.) Also, feel free to submit your own comments to the committee. The deadline for comments is April 20, 2010.
COMMENT ON THE PROPOSED DSM-5 DEFINITION OF ANTISOCIAL PERSONALITY DISORDER CONTRIBUTED BY LOVEFRAUD.COM
Lovefraud.com is a website that teaches people how to recognize and recover from people with antisocial personality disorder — we use the term “sociopaths.” Lovefraud was launched in 2005 and now averages 3,000 visits per day. Our writers include a journalist, a psychiatrist and a marriage and family counselor. Readers are also invited to tell us their stories of entanglements with sociopaths. We have collected nearly 1,900 cases related to sociopaths in the community, only a small minority of whom have extensive criminal records. Most of our readers were victimized by “professional” con artists who use “love” to prey on victims and who have evaded prosecution.
Lovefraud readers have all learned about sociopaths the hard way—through being deceived and destroyed by them. Many of our readers believe that knowledge of antisocial personality disorder and the existence of people who are “without conscience” could have helped prevent their victimization. The biggest reason our readers fell into the relationships is ignorance of the personality disorder and its symptoms. Therefore, Lovefraud’s primary goal is public education.
The proposed DSM-5 definition for antisocial personality disorder is, in our view, a vast improvement over the language in DSM-IV. However, we have three concerns with the new definition. They are:
1. Although the traits described in the first paragraph—arrogance, entitlement, manipulation, superficial charm, etc.—are accurate, these traits are frequently not apparent upon meeting a sociopathic individual or early in a relationship. In a community setting, the only way a clinician would find out about the traits is through interviewing the people around the sociopath. Many of our readers tell us that sociopaths successfully con mental health professionals and the legal system.
2. The second paragraph of the definition includes the following sentence: “Their emotional expression is mostly limited to irritability, anger, and hostility; acknowledgement and articulation of other emotions, such as love and anxiety, are rare.” This is incorrect. The vast majority of Lovefraud readers have experienced sociopaths professing their love and devotion, quite convincingly. We’ve seen them cry at the thought of losing us. It is only when the sociopaths have drained us of everything they could and discarded us, that we learned it was all an act.
3. The public is extremely confused about the name and definition of this disorder. The suggested name, “Antisocial/Psychopathic Type,” only muddies the water further. From a communications perspective, it is unsuitable for educating the public about this disorder. And education is the only way of preventing more people from falling victim to these individuals.
Lovefraud conducted an online survey of our readers in order to provide evidence and documentation for our point of view. We received 1,378 responses. Readers were questioned regarding their observations of the abusive individual—78% of them identified the individual as a romantic partner or spouse. Respondents were also asked questions related to the emotional expression issue, and their understanding of the terms used to describe this personality disorder.
We are writing a scientific research paper to describe the complete survey results, which we will send to the DSM-5 committee when it is finished. However, for the purposes of this comment, we include the following highlights.
WERE OUR RESPONDENTS INVOLVED WITH INDIVIDUALS WHO FIT THE SOCIOPATHIC PROFILE?
We know from the many narrative stories we receive that our readers have been involved with highly antisocial individuals who enter relationships with the aim of predation. Respondents were asked to rate how closely the individual they were involved with matched the scale in the new DSM-5 criteria for antisocial personality disorder. Here are the results:
1. Antagonism: Callousness
Very little or mildly like that: 3.7%
Moderately like that: 14.5%
Extremely like that: 81.9%
2. Antagonism: Aggression
Very little or mildly like that: 18.1%
Moderately like that: 24.7%
Extremely like that: 57.3%
3. Antagonism: Manipulativeness
Very little or mildly like that: 2.2%
Moderately like that: 8.7%
Extremely like that: 89.0%
4. Antagonism: Hostility
Very little or mildly like that: 18.4%
Moderately like that: 24.0%
Extremely like that: 57.6%
5. Antagonism: Deceitfulness
Very little or mildly like that: 2.5%
Moderately like that: 11.0%
Extremely like that: 86.5%
6. Antagonism: Narcissism
Very little or mildly like that: 8.4%
Moderately like that: 17.4%
Extremely like that: 74.3%
7. Disinhibition: Irresponsibility
Very little or mildly like that: 15.0%
Moderately like that: 18.0%
Extremely like that: 67.0%
8. Disinhibition: Recklessness
Very little or mildly like that: 21.2%
Moderately like that: 23.5%
Extremely like that: 55.3%
9. Disinhibition: Impulsivity
Very little or mildly like that: 17.2%
Moderately like that: 22.7%
Extremely like that: 60.1%
Respondents were asked when they first noticed each of the above traits in the individual. The choices were: right away, within the first month, within the first six months, within the first year and after one year. For every single trait above, the timeframe selected most often was “after one year.”
