Many people who write us have children who have their own attorneys because in difficult cases the court assigns and pays for them. We have heard many stories now and sadly it seems unusual that parents say these attorneys have helped protect their children.
It’s nice to know that the legal profession is also concerned that children receive ethical and competent representation. There is actually an American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers (AAML) that developed in 1995 Standards for Attorneys and Guardians ad Litem in Custody or Visitation Proceedings. These standards have recently been revised and there is considerable debate about just what the role of children’s attorneys should be.
In 2003, the American Bar Association developed its own standards, and in 2006, the Uniform Law Commission (ULC) (formerly the National Conference of Commissioners on Uniform State Laws) released a draft of its Model Act regarding children’s attorneys.
The heart of the debate is whether it is ethical for an attorney to formulate his/her own opinion about what would be best then argue for that opinion before the court.
In an important article, The AAML’s revised standards for representing children in custody and visitation proceedings: the reporter’s perspective, Martin Guggenheim, (Fiorello LaGuardia Professor of Clinical Law, New York University School of Law), argues that children’s attorneys should not be allowed to advocate for their own personal opinions. He states:
It is one thing to want to hear from a neutral investigator who has spoken with the child in an extended way. It is another entirely to empower this investigator to try to ensure that the case comes out the way the investigator wants. The one adds to the case the findings of the investigator but leaves the case in the hands of the court and the adult parties to debate how much the investigator’s views and opinions ought to matter. The other contaminates the proceeding by adding a forceful and skilled advocate who is now advocating for the outcome s/he has selected. This is not only dangerous; it is unnecessary.
Professor Guggeinheim argues that the court needs neutral trained experts that can assess families, report to the court and be subject to cross examination. A layers job is to advocate for what his client wants, Guggeinheim concludes “I hope others in the field of custody and visitation disputes who are interested in improving practice will build off of the (AAML’s) Standards by supporting efforts to limit sharply the use of the term “children’s attorney.” If we could agree to call someone a child’s lawyer only when we expect him or her to advocate for the objectives sought by the child, we can then work on the rest of the issues plaguing the field.”
The problem with lawyers formulating their own opinions and arguing for them, is that they are subject to being deceived by the sociopath and may not even know that psychopathic personality traits are something they should watch out for. I agree with Professor Guggeinheim in that allowing these lawyers to only represent the child’s wishes prevents them from having undue influence over the outcome.
Recently someone told me about a Guardian ad Litem (GAL) who tried to convince a child to see the psychopath parent saying “children are better off when they have relationships with their parents.” Thankfully the child now a tween is wise enough to understand that this dictum does not always apply.
In hearing these stories in the last 2 weeks I came to a realization. There has really been a great deal of research done regarding what factors help shape development in a positive way. It is only natural that clinicians, academics and others would want the family courts to utilize this information to help children. The problem is that clinicians are trained to understand and interpret the data that comes from these kinds of studies. They are also trained in how to apply that data to individual cases.
For example an oncologist reads about treatments for cancer. He knows that these treatments do not work 100% of the time. He also knows that there are certain characteristics of tumors that increase the likelihood they will respond. He then looks for these characteristics in individual patients and can predict how likely it is the patient will have the outcome suggested by clinical research. Clinicians have a natural understanding of percentages and variability in people.
The legal profession has an opposite mandate. Lawyers and judges ignore individual differences and try to treat everyone the same, equal justice under the law. Therefore, I conclude that it is impossible for a lawyer or judge without specialized training to understand how to apply clinical studies to a legal setting. We have to do a better job in the process of going from study to practice in the courtroom.
Please comment on your GAL experience in the comment section.
Addendum: Thanks to everyone who has written in response to this issue. I am working on getting back to you all! Everyone has very important insights to share.
Helloo Verity
How’ve you been doing lately.
Good to hear from you back on the board.
Delta 1 x
Hey Oxy and Delta *hugs both* Today I have vertigo and it’s knocked me down but I’m able to type now so I came to see what was happening.
