Having spent time listening to many psychopathy researchers, I can attest to many times coming away with the feeling that very critical insights are being missed. An appreciation for the bigger picture just isn’t there yet. For me the bigger picture always includes the family. A sociopath may prey on strangers, but usually that is after a lifetime of practice on family members. The reason this piece is so critical is that the personality disorder, psychopathy is a pervasive disorder of human social behavior that affects every relationship the disordered person has.
Considering what this disorder actually is- a pervasive disorder of human social behavior, the perspective of family members becomes very important. Methods of victimization of others also shed light on the nature of the disorder itself. I think this may be the only psychiatric disorder that would not be present if the affected person was lost alone on an island somewhere. That observation is often lost amid the abnormal brain scans and cognitive tests that are sometimes seen in affected persons.
Without the balance of hearing from victims and family members theories of psychopathy can even miss the central features of the disorder. For example, one new theory of psychopathy called the Triarchic Theory, states that the three traits of boldness, meanness and dysinhibition tell the entire story. The theory is actually better than this sounds but meanness is not what the authors of the theory think it is. If sociopaths were obviously mean, there would not be as many victims.
Given the assertions of the Triarchic Theory it is not surprising that the DSM 5 Personality Disorders Task Force proposed that “acknowledgement and articulation of other emotions (than anger) such as love and anxiety is rare.” Researchers need to put their theories into a perspective that can only be gained through real life outside the laboratory. Therefore it is critical that meetings include work on victims and their experiences, as subjective and “unscientific” as this may sound.
The posters Donna and I presented were an opportunity to challenge researchers to consider their words and assertions carefully. Many came away from reading them doing just that. I had to explain why the language proposed for DSM 5 is wrong, as many tried to defend the proposed statement as true.
There were also two posters from Adelle Forth’s group out of Canada’s Carleton University by graduate students Henriette Bergstrom and Janelle Beaudette on the effects of victimization by a psychopath on victims’ relationship functioning and physical health. This group has identified several themes in the narrative stories of victims, ongoing suffering, transformation and transcendence. But they also say those victims who came through the experience stronger did not really describe how.
This group has identified something I think is very important, that is the question of how to survive victimization and grow from the experience. The fact that a relationship with a sociopath has detrimental effects on psychological, emotional and physical health that lasts for years after the relationship has ended, tells us a great deal about what this disorder is about.
Watch the video: Donna Andersen explains Lovefraud research at psychopathy conference.
Hi Eden,
What I try to keep in mind is that the spaths never speak without the intent to lie or manipulate.
It’s true that they can feel a narcissistic injury, but that is not the feeling of a normal person whose feelings are hurt because a loved one rejects them. When we are rejected, we blame ourselves, when they are rejected they blame us too. This is significant because it goes toward responsibility. And the spaths never take responsibility for anything. So part of your answer is: No your spath isn’t hurt, but he wants you to take responsiblity for his narcissistic injury.
Another way to phrase your question is “WHY would he say he was hurt if he really isn’t.” Again, it’s about making you feel responsible. Putting a responsibiltiy/blame on someone is a form of scapegoating and it’s what they do. He wants to guilt/shame you and he’ll look for any opportunity to do that. So, I think that LL answered you correctly on that. He is projecting his slime with the express intent of making you feel bad (sliming you).
The book, “why is it always about you?” by Sandy Hotchkiss, really gets into this aspect of spaths. If you haven’t read it, you might want to.
Another reason that the spath accuses you of hurting him is because it’s part of his story. He wants to appear “human” so he will pretend to have human emotions. Even though it isn’t really appropriate for him to say you hurt him when he was the actual offender, they will say it anyway to confuse you. If you believe that he is human, then this will elicit some normal guilt and you’ve been manuevered into cog/dis territory. What you feel and what you know are now at odds. Humans usually go with what they feel. Now you’ve been slimed.
Furthermore, (I know – the layers of BS are never ending), the spaths need to create this story and act it out, because he intends to slander you down the line. So he likes to have a memory of himself acting hurt so that he can later tell people that you hurt him. I know it sounds weird but spaths are like method actors, they like to anchor their lies with a kernal of truth and all kinds of props and memories that prop up the lies.
My spath, during an argument said, “Keep calling me that because it helps my resolve to hate you more.” Or something to that effect. The whole reason for starting the argument was so that I would get angry and be hurtful to him, then he could “feel” justified in hating me. It’s a circular, chicken and egg logic, but spaths are ok with that.