Conclusion: Lovefraud readers were indeed involved with individuals who seem to possess the characteristics of the antisocial/psychopathic type. However, these individuals were almost always able to keep their true natures disguised until the relationship was well-established.
WAS THE ARTICULATION OF EMOTIONS SUCH AS LOVE AND ANXIETY RARE?
Following are survey questions related to the issue of love and anxiety, and the answers.
Did the individual you were involved with verbally express love or caring for you?
Yes: 85.1%
No: 11.9%
If the person verbally expressed love or caring to you, how often?
Daily: 44.1%
Weekly: 14.7%
From time to time: 24.9%
Rarely: 16.3%
After a period of time, was the person’s emotional expression mostly limited to irritability, anger and hostility, and acknowledgement and articulation of other emotions, such as love or anxiety, became rare?
Yes: 72.0%
No: 21.1%
Did the person you were involved with display charm and concern in public, but hostility and anger in private?
Yes: 84.8%
No: 12.8%
Did the person you were involved with express fear or anxiety?
Yes: 47.9%
No: 50.7%
Conclusion: Antisocial individuals do indeed express love, although they are acting. Unfortunately, it is an extremely convincing act. When asked to describe how the person expressed love, comments from the survey included:
“He used expressions of loving and caring to lure me into a relationship with him and to keep me from leaving the relationship. Therefore, he did express love and/or caring throughout the relationship, although in hindsight I know that these were calculated performances designed to fit my own needs.”
“It was the greatest game for him totally adoring, expressing love in every way imaginable until he had ”˜conquered’ and was sure of me which took some time to get me into the trap completely, but once that happened, he changed and as I became more aware of his lies, his imagination, he then found another.”
“A convincing way of expressing love, such that I was 100% sure she experienced it.”
“He would say, ”˜I only do and say these things because I love you.’ I became confused about what love really means.”
Recent news stories have included con artists like “Clark Rockefeller” who was evaluated by a psychiatrist, found to be antisocial and yet claimed to “love” his family. The judge in this case acknowledged the defendant’s “love for” his daughter, whom he kidnapped. It is our concern that if this statement remains in the DSM, the presence of professed love will be interpreted as “ruling out” this personality type.
Lovefraud recommends that the sentence, “Their emotional expression is mostly limited to irritability, anger, and hostility; acknowledgement and articulation of other emotions, such as love and anxiety, are rare,” be ELIMINATED FROM THE DEFINITION. We are concerned that if it remains, a clinician, hearing a sociopath talk about his/her love for partner or family, or his/her fear and anxieties, will fail to diagnose the personality disorder when, in fact, this diagnosis is appropriate.
In fact, people with this disorder negatively, and often tragically, affect their spouses, romantic partners and other family members. Perhaps this fact should be included in the description of the disorder.
WHAT SHOULD THIS DISORDER BE CALLED?
The public does not understand antisocial personality disorder. This is an extremely dangerous situation. Antisocial individuals are social predators at worst, and parasites at best, who live by exploiting others. We find that once a person becomes entangled with a sociopath, there is virtually no support from institutions such as law enforcement and the courts. Therefore the only way to protect the public from sociopaths in the community is to teach people what this disorder is all about, so that if they start seeing the signs, they can escape before serious damage is done.
The survey asked the following questions:
Before your involvement with this disordered individual, what did you understand the term “sociopath” to mean?
Criminal: 19.2%
Serial killer: 19.4%
Someone who was delusional: 6.4%
Person without empathy or a conscience: 19.7%
I didn’t know what it meant: 35.3%
Before your involvement with this disordered individual, what did you understand the term “psychopath” to mean?
Criminal: 15.0%
Serial killer: 51.2%
Someone who was delusional: 13.4%
Person without empathy or a conscience: 8.9%
I didn’t know what it meant: 11.5%
In your view, what term should be used to describe this disorder?
Antisocial personality disorder: 10.9%
Sociopath: 34.9%
Psychopath: 11.3%
Antisocial/Psychopathic Type personality disorder: 43.0%
Conclusion: If we are going to educate the public about this disorder, we cannot use the term “psychopath.” Probably due to mass media, most people believe that a psychopath is a serial killer. This cultural bias is simply too strong to overcome.
People are confused about the term “antisocial—”people tend to believe it refers to someone who doesn’t want to be around others, like a hermit. This is certainly not the case with the individuals we are discussing—they love being around people, although they view every social interaction as a feeding opportunity.
Although 43% of our survey respondents approved of the term “antisocial/psychopathic type personality disorder,” from a communications perspective, this terminology is a disaster. In order to educate, we need to be able to identify the individual. What do we call this person? An “antisocial slash psychopathic type personality disordered person”? The suggested term obfuscates the definition. We need clarity.