When I was in my big anger just recently it was half killing me and I was getting triggered too much and taking it out on people here and at home and I knew I had to think about positive things instead of focusing on how much he hurt me and what was the matter with him that he could do it without seeming to care.
A friend sent me words from Susan Elliott of Getting Past Your Past to make me smile:
“Read ‘Men Who Hate Women and the Women Who Love Them’ because I can tell you (I would bet my house on it) your exBH is a woman hating low life std carrying sociopathic narcissistic misogynist fuckface.
You are choosing to give your precious self to this miserable son of a bitch. And you aren’t getting jack shit in the bargain. Yes he wants to crush you like a bug. He hates women and he probably hates the no boundaries, no standards,” just come and fuck me” women the very most (that would be you).”
That was me. Not actually, but it’s what I did. Never again. Learning to stop hating myself for who I’ve always been because of my childhood is my full time occupation now. Childhood abuse is the reason and NOT an excuse. Can’t excuse myself any more. I made it too easy for him to do his thing (exploitation) with me.
Don’t want to talk about him any more. Hooray for me for changing! 🙂
Dear Verity,
TOWANDA!!!!!!! Good for you! Great rant, I love the “you are choosing to give your precious self……etc” quote GREAT!!!!!
Yea, you’re on your way skipping down the road toward healing! We’ve all been CRAWLING on that road, but when you get to the point you can skip a while (before you fall into the next hole!–boy am I a pessimist! ) it feels great!
I’ve got to quite reading and get back up and get back to work! I’m really really REALLY gone this time….for a while!
We actually had a GAL who was decent… a little full of her self as well as most of them are. She did want what SHE thought to be best for my child… and WAS slightly snowed by my ex sp. (well until the end of it all and she realized when he never showed up for court that she WAS NOT getting paid by him!) BUT the worst issue I have as far as GAL and our case was that at one point, we had a Commissioner who actually DENIED our GAL the opportunity to speak when the decision about UNSUPERVISED Visitation was being made!!!!! NOT ONLY that but she denied my atty, the GAL and the PSYCHOLOGIST with a diagnosis of ASPD in his hand the chance to speak in her “3 hour hearing” that lasted 20 minutes because she was running just a “little behind and didn’t want to be bothered with all this” She only wanted to hear from the supervisor of the program that provides the Supervised visitations (a trained monkey could have appropriately played with my very small child in this setting.) She said her “philosophy was for both parents to get along and share the kids and be happy” & she ‘didn’t want to hear what happened in the past” (she didn’t care that what happed in the past was a CONTINUAL happening)!!!!
What do we do to get this into the heads of these attys & commissioners that what they are doing to these children is NOT OK??? We are in a vicious cycle that is creating MORE and MORE of these S/P because they get away with ANYTHING THEY DARN WELL WANT!
I agree with the overall feeling expressed about this subject. Having been a member of LF for over 3 years, watching, reading, learning and occasionally participating, I have taken GAL training, but refuse to go to work “for” the courts, until I have practical experience in my hands (per se).
I have received several inquiries through my listing as a resource on LF; and I appreciate the opportunity to help people who have ongoing custody issues with AsPD’s, S’s, P’s and NPD’s. I am listed as a “Child Advocate” and that is WHO I advocate for…short and long term.
I hate how the courts assign (at present & locally) too many cases to be adequately and competently handled by the available GALs. Having taken my training at the 8th largest family court and learned their guidelines for case processing – I have learned that MOST GALs take their own sweet time in ‘getting around to the investigation’ part of the equation. My time-guide is 60 days, from initial contact to resolution – (on my part) – I can find info, process it, make recommendations, and write court papers in that 60 day period; however, I have done so in the past, and people either DOUBT the potential effectiveness ‘IN THEIR CASE” and don’t utilize the documents; they are too busy trying to second-guess HOW the court will take the info or they’ll take it to a LAWYER (sry Matt! lol), who then tells them, “well, it’s a good start but I’ll have to re-work it, and that’ll cost ya another $1,000. for my time….”
