Last week Lovefraud posted an article that described one woman’s experience of romantic manipulation by a sociopath. Another reader responded with advice.
This woman had been married to a narcissist, which in many ways is similar to a sociopath. Once she divorced him and started dating again, she relied on a list of red flags. “If I saw even ONE flag, the guy was OUT of my life, period,” she says. Here is her list.
Red flags
1) Needing to be around you as much as possible and knowing where you are at all times.
2) Refusing to have any meaningful social life, even with his own family.
3) Telling you what to wear and advising what is “appropriate clothing” for you.
4) Requesting that you spend all your free time with him and NONE with friends. (In the beginning, you can see friends on a limited basis, but he has to be there.)
5) Absolutely NO male friends or hugging any male.
6) Dictating what you look like, i.e., you should wear glasses instead of contact lenses, less makeup, less jewelry, etc.
7) No more going to the gym, men might look at you there while exercising.
8 ) Outright anger when you join a church or any other “institution.” The REAL issue is…he is afraid a priest or other “authority” will tell you what to do and “control” you.
9) Encouraging you to engage in unhealthy habits like not losing weight. They use these “bad habits” later to criticize you.
10) You cannot be “too friendly.” People might get the “wrong idea,” especially MEN.
11) You have the feeling of walking on eggshells, waiting for a blow-up if you say the wrong thing or say the right thing in a way he does not like.
12) You know he thinks he is smarter and better than others by his almost constant criticism of others…words like “idiot” and “slow learner” are a common part of his everyday language as he discusses others.
13) He loves the thrill of a good “fight” with nearly anyone, but when he perceives himself as the loser, he is a very poor one and there are always rationalizations for WHY he lost and they have nothing to do with HIM, of course.
14) He acts like he cares what you think, gives lip service to being “liberal” and open minded but his actions are the opposite.
15) He thinks absolutely NOTHING of lying and will take advantage of anyone at anytime if it furthers his goals.
16) You have never met anyone like him”¦he does things that no one else does…his behavior is simply outrageous to others and they shake their heads and say what GALL!
17) The rules do NOT EVER apply to him…he is above them.
18) He resents, on many levels, having to care for his children unless a woman is around to take on most of the “burden.”
19) He often “forgets” what he is supposed to do for his children (especially when it involves anything to do with money).
20) He says things that simply make NO sense and you, as a rational, logical person, just cannot quite figure it out.
21) He shows up with no notice at your job or home (no common sense of courtesy).
22) When he thinks he is being rejected, he calls, emails, comes to your home or job obsessively and often actually stalks.
23) Early in the relationship you are his “whole world” and he does not want to spend any time with anyone but you.
24) He seldom thanks anyone for anything.
25) These men are VERY adept at fooling others”¦everyone thinks they are just great and love you so much”¦BEWARE!
By the way, the woman who compiled—and applied—this list of red flags has healed and met a wonderful man who is now her fiancé.
After reading through the entire thread now, I have a few thing to add. Some of them have already been discussed in other blogs, but for me, these are the most important cue off the bat.
The problem that I see with many of the things listed as “red flags” are behaviours that define sociopathic and other personality disorder behaviours, and ways we can make sense and recognize them and say AFTER THE FACT, that yes this is sick and not normal.
However, what I would be on the look-out for is not the later behaviours, once we’ve been hooked because by then it was already too late for us.
For example, one of these would be the “push and pull, love bomb and dump/rejection” ploy to instill emotional stress, insecurity and disequalibrium. Had I KNOWN that this was what was going on at the time, and that I was dealing with a sociopath and NOT as I was told a “tormented, confused and guilt-ridden sensitive man who just needed help and didn’t know what to do” I would have RUN!!!!
But no, that came too late and I was already too hooked by then. It’s like I already COMMITED to sit down and play a game of RISK with this creep (only I thought we were playing the game of LIFE)…until ONLY ONE PERSON is left standing. Once I sit down and commit the rest is just mechinations by the Sociopath to get EVERYTHING.
So, the question to me is “How do I NOT GET HOOKED?”
That really lessons the RED FLAGS for me.
Here’s mine:
1.) Instant CHEMISTRY.
Really strong overpowering physical vibes
There is something compelling about him
You feel like you have met your soul mate
He knows all the right things to say, all the right topics, loves all the things you do…you are BLOWN AWAY and feels like he was sent to you as your IDEAL MAN from the GET-GO.
He seems PERFECT…too perfect (like someone read your diary).
2) PITY PLAY
very early on…maybe even the first time you meet
a man might cry copious tears and share his “pain” with you right away
your EMPATHY is on high alert
you immediately feel sorry for him and want to do so much to help him
you can’t believe you’ve met such an open and sensitive guy
you feel protective and caring instantly even though you barely know him..but you feel like you do…because he’s IDEAL afterall
3) YOU START BEHAVING OUT OF CHARACTER
you do things you wouldn’t normally do
you make excuses for him
Once all 3 of those are in play, you are toast.
GREAT Article and I’m glad I found it. I’ve been slowing making my way through LF and all that’s been written here.
