Lovefraud receives many letters from people who want a sign. Readers ask, “How do I know whether or not someone is a sociopath?” There is one behavior that every sociopath engages in to extreme excess. If I were only allowed one criteria for the diagnosis I would choose this behavior. If someone does not do this thing to extreme excess he/she is certainly not a sociopath. Those of you who have been involved with a sociopath know too well what this one thing is. It is lying.
I enjoy reading old religious texts because I believe there is truly nothing new under the sun. It is comforting to get reassurance of that fact. I mentioned some time ago that female sociopaths are described in the Bible. The cardinal symptom of sociopathy is described best in the Babylonian Talmud! One source I found dated this document to the 6th century.
The Babylonian Talmud describes something called geneivat da’at (literally, theft of one’s mind, thoughts, wisdom, or knowledge), i.e., fooling someone and thereby causing him or her to have a mistaken assumption, belief, and/or impression. The sages believed that there are seven types of thieves and, of these, the most egregious is the one who “steals the minds” of people.
Anyone who has been in contact with a sociopath has had his/her mind stolen. Sociopaths do not interact with anyone without stealing a mind.
Although sociopaths are very proud of their ability to steal minds, this behavior does not make them unique, talented or special. Sociopaths are just the worst species of thief!
Many are baffled by the lying sociopaths engage in. A reader who wrote me recently commented that they lie even when the truth sounds better. Sociopaths continue to lie even after their lies are discovered. This often makes them look silly.
Sociopaths lie in order to steal the minds of others. They do this because of an unrestrained drive for power and control. This drive is present in all of their dealings with others.
The best thing to do if your mind has been stolen by a sociopath is Take it Back! Don’t have any more interactions with that person. Accept that you can never deal with a sociopath without experiencing the theft of your mind.
Nottoolate,
there is a book called, “Why does he do that? inside the minds of angry men” It’s by a man named Lundy Bancroft who counsels these type of men when they have been court ordered to go to counseling for domestic abuse.
It’s very good and has helped me alot. My only problem with it is that Lundy says that not all of these men are sociopaths.
I understand why he says it: No one has really gotten a good definition of what a socipath is. But it still bothers me because the men he described really seem sociopathic to me (lying, faking, deceiving and beating their wives).
Because they lie so much, it’s hard to tell what they are really thinking and basically, the definition of a sociopath is not so much what he does but WHY he does it. For example, If I was living as a CIA agent and lied all the time, that wouldn’t necessarily mean that I’m a sociopath UNLESS, I became a CIA agent because I want power, control and manipulation through lies to become my way of life just for the sheer pleasure of it.
But all of the men Lundy counsels are narcissists which is the first step towards sociopathy, so they are toxic anyway.
in the stories the path makes up the father is always:
incestuous, a drug addict/ drunk, physically abusive, and usually pimps the main character out to cover debt
mothers are usually:
absent, outside the mainstream (in profession or philosophy); and ineffective at protecting the ‘good character’; or extremely religious and religiously abusive;
siblings are usually:
incestuous, gay and closeted, stalkers, mentally ill, religiously abusive.
Freinds are: sexually inappropriate, lusting after the main character
past lovers/ present lovers are usually:
jealous, murderous, possessive, old, fat, boring.
everything always revolves around the main sweet character – he is the one abused most often in the stories. he is:
sweet
niaive
kind
smart
funny
adventurous
artistically talented (art, music, writing, etc.)
noble
witty
wary
suicidal
abused
dying of something – cancer heart attacks, etc.
raped
horribly abused by small group of people!
’cause this spath uses sock puppets to make up her lie landscape, what would you surmise HER true character is from the traits given above?
I’d say she wants to steal from all her dupes, all the good qualities attributed to the main character.
I’d say she is: predatory, constantly researching her dupes in search engines, jealous, abusive (the number of sexually abused kids in her stories makes you wonder if she is a child molester…); and that she likes to make up her little ‘groups’ of sock puppets to abuse people.
Happy New Year One!
Wonderful that so much is in the rear view mirror isn’t it?
Not saying its all gone and done, not. But I am happy with how far the road away has been traveled!
A friend observed that being a sociopath must be a very hard way to live. To have to be “ON” like that all the time because if you lie so much that you have to keep up with yourself, how could you ever relax? My observation, to a spath, telling a new lie is recreational….
The truth will out!
Happy New Year!
ah, here you are! yes, may the cat door hit 2010 on the ass on the way out.
things are getting MUCH better. I have been going for infrared saunas and they have really made a difference with the level of toxicity in my body – of which my brain is a part. 😉
How is your ski slope driveway this winter?
SKY – would you take a look at my above post about the shit the spath ‘hates’ and always having happen to the main character, and give me your take on it – oh ye of incisive mind!
Hi One Step,
You hit it right on the nail.
I could take it into a deeper analysis by saying that it’s likely that she is describing her parents and what happened to her.
The siblings, friends and past lovers are just descriptions of her (we KNOW she is old fat and boring!)
The good traits are those she envies and will never have so she looks for people with those traits to prey on.
suicidal
abused
dying of something ”“ cancer heart attacks, etc.
raped
horribly abused by small group of people!
These are things she wishes she could make happen to her prey. She really NEEDS DRAMA. How sad.
This may not be what people here want to hear, but I’ve come to the conclusion that the evil ones are doing what they do as a cry for help. It comes across as a cry for attention and selfish narcissism, but really, they want that attention because they feel so aweful deep inside and they are “acting out” how they feel.
