Last week Lovefraud posted an article that described one woman’s experience of romantic manipulation by a sociopath. Another reader responded with advice.
This woman had been married to a narcissist, which in many ways is similar to a sociopath. Once she divorced him and started dating again, she relied on a list of red flags. “If I saw even ONE flag, the guy was OUT of my life, period,” she says. Here is her list.
Red flags
1) Needing to be around you as much as possible and knowing where you are at all times.
2) Refusing to have any meaningful social life, even with his own family.
3) Telling you what to wear and advising what is “appropriate clothing” for you.
4) Requesting that you spend all your free time with him and NONE with friends. (In the beginning, you can see friends on a limited basis, but he has to be there.)
5) Absolutely NO male friends or hugging any male.
6) Dictating what you look like, i.e., you should wear glasses instead of contact lenses, less makeup, less jewelry, etc.
7) No more going to the gym, men might look at you there while exercising.
8 ) Outright anger when you join a church or any other “institution.” The REAL issue is…he is afraid a priest or other “authority” will tell you what to do and “control” you.
9) Encouraging you to engage in unhealthy habits like not losing weight. They use these “bad habits” later to criticize you.
10) You cannot be “too friendly.” People might get the “wrong idea,” especially MEN.
11) You have the feeling of walking on eggshells, waiting for a blow-up if you say the wrong thing or say the right thing in a way he does not like.
12) You know he thinks he is smarter and better than others by his almost constant criticism of others…words like “idiot” and “slow learner” are a common part of his everyday language as he discusses others.
13) He loves the thrill of a good “fight” with nearly anyone, but when he perceives himself as the loser, he is a very poor one and there are always rationalizations for WHY he lost and they have nothing to do with HIM, of course.
14) He acts like he cares what you think, gives lip service to being “liberal” and open minded but his actions are the opposite.
15) He thinks absolutely NOTHING of lying and will take advantage of anyone at anytime if it furthers his goals.
16) You have never met anyone like him”¦he does things that no one else does…his behavior is simply outrageous to others and they shake their heads and say what GALL!
17) The rules do NOT EVER apply to him…he is above them.
18) He resents, on many levels, having to care for his children unless a woman is around to take on most of the “burden.”
19) He often “forgets” what he is supposed to do for his children (especially when it involves anything to do with money).
20) He says things that simply make NO sense and you, as a rational, logical person, just cannot quite figure it out.
21) He shows up with no notice at your job or home (no common sense of courtesy).
22) When he thinks he is being rejected, he calls, emails, comes to your home or job obsessively and often actually stalks.
23) Early in the relationship you are his “whole world” and he does not want to spend any time with anyone but you.
24) He seldom thanks anyone for anything.
25) These men are VERY adept at fooling others”¦everyone thinks they are just great and love you so much”¦BEWARE!
By the way, the woman who compiled—and applied—this list of red flags has healed and met a wonderful man who is now her fiancé.
Feeling anger is a good thing.. just a part of recovery and release..
and Star.. I think that it is a sign of the times.. and or our personal awareness… they are revealing themselves really fast and we are seeing it…
There are more and more desperate people in this world.. and they can’t hide as easily as they once could.. and they are trying to attach to any and everyone…
I had a date with what first appeared in the first few seconds as an upstanding attorney.. and in thirty minutes I am thinking something is off with this man..
and but the end of the date.. I knew something was wrong but couldn’t put my finger on it.. he began saying things like we are dating and I am going to take you to Paris.. blah blah.. we had one more date planned and I almost cancelled it .. but he had driven a long way so being ‘nice’ I didn’t.. and wham…
he became abusive.. he was a dominating control freak.. and was the one that asked if I was one of those women that waited until marriage tohave sex…
My answer was … “Who ever said that I wanted to get married?… good bye!”
Kathy, I can so identify with what you said about the anger. In so much of my life, I also wasn’t “allowed” to feel anger, justifiable anger, because with my egg donor’s definition, if I felt angry at someone for abuse, then I had “not forgiven” them and therefore was condemning myself to hell-fire-and-brimstone for my feelings of anger.
that’s a powerful message to lay on a child and when the child feels anger at another, they shame and castigate themselves for being a failure. For being “bad.” Just verbalizing this, seeing a pattern here, and then looking back over my life from an early age and seeing how I crushed down my feelilngs of anger, I can so relate to what you said about when it finally came out, it was a huge feeling of anger.