RED FLAG #1 -This was HUGE early on in my relationship with him. He would call several times a day just to “hear my voice”. He would talk about how wonderful it was that we had finally found the “perfect” relationship and needed no one else. He would follow me into every room in the house and refused to go to sleep unless I was there. He called where I worked. If I didn’t answer the phone at home, he would send his mother over to see if I was “OK”. By the time that started happening, I knew there was something wrong here but before I hit that stage, I truly believed his BS, which was really that because the whole time he was pulling this crap, he was already screwing around with someone else!
icanseeclearly, I was TOAST with butter and jam!
The instant “chemistry” was overwhelming and the tears were there almost from the start. He can still cry faster than I can turn on my faucet. I really thought I had met the one and only knight in shining armor, but as my friend pointed out, what I REALLY got was Satan himself on the dockey, sitting backwards. I carry that picture with me all the time now and the only toast I eat is what I make.
YOU START BEHAVING OUT OF CHARACTER.
It took me a long time to see that I wasn’t myself, that I was making allowances for him that I wouldn’t even make for myself. I started not liking me because the person I had become wasn’t one I wouldn’t have put up with in any other set of circumstances. I “excused away” things that were morally, ethically and legally wrong.
I don’t do that today. My sense of self is coming back but I spent a long time being lost in his world. It’s so not a pretty place to be. Ick!
Dear YOUcanseeclearlynow,
YES!!!!!!!
They do come on like you are THE most interesting person in the world and they just can’t wait to be your INSTANT BEST FRIEND, and the FLATTERY is over powering.
I used to call this “making application for instant best friend” and I noticed this especially with WOMEN who are Borderline Personality Disorder (which is more or less a female version of a male Psychopath/user) and from then on decided that people who come on that way and sort of “court” me as a “friend” very quickly are “suspect” and I back off from them and observe….usually I would be right.
However, when my P-BF started doing the same thing after my husband had died and I was lonely, I DIDN’T APPLY WHAT I KNEW TO APPLY, AND he love-bombed me and bingo, I’m HOOKED.
The Pity Play—yep mine did that too and before long
#3 kicked in and I’m DOWN FOR THE COUNT…..4 months of bliss, 4 months of hell, kicked him to the curb and ANOTHER few months of pain and grief.
You have some good things in your post, things we NEED TO KEEP IN OUR MINDS ANY TIME WE FEEL #1 AND 2, WHICH HOPEFULLY WILL PREVENT #3. (HUGS)))
Cat:
Satan on a donkey is a great picture!! Yup. That works for me.
Everything you said about making allowances for him and not liking yourself and excusing behaviour from him you wouldn’t allow from yourself – check, check and check. ALL of it. Yes, I started to feel like NOT GOOD about myself because of this from very early on and instead of sticking to my guns and realizing this was a SIGN, I kept right on believing the MIRAGE, addicted to the charisma and the seduction play that I felt as love.
Not a pretty place to be is an epic understatement. ICK – good word!!
Oxy:
Oh you make a great point in adding in about the FLATTERY. That’s another tip-off with the love-bombing and the instant chemistry. The over the top flattery is a sure sign. You know it’s funny because there is a part of me, the small voice or gut feeling that is there all along that is being smothered with the chemistry, which recognizes all of these signs. I told him so many times that the flattery was too much. I HATE flattery normally. But HOW he made it feel different somehow is creepy, creepy, creepy. I honestly think there is a chemical component to some of these attractions. Something was “clicked” in me when I was around him that made me stupid. I think another part of it is the CONSTANT physical and sensory overload and I think that that somehow kills the SMART MESSAGES of self preservation that we would naturally get.
You also make a good point about the INSTANT BEST FRIENDS thing. I have had run-ins with women like this as well. Without a doubt, it is a ploy by Cluster B’s and sociopaths.
NEVER AGAIN.
((hugs back to ya))) 🙂
Dear Youcanseeclearly now,
We all like to hear nice things about ourselves, and especially if we have not heard good things in a while, or are lonely, etc. and it is SUCH A HOOK, who would NOT want to be around someone who thinks we are charming, beautiful, interesting, witty, sexy? Yep, that is a great HOOK.
I fell for the big HOOK with my X-BF-P and he sank the trebble hook deep into my heart and it was very painful when he started pulling on the line to reel me in. I just thank God I got like a “flash” of what he was, suddenly, my eyes opened and I saw he was “just like” another predator-P I knew and crying like a baby, I pulled the hook out, but took me months of pain to recover.
WANTING to think the BEST about those we meet, and wanting to believe the wonderful things they say ABOUT US…gets us in trouble.
And yes, that “CHEMISTRY” is chemical, all that flattery and sexual teasing and so on LIGHTS UP OUR BRAIN CHEMICALS and falling in love and bonding is WONDERFUL—just like some kind of wonderful DRUG!!!! And we get addicted to these “feel good” internal drugs quickly. IN a good relationship they are good, but in a situation where it is a psychopath bonding us to them, it is pathological and fatal to US and our souls and sometimes our finances and even our lives.