Lovefraud recommends using the second-place term”—sociopath.” The word is already in the lexicon, but it doesn’t have the cultural baggage of “psychopath” and the misunderstanding of “antisocial.” The fact that most people are unsure of what “sociopath” means gives us an opportunity to teach them. “Sociopath” is one word—a word that can be defined. Remember, in 1930, Dr. Partridge made very strong arguments against the use of the term “psychopath.” His arguments remain valid today.
This is perhaps the only disorder in the DSM where the very criteria imply victimization of others. Therefore, the need for victim and public education should be taken into consideration as the disorder is renamed and described. Perhaps professional societies such as the Society for the Scientific Study of Psychopathy should be consulted to arrive at a consensus name for this disorder. Then, once the disorder is officially renamed, issue a press release and actively discourage the use of other terms. Confusion was created when mainstream psychiatry had valid reasons for changing the name of the disorder from psychopathy to sociopathy, but since there was no real consensus, many continued to use the term “psychopath.” The use of multiple terms has thwarted efforts to educate people about this disorder. These many terms also give the false impression that there is more than one categorical disorder, one that is largely genetic and another that is entirely environmental in origin.
If any member of the DSM-5 committee would like to discuss Lovefraud’s findings, the needs of victims and family members, and our recommendations further, we are available.
Donna Andersen, author of Lovefraud.com
Liane J. Leedom, M.D., contributing author to the Lovefraud Blog
How to recognize and recover from the sociopaths – narcissists in your life
https://lovefraud.com/blog/
Ya know..
its funny how after posting my vegetable soup request, I had a feeling or knew someone in particular here was going to jump to the task…faster than a rabbit!!!!
I knew it! I felt it within!!!! It actually crossed my mind thats something they would do. Their predictability is uncanny!!!!!
Im LEARNING…. Im totally learning!!!!!! WOOHOOOOOOOOO
Catch up with all you wonderful real peeps soon!
I am probably the only one here who feels this way, but I actually appreciate Douglas for being straightforward about what he is.
I also believe & agree with what he says over on the other thread (I’m paraphrasing):
“We should be much more concerned and weary about the intruders who come onto this site INSIDIOUSLY & COVERTLY and enmesh themselves with the innocent members.”
I have not seen Douglas display aggression towards anyone here.
Of course, I disagree with his comments.
But, he’s been clear about what he is right from the beginning.
So, when someone confesses to being a sociopath, why should I get upset when he also talks like one and acts like one?
That should be expected when we are dealing with sociopaths, right?
If I see a duck, I am not going to get angry when I hear a “quack”.
Kathleen Hawk explains it best.
She says (I’m paraphrasing):
“We have a choice about what we pay attention to and what we react to. If something triggers you, try looking within YOURSELF, and ask yourself why you are having this reaction.
Find out where the emotions are coming from.
And then you can decide if it’s worth it to react or not.”
Kathleen is better at explaining these things, but I think that’s the main point.
Anyway, I hope this helps anyone who may be having problems with emotional triggers or gaslighting.
You arent the only one who actually appreciated him for being straightforward.
As this morning I came to that conclusion myself when I wrote
“proof there is something to be learned from every experience (in life or on-line). I guess its helpful that Douglas revealed himself as a self-proclaimed sociopath and also as a patient being diagnosed with Schizoid Personality Disorder”
I learned that it actually does make predictability easier and much easier for me to steer away.
My reaction was a protectiveness for others and coveting the lack of them actually wanting to peruse this site. But through discussing my thoughts I realized when Donna expressed that they are going to be everywhere – including here – Im thankful for the self-proclaimed ones who reveal themselves — I can learn from what they say/how they react. And I am!
Ill always be triggered by a Sociopath – but I certainly dont always have to choose to react. Thats my goal!
Rosa:
You make some good points.
And this is why I see value in trollers as well……it points out things in me of which I need to work on…..here onLF….a safe environment and not in the vulverable ‘real’ world.
Triggers etc…..Kathleens points….
so true.
I saw someone setting up for bait….then the boom lowered…..
I saw a victim…..and a taunter…….
I wasn’t going to wait until the boom lowered…….
This is MY personal stance…..I don’t have to be nice….I don’t have to show compassion…..If I’m not clear…..
I saw babblybook and false statements…..and when Learned called Bullshit…it changed the stance…..
Just becuase they draw in….like talking cats and all….very innocent indeed…..doesn’t mean I must participate…..my choice….
I saw passive agressive……
And of course the name certainly didn’t help me one bit!
🙂
Thanks for your ever so balanced as always insight!