That list,
suicidal
abused
dying of something ”“ cancer heart attacks, etc.
raped
horribly abused by small group of people!
is how SHE feels. and she wants someone else to feel it too.
no, edit that, she wants EVERYONE else to feel it too.
Misery loves company is what the spath is all about.
She was slimed and needs to slime everyone else, but it will never be enough. How sick and sad. Even with all the compassion I feel for her, I still think a kick in the head might help her feel better. Not kidding. If she was kicked in the head everytime she started to pull her shenanigan, she would eventually be trained to not “feel better” by sliming others. She would then learn that it feels worse. Just like you train a monkey or any other animal.
My two cents from my incisive mind.
excuse me while I go look up “incisive”. LOL.
Penetrating, clear, and sharp, as in operation or expression: an incisive mind; incisive comments. in·ci sive·ly adv. in·ci sive·ness n. …
Cool, thanks!
((((One Step))))
’tis true. i value your unique exploration into the workings of spaths.
i don’t know what happened to her in life – i know she still has a relationship with her mother. her father doesn’t seem to be on the scene.
and (shudder), she has a child (an adult now) who she still has a relationship with. she is REALLY focused on child molestation; and to a slightly lesser degree, rape and dying.
she should feel stalked these days.
But in her case ‘stalked’ is about being caught.
she IS being watched by people. She is exposed – her name and image is on the web as a con/ liar/ spath. stories about her exist in the printed press and in blogs. Found a whole new scam yesterday, that i didn’t know about, and encouraged those people to take it outside of their forum and post about it in some places where people go for info about the spath.
NotTooLate, I’m sure not an expert on psychopathy—I knew very little about sociopaths until this past summer when we realized that my X HAD to have been sociopathic, & then I started doing research &, especially, learning here at LF—but I have to believe that Dr. Leedom is 100% correct in saying that the ONE, absolute, characteristic that ALL SOCIOPATHS have in common is LYING.
I believe that Oxy’s probly correct in saying that 75% of domestic abusers are deemed “psychopaths”, but you know—a rectangle is a square, but a square isn’t necc a rectange, so to speak. My 3rd hb emotionally & physically beat & tortured me in the finest hotels all over the world & in our home in a statusy compound. But he wasn’t a sociopath. He was honest & true & caring & kind & didn’t have an ounce of deceit in him…..wasn’t seeking power or sex or control thru manipulation. His “episodes” were always triggered by drugs & alcohol, tho drugs & alcohol didn’t always trigger an episode. I was told by a number of people who he’d worked with for years that he’d never been the same after taking too much LSD at a certain 4th of July Picnic in Texas 2 yrs before I got involved with him, & had been found wandering the streets of Austin, still incoherent 2 days later. I always had this vision of his mind as one that had been “pitted”—like those ceramic tile kitchen counters we all used to have….& everything that got spilled on it afterward was absorbed into the pits. (Remember what grape juice would do to our white tile??)
He was brutal in his “episodes”—with the torment sometimes going on for hours & days. But he never hit me where anyone could see it: he’d turn his huge diamond-encrusted band ring around to the inside of his hand & hit me in the back of the head repeatedly….sometimes I wouldn’t be able to put my head on a pillow for days, but no one could see the hematomas. I jumped out of windows, barricaded myself in bedrooms, hid for hours under kitchen cabinets or outside in the bushes, & fled for my life many times….dragged my 9 bags thru the streets of Tokyo one nite, trying to find a cab that would take an AmEx card, etc etc etc.
But when the effects of the drugs & alcohol wore off, he was back to normal, & always deeply repentant, tho I don’t think he really ever knew what sort of things he’d done. He was very possessive, but he wasn’t narcissistic or sociopathic or psychopathic. And he Never lied. He had delusions.
I’m just throwing this out there…..maybe it doesn’t fit anyone else’s profile….but I do know that I was married to one of the 25% of domestic abusers who Aren’t sociopathic.
the kick to the head is a good idea. i don’t WANT to feel compassion for her sky. only acceptance of the fact that she is a spath and that i was spathed. I guess i don’t want to ‘feel’ much about her at all.
i am still angered and at times still enraged. i am good with that. i let it be, and i work to become bigger than those feelings.
i think spathy is genetic, and i think that they will be this way REGARDLESS of what their childhoods are like – HOW it is expressed would change with the childhood experience.
i have compassion for my mom, who cannot form the intention to follow through on her offers of help, time and again. At first i felt abandoned each time she offered and I knew she couldn’t follow through. today i visited her. i told her that i know that she wants to help, but that she never will, that she never remembers to act on it. Told her i know she loves me and that it must be painful to not be able to help me, but she can’t. (the n sire would also freak about it and accuse me of stealing from her. #$%^). I was so much clearer with my boundaries – usually i am trying to make ALL allowance for my mom, because she is demented, and i always sacrifice my feelings for hers. Not today. lots of assurance that i love her and know she loves me , that she wold help me if she could, but she can’t. I also told her that I don’t want anything to do with the sire. she, the good supply, said, ‘i had no idea that you felt such hate…’ i said no, i don’t hate him, i just don’t trust him and i am protecting myself now.’
i felt like a bit of a jerk for explaining some of it – but, i also am good with the new parameters – told her why i haven’t been visiting (i have to do this eVERY time i do) – sick, working, no car. and that in the spring i will try to come more once this job is over. i told her that i have been barely able to deal with myself, and that I had to do that first. HUGE boundary for me…i am such a guilt person when it comes to my mom. sick demented,living with that prick, and not long for this world – and yet, i still have to take care of myself first and make boundaries.
i hate to, but i have to work soon. would rather relax and post…but much to do.