But you are right too, I don’t want to live with this terrible burden of BEING ANGRY all the time—so since crushing it down isn’t the answer, and feeling it all the time isn’t the answer either, so some how I had to come to a way to feel it, acknowledge it was justifiable (or not as the case may be) and then RESOLVE IT. Since I had no way to know, no training in WHAT is justifiable, or HOW to “resolve” it in a healthy way, it was a trial and error method for a while and I would over or under do it. Just like a kid on a bike making over or under corrections for balance and then falling. but I learned, and AM STILL LEARNING, how to acknowledge, assess, process and resolve my angers so that they are done with.
I have not, I know, 100% resolved my angers at my egg donor or my son, though I think I have with the X-BF-P, and even with my X-DIL, primarily I think because I cared less about those two Ps in the first place than I did with my P-son and my egg donor. Even my P-sperm donor I’ve pretty well I think completely resolved and processed my anger at him. I didn’t totally realize that until he died and his estate contacted me to let me know I didn’t get anything. LOL LIke I expected anything, I was suprised though, that he cut 2 of my other 3 sibs out of the will as well and left it all to his youngest son, a “clone” of himself.
I can STOKE my anger if I try, but I don’t see a benefit in doing that so I don’t. I do acknowledge my anger though, and if it is justified I try to acknowledge and resolve it rather than supress it.
In some cases, “resolving” the anger includes that I disengage from the person who made me angry and limit or stop my relationshiip with them. Resolving the anger for me means taking ACTION not pasively enduring iinsult or injury, and for sure, not allowing that same person to re-insult or re-injure me again.
The action may be verbal, or the action may simply “voting with my feet” and quietly slipping away from the cause of the anger. I realize now that all ACTION doesn’t even have to appear to be action, but can be a stepping quietly away, witout slamming the door, giving them the finger, or yelling names at them. I’m learning through that QUIET ACTION to get my own closure, my actions are my “last words” and maybe they don’t even realize I’ve HAD the “last word” but I have. I’ve made a DELIBERATE CHOICE of ACTION and validated myself. That lets the anger resolve and drift naturally away.
Setting boundaries, enforcing them, can be done with deliberate action and there are many ways to accomplish that. Sometimes it is with a verbal setting so there is no unclearness about my expectations, and sometimes, it is simply distancing myself from the person because they are not actually ‘worth enough” to me to confront it. Some relationships simply aren’t worth the hot air in the breath to try to explain to the person why what they are doing is not appropriate.
I think I have finally grown past the need for the “last (audible) word” to the person or relationship that has made me angry, cause most of the time, it is wasted effort and doesn’t accomplish anything expecpt frustrate me.
Somtimes expressing the anger or the last word is for you not the other person.. it’s getting it out… but agree disengaging is good also..
I have to express until I get it out… I don’t anger often but when I do .. I express it clearly. I have been told that it why that I am so healthy.. I express.. I emote… I don’t hold it in.. I express appropriately though.. as a child I I was clearly taught how and how not to behave and this stifled me until I went into therapy and learned that I should honor my feelings and to express them and if someone can’t handle it .. tell them so long…
Abusers don’t want to hear or feel your anger.. or your emotions.. emotions are caused by feelings that this is what makes us sentient beings.. denying feeling will make us sick….
Kathleen,
I see the past 3.5 years as a gift…..I wholeheartedly feel this way….
The emotions have sucked, the pain and lonliness have sucked and the being slapped upside the head with a 2×4 of reality has been hard…..
BUT…..here I am…..growing, learning and living my choice!
Sometimes it’s not so good…..sometimes it’s great…..
I embrace my anger and I know that stiffeling it has hurt my health……I wrestle with the ‘old’ EB and her ways of coping, and responding to what I go through day to day……and am in need of constantly reminding myslef that it’s OKAY!
I have learned patience…..this was the gift of my divorce……I shut my mouth and spring when I need to ……without warning……
I used to feel the need to have the last word….and only found (through patience) that by blurting our the ‘last word’….it only provides a warning.
No need.