My observation has been that when on a “special interst” group, say, for example, Star’s reptile site, some one comes on and starts out by saying, “I really hate snakes. I like to hurt snakes. I don’t understand why you people want to keep those nasty slimy creatures, there must be something wrong with you,” I don’t think they are really seeking answers to “why you people keep those nasty slimy creatures.” First off, they announce their ignorance and that they are don’t know much about snakes, as snakes are NOT slimy or nasty, for that matter.
Now I really am not particularly fond of snakes in general as pets, but from my days as a wild life photographer I had quiet a bit of contact with them. Around my home, because mice tend to congregate around houses and barns we have quite a few copper head snakes, which have great camo and can lie still and be “invisible” just before they nail you and bite.
Every poison snake I find anywhere around my place I KILL. I do my best to keep down mice as well so snakes are not attracted here in the first place, and I am cautious about WHERE I put my hands and feet. I don’t walk outside after dark barefoot, and I don’t put my hands under rocks or anything else without being able to see what is under there.
It would be quite inappropriate, and a few other words that I can think of though, for me to go to Star’s reptile site and keep on blogging there, though I knew that those people did not want me there and really, except for my own attention seeking behavior in causing a stir, I would not be “educating” them any and I sure would not be getting educated by them. Our views are entirely different. Even if I did announce myself as a snake hater when I first went there.
Many times though, that kind of inappropriate and immature attention seeking is just that, immature behavior from someone who doesn’t have the maturity to behave appropriately.
I think the best way to handle someone who comes to Star’s reptile site and starts out by behaving as an ignorant and irritating influence is to ignore them. I think that is what Star should do, but Star’s a big girl and I think she can make up her mind how she wants to either interact with them or to ignore them. For me, I will just stay off Star’s reptile site, I really don’t have any interst in causing a fuss and I have other things that are more productive to do.
TOWANDA!!!!
My xb/f socio told me to read the book…”The Art of War”.
I wonder if thats where Douglas got that quote from.
Its a shame that socios are so fearful of the world out there and paranoid…and think “there’s always someone around the corner trying to jam you up”. That was what my xsocio taught me. To watch out for people out there. They seem to be so afraid of getting hurt..so they are always trying to protect themselves. They see everyone as “the enemy”.
What a sad way to live. However, the “predator” (him) taught ME , (the prey) and important lesson in life. Don’t trust anyone unconditionally.
For really goodhearted people..this is a valuable lesson. It surely has changed my way of seeing the world. It made me stronger than I’ve ever been.
I was always too nice. Some eople mistake kindness for weakness. It was a great lesson for me.
Yeah, he told me I was too nice.
He could be sweet when he wanted. I guess it was all for reasons known only to him.
Whatever they were, not hay to me anymore.
I was always an “analyst”. I am very interested in what I learned from my last relationship with a sociopath. I would love to study “sociology/psychology”. I always wanted to be a psychologist/therapist. Maybe this r/s has helped me to pursue a new career.
When I was a special ed teacher, I worked well with the most “difficult” kids in the high school I taught at for 15 yrs. My boss assigned me to the “alternative” program…which was basically higher IQ kids…criminal minds. We called them ED…emotionally disturbed. Now they call them BD…behavioral disordered.
Noone could handle them like I did. (Guess I had alot of experience growing up with a socio mom and having socio b/f’s!) I listened to them…esp about their fears and I realized that they were all “big babies” in adult bodies…
Most had criminal records…juvenile delinquents.
What I found was that they were really scared little boys deep down….so they hurt alot of people. They were full of deep rooted anger and even though people think “narcissists” love themselves….they really don’t like themselves at all. They are hurt and angry. So, they hurt others…blame others…etc…
I am too strong to “engage” and be triggered by sociopaths now. I know the “rules” of how to not take anything they do or say personally. They see the world differently and there is no rationalizing with them. Its like talking to a 3 yr old…thats really where they are emotionally. No use confronting them..they think they win….because once they can “get to you”…they win. Just like 3 yr olds.
Its just so interesting that these “disordered” people are on this earth…all around us…and it is the reason why we have wars….
I would love to study them more.
Dear 2B,
To me, they are really “interesting” (NOT!) They are kind of like rattle snakes, and that is just the way they are.
I’m afraid I don’t share your idea that they are just “scared little boys” inside because I know ones that have killed and raped little kids, so I don’t have much empathy for that “scared little boy” inside them, I think they are capable of EVIL and actually enjoy it. Maybe there are some who are just emotinally and environmentally problematic that have something “good” down inside, but the ones I know, the ones I’ve seen, are about as sympapthetic as SAtan himself.
Personally, I spent several decades trying to find the “scared little boy” inside the “Rosemary’s Baby” I gave birth to, and it wasn’t there—just the offspring of EVIL! Nits make lice.