Loving anyone–friend, lover, child, parent, etc. lets us be VULNERABLE to pain of loss when something goes wrfong. The more we love the more vulnerable we are and to a bigger loss and pain. NOT loving would “keep us safe” from pain, but it would totally get rid of any pleasure in life. So, we just have to be “careful” and “cautious” and use our good sense and learn to set boundaries and to not get “hooked” too quickly. While it is possible to have “love at first sight” that does work out, I think it is more likely to be a good relationship if it grows over TIME in a healthy way.
WAtching the red flags and distancing yourself from the FIRST sign of DISHONESTY or manipulation is the best way to help ourselves stay P-free and we still may be caught, but not I think as likely. But believe me, I have been “caught” by friends, relatives and a lover and I’m still discovering I’m not as cautious as I should be. It takes work, practice and time.
I posted this quote on my FB page – when outing myself as having been duped by a spath yesterday – and here’s one friends comments:
ONE STEP “The great masses of the people… will more easily fall victims to a big lie than to a small one.” ”“ Adolph Hitler
ONE STEP’S FRIEND
He was a wordsmith gotta give him that
ONE STEP
haha – when your comment showed up in my email inbox, I thought it was in response to my quote about the sociopath!
SNORT!
ONE STEP
um, the one I met – not the Hitler one.
ONE STEP’S FRIEND
ROFL! If there needs to be a distinction made, then there isn’t much of a distinction to be had.
ONE STEP
EXACTLY!
Hi Oxy,
For me the flattery wasn’t the hook, but a sign that I ignored. You know, one of those annoying nudges you in the gut every time you hear it kind of things? I see it as my self preservation intuition sending me a message. The problem is that I didn’t listen to it. It was smothered by all the other hooks into my weaknesses.
I have a feeling it’s different for everyone and their own experience, which tactics actually hook you in and I’m fairly certain that the sociopaths KNOW who to target and WHAT to use on us that will work like a charm.
For me the hook was that he knew all the right things to say and way to act to catch me. I was an open book online with blogs and a profile that basically gave a blueprint for any skilled con man. He even told me, early on in the relationship, “I KNEW you would love me.” What he did was turn himself into the “perfect man” that he knew I would fall for.
When he contacted me I was NOT feeling lonely. I did NOT have low self esteem. I was NOT looking for a man or a relationship. I did NOT need someone to make me feel good about myself.
Quite the opposite. I was feeling energized, happy, satisfied with my life, proactive, and I was on the road to achieving goals I had set for my life. I was not OUT LOOKING for anything.
But, my need to “do good” and “see the best” and my own problem with setting boundaries was obviously still an issue that I didn’t realize had not been solved for myself. It was not causing me problems at that time in my life (although it has from time to time repeatedly cropped up in work situations and other interpersonal relations where I’d feel taken for granted or walked over or scapegoated).
So, I think it’s the sociopath’s recognition of that factor in us, the SCAPEGOAT factor and OVER ACCOUNTABILITY plus the HIGHLY EMPATHIC nature that they know they can hook us with their manipulative act.
As for the chemistry, I am convinced from my own physical experience that some kind of a pathological chemical addiction thing occurs in which they are actually FEEDING off of the prey.
I don’t know if there have been any studies done on this, but it would be very interesting.
I feel like I am recuperating from a major illness/addiction and wouldn’t a nice idyllic rehab retreat be wonderful! One with an art studio 🙂
Dear Youcanseeclearly now,
Yep, I LIVE IN SUCH A RETREAT, COMPLETE WITH THE ART STUDIO, but it is still such a painful walk sometimes.
Yes, they know which thing to hook into and at the time my P-BF hooked into the “lonely older widow” who felt like she would spend the rest of her life now alone….I had a good marriage and when my husband died suddenly it was my foundation that crumbled, along with my self esteem, my whole world.
I didn’t set boundaries well either with folks close to me, “friends” and “family” were able to abuse and abuse me and I kept as steve’s article said “compartmenting” the problems rather than facing the BIG PICTURE and boy, did that article come at the PERFECT TIME FOR ME! Happens a lot around here I think for many of us.
Yea, I was also OVER accountable for everyone’s welfare and happiness. The world couldn’t run without me taking care of everyone’s needs, except my own.
Yes, there are some studies on the chemical changes in our brains with addictions (not just to substances) and to “love” and “bonding” and so on. Apparently Oxytocin is one of the big bonding hormones and the Ps don’t have enough RECEPTORS for it.
Abour red flags – in the basic description of the sociopath profile, it says that their expressions of love and other emotions are unconvincing. I remember that. I found it hard to believe him, and I had to try and convince myself – “why would someone say that if they don’t mean it?” (why indeed, unless they’re psychopaths). There was something in the look and in the tone that wasn’t right, though I couldn’t put my finger on it. He also kept asking if I believed him, and had that happy (read: triumphant) look if I said yes.
I have another red flag…I don’t think it’s relevant to anyone, it’s probably a signpost for generic losers not just sociopaths, but I’ll mention it anyway just for a laugh! So….Did anyone have a sociopath who was too lazy to go to the bathroom and used plastic bottles instead?
oh fk. my fahter. when driving.