It seems like the spath must have an endless supply of braincells to be able to juggle so much BS, but it’s not that at all. These are things that children do too. Creating stories and believing them is a uniquely human trait. Spaths just go overboard.
Oxy –
thanks for the insight to the bonding issue – now that I think about it and can look back on some situations with his children I can see the lack of bonding with them – one of the reasons why his daughter wanted to stay in touch with me. she said I was more of a parent than he was. he was always just the disciplinarian.
and the way he used to watch other people act around each other and their reactions to things.
It just came to me how he said something to me at one point that we had overheard a guy say to a girl while we were all at a restaurant together. the couple was obviously in an argument so you couldn’t help but overhear –
then about 2 weeks before I left him (or he kicked me out – depends on which one of us you talk to) he said the same thing to me when I was trying to explain how I felt. I remember thinking – I’ve heard this before, maybe on tv or something, but of course it just hit that he used someone else’s words because he had none of his own – that includes none of his own emotions either I think now.
Eden,
Yep, the words our spaths have said are either exact or darned close!
I’m doing well, thank you, although having just passed month 6, it’s better, but still hard. Is this your point of passing as well?
Good to see you here!
Sky, you’re amazing. You put into words so well, the things I wish I could say, things that I feel. you’re very expressive and I appreciate it. I learn from you.
LL
Gosh, I didn’t realize how much I needed this place at this time. The Love I am feeling from you all, right now, by just replying to my inquiry feels so huge in my heart. I know it is just what you (we) do here, but for some reason, I am feeling it so deep in my heart at the moment that it is producing some tears.
SKylar, thank you for writing. I am starving and going to get some yogurt out of refrigerator, then I will return to read your post. So glad to see you here, today! Love and Hugs. Be right back…
PS Oxy, I forgot that I wanted to hug you back, before (after you had sent me a hug). Love, E
Hi Skylar,
I finally caught up with my friend at work and gave her the book, “Why is alway’s About You?” I told her what you told me to tell her: Reading this book will give you more contol. Boy, you shoulda seen her lil eye’s light up! “Oh, good” she said. “I need more control of him” I thought DANG! Skylar was right on this one lololol. I hope she reads and gets help for herself.
Hi Ana,
Oh yeah! I forgot about your friend, but I remember that now. LOL!
What I’ve experienced in myself and in others is that nobody wants to talk about evil or sociopaths and serial killers. But everyone wants to talk about relationships between men and women because everyone thinks that if ONLY I had some idea what I can do right, I can FIX this relationshit. So that explains the huge market for self help books.
I thiink that book is a “transition” book. I hope it helps.
adamsrib:
I am glad you have a loving church community. It can really mean a lot…to see real people’s love and compassion.
Sky,
I think that is VERY true. I think grasping the whole concept of why spaths do what they do is so evil and SCARY, it’s beyond an empathic perspective. WAY beyond. But it IS true.
When it’s put into terms of “feelings” and relationshit problems between men and women, it kinda puts a fluffy coat of bullshit onto psychopathy, sociopathy and Narcissism. not the evil that it truly is and that this is more than just “relationshit problems” between men and women.
Nice point!
LL
(((((((((((((( Eden )))))))))))))))))))))
You are just a sweetheart! You’re doing so good too!
Hang in there, Chica. I’m finding that with a lot of support and help from friends, it DOES get better!
LL
Jeeez Sky, You are so right! How do you do that? Thank you for going into that depth. Sky…. not slandering me “DOWN THE ROAD!!!! P has been doing the smear campaign and slandering me sinse the end of January!!!!! I don’t want to start cussing, so I will ease up here, but the humiliation factor came mostly from this, if you might recall. M.F., A.H., Creep of all creeps, Satan Ambassador of Hell, etc….. But enough with that. I cannot allow myself to go to that place again. Cannot give him that power or endure that type of outrage or pain. It controlled me and my life, focus, work, relatiing to others, blah, blah, blah, lah, lah, lah…….
He did to me, what you speak of, above, when he ended the relationship (that “I” had actually ended two days prior to his ending). He slimed the begeeebiieesss out of me so that he could feel justified in his deranged actions. Creepazoid!!!!!!!!
Thank you! Thank you!
Eden