People who finally DO find me thru LF – are broke, broken and need the type of help I can provide ~ they have been kicked around enough ~ and some can barely pull themselves together long enough to provide me with a CONCISE and COHERENT history of their case and the issues.
Those who do get me their case information, and who are willing to communicate with me in ‘almost real time,’ have found a measure of comfort and solid help, through what I do.
I said all of that to say this: There are GALs and CASAs out there, for whom this is their BUSINESS – as I one day hope it to be mine. * But there is a need for MORE certified para-professionals to undertake this type of case “pro bono” simply for the reason that I have: to actually HELP children, and the NON-disordered parent, in the fight to free themselves from the AsPD, S, P NPD’s out there.
I do not believe that children are happiest in situations where the disordered parent continues manipulating the situation/s, and the children, and the former partner ~ but I also don’t believe in indiscriminately advocating in the dark. I like to SEE ‘both sides’ of the situation, and recommend accordingly ~ Judges do respect that.
Dear Jewels
I work as a CP social worker in the UK and am familiar with the system here but not in the USA so much.
Are GALS the equavalent to what we have ‘Children’s Guardians’ in the UK – or otherwise? I don’t want you burden you to lots of time posting – but is there a link you could signpost me to?
Ta
Delta 1
Hi Delta1,
Here’s a link to “WA state” info about GALs, primarily the process involved in becoming a Guardian ad Litem. As I trained in Washington state, it is here that I am certified. However, I do know how to find information in other states, and work within those time-guidelines, where indicated.
http://www.courts.wa.gov/committee/?fa=committee.home&committee_id=105
To answer your question, I believe the positions are equivalent.
Before I go on about my current “horror story” as it relates to GALS, I must mention that 5 years ago when we were awarded custody of my then 4 year old grandson, we had the GAL sent straight from Heaven. This woman interviewed the “S/P” daughter for the first time, went to her car and called Protective Services. She saw through the manipulation.
Upon our first meeting with her, she told me how much my Grandson talked about us and how much he loved and needed us. She was there for HIM and took the time to check into every detail.
When we physically removed him from a domestic violence incident which had him in great danger, she made a trip to our house (1-1/2 hour drive) to make sure he was OK, then personally contacted the Magistrate and demanded immediate action be taken so he would not have to return to the situation we had removed him from. Up until that time, the court refused to see any urgency or seriousness in his situation.
Now, 5 years later, she is a Magistrate in JV Court. She is one of the few “good guys”.
The legal system terrifies me as far as going to court against my sociopath. I had a horrific experience when trying to divorce my psycho, and honestly, I believe the PTSD I got from this whole experience had a lot more to do in the betrayal of the justice system than from my actual spath.
My ex had a lawyer who I believe is also ASPD himself, and I honestly feel the magistrate may be one also. I have been to court around 28 to 30 times because of him, and even when my lawyer and I felt we had done really well, many times the judgments went against us.
I have a 12 yr old with this individual, and she really needs to get away from him. She does not want to see him, she can’t handle the lies and neglect, the verbal abuse and mind-control, he forgets to give her medicine, refuses to take her to the doctor, for the longest time did not allow homework to be done on “his” time, and also does not allow her to see friends on “his” time. He uses her as a control mechanism only.
However, knowing how this court works, going back for full custody could actually result in me losing custody (as I know he would file for full custody also, he wanted it originally so he would not have ot pay child support but could not get it because of his work hours.) He has since quit his job, so now he does not have to worry about his job hours impeding him.
I have chosen to just keep her in counseling and do my best to mitigate the damage, as my lawyer has seen how this works also, tells me that for some reason she can’t understand the magistrate does not seem to like me, and so until my child is old enough to go in and tell her story and have the judge listen to what she wants, or this magistrate retires or has a heart attack or something, we are just dealing with his manipulations as best as we can.
Although I am going back to school with the purpose of getting into the system and trying to make some changes, and help other victims.
Dear Stillinshock,
Sounds liek you have a reasonable plan given your “choices” and the situation. God bless you and give you strength! Thanks for sharing. Glad you are going back to school!