I am now a sponge…..I watch, observe and learn through others actions…..I think, and I think some more……how I wish to proceed in any given situation…..good or bad.
I guess I have become ‘cerebrial’ in that sence.
I look forward to the angry stage dissipating……but I know it’s a necessary part of the process…..I try to use it to empower myself…….
I do know that none of us can come out unscathed…..and I know in my heart……one day…..they will get what the universe decides they must!
I just need to learn how to not look forward to that day coming so much and concentrate on living MY life.
GRRRRRRRRRR…..from a growling EB!
Dear EB,
Oh, yea, having that last word DOES give them WARNING! and HOW I have learned to my regret–over and over—in fact, got one of those “letters from God” that said “Dear Oxy, You need to learn PATIENCE, so I’m going to give you another chance to learn it! Love God” Oh, yes!
Actually the people who make us the most angry are of two kinds…one: the ones who INTENDED to make us angry, so by spouting back at them we give them REWARD and show them they got what they wanted–they pithed us off! Two: This kinid doesn’t CARE if you are angry, so spouting off at them just doesn’t faze them and ultimately they could CARE LESS if you are angry, that’s your problems.
SO, in either case, I think, spouting off, even in a “lady like” manner doesn’t accomplish a darn thing AND in some cases it warns them. I have SHOT MYSELF IN THE FOOT many many MANY TIMES getting that last shot at them to show them just how angry I was. Like you, EB, I am learning PATIENCE though it has taken me a looooooong time. Also I am learning CRAFTY and CAUTIOUS because what GOOD does it do, really, besides give you a vent to let people like that KNOW how you feel? They don’t deserve it from me, and now that I really SEE that, any of the “feel good” I get from “tellin’ the f@c7er off doesn’t really give me any satisfaction at all because it doesn’t really accomplish anything positive at all.
However, walking away calmly and quietly sometimes does make them sit up and take NOTICE.
Where I developed the POTTED PLANT treatment was when years ago my friend was dating a P that hated me, or any of her friends actually. I was refinishing an antique chair in her garage adn had it in pieces.
One day he went out of town and we went over to his house to feed the dogs and let ourselves into his house through the garage, and what should I SPOT lying right there on top of another pile of junk, was a couple of the rungs and a back piece from MY CHAIR that he had taken just for the hell of it, so that I wouldn’t immediately miss it and would then wonder what happened to the pices of my chair and why some were missing.
When he came back, I was over at her house and had the pieces lying on the BAR so he would KNOW I KNEW and KNOW where I found them, but I refused to act like he was even in the room. I gave him the POTTED PLANT TREATMENT and it INFURIATED HIM.
Later when she tried to break up with him, he came into her house while she and I were gone and backed a truck up and had a couple of kids LOAD UP EVERYTHING SHE OWNED INCLUDING HER KIDS’ PICTURES AN DPUT IT IN STORAGE. He was her land lord and lied and said she owed him back rent which she didn’t.
She got a lawyer but it was going to be terribly expensive to fight it, so she ended up being friendly to him again and every weekend he would return ONE OR TWO of her things and my BF and I would have to go over there to help load them…so after a week or two of this when he would only give back 1 or 2 things I had my BF who was a huge guy, quietly tell the guy that “up til now, suzie and oxy had kept him from killing him, but he had decided he’d wasted enough weekends so we either got it ALL that day, or my BF was going to crack the guy’s spine and put him in a wheel chair since Oxy and Susie made him promise not to kill him.” LOL Guess what, we got it all back that day! LOL
a year or so later the guy came to the company my BF worked at, driving a borrowed truck (he was really cheap skate) and he wanted a “pick up truck load” of gravel lwhich was $3, but it didn’t FILL the truck because it was so heavy, it was just what a truck would haul WEIGHT WISE not volume wise. So the crane operator put the weight amount in the truck and the guy jumped up and down and screamed cause he was being “cheated” he wanted a TRUCK LOAD like he was supposed to get, so my BF who was teh foreman, looked at the crain operator and said, “Fill the man’s truck up, don’t cheat him John” So the guy FILLEd the truck, broke the axle in two and the wheels blew off and the tires blew out.
The P stood there jumping up and down and said “How am I going to get this out of here” MtyBF handed him a shovel and said, “Have it out of here at 7 a.m. by Monday or we will push it off with a bull dozer.
We would drive out there off and on all weekend while the guy was there shoveling gravel all weekend before he could call a tow truck. LOL What goes round comes round! I love it!
Sometimes these old HAPPY MEMORIES of dealing with a P and actually getting one over on them makes me smile. I guess there is really an evil streak down in old Oxy’s heart after all, but some things are just TOO GOOD to forget! ROTFLMAO
I LOVE IT…..
I don’t even question anymore, I have the evil deep down….I can’t tell you how many moments of chuckle I have had with the S biting hs own nose, tongue , lips and WALLET!
One of my favorites that pop into my mind, mostly when I’m drivning, is the “macully Caulkin’ home alone face ‘smear’ jaw drop the S did in court……THEN for me to have it recorded for eternity on DVD is even more CLASSIC!
This was his motion even before the judge ruled!!!!
Oh, heavin!!
My GF, is going through divorce curretnly….trial in early Jan…..
She’s getting really angry….and there is a lot of alimony money at stake for her…..A LOT!!!
She called me yesterday really pissed off. More at herself.
She said, she had called him for money, he refused and she went ballistic. She has bills ot pay and is feeling cornered.
He has 200K cash in the safe at the home and he changed the combo.
Her attrorney advised her to drill the safe, when he wasn’t home, but make sure she had anything and everything she wanted out of the house prior….because he would most likely get an order giving him posession of this home. (keeping her out)
She said to him…..you better send me a check or i’ll have the safe drilled.
I told her…..well…..that was fruitless….now all the money has been removed from the safe…YA THINK?
This is a perfect example of self control……
What is our goal? Purpose? (of having the last word)
Is it just to make us feel better…..cuz it’s false feelings…
It is to threaten or bully someone into doing what we want????
What is the goal here…..TO GET THE MONEY, so she can pay the bills…….
She should have shut her mouth……..bit the bullet, hired a safe driller dude on Christmas eve when he was gone with his family, and gone over and accomplished her goal.
Better outcome, no confrontation.
Sure, he would have been mad…..Oh well….she has the money now……be mad!
I’m worried about her going into trial not being able to control her outbursts…….she went ballistic in mediation….they know her weakness…..she won’t fare well……
\It ‘s all about self control and patience….
Who cares how we gotta get our point accomplished SILENTLY is best, as long as it gets done……that’s the only important ‘last word’ that we need……the pudding!!!
Back to the snake under the rock analogy……
SOmetimes we gotta let them pass on the trail a few times before we strike…..sometimes they will trip themselves and break their own ankles before we bite them…..and we can save our ‘venom’ for a next time…..
Stay hidden and cozy under that warm rock folks……and ONLY strike when the strikens hot and there is no antivenom available for miles……
PATIENCE my dear….PATIENCE!!!
Geez! I agree… she blurted out something when she should’ve acted…
She should’ve gotten everything that she wanted out… drilled the safe and left….
Darn it! Why did she tell him what she was thinking about doing…?
ErinBrock:
That snake analogy is one of my favorites on this site.
I’m actually utilizing that one in my real life.
My other favorite is Kathleen Hawk’s? dolphin analogy.
I’m using that one, too.
On a full-time basis, I think I’d rather be a dolphin than a snake, because dolphins are so much more friendly and lovable.
But, sometimes, ya gotta do whatcha gotta do. 🙂 (HiSSS)
~A locksmith can open a safe. There’s a price to pay (nowhere near 200K though), but the good news is that the money is removed from the safe, and the safe is left unscathed.
Thank you Oxy, and Kathy….( I emailed you a while back a month ago , I may have an old address for you Kathy) its not funny my best friend actually went through a similar situation and says she refuses to change her phone # because of him she has had it for 17 years… its only bill collectors that call for her ex s/p/n…but she is standing her ground..
I just wish there was an easier way to deal with it… I have been told the Hopi Indians do not have language for past tense action or verbs. Because they deal with what happens in the “now” easier said than done.. its hard not to be angry and in hindsight feel anger for not listening to your gut, and the “redflags” just living in ignorance is bliss…. NOT… Thanks for sharing it helps a lot more than you know. I appreciate your words and experience sharing helps to know that I am no where near alone in this . Thanks Hugs !